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ryan's hope AND Game 121 Open Thread: August 20, 2007

pineiro

lilly

3-2, 4.25

13-5, 3.74

that counts as a win in my book. getting out of having to face zambrano can only be good.

yesterday, for the second time this year, a cardinal minor-league affiliate won after getting no-hit for most of the game. the gcl cardinals did it back on july 7, you may recall, posting a 1-0 victory after getting no-hit for the first 14 innings of the game. yesterday it was quad cities' turn: blake wood, the royals' 3d-round pick in the 2006 draft (out of georgia tech), held the swing hitless for 8 innings and then --- having reached his pitch-count limit, obviously --- was lifted for a relief pitcher. a relief pitcher with a 5.55 era. why the opposing manager chose this particular guy to protect a 1-0 lead is beyond me; the team's saves leader was available (indeed, he eventually entered the game after it was too late). mysterious things happen in the minors sometimes. . . . . the swing's leadoff man, antonio dejesus, drew a leadoff walk and stole second; then daryl jones broke up the no-no and tied the game with a base knock to center. jones took second on the throw home, and the swing spent most of the rest of the inning attempting to bunt. the first one failed; the next moved jones over to 3d; and the last, a suicide squeeze by christian lopez, plated jones and gave the swing a 2-1 lead, which they made stick. they're 5.5 games ahead in the 2d-half standings and are well positioned to become the 2d st louis farm team to quality for the postseason. springfield is already in, having won its first-half title.

speaking of springfield, their win couldn't have been any more different from QC's; they clubbed 20 hits and bludgeoned corpus christi 17-10. colby rasmus (who's been batting leadoff lately) had the only two extra-base hits among the 20, a double and a homer; he and #2 hitter jose martinez combined for 9 hits and a walk in 12 plate appearances. martinez, the 21-year-old shortstop, seems to like the hot weather; he's hitting .370 in august with a .562 slugging percentage. last year at quad cities he warmed up in july, hitting .327 and slugging .514. . . . this guy will probably be at triple A next year and might have a chance to compete for playing time in st louis lineup by 2009.

unless he's blocked by brendan ryan, that is. ryan is even hotter than martinez at the moment, batting .424 over the last 30 days (big leagues only) with a slugging pct of .667. the manager likes him (and why shouldn't he); he already has amassed 79 at-bats and, with kennedy out of action, is sure to get regular playing time the rest of the way. depending on how things go, ryan has a chance to crack the la russa era's top-10 list of rookie-season at-bats.

and more important than that ---- he has a chance to become the cardinals' first homegrown shortstop in 30+ years. the last shortstop to come out of the system and become a long-term starter at the position was garry templeton, who came up in 1976. since then, the cardinal shortstops have all come from other organizations via trade (ozzie smith, royce clayton, edgar renteria) or free agency (david eckstein). since templeton, only four homegrown shortstops have played more than 100 games for st louis: mike ramsey (168 games between 1978 and 1983), placido polanco (121 games, 1998-2002), tim jones (119 games, 1988-93), and tripp cromer (106 games, 1993-95). none of these guys ever started as many as 100 games at short in a single year; they were all just backups. if ryan does get a shot at the full-time job, he'll be the first since luis ordaz, who started 46 games as a rookie in 1998.

for comparison's sake, here's a list of homegrown players at the other nonpitching positions --- ie, guys who game up through the system and became full-time regulars for at least a few seasons:

c: molina, marrero, zeile, pagnozzi, mike lavalliere
1b: pujols, john mabry, keith hernandez (who reached the big leagues for good the same year as templeton, 1976)
2b: geronimo pena, alicea, herr, oberkfell
3b: polanco, zeile, pendleton, oberkfell, reitz, hector cruz
of: chris duncan, taguchi, pujols, jd drew, brian jordan, lankford, gilkey, coleman, mcgee, van slyke, david green, dane iorg, jerry mumphrey
another way to break it down: since templeton left after the 1981 season, the cardinals have had a homegrown regular at catcher for 13 of 25 seasons; at first base for 9 seasons; at second for 13; at 3b for 15; in left field for 19; in center for 17; and in right for 11. but at shortstop, they've had a homegrown regular only one year --- 1995, when tripp cromer took over for an ailing, aging ozzie and started 86 games of the team's 143 games.

a large part of the explanation here lies in the fact that the cardinals' incumbents for most of this period were so good that a prospect had no chance in hell of cracking the lineup; ozzie and edgar held the position for 19 of the last 25 years. since templeton came up in 1976, the cardinals almost always have had one of the best shortstops in the league; of the five primary regulars during that era, four (templeton, ozzie, edgar, and eckstein) were all-stars, two were serial gold glovers, two won silver sluggers, and one was a postseason mvp. the only real opening for a rookie ss came in 1998, at the tail end of the royce clayton era; ordaz and polanco both got reasonably long looks, but the former couldn't hit and the latter couldn't cover the ground at ss. hence the trade for renteria during the ensuing off-season.

a few other shortstops did come out of the cardinal system and go on to become regulars for other teams. rafael santana passed through the st louis sytem (they got him as a double A player from toronto) and got traded to the mets for jose oquendo; he was the starting ss on the great strawberry-gooden teams of the 1980s. jose uribe was sent to san francisco in 1984-85 as part of the package that fetched jack clark and started there for six years, including two division-winning seasons. and of course there's jack wilson, the pirates' everyday ss for the last 6 years. so the pipeline hasn't been entirely dry.

can brendan ryan become the first homegrown ss since templeton? i wrote at length about that possibility at Future Redbirds back in may, and azruavatar updated the picture just last week. he's surely not this good a hitter ---- in 79 at-bats for st louis, he has hit more homers than he did in any full minor-league season --- but his glove is big-league caliber, and he obviously doesn't get intimidated. with that glove, all he needs to supply is .720 ops, and i'm a lot more confident today that he can produce at that level than i was 3 months ago.

and if he doesn't stick, jose martinez and (hopefully) pete kozma will be right behind him to take their shots.

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Late 90's
We had a number of SS prospects then--Ozuna, Kennedy, Butler, Wilson, Polanco

I am excited about our group right now--Ryan, Hoffpauir, Martinez, and Kozma. Hopefully, Greene can come back healthy and become the best of the bunch

Come on You Redbirds--Mike Shannon

by BluesDrummer85 on Aug 20, 2007 9:49 AM EDT reply actions  

Another explaination....
Larry, you hit on the obvious answer which is that Ozzie and Edgar stunted SS development.  The Cards didn't draft SS prospects because there was no need.  If they did get a decent SS prospect, he was moved to another position because of the incumbant, see Polanco.  

Another factor at play is that many, many SS canidates get moved from the position to either 2B or 3B. Part of the reason is the difficulty of fielding the position, players are moved to an "easier" position, if they cannot handle it.  

by Brock20 on Aug 20, 2007 9:59 AM EDT reply actions  

Tommy Pham
Is a current example of Brock's explanation. The Cards did not even give him a chance to be a SS prospect. Instead they moved him almost immediately. Shaun Boyd was moved to the OF fairly quickly also when he was drafted.
Come on You Redbirds--Mike Shannon

by BluesDrummer85 on Aug 20, 2007 10:02 AM EDT reply actions  

Pham
You know, I find their handling of Tommy Pham very suspect.  Yes, the kid was bad last season with the glove, but they move him off one of the most premium of all positions after less than one full season there?  He would have had to actually catch on fire when a ball was hit to him for me to have given up that quick.  If the Cardinals have that little faith in their minor league coaches, that they don't think there's any way they could fix the kid's footwork and all, then they should maybe think about finding some different coaches.  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

My uneducated guess
They may have felt that his fielding woes were so seriously hindering his bat development that they wanted to take some pressure off him. He's young enough and will see enough extended spring training playing in short season that he could still move back to short if his bat comes around.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hmmm...
You know, you could be right.  I had never thought of that particular angle before.  If that's the reason, I still don't think it's a very good idea, but there is at least some sort of logic to it.  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ryan, etc.
I like the idea of a 2009 middle infield of Ryan at short and Martinez over at second base.  Not a whole lot of power there, but it would be a tremendously athletic middle arrangement.  Add in Rasmus in center, (or Daryl Jones if he's figured it out, hell, this Henley kid can cover acres, apparently, and does nothing but rake) and you might have a pretty solid core up the center of the field in a year or two.  If I wanted to get crazy, I would throw Bryan Anderson's name in there, too, but I don't want to start any arguments.  Especially after Yadi played so well in Milwaukee.  

If I'm the Cardinals, though, I'm still trying to move some of the veteran contracts around here to acquire a top flight MI prospect.  Never a bad idea to hedge your bets.  

To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 10:05 AM EDT reply actions  

I think
Yadi will be our Catcher for awhile. I hope he starts hitting. Martinez and Hoffpauir are exciting prospects. Ryan is already showing the ability to play up in the bigs. He has speed too. I know a lot of people are thinking Bo Hart when it comes to Ryan, but I think he has more pop, more speed, a far superior glove at 2-3 positions, and is younger.
Come on You Redbirds--Mike Shannon

by BluesDrummer85 on Aug 20, 2007 10:11 AM EDT reply actions  

About Yadi
I would say I hope Yadi continues hitting rather than I hope he starts hitting.

Yadi's average for August is .373 (it's .394 in the last ten games).  

Before his wrist injury, his average in May was .297.  He gradually improved throughout April and May before he was injured.  It took him a month to get going again after his DL for the broken wrist.  But even though that's a difficult injury to come back from (hitting wise), he has slowly worked his way to his very respectable .373 avg this month.  And he looks much more confident at the plate this year.

I also really hope Ryan is an everyday player next year--not only for the pop in his bat and his offensive stability, but because I think he has a contagious energy this team needs.  

by nycardfan on Aug 20, 2007 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm on the energy committee too
especially at the three open positions next year, viz, SS, 2b, RF.
I say 'open' because I believe we are pretty well stuck with/pleased with (pick your verb) LF {Dunc} CF {Jimbo} 1b {that big boy whose name I forget} C {yada-yada} and 3b {Rolen}
If change is going to come, and I hope it does, it will be those other three spots.  And I would like to see "energy" heavily factored in. And defense.
My early favorites are already in-house -- Ryan at SS; Eckstein moves to 2b; Ank in RF

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm a big fan of Anderson....
and I say let's see a year at AAA for Anderson, then we will talk.  Though, it will be a nice problem to have.  

by Brock20 on Aug 20, 2007 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

no kidding
After watching the Mets play Mike DiFelice and Sandy Alomar at catcher this weekend, it's nice to know that we actually have some young options should disaster strike. Maybe not this year, but soon.

by nybirdgirl on Aug 20, 2007 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Holy Tripp
References to Tripp Cromer and Luis Ordaz interwoven in one post ... well played, sir. You've made my Monday.

by sjoshi on Aug 20, 2007 10:20 AM EDT reply actions  

heh
When I looked at Ordaz's stat line, I couldn't help but think "Rafael Belliard."  

by jdub176 on Aug 20, 2007 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

With all due respect to Tony Fossas
Luis Ordaz is the worst Cardinals player I've ever seen.

