Game 28 Open Thread: May 3, 2006

by lboros on May 3, 2006 5:37 PM EDT in St. Louis Cardinals News

marquis oswalt
3-2, 5.04 4-1, 2.76

this article says the astros are coming hard after roger clemens, offering him the same $18m salary -- pro-rated for playing time -- that he made last season. they could probably use him; even with surprisingly good aprils from wandy rodriguez and rookie taylor buchholz, the 'stros lag the cardinals in era by two-thirds of a run. the bullpen has been a mess, brad lidge in particular; he's yielded 11 walks and 3 hr in 13.2 innings. but the houston offense, so feeble last season, has been pretty good in 2006 -- 4th in the league in runs per game (the cardinals are 8th), 2d in obp (cards are 7th), 4th in slugging (cards are 7th). like the cardinals, they have fattened up their early record against bad teams -- they're 8-2 vs florida, washington, and pittsburgh, 9-7 vs everybody else. the cardinals are 8-2 vs wash/pgh, 9-8 vs their other opponents. st louis is 11-9 against the nl central so far. after the games tonight and tomorrow, they won't play another game within the division until memorial day, when these same astros come to busch III.

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Comments

Line-ups?

Who's in the #2 hole?

by bgh on May 3, 2006 6:31 PM EDT reply actions

Marquis de Sade

At least Oswalt hasn't been completely consistent so far this season, either, despite his ERA.

Be gentle on us today, Jason.

by glamberson on May 3, 2006 7:04 PM EDT reply actions

tonight's lineups

via Yahoo ... J-Rod hitting #2 (yay!), El Hombre and Jed back in the saddle, and Luna at 2b:

D. Eckstein ss
J. Rodriguez lf
A. Pujols 1b
J. Edmonds cf
J. Encarnacion rf
S. Spiezio 3b
G. Bennett c
H. Luna 2b
J. Marquis p

C. Biggio 2b
W. Taveras cf
L. Berkman 1b
M. Ensberg 3b
P. Wilson lf
J. Lane rf
B. Ausmus c
A. Everett ss
R. Oswalt p

by DCRedbird on May 3, 2006 7:13 PM EDT reply actions

Per the P-D:

Eckstein, SS
Rodriguez, LF
Pujols, 1B
Edmonds, CF
Encarnacion, RF
Spiezio, 3B
Bennett, C
Luna, 2B
Marquis, P

by cardsrul on May 3, 2006 7:13 PM EDT reply actions

Barry Bonds

Mr. Bond's just got walloped by a foul ball in batting practice, right off the noggin. Don't know how bad it is, but I imagine he has enough padding in that big ol' melon.

by CougarCard on May 3, 2006 7:14 PM EDT reply actions

I feel bad for the Astros

having to deal with a prima donna like Clemens. Is his talent and his supposed ability to bring people to the ball park really worth the soap opera? I don't think the Astros would necessarily be better without him, but wouldn't they be better without all the question marks and uncertainty surrounding him?

On another note, I'm looking forward to finally watching a game again tonight. My MLB Extra Innings has blacked out the last 5 Cards' games here in NC. Hopefully Oswalt won't make us look like little leaguers as he has been known to do. I've always felt this Cards Astros rivalry was better than our alleged one with the Cubs. Will Pujols be in the lineup?

by stash3630 on May 3, 2006 7:24 PM EDT reply actions

Is anyone else worried

about Marquis pitching tonight? The CW is that he's an emotional guy. Certainly, pitching against your team's actual rival, who is sending out the guy who ended our season last year, would tend to get a guy geeked up.

And a geeked-up Jason Marquis tends to overthrow, which is bad news for a sinkerballer.

Hold my hand, tell me I'm delusional.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 7:54 PM EDT reply actions

Sadly...

you are not delusional. Clairvoyant maybe, but definitely not delusional.

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions

They weren't booing...

they were saying "Puuuuuuuuuu!"

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 8:09 PM EDT reply actions

I can't watch or hear this game...

but what was the reaction to Pujols? I would assume by the last post that there were some boos, but were they resounding?
Ugh Marquis walks the leadoff man. Gameday shows at least that the pitches were low (if you can trust it). How close was he?

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 8:16 PM EDT reply actions

Boos

weren't overwhelming. There were enough for Dan and Al to comment about, but it's not as if they were Damon-in-Bostonesque.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 8:22 PM EDT up reply actions

Gorgeous

Walk, single. Get Marquis out now ;)

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 8:18 PM EDT reply actions

Nice start there Jason

Don't worry though, I'm sure two runs won't be enough for Oswalt...

