what halve we here
Update [2007-8-27 15:30:49 by lboros]: breaking news out of houston: garner and purpura are out, according to KBME radio in houston (790 am).
if we break the season so far into two halves, the dividing line falls on june 15 --- just about the time the cardinal pitching reached its low point. the cardinals lost 14-3 that day, after having lost 17-8 the previous night; scott spiezio had to come in and pitch the bottom of the 8th, and he was the only st louis moundsman who wasn't scored upon. braden looper left with an elbow injury that day and went onto the dl, and kip wells had been dumped from the rotation the day before --- two starters lost in two days. that left wainwright and reyes as the only surviving members of the opening-day rotation (and reyes, of course, had already been kicked out of it once and was only recalled out of necessity). the team era stood at 5.15, nearly its worst point of the whole season (it would reach 5.16 a couple of days later); the rotation consisted of wainwright, reyes, thompson, and wellemeyer.
a lot more has gone wrong since then --- wellemeyer and tyler johnson got hurt; thompson and maroth pitched themselves off the team --- but these woebegotten rag-arms have stiffened up anyway:
| W-L | ERA | AVG | OBP | SLG | BB/9 | |||
| through jun 15 | 28-36 | 5.15 | .272 | .340 | .432 | 3.4 | ||
| since jun 15 | 35-28 | 4.04 | .266 | .325 | .415 | 2.8 |
in trying to understand the improvement, the decreased walk rate is the place i would start; that alone has shaved more than half a baserunner a game off the ledger, which translates into about 0.35 of the era improvement. st louis pitchers were slightly worse than league average (3.3 bb/9) through june 15; as of today, they have yielded the 2d-fewest walks in the nl. the other major change since june 15 is that they've yielded fewer extra-base hits --- not fewer homers (63 hr through june 15, versus 64 since) but fewer extra-base hits on balls in play (12 fewer doubles, 8 fewer triples). this could be the result of a) better luck, b) better outfield defense, c) a better groundball ratio, or most likely d) some combination of a, b, and c.
i thought the apparent improvement might just be an illusion produced by the last 3 weeks of strong pitching --- ie, a sample-size distortion --- but it isn't. from june 16 through july 18 --- 5 weeks, 27 games --- the cardinal staff maintained a 3.63 era. then it got bombed for two weeks (6.08 era) before reclaiming its mojo; since august 5 the staff era is 2.82. this run has really lasted 10 weeks, not 3; it began roughly when wainwright got hot and kip wells and anthony reyes became the 4.00-ish pitchers we thought they'd be, instead of the 6.00-ish pitchers they had been up to that point. it also helped significantly that the cardinals added troy percival, which eliminated the opportunity for sub-replacement performers like jimenez and cavazos to inflate the team's stats. out of curiosity, i compared the cards' 4.04 era since june 15 to that of the top 5 teams in nl era:
padres 4.04
dodgers 4.46
cubs 4.18
mets 4.37
giants 4.30
raise your hand if you saw it coming.
the next, obvious question is whether they can keep it going --- and my answer to that is, do i look stupid? i'm not gonna try to predict what this team might do next. rolen had it right a couple weeks ago --- it don't make no sense. it's almost labor day, and the games are still worth watching --- that in and of itself is a triumph, given everything this team has faced in 2007. whether or not they close the deal in the last 34 games, you have to applaud them --- and the joke that is the nl central --- for hanging in there. a couple other items:
- wainwright over this period (ie, since june 15) has the 5th-best era in the national league, behind peavy, webb, zambrano, and (??) tim redding.
- mulder threw 4 innings last night --- 2 hits, 1 run. in 9.1 rehab innings, he has yielded 7 hits, 2 earned runs, 3 walks, and no homers --- all in class A, in a pitcher's league no less, so don't draw too many conclusions from those stats.
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One thing I said
How wrong/right I was. That sticktoititvness payed off. Look what we got here?
please please please
by Milfy McMilf on Aug 27, 2007 10:00 AM EDT reply actions
Johnson
Actually...
by TriplePlay on Aug 27, 2007 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions
really?
Game log: http://www.baseball-reference.com/pi/gl.cgi?n1=johnsty01&t=p&year=2007
ERs
not sure
Since the DL he has 0 and 0 but still has a 4.50 ERA and a .500 SLGA
All I remember...
by TriplePlay on Aug 27, 2007 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
That isn't what happened
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
yes
His goal--since mid-minors--
Do other teams ...
