the 'wright stuff
yesterday i was fretting about the cards' rotation and engaging in some rather desperate speculation about cy-young-caliber pitchers who might get dumped onto the trade market. well, screw that. after watching wainwright's two innings last night, i realized there's a simpler solution: just put wainwright into the rotation.
is it really that difficult? he put up an 0.57 era in 15 grapefruit-league innings and had a 4-1 strikeout-walk ratio; if that "competition" for the #5 slot in the rotation hadn't been rigged, he'd have won it handily. since they started firing live ammo, wainwright has posted an era of 0.66, with a 5-1 strikeout ratio. he's making hitters look stupid, sending them back to the bench shaking their heads. and he's a starter -- pitched in 137 minor-league games, and started all but two of em. it's not as if this is the first hot month he's had in pro ball, either; he has a long record of success, a former 1st-round draft pick whom baseball america once deemed a top-20 prospect and listed in the top 50 just two years ago. (for reference, anthony reyes is the #47 prospect this year.) wainwright's stock dropped when he injured his arm in 2004, but his success is no fluke. he has always had a lot of promise; at 24, he appears ready to live up to it.
i wrote a little ode to wainwright back in february, and he has exceeded my hopes by a longshot. the guy is pitching with great determination and no fear; he acts like he's got something to prove, provides a shot of energy ev'y time he takes the mound. he's a valuable reliever, the best they've got so far, but he's still only 3d (at best) in the bullpen pecking order; they gotta find a more prominent role for this guy while he's hot. he throws hard, changes speeds, and above all makes batters swing and miss. with the stuff he's exhibited to date, you could imagine him throwing a shutout against a strong lineup in a postseason game. i can't see marquis doing that; can't see anybody else but carpenter, really.
once wainwright goes around the league a time or two, hitters will adjust and he'll take some licks; he's not gonna finish the year with an era under 1.00. but i'd settle for 3.80 in 15 to 25 starts; i'd settle for giving the guy a chance to succeed in the role he's spent 6 seasons grooming for.
so there's your solution: if and when the cardinals move a starter for an outfielder, they should stick wainwright into the vacancy. that'd strengthen the lineup and the rotation simultaneously. might weaken the pen just a tad, but since wainwright can't throw on back-to-back days and is not even that comfortable going every other day, he's just not adding that much value pitching out of the bullpen.
if wainwright does go into the rotation, then what of young mr reyes? gotta leave that discussion for another day, another post . . . .
albert's back is still mighty sore; that could render all our discussions here moot. . . . . the same article says mulder's back isn't bad enough to make him miss his turn this weekend; also that bigbie will be activated by the cardinals next week. see ya, john gall.
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49 comments
Comments
alas
Speaking of Gall, how 'bout that 9th inning pinch hitting choice? Bennett?
by DCGreg on May 5, 2006 6:56 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Damn straight
by DCRedbird on May 5, 2006 7:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
So did I
I suppose that might leave the bullpen a little thin, so why not move Marquis to the bullpen? They've held his hand all along and at some point he's going to have to either prove his consistency or go. I would guess that moving him to the bullpen would lower his trade value, but it might be worth it if he becomes effective after adjusting to the switch.
What I would like to know is could Marquis become an effective bullpen hand, and if so, would that allow him to pinch hit more or less than he does now? I like the idea of receiving two players for the price of one with Marquis, but not when one of those players is a starting pitcher.
by rob is back on May 5, 2006 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Braves tried putting him in the bullpen
So Atlanta traded their uncoachable player (and Ray King and Wainwright I believe)for ours: J.D. Drew.
I don't think we would want to see Marquis in the bullpen.
by glamberson on May 5, 2006 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What more can be done though?
Hopefully he's matured more since Atlanta and won't throw a tantrum, but it might be good for him if not, because something has to change with him mentally imo.
You may very well be right that he's not suited for the bullpen, but it does seem that something has to change with Marquis.
by rob is back on May 5, 2006 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
wow
No offense, but Marquis is a better pitcher than Adam Wainwright. He just is. Marquis put up better numbers across the board than Wainwright last year and was pitching at the MAJOR league level...not against the Iowa Cubs.
Right now the Cardinals are better off with Wainwright in the pen. How does moving him to the rotation make us a better team? I don't see it.
Remember, you can throw harder and let it all hang out when you are throwing 30 pitchers per outing as opposed to 110. Wainwright has been DOMINANT out of the pen..and that's great. But he was anything but in the minors.
Maybe he is a better reliever than starter.
by beanocook on May 5, 2006 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we know a lot about marquis
we won't know anything about wainwright unless we give him a chance. if tony/dunc would be willing to do that, maybe they'd be pleasantly surprised
by lboros on May 5, 2006 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
True
Marquis has been a better pitcher than Adam. The numbers back this up.
by beanocook on May 5, 2006 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, but
But if you want to look at the past numbers in order to project what Marquis and Wainwright would do, ZiPS has already done that.
Marquis 12-13, 33G, 204 IP, 4.68 ERA, 27HR, 209H, 69BB, 115 K
Wainwright 9-9, 4.50 ERA, 28 G, 174 IP, 23 HR, 44 BB, 184 H, 112 K's.
According to ZiPS, Wainwright's projections look a little better then Suppan, Ponson, Marquis and not that far off from Mulder.
Personally, I think he can do even better then his projection. From what we've seen from Spring Training until now is a guy with good command and dominant stuff, and a ton of confidence and poise.
