Game 162 Open Thread: September 30, 2007
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3-0, 1.85 |
0-2, 6.00 |
Well, here we are -- at the end of the long journey that has become the 2007 St. Louis Cardinals. We had such high hopes coming off our 10th championship; we, at the very least, had the belief that we might be able to celebrate another division championship. At the same time, however, most of us probably thought that this might be the year the wheels fell off. And, of course, that began on opening night with a 6-1 shellacking by the team we dispatched in last year's NLCS, soon followed by the news of Carp's injury. In a sense, that night sealed this team's fate and now we're in a place where this team has been only once before in the previous 7 seasons -- on the outside looking in.
Strangely, this season is ending eerily similar to the way in which last season ended. The p-d lists Looper as today's starter, despite the fact that it also has a link to an article saying that Looper won't be starting. stlcardinals.com lists Percival as today's starter, while the article linked above suggests it might again be Brad Thompson on short rest. If we go back 364 days, to October 1, 2006 -- the last regular season game of last season -- the Cards had a 1 1/2 game lead over the Astros w/ a possible makeup game vs. the Giants, pending the result of our game against the Brewers and the 'stros game against the Braves. Carpenter could have gone, to try and seal the deal, but Tony decided about 5 minutes (Ok, I exaggerate -- a little) before game time to throw Anthony Reyes instead. We knew he wasn't going to go w/ Carp -- saving him instead for the game against the Giants, if needed, all the while hoping to save him for game 1. Well, Reyes got bombed but Smoltz bailed out the Cards and the rest is history. And here we sit, again having no idea just a few hours before game time on the last day of the season with no idea who the starter will be. As I said last week, "What a long, strange trip it's been."
Interestingly, the Padres enter today's action w/ Bud Black facing the same dilemma that LaRussa faced 1 year ago and he's making, essentially, the same decision Tony made. The difference is that Peavy would have to come back on 3 days rest whereas Carpenter would have gone on his regular 4 days rest. Instead, Black's going w/ that former Cardinal great -- Brett Tomko. Best of luck, Pads. Even more interestingly, when Tony's gamble paid off and Carpenter got to start game 1 of the playoffs, guess who his mound opponent was: You guessed it -- Jake Peavy.
So we enter game 162, w/ Thompson, or Looper, or Percival -- one thing we know for sure, of course, is that it won't be Carpenter. His loss is one the organization's going to be grappling with throughout next season. The team is, strangely enough, closing the season by playing pretty decent baseball -- they've won 4 in a row -- and stand a pretty decent chance to make it 5 to close out the season. They've gotten 4 pretty solidly pitched games in a row behind Thompson, Pineiro, Wellemeyer and Wainwright. God knows the team has a lot to deal w/ in the offseason so it'd be nice to end the season on an uptick.
What's really interesting, however, is the rest of the NL. The Phils and Mets are playing for the NL East title, against the Nats and Marlins, respectively. Each is hoping that the Brewers are able to, once again, defeat the Padres thereby forcing at tie for the Wild Card. If the Rockies manage to win this final series against the D-backs, we could be looking at a 4 way tie for the Wild Card. You can read about all the playoff possibilities here.
The fact that the Wild Card possibilities are so interesting brings me to something that's been a bone of contention with me for some time -- the unbalanced schedule. I'm sure all of you are familiar with this -- each team plays the other teams in their division 15-19 times during the season while playing the other teams in their league 6-8, usually just 2 series. The basic idea behind this is two-fold: first, it creates the most games between division rivals so that the division titles are truly decided, largely, based on how each team did in its division; and second, to maximize the number of games between these rivals so as to maximize the excitement. 18 games between the Cubs and Cardinals are better than 12 and the same is true of the Giants/Dodgers and Red Sox/Yankees.
To me, however, the unbalanced schedule, in attempting to make the journey to the playoffs more fair and exciting, unfairly favors teams in the weaker divisions. Teams that play in tougher divisions end up with significantly tougher schedules, therefore increasing the possibility that inferior teams make it to the playoffs and relatively superior teams are left to their hunting trips prematurely. And, BTW -- do we really need 16 games w/ the Cubs or 18 w/ the Pirates? After all, one of the biggest problems with the snow-outs the first week of the season in Cleveland was that Seattle only made 1 trip there. As for the schedule itself, I looked at all the schedules for the NL's playoff contenders (+ the Cards, just for reference) to determine their level of competition this year. I took each opponent's winning % through game 161 and multiplied it by the number of games against that team. Then, I added all those up, to give me the number of games that those opponents would win out of the number of non-interleague games. For example, the Cards played 147 games (through Sunday) against the NL and the winning % of the Cards' opponents was .48993. Multiply it by the 162 game season and the Cards' opponents would have 79.4 wins. The # of wins for each contender is listed in the table below.
