Viva El Birdos: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Around SBN: Ole Miss-Alabama: "Let's Go Eat.Wait. What Happened?"

pujols for mvp

Update [2006-11-20 15:14:15 by lboros]: ryan howard won. whatever. here are the voting results.[end update]

there's already a diary going about the soriano signing, but here's my 2 cents. first, it's the type of signing that might make sense for a team that's a player away --- that needs one more big bat to take a shot at a pennant or a world series. the cubs, 66-95 last year, are not that team. all they need is a full season from mark prior; if he can stay healthy they'll contend, and if he can't they won't. i don't think soriano is a difference-maker. so i don't think the signing does serious damage to the cardinals' 2007 hopes.

it might, however, significantly damage another hope: that pujols plays his entire career in cardinal red. he's signed through 2011, at which point he'll be 31 years old --- same age as soriano. if soriano is worth $17m a year at 31 based on one mvp-type season, then what can albert demand at the same age five years from now? he'll be hitting the market 11 years after a-rod signed his $25m-a-year megadeal; i can imagine him commanding upward of $30m a year. i think albert likes st louis (he's building a lavish home in the area), and the mid-market pace seems to suit him; most of the teams that could afford to pay $30m+ a year play in high-pressure big-city environments. remember albert's run-ins w/ the new york media during the nlcs? i can't picture him on the yankees. but if the yankees offer $30m a year, the cardinals will have to counter at $25m a year just to have a chance.

that looming payroll obligation will play an increasingly large role in future off-seasons; the cards, already loathe to take on any large multiyear contracts, may become even more cautious than usual as albert's walk year approaches.

he might win his 2d mvp award today; the race is pretty much down to him and ryan howard. i broke down the competition with a month to go in the season and promised to revisit the issue once the full-season data were in; here's the original post. i'll use much the same approach today, comparing the top candidates across a range of important stats. one modification: the tables that follow only list each player's rank on the nl leaderboard in each category. click the "Read More" button at the end of the post to see the same tables with all the actual figures (ie, the actual batting avgs, hr totals, etc etc) filled in. so here are the rankings in raw, unprocessed stat categories:

pujols beltran howard cabrera berkman
HR 2 6 1 t21 3
RBI 2 7 1 t9 3
R 5 2 14 11 21
AVG 3 48 8 2 7
OBP 2 14 5 3 6
SLG 1 4 2 6 3
OPS 1 5 2 4 3

and here's a second table with some of the more popular processed stats --- again, nl ranks only:

pujols beltran howard cabrera berkman
VORP 1 5 2 3 4
WinSh 1 2 6 t3 t3
EqAv 1 8 2 4 5
RC/27 2 5 1 4 3
WPA 1 4 2 5 3

there's little disputing that these are the top 5 candidates. they rank 1 through 5 in the nl in four of the "unified-theory" sabermetric stats, ie OPS, VORP, RC/27, and WPA; in the fifth such stat, Win Shares, they hold the top 4 spots and the 6th. (the mets' david wright finished 5th in that category.)

pujols remains the front runner, in my estimation. he places first in 6 of the 12 categories under consideration, and either first or second in 10 of the 12; he alone rates among the top 5 in all 12 categories. having said that, howard has improved his case tremendously. as of late august he ranked only 17th in the league in on-base percentage, 7th in VORP, 18th in win shares; his teammate chase utley had better numbers in all those categories. howard's only claims on the trophy at that time were his gaudy hr/rbi totals. but after september 1 he put up a bonds-like .387 / .561 / .763 line and helped the phillies --- who'd dumped abreu and cory lidle at the trade line --- stay in playoff contention until the final weekend. he actually overtook pujols in one important rate-stat category, RC/27, and finished right behind him in most of the others --- VORP, equivalent average, OBP, slugging, OPS, and WPA. howard finished the season first in 3 of the 12 categories, and either first or second in 8 of the 12; that's a strong candidacy. if he wins, the injustice will not be extreme.

but pujols is still the more deserving player. let's just compare the top two contenders, side by side --- the better figure in each category is highlighted in red:

avg hr rbi runs obp slg ops vorp win sh eqa rc/27 wpa
pujols .331 49 137 119 .431 .671 1.102 85.4 39 .356 9.94 9.24
howard .313 58 149 104 .425 .659 1.084 81.5 31 .346 10.19 8.20

pujols beat howard head-to-head in 9 of the 12 categories, and one of howard's 3 victories --- rbi --- is a hollow one: howard had far more rbi opportunities than pujols, and converted them far less efficiently. his batting avg with runners in scoring position was .256, which ranked 51st among the nl's 71 batting-title qualifiers. albert led the league in this category with a.397 average. howard batted with 509 men on base in 2006, which led the league. albert batted with 72 fewer men on base (427) than howard, but still drove in nearly as many guys --- only 12 fewer, in 16 fewer games.

howard's incredible september is compelling --- his team outplayed the cardinals by 6 games in september, and finished with 3 more wins than pujols' --- but albert was no slouch down the stretch; he went .368 / .464 / .679 after september 1 and hit the crucial home run on september 27 that ended the cards' final losing streak. factor in his gold-glove defense and his major-league-leading total in win-probability added, and i think you've got your answer: pujols is the mvp.

we'll know soon if the voters saw it the same way. if they did, pujols will become the first back-to-back mvp winner in franchise history, the 6th in nl history, and the 13th in major-league history.

fully elaborated data tables after the jump.

Star-divide

pujols beltran howard cabrera berkman
HR 49 (2) 41 (6) 58 (1) 26 (t21) 45 (3)
RBI 137 (2) 116 (7) 149 (1) 114 (t9) 136 (3)
R 119 (5) 127 (2) 104 (14) 112 (11) 95 (21)
AVG .331 (3) .275 (48) .313 (8) .339 (2) .315 (7)
OBP .431 (2) .388 (14) .425 (5) .430 (3) .420 (6)
SLG .671 (1) .594 (4) .659 (2) .568 (6) .621 (3)
OPS 1.102 (1) 0.982 (5) 1.084 (2) 0.998 (4) 1.041 (3)
pujols beltran howard cabrera berkman
VORP 85.4 (1) 68.5 (5) 81.5 (2) 78.7 (3) 70.7 (4)
WinSh 39 (1) 38 (2) 31 (6) 34 (t3) 34 (t4)
EqAv .356 (1) .328 (8) .346 (2) .342 (4) .339 (5)
RC/27 9.94 (2) 8.39 (5) 10.19 (1) 8.72 (4) 9.34 (3)
WPA 9.24 (1) 4.93 (4) 8.20 (2) 4.30 (5) 5.37 (3)

0 recs  |  Comment 130 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

The Glove
I think Albert's Golden Glove is what is going to put him over the top. When two guys are so close you  have to start to look at their full game. Albert was a Gold Glover this year to put him over the top.

by DimitroffVodka on Nov 20, 2006 9:32 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Let's not forget...
the ever-important 'his team made the playoffs'.  Based on previous MVP awards it would be quite an injustice, if not a surprise  if Pujols is not awarded.