I'd at least rather try him out then play it safe with the mediocre stuff we have now.
by erik on May 5, 2006 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As the mutual fund companies say:
by 26thMan on May 5, 2006 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good Banter
by Baily on May 5, 2006 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"A guy has two bad starts"
Marquis has a career long track record of mediocrity with fluctuations from dominating to turn-off-the-game pathetic. Marquis has been given every opportunity to prove himself and has failed.
"How does moving him (Wainright) to the rotation make us a better team?"
I'm not sure that it does. You raise some valid concerns re: pen vs. starting; however, given Wainright's dominance thus far, giving him an opportunity to start would give us (and more importantly tlr and dunc) the chance to evaluate whether he's a better reliever than starter. It's not as if he can't go back to the pen if the "experiment" fails.
by sdesserman on May 5, 2006 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
understood
It is a far more valid comparison than comparing Marquis and Wainwright statistically this season. Look, I like what I've seen from Wainwright. Great, great stuff. However, I'm just not certain that would translate as a starter.
For some reason or another, he gave up quite a bit more hits than innings pitched at the AAA level. Why is that? He has been more "hittable" the last two seasons than Jason Marquis has.
I guess to me the problem isn't the starting pitcing. Im willing to give Marquis some time before deeming him a failure.
by beanocook on May 5, 2006 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can understand
Everyone talks about him being stubborn, but what bothers me is that he's too emotional, he let's his emotions get to him, and I'm not sure that he can change; it may be in his chemistry. I don't know that much about baseball, but I tend to believe that this is a bad characteristic for a pitcher. He obviously has the physical tools, but like Ankiel before him, I'm not sure that he has the mental characteristics needed to be a good pitcher.
by rob is back on May 5, 2006 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I remember
Not that I'm saying anything, but I'm just saying.
by 26thMan on May 5, 2006 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
jim needs shoulder surgery
by cards4life on May 5, 2006 8:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Ugh
by mikedallas23 on May 5, 2006 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't...
Don't they need to find out what they have with Wainwright right now? To see if trading a starter for a bat is an option? We move Wainwright to the rotation and Reyes to the 'pen to avoid Reyes becoming the perpetual injury risk that is Kerry Wood.
by bgh on May 5, 2006 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup
by mikedallas23 on May 5, 2006 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe Tori Hunter is a FA next year
by rob is back on May 5, 2006 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has something...
by bgh on May 5, 2006 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bigbie & Wainwright
If Bigbie gets a lot of starts in LF simply because he was Plan A coming into the season, I'm going to be, uh, not surprised, just pissed I guess. J-ROD deserves to start every day until he proves great major league pitching can figure him out. Why he and Luna haven't won their starting spots yet is beyond me -- especially considering how average our once-amazing lineup has been.
by PhatAlbert on May 5, 2006 9:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
not hard
by beanocook on May 5, 2006 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You mean just this year, right?
by mikedallas23 on May 5, 2006 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
JRod in 05 vs. LHP
Plus, Gooch had more AB vs. righties this year than he has against lefties.
by salvomania on May 5, 2006 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jrod
He has started four of the last six games. I agree though. I like seeing JRod in there. He is a legitimate threat with the bat and he has displayed more plate discipline.
I would like to see him start five-six days a week but I understand why he doesnt.
by beanocook on May 5, 2006 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's only May 5th, It's only May 5th
a couple cervezas tonight may also help. 7 strong innings from Sir Soups will help too.
Happy Cinco de Mayo.
El Birdos despojo nos demasiado! Viva El Birdos!
by Schnake on May 5, 2006 11:11 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
amen...amen.
by jroman on May 5, 2006 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
By the way....
by sdrone on May 5, 2006 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
poised and ready
by thatsawinner on May 5, 2006 12:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
DSM too!
by indakind on May 5, 2006 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
sounds like a plan
name the game and place.
by thatsawinner on May 5, 2006 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why trade Marquis for a can of Tomato Sauce...
http://www.northernleague.com/transactions/
Go to May 1 and Schaumburg...
by pcgd on May 5, 2006 1:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh man, that's funny
by liam on May 5, 2006 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One more twist
by liam on May 5, 2006 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In other news,
did anybody else notice that the U.S. House or Representatives passed Resolutions 626 and 627 yesterday congratulating Pujols and Carpenter for their respective seasons?
That should restore your faith in government.
by glamberson on May 5, 2006 1:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Wainwright
MikeJordan23 (Brooklyn): How good is Adam Wainwright? And do you think he should be in the Cardinals rotation this year, if they trade one of their current starters for a hitter later this year?Joe Sheehan: Very good. Hard to remember that he was a Braves' #1 pick a while back, and missed a fair amount of time to injuries. He's through the nexus now (he'll be 25 in August) and pitching well. If he had to take a rotation spot, I doubt he'd be a falloff from anyone but Carpenter.
by holden on May 5, 2006 3:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Those are pretty strong words.
by sdrone on May 5, 2006 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why is that hard to believe?
by lboros on May 5, 2006 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not saying it won't happen
I think maybe this whole "Reyes is destined to only be a bullpen guy" line of thought is dragging me down.
by sdrone on May 5, 2006 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also on BPro...
There's no depth to work from if Mulder's lost for any significant period. Cards fans want to believe.Looks like these Baseball Prospectus guys are not reading one another or are just on different pages.
by holden on May 5, 2006 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i realized last night
by chuckb on May 5, 2006 6:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
last night
by SleepyCA on May 5, 2006 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He reminded me of Carp
by rob is back on May 5, 2006 7:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs




