He hit like a defensive specialist, and fielded like a relief pitcher.

by musial6 on Aug 21, 2007 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Weather Watch
If you look at the hour by hour things look to clear up around game time.

The radar looks like the worst stuff is moving through to the south.

From these reports, I would think the chances are good for today. The real problem at this point may be the state of the field.  The Cubbies ownership was too cheap to modernize their drainage system.

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 10:27 AM EDT reply actions  

It's already so humid
that it's practically raining.   Heavy cloud cover makes it look like rain is imminent.

I don't know how well Wrigley's field will shed this much water.  In theory, they have one of the worst outfields in baseball.  They were gonna redo it either last winter or this winter, but the sale has changed that.

by sdrone on Aug 20, 2007 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

Moving through the south
I can vouch for that. Got soaked in Champaign, IL on my walk in to work earlier.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

champaign
ur in champaign too? i feel like such a loner here all i see is cubs hats im constantly pissed off

by bigmcq16 on Aug 21, 2007 4:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

On Deadspin "Today's A Perfect Day..."
Best comment on the NL Central:
"looks more like three guys pretending to outfight each other for the garter."

I mean, seriously, we need to start whipping the Cubbies and end this farce!...before the Astros and the Reds are back in contention...

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 11:02 AM EDT reply actions  

i have fully embraced ryan @ ss
I am ready for it, because some one will give eck the gross national product of Bolivia, and he isn't worth it. I like Ryan, he is just fun to watch.

That and on a personal note it would keep my father from yelling at the tv: "why don't they move that short guy to 2nd?" and 50 times a game.

"Textbooks are Soviet propaganda" - Rev. Jerry Falwell

by elirock83 on Aug 20, 2007 11:39 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree--
but the title of your post made me LOL.

by rockin redbird on Aug 20, 2007 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I, for one, welcome our new
middle fielder overlord.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

two geezers can't be wrong
your dad is not the only one yelling that exact same thing.

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Your 2009 Homegrown Cardinals...
C: Molina or Anderson
1B: Apu
2B: Martinez or Hoffpaur
SS: Ryan or Martinez
3B: Allen Craig or Arnoldi Cruz (I know Rolen will still be here, but i'm assuming he'll have had to get his shoulder amputated by then)
OF: Some mix of Colby Rasmus, Chris Duncan (unless he continues to regress), Rick Ankiel, Antonio DeJesus (this kid has a sick ability to get on base), Daryl Jones (wishful thinking that he could put his tools together), possibly Joe Mather
SP:
  1. Chris Carpenter (I realize he isn't homegrown)
  2. Adam Wainwright (same here)
  3. Anthony Reyes
  4. Jaime Garcia
  5. Adam Ottavino
RP:
I don't really know, other than Chris Perez for closer.

Wildcards: The heavy hitting first basemen we have in the system who are blocked. Steve Hill, Mark Hamilton, Brandon Buckman.

Obviously, this is all just wishful thinking, as we'll be lucky to even get 2 or 3 of those guys to perform like MLB regulars.

- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 11:50 AM EDT reply actions  

i dont understand...
why are some many people wanting anderson as the cardinals catcher instead of yadi? at most he would be a good hitter for five years because of the wear of cathcing...but a good defensive catcher can do it for 10+ years...who wouldnt want a great definsive catcher over a good offensive catcher anyways? maybe i am missing something...
plus if yadi has a .250 avg with .340ish obp then id take him over any other catcher in the league...
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why do you assume they
are mutually exclusive?
"We're sniffing the winning situation."

by MdRedbirdFreak on Aug 20, 2007 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

and by that you mean...
a platoon?
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

No,
he means why do you assume that a catcher can only be good offensively or defensively?  The two are not mutually exclusive.  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

The reports I've read about Anderson
indicate he isn't good at defense and may need to change positions at some point if he stays with our club.

So you're right, they aren't mutually exclusive.  But it doesn't seem that Anderson is excellent at both at least this time.

by nycardfan on Aug 20, 2007 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

His defense isn't great.....
but he's not a defensive liability ala Mike Piazza, Victor Martinez, etc...

He can stick at Catcher, and his defense can be improved. His arm isn't bad, he has had some troubles with blocking balls though.

- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

well
a) as time goes on, Yadi will become more and more expensive to keep.

b) it appears that not only can Anderson hit, but he can ALSO play really solid defense

I personally enjoy having both of them. That way, if Anderson flops as he moves up, we still have Yadi.

On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

i disagree on his defense...
i have seen anderson play several times here in springfield and find him average at best defensively
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

What?
What do you base the assumption that no catcher can be a good hitter for more than five years upon?  

Also, I'm sorry, but catcher defense is vastly overrated.  Even just an average defensive catcher, who is a plus offensively, is worth far more than any glove specialist behind the plate.  There just aren't that many things a catcher does defensively to justify the overwhelming emphasis that's placed on it.  He blocks balls in the dirt and he throws out runners.  While there is value in both of those things, the number of times in a game a catcher is called upon to make a play pales in comparison to the difference he could make with a bat in his hands.  

To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

how many catchers...
are good hitters for more than five years? Piazza, IRod, maybe Posada...three out of 60+ catchers in MLB...

Also, i can see what you mean (kinda) about overratted definsively but having the confidence of the pitcher not to worry about baserunners and focus on the hitter or not thinking twice about throwing a filthy breaking ball in the dirt with the tying run on third isnt really something you can measure but is as important as any offensive stat, imho.

"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also
LoDuca, (as much as it pains me to say it) Ramon Hernandez, Varitek, even Jason Kendall, (although without any power) have all had sustained success as hitters while catching.  We'll see a whole lot more of them in the next 25 years, as the focus of evaluating players shifts a little more to the offensive side.  

There's a very quiet revolution going on, and I hope the Cardinals are a big part of it.  

To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

ill check...
but i dont think any of them have been offensivley good for more than five years...mediocre maybe...all of them have had 3-4 good years at the most...
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

First off...
There aren't that many catchers who can hit for one year, so saying they can't sustain it for five because only x of the 60 in MLB have done it is a self-fulfilling prohpecy.

Kendall sustained it until the most gruesome broken ankle in baseball history robbed him of his durability.  LoDuca's been hitting for more than five years, so has Varitek.

Then there's Mauer, Martinez, and McCann, who are going to keep hitting.

by whopperman on Aug 20, 2007 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

After watching the Brewers
and some other NL teams since the all star break, I think a good defensive catcher is essential.  Yadi has saved us from a lot of runs, whether that be from stealing or wild pitches or good catches.

by nycardfan on Aug 20, 2007 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

I find it interesting that you'd say this
"Also, I'm sorry, but catcher defense is vastly overrated. "

as Ankiel patrols right field for us.

by sdrone on Aug 20, 2007 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Huh?
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

day game today...
no game thread right away?
VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 12:08 PM EDT reply actions  

Game isn't until 2:20 ET/1:20 CT
still plenty of time.

I'm somewhat annoyed at the Cubs for this not being a DH.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

i am and i'm not
am: it was already a sceduled day game today and it wouldn't have been that hard to either a) tack on a night game or b) play them back to bakc (even thought that never happens anymore).

am not: the cubs have to travel out to the home of BALCO's favorite client after the game today.

VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

cubs v giants
it will make me feel dirty, but i will be cheering for the giants this week (but hoping barroid is a big ol' ofer)
Just remember -- if the world didn't suck, we would all fall off

by RosevilleRedbird on Aug 20, 2007 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Giants and Pirates played a btb
just last week.  I was planning to go to the 2nd game, as I figured it wouldn't start until 8:30.  Unfortunately, the first game took a whole 1 hour and 50 minutes and the second game was started before 7:30.

That's 1 game starting at 5:00 and the 2nd at 7:30.  

Had the Cubs wanted to, they could have bumped the first game up to a 12:30 CT start time and had the 2nd game 'start' 45 minutes after that one.  Remember, we were already in the 3rd inning of yesterday's game.  Could have just resumed it.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes you are right but,
doesn't it have to be a tie game and later than the fifth inning to resume a game?

is the weather forecast still as shitty as it was last night?

VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Home Team Descretion??
Who decides these things?  Does the League Office not have a say, or the Cardinals either?

I suppose the Cubs like their chances better by rescheduling since they used the great Zambino for only three innings.

Fan for Life. Go Cards.

by Birds on the Bat on Aug 20, 2007 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

the who decides question
is complicated I think.  I believe the home team holds the ace card... but I also understand that the PLAYERS (visitors too) in some cases have some veto power.  I think this is because of the players' union contract re consecutive days played.
Hypothetically... Cubs management may have wanted a DH today, but that could have been nixed by either the Cub players OR Cardinal players.  I said hypothetically; I'm sure that was not the case this time.
Also, this late in the season, it is probable that the Commish could step in and over-ride a players veto, or out and out set the date (for a make-up game) himself.

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

and i am somewhat annoyed
at the cubs, well, for being the cubs...
Just remember -- if the world didn't suck, we would all fall off

by RosevilleRedbird on Aug 20, 2007 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wrigleyville
has a love/hate relationship with the Cubbies - they're limited by their agreements with the neighborhood on how many they can play, so I don't know that they have the leeway to just tack on another game like that.

by LilEck on Aug 20, 2007 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Smart on their part
I'm not sure how they would do this.  But next in the starting rotation line-up for us?  Adam Wainwright (he of the soon-to-be sub-4.00 ERA variety, knock on wood).  Next in the starting rotation line-up for the Cubs?  Jason Marquis (he of the soon-to-implode variety).
"The Phillies honored PR man Larry Shenk for 44 years of service. Shenk told the crowd he had one request: 'Don't boo so much.' The crowd promptly booed."

by Mr Redbird on Aug 20, 2007 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mulder's current 5 day rotation
has him on pace to start in that DH at Busch against the Cubs.  Interestingly enough, if they pushed him back just 1 day he could make his next 2 rehab starts and then start for the big league club on September 1st.  

Otherwise, he gets 3 more rehab starts and enters the rotation on September 5th @ home vs Pittsburgh.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 12:55 PM EDT reply actions  

I vote wait
for Pittsburgh.  Unless we dovetail and are out of the chase again... in which case, it doesn't matter.
I'm still one who believes Mulder will not pitch a single inning this year.

