2012 Draft Preview Ni: I Have the Powerrrrr!
I'm writing this Tuesday. I have some spare time and this is easier than trying to fit a post between things on Wednesday morning. So if something drastic has happened overnight you'll just have to discuss that amongst yourselves instead.
I'm also writing this just a few hours after the Prince Fielder signing was announced. Nine years, $214 million. Wow. He's four years younger than Pujols, but I'm not sure I would be any more comfortable betting a decade's worth of paychecks on a guy with Fielder's build than on Albert. I'm also a little curious what the Tigers plan on doing with all of their first base/DH combo hitters; Victor Martinez will be out this season, sure, but it isn't as if he's going to magically be able to catch again -- or play any other position for that matter -- when he comes back in 2013.
Still, the spectre of facing Miguel Cabrera and Prince Fielder back to back in the lineup should be enough to give any American League pitchers screaming fits of night terrors. Unless the Royals' prospects all mature and start producing at career peak levels at the same time this season, I think the Tigers are going to run away and hide with the AL Central. That's an horrific division with one super team.
Anyhow, I was already planning on doing a draft preview this week, but in honour of Prince leaving the division I'm going to feature a troika of players who offer a toolset the Cardinals' minor league system is a little light on at the moment. I speak of power. Big time, over the fence power. Thirty homer a year power. Chicks digging it power.
The Cards' system, flush with power arms, is a little soft on power bats. Matt Adams has plenty of power potential, of course, and it's tough to say just what kind of ceiling Oscar Taveras might have. Beyond those two, though, the Cardinals' top hitting prospects are mostly guys like Kolten Wong and Zack Cox, players with an outstanding ability to barrel the ball but who lack either the stature or the swing to produce true home run pop. There are a few players like Kyle Conley, who managed to put 13 over the fence in just 305 plate appearances while playing in the hitter's graveyards of the Florida State League but did so as a 24 year old and has yet to prove he can stay on the field, who show up at the margins of sleeper lists and the like, but players with that profile are really no better than a lottery ticket.
Last year the organisation perceived a lack of athleticism within the farm system and moved to address that need by taking speedy athletes like Lance Jeffries, Charlie Tilson, and C.J. McElroy. Right now there's a fairly apparent lack of mashers. Whether the Cards will take that into consideration and try to shore up a need through the draft is really anyone's guess, but hey, I've got to come up with some kind of bullshit narrative to help organise these scouting reports, right?
Christian Walker, 1B/3B, University of South Carolina
6'0", 220 lbs
Bats: Right
Throws: Right
So, what's so great about this guy?
Chris Walker is pretty much your prototypical middle of the order hitter. Highly thought of coming out of high school back in 2009, he was drafted very late by the Dodgers thanks to what looked to be an ironclad commitment to South Carolina. In the three years since, Walker has done nothing to diminish the perception of him as a big-time power prospect.
If you're looking for a true home run hitter near the top of the draft, Walker is your man. He put on a show at the Powershowcase event in Tampa his senior year of high school, the same event that first made Bryce Harper such a household name. His swing is explosive, with a short stride and the kind of hip torque that can make a ballpark seem small in a hurry. Pure power isn't all Walker brings to the table, though, as he's shown a solid approach at the plate and the ability to hit the ball to all fields.
Walker has the strong, stocky build of a running back, leaving him little room to grow any further. Physically, he's pretty much a finished product. He has the range and quickness to handle third base for now, but his likely future is at first. He is a plus athlete, with outstanding feet and an arm which was clocked in the upper 80s in high school. It's possible some team could select him with an eye toward playing him at the hot corner, but such a situation would likely fall into the, "Until he proves he can't do it," category. Call it the Brett Wallace Exception.
If Walker is somehow still on the board when the Cardinals make their pick in June I would be almost certain he's the pick. He fits ideally into the Zack Cox/Wallace demographic the Cards have plumbed before and would represent an outstanding value. However, with a strong spring Walker will almost assure himself of a draft status which will likely keep him from getting anywhere near the Cardinals' hands. He puts me in mind of Bryce Brentz of the Red Sox, but I think Walker should show better on the plate discipline front, particularly in the strikeout department.
Victor Roache, OF, Georgia Southern University
6'1", 225 lbs
Bats: Right
Throws: Right
So, what's so great about this guy?
Victor Roache may have the best raw power of any player in this year's draft. He led all of NCAA baseball last year with 30 home runs, and that came in the first year with the new, power-sapping bats.
Bat speed and strength are Roache's calling cards, as he takes a vicious hack at any pitch he deems worthy. He's capable of hitting the ball an absolute mile, both in batting practice and game situations, and has shown a capacity for hitting with wood as well. Roache hits from a widespread stance with no stride, only a toe tap for timing, and his pure hand speed jumps out at you immediately. He posted a .975 OPS in the Cape Cod League last summer, and we know what kind of value the Cardinals place on players who put up big numbers on the Cape.
The rest of Roache's tools all profile average or a little better, with an arm strong enough to make him an ideal right field candidate. He's an absolute physical specimen, chiseled and huge. The one physical concern with him is a broken ankle which required screws and a plate to repair back in 2010 and has caused some to question his speed after the injury. Even so, he runs well enough; he's just not a burner.
Unlike Walker, who shows the ability to hit the ball hard to all parts of the park, Roache has a tendency to sell out trying to hit for power, which leaves him vulnerable to offspeed pitches. His pure bat speed is good enough, though, that he should be able to learn to wait on the ball and drive it wherever it may be delivered.
Roache, originally from Michigan, has many of the same concerns attached as all cold-weather players. He's more raw at this stage of his career than are players from warmer areas, and the level of competition he's faced in college isn't the greatest. Still, his performance on the Cape should help to assuage those concerns somewhat, as he blistered the very best college baseball has to offer.
Roache is right in the Cardinals' wheelhouse this year I think, at least in terms of draft status. He's projected by most as a mid- to late first round pick, which would put him right around the Cards' draft slot. He offers power in spades, and his overall tool package make him a perfect fit for a corner outfield spot in the future. There have been some teams of late who have actually seemed to favour players who have yet to be exposed to high-level coaching and/or competition, with the thought that elite level development help could take said players' abilities to as-yet unseen heights, whereas players able to take advantage of the best coaching and playing at the highest levels are much closer to their ceilings already. It's an interesting philosophy, and one I'm curious to watch in the coming years. Whether the Cardinals are such a team or not I have no idea -- particularly now, under a new scouting director -- but Roache would seem to offer a remarkably good fit for the Cardinals in this year's draft.
Love the bat speed.
Richie Shaffer, 1B/3B, Clemson University
6'3", 205 lbs
Bats: Right
Throws: Right
So, what's so great about this guy?
Of the three players covered here today, Shaffer is probably the player with the fewest holes in his game. Now, that's not to say he's the most highly thought of -- Christian Walker holds that spot in most people's minds fairly handily -- but Shaffer's game is more rounded than either Walker or Victor Roache. While I think Walker would only nominally be considered a third base prospect in the way Brett Wallace was, I've seen Shaffer play at third and I think he has a legitimate chance of playing there at the next level. Shaffer may not have the pure off the charts power of Roache, but he has a more intelligent, sound approach at the plate which could ultimately make him a better hitter.
Coming out of high school, Shaffer was a rail-thin middle infield prospect who showed the kind of occasional power which has been getting shortstops slapped with Cal Ripken comps since forever. Since that time he's filled out considerably and slowed down as well, moving inexorably toward the corners of the diamond. Along with the added bulk, though, has come bigger present power and the knowledge of how to apply it.
In his 2011 sophomore campaign, Shaffer posted a 1.015 OPS and a sterling 44:53 BB:K ratio. His 13 homers doesn't quite put him in the same company as the other two guys here, but his .262 ISO and 15.9% walk rate speak for themselves. He hit to the tune of an .846 OPS in the Cape Cod League last summer as well, showing plenty of potential to handle wood. (snicker)
I like Shaffer quite a bit. For one thing, I'm a sucker for people with that last name; for another I think there's a very real chance he'll play further up the defensive spectrum than either Walker or Roache without a huge dropoff in offense. He might be seen as a bit of a stretch at 23, or he might not. We're still awfully early in the process to make those kinds of assumptions. What I do know is this: the Cardinals are thin on bats, and Shaffer has what could end up a very, very good one. Whether that makes it a fit or not is beyond my ability to prognosticate.
The Cardinals have a question; any of these players could easily present an answer. Two of the three should still be on the board, depending on how things may change between now and June. Will one of these players hear his name called when the Cards go on the board? Only time will tell.
The Baron's Playlist for the 25th of January, 2012
"Falling For You" - Weezer
"Across the Sea" - Weezer
"(If Loving You is Wrong) I Don't Want to Be Right" - Luther Ingram
"World Keeps Turning" - Tom Waits
"Downtown Train" - Tom Waits
"You Will. You? Will. You? Will. You? Will." - Bright Eyes
"The Calendar Hung Itself" - Bright Eyes
"Save for Me" - Theodore
"All I Ask" - Theodore
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Oswalt "news"
Peter Gammons @pgammo
We shall see, but 2 GMs think Oswalt wants to reuinite w/ Ryan and M. Maddux in Texas, 1 says St. Louis.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
I just don't see Mo taking him
for anything close to what he’s probably asking for.
Maybe Mo is holding out to acquire him at the deadline if for some reason the rotation/bullpen needs help.
Cards fan in Middle East
It has been reported...
that he is only seeking a 1 year deal for $8million.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Iiiiinnnnnnttttteeeeerrrreeessstttiiinnnnggg
Maybe he wants to reunite with Berk and Beltran?
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Jan 25, 2012 9:55 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
If you ask me that's all these "GM opinions" are based on
Which of his former teammates he wants to reunite with.
Just WAGging. And trying to force some kind of dramatic line.
Cards fan in Middle East
doesn't it seem like oswalt would have happened by now if it were going to happen?
"Alright, you caught me. I was wearing the clear heels"
-azruavatar
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 25, 2012 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe not -- I assume his price continues to drop with time
At some point, maybe Mo decides that “for that price” we could afford to eat the salary of Lohse or Westbrook or put them in the bullpen.
I can't help but think...
there is a price that we jump in at, and his agent has already been given that price (or our negotiating price based off of our top dollar price)…maybe around $6M?
