St. Louis Cardinals Reach Deal with 'Dead-Arm' McClellan to Avoid Arbitration
by bgh on Jan 17, 2012 8:04 PM EST
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PrintOn the bus ride from Reagan International to Walter Reed today, St. Louis Cardinals general manager John Mozeliak reached a deal with the representation of free agent pitcher Kyle McClellan. By reaching an agreement, the sides avoided an arbitration hearing and also set the pay rate for a replacement-level pitcher whose season was cut short by a case of the dead arm. The salary amount was not disclosed by the Cardinals or McClellan. Joe Strauss of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch tweets that McClellan will received $2.5 million plus incentives for games started (that we hope he never receives).
Despite coming off a sub-replacement -0.4 Fangraphs WAR performance in 2011, the righty will likely receive an increase in pay from the $1.375 million he received last year. McClellan will also likely receive a spot in the St. Louis bullpen over a cheaper and better pitcher. Like Miguel Batista last season, McClellan will bump one of Jason Motte, Fernando Salas, Lance Lynn, Eduardo Sanchez, or Mitchell Boggs off the 25-man roster and onto the Memphis Redbirds.
In many ways McClellan is the Skip Schumaker of the pitching staff--described as "versatile" despite not being very good in any role. Both players lack the skill to merit a Major League contract yet Mozeliak gave one to each. Whereas Schumaker doesn't walk enough, McClellan walks too many. Schumaker hits the ball too softly and McClellan pitches it too softly. Given their "versatile" mediocrity, each player is a waste of a roster spot for the 2012 Cardinals.
Last season McClellan was the emergency fill-in starter when Adam Wainwright was lost for the season to Tommy John surgery. He posted a line of 4.56 K/9, 2.58 BB/9, 4.21 ERA, 4.54 FIP, and 4.25 xFIP over 104.2 innings. Recognizing the need for a un upgrade in the rotation, the Cardinals replaced McClellan in the rotation with Edwin Jackson via trade and moved the soft-tossing righty to the bullpen.
In the bullpen, McClellan revealed himself to be the relief corps's worst member. In 37 IP, McClellan posted a lucky 4.14 ERA that masked his ugly peripherals: 5.59 K/9, 3.16 BB/9 and the distinct hittability of a soft-tossing righty dependent on smoke-and-mirrors led to a bloated WHIP to 1.41. He also gave up homers at a high rate (like the one that led to the above picture of Alfonso Soriano in his home run trot). Predictably, his reliever FIP was 5.97 and xFIP was 4.59.
Mozeliak and then-manager Tony La Russa left McClellan off the NLDS roster due to their concerns that McClellan had a "dead arm." Like any individual bitten by a zombie, McClellan denied feeling any ill effects from the bite and stated that his arm felt fine. Apparently not familiar with zombie films, Mozeliak and La Russa appeared to listen to McClellan's seemingly heartfelt pleas and placed him on the NLCS roster. After he was hit hard in a very short Game 1 outing, however, La Russa relegated the dead-armed zombie to the bench for the remainder of the series and left him off the World Series roster entirely.
Perhaps due to their memories of McClellan the living, the Cardinals have allowed McClellan the undead back into the clubhouse. Having never posted a season of more than 0.4 fWAR and accumulating only 0.1 fWAR over his four-year career, McClellan is the type of right-handed pitcher that is most fungible--a replacement-level reliever. Harmless enough when making less than $500,000 for his dime-a-dozen relief work, McClellan is now easily replaced with a better and cheaper player. Throw in McClellan's dead-armed zombie-ism and one hopes it is Mozeliak's intent to trade him. Then again, maybe this is all part of Mozeliak's master plan to make another improbable postseason run via zombie-ism...
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oh good
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:07 PM EST reply actions
he and skipperdoodle
probably eating nearly of roy-o
but i don’t know which half
TLR is gone, long live the king
fwiw if he is limited to bullpen
and is not used much, this is not quite as annoying as it seems. that said, I don’t understand why they want to bring him back other than being loyal to their players… they just usually pick the wrong players, and it is probably unnecessary to do it if that’s the case.
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:09 PM EST reply actions
Keep hoping that in a (properly) limited role K Mac can be of some value.