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rasmus is having some kind of August
BA = .396
OBP = .522
Slug% = .830
OPS = 1.352
BB/K = 12/6

He's definitely proving to be a very streaky player, similar to Edmonds, but when he gets hot.. Damn...

That BB/K ratio is by far the best ratio he's had in any month this year, leads me to believe he is really seeing the ball well.

I think he's still on track to be here by 2009, anyone disagree?

by boilertiger on Aug 20, 2007 1:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Yea...
that first month of the season, and now this one, now he just needs to work on doing it in between.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ryan
leading off today.  I'm very excited.  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 1:21 PM EDT reply actions  

Lineup
Ryan 2b
Ankiel LF
Pujols 1b
Encarnacion RF
Rolen 3b
Edmonds CF
Molina C
Pineiro P
Eckstein ss
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cubbie Cam
It is DRY out there, looks like we are gonna get this one in today (although i haven't looked at a doppler or anything).

by lopey986 on Aug 20, 2007 1:24 PM EDT reply actions  

Pujols Rankings (8/20)
  • Ranks 8th in NL in BA (.321)
  • Ranks 5th in NL in HR (27)
  • Ranks 10th in NL in RBI (79)
  • Ranks 5th in NL in BB (75)
  • Ranks 2nd in NL in OBP (.423)
  • Ranks 8th in NL in SLG (.564)
  • Ranks 6th in NL in OPS (.987)
As far as the counting stats, to be in the Top 5 in every catagory:

10 RBIs behind Miguel Cabrera
10 BA pts behind Chipper Jones
17 SLG pts behind Chase Utley
Tied with Prince Fielder in OPS

Comparing him to the widely touted NL MVP candidate, Prince Fielder:

    Pujols         Fielder
BA  .321(8th)      .284 (36th)
HR   27 (5th)       38  (1st)
RBI  79 (10th)      92  (4th)
R    77 (12th)      82  (6th)
BB   75 (5th)       59  (17th)
OBP .423 (2nd)     .379 (20th)
SLG .564 (8th)     .609 (1st)
OPS .987 (6th)     .987 (5th)

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 1:36 PM EDT reply actions  

Fielder can't be the fave any more....
Not with the Brewers nosediving their way out of the race, he's not even the MVP of that team any more (Ryan Braun is). Homers do seem to be the most important category in MVP voting, but Ryan Howard also had a .300+ batting average to go with his last year, as well as the RBI title and he led a Phillies team that had been left for dead to the brink of the playoffs.

Right now, i'd say the top 5 candidates for NL MVP are (in no particular order), if we are going by #'s and not team position:

  1. Pujols
  2. A. Ramirez
  3. H. Ramirez (What a season he is having, Jose Reyes who?)
  4. Jake Peavy
  5. Matt Holliday
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Doesn't matter.
The only number that really counts is that home run number.  You want proof?  Last year's MVP.  You want further proof?  Andruw Jones, circa 2005.  Yeah, he hit 70 points lower, but Pujols stole that MVP award from him.  

I take your insistence on well rounded players as further proof of your lack of baseball knowledge.  

To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah..
The rankings that matter are probably...

HR
HR
RBI
HR
RBI
team record / team rank
HR
OPS
HR

by redbird2006in on Aug 20, 2007 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

In all honesty
If Pujols wants to win the award, he has to do the following
  • In the Cardinals final 11 games of August, hit 5 HRs and drive in 13 RBIs.  (Season totals: 32 HRs/ 92 RBIs).
  • In September, the Cardinals will play 31 games.  A lot of opportunity there to add to the counting stats.  Pujols had the best September of his career last year (10 HRs/28 RBIs).  Traditionally, he hasn't be amazing in that month.  With all the extra games, he needs to be certain to reach the 40+ HR marka and the 110+ RBI mark.
  • The Cardinals need to make the playoffs.  I know, Ryan Howard's Phillies didn't, but for Pujols to put away the likes of Ramirez and Fielder/Braun, HIS team needs to make the playoffs.
He does those things, and he'll get the MVP he deserved last year.  This doesn't even count the SABR stuff.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jose Martinez
I'd hold off getting excited about him. I've watched a half-dozen games at Springfield, and the kid at shortstop is (at best) average defensively. Questionable hands, not much range, arm like Eckstein's. We'll see what happens as he gets older.
All things are ready if our minds be so.

by Dexter Westbrook on Aug 20, 2007 2:06 PM EDT reply actions  

Flipping Daryl Ward and Jacque Jones
seriously, those 2 are the 2 players that are what is keeping the Cardinals from being near 1st place.

Either of those balls don't sneak over the wall and we are looking at a sweep the other way.

Freakin' Cubs.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:07 PM EDT reply actions  

And furthermore
with all the rain, starting this game at the original 1:20 start time is stupid.  This game should have started at 1:05.

I hope we beat their heads in today.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'm sensing pent up anger ;)
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's just when you stop and think about it
you find yourself saying:
"Come on now, they're the f$($%$(**% Cubs for chrissake!"
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Today is so huge
I feel like the season swings in its outcome....the difference between 3 and 5 games is just so big at this time of year

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 2:26 PM EDT reply actions  

damn it Albert
you barely EVER swing at the first pitch....

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 2:26 PM EDT reply actions  

this is pathetic....
wow.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:29 PM EDT reply actions  

GRRRRR
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 2:29 PM EDT reply actions  

this is pathetic
we're not even asking them to get hits. All they need to do is frickin put it in the outfield.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 2:29 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm so sick of this
a long fly scores the run, a well placed grounder scores the run...

by hannah_in_va on Aug 20, 2007 2:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Are you kidding me with this shit?
We start the game with runners at 2nd and 3rd and no outs, and our #3 and #4 hitter pop up on the infield?!?

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 2:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Early lead
That's important since this game might be called after five or six.

Go get it, boys!

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 2:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Clearly
the cards are going to show the cubs what loosing looks like...

by JMedwick on Aug 20, 2007 2:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Scotty Rooooooooooo!!!
"The Phillies honored PR man Larry Shenk for 44 years of service. Shenk told the crowd he had one request: 'Don't boo so much.' The crowd promptly booed."

by Mr Redbird on Aug 20, 2007 2:33 PM EDT reply actions  

ATTABOY, SCOTTY!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 2:33 PM EDT reply actions  

good job Rolen
I forgot what a two out looked like.

by Hammondsbird on Aug 20, 2007 2:33 PM EDT reply actions  

Is anyone else
getting commerials?  MLB.tv must not be paying attention.  

by cardsgirl95 on Aug 20, 2007 2:35 PM EDT reply actions  

did JEd hit the ball hard?
it said line drive on game day but was it smoked?
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 2:36 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah.
Nice contact, just hit it to where the left fielder was.  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Brendan Ryan
Larussa, with Ryan leading off the game with a basehit, STILL doesn't steal 2nd base.

If we can't run on Jason Kendall with our fast players, then we plain old can't steal.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:36 PM EDT reply actions  

we are last in the league
in steals... and in attempts

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Eat it,The Riot
don't run on Slick Rick.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:36 PM EDT reply actions  

i love
how the 1-2-3 hitters are all batting .320 or over.

by tomsteele on Aug 20, 2007 2:37 PM EDT reply actions  

way to go ankiel
ready to start pitching again?

by Hammondsbird on Aug 20, 2007 2:37 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm only gamedaying it...
was Ankiels throw a bullet ?
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Ankiel lept into the Ivy
it hit the top of his glove and bounced back into the outfield.  Rick ran in, picked it up barehand and threw a no hopper to Rolen who applied the tag on The Riot.  Actually, he just put the glove down and waited for The Riot to get there.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

ankiel
should be the most obvious outfielder to have a good arm.

good think Theriot, good thinking.

On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 2:37 PM EDT reply actions  

That kid has a gun
did he used to be a pitcher or something?
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 2:38 PM EDT reply actions  

classic...
n/t
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

the best there ever was, in this game
coulda broke every record in the book...
"This is a ball club with issues." -Nats announcers (talking about the Cardinals)

by SleepyCA on Aug 20, 2007 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Was it like...
SWING and there's a home run to left

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, basically -
Something pretty close to "Swing, and a home run. One pitch and the Cubs are back in it -- OH, it's off the wall!! There's going to be a play at third, and he's going to be out! WHAT A THROW BY ANKIEL!!!"

I like it a lot better when the other team's no doubt home runs stay in the park than when ours do....

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sweet mercy that kid's got a cannon
Great job, Rick!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 2:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Cards think Cubs are stealing signs
as per Len and Bob.  They are using multiple signs on pitches with no one on.

That might explain something.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:40 PM EDT reply actions  

i don't know what...
the cubs aren't doing much damage on good pitches; they've just hit a couple of timely mistakes.

tony's paranoid.

by ortic jones on Aug 20, 2007 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

They said this
because Yadi was going through a series of signs.  Doesn't he always do that?  It didn't seem unusual to me, but I watch him several times a week and Len and Bob don't.  

by cardsgirl95 on Aug 20, 2007 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I noticed...
Molina using multiple signs the first game of the series.  

by Hoffa on Aug 20, 2007 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can anyone think of a team
that has better overall defense than these 07 cards?

by El Hombre on Aug 20, 2007 2:41 PM EDT reply actions  

Almost every team in baseball
Now, if you meant with this lineup:

CF Edmonds
LF Ludwick
RF Ankiel
1B Pujols
2B Kennedy
SS Ryan
3B Rolen
C Molina
P Wainwright

Yeah, that's a pretty good defensive team.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

a lot
actually.

I will admit that I think our defense is underrated though. ESPN etc. always says it's very below average, but when we've got Yadi, Rolen, Pujols, and Ryan starting, that's a beautiful infield.

Our outfield could use work, though. . .

On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

'04 cards were pretty good
granted lwalk and reggie were on the downside but both were pretty good plus edgar matheny... womack was the weakest link but had one of his better years definsivly
"Back in the day when I played, a pitcher had 3 pitches: a fastball, a curveball, a slider, a changeup and a good sinker pitch." - Mike Shannon

by nomar34 on Aug 20, 2007 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry,
I did not mean best defensive team ever, what teams this year are better defensively?

by El Hombre on Aug 20, 2007 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Colorado and Atlanta, for two
and probably the Mets.
(( just my opinion ))
but I for one, concede your general point.