"Progress always involves risk; you can't steal second base and keep your foot on first base." - Frederick Wilcox
by cardzfanbub on Jan 25, 2012 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
hope so!
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Robert Garber
according to Baseball-Reference; previously represented by Barry Meister
I was reading about how countless species are being pushed toward extinction by man's destruction of forests. Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us. - Calvin, Scientific Progress Goes "Boink", Watterson
Sure, but does Texas have a rotation spot for him?
Darvish, Harrison, Holland, Ogando, Lewis, and Feliz (who is thought to be moving to the rotation) give them 6 starters for 5 spots on the 40 man roster already. Not to mention, they have Martin Perez, Tanner Scheppers, and Neil Ramirez who will all start the season at AAA.
Seems to me like signing Oswalt would be a major waste of resources, just like signing CJ Wilson would have been and signing Yu Darvish probably was.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
If you ask me,
Boston and Detroit are the teams that should be interested in him right now and should also interest Oswalt, as they will be contenders next season.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
If they signed Oswalt...
they would create an excellent trade chip in either Harrison or Lewis. Plus Ogando is really better off in the bullpen.
They could package of Uehara, Harrison/Lewis, and Murphy could get something really good.
Sign Roy O
...
Latest On Roy Oswalt
By Ben Nicholson-Smith [January 25 at 1:33pm CST]
1:33pm: The Red Sox made Oswalt an offer, but are unsure of his interest level, since he has yet to accept, Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com tweets.
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
"but are unsure of his interest level, since he has yet to accept"
Thank you, Captain Obvious!
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
CBS Sports post by Knobler
It states that Oswalt turned down Detroit even after a recruiting phone call from Verlander.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Of note
Oswalt’s representatives indicated that the deal breaker was the City of Detroit’s refusal to agree to Oswalt’s demand to be allowed to clear blighted property with his bulldozer on days that he was not pitching.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 3:11 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
seems like a reasonable request.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
well sure
anyone who was gonna clear blighted property would just have to bulldoze the whole city.
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
what about the pawn shop?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
Whata about Ball Park Village?
Maybe that would be a local incentive. . .
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
Well sure...except all those guys are cost controlled for 3+ years beyond this one
So why trade a bunch of good assets for an oft injured 34 year old who really isn’t an upgrade over ANY of those guys.
Ogando is NOT better off in the bullpen. He was a 3.6 fWAR pitcher in the rotation last year. Would you put a cost controlled Chris Carpenter in the bullpen? Yeah, me neither.
I think you just are so enamored with 2001-2008 Roy Oswalt that used to kick our ass all the time that you forget that he isn’t that pitcher anymore. He’s a #3/#4 starter now.
Furthermore, who do the Rangers target with all those pieces to upgrade their team? What spot on their team absolutely has to be upgraded? They have the best defensive infield in baseball, and all those guys hit pretty well too. Moreland/Young is decent at 1B/DH and there’s no 1B on the block right now anyway. Napoli put up MVP #’s last year behind the plate. They are set in the outfield with Cruz/Hamilton/Borbon/Gentry.
You seem to be talking out of your ass here, without thinking about what you’re saying. They have arguably the best team in their league right now. So why blow it up?
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
They'll want to get rid of Harrison or Lewis soon anyway...
because they’ll be climbing the arb ladder and they have too many pitchers for too few spots. As for Ogando, he was good, but he’s still a two-pitcher – he might be able to replicate his 2011, but it’s an open question.
As for who they could get, someone to replace Gentry/Borbon. That’s the only upgradeable spot. Would the Dbacks take Harrison/Uehara/Murphy for Chris Young? Maybe. Or they could shoot for Alex Gordon. Or someone with upside like Drew Stubbs or Rasmus.
Sign Roy O
Maybe, maybe, maybe.
On paper, they’re a 93 win team right now. Why blow that up for a bunch of maybes? So they can be a 94 win team?
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
They're not a shoo in for a playoff spot at all...
I think they’re better than the Angels, but it’s very close and quite dependent on Darvish. And the Wild card will be fiercely contested. Two of Tampa/Boston/NY/LAA/Texas will not make the playoffs.
If Oswalt wants to come to Texas and they can get a 4 or 5 win corner OFer to take the place of Murphy, they should definitely think about it.
Sign Roy O
Hopefully they trade
Ogando to an NL Central team so Allen Craig can continue his ownership of him.
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
hah yes, imagine the damage if Ogando and Craig are both starting vs relief / off bench match-ups!
4 HR games would be sweet
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
the rangers will contend as well, of course.
but it seems to me that just as the cardinals’ stated interest is to put oswalt in the bullpen—which makes very little sense to me—that would probably be the rangers’ interest, too.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Thing is, they're pretty well set in the bullpen
One of Feliz/Ogando is not going to make the rotation (my bet is on Feliz and he remains the closer). Which would give them Nathan/Feliz/Adams/Uehara/Feldman/Oliver/Lowe in the bullpen already. That’s 12 pitchers.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Holy fuck that team is stacked.
Texas could very well be the best team in baseball next year. If not, they can’t be far behind the Yankees.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
To be perfectly honest
They were probably the best team in baseball last year – at least on paper.
They didn’t do too badly on the field either. #11 was a very close thing, after all – pure DENSITY.
Cards fan in Middle East
We were the best team in October!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 7:13 AM EST up reply actions
Arizona could use him.
Cincinatti too. Not sure either of those teams have any money left, but they’ve both got pretty crappy 5th starters and are trying to contend. I suppose you could throw Colorado into that bracket as well, perhaps.
Kinda agree about Detroit but, by that same token, I bet they project about 10-12 wins better than any other team in that division, so it’s hard to know how much extra playoff value Oswalt adds. But if Ilitch is going for it, I guess what’s another $8m when you’ve just spent $200m on a fat soon-to-be-DH?
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
FWIW I expect Oswalt to sign with Boston within the next week.
I can’t really see how he ends up anywhere else.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:25 PM EST up reply actions
boston is negotiating with edwin jackson.
do you think they sign both? boston stated they prefer e-jax.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
so
Was there any talk about fielder going to Detroit before it happened? Kind of seems like it came out of nowhere.
Piss off Tony, get shipped to Canada.
by beer me on Jan 25, 2012 9:58 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Well, as narratives go
It does turn out kind of neat, doesn’t it?
Still, Detroit had no place for Prince until Martinez went down.
Cards fan in Middle East
It caught some momentum...
when V-Mart went down for the year. The rumors have been around and gaining steam for the last week.
"Progress always involves risk; you can't steal second base and keep your foot on first base." - Frederick Wilcox
by cardzfanbub on Jan 25, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
Earlier this week, there was a discussion on the top second base prospects.
The discussion touched on who should be considered a second base prospect.
Jeff Sullivan of Baseball Nation has written a post entitled “There Are No Second Base Prospects.”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Without reading the article first
Would you say he’s Wong?
Cards fan in Middle East
by Shloz on Jan 25, 2012 10:07 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Yeah.
It’s a comedy piece, but I found it funny after VEB’s recent discussion.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
This was SBN'd.
It had a comment, too. I thought it was funnier than I would have without the recent VEB discussion on the topic.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Also without reading the article first
if he is Wong, I don’t want to be White.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2012 10:13 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Second read and this
He fits ideally into the Zack Cox/Wallace demographic the Cards have plumbed before and would represent an outstanding value.
is exactly why I don’t think Walker is a good pick because I don’t think either Wallace or Cox were an outstanding value.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
Hey Azru
Are you suggested we did a sort of overdraft on Cox and Wallace? Because my impression has been these were good, aggressive picks.
At time of draft, it was good value
But with the way Wallace turned out, not so much
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:15 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Well, is it still arguable that picks like that are seen, at least somewhat
as opportunities to cash in on perceived value, i.e. via trades? Turning Wallace et al. into Holliday (I know, I know, only partial season because we signed him after that, but still) seemed like a good result to me. I have no clue how to prove or even provide evidence that this was their intent with Wallace all along or something, but I suppose it’s at least possible?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
That's true
Its just that twice in the past few years, we have drafted te best college hitter, and both are seeming to underwhelm (granted, coz gets more time)
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:19 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I wonder if this is a trend with the "best college hitter" or something?
Could just be pure bad luck? Or maybe those hitter had significant flaws that didn’t effect them yet due to competition level? I’m just thinking out loud at this point but I find this stuff interesting.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I don't really have a problem with drafting good hitters.
It’s probably easier, since pitchers arms can flame out, and power hitters have not in many cases fully filled out. And honestly, it seems like the last couple of drafts have been good.
My big hope is with what people are already calling a strong system, let’s swing for the fences. If we have five picks in the top 50-ish, let’s take some chances. If that means picking up power bats, sounds good to me.
Dream first 5 is Stryker Trahan, 2 power bats, high upside SS
And a LH pitcher with upside
So basically, every teams dream draft
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:28 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Heh
The rest of the dream scenario would of course involve our team winning the world series and then hiring VEB and all its members as highly paid consultants. GO BIG OR GO HOME.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
"The rest of the dream scenario would of course involve our team winning the world series and then hiring VEB and all its members as highly paid consultants."
So, we’re halfway there? Or are you taking 2012WS?
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Jan 25, 2012 12:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Oops, should have specified
I mean a 2012 repeat.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Winning the world series once in a row is so, you know, boring obviously.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Good point!
Who am I to argue with a 21st century cultural icon like Leapin’ Laird?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Wasn't Kyle Russell pretty well thought of as a college hitter too?
From a power stand point.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
As a power hitter
Not so much as a pure hitter like cox and Wallace
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:43 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
He had unreal power but huge contact problems even in college
He practically had a golf swing it was so long, but he still hit the farthest ball I’ve ever seen hit live and it’s not particularly close. Unreal. Ball rolled down the opposite side of the Mizzou indoor football building, the front end of which is 380. For it to have gotten down to the other side, Google Earth tells me he had to have hit it 500 feet legit, no BSing.