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:21 PM EDT reply actions

Too bad that ball missed.

I wish that hit had richocheted off of Marquis's head.

by glamberson on May 3, 2006 8:23 PM EDT reply actions

hate

i hate listening to astros announcers on xm.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 8:25 PM EDT reply actions

I'm stuck with them

on MLB.com...

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions

try closing mlb.tv and reopening, duke

Sometimes when you do that, you get different announcers.

DCGreg

by DCGreg on May 3, 2006 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions

I tried it just now

And now it's telling me I'm blacked out and I can't watch the game at all.

And MLB.com phucks me again. I'm located in central Texas, so I'm blacked out. But as usual, the local FSN affiliate is showing the Rangers instead of the Astros.

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions

Ack

Sorry to have made the suggestion, then. Very strange that it would have let you on in the first place, then rejected you.

DCGreg

by DCGreg on May 3, 2006 9:11 PM EDT up reply actions

It's happened before

I know a way to get around the blackout, but it's kind of a pain...not sure it's even worth it tonight. :(

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions

Too Late?

Is it too late to take the Rangers up on that Marquis for Mench deal we all assumed was on the table? (end sarcasm)

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 8:27 PM EDT reply actions

now, now

'Tis only the first inning. And we do have The Greatest Player in the Entire History of Forever on our team.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 8:28 PM EDT up reply actions

Yes we do

I say we put him on the mound tonight. ;)

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions

I've Got a Feelin'

That the at-bat in the first may have been the only one El Hombre gets in this game.

Anybody notice the smack that Memphis laid down on the gNats' AAA team this afternoon? Things of note from the boxscore:

Larry Bigbie sat out the game after leaving last night's game before the fourth inning.

Ty Johnson pitched two scoreless innings of one-hit ball while ringing up three Zephyrs.

by liam on May 3, 2006 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions

TJ still has a 12.00 ERA

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions

Over six innings

He's off to a good start bringing that bloated ERA down.

by liam on May 3, 2006 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions

but

nice going jason you must try and beat your streak of losses from last season.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 8:27 PM EDT reply actions

Ya know what...

Everyone who was calling for a Marquis trade: I agree with you now.

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 8:30 PM EDT reply actions

sorry

i just get pissed when we are losing to the astros (or anybody)

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 8:34 PM EDT reply actions

go

i say we keep spiezio.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 8:38 PM EDT reply actions

It looks like

he's given the muskrat on his chin a fresh dye job. It's a nice, healthy shade of red again.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions

Whatever works for him I guess

It's kind of growing on me. :)

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions

ya gotta admit

the guy has style... and that swing was beautiful.

by SleepyCA on May 3, 2006 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions

Yes

that thing may be hideous, but at least he has personality.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions

Have you seen

his tat?

Nice.

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions

I hope to never

see that hideous thing ever again.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions

Well I'll be damned

Spiezio takes Oswalt deep...didn't see that one coming...

Here comes "that man" again...

by iron duke75 on May 3, 2006 8:39 PM EDT reply actions

speez

that home run could be the duct tape that holds together marquis' fragile psyche for a couple of innings.

dum loquimur fugerit invida aetas

by Neth on May 3, 2006 8:40 PM EDT reply actions

well

at least marquis is keeping the ball down.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 8:42 PM EDT reply actions

nice d

from j-rod

dum loquimur fugerit invida aetas

by Neth on May 3, 2006 8:45 PM EDT reply actions

Whoa

the pitcher just tagged up on Edmonds.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 8:48 PM EDT reply actions

a modest diversion

Look -- even Spivey was hitting today for Memphis!

http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/app/milb/stats/stats.jsp?gid=2006_05_03_nozaaa_mrbaaa_1&t=g_b ox&did=milb

DCGreg

by DCGreg on May 3, 2006 8:50 PM EDT reply actions

MM Park

According to Gameday, it looks like J-Rod just smacked another ball to deep deep center and was robbed by the dimensions. Perhaps things like this nonsense is why we hate the park so much?

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 9:00 PM EDT reply actions

I don't hate their park...