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

last night
did they ever announce a makeup date?
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 2:42 PM EDT reply actions  

nope.
VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

What happened to the Eckstein...
who worked a count and was an acclaimed bunter?
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:47 PM EDT reply actions  

Wha???
The hell was Eckstein doing there?  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 2:49 PM EDT reply actions  

The SWING
Tony La Russa was impressed with the strategy of bunting with three batters in the ninth by the Swing of the Quad Cities last night and wanted to try it out himself.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Subject
Did you guys know that you can't use only punctuation as a subject?  I tried to post my Eck comment with just three question marks as the subject, and it was denied.  Wonder why it's set up that way?  I figured any character would do.  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 20, 2007 2:51 PM EDT reply actions  

that bit.
i was all psyched for walk, ankiel doubles them in

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 2:51 PM EDT reply actions  

Nice plan,
too bad the ump didn't follow your script.  

by cardsgirl95 on Aug 20, 2007 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

New Rule: If Ted Lilly throws that shitty curve
again, everyone hand it back out as souvineirs to the drunks in the bleachers.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:52 PM EDT reply actions  

wow.
Yeah...I see it now...I think I just learned how to diagnose "hung curve" on Gameday.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Miguel Cairo?
Cards signed Miguel Cairo? why? would he be doing Spiezio`s job?

by Calhoun on Aug 20, 2007 2:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Cairo
Looks like a "break glass in case of emergency" signing, in case Scotty goes down.

by mikedallas23 @ Viva El Birdos on Aug 20, 2007 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Brian Barden
Will probably get swapped in for Travis Hansen on the 40-man and get a September call-up. Until then, Ryan's the backup at the hot corner.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Daryl Ward, again?
Drill him next time up.  He clearly needs to be woken up and realize how fat he is.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 2:54 PM EDT reply actions  

Seriously....Daryle ward?
i'm glad he could get his first 2 homeruns of the season off us :/
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:55 PM EDT reply actions  

They must be
Serving sno-cones in hell.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

daryl freakin ward AGAIN?!?!?!?!
i can't stand it.
VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 2:55 PM EDT reply actions  

mark freakin' derosa.
excuse as i go slit my wrists.
VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 2:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Ward
He was the last visiting player to cycle at Busch II, if I'm not talking out of my ass. And I don't think I am.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeez Pineiro....
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 2:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Is the Jo-el run of dominance over?
I blame the article in the post-dispatch this morning as jinxing Pineiro's sucess...

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 2:58 PM EDT reply actions  

c'mon Pineiro
stop the bleeding while we've still got a tie.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 2:59 PM EDT reply actions  

i hate gameday.
i have this horror-movie feeling that lilly has already batted and gotten an rbi AND I DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT YET!!!

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:00 PM EDT reply actions  

lol
Maybe he`ll be a poopy pants lol
Did anyone else here Skip say that? that was hilarious

by Calhoun on Aug 20, 2007 3:00 PM EDT reply actions  

That was good stuff
I think FSN replayed that interview about 100 times, and it made me giggle every time

by hannah_in_va on Aug 20, 2007 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Signs
2 more bombs. So maybe they are stealing signs? Or is Jo-el just dishing them up?

by paCardsFan on Aug 20, 2007 3:03 PM EDT reply actions  

where's big red and the other chicago people?
are we going to get this one in or should the cardinals try to get the lead by the fifth?
VEB Fantasy Football League! leave me a comment, and i'll send you an invite!

by stlcardinalsfang on Aug 20, 2007 3:04 PM EDT reply actions  

I think that regardless
we should score in every inning, and preferably none of those lame-a$$ straight-line figures.  I like 8's.  They are curvy.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Do it again Scotty
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Oquendo is bassackwards
He sends players on close plays, holds them on stand up scoring ones.

Pujols would have scored easy, unless he tripped on a beer can.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:09 PM EDT reply actions  

Oquendo
Pujols was dying to try to score on Juan`s double and it looked like when he stopped he kind of snotted off at Oquendo for holding him up lol I love aggressiveness.

by Calhoun on Aug 20, 2007 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Scotty is on fire!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:10 PM EDT reply actions  

LOL
I love it when they just fall down

by hannah_in_va on Aug 20, 2007 3:10 PM EDT reply actions  

If the ball did what gameday says
that's twice Ramirez has screwed up a ground ball for Theriot.  He did it Saturday.

by sdrone on Aug 20, 2007 3:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Now...no one remind Joel Pineiro....
that he is Joel Pineiro, be it at the plate or on the mound.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:13 PM EDT reply actions  

Better take that 1st strike, Joel
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Bah.
I guess you can swing at THAT.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Man
he crushed that! I thought it might be a gapper...

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gotta love this team's tenacity
to pick up Jo-el and give him the 2 run lead right back.

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 3:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Hey, he gave it a ride
Not a bad AB, Joel.  Now get back on the mound and no more with the meatballs.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Piniero made good contact....
...but Dan's call made it sound like he'd be rounding the bases.  

by jdub176 on Aug 20, 2007 3:16 PM EDT reply actions  

I thought it would be too
it was ripped, good uppercut swing, timing looked good.

Then again, the last 3 years there have been alot of balls that USED to be HRs.  Hmmm..

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah
Dan does that a lot - "EDMONDS!...and the right fielder is under it with plenty of room..."

by jdub176 on Aug 20, 2007 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

they just intentionally walked
the catcher.  With two outs.

Could we have warmed up WonderBrad and sent up a pinch hitter?

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Huh?
It's only the top of the 3rd inning.  And with a possible rain delay?  That would be a really bad idea.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, i wasn't thinking about rain delays
hmmm...maybe they should show raindrops on Gameday?

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

As someone said earlier: "Look out below
Ted Lilly is falling back to earth.

As I say that, Murton singles to RF.  Get Babyface up!

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:18 PM EDT reply actions  

A little early for hittin' the sauce, isn't it?
Lilly?

Murton?

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey, Theriot...
please run on Yadi.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:19 PM EDT reply actions  

were the pickoff festivities
distracting JJ?  I know they'd be distracting to me.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:21 PM EDT reply actions  

Wanna get the bullpen up NOW
Tony?  Wainer will give the pen some rest tomorrow, might as well hand this one over now.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:25 PM EDT reply actions  

OK, I'm convinced
7 hits (w/ 2 HR) thru 3 is bad.

I guess we better warm up WonderBrad.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

be it time
to start the "would ryan have got that?" game?
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 3:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Yes, he would have
but he can only play so many positions. :D
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

No kidding
I mean, sure the kid hustles...but c'mon.  ;-)
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha
okay, so we start Ryan at SS / 2B and bust out the softball 4 outfielders. No one would ever hit a double again!
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

That game
seems to be getting played pretty frequently these days.

(and yes, he would have.)

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joel P doesn't got it today
short leash tony. short leash.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Nice.
Good turn, guys.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 3:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Thank god.
Good ol' 4-6-3.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Based on what we've seen from Jo-el so far
if ankiel doesn't make that play in the first, this could be an ugly game. Hopefully tony has him on a short leash.

by jeff abs on Aug 20, 2007 3:29 PM EDT reply actions  

i hope we bat around
so i can ask more silly questions about whether to pull pineiro for a pinch hitter.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:29 PM EDT reply actions  

wtf
is Gameday saying?  Foul bunt with nobody on?

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 3:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Bunt for base hit attempt
Ankiel was just robbed of his 2nd double on the day.  I don't ever want to see him sit against a LHP again.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rick needs to take those pitches to left
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:33 PM EDT reply actions  

If the best defensive 1B
isn't playing there, that's a base hit (sorry to Albert, but Derek Lee is better)

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Okay
But I still think he's a little "pull happy".  Methinks a line drive to left would be better than a ground ball to the right side.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

It didn't touch the ground until it was behind
the 1st base bag.  Lee dove and speared it from going into the bullpen.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ahhh...
I stand corrected.  I'm watching via gameday, which merely described it as "grounds out to 1st".

Pull away, Rick!

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pineiro still getting knocked around
we HAVE to try and hold on to the lead here in the 4th and pray for rain.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:36 PM EDT reply actions  

Here comes the rain
hurry up Jo-El, get this guy out and let's swing at the 1st pitch next inning.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cubs relievers
Will begin warming up and "accidentally" throw a few warm-up tosses into play.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Whew.
They're not missing by much.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah
we're playing with fire here.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

with a one run lead
I don't like this - every ball off of Jo-el is just crushed.

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Now with a two run lead
we can breath easier - thanks ALberto!

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Any action in OUR pen?
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:40 PM EDT reply actions  

PUUUUUU!!!!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:41 PM EDT reply actions  

That begs the question -
how many of his shots have been of the solo variety?

Seems like most of them.

by Urban Pawnee on Aug 20, 2007 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

lately a ton of them...
no one gets on ahead of him most of the time.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

10 of his 12 post ASG HRs
have been solo shots.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Scotty is da man.
3 for 3 so far.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Think Rolen might try to steal off Kendall?
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:45 PM EDT reply actions  

NM
E-4.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

What's the weather like there?
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:45 PM EDT reply actions  

That's better
the cubs are starting to act like the cubs again

by hannah_in_va on Aug 20, 2007 3:46 PM EDT reply actions  

C'mon Yadi...
Just don't GIDP...
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:47 PM EDT reply actions  

Dammit
Anything but a DP and Tony would have been forced to pinch hit for Piniero.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ask and you shall...not receive.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can't blame Yadi for that one
he smoked it - good defensive positioning - Lilly got away with one (much like Jo-el did last inning!)

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pinch-hit
We need to pinch-hit if Yadi doesn't DP here.

by mikedallas23 @ Viva El Birdos on Aug 20, 2007 3:48 PM EDT reply actions  

Please don't walk the damn pitcher
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:50 PM EDT reply actions  

Thank you.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeez,
I hope Jo-el gets out of this inning unscathed so they PH for him. To state the obvious. What's his pitch count?

by boog on Aug 20, 2007 3:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Why did Ted Lilly bat for himself?
Lou is a moran!

You need runs, the rain is coming and you let your pitcher who is getting TAGGED hit for himself?

May Ludwick crush him to leadoff next inning.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Nevermind
Tony will bat Joel for himself with 3 straight groundouts.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

I believe...
that the official spelling is "maroon".
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

wouldn't that make it "mooran?
chill out a bit.  The fact that he put the word in bold probably should have been enough of a [SIC], but since it wasn't:

http://www.dannemann.org.uk/images/morans.jpg

"This is a ball club with issues." -Nats announcers (talking about the Cardinals)

by SleepyCA on Aug 20, 2007 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

man...
i usually think of cards fans as intellectual 'cause i mostly get to compare them to reds fans but...

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Classic pic
He could be a Cub agent provocateur, though--note the Bear fan mustache and mullet. He's heavily disguised in do rag and what appear to be swimming goggles--and a shirt he picked up at that Salvation Army megastore near Grand & Halsted.
"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can relate, lordsummer
living my whole life less than two hours from Cincy.
But... their new park is cute and efficient; and I, for one, appreciate Grande and Welsh.
but NOT Thommie-boy.