Not afraid to nitpick
do they still use aluminum bats in college?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 7:16 AM EST up reply actions
well then
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:50 AM EST up reply actions
No they don't
They’re composite now
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
well then
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
then
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
Not everyone thought that about Cox
IIRC, there were quite a lot of Cox naysayers around that draft (possibly in front offices, which is maybe partly why he fell as far as he did). I think I might’ve preferred Castellanos at the time but thought it was a good pick, so there ya go.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:31 PM EST up reply actions
fwiw, it looks like a lot of people in detroit think castellanos will end up a corner outfielder.
so, we definitely haven’t cornered the market on faux-third basemen.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
I've long been on record as a Wallace detractor because
his defense was beyond the pale. I’m more tepid in my criticism of Cox but I don’t think I’d characterize the pick as an “outstanding value” especially considering the contract he signed.
When we have appreciable history, as we now have, that is not the comparison I’d wish to draw between a new draft prospect.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
I too like roache...a lot
What is your reasoning against the other two?
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 10:41 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
It's mostly defense/position related.
I’d take Shaffer over Walker. Walker looks like a redux of a bad fielding first baseman. You’re basically talking about taking a Matt Adams in the first round but having the uncertainty of him never playing professional baseball. I think Shaffer at least has a chance of sticking at 3rd though maybe not a great one. (In most WAR arrangements, the difference between playing 3rd and 1st is worth 12.5 runs over a full season.)
Basically, I like athletic players and I think Roache is the most athletic out of the bunch.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
Is there a chance walker doesn't sign?
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 12:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I was just confused with your statement that he might never play pro ball
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 2:31 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think it's a "he might be Adam Dunn levels of bad at 1B"
without the 3TO skills that Adam Dunn has.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Speaking of Dunn
What is one to think of him going forward?
He was horrendous last year. Putrid. Can one expect him to return to normal Adam Dunn stuff or just rebound but not quite be the Adam Dunn we once knew or is this the beginning of a very painful end? He didn’t seem to be injured and I can’t believe he was that unlucky especially someone with his on base ability.
-2.7 bWAR, -2.9 fWAR
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
I wouldn't be on him ever returning to his 40 HR self
But he’s making so much money, he’s going to get a shot at doing it.
From a fantasy baseball perspective, he’s probably my favorite pick in the 15th round and beyond this season since he’ll get 500 PA’s and could hit 30+ homers.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Apparently he really didn't like DHing, which happens with some players I guess
I’m thinking he’ll bounce back but then I’ve thought that about Alex Rios for a couple of years.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
has there been a good study about DH effects yet?
I remember always hearing it about frank thomas and jason giambi but it seems like an especially difficult thing to isolate.
I know what you mean
the figure I heard bandied around was that it depresses offense about 5%, but I’m not sure what that’s based on. Seems to me that there can only be huge biases involved, unless you literally only base it on data from guys who play the field and DH on their day off (like the Yankees system), and I’m not sure how many PAs of total data of that sort that there’ll be.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:40 PM EST up reply actions
Pat Burrell too, yes?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
I see.
I meant to draw a comparison to Matt Adams current skill set but with Walker still being an amateur. So he’s comparable to what we know Adams can do in AA but there’s added risk since Walker hasn’t ACTUALLY done that in AA.
It wasn’t meant to be a comment about his long term viability in the majors.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
Me too, and mostly because he's a corner OF who can mash.
Haven’t seen a lot of those out of our system in the last 25 years.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Also really like Roache.
Quiet swing.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
Agreed on Roache
After reading the three write ups, he’s the one that stuck out to me. That .975 Cape Cod League OPS jumped out at me, especially after the Wong and _(?) picks from the Cape Cod League recently.
My order:
1. Roache- I think he sticks in right and has the bat speed that will allow him to lay off junk
2. Walker- I like his approach, but he’s a first baseman.
3. Schaefer- not as much pure power and from what i’ve read and seen (seen very little) he looks like a future 1B to me
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 10:46 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I'm kind of psyched about the draft
By my math, we have four of the first 51 picks. The 19th and 23rd should let us take some chances. I’ve heard the high school class this year is surprisingly deep. It sure would be nice to get a masher in the system with 70-80 power potential. I guess we shall see.
We'll get a 5th when Jackson signs
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:13 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Someone will
Now that Nora’s has gotten prince signed, he can turn his attention to Jackson…I still say the yanks do it, though look out for a Nats bid as well
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:16 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Nora's=Boras
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:18 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I could also see the Tigers making a run at him. He was a good pitcher for them a few years ago
and that rotation behind Verlander just isn’t real solid.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Yeah, that's a good fit actually.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:41 PM EST up reply actions
High School hitters take forever to develop
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 25, 2012 6:00 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, like Mike Trout!
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
FWIW, while we're talking about the draft
Brewers get the Tigers’ #27 first round pick, plus #38 comp pick for Fielder.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 10:53 AM EST reply actions
Minor League Ball flexed its newly-assimilated MLB Bonus Baby muscles today
Matt Garrioch posted a top 100 college draft prospects lists. Roache was number 5, Christian Walker was 9, and Richie Shaffer was 21. For what it’s worth, Walker and Shaffer are both listed at 1B, I dunno if that is just a guess on the author’s part as to where they’ll eventually end up or what.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
If mlb draft picks were trade-able would the #17, 23, and 45 be enough to move into the top 3?
Sign Roy O
Definitely
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:44 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Though
I’m not sure there is anyone in this draft with trading that much potential value to get
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:45 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Worth
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:46 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, pretty weak draft
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Bad year to have this many high picks
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 11:48 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
We don't really have any "high" picks...
is it possible to gauge with any accuracy the talent level of the 20th-70th best prospects this year relative to other years’ 20th-70th best prospects?
Sign Roy O
Probably not.
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 12:54 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Really?
Look. I’m not much of a draftnik when it comes to baseball amateurs, but I could have sworn just recently, that I read this was a deep draft and one that was good to have a lot of early picks.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
I don't see how it is "bad" to have lots of picks no matter what the situation
Are people saying “bad year to have awesome amount of picks” when they actually mean “lucky in a year with relatively bad draft class, and would be even luckier if the draft class were better”? I don’t see how this makes sense other wise.
If we can have quality and quantity, then that’s awesome. If we can’t have as much quality, having quantity is not a bad thing, it is still good. If we can’t have both, well then that sucks.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Yea, thats what I meant
I’m glad we have a lot of picks, just wish it was last years draft
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 1:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Right, I agree
And I also wonder if you could make the argument that it’s better to have a higher number in leaner years. That way it increases your chance of getting more scarce talent. In an awesome year you probably have a decent chance of getting someone good no matter what, as long as you don’t draft terribly or have really low picks combined with giving picks away signing FAs and stuff.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I guess I'm comparing it to last years draft
Plus taking the CBA changes into consideration.
The top end talent is certainly down this year
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 12:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I disagree.
This looking more and more like a very, very good draft, particularly in terms of depth. I will agree there isn’t that colossal talent at the top this year, a Strasburg or Harper or Price, but the overall crop is remarkably deep.
Who'd want to be a man of the people when there's people like you?
by the red baron on Jan 25, 2012 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
That's good for us since we don't have any top 15 picks
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, oddly enough.
It’s probably a good year to have a bunch of picks in the 20-70 range. At the very very top you’ll probably overpay for players who are definitely good but not all that much better than the guys taken 15-20 picks later. The Cards should be able to absolutely clean up this year with all these extra picks.
Who'd want to be a man of the people when there's people like you?
by the red baron on Jan 25, 2012 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
HOARD TALENT, RULE OVER NL CENTRAL
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed
And that’s really been where the strength is in terms of talent evaluation for this organization. We’ve done very well with picks from 20-80 since Mo took over as GM.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
His skill with 13th round picks, however. . .
is nowhere near that of his predecessor.
Sob. . . .
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
Practice makes perfect.
How often have the Cards had a pick higher than 20th during Mozeliak’s tenure?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Yeah, I do wonder how much of a chicken/egg relationship is going on here
But if we’re going to be as competitive in the next several years as everybody hopes, we aren’t going to get any high first round picks anyway.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Twice.
Wallace in ’08 and Shelby the next year.
Who'd want to be a man of the people when there's people like you?
by the red baron on Jan 25, 2012 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
I strongly disagree that this is a "weak" draft.
In terms of the amount of players with 80 level talents, yes, this draft isn’t as good as last years. In terms of the amount of players with 70+ talents however, this draft is loaded with depth. LOADED. We really couldn’t have picked a better year in the last 3-4 years to potentially have 5 picks in the top 100.
FWIW, if Charles Tilson were in this year’s draft, he probably drops out of the top 150 picks. That’s how much depth this draft has, and this draft has the potential to push our farm system into the top 5 for the next 3-4 seasons continuously should we hit on half our picks in the top 300.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I dub Victor Roache to have the funnest sounding name of the three
(No offense intended to Shaffers/Schaefers out there, mind you.)
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Boras wins again.
After all the “it’s a bad year to be Prince Fielder” sentiment — that I shared — Boras pulls out the kind of contract the Yankees or Red Socks are supposed to be in on.
Play ball!
by IL and StL Fan on Jan 25, 2012 12:36 PM EST reply actions
Cards looking to hire a
batboy
Must be at least 16 years of age
Flexibility to work all 81 home games and all additional home post-season games
Must be an outstanding student
Physically able to lift a minimum of 40 lbs.
"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78
I'll do it
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
Can't lift 40 lbs
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
you no work out anymore?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
Bat's don't weigh anywhere near 40 lbs
Let’s get a female bat girl, should be 21 to 30 yrs old though
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Is Barbara Gordon too old now?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
by mattybobo on Jan 25, 2012 1:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
apparently not
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
I'll do it!
screw being an attorney!
I would much rather spend an entire season trying to get in on one of Waino’s goofy handshakes.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Power just went out at work.
Awesome.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
must be using phone app then
Can you see this amazing picture of the new Cardinal Bat Girl for 2012?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
And we're back.
No, everything was on battery backup at that moment so the network was still up.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Aaaaaaaaaaand we are on line, people!
I hate that commercial.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
We're not so blessed. When power goes, access to internets goes
Fortunately it normally doesn’t last long…except for a month or so ago when a construction company cut into the main power feed over in Belleville. I think we were out for about 2 hours before they got power rerouted. That was a long one.
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
This is what caused the outage.
That’s two blocks from my office.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
holy crap
Glad you are OK, no mention of casualties either so very good for you all
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 4:56 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, no people hurt (that I've heard) on my side of Houston.