| win % | # of games | # of wins/162 | |
|---|---|---|---|
| Colorado | .49896 | 144 | 80.8 |
| San Diego | .49850 | 147 | 80.8 |
| Arizona | .49584 | 147 | 80.3 |
| New York | .49160 | 147 | 79.6 |
| Philadelphia | .49138 | 147 | 79.6 |
| St. Louis | .48993 | 147 | 79.4 |
| Chicago | .48408 | 150 | 78.4 |
| Milwaukee | .48350 | 147 | 78.3 |
It should come as little surprise that the teams in the West have played the toughest schedule -- a full 2 1/2 games tougher than the Brewers and Cubs. The Eastern teams are in the middle and the Central teams played the easiest. Of course, the Rockies' and Padres' schedules and the Cards' schedules were a little tougher b/c they had to play their respective division winners 15-18 times and didn't get to play themselves at all. Maybe the Cards would be in the playoffs if we got to play ourselves 16 times. (of course, we couldn't hit Tony Armas, Jr. so what makes me think we could hit Wellemeyer or Thompson, but I digress).
So the Rockies and Padres, at least 1 of whom will be left out of the playoffs, will have played a more difficult schedule than any of the teams in the Central or East. And the Phils or Mets may BOTH make the playoffs at the expense of the Rockies and Padres.
In short, the schedule should be more balanced b/c of the Wild Card. The battles more often come down to teams in opposing divisions, and no team should be at a 1 game or 2 game disadvantage. Think it's insignificant? 4 teams enter the last day of the season within that margin, and all 4 have a decent chance of making the playoffs. If the playoffs are to be decided from among the 4 best teams in each league, each team needs to be on an even playing field -- and the unbalanced schedule doesn't allow for that.
Best of luck, guys. Let's go out a winner!
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I've always wanted the doomsday scenerio
I can't fully wrap my mind around how baseball would even handle that but I really do hope that the Brewers can muster a win tomorrow, coupled with Mets/Phillies/Rox victories to get that playoff to happen.
by Hardcore Legend on Sep 30, 2007 4:55 AM EDT reply actions
Got to wonder who is pitching tomorrow.
I actually thought they would go with
When is tomorrow?
by cardsgirl95 on Sep 30, 2007 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Just a correction:
With Arizona leading the West, it's not a situation where either the Rockies or Padres WILL make the playoffs. If the Phils and Mets both made it(one taking the East and one taking the WC) then both SD and Colorado would be out.
nitpicky little detail to an otherwise very good, informative post. Glad to see LArry's found someone else that can step up and present new outlooks on issues concerning out beloved team and sport. Well done houstoncardinal!
Yeah, I caught that too
Here are the odds of each team for a post-season series berth:
----East----- ----------WC---------- Total
Win Tie Win Tie(2) Tie(3) -----
NY 25.0% 25.0% 1.6% 0.8% 52.3%
PH 25.0% 25.0% 1.6% 0.8% 52.3%
SD 68.8% 12.5% 1.6% 82.8%
CO 9.4% 3.1% 12.5%
I still don't see it
Beyond the problem of unbalanced schedules
by MikeG on Sep 30, 2007 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree that the leagues should have an equal
But you're right about the effect it creates within the NL and AL. Each team in the NL East and West played all the others 18 freaking times! Within the Central, we played most 15 or 16 but all had 1 opponent we played 18 times. Fortunately for us, we got 18 games against the Pirates but that, in itself, creates additional inequity.
why not have de 15th team
i realiza a new unbalance would be introduced.
Well it could work...
Figure it this way, right now each team plays ~15 interleague games/ year. If interleague games were spread out over a season, basically at any one time there would be 7 NL games, 7 AL games and 1 IL game. That means basically 1/8 of games or ~20 games a year would be IL for each team. I am guessing if it was scheduled right you could have each team play another division 3 times/ team or 15 games a year, plus their "natural rivals" three times for 18 games.
This is pretty much what we do now, the difference is simply IL play would be spread out through the year.
Don't get me wrong, I really don't like IL play, but if the divisions were balanced IL play more or less in its current format would still work.
HC, you are right
There might be a 4 way tie
Let us hope for that crazy scenario
Zubin
Not disagreeing or criticizing -- just curious and looking for clarification/confirmation.
