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who'd a dunc it?

chris duncan is at it again today; 1 for 3 with an rbi single. let's try to get a read on this guy: is he simply having one of those springs, or could he actually become a productive major-league hitter in the near soon?

let's begin with duncan's major-league equivalents, or MLEs. i referenced them in an earlier post about duncan; here's his full MLE line from 2005:

ab h 2b 3b hr bb so avg obp slg
439 105 18 2 15 55 118 .239 .324 .392

pretty tepid for a prospect in his age-24 season. duncan turns 25 in may, which makes him about a year younger than pujols and two years older than yadi molina; factor that in any time you start projecting great things for this hitter. because he got entangled in the low minors for so long, duncan isn't as young as he seems; he is running out of the upside that comes with true youth. if he's going to develop, he'd better do it quickly -- as in, this year.

so, what are the chances of that? here's what two projection systems think duncan could do with regular playing time in 2006:

ab h 2b 3b hr bb so avg obp slg
ZIPS 410 95 20 1 11 45 99 .232 .309 .366
PECOTA 400 100 20 1 14 43 98 .249 .325 .410

these are nearly identical; pecota forecasts three more homers and two more singles than zips, but those are virtually the only differences. yet they're significant -- about equal to a game in the standings. at duncan's level, that's the difference between a useful player and a useless one. looking five years out, pecota sees duncan as a 25 hr, 80 rbi regular with an .800 ops -- a much sunnier forecast than i would have guessed.

you look down at duncan's comps (on which PECOTA is based) and it becomes quickly obvious why the system likes him so much. his top three most comparable players are

  1. george boomer scott
  2. derrek lee
  3. nick johnson
three other pretty good players, all-stars -- roy sievers, tino martinez, and jody davis -- also make the list. so pecota projects duncan to come on like fully loaded big rig, which he kind of resembles in physical proportion -- slow to get into gear, slow to gather momentum, but gradually building up to highway speeds and delivering the goods.

i would never have believed that assessment until yesterday, when duncan took randy johnson deep over the right-centerfield wall. johnson simply does not give up homers to left-handers -- only 6 in the last three years. it's only spring training, i know; but that sonuvagun never gives anything away.

let's just say he's a legitimate sleeper. of course, we haven't talked about his glove yet . . . . some other time.

the game has apparently ended after 10 innings as a 2-2 tie. duncan went 1 for 3 with a walk, and the cardinals got just 4 hits (the others by bigbie spiezio and schumaker). spivey went 0 for 3 with two strikeouts; he's now whiffed 11 times in 32 spring at-bats. mulder had another very sharp outing, and the fringe bullpen candidates threw 4 strong innings.

0 recs  |  Comment 18 comments

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PECOTA
I like how PECOTA projects 100 hits in 400 at-bats and calls it a .249 batting average.

I also never would've thunk Nick Johnson was an All-Star.

You learn several things every day I suppose.

I still think our best hope is that Duncan's spring makes him attractive trade bait; regardless of how good a hitter he is, his defense makes him almost useless to St. Louis other than as a late game pinch hitter, or a five time a year starter at first base.

by STLEdge on Mar 15, 2006 4:28 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Can't see Duncan being traded
with his dad on the bench, and all. Who knows, maybe he's a late bloomer like J-Rod?

On other matters...

What's the back-up plan for second base? Hector "Shoetops" Luna? Maybe we can get Grudzilanek back.

by Red in Chicago on Mar 15, 2006 4:37 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I'm really thinking that
given the ST he is having, Spezio is going to break camp with the team, and Luna will be the starting SS in Memphis

by Valatan on Mar 15, 2006 6:37 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Even if Speizio breaks with the team
he doesn't play second does he??? I thought he only played the corners...

by azruavatar on Mar 15, 2006 10:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Speizio
He's actually played 300 games at second -- more than he's played at first. TLR must be jumping up and down with excitement over his versatility.
DCGreg

by DCGreg on Mar 15, 2006 10:12 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

strike that
Meant to say "more than he's played at third." First is where he's played the most:
  1B  447
  2B  304
  3B  206
  LF   30
  RF   19
DCGreg

by DCGreg on Mar 15, 2006 10:15 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

hmmmm.
That's actually a better split at second that I would have thought...have they seen him there at all this spring?

