FanPost

Carlos Martinez, the starter

I am in the minority on Carlos Martinez. I think he is a fantastic pitcher and could be an absolute incredible reliever if he could ever get command of his blistering fastball and even better slidery-curvey-slurvey-whatever the hell that is that everyone misses like 94% of the time.

In any case, I just don't see it happening as a starter. For whatever reason, I just don't believe in it like I believe in Waino, Wacha, Lynn, Miller, Rosenthal, Garcia, and more. The main reason, I believe, to me is that he just doesn't have the stamina - which is likely a byproduct of the lack of command. Let's look at his minor league career to illustrate this point.

In 2011, Carlos spent part of the year with the Quad City River Bandits and part of the year with the Palm Beach Cardinals.

Martinez threw a total of 84 2/3 innings in 18 starts over the two levels. That's 4.70 innings pitched per start by Martinez.

His contemporaries at that level did the following:

Quad Cities and Palm Beach

John Gast pitched some at High A in 2011. He started 25 games and pitched 161 1/3 innings, an average of 6.45 IP/GS.

Shelby Miller pitched some at High A in 2011 as well. He started 25 games and pitched 139 2/3 innings, an average of 5.59 IP/GS.

Eric Fornataro started at High A in 2011. He is now a reliever, but then started 24 games and pitched 144 2/3 innings, an average of 6.03 IP/GS.

Zach Russel started at A in 2011. He is now out of baseball but started 23 games and pitched 113 1/3 innings, an average of 4.93 IP/GS.

Anthony Ferrara started at A in 2011. He is now pitching in the Independent League, but started 22 games and pitched 127 2/3 innings, an average of 5.80 IP/GS.

Joe Kelly pitched some at High A in 2011. He started 22 games and pitched 132 innings, an average of 6 IP/GS.

Trevor Rosenthal pitched at A in 2011. He started 22 games and pitched 120 1/3 innings, an average of 5.47 IP/GS.

Seth Blair started at A in 2011. He started 21 games and pitched 81 2/3 innings, an average of just 3.89 IP/GS. I would never say that he's had a good season in the minors, but he's now at AAA in 2014.

Kevin Siegrist pitched at both A and High A in 2011 also. He started 19 games and threw 107 1/3 innings, an average of 5.65 IP/GS.


CMart's 2011 season was well below the average of nearly every starter in the minors who has made the majors at this point in time. Yes, he's 2 years younger, but it doesn't get any better along the way. Continue following the journey.

In 2012, he started again at Palm Beach - going 33 innings in 7 starts - 4.71 IP/GS. He continued at Springfield - 71 1/3 innings in 15 games, 14 starts (4.77 IP/GS). His contemporaries?

Palm Beach and Springfield

Anthony Ferrara again started both places Martinez did in 2012. He started 21 games and pitched 108 innings, going 5.14 IP/GS.

Kyle Hald started a few games at A+ in 2012. He started 24 games and threw 136 2/3 innings. averaging 5.69 IP/GS.

Scott Gorgen pitched some at AA in 2012. He started 24 games and threw 129 1/3 innings (pitching in 5 more games as well). He averaged ~5 IP/GS.

Richard Castillo again started both places Martinez did in 2012. He started 25 games and pitched 148 2/3 innings, averaging 5.95 IP/GS.

Seth Maness pitched in both A+ and AA in 2012. He started 27 games and pitched 169 2/3 innings (leading all Cardinal minor leaguers), averaging 6.28 IP/GS.

John Gast started some games at AA in 2012. He started 28 games and pitched 160 2/3 innings, averaging 5.74 IP/GS.

Trevor Rosenthal pitched some at AA in 2012. He started 20 games and pitched 109 innings, averaging 5.45 IP/GS.

Todd McInnis pitched some at High A in 2012. He has been out of baseball for over a year now, as far as I can tell. He started 19 of 27 games and pitched 117 1/3 innings, averaging 5.37 IP/GS.

Ryan Sherriff pitched at High A in 2012. He is currently a reliever in Springfield. He started 16 games and threw 97 innings, averaging 6.06 IP/GS.

In this case, everyone listed threw way more innings per game started than Martinez. They might not have been as good, but some were even better - or at least as good. Martinez was still young for his level - as he currently is in the majors - but you just have to be able to eat innings as a starter.


In 2013, Martinez averaged 3.89 IP/GS in 3 starts at AA Springfield before being moved to AAA Memphis. At Memphis, Martinez started 13 games and threw 68 innings. That's an average of 5.23 IP/GS. His average for the season ended up at 4.98 IP/GS.


Others he played with?


Springfield and Memphis

Boone Whting pitched both at AA and AAA. He started 27 games and pitched 136 1/3 innings. That's an average of 5.05 IP/GS. Whiting has yet to make the majors as a starter or reliever, despite pitching quite well and being 2 years older than Martinez.

Richard Castillo also pitched at both levels. He started 26 games and pitched 147 2/3 innings, an average of 5.68 IP/GS. He's now pitching in the Rockies' organization.

Tim Cooney pitched some at AA in 2013. He started 26 games and pitched 154 1/3 innings, an average of 5.94 IP/GS. He's now in AAA at just a year older than Martinez.

Scott McGregor pitched at both levels. He started 25 games and pitched 148 2/3 innings, an average of 5.95 IP/GS.

Seth Blair pitched at AA in 2013. He started 22 games and threw 129 2/3 innings, an average of 5.89 IP/GS.

Nick Additon pitched at AAA in 2013. He started 21 games and threw 131 2/3 innings, an average of 6.27 IP/GS.

Tyler Lyons pitched at AAA in 2013 when he wasn't in the majors. He started 16 games and threw 100 1/3 innings, an average of 6.27 IP/GS.

Michael Wacha pitched at AAA in 2013 when he wasn't in the majors. He started 15 games and threw 85 innings, an average of 5.67 IP/GS.

Really, all but Blair pitched pretty darn well, too. Castillo was on the low end of good, which is why he's no longer a Cardinal. There were quite a few Martinez didn't blow out of the water by any means.


Martinez is a heck of a pitcher, and I want to make that perfectly clear. I just don't think that he'll be all that as a starting pitcher in the major leagues - at least not without a TON of learning on the job. I hope I'm wrong...but I just don't see it.

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