Clearly the early season innings were felt into October – barely
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
welp, now that he's definitely back
and assuming no team would take him in a trade, I do sincerely hope that he does better and is given better opportunities to do better
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 18, 2012 12:06 AM EST up reply actions
He better be better.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 12:55 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
it's still really annoying
because it takes away a roster spot on a worthless player, and we would be a third of the way to Oswalt with his salary.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:15 AM EST up reply actions
1/4 of the way, assuming that we're talking about the $8M figure that's been floated for Oswalt.
You have to discount the amount that the person replacing McClellan would have to be paid (in this case $440,000).
Also, I’m pretty sure that Oswalt isn’t taking a 1 year deal for $8M. I think the $8M number is the AAV number on a multi year contract. And I’m not sure I’d want Roy Oswalt for multiple years.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I'm beginning to think there's something...
seriously wrong with Oswalt’s knee. It doesn’t make sense for him to be out there if he’s willing to take a one year deal.
Sign Roy O
Oswalt would essentially be replacing KMac
Assuming Westbrook moves to the pen.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
So paying a guy you shouldn't hardly ever use anyway $2.5M
when you have a better option making $0.44M isn’t annoying? I think this is pretty much annoying no matter how you rationalize the signing.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I still need to watch my world series dvd
that’s going to be great
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:12 PM EST reply actions
Spoiler: You'll like the result.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
save Game 6 for last
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 17, 2012 8:13 PM EST up reply actions
That will make the celebration at the end of Game 7 very confusing
by BTown Birds fan on Jan 17, 2012 8:14 PM EST up reply actions
can't you just go with the flow Btown?
man it would have been awesome if Game 6 were Game 7 in real life, I think that’s about the only way top to what was…wait, maybe Holliwood could take some liberties with the narrative. Spielberg I’ve got an idea to pitch you, yes I’ll have my peeps call your peeps.
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 17, 2012 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, about the only way that game could have been better
(well, maybe along with getting rid of a couple ugly errors…) is if Freese’s walk-off won the whole damn thing.
by BTown Birds fan on Jan 17, 2012 9:36 PM EST up reply actions
oooooooh!
can’t wait!
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:15 PM EST up reply actions
i just watched game 7
for like the 10th time
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 17, 2012 8:20 PM EST up reply actions
game 5 of the nlds is on it too
which is awesome
Swing and a high drive to center field...GET UP BABY...GET UP BABY, GET UP...OH YEAH - Shannon, Gm 6
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Jan 17, 2012 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
Yup.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:19 PM EST reply actions
that's right, tyler greene was the turning point
forgot about that
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
Wait, what?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
for me it was anyway
I was like, this season is over, let’s just play tyler greene every day. then it got better. but tyler didn’t get his chance…. 2012
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
He got to meet the President today.
Perhaps he’ll get a pardon out of it.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
speaking of
I totally missed out on that, are there any good links?
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:34 PM EST up reply actions
...
http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=20059455
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:45 PM EST up reply actions
The whole time the President is talking
Motte looks like he’s gnawing on beef jerky.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:53 PM EST up reply actions
who is standing next to motte directly behind obama?
motte lookin like a cross between beethoven, wolverine, beast, and grizzly adams
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:55 PM EST up reply actions
I left room for doubt
because it might have been venison jerky.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:01 PM EST up reply actions
what does Obama say to Tyler Greene?
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 9:02 PM EST up reply actions
"I've taken care of it.
The job at second base is yours."
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Joe Strauss @JoeStrauss
Hearing McClellan, Cards settled at $2.5M w/appearance goodies in event of starts. #stlcards
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
sorry kyle, I hope there are no appearance goodies in the works for you
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:25 PM EST up reply actions
Not even a nice casserole?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
oh, ok
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:27 PM EST up reply actions
$2.5M less for the Roy Fund.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:27 PM EST up reply actions
skip and kyle are waving at roy
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
God damnit
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:16 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe, but I'm not optimistic.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:40 PM EST up reply actions
It's definitely movable...
the main concern is whether the Cards want to move it and sign someone useful, like Oswalt.
Sign Roy O
Would you trust this man to be your bench coach?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 17, 2012 8:30 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
probably not
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
WHOA
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 17, 2012 8:33 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
this is it!!!!!!!!!!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 17, 2012 8:38 PM EST up reply actions
Brian McTaggart has been notified
As he covets the baseball card
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
He made me laugh
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 1:00 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I can't find Parco MacArthur anywhere on YouTube, which is sad
Apparently the internet is lacking in Guido Sarducci.
