outmakers in the outfield
it has been amusing to watch the numbers in the sidebar poll change over the last few days. i posted the poll a week ago, ie last friday; as of game time on sunday night, a solid 72 percent of the respondents had selected "close call, but they win the division again." i don't know if that particular candidate has garnered a single vote since sunday; its constituents have suddenly discovered the charm of "sorry, 83 wins doesn't cut it," and fringe-party nominees like "sub .500" are getting a second look. even the quixotic "franchise moves to buffalo" (the pat paulsen in this field) has been holding its own against "close call" since the season began. the protest candidacy of "0-162" hasn't caught fire yet, despite some promising endorsements . . . . .
i highly recommend houstoncardinal's diary about the looper start. HC is one of the volunteers charting games for the pitch-by-pitch data project, and braden looper is his designated starter; the diary breaks down the pitch selection and speeds in the fateful 6th inning wednesday night, adding some detail and hard data to the general impression we all got --- viz looper, unused to throwing 80 pitches a night, ran out of gas.
while i'm on the subject --- some sabermetric superheavyweights (tangotiger, mgl, nate silver, phil birnbaum) got into a discussion about close observation of pitchers yesterday. they were talking specifically about dice k, whose start i missed (although i did see about 8 of his pitches over and over and over and over and over again last night on espn with the sound turned down). perhaps our accumulation of pitch charts, over the course of the year, will add some useful fodder to that conversation.
apropos of nothing: my cousin mark wrote something pretty interesting at his blog, Bookfraud. it's not a very good blog; he typically writes about incredibly boring stuff like fiction, art, music --- you know, culture. hardly ever says a word about baseball, so why bother reading? but last night he put up a hilarious, seething rant about the sale of the cubs (pssst --- poor guy's a cub fan). in truth it's a rant about the current state of fandom and profiteering thereon. it's an entertaining read --- when he chooses to write about something worthwhile, the guy can turn a nice phrase.
if you head over there, go easy on him in the comments --- dude and his wife are expecting their first kid any hour now.
* * * * * * * * * * * *
given the current state of the cardinals' outfield corps, i thought it'd be interesting to look back 20 or 30 years and find the franchise's weakest-hitting outfield units. you have to go back that far to find a truly subpar group; even last year's outfield, tepid though it was, got most of its at-bats from average-or-better hitters like duncan, edmonds, spiezio, j-rod, and preston wilson. prior to that, going back all the way to the beginning of the 1990s, st louis outfields were stacked with players like edmonds, lankford, sanders, walker, drew, gant, and jordan. even nondescript regulars like mark whiten, bernard gilkey, and felix jose had batting lines that would do credit to our current lineup.the last truly awful collection of cardinal flycatchers belonged to the 1986 roster. here it is, in its full glory:
| AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | | | AVG | OBP | SLG | OPS+ | |||
| coleman | 600 | 94 | 139 | 13 | 8 | 0 | 29 | 60 | | | .232 | .301 | .280 | 63 | ||
| mcgee | 497 | 65 | 127 | 22 | 7 | 7 | 48 | 37 | | | .256 | .306 | .370 | 87 | ||
| van slyke | 418 | 48 | 113 | 23 | 7 | 13 | 61 | 47 | | | .270 | .343 | .452 | 119 | ||
| ford | 214 | 30 | 53 | 15 | 2 | 2 | 29 | 23 | | | .248 | .318 | .364 | 89 | ||
| landrum | 205 | 24 | 43 | 7 | 1 | 2 | 17 | 20 | | | .210 | .279 | .283 | 57 | ||
| morris | 100 | 8 | 24 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 14 | 7 | | | .240 | .287 | .290 | 61 |
van slyke's line doesn't count for full value, because by random chance his most productive at-bats in '86 came as a first baseman --- he hit nearly .400 at that position in 92 plate appearances. in 326 at-bats as an outfielder, slick batted .234 and slugged only .401. most of these same players were major offensive contributors to pennant-winning teams the years immediately before and after 1986, but some collective funk afflicted them for a few months. it'd be nice to blame it all on jack clark's injury, but he didn't get hurt until almost the all-star break (june 24) --- and most of the cardinal outfielders were at their worst early, while clark was still in the lineup. van slyke reached the all-star break hitting .237 with 4 homers and a .673 OPS; mcgee (who as i recall was hobbled by a bad hamstring that year) got to the break at .237 / .289 / .316; landrum was at .171 / .244 / .248. the cardinals, who led the league in scoring in 1985 and were 2d in 1987, finished dead last in runs scored in 1986.
