weekend update
saturday morning thisnthat:
- perhaps this got mentioned somewhere on the site --- or maybe it didn't; maybe it's not worth the pixels --- but the cards signed another minor-league free agent last week, former big-league catcher mark johnson. this guy's the very definition of a journeyman --- 32 years old, now with his 7th team --- but it's interesting how much he has in common with the other backup c the cardinals signed, jason larue: left-handed hitter, low batting average but good secondary offensive skills, solid defense. johnson hasn't played in the majors since 2004 and hasn't had more than 100 at-bats in a big-league season since 2002, so it's not as if this guy is poised to make a difference. nonetheless, you can still detect a faint trace of fresh thinking in this signing. bryan smith of Baseball Prospectus, one of the better-regarded minor-league observers around, called johnson "one of the winter's top minor league free agents" and "the best player available beyond [Brian] Barton and Lubanski." so as far as smith is concerned, the cardinals picked up 2 of the top 3 freely available minor-league position players this year. johnson also was one of the catchers listed on baseball america's best-of-the-milb-free-agents team.
- free agent the cards won't be signing: mike crudale.
- stray line from mozeliak, quoted in a recent post at matt leach's blog, explaining the lack of a trade matchup for anthony reyes: "I think when you try to weigh out the value, people are trying to look at how he pitched last year, and his record, and thinking they can just take advantage of that situation. And I think internally we look at him a little better than that." like the thinking here too: the cards know he's better than a 2-14 pitcher and aren't gonna simply dump the kid out in the alley. does this mean reyes will be on the st louis roster? he's out of options and probably won't make it through waivers; maybe, against all odds, he'll be back. or maybe the bids on reyes will become more attractive as the market thins out. however it shakes out, so far mo has resisted the pressure to make a stupid move just for the sake of making a move.
- about a month ago, citing a post at South Side Sox, i noted the similarity between the white sox's position and the cardinals'. SSS is back at it; read this screed and tell me if it doesn't sound familiar. he decries the sox's unwillingness to pay over slot in the amateur draft; their reluctance to offer arbitration to departing free agents; and their refusal to lay out big bucks for big-name free agents. he also complains of inactivity in the international talent market, a complaint that until a few years ago would have applied to the cardinals. . . . taken in isolation these critiques all seem to stand up, but they don't fare so well when placed into the context of the standings. you could levy the same criticisms against three of the last five champions (marlins, white sox, cards). and all but one of last year's four lcs participants (dbacks, rockies, indians) are slotniks in the draft and non-factors in the free-agent market. in the end, it's still about talent evaluation, not about money. spending exorbitantly in the draft and/or free-agent markets can yield an advantage, but it's exaggerated; it's not a prerequisite for being competitive.
- Bleed Cubbie Blue has a winter-meetings wrapup from the north-side perspective.
- Brew Crew Ball is way psyched about the salomon torres acquisition; takes some of the sting out of the loss of cordero.
- pirates fans apparently are freaking out that the pirates didn't take brian barton in the rule V draft. in fact, they're pretty unimpressed overall with new gm neal huntington --- and (like many cardinal fans wrt mozeliak) torqued that he hasn't fixed the team in his first six weeks on the job. Bucs Dugout counsels patience.
- Crawfish Boxes takes a look at the astros' batting order.
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53 comments
Comments
MO 'horrified'
"Rookie GM John Mozeliak, who got the job after the highly regarded Walt Jocketty was canned, has added no one significant this winter (no, Cesar Izturis doesn't count) and was horrified Wednesday when manager Tony La Russa delivered an unprovoked attack on Scott Rolen."
He goes on to say that Milwaukee backed out of the Scott Rolen talks because STL management would not pick up part of Rolen's contract. You don't think Tony blasted Rolen in public as part of a ploy to push management to pony up and unload Rolen? I wouldn't put anything past the increasingly hard ass LaRussa. IMHO, the negatives of this man's personality have intensified since the DWI thing.