However, his website does have an .rm file available for download: http://www.fathersarducci.com/parco.html
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
It also just occurred to me that "McClellan's Arm" will have to appear in the bonus disc of previous unreleased recordings
McClellan’s arm is dying in the dark
Pitch velocities are falling down…
Someone left the long-man in the rain
I don’t think that we could trade him
As rich as we just made him
I guess we bid against ourselves again, oh no
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
(Also, I do realize that graph is skewed because he started so much last year, I just couldn't resist)
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
No, that's Bobby Valentine.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:36 PM EST up reply actions
Hmmm...could be.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
The Red Sox hired this guy
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 17, 2012 8:40 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe they hired Fr. Guido Sarducci?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:41 PM EST up reply actions
Probably a better choice.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
is that like one of those candy mustaches from my childhood?
Or is it a shoe polish stache ala this guy?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 17, 2012 8:42 PM EST up reply actions
bs, that jmo
in a bad disguise
TLR is gone, long live the king
by sportsman on Jan 17, 2012 10:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
father guido sarducci to you
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 17, 2012 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
Find a the Popes
in a the pizza
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 17, 2012 8:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
They got too many Italian saints already
Americans, they only got to perform 2 miracles. Everybody else got to perform 3.
by gocards62 on Jan 17, 2012 10:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I found out something interesting about my favorite player Skip Shmuckmaker.
In 2010-2011, among those Cardinal players with at least 200 PAs, Skip tied for the worst speed score (Spd on fangraphs) with a 2.6. He was tied with Yadi and Berkman.
In 2011, among those Cardinal players with at least 100 PAs, Skip was dead last, by a lot. He scored a 1.4 for Spd, which was 1.2 below Yadi.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 8:46 PM EST reply actions
sigh
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions
Whenever I see him live, it always surprises me how slow he looks.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
To put this in (further) perspective...
this means Schumaker has worse baserunning ability (according to his Spd score) than David “two broke ankles” Freese.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 8:59 PM EST up reply actions
I knew Schumaker was a horrible base-runner
but this Spd score could also help illuminate why he is such a horrible defensive outfielder, too. He’s slow as molasses.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
But, but...!
My eyes tell me he is fast! You can’t argue against my subjective feelings, therefore by the scamsitive property, Skip is fast. QED!
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
just think how slow he'd be if he didn't slide headfirst into first base.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 17, 2012 8:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
slowmacher
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
he has a screwdriver, hammer, wrench, pliers, and a chisel with him at all times?
TLR is gone, long live the king
That just goes to show no matter how good you are at making shoes you still need to be fast
/lame pun
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:17 AM EST up reply actions
. McClellan will also likely receive a spot in the St. Louis bullpen over a cheaper and better pitcher.
Isn’t that how the Cardinals roll?
flayed ones stealth mode
"Fleshling! Do not shoot! For I am one of you fleshy things. It is I. Your Uncle Stan. Can't you tell by the long strips of fleshy substances covered in bodily fluids? Trust me! I have fleeeeeeeeesh."
It seems to be Mozeliak's M.O. but that doesn't mean we have to like it.
The Cardinals’ way of rolling also typically involves horrible defensive player with horribly hollow offensive profiles (like Aaron Miles and Skip Schumaker) but that doesn’t mean we have to like it.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
We don't have to like t
But it happens often enough, that at least for me it’s hard to get worked up about.
But talk to me, after McClellan gets shellled for 12 runs, on like 3 hits.
flayed ones stealth mode
"Fleshling! Do not shoot! For I am one of you fleshy things. It is I. Your Uncle Stan. Can't you tell by the long strips of fleshy substances covered in bodily fluids? Trust me! I have fleeeeeeeeesh."
I think it's absurd that we're paying McClellan more money to be a worse pitcher than other options *already on the 40-man roster.*
It makes no sense. I really hope Mozeliak trades McClellan for a useful player.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
that would require magic
maybe he’ll manage that on the way to disney
TLR is gone, long live the king
Do you guys never take depth into account?
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 17, 2012 9:00 PM EST up reply actions
hard to call the most expensive player in the bullpen "depth."
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
Like the depths of my sorrow
over having these guys on my favorite team?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:02 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
As a general matter, I agree that VEB does not appreciate depth as much as it ought to
or at least as much as the team apparently does.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
lololol
The definition of “replacement level player” is that their production can be replaced for the minimum. Now KMac and Skip aren’t quite replacement level players, but they are also being paid way more than the minimum. Explain to me how Skip Schumaker offers depth and Adron Chambers doesn’t.