Seems like Luna or Spivey has been spending all their time there.

by azruavatar on Mar 16, 2006 12:36 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Speaking of whom
after tearing it up in winter ball, R-Rod is having a pretty dull spring.

by Zubin on Mar 15, 2006 8:00 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

J-Rod
That should be J-Rod of course, not R-Rod.

by Zubin on Mar 15, 2006 8:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

after further review
after looking over the numbers, he is perhaps a little better prospect than i gave him credit for.  i'd probably be more excited about him if his last name was different.  if he goes to AAA and continues to mash that would be a different story.  lots of people can hit well in ST.

i wouldnt count on him being trade bait.  there is no shortage of players that can hit the long ball but do little else.  i just cant see how he would be anything other than a throw in, and they probably arent going to throw in the coach's son.  then again, maybe he wouldnt mind getting out from underneath the microscope.

by dmb60614 on Mar 15, 2006 5:03 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Duncan as trade bait
On the topic of Duncan and his tradeability - I seem to recall a local game broadcast late last season in which it was suggested by the local guys (I can't remember if it was a weekend or not) that Duncan and his family were hoping that he would in fact be traded.  Between being stuck behind Pujols and having the cloud of nepotism hanging over him, supposedly they thought it would be for the best.

Maybe it's true, maybe not.

by Robb on Mar 15, 2006 5:07 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Duncan
Oh, another thought on Duncan.  I was told years ago that to project power in the minors you should look for hitters than have extra base hits with 30% or more of their total hits as an indicator.  You know, the whole doubles turning into home runs thing.

Duncan had XBH 35% of the time in 2004, 37% last year.  It's not completely impossible to think that he's finally turned his doubles into home runs...

by Robb on Mar 15, 2006 5:10 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Error?
C. Dunc had an error today.  At least that is what the box score said.
Stash him in LF in AAA and let him track a million fly balls then give him a Sept. call up.
My 2 cents.

by jroman on Mar 15, 2006 5:10 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

throwing error
led to a run in the 5th inning

by lboros on Mar 15, 2006 6:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Duncan
How does anyone know about his defense?  Have you seen him play or seen a scouting report on him...or is this just a general rumor?  Is he error prone or range limited?  

I have heard that he needs a season down to learn how to play outfield.  In my opinion, he should be considered for the left field job as seriously as anyone else on the team right now.  I have heard a lot of people on Cards talk who are quick to point out that it is spring training, and he is playing against some watered down competition.  While that may be true...so are Taguchi, Bigbie, and Rodriguez and they are all hitting around .200 for the spring.  They have all received significant at bats.  And one could hardly scoff at Randy Johnson as watered down competition.

I personally don't think you have to be that good of an outfielder to play left field.  My baseball coach used to always say that you put your fastest and best athlete in center, your best arm in right, and whoever else can hit in left.  Having been an outfielder myself, I honestly think this is true.  (I think its crazy that Barry Bonds has ever won a gold glove, partially because of this)  

I also think that the major league equivalent projections are very skewed.  I think it presupposes that your performance will be worse at the higher level, and while I understand the thought process, I disagree.  Lots of people play BETTER in the big leagues.  Albert Pujols hit more homeruns in his first season in the bigs than his last season in minors.  There are several possible reasons for this.  One is that you play more games.  Another is the fact that the major leagues has the smallest strike zone.  Depending on the umpire, I think the strike zone in the bigs(heighth wise) is about the size of 1000 page books thickness.  Of course, I realize that there is better pitching.  Especially better breaking balls.  Guys see big league fastballs (speed wise) in the minors, and there are a lot of good arms out there.  Anyway, IMO if Duncan hits all spring and we don't make an upgrade anywhere he deserves a platoon shot at left field (Taguchi I guess).  He should have the same shot as the other guys, based on the merits of his performance and talent.  Whatever else can be said about him, he has special power.  Maybe that makes him a one tool player, I don't know.  

As for the possibility of him being traded, I don't think the Cardinals are any less likely to trade him than anyone else.  They are in the business of putting the best team they can on the field (for the money they have), and being traded to another team might actually give him a chance to play.  I don't know if there are teams he could start in the outfield for, but there might be.  I think his dad would be happy for his son to move on to a better opportunity (but of course I don't know him).  

I think you were probably joking about getting Grudz back, but I don't know.  We can't get him back is the answer though, and I don't think management wants him back at that price (citing the 2 mil budget for 2b).  They could have signed him for that if they wanted to, and the Royals are not in any position to eat part of anyone's salary.

Just a few of my thoughts, for what little they're worth.

by Toddius396 on Mar 15, 2006 5:13 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

defense
>>>How does anyone know about his defense?  Have you seen him play or seen a scouting report on him...or is this just a general rumor?<<<

personally, i've never seen him play...its just what i hear or read on the internet.  could be wrong.

>>>Is he error prone or range limited?<<<

i think both.  he is a big guy, i cant imagine he moves like a gazelle.  i've heard he is kind of stuff and had lots of trouble scooping balls at 1b.  i'm sure he can get under a pop fly just fine, its racing to the foul line or power alley, scooping and firing to a base thats going to be a problem.

by dmb60614 on Mar 15, 2006 5:30 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

edit
that should say he is kind of stiff

by dmb60614 on Mar 15, 2006 5:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

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