It's the best miniature golf course I've ever seen.

by glamberson on May 3, 2006 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions

how close was that ball by j-rod

n/t

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 9:01 PM EDT reply actions

At the track

Just to right field of Tal's Hill.

by liam on May 3, 2006 9:08 PM EDT up reply actions

marquis at 65 pitches already...

looks like we will be lucky to get 5 innings from him tonight.

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 9:04 PM EDT reply actions

Dan and Al

Their banter ought to please Pip over at Fungoes. They keep prattling on about Oswalt's W-L record.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 9:16 PM EDT reply actions

tiny, inconsistent strike zone this inning

At least for marquis. He's thrown 4 nice pitches in this inning alone that were called strikes earlier in the game that were called balls now, including the one Taveras walked on.

by SleepyCA on May 3, 2006 9:33 PM EDT reply actions

98...

pitches through 4 innings WOW..... vintage Marquis.

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 9:33 PM EDT reply actions

Bennet and Marquis

It's a little too early to say, but I think Bennett may be dealing better with Marquis than Molina. Molina gets pretty emphatic with Marquis, and it seems like he wants to rip his head off sometimes.

While I share Molina's apparent feelings, it'll be interesting to see how Bennett does, and if he starts catching Molina regularly.

Of course, the best possible outcome would be to trade Marquis for, say, a bat boy or maybe a bucket of dirt, but I'll refrain from getting that ridiculously optimistic.

by glamberson on May 3, 2006 9:39 PM EDT reply actions

I've noticed that as well...

Marquis wears his feelings on his sleeve something awful. Maybe that's why he couldn't work under Leo Mazzone.

by Matt @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions

we just have to wait

until Marquis throws a shutout and ship him out while his stock is high.

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:02 PM EDT reply actions

how far....

... did that ball pujols hit go. on game day they put it out farther than I have ever seen them do it before.

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:05 PM EDT reply actions

El Hombre

Oswalt gives up his third hit of the night. Pujols launches it off the silly train trestle thing.

Willy Tavares' at-bat to triple in the bottom of the sixth was an incredible piece of hitting.

by liam on May 3, 2006 10:06 PM EDT reply actions

Here's my Pettitte impersonation:

"Oh... my... gosh!"

That appeared to be roughly the same spot as The Homer.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 10:07 PM EDT reply actions

I just turned the game on

but Marquis has a nasty line. Was his command off, was he not throwning sinkers, or was it just Marquis being Marquis...

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 10:20 PM EDT reply actions

all 3

He had some control issues, but even when he threw nice pitches he wasn't getting any help from the plate umpire, which forced him to try to throw the ball by people. He doesn't have the ability to do that, so he got hit hard.

by SleepyCA on May 3, 2006 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions

Down Again

Apparantly John Gall misses Memphis.

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 10:28 PM EDT reply actions

What is it

with Gall and those low pitches?

by cardsrul on May 3, 2006 10:29 PM EDT reply actions

gall

he might be trying to hard. TRL never gives him a chance so when he does he pushes.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 10:31 PM EDT reply actions

Falkenborg

I'm glad that we used Falkenborg in the ninth yesterday to save our relievers for tonight.
O wait, here he comes again. Yay.

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 10:33 PM EDT reply actions

My thoughts exactly...

But I'm rootin' for the kid!

by dccardsfan on May 3, 2006 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions

Absolutely.

Thank God Wainwright is good to go tonight.

by knieriemd on May 3, 2006 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions

Got to give credit

Well, I questioned the move but he did the job. Now let's get some runs. It is absolutely crucial that J-Rod gets on ahead of Pujols. Can you say rematch vs. Lidge?

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions

So, Top of the 9th...

Oswalt up to 116 pitches - he's done.

I really hope Lidge gives up a hit to J-rod. What would happent next?

by edgesofsanity on May 3, 2006 10:33 PM EDT reply actions

well

god comes down from heaven?

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 10:38 PM EDT reply actions

Just a thought about midseason trades...

Schmidt threw a complete game tonight against the Brewers, but a) he'd be costly to acquire and b) the NL West looks to be s**t again so the giants may not want to sell parts at the deadline.

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 10:39 PM EDT reply actions

well

i think he's a free agent at the end of the year.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions

I hate losing, but this isn't that bad...

You know, we may be losing, but this game hasn't annoyed me nearly as much as the two in Cincinnati. The bullpen has been good, Marquis settled down nicely instead of just completely losing it, and the offense has done enough to keep them in the game...which is pretty decent, considering who is pitching.