In following the cards for the last few years, its seems to me that this exact phenomenon has occurred semi-frequently. In 2004, our pitching was pretty bad for the first part of the season (until the Steve Kline game, right?), and then the pitching gelled, and the team became a juggernaught. Last year the pitching fell apart for a good chunk of the season, but it started to reassemble itself at the end of the season and was spectacular through the postseason. Now, this.
Perhaps someone can correct my history here, but as I recall it each of those times one key area of improvement was the walk rate.
To me, this kind of dramatic overall improvement in the pitching that seems to effect everyone, or nearly everyone, on the staff, looks like a social phenomenon - how else can you explain the abrupt, seemly random changes in not just one, but nearly a dozen players? If pressed, I would choose the word "trust" to describe it. The (starting) pitching trusts the offense, defense, and bullpen to do their jobs, so they don't feel the need to be perfect. That leads to more strikes, less walks, and better results.
All this is very unscientific, because its totally unfalsifiable. Nevertheless, I think its a better theory than the alternative, which is essentially that the Cards have repeatedly had a group of mediocre pitchers all put up some of their best career numbers at the same time, by luck.
Of course trust is pretty easy to destroy. In 2004-05 the trust (if trust is what it was) was solid, and it was deserved, because the teams were reliably competant in every area. It remains to be seen if this team has the makeup to maintain this run, or if bad defense, inconsistent offense, and the pitchers' own insecurities will send us back where we were in the first half.
by Leo on Aug 27, 2007 10:03 AM EDT reply actions
On 2004
No, it wasn't bad for the first half, actually. Save the first ten games, it was solid for the entire year.
In 2004, the pitching was bad for the first 10 games, allowing 6.9 r/g. For the remaining games in April their r/g was 4.2.
For May the r/g was 3.8; June 3.9 (the Kline game was near the end of June). So the pitchers were effective in the first half after the first 10 games.
What happened in 2004 was the Cards' pitchers started poorly, allowing a lot a runs and having a 4-6 record. The Cards then went 8-5 for the rest of April.
In May, the pitching held up, but the bats disappeared, and the runs scored per game dropped by about .9 runs per game to 4.4/game. So the Cards record for May was 15-12.
In June the bats rebounded to 5.6 runs/game and the Cards went 19-9. In July, the rs/g was 6.0 and the ra/g was 3.6, and the Cards went 20-5, and effectively ended the race.
For the first ten games, the Cards allowed the 6.9 r/g and went 4-6. For the remaining 154 games the pitchers allowed 3.9 r/g (the batters scored 5.2 r/g) and the Cards went 101-51.
Now that was a fun summer (until late October, at least)......
Dave
by Sydney dave on Aug 27, 2007 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
What team is all about
Start picking at any part of that framework, IMO, and you're back to square one.
by Fred McTaggart on Aug 27, 2007 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
The bullpen strength
One thing I've noticed, having charted Looper all season, is that Tony gets Looper out of there in the 6th or 7th as soon as he starts to get in trouble. Looper's been pretty good the first 2 times through the order (for the most part) but has really run into trouble the 3rd time through. Tony's recognized that as well and has significantly shortened Looper's leash of late.
If the pen wasn't as strong as it is, Tony would have to extend Looper and Reyes and Wells and the numbers, not to mention the winning %, wouldn't look so good.
Wellemeyer status?
Activated
Thanks, man
Wainwright
Funny the Cards have 3 pitchers in the top 50 ERA (Waino, Looper and Wells {5.41}) but considering only 48 pitchers qualify based on IP and Wells is 47th this doesn't say very much.
Back to Wainwright: He is tied for 13th with 12 wins, tied with Suppan for 20th in IP with 163.1, 26th in SOs with 113, tied at 30th with Kip Wells and Maddux in BAA at .276, 15th in fewest pitches per inning with 15.75.
I can't find a ranking for it but he has only allowed 11 HRs all season, that ties him with Maddux and Smoltz and puts him ahead of many of the top pitchers (if you include AL names Verlander, Halladay, Oswalt, El Duque, Dice K, and others.
MLB HR Allowed Leaders
HR IP Pitcher
5 135 C Young
5 173 B Penny
5 183 T Hudson
6 170 J Peavy
7 159 C-M Wang
8 172 K Escobar
9 134 B Bannister
9 153 N Lowry
9 140 S Mitre
9 191 B Webb
10 164 M Cain
10 160 J Beckett
10 173 A Pettitte
11 161 J Smoltz
11 161 G Maddux
11 170 A Wainwright
Reyes is not scheduled to pitch
Tony wants to use him against the Reds
Reyes....
by TriplePlay on Aug 27, 2007 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Tony decided that the best way to start a
I jest.
Anthony is better at home. It's a good idea to use him wisely.