that was a terrible year for the st louis outfield. but the worst of the last half-century, by far, was 1978. behold:
| AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | | | AVG | OBP | SLG | OPS+ | |||
| morales | 457 | 44 | 109 | 19 | 8 | 4 | 46 | 33 | | | .239 | .288 | .341 | 77 | ||
| mumphrey | 367 | 41 | 96 | 13 | 4 | 2 | 37 | 30 | | | .262 | .317 | .335 | 84 | ||
| hendrick | 382 | 55 | 110 | 27 | 1 | 17 | 67 | 28 | | | .288 | .337 | .497 | 132 | ||
| brock | 298 | 31 | 66 | 9 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 17 | | | .221 | .263 | .252 | 46 | ||
| scott | 219 | 28 | 50 | 5 | 2 | 1 | 14 | 14 | | | .228 | .278 | .283 | 59 |
hendrick didn't join the cardinals until just before memorial day. at the time he arrived, the st louis outfield as a group had produced 4 home runs.
both the '86 and '78 teams suffered abysmally slow starts; each had a 7-game losing streak in mid-april and followed it up with a disastrous california road trip, and both found themselves more than 10 games under by the time summer started --- cautionary tales. yes it's early, but not too early to start spotting patterns. i'd like to see 'em score a few runs.
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35 comments
Comments
Yikes
I think if they gave me nearly 300 ABs, I could get 70 hits just by accident.
I sure would be nice to see tonight Eckstein single, Duncan walk and Pujols deposit one in the Crawford Box just to get this team rolling.
We are currently the worst team in baseball, but one good game changes all of that.
I'll be in Cincy tonight, at GAB watching the Pirates take on the Reds in 25 degree weather, with a chance of snow flurries and freezing rain. Fantastic!
by Hardcore Legend on Apr 6, 2007 9:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'll be at GAB too
by JBagKY on Apr 6, 2007 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gah!!
by rockin redbird on Apr 6, 2007 10:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Hey I'm 27 years old
by silent_bob on Apr 6, 2007 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
me, too
Not that I'm ready to put that label on this team just yet. There's still plenty of time for front office moves, for bats to get hot, for calling up inexplicably banished outfielders from Memphis, etc.
by nybirdgirl on Apr 6, 2007 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Glad you guys/gals
by rockin redbird on Apr 6, 2007 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
duh
by rockin redbird on Apr 6, 2007 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In a way...
by Alxfritz on Apr 6, 2007 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, but there was the despair
by MdRedbirdFreak on Apr 6, 2007 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yay
he picked up a save in the win against the yankees! that guy was money, he filled the void of Kiko Calero for me, maybe not in name but in nasty sliderness.
good to see him make a comeback, even more remarkable, Reyes doesn't seem to have aged, he is still 36. if only he could teach Jimmy that trick.
by Rentboy on Apr 6, 2007 10:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He may be their solution at closer
by silent_bob on Apr 6, 2007 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Coulda had him
He was a free agent who eventually re-signed with TB after almost an entire year spent rehabbing in '06.
Why we didn't pursue him---while going after guys like Russ Springer---I can't fathom.
Since being traded to the Dodgers in 2000 he's allowed 93 hits in 140 innings. He must be doing something right.
by salvomania on Apr 6, 2007 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know
by Speedy G on Apr 6, 2007 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Reed Johnson
by Toddius396 on Apr 6, 2007 10:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Reed
Unfortunately, we'll probably ride our OF out until early summer at a minimum unless a major injury comes about.
And then, hopefully we can aquire a larger prize!
by whatapartier on Apr 6, 2007 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At this point
If worse comes to worse, the Cards do have some nice trading chips at the deadline this season: Izzy, Wells, and Eckstine. With payroll flexablity, I really see this season at the worst as a good opetunity to use the FA's to be combined with payroll space and some decent prospects as an opertunity similar to that in 1997 (when we traded for McGwire) or 1998 (when we traded for Tatis and Oliver)to use our lack of contention, talent, and payroll to add a major offensive player who can help address the fact that from 2002 through 2005 the Cards were built around a big 3 (Edmonds, Rolen, Pujols) complimented by a number of other talented offensive players (Drew, Walker, Sander, Renteria) and that we need a third major offensive cog to replace Edmonds.
At the best, this is a team that can give us another go around in the playoffs. There is talent in the minors, players to trade in the majors, and payroll to allocate. We will see which happens, but either way, I see these as being far from the darkest of times.
by JMedwick on Apr 6, 2007 10:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i'm with you jmed
play it out, gauge carpenter's health and edmonds' health and the young pitchers' effectiveness; if they're in a good spot in the standings at midseason, then look for acquisitions to fill the holes. if they're not making a strong bid, then deal a couple of vets and build up the farm system. i'd add looper and encarnacion to the list of possible trade chips if they do not contend this year.
by lboros on Apr 6, 2007 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought
A. If Looper proves to be a decent #5 starter this season, I would rather hold on to him for next year (giving us Carp, Reyes, Wainwright, and Looper as a core). Cheap #5 starters who are league average are hard to find and a valuable comodity. Of course, that is all contingent on Looper being a decent starter and if Looper is a decent starter this year, that might be our Kent Bottenfield, meaning Loopers trade value will never be higher.