And I should clarify that two blocks means just over half a mile. (ie, not real city blocks)
Heard from our lab guys that they saw a funnel cloud pass over our plant, which is good for everyone as we’re a chemical plant and tornadoes and industrial sized chemical tanks don’t mix too well.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Crap, I know the guy whose bike shop got destroyed by the tornado.
He’s a great guy. This really sucks.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Hope it's just property damage when all said and done
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 7:19 AM EST up reply actions
Know how I know rb speaks in a cockney accent?
That’s an horrific division with one super team.
Or maybe rb is time traveling from the 18th or 19th century to blog about the Cardinals.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 1:26 PM EST reply actions
rebuilding
come on the cards have to have money for deals now that Albert is gone, resign Jackson and go after Oswalt and they have the best starters in th division by a long way. I would think they try more than a handful of rookies at spring training but getting a powerhitting outfielder would be the icing on the cake but get Jackson and Oswalt while they can.
cmay1959@yahoo
A powerhitting outfielder?
Like Carlos Beltran?!?
I agree on Oswalt (especially on a 1 year deal!), not sure what EJax is asking for, but I’m not sure that he would be necessary, especially if we signed Roy-O
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Allen Craig and Matt Holliday may also qualify as power-hitting outfielders.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Of course.
I only mentioned Beltran, because he said “getting a powerhitting outfielder”…
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Understandable.
I was confused since he seems to state the Cards should get (as if they didn’t have three already) a power-hitting outfielder.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
We used much of our Albert money by resigning Furcal and signing Carlos Beltran, who is a "powerhitting outfielder" that you requested
Jackson and Oswalt, while likely upgrades over Lohse and Westbrook, are probably not worth the effort in dealing with NTCs, etc. Also, we would get a draft pick if Jackson signs elsewhere.
Also, what rookies do you think we’re going to see have a legitimate shot at the big league team?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
a couple of thoughts in response:
- i agree that it would be nice to grab oswalt. he would represent a slight upgrade over the cardinals’ current fifth starter, westbrook.
- the problem with signing starting pitching at the moment is the fact that the cardinals have the rotation pretty much set: wainwright, carpenter, garcia, lohse, and westbrook. the two weakest links (lohse and westbrook) both have no-trade clauses and will therefore be difficult to move.
- additionally, jackson’s current asking price seems to be much too high. the cardinals have budget constraints and 5/80 doesn’t sound like something ownership is going to be willing to do. beside that point, i question whether jackson will be worth much over the life of that theoretical contract.
- the outfield for the moment looks set and i would regard it as one of our strengths. while it would be nice to have a good, pure centre-fielder like cespedes—although his performance in the dominican winter league has me questioning just how major league ready he is—holliday, beltran, jay, and craig comprise a pretty good outfield.
- lastly, while the cardinals didn’t spend a ton of money on pujols, a lot of the money that would have gone his way has been spent on furcal and beltran, and simply not signing someone does not create more money to be spent somewhere else.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Ok -- who do you suggest that we sign and for how much?
I don’t see a “power hitting outfielder” on the market that’s better than the current “power hitting outfielders” that our club already has on the roster (Holliday, Craig, Beltran, and Berkman).
Signing Jackson is just silly. You don’t pay #3 starters $80M over 5 years, which is what he’s asking for. We’ll get a draft pick in the top 80 if he signs elsewhere, which is probably better value than paying him $15M+ over the next 5 years. Would you pay Edwin Jackson the same as Chris Carpenter or Adam Wainwright? I know I wouldn’t.
Part of the reason that money isn’t going to be spent on someone like Oswalt is because our club “went out and spent some fucking money!!!!” twice in the last 4 years and we got Lohse and Westbrook as a result. They are sunk costs, have little trade value, and cost $20M next year. I mean, I like to see our club upgrade by spending money too, but I’d rather it be spent wisely.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Who are you quoting?
“went out and spent some fucking money!!!!”
I am just going to assume Mo, because that would be hilarious.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
STLToday commenters after the non-Pujols signing
Because you know that “just spending some fucking money!!!!” solves all the problems.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
There are some remarkably detailed and in-depth replies to this odd post.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:47 PM EST up reply actions
Best sports blog in St. Louis, people!
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Oswalt News!
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
good lord...
just sign the guy to a Madson deal and pay for it by trading KMac. That would leave $4M un-covered for 2012. Trade Westbrook to make up the rest, if possible. If not possible, eat the $4 million and reduce payroll accordingly in 2013 by letting Adams replace Berkman, Miller-Lohse, Lynn-Westbrook.
Sign Roy O
I'm guessing there are serious concerns about his back?
I just don’t know why there is not more (public) interest in this dude.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Yeah this is really strange
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
maybe Mo (and other GMs) have seen this...
and are now really creeped out.

Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
by SheckieZx on Jan 25, 2012 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 9 recs
that is really creepy.
there’s like a million Oswalt’s on the Phillies!!!!!1
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
i salute whoever made this gif. that is some excellent loopwork.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
strange how walking behind Rich Dubie turns Oswalt into Greg Dobbs
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
when was this?
NLDS?
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 25, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions
No. Had to be 2010, Dobbs played for the Marlins last season.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2012 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
this is so incredibly awesome.
Because Matheny
by WyoCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 11:13 PM EST up reply actions
or alternatively
given that the Sawx have apparently made an offer he has yet to respond to, has he just been putting off really strong signals that he is primarily interested in playing for one of a few teams (Cards, Rangers, whoever)?
I was telling myself...
he was waiting for Mo to move one of Lohse/Westbrook but I’m starting to seriously doubt that at this point.
Sign Roy O
moving lohse and westbrook doesn't seem likely at all.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
well we could move westbrook
to the bench, haha!
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
Unnecessarily paying Schumaker and McClellan upwards of $4m, if Oswalt signs somewhere else for about $8m, is going to look pretty f'ing stupid.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:51 PM EST up reply actions
i think the moves look stupid regardless of what oswalt does. but it definitely looks worse.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
I have seen some twitter buzz about the Reds being linked to Oswalt too
which doesn’t really make sense, I thought they were already above their projected payroll. But I seriously hope he doesn’t go to Cinci, the upgrade from Arroyo to Oswalt would be pretty big
If the Reds cut Arroyo and sing Oswalt we should be ashamed
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
It would be very funny though ... how does it go?
And probably pretty humiliating to Arroyo
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
That's not gonna happen
They’re certainly not going to eat that entire contract and then sign ANOTHER 34 year old starter to replace him.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
i just did a quick search it looks like apparently the interest was from oswalts side
and the reds said they didn’t have the money.
http://www.rotoinfo.com/comments-latestfromTwitter-110115.html
what he really wants to play for the Cardinals OR for one of our current arch enemies the Reds! Screw Oswalt
let his back bother him for the Reds then
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly my point
They don’t have the money. And the reason they don’t is because Bronson Arroyo is too expensive. Even if they cut him, THEY STILL HAVE TO PAY HIM.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Drombrowski said they didn't want Fielder on a long contract too.
Believe No One!
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 8:17 PM EST up reply actions
Viva El Birdos-
Winner, 2012 RFT St. Louis Web Awards- Best Sports Blog
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 2:42 PM EST reply actions 6 recs
Hmmmm. I need to decide whether I am a fanboy or a sabermetric geek. Or both ?
The unofficial fanboy/sabermetric-geek website of the Cardinals, Viva El Birdos delivers amusing, in-depth coverage of the Redbirds that can’t be found elsewhere.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 3:00 PM EST up reply actions
I think the / indicates both
you cannot just be a fanboy
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
Does not bode well for me.......
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
I'm not sure it's tied to age
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
me too
But still happy for VEB’s recognition even with the not exactly but kinda backhand compliment
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
we'll be inundated with newbies that don't understand the memes or the vibe, with no Y2S to lead the welcoming party dammit!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
We need Y2S to return!
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
good work, Cody
"That's what I'm talking about! Strike him blind, Lord!" - Berk
Running list of Molina pick-offs | twit
I love that speech
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 4:18 PM EST up reply actions
Woooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!
"young man, when you throw a strike, Mr. Hornsby will let you know"
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 25, 2012 4:37 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
The Brewers look pretty good still
Assuming the ZIPS projections are pretty accurate, we’re only slightly better than them. We could really use extra wins. Sign f’ing Oswalt Mo!
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
does ZiPS account for the loss of fielder and braun's potential suspension?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
VEP is impressed by the ZiPS pitching projections for Milwaukee.
I don’t blame him. Greinke was awesome last year by FIP but mediocre by ERA. He should improve greatly. Marcum has good projections as well but I’m not sold on his health after his September and October.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
It accounts for the loss of Fielder
But not Braun. But that’s only 50 games – if it happens – so it shouldn’t change things that much.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
it's a third of a season.
that’s at least a win or two, right?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Probably two WAR, yeah
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Kotsay catching fire
Would have really helped the team last year. But only if you’re speaking literally.
/NLCS Game 3 nightmares
by Cheeseandcorn on Jan 25, 2012 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, but that's still within the margin of error
assuming Braun is suspended, we’re probably 3-4 wins better than the Brewers. But there’s a lot of variance in that projection.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
I just don't see it.
That’s putting a lot on Mat Gamel/Aramis Ramirez to essentially replace Fielder. Which they can do if they both have good years, but we don’t know what Gamel can do and Ramirez is on the decline and really stunk for 2 months last year.
I think they’re selling at the deadline as they have nothing to trade to be buyers and they don’t have enough depth to sustain Braun’s 50 game suspension and any injury they might have next year.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I'm not sure ARam "stunk" for 2 months although he hit only 2 homeruns
however, he clobbered the ball the rest of the season.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
His wOBA for the first two months of the season was .321
Not great. His wOBA in the first two months of 2010 was .222. Not exactly the guy you want carrying your team while Ryan Braun is riding out his 50 game suspension.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
In 2010, he was recovering from a pretty serious shoulder injury
ala, Scott Rolen.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
That’s putting a lot on Mat Gamel/Aramis Ramirez to essentially replace Fielder.
The Brewers being worse than they were at the start of 2011, and still being only a game or two behind us are not mutually exclusive.
It’s also worth noting that Ramirez is replacing McGehee, who was a massive vacuum of suck last year, and they get a full year out of K-Rod. I think we’re probably an early-90s win team, true-talent wise, but I bet the Brewers (even with the Braun suspension) are late 80s.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
so, we're "achtung baby" and the brewers are "rattle and hum"?