Also, sign Roy Oswalt.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:19 AM EST up reply actions
this is a perfectly fine post
then you have to go and ruin it by opening with lololol
by DanUpBaby on Jan 18, 2012 1:30 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Depth like Cleto, Reifer, Ottavino etc who could all come in and do pretty much the same thing as McClellan for $2.1M less?
Not afraid to nitpick
No, no, no. Not that kind of depth. That's cheap depth with upside.
He’s talking about the kind of depth that Miguel Batista represented last season.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I am just saying
Injuries happen and K-Mac is a known quantity.
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 17, 2012 9:13 PM EST up reply actions
My first thought when I read about the $2.5MM salary was,
“Why didn’t we sign Dotel for $3MM?”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jan 17, 2012 9:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Can we trade K-Mac for him now?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:16 PM EST up reply actions
I would've rather the Cardinals spent the extra 500K
just so I could see Dotel waving around that squirrel around all season
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 17, 2012 9:17 PM EST up reply actions
He's also known to be replacement level.
It’s not like they’re going to put him at Memphis until someone goes down.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:15 PM EST up reply actions
so are lance lynn and mitch boggs. if we were really concerned about depth,
we could’ve gone dumpster diving for any number of guys cheaper and better than mcclellan.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
And maybe the plan is to have one of those two start in Memphis
rather than be in the ’pen.
Lohse and Westbrook are off the team next year. Carp’s on his last year, and probably only has a few left in his career past that. We can probably count on Wainwright being ok, but surgery is dicey. If one of our relief arms can still be fashioned into a middle of the rotation starter, shouldn’t we do that, and spend some money on replacing the bullpen guy.
The Dotel/Oswalt thing is the real counterargument.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
We signed Carp to a two-year extension during the season.
So 2013 will be his final year.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Yes, so he will be on his last year
after 2012 is complete
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
And Westbrook will cost us $1 mil if we don't pick up his $8.5 mil option for 2013.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
there is no such thing as a known quantity
especially in the bullpen.
Besides, KMac is replacement level, so there is no value to the smaller range in his projection.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:20 AM EST up reply actions
There is no certainty that any of those guys. . .
would be able to match K-Mac’s performance in the bullpen over the past few years. Granted, there is no certainty that K-Mac can either, but at least he has done it before in a major league bullpen.
VEB has its hate on for K-Mac much too much.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
I take the liberty of asserting
that if this is the worst signing the Cardinals make during this off season, then Mo is a friggin’ genius.
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
Cardinals' offseason signings:
J.C. Romero
Skip Schumaker
Carlos Beltran
Kyle McClellan
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
which one of these is not like the other?
which one of these doesn’t belong?
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
I think Furcal needs to be there too (to raise Mo's average...)
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 8:55 PM EST up reply actions
I knew I was forgetting someone.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
R. J. Swindle!
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:56 PM EST up reply actions
Koyie Hill....
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:07 PM EST up reply actions
Remember the kids' fun pages . . . Hey, what's wrong with this picture?
Clowns would have upside-down hats and noses. Cats would be running dogs up trees and the Cards would sign four players, three of whom had no value. . . .for $millions
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
huh, yeah
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:21 AM EST up reply actions
If Koyie Hill takes a single fucking PA in a Cardinal uniform,
this statement will have been proven false.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
seems harsh a bit harsh to me
I think Kyle has earned another year. He helped the team bridge a tough spot last year. It’s possible that Boggs is better. It’s possible that there are many arms in AAA that would be marginally better and marginally cheaper. But I think there is value in a guy who can do both relief and starter roles at a low price. There might be 3 or 4 games where the ability to throw Mac out there for 2-4 inning stretch helps us win a game and save the bullpen. Skip performs the same role in many respects.
A lot of obsessing on the 24th and 25th players on the roster.
I’m the biggest Roy Oswalt fan on this site and I don’t think signing Kyle for $2.5 has any impact on that decision. That is the same as saying that they can afford to pay for Oswalt because Matheny makes less than LaRussa.
Just win
I agree.
Skip is just as capable of pitching 2-4 innings to save the bullpen.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 8:58 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Bah
It’s like taking $2.5 million and throwing it right down a sewer
All this wasting money on crap players that could be had for the minimum (their replacement, anyway) adds up….
A million here, a million there...