I wish I didn't live in Portland so I could actually watch this stuff.

Old Abner's at it again...

by matt reeder on May 3, 2006 10:41 PM EDT reply actions

is it just me...

or have the astros been getting the low strike call that Marquis wasn't getting all night?

by effin fisk on May 3, 2006 10:46 PM EDT reply actions

Hmm

That at-bat: Falkenborg vs. Berkman: was it as awesome as it seemed online?

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 10:46 PM EDT reply actions

YES!

I'm jittery with excitement right now. as long as he doesn't walk...

by effin fisk on May 3, 2006 10:47 PM EDT reply actions

Way to go

Rodriguez!

He's been waiting to get that hit to that spot since the 2005 NLCS. That one went just a few feet longer.

by liam on May 3, 2006 10:48 PM EDT reply actions

JROD!!

God he's awesome.

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 10:48 PM EDT reply actions

oh well

a game-tier anywhere else. advanced the runner. let's go Jimmy!

by effin fisk on May 3, 2006 10:50 PM EDT reply actions

Holy Smokes...

After the ball left Pujols' bat, Lidge squatted down just like he did in Game 5. Looky there... Jimmy ballgame's 2-13 vs. Lidge now.

by liam on May 3, 2006 10:50 PM EDT reply actions

Not quite, Al

but big rip, tho. Dig how you jogged over the pitcher's mound on your way back to the dugout. Go scratch, Lidge!

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 3, 2006 10:51 PM EDT reply actions

damnit. Pujols and Edmonds, we needed a homer.

Unless Encarnacion can pull another homer out of his a**...

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 10:51 PM EDT reply actions

darn

i hate this place.
lidge=damaged goods

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 10:51 PM EDT reply actions

Lets leave this game in the hands of....

enKarnacion... I cant watch

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:52 PM EDT reply actions

Would that ball that Pujols hit...

have went out at bush?

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:53 PM EDT reply actions

J-Rod's might have gone out...it was on the hill

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions

implying pujols definitely would have

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions

Both would have, probably.

Bush stadium is 400' to center, and the announcer said rodriguez hit his "at least 420 feet". Pujols' shot didn't go quite as far but it was still past the warning track, so it was hit well over 400 feet.

by SleepyCA on May 3, 2006 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions

OMG

I'm gonna have a heart attack win or lose.

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 10:55 PM EDT reply actions

please

bring rolen in.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 10:55 PM EDT reply actions

Power to the beard here please!!!!

n/t

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:56 PM EDT reply actions

we lose

damnit

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 10:57 PM EDT reply actions

aaaahhhh!!!!!

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:58 PM EDT reply actions

damnit

Lidge is hittable, and we're swinging at pitches in the dirt.

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 10:58 PM EDT reply actions

Lidge is hittable and we are PH

w/ MILES...

Seriously because Rolen wouldn't have had a better chance than that...

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions

Freakin Minute Maid park...

and all its stupid little quirks.

by RB @ Viva El Birdos on May 3, 2006 10:59 PM EDT reply actions

was Spiezio's check swing really a strike?

It looked like he held up to me. oh well. game over. Glad to see we kept trying til the end after a crappy start.

by effin fisk on May 3, 2006 10:59 PM EDT reply actions

i thought so too but I didn't see a replay

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions

It's childish to blame a loss on park dimensions

but when we play here, I almost end up not being able to help myself. J-Rod and Pujols hit the ball 420+ feet to center and it doesn't matter.
I understand that it's wrong to get too worked up about that. Just have to vent.

by phatalbert5 on May 3, 2006 11:01 PM EDT reply actions

Goes to show

If Pujols doesn't win it for us, we won't win.

Get healthy Scott!

by SirVLCIV on May 3, 2006 11:01 PM EDT reply actions

well

well at least lidge didn't dominate us. if only the person who designed the park wasn't.....nevermind.

by tnek5 on May 3, 2006 11:01 PM EDT reply actions

WHY WAS MILES PINCH HITTING???

