jeff weaver to cardinals

by lboros on Jul 5, 2006 10:43 PM EDT in News Comment 67 comments

the news is so fresh i can't find a link; DJ87 posted it in the game-thread comments. the cards gave up AA outfielder terry evans and cash.

here is a link from espn. it's a necessary move, can only help.

Update [2006-7-5 22:49:17 by lboros]: here is weaver's career stat page at espn.com. as i mused here, he has far more raw ability than sidney ponson -- or, for that matter, jason marquis or jeff suppan. if he gets it together, he could be a pretty solid pitcher. and if he doesn't . . . . is the team any worse off?

Update [2006-7-5 22:54:41 by lboros]: weaver's list of top comparables at baseball prospectus is led by esteban loiaza, followed by rick wise, steve trachsel, jaime navarro, mark clark, kevin millwood, todd stottlemyre, and pat hentgen. . . .interesting that 4 of the top 8 pitched for the cardinals, no? these comps all ring true; all were solid middle-rotation guys who were capable, in their best years, of pitching like aces.

i wouldn't expect an ace-like performance out of weaver, but vintage todd stottlemyre? bring it on.

his #1 comp (age adjusted) at baseball-reference is . . . . . sidney ponson. urp. followed by ismael valdez, scott erickson, livan hernandez, and brad radke.

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Help (?) is on the way

Rotoworld has it too:

Jeff Weaver - S - Angels
According to FSN, the Cardinals have acquired Jeff Weaver from the Angels for outfielder Terry Evans.
So much for the Angels getting any immediate help. Evans has big numbers in the minors this year, but he's been old for his leagues and isn't likely to develop into a regular. Weaver will almost certainly take Sidney Ponson's spot in the St. Louis rotation. Expect him to have quite a bit of value in NL-only leagues. Jul. 5 - 10:42 pm et

by birdjam on Jul 5, 2006 10:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hey, I just noticed

The Cardinals play in an "NL-only league," so Weaver should have quite a bit of value, right?

by birdjam on Jul 5, 2006 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

HAHAHAHA.....

...I'm still laughing at this comment!

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 5, 2006 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Link

Found this at ESPN.com...

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2510568

by indakind on Jul 5, 2006 10:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

press release

here is the official press release from the Cards website:
http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060705&content_id=1541 684&vkey=pr_stl&fext=.jsp&c_id=stl

by themarquee on Jul 5, 2006 10:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

and now the main story

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20060705&content_id=1541694&vkey=news_stl &fext=.jsp&c_id=stl

by themarquee on Jul 5, 2006 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like the trade

I like the trade. Let's see if Dunc can work his magic with another veteran.

Evans was really hitting well .300+/22 HR/65 RBI and he has speed, 26 SBs. He had done nothing before this year. He is only 24 and maybe he finally figured out how to play. Then again, this could be his one and only great season.

I think it was worth trading Evans to see if Weaver has anything left. We have other OFs in the system. Chris Duncan, Stavinoha, Haerther, Gorecki, Rasmus and even Schumaker.

by jdubya on Jul 5, 2006 11:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Our Rotation

Here's how I see our rotation shaping up and hopefully what our rotation will be like in the postseason (baring Jocketty getting a steal for Jason Schmidt or something).

Carpenter
Mulder (healthy)
Reyes
Weaver
Suppan

Not too pretty still, but a healthy Mulder and a Dunc adjusted Weaver should be better than Sir Sid and Marquis. Now what to do with Sidney and Jason. Ponson should be DFA'd as soon as possible, we should take anything we can get for him if any other team wants to take a look. A lot of teams (including the Yankees Chacon got torched yesterday) have pitching problems so maybe someone will give us a Terry Evans or something for him. Marquis can continue to pitch in the rotation until Mulder makes his triumphant return or we work out a solid trade involving him for a corner outfielder to the Bluejays (Frank Catalanato or Russ Johnson), Rangers (Kevin Mench or Brad Wilkerson), Diamondbacks (Luis Gonzalez or Shawn Green). I think the Diamondbacks is the most likely as it would also be a salary dump for them. If we can't trade him by the time Mulder comes back we should put him in the bullpen and continue to try to trade him, maybe for less.

"The right-hander is throwing up in the bullpen." -Mike Shannon

by DJ87 on Jul 5, 2006 11:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Does anyone know?

Can Weaver start last night's game?

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 5, 2006 11:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

looking for hope...