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Eckstein's defense is putrid
almost gets Albert injured on a routine groundball.

Can we end this farce and move Ryan over to SS?

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 3:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Crap
joel's pitch count is low. he may hit for himself.

(could get a qs, though)

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 3:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Sweet...OFFICIAL GAME!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:53 PM EDT reply actions  

there we go......
now LET IT RAIN!
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:53 PM EDT reply actions  

that quick inning means
we'll probably see jo-el in the 6th

by jeff abs on Aug 20, 2007 3:53 PM EDT reply actions  

it was a clever ploy by the Cubs...
to make TLR keep Joel in for the next inning when faces Lee, Ramirez, Ward
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wouldn't So be a better PH over Ludwick...
due to the lefty/righty splits?
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 3:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Great job by Joel
He settled down nicely.  Even nicer job by Tony to realize he didn't have it today.. excellent managing right there.
"We're too talented to let this season go down the drain." - Adam Wainwright

by stltrav09 on Aug 20, 2007 3:56 PM EDT reply actions  

david eckstein
5 pitches, 3 outs

by jeff abs on Aug 20, 2007 3:58 PM EDT reply actions  

Eckstein freaking SUCKS
keep swinging at the first pitch midget, i hope you never get your leadoff spot back.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 3:58 PM EDT reply actions  

he's a terrible baseball player
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

In case you've forgotten
World Series MVP.

Some people are never satisfied.  

"We're too talented to let this season go down the drain." - Adam Wainwright

by stltrav09 on Aug 20, 2007 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

So?
That was last post season, and he didn't deserve the award. They gave it to him for being a "feel good story". Scott Rolen was much more deserving. He is not a good baseball player.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree
that part of the decision to select eck MVP was because he is very media friendly.

by jeff abs on Aug 20, 2007 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's won 2 WS championships
as a shortstop, the most important position player on the team.  Give it a rest.

by silent_bob on Aug 20, 2007 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

You got me by nine seconds...
I still think you have hostility issues, even though you're right...
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

The MVP was Rolen...
the tools who vote for that award thought Eckstein would make a better "story".
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

It was Rolen's award
remember, Eckstein has quite a few 'clutch hits' that were actually errors.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

you turn on players so fast
didn't you do this with Rolen earlier in the year?

What's the purpose of venting uncontrollably here?

by silent_bob on Aug 20, 2007 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

when did I turn on Rolen?
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Let's not turn on our guys
Wow, man. In Eck's 7 games since August 10, he's gone 12 for 30, including 5 multihit games. (That .400 patch includes Saturday's 0 for 4 but not today's 0 for 3.) In the Milwaukee sweep he was 2 for 5 each game and got his season-high 3 RBIs in the last one.
"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cmon, Brendan...
Get on base for Rick...
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:00 PM EDT reply actions  

Tough AB by Ryan
Showing Eckstein how it's done...
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

WOW
I love this kid.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great at bat B-Ry
Regardless of the outcome.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 4:02 PM EDT reply actions  

Kerry Wood
is warming in the 'pen. Is it just me, or does he resemble Leonardo DiCaprio these days?

by lawman3842 on Aug 20, 2007 4:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah, not to sound mean or anything
but he looks he's been living in a basement, has become a vampire, or has a disease

by hannah_in_va on Aug 20, 2007 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Leo, eh?
I can't see him on the radio, but he did used to be a dead ringer for Ray Liotta.
"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow, that was fast.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:06 PM EDT reply actions  

Was that...
...a 1st pitch changeup over the middle of the plate to DLee?

Not a good idea.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Boom
Ouch, no more first pitch right down the pipe fastballs Percy.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:06 PM EDT reply actions  

Of course - it's that type of season
Even when Tony makes a sound move - it backfires

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 4:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Lee is a beast...
he's going to get his share no matter what...
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

It appears that
the pulled Piniero so they could avoid exposing him to the meat of the Chicago order for a third time. Oops.

But hey, whatever. As good as Percival is, he's not going to strike everyone out every time. Even Johan Santana gives up homers every once in a while.

by lawman3842 on Aug 20, 2007 4:08 PM EDT reply actions  

typo
they* pulled Piniero of course, not "the".

by lawman3842 on Aug 20, 2007 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

DFA Eckstein
he's awful. Give me Miguel Cairo.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:08 PM EDT reply actions  

Confused
Did he pull Albert off the bag again?
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

By about 4 feet
Pujols had to tag Ramirez as he went by.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Man, Tony REALLY needs to move Eck to 2nd
if he's going to keep him around.

Ryan already took his leadoff spot (thank god), let's hope he soon takes the SS position, as well.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thank goodness we are using Flores now
so he can't blow the game later.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:10 PM EDT reply actions  

See what I mean?
Also nice to see Juan drop that ball off the wall allowing Ward to get to 2nd.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Did Flores just throw 1 pitch
and get pulled?  That's nice work if you can get it.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

That was
Ramirez' Juan Incarnacion impersonation - trying to pull that slider down-and-away and hitting a weak grounder instead of a home run.

But Ramirez sucks at impersonations. He totally hustled down the line that time.

by lawman3842 on Aug 20, 2007 4:10 PM EDT reply actions  

By the way
I think Daryl Ward ate an umpire or something. That is a big man. Sure runs fast for a big guy though.

by lawman3842 on Aug 20, 2007 4:12 PM EDT reply actions  

surprisingly enough
so does Prince F.  But not so much R. Howard

by CurtFlood on Aug 20, 2007 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good work
Flores.

Jeez.

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 4:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Hey, look...
Tony brings Flores in to get a lefty, and the guy gets a hit.

I mean, what are the odds?

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:13 PM EDT reply actions  

How many innings is Franklin going to pitch
today?  This was an odd use of the bullpen.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:15 PM EDT reply actions  

if I had to guess
Franklin will go some of if not all of next, then springer, then Izzy.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Remember when Kendal wasn't a good hitter?
It'd be nice if he remembered that too.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Right now
I would prefer that he stay uninformed of his previous skills.

by JMedwick on Aug 20, 2007 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Makes no sense to me.
Franklin is the 8th inning guy?

Don't tell me we are going to Izzy for a 2 inning save...

by JMedwick on Aug 20, 2007 4:17 PM EDT reply actions  

Still have Springer
and Thompson to go with Johnson as a LOOGY.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can see
Springer going the 8th.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I trust
Franklin alot more than Springer.

by JMedwick on Aug 20, 2007 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah
and that's why he was needed to get out of that big time jam.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

we needed to get out of the jam
I liked the move. Yes, he's typically the 8th inning guy, but that inning could shape out to be the more pivotal one in this game.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I really LIKE this use of Franklin
This is perhaps the game on the line here...and Franklin's been nails.

Worry about the 8th if you get there, and hope Franklin gets you there with your lead still intact.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I like the move
you've got 11 outs left.  Use your 2 best pitchers to get em.  Let Franklin get 6 and maybe Izzy get the final 5, or possibly work Johnson in between them if there's a lefty to face.

by CardFaninVA on Aug 20, 2007 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

The real DEAL
Opposite field jack on a low and away fastball.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:21 PM EDT reply actions  

SEE?
I told you he needed to take those to left.  ;-)
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

SWEET MERCY!
ROY HOBBS!!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:21 PM EDT reply actions  

The Cubbies apparently...
didn't check Rick's MiLB splits...
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

We <3 Rick.
Cheering on the Cardinals, one pitch at a time.

by ColinMacLeod on Aug 20, 2007 4:21 PM EDT reply actions  

2-run leads
We really seem to like 'em today.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 4:22 PM EDT reply actions  

So now what is the scouting report on Rick?
Can't throw him down and in, can't throw him down and away, can't throw him up, can't throw him breaking pitches.

I'd assume high heat is about all ya got left.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:23 PM EDT reply actions  

playing the role of randy flores
for the cubs, ladies and gentlemen, carmen pignatiello!

by acham8206 on Aug 20, 2007 4:23 PM EDT reply actions  

The Taunt
Our guy's one-pitch outing sucked less than your guy's one-pitch outing! Nyah!

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 4:23 PM EDT reply actions  

we don't like them
enough to keep them...
"Forget about the curveball Ricky...Give him the heater!!"

by BleacherBum on Aug 20, 2007 4:23 PM EDT reply actions  

wow...
that reply to this button is kind of important ay?
"Forget about the curveball Ricky...Give him the heater!!"

by BleacherBum on Aug 20, 2007 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wonder....
How many 1st pitch strikes Albert has taken this year?....I swear it seems like almost EVERY at bat he looks at strike 1....

by Timbo02 on Aug 20, 2007 4:24 PM EDT reply actions  

He's looked at 460 out of 523...
coming into this game. I've been counting...

That's 12%. The league average is 28%, and Albert used to be in that neighborhood. I wish someone would ask him why he's overhauled his approach. In any case, it hasn't affected the results much.

Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

WOW...
dude..I'm impressed with you having that info....I was just talking off the top of my head !...thanks !!

by Timbo02 on Aug 20, 2007 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've been keeping track all year...
writing the results down on stickies and posting 'em all over the refrigerator. My wife is leaving me...

Actually it's at baseballreference.com - pitch summary data show or hide (under Special Batting). You'll also need the glossary.

Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

These guys are HACKIN'
at Kerry's pitches.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Rain delay
probably knocks Franklin outta the game.  That's highly unfortunate.

by CardFaninVA on Aug 20, 2007 4:29 PM EDT reply actions  

Damn.
Let's just hope, then, that it doesn't STOP raining...
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Goodbye HR?
Radio guys say Ankiel's homer might not count if this game doesn't resume.

by enoscountry on Aug 20, 2007 4:31 PM EDT reply actions  

If we have to make-up
the last few innings at some later date, and that HR proved decisive... I don't want to guess what I'll do, but it'll cost me a lot of money.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

If we have to finish the game later they'll
start in the bottom of the 7th and Ankiel's HR will count, right? I think Rooney was saying on the radio that if they call the game today as a Cardinal win then the top of the 7th won't count.

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Confusing rules
They're here. I think there are a few conjunctions missing in there at a few points that would be nice for disambiguating some of this.

But: it looks like if the game is called and ruled a regulation game, it would have officially ended at the conclusion of the sixth—Ankiel's homer wouldn't count (conversely, Pigtails might breathe a sigh of relief) but the Cardinals would hoist a red W for the Wiese company with a 5-4 score. If it's suspended, the game would resume before that makeup-game for yesterday after 6 1/2 innings with the Cards up 6-4 and Ankiel's homer would be official once that game was played.

My reading of the rules is that the game will be called if it can't be resumed.