W/o AP the Cards are not in the Playoffs this year, but then, w/o Howard neither are the Phils (still).

by cardzfanbub on Nov 20, 2006 10:01 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

At voting time
When the voters made their selection, nobody knew who the Gold Glove winners were.  So it's hard to see how that would have much of an impact.

by blove121 on Nov 20, 2006 12:02 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes
but these are the same voters that gave AP his first GG.  So they were thinking about his defense.

by Just Rope Ball on Nov 20, 2006 12:43 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Wrong
Gold Gloves are voted on by coaches and managers.

MVP is awarded by the Baseball Writers.

by OCCardsFan on Nov 20, 2006 1:02 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Ahh, Sorry
there goes my street cred out the window.

by Just Rope Ball on Nov 20, 2006 5:28 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

As usual, great analysis, lboros...
I always wonder how many of the voters look at the stats so closely. Then again, I wonder if I would, in their position. As we closed in on the conclusion of the season, I felt like if a) Howard caught Maris OR b) the Phillies made the playoffs, that would tip it in favor of Howard. When neither of those things happened, I became cautiously optimistic that Pujols would win. I just wish some of the voters could have read the post you just made, but I guess we would need a time machine for that. I also agree that Albert's gold glove SHOULD help, but unfortunately the voters did not know he would be winning it...
"Players like Pujols don't come along once in a lifetime. They never come along." -Buzz Bissinger

by PujolsFor President on Nov 20, 2006 9:41 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

I suggested this...
a few months ago and it was met with derision, but the Cards ought to do something creative to keep Pujols around... like make him the player-manager.

He could get some old-timer to be bench coach and focus on the in-game decisions. Alternatively, they could give him a minority stake in the team. Can that be done in baseball?

by guayzimi on Nov 20, 2006 9:42 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

very michael jordan-esk
but i def think it'd be worth it if its allowed in baseball...of course if u can pay a player $136 million u should be able to pay him in stock in the team as well IMHO

by MarcGldstn on Nov 20, 2006 9:56 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

why would they want to?
if you made albert (or anyone) a part owner they'd have to open their books to a player.  i dont think any owner would ever do that.

by dmb60614 on Nov 20, 2006 10:08 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Didn't the Bulls
give Mike $30 million for one season like 10 years ago? I recall that this news was mostly met with shrugged shoulders, sorta like, "He's Mike. He deserves it."

by 26thMan on Nov 20, 2006 1:32 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

He did deserve it, but
he was actually WORTH it.   His dollar value to the franchise was more than that.

by sdrone on Nov 20, 2006 2:22 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

the market
its hard to say what the market will be like in 5 years.  could be the cards cant afford to keep him.  could be the market will take a little dip as everyone recovers from spending 136MM on soriano, eleventy billion on matsuzaka, etc.  i'll worry about that contract in a few years.  five years is a long time in the baseball world.  heck the cards might even be under knew owners by then.  

by dmb60614 on Nov 20, 2006 10:01 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Thoughts
First of all, great statistical comparison as usual. I will be extremely pissed if Howard wins the MVP.  Pujols had the better year and deserves the award.  I know the ring is the most important thing, but awards matter to me and I think it will be B.S. if Howard wins over Pujols.  

Stephen A. Smith (the basketball writer) made a case for Howard in Sunday's Philadelphia Inquirer. I doubt he looked at any stats other than home runs and RBI.  How does one explain the disparity in their averages with runners in scoring position?  How does one explain how Howard only had 12 more RBI in 16 more games and in 72 more chances?  I don't know, but if Pujols doesn't get the MVP I'm going to rip off my shirt, turn green and smash something.

"I only am who I am because I was born that way. I have a gift and I'm trying to not be selfish about it, but to use it, OK? Jealousy will get you nowhere!"

by I Bleed Cardinal Red on Nov 20, 2006 10:01 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

stephen a smith
here is his case for Howard, hysterical

"The result of the voting for the National League's most valuable player is expected tomorrow and, with apologies and respect to Albert Pujols, the vote shouldn't even be close. Of course, there are naysayers who'll spew otherwise, vociferously pointing out how the league's 2005 MVP still had 49 homers with a better batting average and slugging percentage than Howard - despite missing 15 games in June because of an injury.

They'll be the same people I accuse of not paying much attention last season.

You don't just look at the stat sheets or the box scores to measure the impact of Ryan Howard. You view the landscape of MLB then ask yourself, "Where did these fans come from?""

and then this gem,

"The same can be said of Pujols, who is as big-time as they come. The St. Louis Cardinals would not have sniffed the postseason without him, let alone captured a World Series championship. But the reality is the talent that is Pujols, while fairly unique, is a dime a dozen in the laundry list of Latin talent that has invaded baseball.

When you think of Pujols, you also think of Manny Ramirez and David "Big Papi" Ortiz or Alex Rodriguez. They play great baseball, but that's it.

In Howard's case, not only has he performed, he's single-handedly transformed the focus of a sport, forcing baseball - and possibly the rest of us - to take a closer look at potential African American prospects perhaps through something more than Reviving Baseball in the Inner City (RBI) programs."

I can't wait for the guys at FireJoeMorgan to get ahold of this one.

by plh903 on Nov 20, 2006 11:42 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Stephen A. Smith
is by far the worst analyst on ESPN. I have watched a grand total of 15 minutes of his show, Quite Frankly. His show is almost completely opinion based and all of his topics seem to end in a racial debate. When did the MVP race come down to race?
"Forget about the curveball Ricky...Give him the heater!!"

by BleacherBum on Nov 20, 2006 11:55 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm still giggling about this...
If I didn't know better, I'd honestly think Smith's "argument" was an excerpt from The Onion sports pages.
Brian Gunn

by briangunn on Nov 20, 2006 3:54 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

So basically he's saying that
Howard should win because there are just too damned many talented Latino players "invading" baseball?