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
Alternate musical metaphor
The Brewers are Mother’s Milk, and the Cardinals are Blood Sugar Sex Magik.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
by mattybobo on Jan 25, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The universe exploded 'cos of one man's simile.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:15 PM EST up reply actions
Also, no Yuniesky Betancourt playing 152 games at shortstop
This cannot be underestimated. Seriously.
by Cheeseandcorn on Jan 25, 2012 7:54 PM EST up reply actions
replaced with this

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Jan 25, 2012 11:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yeah
it’s from the top gifs of 2011 post somewhere on sbn. It looks bad for Alex Gonzalez out of context. Context: It’s an 8-1 game
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
maybe if he wasn't walking towards it
like an elderly retiree he’d be a little closer to it
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 25, 2012 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
two wins I'd have thought
Their replacement is looking kinda like a 0-1 WAR guy IIRC.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
haha, he's gonna be braunian there
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
Pujols is average and so is Freese.
The Tigers are below average across the infield.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
and potentially
comically inept at 3B.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 3:12 PM EST up reply actions
I agree it'll be interesting to see if Cabrera is as bad at third as Schumaker is at second.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I don't see Cabrera playing 3B
I just don’t see it happening. I would guess that Young moves back to LF and Prince/Miggy take turns at 1B/DH much like the White Sox did with Dunn/Konerko last year.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I can see it *eventually*
He’s actually got a pretty slick glove he’s just fat and not quick. If he dropped 30 pounds he could probably be alright and he basically has a year to drop the weight.
Not afraid to nitpick
if i recall correctly, Cabrera has a relatively good arm and pretty soft hands- it's his reaction time/movement/quickness that i would be very, very worried about
if those are better than i expect, it’s possible he could be only a bit subpar, but i think he has the potential to be truly awful at 3B.
mumble mumble Peter Bourjos mumble mumble
he was a minus defender at 3b in 2007
dude could be historically bad if they really let him play their all year
I think he could be worse.
Skip’s what, a -10 2B? Cabrera was below average last time he played 3B, and that was a few years (and a few lbs) ago now. I think he’s about a -5 1B, so I’d guess he’ll be maybe -15 at 3B. Possibly -10 at a real push.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:57 PM EST up reply actions
Large corners yes,
large defense? Not so much.
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 4:08 PM EST up reply actions
At least when verlander pitches hell be striking everyone out
"young man, when you throw a strike, Mr. Hornsby will let you know"
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 25, 2012 4:39 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
I dont think that...
…the Barron meant to but from my sources he sugar coated Roche’s ability to play the field a bit.
Some of my old colleagues that saw him play in the cape said he was a fringy left fielder in the pros. That said they like the hit tool a lot and said the bat plays somewhere.
The problem Roche will have is that to be a left fielder in the show you bat needs to play a lot.
Some of that...
…but I got the impression that he didnt move as well as one would expect from his build, etc. Like he was athletic but was kinda heavy footed. Purely subjective crap.
I say that currently it is subjective...
…he is one of these guys given his numbers that you would really want to bring in and work out because you would want to see some foot work and some speed numbers, etc.
I don’t want to come off as being a hater. Potentially a really good hitter.
Was this before or after the screws in his ankle?
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 6:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The MLB wOBA for LF last season was .320.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Wow, that must be historically low? Since the deadball era even?
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:58 PM EST up reply actions
According to Fangraphs...
2010: .328
2009: .338
2008: .337
2007: .339
2006: .342
2005: .336
Looking at the media-generated arbitrary pre-PED era…
1992: .324
1991: .325
1990: .335
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
That's still consistently above average though, right?
I am doing this from memory, but first base is usually the best hitting position, then some mixture of LF/DH/RF, then third base is right around the middle?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
That said, left field is not quite the masher's haven a lot of people seem to think it is.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
has anyone read "scorecasting"?
if yes, would you recommend it or not?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I haven't read "Scorecasting" and was hoping for some folks to comment.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
yeah, apparently not a big seller among the veb crowd.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I have it at home, it's next on my read list
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
what are you currently reading?
i’m working my way through mathletics right now for my non-fiction. i like it thus far, though i’ve only read a few pages.
novelwise, i just finished my re-read of the millenium trilogy. thought the books stood up well to a second look.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Just got done with Mathletics. Making my way through "Soccer Men" right now. Meh.
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Yeah. It's pretty turrible
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i'd be interested in knowing why.
i have it in my queue.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
They essentially run a bunch of simple linear regressions
And extrapolate that to make conclusions like “Oh, because of wealth, size, etc., USA and China are going to be the next big powers in soccer!”
It’s been awhile since I’ve read it, but I just felt like he took his conclusions too far
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
huh. that's sort of disappointing if it really is simplistic.
it was recommended to me by one of my colleagues, who said that simon kuper (who does football columns for the ft) was one of the better writers out there on the topic.
is there a book covering soccer you’d recommend?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Have you read Fever Pitch?
It’s more of a memoir, but it’s one of the most enjoyable books on sports (and especially fandom), period
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
You like Jimmy Fallon?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
This comment just hurt my soul
2015 St. Louis Rotation-- Wainwright, Garcia, Miller, Martinez, Rosenthal...towels please
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2012 6:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
i'm very apologetic.
i only knew of the american film dealing with the red sox. i know veb has talked about the book at length before, but i always equated the american film with what was being discussed.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
There's a British film version of it as well
based on the book (i.e. about soccer) with Colin Firth.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
I can't remember where the article was
Maybe the Economist? “Why China is bad at soccer” or something to that effect. Apparently Chinese soccer is extremely corrupt.
Everything in China is corrupt
/politics
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 25, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
So why does England always lose?
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 25, 2012 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
According to the author
They perform to expectations given wealth, population, etc.
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Guess this should apply to tennis, as well
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 25, 2012 4:50 PM EST up reply actions
Also, as is the case with the MLB playoffs, world cups are a pretty big crapshoot.
Once you get to the knockout stages, there probably isn’t that much difference between the best couple of teams in the world and the 15th or 20th.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:01 PM EST up reply actions
On the topic of books
Still can’t remember who recommended it to me, but I thoroughly enjoyed Childhood’s End. Just got Rendezvous with Rama today and think I may completely fly through it, already around 1/3 done.
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 25, 2012 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
That was me and vep, I believe. Haven't we been through this already?
Don’t forget The City and the Stars. You could alternatively start out with Against the Fall of Night, which is the short novel (and his first) that Clarke eventually rewrote and expanded into The City and the Stars. I read them in this order, not knowing TCatS was based on AtFoN. Seemed pretty familiar as I started reading it. Don’t forget to pick up some Zelazny, Simak and Asimov while you’re at it.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 26, 2012 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
Hypothetical featuring organizational need and best player available.
When the Cardinals pick in the first round, if a pitching prospect that is unanimously more highly rated than either of these three hitters is available and all three of these hitters are available, who would you select if you were making the decision for the Cardinals?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I'll play. . .
depends upon what “highly rated” means.
If it means high floor, but limited upside starter, or accomplished college closer who could close right now this very minute in the majors, I’d pass, I think.
If it means high upside (like a Shelby Milller or Rick Porcello type), then I’d absolutely pick that guy.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
i'd probably take the pitcher.
dependent on what exactly you mean by “more highly rated”. if it’s another shelby miller, for example, i’d take the pitcher.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I meant that, on every draft board, every expert has ranked this pitcher higher than any of the hitters.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I'm still taking Roache
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Roache is my favorite of the trio, too.
This was more to see if folks felt drafting for organizational need should trump best player on the board.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Meh
In this situation, Roache is the “best player on the board” mainly because high school arms are so volatile to begin with.
I think this is more of a question of draft preference and style than it is about “best player on the board”. FWIW.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Draft preference and style is what I was driving at.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Only if it's written in blood
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
Heh
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
o/
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 4:07 PM EST up reply actions
If Roache is available
There’s not a single high school arm in the draft I would take over him.
I’d rather not have either of the other two players, so I guess I’d draft the arm then.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I'd take the pitcher
assuming the bonus demand wasn’t significantly higher, but I’d hate doing it. free agent pitchers are just such a scary proposition that it seems like a better bet to develop pitching and sign matt holliday if you need to than the other way around.
The answer possibly changes if we don't have eleventy million picks in the top 100
But I take best player available this year, no doubt.
In all honesty, if we’re drafting for need, I’m far more likely to go for a reasonably advanced college catcher who’s projected to stick at the position somewhere in the first couple of rounds, rather than a power-hitting corner guy. We really need to improve behind the plate down on the farm.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Considering our depth at pitching right now
I’d go with one of the hitters. With 5 or 6 picks in the first 100, I think we could wait until the second pick, at least, to add to our pitching (lefty, please).
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 26, 2012 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
Cardinal Trivia
In the 1970s the Cards played a marathon game against a fellow NL East (yes, NL East) foe. St Louis scored in the top of the 25th to break a 3-3 tie and went on to win 4-3. The winning run scored when a runner on first scampered all the way home after an errant pickoff attempt. The game ended at 3:13 am.
1. What was the given name of the speedy Redbird outfielder who scored on the botched pickoff attempt ?
2. Who was the former Dodger pitcher who threw more than 9 shutout innings in relief for the Cards ?
100 Internet dollars each to the first correct answers to 1. and 2.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 3:22 PM EST reply actions
no idea but 2. is amazing
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
Bake McBride was the Cardinal outfielder
and Claude Osteen was the pitcher. Osteen was a horse for the great Dodger teams in the late 60’s along with Koufax and Don Drysdale.
McBride won ROY that year for the Cardinals and hit .300 in every season in a Cardinal uniform.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Yep
Osteen was a two-time 20 game winner and a three-time All Star
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 3:40 PM EST up reply actions
1400 pages of Cardinals history reading
comes in handy for games like this.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I remember McBride
for his blazing speed (my Dad just loved watching him run) and for being the final piece of the puzzle for the Phillies, the year they overtook the Pirates as the dominant team in the division. (McBride was traded midseason to Philly.)
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
BTW, I listened
to every pitch of that game on the radio.
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
Wow
Me too.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
For the last 2 hours, I had to
hide under the covers with my transistor radio so my parents wouldn’t yell at me to go to sleep.