Weaver's stat line looks pretty bad, but there is hope

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2006/06/jeff_weavers_va.html

"The right-hander is throwing up in the bullpen." -Mike Shannon

by DJ87 on Jul 5, 2006 11:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I like the move if only because

it can't make us any worse.

Unless they send Reyes to the bullpen or bump him from the starting rotation. Should that happen before Ponson gets DFA'd I will have a real shit fit.

by azruavatar on Jul 5, 2006 11:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This works out GREAT!

I can see it now...the Cards can set their rotation up like this:

Carpenter
Marquis (Weaver comes in the 5th)
Reyes
Suppan (Weaver comes in the 4th)
Ponson (Weaver comes in to get the last out of the first)

Lather, Rinse, Repeat.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 5, 2006 11:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

LOL!

That was hilarious! I had to read it a couple times to let it sink in, but nicely done. God I hate Jeffney Marponuppan

by ryanisforever on Jul 5, 2006 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

nice one hardcore

that was funny

by lboros on Jul 6, 2006 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I hate to mention it but the

Free Agent Four have now become the Free Agent Five...

Also, given that Weaver's K rate and BB rates have been either inline with his career rates or slightly better, why is he so bad this year? Those AVG/OPS (.309/.892) numbers make it look as if he is just emminently hittable...any ideas why? Has he lost velocity or life on his pitches...his stats just don't line up well with those periperhals and I'm curious why.

by azruavatar on Jul 5, 2006 11:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

me too

He's served up 18 HR in less then 90 IP. But the fact he can still get k's and not walk the house shows me it's not his velocity or his command. is it bad luck? His FIP/ERA is a whole 1 run lower, but that still ain't too good. But it does show he's played behind some poor defense and run into bad luck.

The gophers have hurt. About 17% of his fly balls are going over the walls. The average is around 11%-12%

62.4% LOB usually reeks of bad luck, too. Average should be around 71%

Reverend Redbird

by erik on Jul 5, 2006 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like this...

I commented in the off-season tha Weaver might be a good pick up for us. He is a hand picked Duncan Special. I think Weaver can put up a low 4ish ERA from Weaver for the rest of the season. I see no reason why he cant get back to the form he was with the Dodgers... I mean lets be honest... the NL is much worse than the AL... I know that doesnt account for all of the difference from this year to the last few... but it has to have something to do with it... doesnt it?

by BigMac545 on Jul 5, 2006 11:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Another thing to think about

is the vastness of Dodger Stadium--his three year averages indicate that his home ERA is .7 points lower than his away ERA, and this is with him doing the exact opposite this year (9.09 home/4.66 away).

He's also improved every month this year after a truly horrendous April.

The other thing I like is that this gives the organization a lot more opportunity to pick and choose which players to keep at the end of the season--we are no longer stuck with Suppan/Marquis/Mulder/Ponson vs. possible free agents.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2006 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rotation

With this addition I would go with a rotation like this...

Carp
Mulder (Healthy)
Reyes
Weaver
Wainwright

anyone think that arizona would be stupid enough to take Supp and Marquis now? They almost took them in the offseason... id trade them both for Carlos Quentin and stick him in left... haha if only it were that easy

by BigMac545 on Jul 5, 2006 11:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd much

prefer:

Carp
Smoltz/Schmidt/Willis, et al
Mulder
Reyes/Weaver
Weaver/Reyes

I know--not gonna happen. But I gotta have something to hope for. Reality, I fear, will soon enough reveal itself in the form of:

Carp
Mulder
Reyes/Weaver
Weaver/Reyes
Marquis/Soop/?Ponson?

And then my dream will be dead.

by rockin redbird on Jul 6, 2006 1:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Like things in the passenger side mirror ...

he may be better than he appears. It may be that the Angels are just frustrated - seems his worst is behind him and he just had one more bad start at the wrong time.

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/story/2006/7/3/233246/7394#readmore

by Murrel on Jul 5, 2006 11:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

those #'s

are VERY encouraging. Seems the Halos just lost patience with him.

Reverend Redbird

by erik on Jul 6, 2006 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Even if BTB is right...

and Weaver ends up being nothing more than a "league-average innings muncher," that's still a big step up from what the current staff is doing. Having someone besides Carp who can give the bullpen a little rest is exactly what the Cards need right now.

by stlnd on Jul 6, 2006 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: LAIM

LAIM's are a necessary part of a 5-man rotation, and the Cards absolutely could use one (or two). I meant nothing negative by the acronym :-)

by Marc Normandin on Jul 6, 2006 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Weaver gets his wings...