Quite frankly, I don't think race should be an issue. But hey, that's just me...

by iron duke75 on Nov 20, 2006 5:52 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

With so many...
teams having money to spend this year and driving up prices...does anyone else feel that next year may be a better year to go FA hunting?

by cardzfanbub on Nov 20, 2006 10:02 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Doesn't it feel like that EVERY year?
Either there are too few good FAs which drives up prices, or too many teams need help which drives up prices.

by jimstllax on Nov 20, 2006 10:15 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

how good does...
4 years and 44 million for AJ Burnett sound now? just fine to me.
o8o88o888o

by ilillillli on Nov 20, 2006 10:29 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Very True
Perhaps some of these GM's know something that we don't

by jimstllax on Nov 20, 2006 12:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

4 years and 52 million still doesn't sound good
Burnett is not great.  I don't know where this came from.  21 starts this year.  200 innings twice.  Career 3.77 ERA in a massive pitcher's park.  
Pujols > God

by joker24 on Nov 20, 2006 6:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I hope Pujols wins
I still can't believe Pujols got arrrested.

and Soriano is being placed on notice.

Redbirds Fun
The Kentucky Democrat
2006 WS for JB and DK57

by cardsfan84 on Nov 20, 2006 10:30 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

He's on the cubs
i think he goes in the dead to me category.
Cardinals Jayhawks all the way.

by birdland on Nov 20, 2006 11:15 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

MVP
Pujols should win, but it wouldn't exactly be a travesty if Howard did as he did come quite close to winning the sabermetric triple crown.  Anyone interested in that analysis should read fungoes (http://stl.sabr.org/fungoes/).

As for Pujols career with St Louis.  When he first came up I thought two things about the guy.  So far only one has come to pass.

  1. He is destined to play 1st base.
  2. Someday he'll be a Yankee.
Realistically I can see him staying in St Louis, but he'd have to take less $$$ and quite possibly in some kind of creative fashion (i.e lots of deferred money).  But given how competitive he is, pinstripes are a very real possibility.
He called fate's bluff on a cool New York night, October 19th, 2006.

by Number47 on Nov 20, 2006 10:38 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

the cardinals should "post" him
seibu lions style and make a cool $51MM
o8o88o888o

by ilillillli on Nov 20, 2006 10:39 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

If you could...
actually take bids to buy out Pujols giving the other team the opp. to offer him a new contract (or maybe keep the current contract), I wonder what kind of bids you'd get.

$75 - $100 mil?

by cardzfanbub on Nov 20, 2006 10:48 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Long term deals
While questions about Pujols remaining a Cardinal are appropriate, a more salient concern should be extending Carpenter's contract.

by carys on Nov 20, 2006 11:08 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Agreed on Carp...
sign him now. As far as Pujols goes, I'll be shocked if he remains a Cardinal his whole career. He's already bigger than the team now, so why would he want to stay if he can make more $$ elsewhere?

by cardsrul on Nov 20, 2006 11:28 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

his kids
my wife is a teacher, and word through the teaching grapevine is that albert likes the services that the stl special school district offers for his special needs daughter (and supposedly he attends every individual meeting about said services).
it might not be enough to keep him, but it is one more thing adding to the list of "the little things."

by gthedamned on Nov 20, 2006 12:07 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

The STL
As ILBOROS said, the guy obviously likes the Stl, especially since he's building a house. Don't forget that his extended family lives in Kansas City and thats very close to St.Louis. Hope the cardinals sign him after his deal is over, because if they don't then we're doomed.

MVP=PUJOLS

www.redbirdramblings.wordpress.com

by redbirdfan on Nov 20, 2006 12:26 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Not enough to keep him
TLR doesn't live full time in St. Louis. He spends the season away from his family. Lots of baseball players do this. The family could stay in St. Louis during the winter months (School year for the kids) and live somewhere closer to Albert in the summer. I'm not really saying this would happen, but just because the kids like the area doesn't mean he won't  reconsider. Lots of places look pretty when you're paid $200 MM to play there.

by effin fisk on Nov 20, 2006 12:49 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Albert
While I have no desire to see him go, I would hope that come 2011 (or whenever his contract is up) they at least get negotiations started before his final year.  It will be essential for this franchise to plan accordingly.  If we are going to lose him, it is imperative we get more than a first round draft pick for him.  AGAIN - I have no desire to see him go - however, I am practical enough to understand that it is a real possibility.  I also understand that if there is no way we can sign him - we need to trade him for as many blue chip prospects as possible.  This would be a horrible scenario - but it would be a better scenario then losing him and receiving only a 1st round pick in one of the biggest crap shoots in all of pro sports in return.  Given what Florida received this year for some of their better players...you would have to think that Albert is worth a lot.

by wrv18 on Nov 20, 2006 12:20 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Dime a dozen?
Ever bother to look at Baseball Reference to see who Albert's comps are?

Some piker named Joe Dimaggio is No. 1. Another goon named Jimmie Fox is listed. And then there's this clown Frank Robinson...

I see the point, it's whether attendance is up in Philadelphia that counts.

by Red in Chicago on Nov 20, 2006 12:21 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

He's worth the money
Albert is the type of player that comes along once a generation as far as I'm concerned. Not many players can command the kind of attention he gets besides Bonds maybe. McGwire did it too during his historic seasons.

In short, the Cards need to sign him. To me, it's not about being competitive in your negotiations. It's making sure that if someone pays more for him than you do, they pay RIDICIOUSLY more. You don't lose those negotiation battles over small stuff. So yah - start thinking now about keeping him on the roster long term again.

Good post by the way..

by HugeCardsFan on Nov 20, 2006 1:45 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Albert's deferred money
So, after Albert's contract is up, he will still be getting paid millions through something like 2020, right? I'd feel kinda bad playing for one team & still getting paid by another. Unless I don't understand how it works. Then again, for those crazy amounts of money, maybe I wouldn't feel so bad...

by busch bird on Nov 20, 2006 1:57 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Pujols
He's taking that cash way in the future with no interest.  In other words - he's giving the Cardinals a 0 interest loan now that they don't have to start paying him back until 2020.  

I can tell you right now that if my current employer asked me to take a pay cut that they would pay me back 15 years in the future - without interest - I wouldn't feel one bit bad about cashing those checks, no matter who I would be working for later.

by Robb on Nov 20, 2006 2:04 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

What a joke.
So, keep this in mind kids, if you can swing for the fences EVERYTIME YOU BAT, be a defensive liability and not get your team into the playoffs, you too can be the MVP.
Walk your dog, not Pujols.

by Hardcore Legend on Nov 20, 2006 2:07 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I disagree with this
  1. Howard doesn't swing for the fences every time up -- he walked 108 times and had nearly as many non-HR hits as Pujols.
  2. The argument about not getting his team into the playoffs is weak, I think.  Howard did A TON to give his team a shot at the playoffs -- why should he be penalized for an individual honor b/c the Phillies don't have a 5th starter?
  3. Howard's selection is not a joke.  He was the second best player in baseball this year, which actually makes him a perfectly legit winner.  Mind you, he's not the best pick -- Pujols is -- but let's try to be a little more gracious.  Howard is a St. Louis kid, after all.  
Brian Gunn

by briangunn on Nov 20, 2006 4:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with almost everything you say
and I think Howard is an acceptable choice for MVP, not neccesarily the one I would have made but acceptable nontheless.