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
this sounds made up.
and then I suppose you had to walk to school the next day, uphill, in a foot of snow.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
Why yes, yes I did.
Mom, is that you?
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 4:50 PM EST up reply actions
And we didn't complain - no sir, we were happy!
And we got a dime a year to work 17 hours a day in the mines, one cent an hour, but did we complain? NO! We were ’’satisfied’’, dammit, because there was a ’’depression’’ going on, and we didn’t dare complain when dad beat us, because it built character and we ’’respected’’ him for it, not like these days…
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 25, 2012 4:55 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know about MRF
But I had to walk to and from school.
And it was uphill both ways.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 5:15 PM EST up reply actions
what was the grade?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
All grades
First grade, second grade, third grade ………..
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
...
not the grade I was referring to

11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 5:37 PM EST up reply actions
Interesting, how did it stack up against game 6 of this years WS?
Must have been pretty exciting btw I’m imaging at least one of you were roughly 10-12 yrs old.
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 4:50 PM EST up reply actions
It was 9/11/74 so I would have been 13.
It actually was pretty tedious, but one of those things where I had so much invested in the game I couldn’t very well quit listening. The most entertaining thing was listening to Buck and Shannon, for former for his humorous remarks and the latter because a) he’s Shannon, and b) he was hammered by inning 25.
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 4:56 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sure he was hammered well before inning 25
“invested” reminds me of a game last year, like 20-22 innings, I wasn’t in bed worried about parents. Had other things to do under the covers, took a nap, woke up, watched final several innings, we lost.
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 5:00 PM EST up reply actions
Shannon probably drank himself sober
and then drank himself drunk again by inning 25
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 25, 2012 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
We're about the same age
It was an important game – the Cards were in a pennant race they wound up losing to the Pirates by 1.5 games – but by the time it ended I was likely more happy it was over than happy the Cards came out on top.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
El Birdos finished
1.5 games out in ‘74 AND in ’73. Now you know why those of us following the team those years will never ever get over the Carlton Trade. Two playoff appearances, lost forever. (Though Carlton’s 1973 was a pretty bad year for him.)
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 25, 2012 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
I'll play part deux
1. Arnold
2. This is a WAG: Rawley Eastwick?
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 3:25 PM EST reply actions
You got 1. right
Arnold (Bake) McBride
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
Wow.
Great question (I just looked up the correct answer to #2).
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
it was amazing w/o looking it up, but still is afterward
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:30 PM EST up reply actions
Plus McBride scored from 1st, he didn't just score as a result of the pickoff move, he was the guy they were trying to PO!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:32 PM EST up reply actions
He still holds the 200M record at Westminster College
I would guess there aren’t too many sprint records from 40 years ago still held at the college level in track either.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
especially post steroid era
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 25, 2012 3:56 PM EST up reply actions
Wow the Tigers went from 20-1 to 5-1 to win the WS on my sports book
Talk about overreaction. They are #2 behind the Phillies who are +475
that's ridiculous. i think detroit was probably the best bet to win its division of any team in the majors BEFORE signing fielder.
the only real counterargument would be philly, but philly is a year older and the NL East looks tougher than it did last year. and the AL Central looks terrible.
so, the needle could not have moved much on their probability of making it to the postseason. and i doubt that fielder’s acquisition significantly alters their likelihood of success once they get to the postseason.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
that’s ridiculous. i think detroit was probably the best bet to win its division of any team in the majors BEFORE signing fielder.
Ergo, presumably the best bet to win the whole thing? I think I’d have the Tigers and Phillies as my two favourites this year. The Yankees are probably the best team but the ALE is so damn stacked you could easily see them not making the post season if they have a few injuries.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:06 PM EST up reply actions
yes, 20-1 was too low pre-fielder, and 4-1 too high post-fielder.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
yeah i was dissapointed i didn't bet on the 20-1 tigers even before fielder in retrospect
i think it stayed at 20-1 for like an hour after fielder too. if you operate under the assumption they are a virtual lock for that division, your getting 20-1 odds for one of the last 8 teams alive and we all know its a crap shoot in the playoffs.
Should any team be 5-1 at the beginning of the playoffs having to go through 3 series?
Not afraid to nitpick
More Oswalt/Jackson news!
The Red Sox have made an offer to EJax!
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Because of the forgone draft choice compensation
Wouldn’t he more more valuable to other teams than the Cards ?
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 25, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
I guess...
but the value he brings to us is so great it probably swamps the value of the draft pick.
Sign Roy O
when i am king, rod stewart will hunted through the streets for what he did to that song.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
there is a base ball game show now on MLB now?! How long has this been going on?
Baseball IQ, is this common knowledge?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
Didn't it start like yesterday?
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 25, 2012 4:38 PM EST up reply actions
is this what the guy from the Cardinals' museum is on?
There was an article yesterday on the Cardinals site about some gameshow.
The Cat mentioned this on the radio yesterday too
apparently this guy is REALLY GOOD at trivia
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 25, 2012 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
i watched it last night
the guys on there were pretty bad at the trivia. it was a pretty good show though.
one of the questions was- name the 13 cardinals (i think it was 13) to get a hit in the 2011 world series. they got rhough like 5 until one of the idiots says “bengie molina”
Oooo, yeah I saw that.
That hurt.
The show is kind of interesting, but Vasgersian’s delivery as host is kind of annoying.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 8:29 PM EST up reply actions
Motte & Cards settle for $1.95MM plus $75K in incentives
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
$75K in incentives?
Sure that’s not $750K?
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 25, 2012 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
Doubtful. They are not going to gove him incentives that would surpass the arb number he submitted.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
Weren't the numbers like 1.4 and 2.5?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Yes, so $750K in incentives would potentially take Motte over his submitted arb number.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Ok, that's clearer.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
yup, which is why the $75K for incentives makes sense and $750K does not.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 5:16 PM EST up reply actions
Unless the incentive is for something like. . .
setting the saves record or winning the CYA, or hitting 50 HR or something.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 25, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
Balls...

The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 25, 2012 7:55 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
I've hit reposting status!!!
THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!
He gets 75K
if he stops gnawing on the restraints before the bottom of the 8th.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
what an utterly garish twitter background mr heyman has.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I really do STRONGLY feel that we should use our
first round draft pick to draft Lindsay Davenport.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 6:18 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
she is, if you're into jowelly chicks
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 25, 2012 6:51 PM EST up reply actions
this is better than my plan to draft lindsey buckingham.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
Don't Stop
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
thinking about tomorrow
2012 will be better than before, 2011’s gone, 2011’s gone….oooooh, don’t ya look back.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2012 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
my wife just finished watching several shows in which these guys parody movies ... think they're the same guys
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 7:52 AM EST up reply actions
The fact that Roache is currently an OFer intrigues me. More positional flexibility that way if/when his fielding doesn’t cut it anymore. A big donkey corner IF would have a harder time moving to the OF than a OF would have moving to the IF, I’d imagine.
"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby
by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 25, 2012 6:22 PM EST reply actions
Serious question - at what point do we think about making an offer to Edwin Jackson?
He’s a type B, so we’d effectively be losing a draft pick, but the guy seemingly has zero interest so far and the number of possible suitors for the big deal he was wanting is really waning. I’ve been a bit of a fan of his for a couple of years, and it’s beginning to look more and more like he’ll sign a medium-term deal (through his prime years, as I think he’s only 28 next year) for below market rates.
I really wonder if his asking price falls to something like 3yr/$30m whether he wouldn’t even make more sense than someone like Oswalt. If finances are tight next year, we could even consider something like a backloaded 5yr $45m offer, and only pay him $5m in 2012. You trade Westbrook somewhere and eat $5m of his salary, and your net loss in 2012 is only a couple of mill, and you’ve got a 3-4 WAR pitcher signed for the four seasons after that for $40m/yr. Honestly, if the asking price gets anywhere near that, I’d do it.
Still bitching to contact.
No
We don’t need another 4th/5th starter. Never again will I accept a multiple year deal for a 4th/5th starter. Never again
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 25, 2012 6:41 PM EST up reply actions
Jackson remains criminally under-rated IMO
He’s been one of the top 30 starters in baseball over the last three years. Ergo, by that measure, he’s a #1 starter. He’s at least a #2 or 3 on the majority of teams in MLB.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:09 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, Jackson would pretty much be what everybody hoped Lohse would be
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I mean, if 4/5 starters easily project for 3 WAR then where the hell do we find these awesome 4/5 starter?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
He's a Boras guy
When can we learn that Boras guys eventually find a home? I think Kyle Lohse’s first contract is the lone exception that I can think of.
Not afraid to nitpick
He just needs to find an owner that wants EJax more than the GM does.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
He'll be a bargain for someone...
I’d be up for bringing him back, but I think Boras has more rabbits in his hat.
Sign Roy O
i can't imagine offering a multi-year deal to anyone, with waino, carp, and jaime committed through 2013, and miller et al.
arriving from the farm.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
it's up in the air, and it depends on how you project our pitching prospects, as starters or relievers.
but swagerty, lynn, cleto, kelly, rzepczynski, and gast have already pitched at the AA level or better, and all have the potential to start games.
people can differ on how likely any of them are to start, but i don’t think it’s improbable that we get a 4th or 5th starter out of one of those guys. i certainly wouldn’t volunteer to pay anybody $10m in 2013 or 2014 to be a 4th or 5th starter until we see what we have.
even if all of the above end up in the bullpen, or injured, or just fail to progress, a 4th or 5th starter is easily obtained, usually for much less than $10m.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
Jackson is consistently worth 3+ wins...
None of those guys you list is ever likely to be as good as Jackson. Plus another spot comes open in 2014 when Carp leaves…
Sign Roy O
lance lynn has a projected 93 ERA+ for 2012, jackson a 101. that's better, but is it $10m better?
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
By what, ZiPS?
I think it’s probably quite hard to accurately project Lynn, but I find it hard to believe that a sensible median projection for the two wouldn’t have Jackson about 2 WAR better. And you still get to keep Lynn. Also, there really aren’t any positions in our team that can be easily upgraded by spending $10m. If there was a decent 2B on the market, maybe, but 5th starter is about our weakest spot next year.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:21 PM EST up reply actions
Well...
there’s also quantity of innings in addition to being a higher quality pitcher. Jackson can be counted on for 200+; lynn probably would wear down as a starter. And like monk says we could keep Lynn in the pen as a high leverage reliever.