Ok, so I made that one up. Still, it works out better than the AJ one I had done when his deal seemed sealed.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 5, 2006 11:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

If you're going to photoshop it

Might as well give him a Reyes flatbill...

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2006 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Best I could deal...

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

nice ;)

Now... how about a pink soul patch?

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2006 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't see how this deal can fail?!?!?

Looks like Weaver was born to be a Card.

Now all he needs is that JED 'I've been drinking for 6 days straight' stubble and he's come home!

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

HILARIOUS!!!

love it

Reverend Redbird

by erik on Jul 6, 2006 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's funny stuff

Thanks HL!

by rob is back on Jul 6, 2006 1:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

LMAO!!

by rockin redbird on Jul 6, 2006 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

the soul patch

goes along with a tattoo, you know . . . .

by lboros on Jul 6, 2006 1:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Tattoo?

Alright, I'll stop.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 1:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Weaver

Has found the secret to the Matrix

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2006 1:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Let's hope

he doesn't end up making us wish we'd taken the blue pill...

"First of all, let's be real friendly here okay? My name is Norm. Secondly, your coaching days are over."

by iron duke75 on Jul 6, 2006 8:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hillarious!

lmao! Thank you very much.

by stash3630 on Jul 6, 2006 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Will we all be shocked when we first see him...

...in Cardinal red and don't recognize him?

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Weaver...

Seems to have pitched better as of late. He's just been hammered a few too many times. Maybe joining the weaker league will do wonders for him.

by matt reeder on Jul 6, 2006 12:04 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Breaking News:

Reds lose again in epic fashion.

Reds 2 back
Brewers 3.5 back
Astros 4 back

Correct?

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 12:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

how much

are the cards paying weaver this season?

by PGeorge on Jul 6, 2006 12:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Let's do this the ESPN way...

...credit ourselves as the source,thus getting confirmation:

Per MLBTradeRumors:

"Viva El Birdos points out that Weaver would cost just $115,000 for the balance of the season now that he's been designated for assignment. "

So, according to lboros, $115,000 and a guy who woke up one morning in the minors and was a superstar.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just a question

And I'll admit to doing no research of my own before asking this since it just popped in my head, but if we're only picking up $115,000 of Weaver's tab, why did the Angels bother to send cash our way as part of the deal?

by stlnd on Jul 6, 2006 1:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe the cash...

...is what made it $115,000?

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 1:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks

as you can see below, I realized that just a few seconds after you posted your answer

by stlnd on Jul 6, 2006 1:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think we're sending cash their way

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2006 1:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

From what I hear

the Cardinals would in fact have been stuck with Weaver's salary, since he didn't hit waivers.

by DanUpBaby on Jul 6, 2006 1:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Never mind

I just realized that the cash considerations are what's knocking his price down to that amount for us. Sorry for the dumb question

by stlnd on Jul 6, 2006 1:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I could be wrong but....

I believe that for him to be paid 115k, he would have had to clear waivers, which he did not. So we are paying him his contract, minus whatever the Angels send with him.

by FunkeeC on Jul 6, 2006 1:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's correct

the $115K figure would only be true if weaver cleared waivers and was signed as a free-agent. my bad

by lboros on Jul 6, 2006 1:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like this

Weaver deal, but as somebody already said--this better be just the beginning. If this is the one move to save the season, I'm gonna be an extremely pissed Birdfan. Say what? Okay, you're right. I'm already an extremely pissed Birdfan. But if Weaver is it, I'm gonna be, uh, an incredibly extremely pissed Birdfan. So there. Good move, Walt. Now let's see some real wheelin and dealin. Work the magic...

by rockin redbird on Jul 6, 2006 12:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't think Weaver is the "one move"

though he could be the only move if nothing else materializes. Weaver seems like he may benefit from Duncan's tutelage and if he becomes a solid three starter, to go along with Mulder and/or Reyes, then that means they can concentrate soley on a bat and with enough money to do it.