But an interesting scenario: with this wacky umpire crew, they might suspend the game. Suppose they reschedule yesterday's game for October 1st. In the event that the Cardinals and Cubs are within a game entering October, it would necessary to conclude the suspended game and possibly the make-up game, too. We could add two wins the day after the season ended, in other words.

I think I'd call in sick that day.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sure they can
It's been 5 innings, and we were alrady leading before the 1st half of the 7th.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Official Rulebook
4.10
(a) A regulation game consists of nine innings, unless extended because of a tie score, or shortened (1) because the home team needs none of its half of the ninth inning or only a fraction of it, or (2) because the umpire calls the game. EXCEPTION: National Association leagues may adopt a rule providing that one or both games of a doubleheader shall be seven innings in length. In such games, any of these rules applying to the ninth inning shall apply to the seventh inning.
(b) If the score is tied after nine completed innings play shall continue until (1) the visiting team has scored more total runs than the home team at the end of a completed inning, or (2) the home team scores the winning run in an uncompleted inning.
(c) If a game is called, it is a regulation game:
    (1) If five innings have been completed;
    (2) If the home team has scored more runs in four or four and a fraction half-innings than the visiting team has scored in five completed half-innings;
    (3) If the home team scores one or more runs in its half of the fifth inning to tie the score.
(d) If a regulation game is called with the score tied, it shall become a suspended game. See Rule 4.12.
(e) If a game is called before it has become a regulation game, the umpire shall declare it "No Game."
(f) Rain checks will not be honored for any regulation or suspended game which has progressed to or beyond a point of play described in 4.10(c)

So according to this (from MLB.COM) it's only "suspended" if the game is tied.

So as I see it, this game is official.  I don't think the top of the 7th will count (Rick's HR), since it references the last "completed" inning.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rick's homer
Was hit in the top 7th, so it wasn't during a completed inning, but a completed half-inning. The rules give the Cubs an opportunity to tie it if that were the tying run. It was an insurance run, though, and the Cardinals had a lead entering the seventh, after the completed sixth inning. So we'd win if the game is called (as it should be per the rules if the rain doesn't let up), but The Natural would be robbed of a opposite field bomb off a leftie.

by liam on Aug 20, 2007 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good question...
at the end of the last full inning the Cards were winning, so to me, that makes it official. Anyone know the rulebook on this?
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's what Rooney was saying on the radio
Shannon admitted he didn't know what the rule was (apparently there have been some recent rule changes here...?).

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think
as long as the team that was leading at the end of the last full inning is still leading, then they can call it.  

I think some of the rules are new for this year, but I remember a Yankees-Orioles game that was postponed in the 8th a couple weeks ago.  It was suspended rather than called because one team had come back and taken the lead since the end of the previous inning.

by CardFaninVA on Aug 20, 2007 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes they can
but top of the 7th doesn't count.

by jeff abs on Aug 20, 2007 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

And take away Rick's
opposite field HR?  Stop raining!

Just kidding.  We need this win, damnit.

by silent_bob on Aug 20, 2007 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rick knows he did it.
He's got the confidence, pitchers have the fear...and that's all that matters.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

But starting his career so late
if he's ever going to hit 788, he needs this one to count.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think
we can let him beat the single-season record next year.  No need to rush him.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

There are 2 possibilities now
The game ends due to rain, the top of the 7th (and the HR) do not count.  We win.

or

It's just a run of the mill rain delay, and the game picks up where it left off in an hour or so.

Right now that second option is looking very likely based on what I see on weather.com

by redbird2006in on Aug 20, 2007 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

No
they called a game I was at in the 6th against the Mets in June, so they don't always finish em.

by CardFaninVA on Aug 20, 2007 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Suspended games...
are apparently used only in the case of a tie, according to MLB.COM's posted rulebook.
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

OK, I'm wrong...
There's a LOT of additional stuff on suspended games I didn't see below the first rule (4.10):

4.12
SUSPENDED GAMES.
(a) A game shall become a suspended game that must be completed at a future date if the game is terminated for any of the following reasons:
   (1) A curfew imposed by law;
   (2) A time limit permissible under league rules;
   (3) Light failure or malfunction of a mechanical field device under control of the home club. (Mechanical field device shall include automatic tarpaulin or water removal equipment);
   (4) Darkness, when a law prevents the lights from being turned on;
  (5) Weather, if a regulation game is called while an inning is in progress and before the inning is completed, and the visiting team has scored one or more runs to take the lead, and the home team has not retaken the lead; or
   (6) It is a regulation game that is called with the score tied. National Association Leagues may also adopt the following rules for suspended games. (If adopted by a National Association League, Rule 4.10(e) would not apply to their games.):
   (7) The game has not become a regulation game (41/2 innings with the home team ahead, or 5 innings with the visiting club ahead or tied).
   (8) If a game is suspended before it becomes a regulation game, and is continued prior to another regularly scheduled game, the regularly scheduled game with be limited to seven innings.
   (9) If a game is suspended after it is a regulation game, and is continued prior to another regularly scheduled game, the regularly scheduled game will be a nine inning game.
EXCEPTION: Optional Rules 4.12(a)(7), 4.12(a)(8) and 4.12(a)(9) for National Association Leagues will not apply to the last scheduled game between the two teams during the championship season or league playoffs.
No game called because of a curfew (Rule 4.12(a)(1)), weather (Rule 4.12(a)(5)), a time limit (Rule 4.12(a)(2)) or with a tied score (Rule 4.12(a)(6)) shall be a suspended game unless it has progressed far enough to have been a regulation game pursuant to Rule 4.10(c). A game called pursuant to Rules 4.12(a)(3) or 4.12(a)(4) shall be a suspended game at any time after it starts.
NOTE: Weather and similar conditions--Rules 4.12(a)(1) through 4.12(a)(5)--shall take precedence in determining whether a called game shall be a suspended game. If a game is halted by weather, and subsequent light failure or an intervening curfew or time limit prevents its resumption, the game shall not be a suspended game. If a game is halted by light failure, and weather or field conditions prevent its resumption, the game shall not be a suspended game. A game can only be considered a suspended game if stopped for any of the six reasons specified in Rule 4.12(a).
(b) A suspended game shall be resumed and completed as follows:
   (1) Immediately preceding the next scheduled single game between the two clubs on the same grounds; or
   (2) Immediately preceding the next scheduled doubleheader between the two clubs on the same grounds, if no single game remains on the schedule; or
   (3) If suspended on the last scheduled date between the two clubs in that city, transferred and played on the grounds of the opposing club, if possible;
     (i) Immediately preceding the next scheduled single game, or
     (ii) Immediately preceding the next scheduled doubleheader, if no single game remains on the schedule.
   (4) Any suspended game not completed prior to the last scheduled game between the two teams during the championship season shall become a called game. If such game becomes a called game and
     (i) has progressed far enough to become a regulation game, and one team is ahead, the team that is ahead shall be declared the winner;
     (ii) has progressed far enough to become a regulation game, and the score is tied, the game shall be declared a "tie game." A tie game is to be replayed in its entirety, unless the league president determines that playing the rescheduled game is not necessary to affect the league championship; or
     (iii)has not progressed far enough to become a regulation game, the game shall be declared "No Game." In such case, the game is to be replayed in its entirety, unless the league president determines that playing the rescheduled game is not necessary to affect the league championship.
(c) A suspended game shall be resumed at the exact point of suspension of the original game. The completion of a suspended game is a continuation of the original game. The lineup and batting order of both teams shall be exactly the same as the lineup and batting order at the moment of suspension, subject to the rules governing substitution. Any player may be replaced by a player who had not been in the game prior to the suspension. No player removed before the suspension may be returned to the lineup.
A player who was not with the club when the game was suspended may be used as a substitute, even if he has taken the place of a player no longer with the club who would not have been eligible because he had been removed from the lineup before the game was suspended.
Rule 4.12(c) Comment: If immediately prior to the call of a suspended game, a substitute pitcher has been announced but has not retired the side or pitched until the batter becomes a baserunner, such pitcher, when the suspended game is later resumed may, but is not required to start the resumed portion of the game. However, if he does not start he will be considered as having been substituted for and may not be used in that game.
(d) Rain checks will not be honored for any regulation or suspended game that has progressed to or beyond a point of play described in Rule 4.10(c).

However, per 4.12(a)(5), I don't think this game can be suspended.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

agreed
since we had the lead going into this inning and it is past the 5th, it is a completed game.

by jroman on Aug 20, 2007 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I disagree
the rule says...

"and the visiting team has scored one or more runs to take the lead"

We already had the lead at the end of the sixth.  If we had been losing and Rick homer gave us the lead, that would be a different story.  But since we already had the lead at the end of the 6th, that run should just be negated and the game called at the end of the completed 6th inning.

"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by birds 4 life on Aug 20, 2007 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think that's exactly what Mr. Clean is saying -
because of rule 4.12(a)(5) and the fact that we were already ahead to start the 7th, they can't suspend the game; if we can't finish it today we win.

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I believe
that was Mr Clean's interpretation as well.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Whoops
My fault, wasn't reading carefully. Sorry.
"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by birds 4 life on Aug 20, 2007 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's what happens
when you're talking on the phone at work, trying to listen to the radio, and read / comment on a blog all at the same time.
"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by birds 4 life on Aug 20, 2007 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

So what are the chances of actually finishing this
game today? The regional radar at Weather Underground makes it look like the worst rain is all east of Chicago.

http://www.wunderground.com/radar/mixedcomposite.asp?region=a4&size=2x&ID=LOT19

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 4:38 PM EDT reply actions  

bigger issue
is the field.  It's been pounded and can't take much more before the game will have to be ended.

by enoscountry on Aug 20, 2007 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'd say
...the "way more biggerer" issue is who pitches for us after the delay if it were to resume.

I'm hoping it gets called.  We could use a break for once in this series...

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Whether it's delayed or called
Mike Shannon and Bob Gibson talking baseball is a significant improvement over Jeanne Zalasko and mustache-guy talking baseball.

by hannah_in_va on Aug 20, 2007 5:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Hey Mike
remember when we used to make you go stand out in RF when I pitched cause we knew they wouldn't hit anything to you?
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

First Billy
Before things got sent back to the station, though, Billy Williams, of all people, popped into the booth with Mike and John. That was a pretty cool 20 minutes. Billy did a hilarious impression of George Hendrick.
"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

TLR in the Clutch
TLR just can't handle the pressure. In what is basically a must win for the Cardinals if they are to have a reasonable chance to win the division, TLR pinch-hits for Piniero leading off the top of the 6th. The situation was, Cards up 5-3, the weather was threatening, Piniero had retired the last seven Cubs he had faced, and he had only thrown 69 pitches. He used Ludwick to pinch-hit who promptly struck out and the next two hitters were retired. TLR trots out Percival to start the bottom of the sixth whose first pitch was deposited into the left field bleachers by Derrick Lee to make the score 5-4.Percival was able to retire Aramis Ramirez and then TLR went to the ineffective left-hander Flores who immediately gives up a hit, wonderful Juan Encarnacion misplays the ball turning a single into a double. TLR then brings in Franklin who retires the next two hitters, no more damage done. But then, with the rain now pouring down the umpires halt play. Can Franklin come back and pitch when play is resumed......doubtful. So the genius TLR burns three relievers in the sixth as opposed to letting his starter go out there and pitch six and very possibly being credited with a quality start. When play is resumed, who is gonna get the game to Izzy? At least Springer is available and Tyler Johnson for a left handed hitter. But TLR severely handicapped himself. Why? Because he can't take the pressure. Thank God for Ankiel who drove a homer to the opposite field in the pouring rain to make it 6-4. Amazing ball game...very tense....where is the White Rat when you need him?

by Vinegar Bend on Aug 20, 2007 5:05 PM EDT reply actions  

slippery slope
managerial criticism is, by its nature, in hindsight.  in other words, there is no way to pause the universe in its tracks and immediately lodge one's criticisms of a managerial decision, then see how things might have played out.  this is one of the wonderfully engaging things about sports - that one can woulda coulda shoulda with ones friends and neighbors for hours, discussing how a different decision might have changed an outcome.

however, the knowledge of the distinct advantage that hindsight gives needs to be thoroughly recognized in a critique of a decision, in my view.  the idea that somehow la russa could have possessed the soothsaying ability to discern that percival, a capable major league pitcher, would have thrown a ball in such a manner as it make it likely lee would hit a home run is preposterous; in fact, it was a quite unlikely outcome, by any measure.  if soothsaying is a requirement for managerial positions, then sign up miss cleo.

again, the key is moderation in one's praises and criticisms; may we all stay in positions where our every decision is not minutely dissected by those with the advantage of knowing what the future held.

by brentonjay on Aug 20, 2007 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Or maybe not
  1. Pinero had several hard hit balls against him.  He was staying afloat but not dominating.  If he had been left in and givin up the lead people would have wanted to lynch LaRussa for leaving him in.
  2. Ever think that maybe he thought a rain delay was coming and so managed aggresivley to hold the lead?
  3. The substitutions made put people in position to succed.  Some fo the players came through (Franklin), some did not -  I guess Ludwick and Percival in this case but over the course of a season I like both moves.  Ludwick has had some good hits for us and Percival has been solid.  Its not like D-Lee is a perenial bench warmer.
  4.  The White Rat is right were he should be.  At home, retired.  LaRussa winning percentage with Cards  - .545  Rat - .530

by mcurryatl on Aug 20, 2007 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I pretty much agree with...
almost nothing in your little rant there.

Pineiro was getting hammered.  We were very lucky that some of them found some gloves, otherwise it would be the Cubs with the lead right now.  Quality start streak be damned, Joel really needed to come out after the 5th, especially with him leading off the inning.

I probably would have pitch-hit So to lead off against the lefty instead of Ludwick, but that's mostly a toss-up.

Percival's first pitch to DLee was clearly a mistake.  Can't blame Tony for that...Percival has performed well overall.

I can see your point about Flores since he's the rare LOOGY that can't seem to get lefties out, but thank god Tony didn't decide to leave him in there for MORE batters, right?  He came out right away with the hook.

I don't really see where you are getting this "pressure" slant from.  These kinds of moves are classic Tony...even when we were 10 games out, he LOVES his matchups.

Your parting shot about the White Rat is pretty revealing, and shows that it probably doesn't matter what Tony did this game, you would have tried to find fault with it, baseless or not.

Oh, and in case you didn't notice, we're WINNING this game right now...

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sure
5 bucks says this guy owns a Jeff Tabaka jersey.

by Robb on Aug 20, 2007 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

"can't handle the pressure"
Huh?

Is the idea that a man who was managed countless World Series,league championship, and stretch-run games just sort of freaked out at the idea of protecting a slim lead in an August game, and that the freak-out led him to, for example, use a LOOGY to try to get one out from a left-handed batter?

by tdawg on Aug 20, 2007 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

in Juan's defense...
that was a double all the way...no way he was going to hold him to a single I think, it was pouring rain and that field is a mess!

by Timbo02 on Aug 20, 2007 5:09 PM EDT reply actions  

It hit him in the glove
and he dropped it.  That didn't exactly help.

And it was Daryl Ward running.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

A little light reading for the rain delay
There's a new Jeff Passan column at Yahoo Sports about the playoff races, and it opens with a bit about TLR and the Cards. It's not that interesting, but it is about TLR and the Cards....

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Arx.9DWibfESH9VRU9jYTKMRvLYF?slug=jp-pulse082007&prov=yhoo &type=lgns

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 5:22 PM EDT reply actions  

Nice read
I felt the whole time reading it though, the writer just wanted to blurt out and say "No fair! The Cardinals shouldn't be winning with this pitching staff!  They didn't spend over $50 M this off-season on starting pitching like the Brewers and Cubs.  Feh!"
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

My Retort
Nobody addressed my criticism. With Piniero apparently finding his "groove" and with the threat of a rain delay literally hanging over the field of play, are there any posters out there that would not prefer to resume play with a full bullpen and the score in all liklihood no worse that it is now?

by Vinegar Bend on Aug 20, 2007 5:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Dude
Pineiro did NOT have it today. 4 of those "7 straight retired" were absolutely hammered!

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lenny and Bob said the same thing
"Pineiro seems to have settled in yet LaRussa lifts him early".

Settles in?  It was almost like they were saying "Aw Shucks, now we can't light him up"

All those flat fastballs and changeups that Pineiro was throwing against the Brewers that they weren't abusing?  Yeah, the Cubs were driving them all over the place.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

actually
everyone addressed your criticism

by tdawg on Aug 20, 2007 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm always happy...
to see Pineiro-Maroth-Looper-Wells head out and Percival-Franklin-Springer-Izzy head in.

Even though it didn't work out, I definitely like bringing Percival in to face the meat of the Cubs' order instead of leaving Pineiro in for a 3rd trip through.

Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

uh
I guess by "groove" you mean hitting balls hard right at people, and then um yeah I got nothing for you.  

Plus I would bet my bottom dollar that if Pinero had givin up the lead you'd be screaming from the rafters about what an idiot LaRussa was for not taking him out and bringing in our rock solid bullpen.

And I don't think you answered any of the counter points made with factual information of your own.

by mcurryatl on Aug 20, 2007 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

A Little Over the Top Perhaps?
A rather personal criticism with absolutely no basis in fact directed, at a fellow Cardinal fan that you do not even know.

by Vinegar Bend on Aug 20, 2007 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Unlike
A rather personal criticism with absolutely no basis in fact directed, at a Cardinal manager that you do not even know.

Oh, this irony is going down smooth tonight.

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Au Contraire
I do know Tony, and I have watched him over-manage for 10 years.

Obviously TLR had a plan. Only problem is, who closes tomorrow?

by Vinegar Bend on Aug 20, 2007 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jason Isringhausen
He threw, what, 20-25 pitches today?

(Also, I was responding to your "over the top" line as the ironic part. I hate spelling these things out.)

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Win today
Worry about tomorrow, tomorrow. Plus I smell a big Cards win , no closer needed.

by mattyfrommo on Aug 20, 2007 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

reconsidering
You know, rereading my post later, perhaps it was a bit personal.  If you took it as such, I apologize.  But personally, nothing confounds me more then hearing people harken back for the Herzog days.  Herzog was a good manager.  But he was not/ is not a better manager then tony.  You could argue that he was as good (an argument I would disagree with but entertain) but I don't think you would have a leg to stand on if you said better.  Does tony do some odd things ever once in a while?  Maybe stick with a vet to long? yep.  But after watching him manage this team for ten years, I am glad he is on our side of the dugout.

Before last year, I at least understood why some people didn't give him the respect I felt he deserved - because he hadn't won a WS with us.  I though that was a short sighted and cheap critiscm, seeing how he managed in the wild card era with us, how he always got us past the first round (sans that feaking bloop hit), how he managed to guide us through a death on the Cardinal team and keep us in contention (wait now he's done that twice...ho hum).  Do you ever look around baseball and watch talented teams crumble in the face of adversity?  You see it all the time.  But you don't see it on the teams Tony manages.  And now the championship argument is not valid anymore, and I'd like people to let Herzog stay retired and appreciate what Tony has done for baseball in St. Louis.  I guess only in baseball heaven can a sizeable segment of fans be unhappy with a guy who has won a world series, 2 NL pennents, and 7 division titles.

by mcurryatl on Aug 20, 2007 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

You should
have done the second one in all caps, like nobody was listening to you the first time.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Certainly
feeling witty today, aren't we, Alex?  
To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 21, 2007 7:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Franklin
threw all of 11 pitches. I'm betting he'll be back.

by drbill on Aug 20, 2007 5:42 PM EDT reply actions  

Anyone else watching
Comcast Sports Net rain delay?

I feel like these bloopers are from the 60s.

On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Aug 20, 2007 5:45 PM EDT reply actions  

OnDemand better pick this thing back up
and not pull a Houston/Milwaukee gig where they just cut the feed for no reason.

Let us know when the game comes back on, locals.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 5:45 PM EDT reply actions  

Game is supposed to restart at
4:55 CT.  That is 2 minutes away and InDemand* has not come back on!

*corrected.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

We're back...
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 5:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Which makes..
that whole back and forth with vinegar a complete waste of time. I suppose watching bloopers isn't exactly making the most of one's life either... or sitting in cubicle emailing people.
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey Man
What else you supposed to do during a rain delay?

by Vinegar Bend on Aug 21, 2007 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

wow
they are a bitter, angry bunch over there at bcb. here's my favorite:

-----------------
I keep telling you people
I'm telling you. No Cardinal fan has said anything worth listening to.

Ever. In the history of mankind.

by lancaster99 on Monday, August 20, 2007 at 4:17 PM CT
[ Parent ]  
-----------------

i guess that's what 99 years of failure will do to you.

there have also been numerous comments referring to most/all cards fans as stupid/arrogant, based on discussions in the p-d forums. which is sort of like making judgments about the quality of a school by spending half an hour in the special ed class.