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Team concept
by Fred McTaggart on Aug 27, 2007 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions
And maybe while they're at it, they
Team concept again
by Fred McTaggart on Aug 28, 2007 8:14 AM EDT up reply actions
As far as I know, and I've read everything I can
Am I correct....
by TriplePlay on Aug 27, 2007 12:25 PM EDT reply actions
Good point
I have a good feeling
that should
I agree with you
And on a 'spiritual' note, I feel like Mulder would be a Hessian, at this point. Maybe that is silly, but I DO wonder if the recently found team chemistry would be affected.
I could easily be wrong about this... because if it were Carpenter coming back, I know the effect WOULD be positive. I'm just now sure about Mulder.
Of course if he were to throw a couple of six-inning blanks, that would be different altogether.
by CurtFlood on Aug 27, 2007 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm actually wondering how many
Let's use the off day productively
by redbird2006in on Aug 27, 2007 12:52 PM EDT reply actions
The tone of an off-day
When the Cardinals lose, it's a pain in the ass to sit on that loss as a fan for 48 hours and attempt to look at that 1 loss with perspective. By the time you reach hour 36, it becomes almost like 5 losses in a row.
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 1:30 PM EDT reply actions
agreed. i hate ruminating on a loss
thankfully (?) no more off days the rest of the way. ;)
Wonder Brad
As for Looper, who I was also way down on as a starter, can anyone say I told you so? Who could have predicted his success? Hats off to Loop for hanging in there.
by age3in82 on Aug 27, 2007 2:03 PM EDT reply actions
Congrats
GS GF W L CG IP ERA H R ER HR BB IBB SO HBP
Kip Wells 23 0 5 14 0 125.1 5.82 140 94 81 14 63 6 92 7
A Reyes 18 0 2 13 1 99.2 5.33 95 64 59 11 35 0 69 6
Thompson 13 0 4 3 0 75.1 5.02 93 44 42 11 24 1 26 6
BA OBP SLG OPS BAbip
Kip Wells .281 .366 .442 .808 .317
A Reyes .251 .319 .417 .735 .275
Thompson .308 .369 .507 .876 .308
Thompson did it while being bounced back and forth from the rotation and the bullpen. Tough to get in any kind of pattern when you don't know when you're going to get to pitch again.
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Wason
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd hold off for a second on the congratulations
As to replacing Suppan, the 2007 Suppan has a 4.85 ERA, a WHIP of 1.54, and 10 quality starts. Thompson has the aforementioned 5.02 ERA, a WHIP of 1.55, and 6 quality starts. The Cards are 10-3 in the games that Thompson has started, which means for the most part he's kept the Cards in game. The Brewers are 13-14 in games that Suppan has started. Which has done better as a starter? At worse, it's a push.
Two other things; one's making $6 MM this year and is due $42 MM over 4 years; the other is probably on $400k. Thompson is also 25 years old, while Suppan is 32.
Dave
by Sydney dave on Aug 27, 2007 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I am rooting for our boys
Last September my brother and I were joking about putting some $$$ on the Cards to wind the WS. But we never got around to it and lost out on a healthy payday. This year we won't miss that bus.
Go Birds!
I go to Church with a guy from N.Y.
His bowl of alphabet soup spelled StL WoRlD ChAmPs!
He shouldve known...
by yer dog first on Aug 27, 2007 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Was fun....
GO CARDS!!
Cards fans everywhere
CRAP!
by yer dog first on Aug 27, 2007 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Astros Fire Purpura, Garner
Tal Smith will replace Purpura while Cecil Cooper will take over from Phil Garner. The announcement was made at a press conference today at Minute Maid Park.
Later Garner
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7160596?MSNHPHMA
The Astros, initiating a major overhaul, have fired general manager Tim Purpura and manager Phil Garner, according to a major-league source.
The move comes just two years after the pair took the team to the first World Series in franchise history.
The Astros have called a news conference at 3 p.m. ET to announce the change.
Owner Drayton McLane expected the team to contend after signing left fielder Carlos Lee to a $100 million free-agent contract and adding starting pitchers Woody Williams and Jason Jennings.
Instead, the Astros are 58-73, tied with the Nationals for the third-worst record in the National League, ahead of only the Pirates and Marlins.
Bench coach Cecil Cooper will be the team's interim manager.
Hopefully
by rockin redbird on Aug 27, 2007 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
let's hope they don't end up like the Reds...
by TriplePlay on Aug 27, 2007 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I've never liked Garner
GO CARDS!!!