STL is not a town for soap operas. Management made a mistake by resigning LaRussa. They've made the bed, now they must lie in it. Go to the vault, get the money, and send Scott Rolen + cash to some team who will give us something resembling value in return. LaRussa's public bashing of Rolen has made MO's job harder but the situation is what it is.
by jjray on Dec 8, 2007 10:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Keep in mind
by sdrone on Dec 8, 2007 4:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not familiar with Rogers
by jjray on Dec 8, 2007 8:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not a mo quote
we'll see what show's up in Mo's Diary soon enough...
by birdsonthebat on Dec 8, 2007 8:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Reyes
Mo absolutely should push the idea that we don't have to get rid of him, that he's undervalued and will pitch better, etc. but I really don't think any GM is going to fall for it -- at least not any one who cares about young pitching. Everybody knows Tony and Dunc don't like him and they'll wait Mo out, daring him to try to get him through waivers.
He may be able to get something more during the spring from a decent team who knows they'll never get a chance to claim him on waivers, but no one's going to be fooled by the notion that he may be in the Cards' rotation in '08.
by chuckb on Dec 8, 2007 10:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I'm stunned that they are surprised
And just for you, Mr. Red Baron, wherever you are, I'm going to express my admiration and respect once again for the way Reyes handled his difficulties here. Because we all know there is no way out of Mr. LaRussa's doghouse. Bye Anthony, and good luck.
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 11:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Please post the link
by Forsch31 on Dec 8, 2007 2:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, dear. They have said it at the end of the
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 2:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
by beanocook on Dec 8, 2007 3:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
sigh
if they really thought so poorly of him, why did he pitch game 1 of the world series when the "veteran" marquis was available? why did they keep giving him chances last year when many outside observers were scratching their heads at why an (at one time) 0-10 pitcher with a 6+ ERA was still on the major league roster?
the main problem i have with these posts about what the cardinals' management "thinks" is that they are almost always vague and attribute too many thoughts, motives, and prejudices to people whose thoughts we really cannot be sure about. we can only speculate. there is no evidence to these accusations. i don't see how they are at all productive.
reyes' problem next year re: the cards is that he will be competing for a number 4 or 5 starter's spot with about 7 other number 4 or 5 starters. i'm sure they would keep him in the minors if they could (if needed), but they can't.
by willievinceterry on Dec 8, 2007 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What chances?
Heck, even last year, he was stuck in AAA behind the terrible Ponson for much of the year.
by DiscoJer on Dec 8, 2007 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"Any other team...
That is also speculation, and I sincerely doubt it is true. If nothing else, it is unfair to the other pitchers and sets a bad precedence to give preferential treatment to a guy who isn't pitching well. Granted, the bottom of the rotation was bad all around. But Wells, Wellemeyer, Thompson, and Maroth were all bumped from the rotation at times as well. To keep Reyes in come hell or high water and then bump other people would not be fair or reasonable. You might say there's a difference in upside between those pitchers, but that isn't the only factor because past performance (in Maroth's and later Mulder's case), "stuff" and the occasional lights-out game (Wells...remember the 8 IP, 2 H performance against the Marlins mid-summer?), and relative success (Wellemeyer, Thompson) pointed toward at least giving the others a shot as well. It would simply not have been fair to give Reyes preferential treatment above all of them.
He was sent to the minors unlike the others (save, Thompson, who also got "yo-yoed") because he COULD be -- there were limited roster spots and no one else could be sent down. That's the life of a player with minor-league options. Same thing happened to Schumaker, and unlike Reyes, he was actually performing really well.
by willievinceterry on Dec 8, 2007 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
RE: Ponson
by redbirdnation8206 on Dec 8, 2007 6:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you're thinking
by SleepyCA on Dec 8, 2007 7:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He pitched game one of the Series
Oh, and by the way, everyone knows what you think about the Reyes situation too.
I'm going to speculate, from numerous comments and actions, that Reyes isn't in the plans. He never really was in the plans, and for some unknown reason they have been reluctant to part ways with him. I can't know all the hows and whys, so of course there's some speculation, but this IS a place to come and voice opinions. That's all I'm doing.
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 3:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Speculate???
by Zubin on Dec 8, 2007 3:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No, no, no! I'm not really speculating!
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 4:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"I know Reyes is not in their plans."
This is an example of what I'm talking about. You don't actually know this and can't know this. It may be true, but unless you are involved with discussions with the front office or have read a definitive from-the-horse's-mouth report, it is by definition speculation.