What I would like to see...
Eckstein SS
Ankiel RF
Pujols 1B
Edmonds CF
Ludwick LF
Ryan 3B
Stinett C
Percival P
Miles 2B
I want to see that go-around the first time through the order...have Pujols walk in the first and Edmonds hit a dinger. That would give Albert 100 BB and 100 Runs. Then, the second time through the order (the "who cares the season is over" order) should look like this:
Cairo 1B
Ankiel CF
Barden 3B
Schumaker CF
Ludwick LF
Ryan SS
Stinett C (relieved after 2 AB by Bennett)
(someone will have pinch hit for Percival by then...no double switch)
Miles 2B
I think the pitching should just go one time through the order for each person.
If Winning If losing
Percival Percival
Franklin Franklin
*Flores/Johnson Jiminez
Springer Cavazos
Izzy Falkenborg
*whichever one is not hurting at the moment (it seems as though one of them always is).
stlfan
Per MLB Gameday
Schumaker LF
Pujols 1B
Ankiel CF
Ludwick RF
Speizio 3B
Stinnett C
Percival P
Miles 2B
It has Duncan and Molina listed as on the bench...I sure as heck hope neither of them play injured. (Of course, it has Mulder listed, too...he won't play either.)
stlfan
As I re-read the story
Interesting
just curious...
also, didnt we beat up this bullington pretty good last time? i think it was the ankiel two homer game
Here's to hoping
The Fish
i really don't like the phils
Historically
That team would be super dangerous if they had better pitching.
Yost
well,
how can he not get fired
Fielder Held Out
commissioners office
Are you serious?
if only i could master links
and what about the video of the next reliever
by Birds on the Bat on Sep 30, 2007 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
"Edwards"
haha
let's hope he gets his 5 plus innings
MLB.TV
Kip
Oddball Game
Go Kip!
And it's possible for Pujols to walk for the 100th time and score his 100th run in the same frame.
Ugh
Skippy's having quite a day today
Skip Schumaker!
Just googling around
Around the Horn
FLA 7
NYM 1 Top 4
PHI 3
WAS 0 Top 4
SD 3
MIL 0 Bottom 2
The Phillies are in a pretty good position to take the East, the benefactor in a pretty colossal collapse.
Is Tony just screwing with us now?
Albert's gonna have to hit a dinger next time up to keep this streak alive. I thought for sure he'd get it today but he's running out of outs.
by Hardcore Legend on Sep 30, 2007 2:48 PM EDT reply actions
Well that was a waste
by Hardcore Legend on Sep 30, 2007 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Tony didn't want him to get an L
Another pitching change
by Hardcore Legend on Sep 30, 2007 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Getting everyone into the last game?
I'd like to see some big rallies. If Brendan Ryan can go 4-4, he'll raise his average over .300 like he was said he'd hoped to do in the pre-game interview.
I guess Yost can't be critized for dumping
Tomko with 4k's thru 2.
by Birds on the Bat on Sep 30, 2007 2:58 PM EDT reply actions
Demsie of the Metropolitans, I'm Lovin'it
Isn't Glavine a FA? Guess Mets fans won't want him back.
by Birds on the Bat on Sep 30, 2007 3:15 PM EDT reply actions
He can opt out
by Hardcore Legend on Sep 30, 2007 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Doesn't look good for our hero
Just missed a dinger there.
Brewers coming back 3-2 Pads.
by Hardcore Legend on Sep 30, 2007 3:27 PM EDT reply actions
If you had to choose
I'd say the run myself, El Hombre might say the walk though.
Here's hoping for both.
Who pitches the next two innings?
Cards about to blow a 6-1 lead
Pujols
He's got 99 on the season
c'mon people
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:20 PM EDT reply actions
ahhh
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:22 PM EDT reply actions
I realize it's game 162
let's just be glad
(and I think barden is probably as good at SS as Eckstein these days...)
Did I miss something?
houston
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:26 PM EDT reply actions
ya mean like that?
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's the scenario
dang
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:33 PM EDT reply actions
Well, the season's over 1.1 innings early
Can they just change the streak to say 29 HR, .299 avg, 99 runs, 99 rbis?
Talk about ending on a high note
anyone else notice that
um, that was a generous call by the ump
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:40 PM EDT reply actions
3 of 4
by johnstonburg on Sep 30, 2007 4:42 PM EDT reply actions
fisk
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Oops. hit send too soon.