B. As for Juan, if he isn't healty then his value is as low as it can get and there is no reason to trade him. Besides, an outfield of Duncan and Juan and the CF of the day isn't so bad if the Cards have a third top flight offensive player to add to Rolen and Pujols.
In a complete fantast, if the O's are really looking to move someone like Tejada, I could see a good offer coming from the Cardinals with the group of players we are throwing around here.
by JMedwick on Apr 6, 2007 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure
As for the OF, I think we need to play So and Wilson some early to see if they're worth salvaging, so that we can replace them earlier rather than later. Earlier a couple of people mentioned Reed Johnson -- a possibility but he's really not an everyday player. It seems to me that trading for him early precludes us from trading for a better OF later and I don't think he improves us that much. I sure do hope that Duncan's in the lineup tonight vs. Wandy, a lefty, though. Play Wilson in right if you want, but put Dunc out there and see if he can hit Wandy. If he can't hit Wandy, he can't hit a good lefty either.
by chuckb on Apr 6, 2007 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the verdict is in...
Thank you, Tony, for letting him start against the lefty. Please keep doing that.
by Mr Clean on Apr 6, 2007 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
re: Al Reyes
now he is turning 37..his birthday apparently moved from what i swear was 1968 to 1970 on the espn player card. on baseball-reference it is listed as 1971.
maybe reyes was too young to sign sometime in the past and had to adjust his age a wee bit.
if the organization would have known he was only 34 or 35 years old when he had the surgery, maybe things would be different.
at this point, i have no idea how old he is anymore. haha.. maybe he is 44.
he was kind of the invisible glue that kept our bullpen together for that year and change he was here, imo. wish him well in tampa..
if he had only gone by Rafael Reyes instead of Al, what could of been..
by Rentboy on Apr 6, 2007 11:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
not to get off subject, but...
by slonim on Apr 6, 2007 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
dont google it if youre at work!
by Alxfritz on Apr 6, 2007 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it seems to me that
otoh, i'm curious about which of our predictive systems would have accurately identified the precipitous drop-off from '85 to '86 with basically the same cast.
i'm beginning to hear faint drumbeats in the distance.
lb, nice paulsen reference.
by sdesserman on Apr 6, 2007 1:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
paulsen would have made
i'm hearing the same drumbeats . . . . oh wait, that's just my Ry Cooder disc.
by lboros on Apr 6, 2007 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
franken running for senate
by sdesserman on Apr 6, 2007 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
85-86-87
"Some will argue that if the Cardinals can go from 101 wins to 79 in one season, it must be possible for them to get back to 101 in one more season. Perhaps, but if a man is thrown from a horse in a half-second, does it follow that he must be able to get back on the horse as quickly? If you wrap your car around a tree, can you put it back together as quickly as it was torn apart? It is a rule of nature that the processes of destruction, such as fire and violence, act more quickly than the processes of growth and development, and it can be shown that this rule also applies to baseball players and baseball teams."
Fun stuff. He wrote it before the Cardinals did in fact put it all back together in 1987. I just copied that graph, however, out of his collection of writings called This Time Let's Not Eat the Bones, which was published in 1989. I think he could have been gracious enough to note the irony of what he wrote. Roger Angell did that in one of his collections, in which he included a footnote that said the fact that what he predicted turned out to be exactly wrong in no way diminished the brilliance of his analysis, or words to that effect.
I love Bill James. I got onto him when he wrote for Esquire in the late '70s and have a bunch of his Abstracts. Just had to get this off my chest. Thank you for this opportunity!
by Youneverknow on Apr 6, 2007 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
moving to Buffalo
by DCGreg on Apr 6, 2007 2:20 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The Vegas Redbirds has a ring to it
by joker24 on Apr 6, 2007 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Austin Kearns
by silent_bob on Apr 6, 2007 4:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Bring in Tagg!!!!!
Duck and run cause I know it's comin
by DJ4508 on Apr 6, 2007 5:14 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Outside the box thinking...
by silent_bob on Apr 6, 2007 5:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Thanks Bob
by DJ4508 on Apr 6, 2007 9:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
re: Slonim
i loved edgar renteria, so one can pretend it means, RENTeria is my BOY!!
ha
by Rentboy on Apr 6, 2007 5:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
1997
Pre game was at hooters and our friend made the comment " I find our waitress extremly attractive" which she wasn't and we still razz himabout it.
The game was cold wet and rainy and notmuch higlights...Uptilthe bottomof the ninth our higlight was yelling at Mabry in the cards OF and FP santangelo in the Expos OF we had moved to the mid level smokign area even though we didnt smoke to watch the game...
Bottom of the 9th 0-0 I believe and most people leaving it was late and coldand rainy as I said before. So we were able to move down to field level. Willie had not been playing due to a sore hammy, and hit the walk off before it was deemed a walk off HR...still one of my fav games it was our SR yr and last time we were all together for opening day.
by punchinjudy on Apr 6, 2007 6:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs



