Sign Roy O
I take your points but,
a 4th or 5th starter is easily obtained, usually for much less than $10m.
this is somewhat irrelevant. The typical 4th/5th starter is a 0-1 WAR guy. EJax is comfortably a 3 WAR pitcher, probably a bit more (depending on how you feel about his FIP/ERA disparity).
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:13 PM EST up reply actions
2012 Waino, Carp, Jaime, EJax, Lohse
2013 Waino, Carp, Jaime, Miller, EJax
2014 Miller, Jaime, EJax, some combo of Martinez/Rosenthal/Lynn/Kelly/whatever
I think there’s room. You can never have too much pitching!
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
there being room for him is not the same as making the expenditure of $10m sensible.
you’d have a lot of salary tied up in 2013.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
That's true, just an idea though
If we assume the starting lineup is Yadi, Adams, Descalso, Greene, Freese, Craig, Jay, Holliday, we’ve still got a decent team and quite a lot of money to spend. I’d think it’s entirely possible that 5th starter might be one of the easier positions to upgrade (although obviously the middle infield and possibly 1B slots might be weak as well).
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 25, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
molina is not under contract in 2013.
catcher, first base, shortstop, centerfield could all be good uses of money.
starting pitching will be available in 2013. jackson is not such a unique talent that we should lock him up now, when there’s a decent chance of internal options supplying 2 or more wins for league min.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
The base payroll is like $83M for 2013...
if we sign Yadi that goes to $93, if we signed Jackson it would be $103 with the following players:
Carp
Waino
Jackson
Miller
Garcia
Motte, Rzep, Lynn, Sanchez, Salas, plus two more
Molina, Cruz
Craig, Adams
Descalso, Greene
Furcal
Freese, Cox
Holliday, Jay, Beltran, Adron
Would we be better off with a $93 million payroll, Lynn in Jackson’s spot and Swagerty in Lynn’s spot? Probably but not by a huge amount. And we’d be about two wins better in 2012 with Jackson.
Sign Roy O
2 wins = $10m on the free market.
things change fast in baseball. guessing today about where our needs will be in a year has a pretty substantial likelihood of error. to offset for that uncertainty, the deal only makes sense if we’re paying less than market value for those 2 wins. i would rather have the lower payroll and greater flexibility.
think about how constrained the club would be in 2013 if we had a $103m payroll. if dewitt sticks with this yars $110m budget, i really hate the idea of going into a season with only $7m worth of flexibility. that leaves us little room to address injuries or players who don’t pan out. if beltran or furcal get injured, you want to be stuck with $7m available to replace them?
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
I'd rather have $93 million and no Jackson for 2013...
but I’d also rather have Jackson instead of Lynn/Westbrook in 2012. And 2012 is right now.
Sign Roy O
if dewitt wants to expand the budget for this year - big if - i'd happily take on oswalt.
if jackson will take one year, i’d take him on. otherwise, i don’t like how he’d tie our hands.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
I don't think its a good plan to use a Waino-less 2014 in an argument for Ejax
by RasmustheRipper on Jan 25, 2012 7:24 PM EST up reply actions
exactly what I'm thinking
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:15 AM EST up reply actions
Problem is, you can't have it for very long.
Sooner or later Rule 5 and limited options begin to interfere with the stockpiling of arms.
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
by StanTheManFan on Jan 25, 2012 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
Are the statistical analyses that go on in the baseball saber community mirrored in any British sports that
you happen to follow? It constantly amazes me that someone born in Britain a) follows this game, which nowadays most Americans (or so it seems) find deadly dull, and b) also gets the theories and stats that have flourished in the last decade, and that would seem to appeal mostly to those of us who get to watch these teams on a regular basis, i.e., Amurrrricans (fuck, yeah!). Also, how long before you’ll be able to sneak back into the U.S., come to the ’Lou, and actually watch a game at the ballpark?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2012 9:53 PM EST up reply actions
Rugby has a very strong statistical community
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Cricket should, but doesn't...
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
It's thinking about cricket, and the fact that I don't know the rules of that game
that make me think that baseball is a fit for a Brit looking for something similar, and the difference in rules might actually be a plus. Is there a big following (say, a few hundred thousand or so) of baseball in the UK? I would assume the Yankees would be the team most watched or rooted for (still cracks me up that “rooting” means something totally different in Australia).
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2012 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
The issue is that the British don't value statistics in sports like Americans do
They’re very stubborn and believe strongly in technical analysis, but don’t place an emphasis on statistical study
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
In Amurrrricans' defense, though
American Football is incredibly popular and also very complex. I am sometimes in awe of how much better people understand and just “get” what goes on in football than I do. And I can follow it pretty closely, I played it at school in seventh and eighth grade (little bobo running around in hilariously large pads and helmet must have been a sight) and I managed throughout high school. So I have had a decent amount of “under the hood” exposure and I still find parts of it over my head.
So anyway, it’s not as if Americans are averse to in-depth understanding of sports. It’s just that baseball has fallen to football, I think.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
all the people I ever talk to regarding following/watching/paying any attention to at all, about football and baseball
Either love the game and watch/follow rabidly or at least as a backdrop to their life i.e. it’s on the radio on or TV while they are doing something else
or
what seems like the majority to me is people preferring football because of the action and think baseball is boring, and only watch/follow baseball in the playoffs, and then maybe only if a team they like/follow are involved
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:56 AM EST up reply actions
That is fair
I do think it’s a little sad that people find baseball “boring”, but I’m not sure what is to be done about it. Maybe it is the shortening attention span, maybe it’s an older game with a more old-fashioned pace and philosophy, maybe it’s just pure personal preferences and there is no real explanation for it.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
my feeling is it's shortening attention span, immediate gratification thing, etc.
And more competing sports and non-sports time consuming hobbies, gaming, more tv channels/programming, etc. Also,seems like the average young lad is not playing baseball in summers from 5 or 6 years old through H.S. as was the norm in my day and before. Not saying there are very few playing, just when I was young every boy in my class played baseball in the summer. My class was pretty small though.
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
Anywhere I can get an update for what picks we have in the draft
something I can book mark and stop asking the VEB faithful?
I don't think it's been settled out yet.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Well, it's almost settled...
TwinkieTown is keeping this up to date
#19, #23, #36, #52*, #60
*Based on Edwin Jackson signing
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
That's the 1st round plus sammich picks
The team also has pick #87 (second round), so 6 in the first 100.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It has ceased to be
It is an ex-blog.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Did you try sending 4000 volts through it?
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 25, 2012 8:56 PM EST up reply actions
Is it, or should we, pine for the fjords?
Or, to bring Detroit back into this, the Fords?
Honor Alaa Abdelnaby.
First in the NBA. At least alphabetically
It is a late blog
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:25 AM EST up reply actions
did you maintain eye contact?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:31 AM EST up reply actions
ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH
MLBN discussing putting the DH in both leagues
Among their reasons: because AL pitchers don’t know how to run.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
They should probably introduce a designated fielder for pitchers too
Someone who just stands there on the mound until after the pitch is released. Then they field the position instead of the pitcher. Since AL pitchers are so bad at that stuff (at least in our experience they are).
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
ok...
ummmmmm, its fucking baseball, I dont care what position you play or who you think you are, you should be able to know how to run the fucking bases
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 25, 2012 9:14 PM EST up reply actions
heh heh heh
has anybody seen this one before?

I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 25, 2012 9:20 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
screw that guy
he was supposed to get Albert re-signed
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
i high fived this guy before game 7
Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 26, 2012 1:41 AM EST up reply actions
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Dammit, Mizzou!
Well, that didn’t take long.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2012 9:45 PM EST reply actions
is Oswalt the new Sheets for VEB?
SIGN ROY OSWALT
"young man, when you throw a strike, Mr. Hornsby will let you know"
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 25, 2012 9:58 PM EST reply actions
Hey, Chitown
Is Viva El League happening this year?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 9:59 PM EST up reply actions
yep
"young man, when you throw a strike, Mr. Hornsby will let you know"
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 25, 2012 9:59 PM EST up reply actions
when I go to the page it says this
The 2011 season has ended.
Thanks for playing and congratulations to all the winners.
"young man, when you throw a strike, Mr. Hornsby will let you know"
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 25, 2012 10:00 PM EST up reply actions
Huh, yeah.
Maybe a little early yet.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 10:10 PM EST up reply actions
When will 2012 open up so we can see the categories, also is it a live draft again?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:35 AM EST up reply actions
Chad Gaudin
waiting by the phone
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Is it just me or is this Top 100 prospect list (MLB.com, Jonathan Mayo) terrible?
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2012/index.jsp
As far as I can tell, Miller and Martinez are the only two Cardinals in the Top 100
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Some of it is pretty bad...Tim Beckham? Ugh.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 10:12 PM EST up reply actions
Allen Webster over Tyrell Jenkins?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Someone like Christian Yelich (IMO) is pretty comparable to Oscar Taveras
But OT is not on the list.
Hard to get worked up about prospect lists, though. I actually think most of them are just exercises in echo-chambering. If people were actually doing their “own” scouting, there’d be way more variation in these lists.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
Yea, Mayo was releasing this list on a MLBN
Special. He even said the list was put together with votes from (real) scouts from around the league. He said his opinion only mattered in the event of a tie in the voting.
by mick311 on Jan 25, 2012 11:05 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The page layout alone gives me a headache.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 25, 2012 10:15 PM EST up reply actions
Adams #6 for 1st baseman.
Wong #3 at 2nd.
by mick311 on Jan 25, 2012 11:00 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
oswalt
JoeStrauss Joe Strauss
Hearing that Cards made bid approaching $5M on Oswalt weeks ago but not likely happening. Rangers probably win, at $2-3M more w/perks.
2-3 million= kmacs salary. god damnt.