This is so Drayton McLane
Let me say that both of them should've been fired. Garner couldn't manage a little league team from Georgia and Purpura proved his level of ineptitude over the year and a half that he's been in charge. But it's just like McLane to overreact to the fans in this manner.
If Dewitt acted like this, Izzy would've been released in the offseason.
Az Fall League
http://www.stltoday.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=479204
Here is the list Colby Rasmus, Mitch Boggs, Jason Motte, Chris Perez, Stuart Pomeranz, Jarret Hoffpauir, Joe Mather
Pomeranz is in A ball Boggs, Motte and Rasmus are in AA and the rest are AAA.
Looks like we are sending a nice crop.
When is Carp's projected return
He talks about a 2008 rotation of Carp, Wainer, and Mulder.
We can't expect Carp back until at least late July or August, can we?
probably ASB for the optimists
do you mean ASG?
it would be pretty awesome if he could be back by then... ah well.
Purpura
Garner, I believe is pretty decent. Purpura? Assuming McLane allowed him to do his job, he did it awful.
- banking on the backside of Woody's career
- trading 3 for Jason Jennings
- spending a ton on Carlos Lee
- hanging on to Lidge for some reason
- allowing himself to be held hostage at various times by Clemons, Pettite and Beltran
Thankfully, I'm a Card fan
Seems to me Woody was a
the Jennings trade, I don't get. I thought one of the prospects that was traded was gonna start for the Astros this year.
not to mention the great job
Long Time Coming for Purpura
Hirsh is getting better results than Jennings, though admittedly with fairly close peripherals.
Toot, toot, anyways!
I seem to recall
Hold that tooting...
As for Taveras, he's worse than Cameron and Chris Young by a lot, and he's been slightly better than Pierre and Roberts. Big deal...
Worse by a lot?
Houston looked at Taveras as a defensive specialist, fourth-outfielder type, and he's proven to be a valuable leadoff hitter. That's the kind of offensive production you can be happy with from a center fielder. He was pretty much a throw-in from Houston's perspective and has capably filled two needs for the Rox.
Hirsh has been a disappointment this season, but I'm betting as he matures as a ML pitcher, he'll give the Rockies good value for the four or five years that the Astros won't be getting. Hirsh will get better and Jennings will pitch elsewhere.
That was a foolish trade and Purpura should have known it if a knucklehead like me did.
So, I'll keep on a-tootin'.
Yeah
All he had to do was make sure that Berkman
Honestly, it felt like that happened 3 times in a row.
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
try=dry
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think
In terms of his in-game decision making -- he's been playing Jason Lane in center field, almost every day, for about a month and a half. He finally abandoned that strategy thanks largely to Lane's .172 or something batting avg. and his unwillingness/inability to take a walk. He's insisted on keeping Ausmus behind the plate and Biggio at 2b (though McLane had a lot to do w/ that one). He's insisted on playing Everett at SS despite the fact that he's had to play Ausmus and Biggio every day, thus filling the lineup w/ Biggio, Lane, Ausmus, Everett and a pitcher -- at least he's had Woody Williams hitting every 5 days.
I actually...
- the Woody move was dumb, but he's actually been better than Looper or Wells. Granted he cost a bit more
- the Jennings deal was done with the assumption that A) he could improve to an elite level once he left the Rox and B) acquiring him via trade would help the Stros sign him long term b/c he has ties to the area. His injury has pretty much torpedoed the entire thing, but it those assumptions weren't unreasonable. The three players the Rox got are overrated. Buchholz is a triple A guy, Taveras is backup material, and Hirsh hasn't blossomed as hoped.
- Lee's deal was a win now-pay later signing. I wouldn't have done it, but Lee's held up his end so far.
- Hanging on to Lidge was exactly the right call. No reason to sell low, and the guy has rebounded somewhat.
- What should he have done re: Clemens and Pettitte? You see how important they were.
If I had been Purpura, I probably would've reconciled myself to rebuilding after Clemens and Pettitte left (ie passed on Woody, Lee, and Jennings), but given the state of the NL Central, it was reasonable to go for it.
So
you defend Purpura but admit you would have gone in a totally direction?
I'll admit he didn't have easy choices.........and it couldn't have been fun working for a billionaire with an ego
Yeah...
The thing is, the Astros believed going into 2007 that the NL Central was weak, and in Berkman and Oswalt they had Pujols-Carp type combo that would likely be past their prime in three or four years. I can see trying to milk another run or two when you've got those two guys.
Whoa!