Your second point bothers me though.  I agree that not making the playoffs shouldn't preclude a player from winning the MVP just because other players on the team underperformed or simply weren't good.  But there's something about Howard's saying that Howard did A TON to get his team to the playoff that bothers me in comparison to Pujols.

The Phillies had thes VORPs for their top 5 position players:
Ryan Howard    81.5
Chase Utley    65.2
Jimmy Rollins    45.2
Pat Burrell    27.5
Bobby Abreu    25.5

Total = 246.9
Howard's Contribution = 33%

The Cardinals posted these numbers
Albert Pujols    85.4
Scott Rolen    36.6
Chris Duncan    24.8
Jim Edmonds    20.0
Scott Spiezio    16.3

Total = 183.1
Pujol's Contribution = 46.6%

That's a pretty ridiculous difference in who is carrying the offense for each of their respective teams.  I'm leaving pitching out of the equation (which Carpenter obviously posted a ridiculous VORP as well - 67.8) but I think the point still stands.  Arguments that Howard carried his team offensively are overstated in comparison to Pujols.  It's not so much that Howard didn't contribute rather that it's misleading to argue offensive prowess relative to team in Howard's favor.  He had a lot of help in terms of production and protection that Pujols wasn't getting from his teammates.

Acquire Jason Schmidt!

by azruavatar on Nov 20, 2006 4:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Ryan Howard struck out
181 times.  If he wasn't swinging for the fences, then I don't know what equates it.  He lead the league in HRs and was second in the league in strikeouts.  That doesn't show me someone cutting down on his swing.
Walk your dog, not Pujols.

by Hardcore Legend on Nov 20, 2006 5:27 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Etc.
Hardcore, you said Howard swings for the fences every time he bats -- but if he's patient enough to walk over 100 times (more than Pujols, even on a per/PA basis), and still reach base enough times despite the HR, then surely his lack of discipline is not a problem.

As for azruavator's statement that "it's misleading to argue offensive prowess relative to team in Howard's favor" -- agreed, but I should also point out that I did no such thing.  I think Pujols helped his team more than Howard did, and implied as much in my post when I said he was my pick for MVP.

I simply argued that Howad did a ton to  push his team toward the playoffs, which is demonstrably true.  As for which player had the highest percentage of the top 5 VORPs on his team -- that's a shell game that makes little sense to me.  By that logic Lance Berkman was almost precisely as valuable as Pujols (46.4% vs. 46.6% of top 5 VORP), but that's not an argument I'd be prepared to make.

Brian Gunn

by briangunn on Nov 20, 2006 9:57 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

41% of Ryan Howard's at-bats were either a
HR or a strikeout.  35% of his plate appearences were HRs or a strikeout.

For Pujols, 18% of at-bats were HR or SO, 16% of PA were HR or SO.

Walk your dog, not Pujols.

by Hardcore Legend on Nov 20, 2006 10:14 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I think we're talking past each other
I would never deny that Howard strikes out a lot.  He does.  A LOT.  So stats about percentage of PA with a HR or K are fine, but don't tell me anything we don't already agree on.

What I am arguing against is the point you made in your original post, that all those strikeouts are a good argument against Howard for MVP.  They're not.  When a guy can temper his free swinging enough to draw a walk (Howard finished 4th in the league) then what's the big deal about the free swinging?  It's not like those 181 strikeouts are very different from other kinds of outs (study after study has shown that the difference between a whiff and an out on a ball in play is miniscule).  So yes, Howard takes big swings -- but if those big swings do him FAR more good than bad, then how is it a criticism of his MVP selection?

I mean, look, I think Pujols was obviously better than Howard this year, particularly when you look at the difference in defense (but with the bat and on the basepaths as well).  But Howard isn't a bad pick at all.

Brian Gunn

by briangunn on Nov 20, 2006 10:55 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I do so love shell games
point taken - I read farther into your statements than what you wrote.
Acquire Jason Schmidt!

by azruavatar on Nov 20, 2006 11:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Eh, whatever
Albert got a ring this year. That's better.
Cheers

by Alxfritz on Nov 20, 2006 2:10 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

There it is.
There's what counts.

I forget who said it, but the voters love a story.  Ho-hum naming the world champ the MVP is too boring.

We got what counts.

by jroman on Nov 20, 2006 2:17 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Happy for Howard....
But come on!....Albert should have won that damn thing in a landslide!

by Timbo02 on Nov 20, 2006 2:15 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

This is an injustice
I just keep going back to the time Sosa won the MVP over McGwire 'cause he took his team to the playoffs.  
Summoning the Spirit of Jack Clark!

by Big Mike on Nov 20, 2006 2:16 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

We are Cardinals fans!
We demand that our players win every award every year! No MVP or Cy Young and only two Gold Gloves!?!? Outrage! Let's burn this city down!

Sorry. That's probably a bit much, but honestly people... The voters don't usually break down the stats like we do here. What did you expect?

by effin fisk on Nov 20, 2006 2:27 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Good News
Hey guys,

The MVP voting didn't turn out how it should have, but this is nothing but good news towards our real goal of winning.  Pujols will be more determined next year, and marginally cheaper when we extend him down the road.  I think an ego check for anyone as good as he is doesn't hurt either.  

He's still going in the HOF either way.  

by Jonathan23 on Nov 20, 2006 2:32 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Eh
Yeah, Pujols had a better year, but not by much. Howard is a worthy recipient. I'm not too broken up about it.

Pujols lost it a couple of times when he deserved it, but he won it in '05 even though Derek Lee had a better season. Such is life. That's just the way it is sometimes.

He may not have won the MVP, but there's little argument nationwide about who the best player in baseball is: Albert Pujols.

by Bivouac77 on Nov 20, 2006 2:34 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

frank catt
now a ranger..per mlbtraderumors...
Kenny is a "dirt" bag?

by punchinjudy on Nov 20, 2006 2:41 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

bronson arroyo?
got a vote for mvp?  is his mom a sportswriter or something?

by gthedamned on Nov 20, 2006 3:32 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

1Cy + 1MVP = Zero 05 WS
0Cy + 0MVP = 1 2006WS!
We'll take it!

by Big Rev on Nov 20, 2006 3:33 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Here are the voting results,
just so you need not follow a link.

He called fate's bluff on a cool New York night, October 19th, 2006.

by Number47 on Nov 20, 2006 3:55 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Howard vs. Pujols
was a close call and, I agree, there is a valid argument for both players.  What I want to know is who is the idiot who voted 1)Howard 2)Beltran 3)Pujols ?

by ArkansasTravs on Nov 20, 2006 10:43 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Hank Aaron Award vs. MVP
Does anyone else think that for the past several years voters have been confusing the MVP with the MOP (Most Outstanding Player) award?

Geez, the Hank Aaron award was created specifically for guys like Howard.

He called fate's bluff on a cool New York night, October 19th, 2006.

by Number47 on Nov 20, 2006 3:59 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

freaking ryan howard
seriously, they were close, but this made me so mad that I didn't get to spend my GUB entry today making fun of the Soriano contract.

It's just another confirmation that all of the things sportswriters claim to care about only matter when they can be used as part of a story.

by DanUpBaby on Nov 20, 2006 4:22 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I posted a diary about this:
But those of you ragging on Stephen A Smith, look at the link in the diary.(If you have ESPN Insider - otherwise just read my synopsis)

It's an article by Rob Neyer ripping Stephen A. Smith and other people who supported Howard over Pujols.

by mtalken on Nov 20, 2006 4:41 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

pujols/howard
the voters clearly don't rate defense as the award itself specifies they should.

i think albert has some solace: he's tied with mantle for most 2nds, and last time i checked, howard was watching pujols win the series.

you think he'd trade his mvp for a ring?

by kurt on Nov 20, 2006 5:04 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

It's
the MVP award; not the Nobel Peace Prize...
If Steven A. Smith and the others had given their votes to Pujols instead of Howard, most people would be trumpeting their intellect and good sense. Yes Smith is an asshat, but he's an asshat who's entitled to his view, as are the other 18 voters who put Howard first on their ballot.

by cardsrul on Nov 20, 2006 5:16 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

what about the one
who had Pujols third?  This really shouldn't have been that close.  Pujols was the better player in every aspect except for # of homers!  I'll also grant that Howard's emergence was a better story than Pujols' great year.  That's not how an MVP should be decided, however.  And the person who voted Pujols third should lose his credentials, period!  It's inexcusable and undefendable!

by chuckb on Nov 20, 2006 5:29 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

That voter
Must have been the one who voted:
  1. Howard
  2. Beltran
  3. Pujols
I hope he regrets that decision with hindsight as his guide.

by liam on Nov 20, 2006 5:58 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Putting AP
third is not tantamount to revealing state secrets or anything like that. The voter was perhaps a bit misguided; maybe he just doesn't like Albert, for whatever reason. But taking away his credentials? I don't think so.

by cardsrul on Nov 20, 2006 6:03 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

there's nothing wrong
with voting Albert third because he doesn't like him?  If a writer's criteria is "Who do I like best and who do I like least?", his credentials to vote for the MVP should be taken away.

by chuckb on Nov 20, 2006 6:10 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

writers aren't required to pass a test to vote
We're annoyed that there's no gatekeeper for sportswriter motivations in voting now? I disagree. They don't have to pass a 200 point multiple choice test to vote. If they're professional sports writers they likely earned the position through knowledge and hard work. There are plenty I disagree with but I'm glad they're around to make conversations more interesting.

by effin fisk on Nov 20, 2006 6:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Last year,
it was Joe Strauss, I believe, who said something to the effect that "it's our award. We created it, and we can vote anyway we want."
As much as we might not like that, he's right.

by cardsrul on Nov 21, 2006 12:10 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I am not defending Stephen A. Smith at all
This is just simply a possible explanation for his comments concerning Howard v Pujols: Smith is from Philadelphia.

He's obviously trying to make his hometown player look better than he really is. We do the same thing all the time with Carpenter and Pujols. We can come up with a hundred arguments why Carp is better than Webb, Oswalt, or frickin' Hoffman, and only grudgingly point out his comparative faults. As for Pujols ... well, my hometown bias is superceded by the FACT that there are only a few advantages for Howard: HR, RBI, & AP already has an MVP. That's about it.

I'm sure that there are a few people in Philly annoyed with the glowing prose being written by StL sportswriters, confident that Ryan is actually the better player this year. Their biased opinion is no different than ours.

As for that A. Stephen Smith [sic] talking or not talking out of his dirt star, I'll leave that for you to decide. I'll just say that facts shouldn't get in the way of an impassioned idiot.

Oh, the burden of stupid people.

by Solanus on Nov 20, 2006 5:28 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Left Field
Just to stoke the fire (which is already hot over the MVP), I still think Bonds would be a nice addition in LF for the Cardinals with Duncan and Encarnacion sharing time in RF.

With regards to his defense (and what leads me to bring this up again), David Pinto released his PMR data for 2006 left fielders and Bonds faired pretty well.  Concerns about his knee and bad defense may have been exaggerated...

http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/cat_probabilistic_model_of_range.php

Acquire Jason Schmidt!

by azruavatar on Nov 20, 2006 5:52 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Boo! Hiss!
Encarnacion is supposed to have his wrist inspected at the end of this month, when they'll make a decision on whether he'll need surgery or not. I've got a feeling he will go under the knife, in which case we'd need to open the season with our 4th OF'er.

I'm going to be physically ill the day Bonds breaks Hammerin' Hank's record in any case. If he does it in a Cardinals uniform, I may defect. Maybe to the Brewers for a season.
-----
As for PRAR, I think it's above-average score for Bonds is not so much evidence that he was an above average left fielder but that there's a flaw in PRAR's methodology for rating outfielder performance—if I may be so bold. I'm convinced it's a sound method for infielders. I'm not sure what the problem for outfielders is after watching his video explaining the system, but my only guess is that it doesn't account for singles misplayed by OF's into XBH's, since the method only measures how many plays above expected are turned into outs. So according to PRAR, since this play was probably on average a difficult play to get to, Canseco is no worse a defender for turning it into a home run than Bonds would for getting nowhere near it—or Shawn Green would be for getting to it but turning it into a triple—or Juan Encarnacion would be for picking it up and holding the runner at 2nd. (Just watch the clip linked there, it's hilarious.)

Bonds may be slightly better at fielding the easy-to-moderate batted balls, but when he doesn't get to a ball, he really doesn't get to it—and that's not factored in. I don't get to see Bonds that much in the outfield, though, so I may be way off. I remember laughing at some of his plays in the outfield this summer is all.

That may not be right, though—the Giants didn't give up that many doubles compared to the rest of the league. They allowed a ton of triples, but they also play a bunch of games in AZ and CO.

by liam on Nov 20, 2006 6:49 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

That's a riot
looked like Chris Duncan in the WS

by wildman on Nov 20, 2006 9:29 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh I don't know
There was some doofus sportswriter who put Illinois third in hoops two years ago and the outcry was so loud he had to go on television and defend himself. A couple weeks later he admitted he was wrong. Sunshine is a pretty good disinfectant, and I think Marriotti should come out if it was him. :-o

by Red in Chicago on Nov 20, 2006 6:08 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Sarcasm detector broken
Do you mean something like Louisville football this year, where they were ranked third, but one guy (Jason Whitlock) had them 9th and had to defend himself? Then a week later, he was vindicated when they lose an amazing game to Rutgers

Illinois did go to the championship game two years ago, after all.

by liam on Nov 20, 2006 6:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Or a better example
this year where a sportswriter was removed from voting for the AP top 25 because he moved Oklahoma down several spots after believing they lost to Texas Tech.  It turns out he didn't bother to watch the game, watch sportscenter, or check online to see who won.  He asked a friend of his who won and the friend was mistaken, so he moved Oklahoma down to #24 I think.  If people have a serious job, they're expected to do their job professionally.  The AP was correct to remove that sportswriter for failing to do the job he was assigned, which, after all, is a relatively simple task.  It's not too much to ask the 1 sportswriter from each city that is charged w/ voting for the MVP to know something about the game, pay attention to the numbers and vote honestly.  To suggest that a vote is OK even if it is based on a dislike for a player, any player, to me is mind-boggling.  They're supposed to be objective and do their job professionally.  If this voter voted Pujols 3rd because he doesn't like Pujols, the BBWA should find another sportswriter from that city who can be objective and professional.

by chuckb on Nov 20, 2006 10:48 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Strange Pujols MVP trivia...
...the operative word being trivia.

Albert has now come in 2nd in MVP voting for the 3rd time - more than any other players in history except Stan Musial (4 times), Ted Williams (4 times) and Mickey Mantle (3 times).

by BTown Birds fan on Nov 20, 2006 6:31 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

there. is. NO. WAY
the Cards should sign Bonds. I'm not saying he's not still a very good player. And you can actually count me in the camp who believe that, if they're available, we SHOULD at least explore deals for A-Rod or Manny. I'm not opposed to bringing in a guy like that.

But I think Bonds is another matter. Wherever he signs, for the whole season he will be bigger than the team, bigger than the sport. And not in a good way. I don't buy that McGwire's HR chase was a distraction for the Cards. But that's because McGwire didn't have the steroid scandal hanging over him (we didn't find out about him until later). People have thrown needles at Bonds in the OF. Reporters will be all over him as he chases down Aaron. And God forbid George Mitchell actually finds anything or his jailbird medical staff decides it's better to talk and be free than be loyal in a cell. I recognize Bonds is still a .450+ OBP/.900 OPS guy, but it's not worth all of that to have him on the team.

by nycbirdo on Nov 20, 2006 6:34 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

interesting
howard is older than pujols

by cjwest20 on Nov 20, 2006 6:42 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

seriously.......
when's the last time a world series team had NO MVP, Cy Young.. nor manager of the year??

and when's the last time neither the MVP nor the Cy Young of a league not make a playoffs appearance??

im almost offended...

by black3ram on Nov 20, 2006 7:03 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Astros
Last Year
How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!

by Elvis on Nov 20, 2006 8:20 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

you're right
but the stros got swept...

the birds won it all

by black3ram on Nov 21, 2006 12:36 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

i should have phrased it better
a team that won the series

by black3ram on Nov 21, 2006 12:40 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

did a little mvp research
was basically wondering if anyone had ever began a career with mvp finishes such as pujols in their first six seasons

well the simple answer is: not even close

pujols has finshed in order:4,2,2,3,1,2

the closest i found was the man who is also pujols' number one comparable: joe dimaggio

dimaggio finished 8,2,6,1,3,1

while doing the research, i did find two guys who had a better 6 year run than pujols

ted williams with 2 1st, 3 2nd, and 1 3rd
yogi berra with 3 1st, 2 2nd, and 1 4th

also while doing the research, i noticed how many times guys had been involved in the voting during their career

the following are the top ten:

  1. Aaron-19
  2. Williams-18
  3. Musial-18
  4. Bonds-15
  5. Berra-15
  6. Mays-15
  7. F. Robinson-15
  8. Rose-15
  9. Mantle-15
  10. Yaz-15

by bigcardsfan5 on Nov 20, 2006 7:08 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Interesting
Where did you do your research? (I'm hoping it was online someplace.)

What do you mean by "involved in the voting"? Receiving a vote? Finishing in the top 10?

by Youneverknow on Nov 20, 2006 9:55 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

yeah
by involved i was meaning they got at least a vote of some sort, and i did the research at baseball reference

by bigcardsfan5 on Nov 20, 2006 10:42 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

okay
howard had 9 more homeruns than pujols this season... his team didnt make the playoffs

last year andruw jones had 8 more homeruns than pujols.. but his team did make the playoffs.. mainly because of him...

yet pujols won it over jones..

how does one formula work in one year and not the next???

and someone voted pujols 3rd???????

by black3ram on Nov 20, 2006 7:12 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Formula
Now can they go back and give the MVP to McGwire over Sosa...seems like the same situation.
How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!

by Elvis on Nov 20, 2006 8:18 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

apparently
jones was 1 hr shy of taking the mvp last year :-P

i think the mvp committee puts far too much emphasis on hr's and not enough on the rest of play...i mean howard had a great year and i guess im not that surprised by his selection but still, rather annoying...

by MarcGldstn on Nov 20, 2006 7:30 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I guess they left off the
game winning rbi stat?
Kenny is a "dirt" bag?

by punchinjudy on Nov 20, 2006 7:31 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Two things that cost Albert the MVP..
In my opinion here are the reasons why Albert didn't win MVP...

1. The Cards horrible last couple of weeks of the regular season. Remember.. when the writers voted for MVP this was really fresh in their minds. These were the same writers that predicted the Cards to lose to the Padres in 4 games.  In my opinion this was the MAJOR reason many decided to vote for Howard.

If the Cards would have finished the season a lot better and won the division a week before the playoffs I think Pujols would be MVP right now.

2. He was on the DL for a couple of weeks while Howard played the full season.  If Albert didn't get hurt and played those other 10-15 games, I bet he would have been alot closer to Ryan in HR & RBI's.

by KYCards on Nov 20, 2006 8:23 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I partially agree
I think #1 is why Pujols wasn't MVp and Carp wasn't Cy Young.

I wasn't only partially correct, but I alluded to this back in September.  Anyway, I think the team's near colapse at the end the season and Smoltz being the only guy to stop it, really hurt.

  • It's why nobody voted for TLR for manager of the year
  • It's why Carp lost the Cy
  • It's why A'Pu lost the MVP

by Zubin on Nov 20, 2006 8:46 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

imagine if the braves really did lose that game
and the birds had to remake that game against the giants...

carp gets a W and pujols a 3-run walk off bomb....

we have our cy young and mvp..

by black3ram on Nov 21, 2006 12:47 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Ryan Howard, with the season on the line,
in the final 8 games of the year went 9 for 28 with 10 strikeouts, 5 RBIs, and 0 HRs.

Pujols, from the start of the losing streak went 18 for 51 with 13 RBIs, 7 strikeouts and 3 HRs in the final 13 games.

I'm not sure what more Albert could have done during the losing streak to help the club.  It's not his fault that Braden Looper sucks.  :D

Walk your dog, not Pujols.

by Hardcore Legend on Nov 21, 2006 1:46 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't disagree with the analysis
but the perception (and perhaps the reality) was that no Cardinal could stop the skid and the Cardinals were only a Smoltz away from a '64 Phillies.

Comming to think of it MVP should have gone:

  1. Pujols
  2. Smoltz
  3. Beltran
  4. Berkmann
  5. Howard

by Zubin on Nov 21, 2006 3:25 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Alyson Footer agrees
This is surprisingly harsh:

Answering the question, "What's Oswalt got to do to win the Cy?"

I don't necessarily have a problem with Brandon Webb winning it, because he, too, had a phenomenal year. What I do have a problem with is Trevor Hoffman and Chris Carpenter finishing ahead of Roy.
>snip<
Carpenter allowed six runs in each of his last two starts and contributed to what was almost the biggest end-of-season collapse in baseball history.

I know Leach is a Red Sox fan, but I can't imagine him dogging Oswalt like that on the official site.

by liam on Nov 21, 2006 3:30 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Getting old fast...
"...what was almost the biggest end-of-season collapse in baseball history."

That is the problem with too many sportswriters today. They are too hung up on what might have been, rather than focusing on what is.

Hey Alyson, memo to you and your friends: "almost collapsed" doesn't count...

by iron duke75 on Nov 21, 2006 8:37 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually
since Smoltz saved it, it kind of does.

by Zubin on Nov 21, 2006 10:50 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Well then, be sure to let me know
when ESPN airs their "20 Greatest Near-Collapses In Sports History"...

;-)

by iron duke75 on Nov 21, 2006 12:21 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

No it doesn't
What's another term for "near-collapse"?  Division champ.  Houston finished 2nd.  Even if the Cards nearly blew it, they still finished better than Houston.  Her logic absolutely escapes me!  Maybe she should look at the # of complete games and shutouts thrown by the two pitchers.  Hint:  one had as many CG and SHO as the Cy Young Award winner and one had 3 fewer CG and no shutouts.

by chuckb on Nov 21, 2006 6:23 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

If you look at the awards voting,
it certainly seems to have had an effect.  I'm not arguing that Oswalt was necesarily more deserving than Carp, but the late season swoon definately resonated with sports-writters.  And I believe to an extent it should have.

by Zubin on Nov 24, 2006 2:51 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

the soriano deal
I was watching rookie of the yr tonight seen it before, but theres a funny line in there well a few that you can apply to the deal...

when chet Stedman(Busey)asked by reporters about making the series he said "hey anything can happen we're the cubs"  i laughed thought it was a great cheap shot at the "loveable losers"

Oh and Mr Wood...pitchers got a big butt...

i just had too..unless they lock down a few arms..im not too worried about them..

Kenny is a "dirt" bag?

by punchinjudy on Nov 20, 2006 10:08 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I agree
but Hendry's pocketbook sure seems to be open.

by sdrone on Nov 20, 2006 10:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Whew
I was hoping we didn't go after him
A walk is a waste of three pitches-Bob Gibson

by orlando card on Nov 20, 2006 10:52 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

hey
has anyone else seen the juan pierre deal with the dodgers? espn is reporting he signed a 5 year/$45 mil deal

that makes me like the edmonds deal more

by bigcardsfan5 on Nov 20, 2006 10:52 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

i just saw it...
if this is the way things are... duncan is definately starting in left and narveson can have the 5th spot.  no thank you, free agents,  this is rediculous.
o8o88o888o

by ilillillli on Nov 20, 2006 10:58 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yuck
there's the best reason I've heard for a strong farm system, so you don't have to sign .700 OPS guys for $9 mill a year.

by chuckb on Nov 20, 2006 11:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

bless you juan encarnacion.
n/t
o8o88o888o

by ilillillli on Nov 20, 2006 11:40 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

honestly!
$5M/year to Juan looked HORRIBLE a year ago. Not quite as bad now, given how crazy things have gotten in the last week or so. I'd much rather give 5 to Juan than 9 to Pierre. Yecch.

by nycbirdo on Nov 21, 2006 12:05 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

AND
five years?!?

by nycbirdo on Nov 21, 2006 12:06 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Dave Roberts
...won't get five years, but he ought to get paid just as much ($9MM/per) for the next two years.  Or at least 2/$16MM.  (If he doesn't he ought to fire his agent.)  Whodathunk that a couple weeks ago?

Juan Pierre won't turn 30 'til next summer, and he's very good at catching fly balls.  But that's it, man.  He's barely average in SB % for his career, and he has been barely average OBP for the last two years.  And he's got the worst CF arm in the majors!  Is there that much more outfield real estate in Dodger Stadium than Wrigley for him to collect bloop hits?    

5/45?  That is insanity.

youneverknow

by meat on Nov 21, 2006 12:20 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm thinking wait it out is the way to go, right?
This can't keep up, can it?  The bubble's got to burst.  or not...
o8o88o888o

by ilillillli on Nov 21, 2006 12:30 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

its funny no one voted for brandon webb
both carp and hoffman were in the mvp votings....

but theres no webb.. not one person voted for the man. not even 10th. even bronson arroyo got a vote.. ha!

by black3ram on Nov 21, 2006 12:53 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

just think
mcgwire didnt win the mvp the year he broke maris' record.

just becuz sosa's team made the playoffs and the birds didnt...

mcgwire had 70 and sosa 66?

these votes.... they change from year to year..

based on NL, does this mean ortiz wins it for AL mvp over jeter?

jeter isnt even half deserving of the award as pujols.

by black3ram on Nov 21, 2006 12:58 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

rumor has it the cubs are still pursuing Lugo
spending spree anyone?