I still haven't figured out how an anti-cubs beard works, but I figure it should probably work in reverse, right? I've been growing the beard for nearly two weeks now and will probably shave a bit of it off everyday or something.
izzy has to make it interesting....
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:45 PM EDT reply actions
Do we not just delete runs scored from the streak?
and that;s a winner!
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 30, 2007 4:47 PM EDT reply actions
looks like we're picking #13 next year...
That's a winner
At least we have 2006 to think of. If the Pads get knocked out every Cardinal playoff opponent will be out of the postseason. That's a lot more disappointing end than us.
Izzy & The Zombies
Thanks for going out on a win guys.
If Colorado gets in
And That's A Winner!!!!
so long season from hell. may we never have another half as bad.
thanks every one for making this season bareable. without you guys, i would have "officially" gone insane. you guys are the best fans in baseball, and i really appreciate you letting me hang out with you. thanks Larry for making VEB the best Cardinals site.
War VEB & the best fans in the game
War the come back of Rick Ankiel
War the greatness of Albert Pujols
War whoever faces the flubs in the first round
War Eagle taking it to the Gators in the swamp
War the Cardinals winning it all in 2008
thanks again every one. you are the best.
War Eagle taking it to the Gators in the swamp
i knew there was an Auburn grad
Tell me about it
And thanks for the props, brother. Any time my team can knock off the #4 team in the country on their home field, I'd be glad to do it for you (if only I could).
Thank you
I tip my cap to the Redbirds!!!!
Looking forward to 2008!!!!
Congratulations
Ditto
Thanks to everyone at VEB, especially our host, LB, and his back-up posters, Val, eric and Houston. You all made this season from hell easier to take. Go 2008 Cards! When does spring training start?
Uh...
Really!?!
Offseason at VeB
Carlos Quentin
So Duncan could convert him into, pitch to contac?
Now if those two leave, bring him on.
and greg reynolds would be nice too
Nice way to end the season
Waiting for '08...
by Petkovsek on Sep 30, 2007 5:29 PM EDT reply actions
Phillies Mets
Not lately.
Hell, they were "better" than us last year, too.
But arent you glad
Well as everyone here knows
But that doesn't mean I really wish such a collapse on another team- unless it benefited the Cardinals. I honestly think the Mets have a better all-around team than the Phillies and so I'd perfer to see the Mets in the post-season.
Really?? I hadn't noticed...
Don't the Phils
Tlr to meet with
Positive note
Peavy vs. Fogg
As much as I like the Rockies - I'd say the Padres have the advantage.
Note the Padres faced the same situation we faced last year. Have your #1 go on Sunday and go for the win, or save him for the makeup/play-in game. They kept Peavy off the hill and now they have to play.
when did francis last pitch?
I think he pitched Friday night
by player2bnamedl8r on Sep 30, 2007 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions
It's too bad
"Interestingly, the Padres enter today's action w/ Bud Black facing the same dilemma that LaRussa faced 1 year ago and he's making, essentially, the same decision Tony made. The difference is that Peavy would have to come back on 3 days rest whereas Carpenter would have gone on his regular 4 days rest. Instead, Black's going w/ that former Cardinal great -- Brett Tomko. Best of luck, Pads. Even more interestingly, when Tony's gamble paid off and Carpenter got to start game 1 of the playoffs, guess who his mound opponent was: You guessed it -- Jake Peavy."
I wasn't trying to pull
I just thought it interesting that last year everybody put up Tony as a genius for the pull, when he really only got lucky. This year we can see how smart the plan is when the other team doesn't lose.
by enoscountry on Sep 30, 2007 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I still think it was the right move
Also don't forget
Thanks!
And thanks to Larry and everyone who makes this board the best Cards community on the internet.
Yes, Thanks!
Amen to that!
Its amazing...
its so funny to talk to cubs / phillies / etc. fans who are experiencing this for the first time in a while - we are truly lucky and rewarded at the same time for our undying support of the home team - and so with that, I say bring on spring training and 2008 - it can't happen soon enough.
i'm keeping ankiel's game-winning triple in my mind from the last home game as a promise for the future. here's to making the right moves this offseason, and getting after it come spring time. there's ALWAYS next season, and that's why you never stop playing the game.
by getupbaby51 on Oct 1, 2007 5:49 AM EDT reply actions
schedule data
Did you have a nicely formatted league-schedule in order to crunch the numbers for this post? I'm looking for something where I can easily figure out (yay, Excel) the number of games each team played against other teams, separated by home and away games. If anybody has that information or know of a good source, please let me know. skyking162 at gmail Thanks! -Sky

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