I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Aug 20, 2007 5:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Ow.
Although my bro says the same thing about Blues discussions.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Theriot-Fontenot-Jacque...
this is just about the most frenchified team in the history of the game... They should've resigned Pierre.
Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 6:02 PM EDT reply actions  

Small Bears =
Cheese eating surrender monkeys?

by drbill on Aug 20, 2007 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey now-
No making fun of the French. Seriously. I'm moving to France for a year at the end of next month.

by matt reeder on Aug 20, 2007 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

viva le bartman!
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Aug 20, 2007 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

solid work from frankenberry
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Aug 20, 2007 6:03 PM EDT reply actions  

2 innings for izzy?
I dont like the sound of that. Prove me wrong, Jason. Prove me wrong.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 6:05 PM EDT reply actions  

I might give it a try...
..he hasn't worked since wed...i'd guess tony would go to Springer though...

by cardsfaninmass on Aug 20, 2007 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

It usually works for 4 batters
and then those last 2, he struggles against.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

using your best bullpen pitcher
in the most crucial part of the lineup... 'atta boy tony!

by jeff abs on Aug 20, 2007 6:09 PM EDT reply actions  

Izzy
I like this move.  Clearly the highest leverage situation right now with the heart of the order coming up.  Even it Tony would have to use two relievers from here on out (Izzy and Springer?) I would prefer to see Izzy go for the 8th.

by holden on Aug 20, 2007 6:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Yep.
Don't know if TLR is thinking outside the box or it's just necessity, but it is absolutely the right thing to do, no matter how it turns out...
"Don't try to figure this game out"--S. Rolen

by glennrwordman on Aug 20, 2007 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Signature aside...
LaRussa has been pushing all the right buttons lately... Ankiel over Enc, batting the pitcher 8th, turning Ryan loose, using Izzy for two innings here. I'm on board with all that.

I suppose we might miss him when he goes...

Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 6:13 PM EDT reply actions  

batting the pitcher 8th?
Has that really helped us?  When?

by redbird2006in on Aug 20, 2007 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well,
it's not the kind of thing that's obviously helpful in any specific game, but it makes intuitive sense to cluster the best hitters. There have been a number of studies on line-up construction as well, and they indicate better results hitting the pitcher 8th.

Many American League teams essentially follow this logic by putting a better hitter 9th than 8th... I also respect LaRussa for having the stones to do it and not caring about what people say.

Ease LaDunketty out gently, thank him profusely, and... Hire Antonetti!!!

by guayzimi on Aug 20, 2007 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

results
I am not sure it helped, but you can't argue with the team's record since that day in D.C.

by mattyfrommo on Aug 20, 2007 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

5-4-3!!
Classic izzy. Do it for one more, please.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 6:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Boom!
"That's a $99.99 from Cardinals Care and American Equity Mortgage!"
"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 6:16 PM EDT reply actions  

mortgage people?
can they still aford that $99.99?

by mcurryatl on Aug 20, 2007 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

The arm strength on that 5-4-3
was astounding.  Maybe I'm just used to the noodle arm MIF but everytime Ryan turns a dP I get excited.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 6:18 PM EDT reply actions  

The walk and the soft single...
All part of the master plan to set up an easy DP.  It's 2 for 1, donchaknow???  Only 9 pitches for Izzy.  He'll definitely be out in the 9th.

by holden on Aug 20, 2007 6:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Huh, that's interesting.
So you can switch positions.  They put Pie in and shoved Jones over to the corner.  I was chasing that question around the net the other day.  Never paid enough attention before.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 6:19 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah
We can put Worrell in the outfield to let Dayley get a leftie. Oops...wrong year.

by drbill on Aug 20, 2007 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Position Switches
I believe that there was a time when certain forward-thinking managers would put a righty and lefty pitcher in the game, with one as an outfielder, so you could make pitching changes during the inning without blowing through three pitchers.  Say, for instance, the line-up for the other team was righty-lefty-righty -- the righthander would start the inning, with the lefthander in LF, then the lefthander would switch positions with the righthander for the lefty and then switch back for the righty (the third batter).   This allowed favorable pitching match-ups with just two instead of three pitchers.  I believe a rule change was instituted, however, that makes this impermissible now.  
One other quirk of the position shift rules are that if a DH in the AL comes into a game later as a position player, the pitcher has to bat in the DH spot the rest of the game (subject, of course, to pinch-hitting if the pitcher is taken out of the game).

by holden on Aug 20, 2007 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wuertz kind of stinks
An unbelievably flat fastball. We should get some insurance runs here.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 20, 2007 6:20 PM EDT reply actions  

Time has no meaning
on Gameday. I assume Rayn bunted Eck to second

by drbill on Aug 20, 2007 6:23 PM EDT reply actions  

all right, instant breakfast
we're gonna love you FOR an instant with a 3-run dinger raht hyear.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 6:24 PM EDT reply actions  

wuertz is pitching the
"i will NOT TOUCH the strikezone unless i'm forced" approach

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 6:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Dat's a weiner!
"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by birds 4 life on Aug 20, 2007 6:32 PM EDT reply actions  

And...
That's a winner!
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 6:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Easy Izzy.
A New Taste Sensation!
"Don't try to figure this game out"--S. Rolen

by glennrwordman on Aug 20, 2007 6:32 PM EDT reply actions  

yeah, seriously
NOWHERE near as entertaining as the eighth.  I wonder if he'd always pitch boring ninth innings if Tony threw him up there in the eighth.

by lordsummer on Aug 20, 2007 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes!
4-2 road trip. Lots of home games coming up. Looking good....

by drbill on Aug 20, 2007 6:32 PM EDT reply actions  

i'll take a 4-2 road trip...
versus division rivals, any day of the week.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

That last one...
Looked pretty close to the basket on GameDay...how close was it?
There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 6:33 PM EDT reply actions  

very close....
off the bat I thought it was a no doubter.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fox for Wuertz
Who is he? Batting .222--sounds like 2 for 9.

"Ankiel on the track--he has it--and the Redbirds win this one 6-4, as Izzy sets them down 1-2-3 in the 9th!" --Mike

Fox and "Pigtails" called up Aug. 14:
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Ag8iuZ1wBiaoLU2lGqr3_.eFCLcF?slug=ap-cubsmoves&prov=ap& ;type=lgns

Fox now batting .200. :-)

"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Edge of warning track
barely.  Off the bat though, it looked gone.
Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

in odd moves of the day
whote sox picked up Mike myers with a club option..
07 Cards more drama than a daytime soap

by punchinjudy on Aug 20, 2007 6:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Well done!
Now off to see whether the future Birds can do it to the future Cubs as well, in Des Moines tonight. Beautiful blue sky after a dull, gray day here. Let's play two!

by Youneverknow on Aug 20, 2007 6:40 PM EDT reply actions  

oops
obviously meant to reply to this. see my post about three more down.

by thatsawinner on Aug 20, 2007 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'd be there with you...
...except the wife just gave birth to our first son.  Have a hot beef sundae for me.  Or, better yet, don't have a hot beef sundae.  Ever.

by bgodar on Aug 20, 2007 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

congrats!
a new cards fan--way to go! no hot beef sundaes for me. ever.

by thatsawinner on Aug 20, 2007 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ditto
to the congrats!  Cardinal Nation grows!

by cardsgirl95 on Aug 20, 2007 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

being a bit bored
i googled it.  you probably don't want to know, but if you do, you can click this link.

Work safe, surprisingly.

"This is a ball club with issues." -Nats announcers (talking about the Cardinals)

by SleepyCA on Aug 20, 2007 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

hmmm
now I wonder how bad of a thing it is that I think it kinda looks good.

by mattyfrommo on Aug 21, 2007 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

apparently I need to go to an I Cubs game....
Cause suddenly hot beef sundaes intrigue me. I live in ames, and was planning on going to at least one of these games, but alas work and class are getting in the way. Congrats on the son....
Name him Ricky Perhaps????
"If I managed the Cubs, I'd be an Alcoholic." - Whitey Herzog

by cyko42 on Aug 20, 2007 9:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Scott on "Star of the Game"
John Rooney's final question was about the infield conditions for that 8th-inning DP Scott started, after the rain delay. Scott's reply, slightly chuckling:
"With all due respect to the Friendly Confines, it doesn't matter if it rains on the infield here."
"All you campers, besides the chiggers, you'll come up with a sleeping bag from Bass Pro Shops." Mike Shannon, 08.15, promo for Cardinals Campout

by Nelson Brockabrella on Aug 20, 2007 6:48 PM EDT reply actions  

LOL
That's a terrific quote.

Thanks for sharing it.

There are 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

by Mr Clean on Aug 20, 2007 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Adam Ottavino...
this kid is good, but his walks are getting out of control lately. 5 more today.
- Y. Molina stole third

by TriplePlay on Aug 20, 2007 6:49 PM EDT reply actions  

me too!
i'm going to watch the redbirds tonight also. it's a good night for baseball and nicer now that the big team has won. it was brutal saturday night having the loss announced over the p.a. system.

by thatsawinner on Aug 20, 2007 6:52 PM EDT reply actions  

It's amazing to think how good this offense
would be if Chris Duncan was playing like Chris Duncan.

If he was hitting, to go along with Pujols and Ankiel, the Cards wouldn't mind Rolen's doubles and Edmonds moving runners over.

We need 1 more power bat to get hot, whether it be Rolen, Edmonds, Duncan, Encarnacion, Ludwick...whatever, and the Cards could slug their way to a 2 game lead.

Call up PJ Walters!

by Hardcore Legend on Aug 20, 2007 7:03 PM EDT reply actions  

Cubs and Brewers now have to go out West to play
the Giants with their six game winning streak and the DBacks with their 21-6 record over the past month (not to mention Brandon Webb and his 42 consecutive scoreless innings, at least for Milwaukee). In the mean time, we get the tanking Marlins and the treading-water Braves at home. I'm excited about what the standings might look like in a week.

(I hope this doesn't jinx them; they got hot right after I pretty much gave up on the season.)

by BTown Birds fan on Aug 20, 2007 7:06 PM EDT reply actions  

Ankiel
I just watched the video of Ankiel's outfield assist on stlcardinals.com.  I love how the cubs announcers in the video call it a bang bang play.  Pretty sure the ball was waiting on him.

by gdowdy3 on Aug 20, 2007 11:41 PM EDT reply actions  

It wasn't a close play
I don't know if anyone's mentioned this, and I could be wrong, but it looked as if the fly ball hit off the wall, then ricocheted off the top of Ankiel's head. (I DVR'd the game and watched the play several times, and it does appear this happened.)

In any case, the ball bounded back towards the infield. Rick runs, picks it up with the bare hand, and fires it to third. A perfect, one-hop strike into Rolen's glove. Rolen puts his glove down as the guy begins his slide, and the runner just slid headfirst into the glove, with his left hand touching the glove first.

Link to video:

http://tinyurl.com/238pd3

All things are ready if our minds be so.

by Dexter Westbrook on Aug 21, 2007 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

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