This is why it's such a good deal, because Weaver was so cheap. He cost us a decent prospect (the minor league homerun leader, actually), but Evan's ceiling probably wasn't high enough to become a productive big leaguer. WJ may have just filled a major hole with little-to-nothing in return to the Angels.

by rob is back on Jul 6, 2006 1:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

After further review of his game logs:

Weaver in 6 of his last 7 starts went 6.0 innings (one of which was only 5.2) giving up 3 runs or less. If the Angels couldn't give him the lead at that point, then he didn't get a quality start but he pitched like he deserved one. In that stretch, he averaged 5.5 Ks per game and .833 walks.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 1:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Jeff Spicoli

Seeing this guy for the past 3 years in LA, I never really liked the guy, mainly because he looks and acts like a slacker. Of course, Angel fans also used to have the same complaints about Jimmy, so maybe...

by stevenucla on Jul 6, 2006 1:11 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Sounds like the type of player TLR

can motivate. If he doesn't work out, then we don't lose much, but Weaver still seems to have a pretty high ceiling and Duncan might be the person who can help him reach it.

Note to DD: Please spend all your time on improving Weaver's GB/FB rate and leave Reyes alone!

by rob is back on Jul 6, 2006 1:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe that's the key!

Note to DD: Please spend all your time on improving Weaver's GB/FB rate and leave Reyes alone!

Jocketty added Weaver for this reason alone. To distract Duncan away from Reyes. Brilliant!

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 1:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

impressive humor.:)

by sdesserman on Jul 6, 2006 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He seems like a guy

who faces continually diminished expectations since he was supposed to be the Yankees' savior. Here's to hoping that him being the cardinals' savior doesn't turn out that way.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2006 1:19 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Agree...

If I were a religious man, I'd be praying that the Cards are NOT viewing Weaver as the savior. That way lies madness. If they're viewing him as anything but a serviceable replacement for Ponson that may yet twirl well enough to unseat Marquis or Soop (not too difficult this year), they're trying to bamboozle us again. There are potential saviors to be had out there (Willis, Schmidt, Smoltz), but Weaver aint one of em.

by rockin redbird on Jul 6, 2006 1:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Weaver has been mentioned

for years, and now they finally do it as a patch. I never liked the idea when he was mentioned before, but now it works...cheap and if he works out it will help, if he doesnt then well they are no worse off than they are now. Supp is terrible right about now. and sir sid left his magic on the DL...

I like many others would like to see some sort of other move

by punchinjudy on Jul 6, 2006 1:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Do you think Sid will still pitch tomorrow night

Or will they throw Weaver right into the fire? I kinda would like to see that option, even though it smells of failure because we wouldn't see him until after the AS Break:

Thurs - Sid
Fri - Marquis
Sat - Reyes
Sun - Carp

Correct?

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2006 1:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wonder who he's replacing

Seeing as everyone's been so bad. Probably Ponson, who would make the best relief pitcher. But Unless Marquis shapes up, I would really not like to see that guy in the rotation.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2006 1:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What's the accompanying roster move to clear room?

It's gotta be releasing Ponson, right? Or are they still serious about conditioning Wainwright to start?

by stlnd on Jul 6, 2006 1:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I could live with them

sending Wainwright to Memphis to recondition for starting, and then moving Ponson to Wainwright's position in the 'pen for a couplea weeks.

btw, is anyone following the Mexican Presidential election? The recount is a real nailbiter (warning: site in Spanish). It's gonna be over in half an hour, and it's gonna be decided by less than a percentage of the vote.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2006 1:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

they ought to get rid

of ponson, but they can also return kinney to triple a and put ponson in the pen . . . . wouldn't make any sense to do that, but big-league teams make dumber moves every day.

by lboros on Jul 6, 2006 1:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Someone brought up

Weaver's numbers in his last seven starts, when he has been a lot better.

May 24 - 6 IP, 5 H, 3 ER, 5 SO, 2 BB
May 30 - 7 IP, 6 H, 3 ER, 4 SO, 0 BB
June 5 - 6.2 IP, 7 H, 3 ER, 3 SO, 3 BB
June 11 - 5.2 IP, 7 H, 2 ER, 5 SO, 1 BB
June 16 - 6 IP, 7 H, 3 ER, 9 SO, 0 BB
June 21 - 6 IP, 6 H, 2 ER, 7 SO, 1 BB
June 27 - 2 IP, 9 H, 6 ER, 1 SO,0 BB

39. 1 IP, 47 H, 22 ER, 34 SO, 7 BB

5.06 ERA, 1.38 WHIP, 7.82 K/9, 1.61 BB/9

Without that start on Jun. 27, he's got a 3.88 ERA and a 1.21 WHIP.

by ryanisforever on Jul 6, 2006 1:59 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs