community projection: matt clement
matt clement first became a free agent after the 2004 season. at the time i thought he was a good fit for the cardinals, who were flimsy at the top of their rotation --- carpenter hadn't yet established himself as a bona fide ace, morris was in eclipse, and the rest of the staff comprised steady eddies who could win division titles but didn't scare anybody in october. clement went only 9-13 in 2004, but he had a good era and good peripherals; from 2002-04 he showed flashes of dominance, posting the 4th-highest strikeout rate in the league and holding opposing batters to a .223 / .309 / .360 line. he was 29 years old, mature and healthy; he'd taken 30 or more starts for the previous 6 years in a row. the cardinals never showed much interest in clement and instead traded for mark mulder, who was coming off a much shakier season; here's how the two pitchers' three-year lines compared heading into 2005:
| GS | IP | H/9 | W/9 | K/9 | HR/9 | ERA | AVG | OBP | SLG | |||
| clement 02-04 | 94 | 588 | 7.4 | 3.7 | 8.8 | 1.0 | 3.80 | .223 | .309 | .360 | ||
| mulder 02-04 | 89 | 620 | 8.5 | 2.6 | 6.2 | 0.9 | 3.72 | .252 | .310 | .391 |
these pitchers continued to track each other in 2005-07: both wrecked their shoulders, had surgery in 2006, and missed most or all of the 2007 season. now they're teammates.
the VEB community did a reasonably accurate job of projecting last year (here's a summary of what we projected). our most difficult test was to project braden looper, who had never pitched as a starter before, and we acquitted ourselves well. projecting clement is almost as dicey; there's no telling how this guy might perform.
if you're not familiar w/ the community projection trope, here's how it works: you post your gut feeling about how a given player's stat line will look in 2008, and i average up the results. for clement, i'd like you to give me the following numbers:
- games started
- innings
- hits
- walks
- strikeouts
- homers
- wins
- losses
- ERA
shifting gears: i got a note the other day from mike (aka the angry rant) at Stan Musial's Stance; he's involved with SABR's san diego chapter, whose next meeting will feature paul depodesta as a guest speaker. depodesta, the former dodger gm and billy beane protégé, now works in the padres' front office and was on the short list for the st louis gm job. he'll be taking questions at the SABR meeting, and mike has pledged to pass along queries from his readers (although he asks that the questions not be cardinal-centric). more info is here.
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Comments
Here ya go
25/135/141/80/112/19/8/11/4.96
Clement's shoulder may be healthy, but he is going to have control issues and I'm worried his sinker won't sink and his slider won't bite like it used to.
clement time
Space police here........
- Hanging Chad
Cleeement
hmph...
Control will be a problem. His K-rate won't be what it used to...but not too bad.
count me in
I am not as pessimistic as these numbers sound. I think he will get off to a shaky start, find himself for a while, and then kind of fall apart as the shoulder fatigues. Kind of like my golf game.
when do pitchers and catcher's report?
clement? nothing sexy about his numbers. here's my uneducated guess (and that's exactly what it is!)....
23,138,135,58,129,18,8,8,4.20
Clement 2008
25,140,125,65,110,17,8,8,4.75
by martin on Jan 8, 2008 10:16 AM EST reply actions
STATS!
by barry whiteteeth on Jan 8, 2008 10:23 AM EST reply actions
Space police here........
- Hanging Chad
STATS! Part Deux
my bad...
by barry whiteteeth on Jan 8, 2008 3:42 PM EST up reply actions
Im In
Clement
by Hardcore Legend on Jan 8, 2008 10:58 AM EST reply actions
Space police here.......
- Hanging Chad
clement projection
7,35,52,18,18,9,1,5,7.02
yup
But I am very bearish on pitchers with torn cuffs and labrums. I don't think this will be pretty.
You should average the two to represent
clement projection
by rjwillia on Jan 8, 2008 11:41 AM EST reply actions
It's gonna be a long year......
Clement Predictions
by mathisjm on Jan 8, 2008 12:12 PM EST reply actions
Projections
by South Side Cards Fan on Jan 8, 2008 12:19 PM EST reply actions
Here's my line...
As you can guess I am betting he is as healthy as everybody says he is...
my completely uneducated guess
30,173,150,60,20,12,8,4.10
by RosevilleRedbird on Jan 8, 2008 12:51 PM EST reply actions
Senor Clement
by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 8, 2008 1:06 PM EST reply actions
Space police here........
- Hanging Chad
Oops
Thanks
by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 9, 2008 3:45 AM EST up reply actions
The precursor to a rockin' 2009
Hmmm...
by bobbyballgame1 on Jan 8, 2008 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
Clement in '08...
Probably on the optimistic side.
by Cards82 on Jan 8, 2008 1:35 PM EST reply actions
Clement 08 - I think the shoulder's healthy
by Oregonian Redbird on Jan 8, 2008 2:00 PM EST reply actions
Temporary threadjack(HOF news)...
End of threadjack
Clement '08 projection
Clement
games started
innings
hits
walks
strikeouts
homers
wins
losses
ERA
Clement 2008 Projection
by TenRingsAndCounting on Jan 8, 2008 2:25 PM EST reply actions
Clement
by bheikoop @ Viva El Birdos on Jan 8, 2008 2:45 PM EST reply actions
Space police here..........
- Hanging Chad
Is Here Fine?
2008 Matt Clement projection:
27, 170, 150, 70, 145, 17, 14, 8, 3.89
by bheikoop @ Viva El Birdos on Jan 8, 2008 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
You still didn't remove
by Hardcore Legend on Jan 8, 2008 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
Hahaha...
27,170,150,70,145,17,14,8,3.89
by bheikoop @ Viva El Birdos on Jan 8, 2008 5:27 PM EST up reply actions
Clement
10,63,95,28,48,10,3,5,5.36
Here goes nothing....
by SWIN on Jan 8, 2008 3:03 PM EST reply actions
Clement 2008
19,119,119,69,77,16,6,8,4.77
not terribly optimistic
20,106,121,44,55,10,5,10,5.05
Clement in 2008
by CardsFanChad on Jan 8, 2008 4:36 PM EST reply actions
my predictions
He definitely won't get 30 starts this season pitching on the back-end of the rotation and his ERA is probably going to regress to league average from his 3 year average from 2002-2004. Same with strikeouts, althougth I'm optimisitic that his walk rate might go down as he has to rely on location and finesse a bit more to get hitters out. Why only 10-8? Because he's literally the unluckiest pitcher in the big leagues. He should have at least three 15 win seasons under his belt and probably should have won 20 games in 2004 if it wasn't for atrocious run support. Baseball-Reference has him most closely related to Todd Stottlemyre at this point in his career; if he can be as successful as Stottlemyre was at age 33 & 34 we probably have ourselves a steal.
Ummm...
Look at the requested columns again:
GS,IP,H,BB,SO,HR,W,L,ERA
Actually they make perfect sense...
25,160,179,88,125,22,10,8,4.45
Matty C
I think we're going to see some of the same tendencies from Clement this season that we saw from Kip this year, though not quite as pronounced. Good stuff at times, poor control, and times when he's pitching well and then loses it in a hurry, due to the shoulder.
correction
by the red baron on Jan 8, 2008 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
You are a genius!
by Nathan W on Jan 8, 2008 5:37 PM EST up reply actions
Clement
I think that shoulder is shot.
by maddash1946 on Jan 8, 2008 5:36 PM EST reply actions
Pirates may want Brad Thompson....
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2008/01/pirates-interes.html
Maybe they will take like 3 4th outfielders off our hands with 2 or 3 swingmen pitchers.
im so glad that
ick
Someone should throw this up on the side bar
the rumor?
No. I agree. I did the same thing right before you
Clement projections
g, ip, h, bb, so, hr, w,l, era
i think Matt will either be himself (and pitch well), or not pitch at all. i can't see him performing as a '06 Wells/Reyes. i've gone with the optimistic variant.but of course he should have some comeback struggles in the first couple of weeks (april through may).
nothing wrong with being positive
Mr. Clement comes to the Lou
24,177,160,45,155,11,10,11,4.12
a thought about your #s
by the red baron on Jan 9, 2008 2:55 AM EST up reply actions
Guess
On a side note, I'll be in Ft Myers for Easter and noticed I'll be able to take in the Cards v Twins on Mar 24th. Chance to see Colby finishing off a strong spring. And I can be first in line for an Aaron Miles autograph!!
a little feng shui-ish
by SethWestern on Jan 8, 2008 10:09 PM EST reply actions
Matt Clement #s...the projections begin!!
For now, that is what I am thinking. I hope I'm off in the wrong direction on some of those. I REALLY hope I'm NOT off in the right direction.
stlfan
Here it goes...
30,192,196,64,162,21,12,13,4.63
by bobbyballgame1 on Jan 8, 2008 11:26 PM EST reply actions
Clement 2008
He's a first-half surprise: throws a couple of absolute gems and has a nice 6-1 stretch in June/early July. But also throws a few 3-inning Ponsonesque stinkers, misses a couple of starts with soreness and is finally shut down Aug. 15 for more surgery.
Give the guy his due...
Here is what guayzimi had to say...
"W,L,RS,RA,GB/GA
78,84,705,773,-8
Luck swings both ways I'm afraid..."
Nobody could have forseen Carp missing the entire year, but the next lowest win total predicted by anyone was 86. Most people were predicting 90 wins.
The win predictions may look a little different this year...
by bobbyballgame1 on Jan 9, 2008 1:14 AM EST reply actions
My Projection for Clement:
GS, IP, H,BB,SO,HR, W,L, ERA
21,126,108,63,84,13,10,7,4.17
Clement 08'
Not going to go deep, but will make it thru the season with a few games skipped for rest. Velocity will only improve slightly.
BUT....Will whip up on the Bear Whelps, the Houston Minute Maids and will lose mainly because of bad luck run support.
Clement / Cairo
27,155,130,75,165,25,12,12,4.21
Cairo:
Glad to see he signed on somewhere else. Love this little guy! hah
http://mlbfleecefactor.com/2008/01/09/mariners-sign-miguel-cairo/
OK, so I'm a pessimist...
I just don't think his arm is going to hold up. He'll look OK for a while, but will struggle with command/control until something goes sproing. A bit of bullpen work won't solve the problem, and he'll be on the 60-day by late July.
This said, I really like this signing. A line more like 25/150/140/60/140/8/15/6/3.50 (not comma-delimited so that it isn't confused with my "real" prediction) is only slightly less likely than my predicted one, depending on how his shoulder is. Cheap high-risk, high-return signings are 100% appropriate for a team in a position like the Cardinals; it only takes about two of them working out for the team to be a serious contender. The NL Central just isn't that strong.
Clement
OOPS sorry, had my computer do the projections for me and forgot it only speaks in binary.
Wait, did I see a 2 in there? Oh no I think I've got a virus.
by That's a Winner on Jan 9, 2008 10:06 AM EST reply actions
So a subject is required, eh?
29,179,170,65,144,16,14,9,4.02



