SIGN ROY OSWALT
AND THEN MAYBE BEN SHEETS
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 25, 2012 10:14 PM EST up reply actions
This is why I hate the argument that 2.5mm here and 1.5mm there for guys at the end of the roster don't hurt the team.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 10:15 PM EST up reply actions
i highly doubt the reasoning
is that they just can’t find another 2.5MM, but if they could, they’d give it all to oswalt
i have a feeling that a contract approaching $5MM is just how the cardinals value roy oswalt given all considerations
by prophetjohn on Jan 25, 2012 11:06 PM EST up reply actions
really? I suppose it's possible that they believe oswalt
Is only worth $5m, but that’s a very pessimistic view of his value. I suspect it’s more likely that they’ve struck a hard line on the budget.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 26, 2012 12:00 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
i think it's likely that they value him at $5MM given all considerations
he projects for 3-ish WAR, so he’s probably a 1.5 or so win upgrade oer westbrook. so it would fit that the cardinals want to sign him at a little bit of a bargain
but i think if they really wanted hum, they’d find $2MM
by prophetjohn on Jan 26, 2012 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
I wish we would have given him a minor league deal actually, since the Reds got him on one.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 11:12 PM EST up reply actions
oh no...
he completely sucks – his results are always terrible – xfip be damned the guy has been around a long time and he’s just not good – he tops out at 82. We have about 7 minor leaguers I’d rather see on the hill.
Sign Roy O
Yes, of course he sucks.
But I will make an internet bet right now that he beats the Cards at least one time this year.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 25, 2012 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
let's start a pool for how many games arroyo loses
Before he goes on the DL with “shoulder soreness” or “elbow soreness” and francis gets called up.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 25, 2012 11:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Lol isn't he signed for 3 more years???
-1.3fWAR last year.
by mick311 on Jan 26, 2012 12:02 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
What the fuck?!
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 25, 2012 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
Don't tell Wb! It'll hurt his feelings!
/ducks
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 25, 2012 11:51 PM EST up reply actions
2-3m???
If we really wanted Roy I don’t see how they couldn’t make a move to allow that to happen. I’m sure someone would take Kmac off our hands or find a team willing to pay $2-3m for Lohse or Westy and free up the extra money that way.
With all the money coming off the books next year (and 2 openings in the rotation), I wonder if they would consider giving him a 2 year deal at something like 13m (5m/2012, 8m/2013). That would also set up nicely to potentially free up 2 rotation spots in 2014 (oswalt+carp) for guys like miller/martinez/cleto/kelly.
by mick311 on Jan 25, 2012 11:59 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I still don't understand why anyone would want to take KMac.
I keep seeing that he should be traded, but I don’t see why. Is there really a market for replacement-level righty relievers?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 26, 2012 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
I think there is probably at least one GM
Out there dumb enough to get excited about the fact he won 12 games with a decent ERA. You could be right though, 2.5m is a LOT to pay for a RP, and most of these back of the rotation guys are signing minor league deals. I just really can’t believe Mozeliak decided to bring him back at that price. We have plenty of depth with young pitchers who could fill in the rotation or BP.
IMO, deciding to resign Kmac was worse than bringing back Skip. Both moves are pretty awful, but we don’t have a whole lot of guys in the minors who are ready to step in and play the OF. Whereas pitching is a totally different story.
by mick311 on Jan 26, 2012 12:17 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Because he can induce weak contact to consistently outperform his FIP.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 26, 2012 12:21 AM EST up reply actions
How valuable is that when his FIP is 4.9?
Is last season just an outlier? I mean, statistically it is, but who wants to throw the dice on a fringy RH RP at $2.5M?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 26, 2012 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
...
(Shhhhhh! How are we going to get rid of him to another GM if you keep talking bad about him?)
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 26, 2012 1:09 AM EST up reply actions
I'm not sure most GM's look at FIP
KMac had a winning record and a solid ERA last year, and he’s young. I’m sure he has some trade value.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 26, 2012 1:33 AM EST up reply actions
I don't think there are many front offices still in the dark ages.
Luhnow’s participation in the SSA chat a couple of days ago was enlightening. Basically, they’re all doing analytics. Some are better at it than others, I’m sure, but I don’t think they’re looking at baseball card stats any more.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 26, 2012 1:41 AM EST up reply actions
That doesn't mean the GM's make decisions based off that
These past couple of years have seen some of the worst free agent contracts ever, so I don’t believe that most GM’s are particuarly analytical.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 26, 2012 3:47 AM EST up reply actions
I'm still wondering why the hell he was signed
"young man, when you throw a strike, Mr. Hornsby will let you know"
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 26, 2012 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
I think one great thing about KMac is his versatility.
Not only can he start or relieve, he is just as effective against LHB’s as he is against RHB’s.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 26, 2012 1:10 AM EST up reply actions
he can do lots of things at replacement level!!!
THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!
He wasn't good enough to make the postseason roster.
+ Wainwright and Sanchez will be back to start the year. I would rank all of the following guys right now ahead of Kmac on the BP depth chart:
Motte
Salas
Scrabble
Boggs
Sanchez
Lynn
If we are going to carry 2 LHPs, then where the hell does he even fit? Who starts the year in Memphis Sanchez? Boggs?? That would really suck. Not to mention some of the younger guys he will end up blocking this year who may end up being better anyway (cleto, swaggerty, reifer, kelly).
Even as far as being a reserve starter….i would much rather see Lynn or Cleto in that role. I just can’t see where the value in bringing him back is, especially at 2+m.
by mick311 on Jan 26, 2012 1:58 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I don't see why we can't raise by payroll by 3 million
that’s nothing. DeWitt’s a billionaire.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 26, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
Well my girl's gone from the Aussie Open (Stupid superior Belgians)
Think it will be Azarenka vs. Sharapova, with Aza taking her first major
For men I’m guessing classic Nadal-Djokovic match-up, with Novak annoyingly winning again.
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 25, 2012 10:43 PM EST reply actions
I'd just like to take this moment to revel in another Wozniacki failure at a Grand Slam.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
I saw some of the Nadal-Federer match this morning, very early
It was fun to watch. Nadal took it in four sets but the parts I saw Federer was playing well.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Dont know if its been posted but Mayo did
His top 50 prospects tonight on MLBN. Carlos Martinez at #30, Miller at #5.
by mick311 on Jan 25, 2012 10:46 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Why didn't the Cardinals sign Jeff Francis to a minor-league deal?
4.10 FIP and 4.29 xFIP in the American League last season…
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Would have been MUCH better than Romero,
IMO. Also would provide nice insurance as a #6 SP. I have always liked him and thought he would be a good Duncan project.
by mick311 on Jan 25, 2012 11:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
He could serve as both Romero and starting rotation insurance in Memphis.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I watched him out-duel Chris Carpenter last season
in a game that did not make Bill James’s top 100 list!
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
nobody thought amaro was a genius, and maybe he's just covering for his own mistake
But I’m having trouble keeping up with how many ways what he says about the ryan howard contract is completely ridiculous.
http://mobile.philly.com/sports/phillies/?wss=/philly/sports/phillies&id=138024203&deliver=bb&clmob=y&viewAll=y#more
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 26, 2012 12:54 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Ryan Howard has a total of 3 fWAR the last two seasons
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 26, 2012 1:00 AM EST up reply actions
finally getting around to watching the new season of justified
love the show, can’t stand the theme song.
what
Hip Hop+Blue Grass works better than I ever thought it could have. I have not met anyone else who doesn’t like it
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 26, 2012 1:00 AM EST up reply actions
I don't hate the concept
and it’s not a terrible song, really, just kind of grating and the rapping doesn’t fit the mood of the show to me. Anyway, good season premiere.
I was really hoping the psychopath would stick around
I laughed so hard and had the biggest sigh of relief when Raylan just barely pulled that tablecloth. He didn’t sweat at all. It was amazing.
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 26, 2012 2:24 AM EST up reply actions
Power can be bought anywhere
Personally, I’d prefer if the team went after a current area of weakness and that’s shortstop of course. If we got extremely lucky and could pick up Carlos Correa, I’d be thrilled to no end. I don’t get good vibes on Kenny Diekroeger and Stephen Perez seems to be another Ryan Jackson type. Correa would be my # 1 pick for sure and if we did, hopefully we wouldn’t ruin his progress by rushing him through the system a la Pete Kozma. My secondary concern is for an eventual catching replacement for Yadi. If Correa is off the board, I’d jump on Stryker Trahan or Josh Elander. for my first selection. If we’re extremely lucky then Correa with the first pick and Elander with the second. After that then address the power shortage or at least that’s the way I’d go.
What is the level of compensation if/when EJAX signs with the Red Sox? How is that level determined?
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
He's a type B, so a supplemental pick
In between the first and second rounds. Where the pick is in the order of supplemental picks depends on where Jackson ranks on the ELIAS rankings (higher ranking departures get a higher pick). I think we’re expecting the Jackson pick to be around 52ish overall
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 26, 2012 1:23 AM EST up reply actions
Thanks, If this draft is deep, the trade that rented him looks all the better. . .
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
ohhhh yeahhhhh

Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 26, 2012 2:02 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
with lights!

Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 26, 2012 2:03 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Wait, I thought it was just a scoreboard graphic
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 26, 2012 2:13 AM EST up reply actions
nope, way more awesome than that.
the whole thing rises out of the pit, i think
Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 26, 2012 2:18 AM EST up reply actions
How much did this monstrosity cost Miami?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... Az.
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 26, 2012 8:49 AM EST up reply actions
loria most likely
he’s a nutjob
Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 26, 2012 2:22 AM EST up reply actions
Artist Red Grooms
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 26, 2012 2:30 AM EST up reply actions
A person who needs a raise!
Magnificent!
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
after doing a little research, it looks like the green lights are actually just testing, it will be an electronic scoreboard.
Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 26, 2012 2:23 AM EST up reply actions
AMERICA!
kind of
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 26, 2012 8:37 AM EST up reply actions
Oh god, that's really happening.
I am amused and disgusted in equal measure.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 26, 2012 2:26 AM EST up reply actions
As with the uniforms, seeing a real-life picture of it forces my brain to accept it is real
and that, in turn, makes it seem a little less puke-worthy, because I’ve already had the cathartic moment of accepting its reality. It is still gross and wrong.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Only if you think awesome is wrong.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
I admire your unapologetic fervor in defending this even though I disagree with you
You, sir, are a true American! Never give up, never surrender.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I mean, I think old managers with skinny legs and pot bellies wearing baseball uniforms is awesome
And lots of people think I’m crazy for it. So I get where you’re coming from!
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
It's the next step from this:
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
OK, I agree with you that this is totally awesome
I mean, look at that longhorn, that thing knows how awesome he is and doesn’t even care.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
AWESOME.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Fresh DanUp
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski

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