Maybe I've been reading too much philosophy (Hume, etc.), but I can spot an inductive fallacy when I see one. Sorry.
by willievinceterry on Dec 8, 2007 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"inductive fallacy" ...
back to my philosophy paper...
by willievinceterry on Dec 9, 2007 1:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"He pitched game one of the Series..."
More speculation and attributing of thoughts/motives! Are you saying they weren't trying to win? If they had nothing to lose, then what difference would it make if they had just started Marquis. Why not start Scott Spiezio as pitcher? Of course they wanted to win and felt like he gave them their best chance that game.
Re: this: "Oh, and by the way, everyone knows what you think about the Reyes situation too."
This is only because certain people keep bringing this stuff up over and over again. I don't think I initiate these discussions, but I do feel compelled to respond when there are accusations being made that go beyond what any fan could POSSIBLY know about the situation. I don't claim to know what La Russa, Duncan, Jocketty, or Mo think about Reyes; I can't possibly know. There are hints here and there that can be construed one way or another ... but nothing that can be taken to establish these speculations as "facts," which some people seem to do.
If you want to speculate, that's fine, but I personally am bothered when people who know no more than I (another fan) know treat there speculations as facts, foregone conclusions, etc. It is not fair to attribute motives to people when we can't possibly know what they are really thinking or what really goes on in evaluating these situations.
by willievinceterry on Dec 8, 2007 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ugh
by redbirdnation8206 on Dec 8, 2007 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If the Cards
by nybirdfan on Dec 8, 2007 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
White Sox
The Sox simply undermine themselves by creating team rules that prohibit them from certain playes. They have this set of rules that they have made very public. First and foremost, they do not do business with Scott Boras. That in itself sounds like a good idea until you realize Boras controls a huge chunk of baseball players and a huge-er chuck of baseball's really good players.
They also state publically they don't give any pitcher more than a 3 year deal. Granted they went over that to re-sign Buehrle which is fine, I guess. But to go over that and sign Scott Linebrink to 4 years is really strange.
And there's a whole list of other "do's" and "don'ts" the team thinks is important which basically keeps them from acquiring certain talent. Then, what's really funny, is when they don't sign anyone impactful, Kenny Williams gets all bent out of shape and refuses to talk to the media like they sabotaged his entire operation.
That team is a mess. Much more than the Cardinals ever were, and at least our team is starting to correct itself.
by Big Red on Dec 8, 2007 10:46 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
The Sox a mess?
I love Fire Joe Morgan!
by chuckb on Dec 8, 2007 11:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Big Red
To me, this is one of the classic things that always exists to some extent or another in declining organisations. A faction, or perhaps the whole of the org., that refuses to adapt their ideas, and insists on doing things the same way they have all along, regardless of whether it's the best way or not.
by the red baron on Dec 10, 2007 8:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting.
So...., why is TLR the only NL manager willing to try the concept?
by cardsgirl95 on Dec 8, 2007 10:59 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Baseball
by cardsrul on Dec 8, 2007 11:08 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I came across something last night
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 11:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
interesting....
interested to see how this kid plays out.
by HoosierCardFan on Dec 8, 2007 11:42 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He apparently does
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 11:47 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
it's still very early
TLR has handled himself as anything but a mensch, and I thought the Rolen comments were a brilliant (but obnoxious) tactic to get the green GM to panic.
As for Antonetti, though I was heart-broken he chose not to come, and really worried about Mozeliak, I am liking what I'm seeing so far with Mo. He seems quite patient and I like how he's handled the free-agent minors, the Reyes & Rolen issues, and not biting on the big name Free agents. Now, if we could just get him to go ahead and offer Eckstein arbitration, then i'd give him a gold star.
by HoosierCardFan on Dec 8, 2007 11:39 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
bucsdugout
by sportsman on Dec 8, 2007 11:54 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
And I wish we'd get Fukodome.....
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 12:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Fuukodome
by Zubin on Dec 8, 2007 3:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
...the other guy kids of all ages
by cardschinmusic on Dec 9, 2007 9:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Regarding Torres to the Brewers...