Forget the dimensions...I don't want Miles pinch hitting...I would rather see gooch or Rolen...instead TLR trots out the person with the LEAST amount of power on the bench... I DO NOT UNDERSTAND

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:03 PM EDT reply actions

a single would have tied the game

And brought up luna with 2 men on. Miles was the right choice.

by SleepyCA on May 3, 2006 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions

why was miles more likely to hit

a single than rolen or gooch? He's certainly LESS likely to hit more than a single and his career OBP is dreadful (lets not pretend his play thus far hasn't been a little beyond any expectations). What compelling reason is there to have him at the plate? Does he get more hits than Rolen or Taguchi? I know Rolen is not feeling well but if he's starting tomorrow as I have read elsewhere, why couldn't he pinchhit tonight?

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions

some #'s

Rolen, career avg .284
Miles, career avg .289
Gooch, career avg .286

As far as getting a base hit, it's a tossup.

Now, rolen would have been much more likely to make the game 7-5, or 6-5, and I definitely would have preferred him up there if he was well, but we don't have any idea how good he is feeling and miles is hot right now. And he is a much better hitter than anyone gives him credit for being.

by SleepyCA on May 3, 2006 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions

here's some more

Miles is 2-10 in Minute Maid and 3-25 vs. Houston
He's hitting righties to a tune of .200 this year.

Rolen is 38-146 against Houston and is hitting righties to .286 the past three years.

Maybe Miles is SLIGHTLY underrated but when we are down by one with Lidge on the mound, I still want Rolen at the plate before Miles.

Not to mention Taguchi has been hot at the plate lately compared to Miles who has been cooling off.

I'm not sure why this is really debatable...Rolen or Miles? Is that really a question???

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions

beating a dead horse

but if you want to throw out small-sample-size numbers, Rolen is 0-7 against lidge in his career, and So Taguchi of Japan is 0-4. (miles was 0-2).

Again, if rolen was healthy it would have been a no-brainer. B ut he's been in bed for 2 weeks with some kind of flesh-eating virus and there is no telling what his ability to play was yesterday. Taguchi/miles were a tossup and miles was a switch-hitter.

by SleepyCA on May 4, 2006 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions

A much better question

is why did Marquis pitch the 6th after having thrown 105 pitches?

by Valatan on May 4, 2006 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions

if it wasn't for the fact

that Tony had been "saving" the bullpen for the astros I would say that we just needed Marquis to get some more outs. But I agree. With Wainwright not having pitched for several days he should have been out there.

I still very much dislike the decision to PH Miles but leaving Marquis in was another less than stellar decision made earlier in the game.

by azruavatar on May 4, 2006 3:37 AM EDT up reply actions

The miles thing is a lot easier for me to deal

with, considering that all that was needed was a hit, and he was the only lefty left on the bench.

by Valatan on May 4, 2006 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions

Now that I have calmed down

I'm glad to see a little pop out of the lineup but the lack of baserunners worries me and I'm not sure that it is entirely attributable to Oswalt. The bullpen looked good again though. Falkenborg halved his ERA...heh

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:06 PM EDT reply actions

tony

Once again LaRussa leaves Marquis in too long.

by AL on May 3, 2006 11:16 PM EDT reply actions

btw

anyone know why Edmonds was running in the ninth?

Was that a hit-and-run that juan didn't hit?

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:26 PM EDT reply actions

Running with two strikes

Successful steal and he's the potential tying run in scoring postion. Base hit and he's on third. It's a calculated risk but one I like to see.

The 26th Man

by 26thMan on May 4, 2006 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions

eh...

TLR loves his hit and run...
me, I'm not so fond of it...
but it appeared to work out this time

by azruavatar on May 4, 2006 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions

Re: Rolen

He's still weak from the bronchitis. It's not something you can get over in a day or two...

by cardsrul on May 3, 2006 11:45 PM EDT reply actions

he's starting tomorrow

he couldn't pinch hit for one at bat???

by azruavatar on May 3, 2006 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions

YO!!

Chill out. This is your Senor Love Daddy telling you that all may not be well, but all is well in the well, child. This was a game that should have been a 10-0 blowout. Marquis was that bad the first two innings. Can you imagine the score if Oswalt had been that bad? Instead, our boys made it a ballgame. They lost. Did they learn anything? We'll see. They almost took that game back--and that shows some nuts. Acourse, I'd be much happier had they actually won it, but it should have been so much worse. Our Birds handed it to them on a silver plate, but the best the Stros could do with it is 5-4? A win is a win is a win, but ah well, there's still tomorrow night. And that's the triple truth, Ruth.

by rockin redbird on May 4, 2006 3:41 AM EDT reply actions