And why aren't they using some $$$ to stabalize their flippin rotation???

Acquire Jason Schmidt!

by azruavatar on Nov 21, 2006 1:22 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Starting to wonder about that
They still need to sign Zambrano for next season. In arbitration and in this market, he could go for  close to, or over, 10 million. If they sign him to a long-term deal, I don't see how they can sign any FA pitchers without committing to significant payroll increases over the next half-decade—and even then, they'd be committed to the same personnel.

by liam on Nov 21, 2006 2:31 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

they're like
drunk frat boys at a (ahem!) gentleman's club this offseason!

by chuckb on Nov 21, 2006 6:24 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Minor Notes
Cardinals purchased the contracts of RHP Blake Hawksworth, LHP Troy Cate, RHP Dennis Dove and OF Cody Haerther.
Hawksworth, who missed most of the previous two seasons with shoulder troubles, bounced back with an 11-4 record and a 2.92 ERA between Single-A Palm Beach and Double-A Springfield last season. He remains one of the Caridnals' top prospects.

by El Hombre on Nov 21, 2006 1:50 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Good Stuff
Article by our main man Goold here.

Bigbie's been removed from the 40-man and released, as has Cali.

The changes, except for Cali and Bigbie's releases, are both reflected in the official 40-man roster page. Of note is that there's no mention of Ankiel, who I guess will be re-signed and run through the waiver gauntlet.

Of interest to me and anyone else scanning for Rul3 5 candidates, Astro's AAAA power/switch-hitting 2B Brooks Conrad was added to their 40-man. Good for him.

by liam on Nov 21, 2006 3:10 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Terry Evans Jr.
MiLB's lone 30-30 man was added to the Angels' 40-man roster for those of you keeping score at home.

by liam on Nov 21, 2006 3:13 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

good for him
Hope he becomes an All-Star.

by chuckb on Nov 21, 2006 6:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

F**kide F**k F**k F**k
you know my mom always told me that cursing just shows that you are a uneducated person. So I am sorry mom, but this years voting by the BBWAA has driven me to curse. their complete lack of knowledge and respect for their jobs will very soon make their awards obsolute. if all they are going to do is listen to whoever ESPN says to vote for, why even have a BBWAA vote? why not stop the charade,make it official and just let ESPN make their espy's the year end awards?

this is yet another case of blatant east coast bias on the writers part. and don't even get me started that this is a "old&tired" argument. it may be for some, but its completly revelant here. how else could they pick howard? his numbers do not support him winning. the only thing he did better than Albert was hit home runs and drive him more rbi's. if Albert played in that band box, with the kind of protection howard his this year, he too would have off the charts crazy home run and rbi totals. howard is black, so there is no raciest element here. as much as steven A smith would like to make one, there isnt. his argument is about as revelant as if richard justice would say that fat elvis should win the mvp because most baseball fans are fat white guys. so their mvp should look like them. something he would never do of course. but what steven did is just as bad. back to howard, his team didn't make the playoffs. isn't that the "tie breaker" in deciding who is mvp? sure was in 98. isn't it the same reason many pointed out why andrew jones didn't win last season? in fact the phillies fell off the table completly. so did howards play as many of you pointed out. Albert kept his great season going, all the while it was our pitching that let us down. Albert isn't bugs bunny. he can't play the field and pitch at the same time. it can't be steroids. but then if it was, why has Barry Bonds won 7 mvp's if the suspicion of using steroids keeps you from winning any kind of awards? nope. no double standard there.

so why did howard win? what I have to tell myself so that I can finally get some sleep tonight is that its all ESPN fault. they played howard up all the way till the end of the season. even when his numbers were not even close in some aspects to Alberts. if it does not happen on the east coast, chicago, houston, or LA, ESPN ignores it. always has. and always will. and the BWWAA are full of lazy morons who's revelancy will soon be no more if they keep following ESPN lead.

if you can't tell. I am really pissed off. and I would like it if someone from the Cardinals would show some anger too. but, unlike me, they don't really care about personal year end awards. good thing too. awards like this are more for the fans and agents and selfish players that only want big money anyway. not guys like Albert, or any other Cardials player. and thats one of the things that makes them the best franchise in baseball. all they care about is winning rings. and guess what? we got one this year. so no, Albert won't say he is mad that once again he got over looked for a much deserved award. if he is even asked about it, he will be very gracious and say howard was the best this past season, and he deserved. he and the rest of the Cardinals are far more gracious that I will ever be in this respect.

besides, when it's all said and done. when Albert is giving his speach at his hall of fame induction,going in as the greatest player to ever walk onto a diamond. no one will even remember who ryan howard was.

The 2006 St.Louis Cardinals. WORLD CHAMPIONS OF THE WORLD. My Blog: And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Nov 21, 2006 4:27 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Can I get an...
AMEN, brother. You summed up the Pujols case.

Did anyone here that little weasel, Carl Ravijk (Sp) on ESPN last night talk about how sure, Morneau's numbers were better than Jeters', but Jeter was far more deserving because he played on the team with the best record in the AL and won a gold glove. Jeter wouldn't even have made the top 10, nor won that gold glove had he played anywhere but NY and I hear those whining NY maggots complaining because a couple of writers put him 4th and 5th. And the Yanks, with their 250 million payroll won 1 more game than the Twinkies while playing in a weaker division. I'm sure the Twins record would have benefitted from playing the D-Rays a few few more times. Where was this weasel when Pujols was getting hosed.

How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!

by Elvis on Nov 22, 2006 10:53 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the Internet's #1 St. Louis Cardinals blog.
Start posting about the Cardinals »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Img_0981_small
Put Some Hot Sauce On My Burrito (It's OT, Yadi2.)
God_small
Albertofstan fact sheet
Gawstab_small
Offensive Ability Rating Rankings for 2009
Royconrad_fullthrottle_small
25 players : 25 seasons, 1910-1934

Recent FanPosts

4849_buschstadium_small
My Hall of Fame Induction Speech
Mightymouse_small
Schumaker Gets New Contract
39135485-59af19dbb26654095f910f34176af094_4ae8a81e-scaled_small
Predictions Group
The_i
VEB Day 2010 v2.0
Small
Spring Training Split Squad?
Cardwash_small
Chris Duncan signs minor league contract with Nats, also a great pic of him

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >


Managers

Jack_benny_small DanUpBaby

Editors

Bender1_small azruavatar

Le-samourai_small the red baron

Adam1_small chuckb