He's got several million reasons to get over it, but YIKES!
by The Ol Goaler on Dec 8, 2007 12:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I dunno
by Red in Chicago on Dec 8, 2007 1:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Crudale
by 26thMan on Dec 8, 2007 1:37 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Well, I love Kenny Lofton......
by jillsinmo on Dec 8, 2007 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just a tad O/T,
by cardsrul on Dec 8, 2007 2:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Paying over slot
by RedbirdRay on Dec 8, 2007 3:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Well
by joker24 on Dec 8, 2007 8:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybin
The depth of thier farm system and number of trade-able top notch chips seems to indicate the money can be a nice investment.
Of course, Miller was over slot. You can trace it back...Verlander.
I agree, you don't get a chance at the high picks if you don't stink. But, Maybin and Miller both seemed to fall to Detroit due to other teams unwillingness to pay up.
by RedbirdRay on Dec 8, 2007 10:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So what is the profile of the SP we seek?
It seems we are going to continue to embrace the "pitch to contact" philosophy for at least the next two years. Since (even with Izturis) our MI defense figures to be suspect, I am not so sure we really want ground ball pitchers - especially if Rolen gets moved. Are their defensive stats for pitchers? Our outfielders, even Duncan, seem to have pretty good range and our ballpark seems fairly neutral, so maybe a flyball pitcher (Reyes throwing 4-seamers and change-ups) would be a good solution.
I would be very excited if someone could pull together some numbers to help identify potentially available pitchers who might best fill the bill. Just please don't suggest that the answer is Livan Hernandez. Of all pitchers with 200+ IP in'07 he had the league put up a combined .308/.371/.499 against him. That's right, an OBP of .870!! He also had the lowest number of Ks.
I look forward to an intriguing discussion
by giveml on Dec 8, 2007 3:42 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
my 2-cent ignorant advice
I'm not one of those who demean a pitch-to-contact philosophy for starting pitchers... unless, of course the pitcher is a more strike-em-out type talent (which means he has some good combination of heat, or vicious hook, or tricky delivery, or way better than average moose-like stamina... and how many of THOSE are there?)
And I DO realize some obvious points: a) that pitch-to-contact works far better and makes more sense with a good overall defensive team; b)the heart of a p-t-c defense {or any defense, really) OUGHT to be the middle infield... and that our MI this year may be questionable; and c) a p-t-c hurler DOES tend to give up more HITS, and thus probably sustains a poorer-LOOKING ba/against and ops/against.
BUT...I love pointing this out: Bob Tewksbury (who never had a good hits-to-innings ratio) had an amazing two years in a row wherein (in over 30 starts each) he walked only 20 batters each season. Going over 200 innings both years, and compiling a combined 33-15 record.
* I concede Ozzie was the SS in both '92 and '93, but I don't recall the team overall being very good.
by the Tewk on Dec 8, 2007 8:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Bonds and Big mac and issue of race?
I hate the spin and dis-sagree with it..i want to believe big mac was innocent because he was a card nto cause he's white, but since his day in court i think its evident he probably did something..but im not here to talk about the past..
I have read many here speculate about him although i don't know anyones race..
To my knowledge he's never lied in court..unless we count his dodging in front of congress..
I wish that they could cover the story wihtout making it a race thing...Some things are about race but I don't think this is one of them.
by punchinjudy on Dec 8, 2007 5:48 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
race colors people's perceptions
by willievinceterry on Dec 8, 2007 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Jason Larue
by DizzyDean17 on Dec 8, 2007 6:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
'ol Diz beat me to it
But then my steel-trap memory (HA) conjured up LaRue hitting with the Reds a few years ago -- definitely the right side of the plate.
While I'm at it (I live close enough to Cincy to see them a lot)... LaRue can definitely be a stick! I know he has had injuries (knee, I think)... but he is also an eat nails for breakfast tough competitor, and THAT doesn't go away even with a deteriorating body. I think we will appreciate him this season.
by the Tewk on Dec 8, 2007 8:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Larue
by Hinkster on Dec 8, 2007 10:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tewk and Dizzy
by DizzyDean17 on Dec 8, 2007 10:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs



