The Lee deal -- awful, as everyone knew from the beginning. It's not bad for this year and might not be next year either, but he's the worst OF in the national league (according to UZR) and will be a DH in the NL (and an $18 M one at that) in a couple of years. And he's locked up for 6 more after this one.
the Jennings deal -- beyond horrible. At least Lee's a pretty good hitter. Even had Jennings pitched the way they thought he would, he would've only been marginally better than Hirsh. But he was only under contract for 1 year whereas they would have had Hirsh for 5 more. And Hirsh earns the minimum -- more than $5 M less than Jennings earns this year. Plus they gave up their starting CF and another young pitcher.
As for Taveras -- a 4th OF? Yes, probably. However, he'd have been the starting CF in Houston, and a good defensive CF considering that they have a fly ball staff and Lee in LF and Scott in RF. Since they traded Taveras, they've used the likes of Chris Burke and Jason Lane in CF, before Pence and while he was on the DL. Since Pence wasn't in the plans for this year, it seems silly to trade the only guy who can play CF.
Since we mentioned Pence, it should've been obvious during spring that Pence was ready or, at the very least, was better than Burke, Lane, and Scott -- all of whom were on the Astros roster to begin the season. Pence should've been the starting CF.
Hirsh -- hasn't blossomed as hoped? He's been a far cry better than Jennings and the Rocks have him for 4 more years. His ERA+ is 98, meaning that he's an average starting pitcher in the NL -- better than Wells or Looper have been as well. Even if Jennings' injury wasn't forseeable, Purpura should've recognized the relative values of the young starter vs. the league average starter w/ 1 year before free agency.
I should have added
- the Woody move was dumb -- really dumb!
- he was right to hang on to Lidge -- it would've been a bad move to trade him when his value was at its nadir. They should probably move him this offseason, however, as they need to add a lot of parts.
Garner took a bullet for Purpura...
see my above post
Did he deserve the mess he got? Who does? But the man is a terrible manager -- beyond bad and the only team that will benefit from his being fired is the Astros.
I actually liked the Lee deal
While we're on the subject of GMs
Only the Reds surpass Purpura in inexplicable behavior. The lame duck GM O'Brien was atrocious (though probably had hands tied) - Krivsky made a couple of clever moves then lost his mind. The performance of these two front offices have helped create Comedy Central and keep the injury riddled Cards near the top.
For whatever reasons
I don't count the Pirates...they are like the Royals and Vanderbilt sports....they are kept around for community service but not funded to a playoff competitive level...sorry KC, Pgh and Dore fans but......
You know
Yes
As a fellow SEC kinda guy, I would have to agree....Vandy may be on to something with the way they have handled the athletics office (or lack thereof) thing.....light years ahead of Pgh and KC in terms of creativity and efficiency.....and, Vandy makes money!
You cannot dis the Kansas City Royals
Royals
Just for my own personal humor, I'll continue to diss the Royals until all members of the 85 so-called championship team are gone, the flag no longer waves at their stadium and Whitey is elected to the HOF
Have at it....I just wanted you to know
add littlefield to that sad list
The division is bad...
on the contrary
by yorktro on Aug 27, 2007 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions
forgot about that
Larry, about the NL ERA
We know the bullpen has been nails, but it'd be interesting to see how each team's bullpen skews them.
For instance, the Cubs bullpen, which was a joke for most of the year has only had 1 blown save in a long time (as long as the Cards). I'm sure during that, it has helped drive the overall ERA down.
by Hardcore Legend on Aug 27, 2007 4:22 PM EDT reply actions
Garner
I could not stand all the praise he received back in 2004-2006 for getting the most out of "under-performing teams." Garner is a poor manager in most aspects. Good ridance.
I posted this in the izzy appreciation thread,
by jeff abs on Aug 27, 2007 5:42 PM EDT reply actions
Anybody got
Seems like a lot of times, they put together a little streak...hope that doesn't happen here with the Astho's.
You should always worry about the
not this year...
by Ankiels Missing Curveball on Aug 27, 2007 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting comment in Bernie's article today
The "interesting" excerpt in question:
What a division.Now where have I heard an analogy like that before? ;-)The NL Central is a George Romero film...Night of the Living Dead, Dawn of the Dead, whatever...even when it seems like you're dead in this division -- you're not.
indeed
oof...
Maroth: 1.2IP, 4ER, 3H, 1BB, 2K, 1HR
Thompson: 3.1IP, 4H, 4ER, 0BB, 1K, 2HR
Oh man.
by longhornscardinals on Aug 27, 2007 10:18 PM EDT reply actions
Maroth is done.
by Ankiels Missing Curveball on Aug 27, 2007 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions
On the bright side, Falkenborg, Perez and
Boy
by cardsfaninmass on Aug 27, 2007 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions



