Pretty soon you’re talking about real money.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 9:02 PM EST up reply actions
except that he's not particularly cheap. joel pineiro just went on a minor league deal. paul maholm just signed for $4.25m.
for $2.5m we should get someone better than a pitcher who is probably worse than 3 or 4 options at the back of the bullpen.
and our 24th and 25th players lost us about 2 wins last year.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
interesting thought
Which team would have the best and worst 24th and 25th WAR. Is -2 WAR bad?
Just win
that's like negating nick punto's contribution last year.
so, yeah, it’s a big deal.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
-2 WAR sounds bad
but is it bad relative what other teams got from those slots (and I understand that divining who was 24th and 25th might be pretty hard.
Last year Franklin/Batista were probably this year’s McClellan and Laird/Descalso was probably Skip. Wouldn’t this be an upgrade?
Just win
If every other team in Major League Baseball got -2.0 WAR from their last two roster spots,
wouldn’t it be advantageous to the Cardinals to fill their last two roster spots with players who are better than that?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I don't think those are the only two options
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
It's not either McClellan or Miller.
I’d prefer the big-league bullpen be Motte, Salas, Sanchez, Lynn, and Boggs. If we need a spot starter, we have Cleto, Dickson, and Miller in AAA. Honestly, If a starter goes down to injury, I have no problem calling up Miller if he is the best starting pitching option.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Calling up Miller. . .
and starting his arb clock early could cost the Cards far more than $2.5M.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 10:27 AM EST up reply actions
I don't understand your logic here.
Excluding Schumaker and McClellan, the Cardinals are geared to win in 2012. Holliday, Carpenter, Berkman, Molina, and Beltran are all aging veterans with the window of effectiveness closing. What I am saying is, if there is an injury in the starting rotation and Shelby Miller is the best starting pitcher to fill in for the injured starter, then he should be called up. This is because I would like to make the postseason and win the World Series again so I’d like the best option in the rotation. Do you disagree with this?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
A lot of points there with which to agree/disagree.
Excluding Schumaker and McClellan, the Cardinals are geared to win in 2012.
The Cardinals are geared to win, even with Schu and K-Mac on the roster, so this is both agree and disagree.
Holliday, Carpenter, Berkman, Molina, and Beltran are all aging veterans with the window of effectiveness closing.
Agree
What I am saying is, if there is an injury in the starting rotation and Shelby Miller is the best starting pitcher to fill in for the injured starter, then he should be called up
.
Depends. If Miller is by far the best starting pitcher candidate, then by all means, call him up, as flags fly forever. If the choice is more marginal, where Miller is merely a marginally better candidate than, say, Mitch Boggs, or inserting K-Mac from the bullpen, then the smart choice is to move K-Mac or Boggs into the rotation. Ditto if the Cards think that Miller would be better served with AAA starting experience rather than MLB starting experience.
This is because I would like to make the postseason and win the World Series again so I’d like the best option in the rotation.
Agree, with the caveat above.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
Holy mother of false choices
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 1:22 AM EST up reply actions
-2.0 WAR is bad.
It’s even worse when the mistakes were obvious and could have been prevented. That’s what we have here. McClellan’s a good bet to be a sub-replacement pitcher. His stuff is pretty blah and his control isn’t great. He’s like Ryan Franklin if Franklin started at a worse talent level to fall from. McClellan isn’t good enough to pay $2.5MM to take a bullpen slot away from a better player.
As for his versatility, there are two swing men in the big-league bullpen better than him in Lance Lynn and Marc Rzepczynski. Dickson is probably as good and Shelby Miller is probably better. In short, McClellan brings nothing to the table and is a waste of $2.5MM.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
but Lynn will already make the team and I don't think they want to assign him to that role he has huge potential
You’d rather have Dickson than McClellan? Don;t you think Kyle has way more trade vlaue in the long run than a Dickson ever will?
You’d rather Shelby Miller be our mop-up man?
Just win
I'm talking about spot-starting.
I don’t think McClellan will get more than one spot start. The Cardinals have gotten into a good habit of not throwing relievers out there to spot start unless they absolutely have to. They typically call up a starter from AAA to make a spot start. I think that Dickson and Cleto would do as well or better than McClellan and I think that Miller is a better choice to spot start than McClellan.
Secondly, if you’re going to use a reliever for a spot start, why not use one who is good? Rzep and Lynn are both better pitchers than McCellan. Why not start them? This is all kind of moot because any spot-starter is only going to be left in for two or three innings so the order doesn’t really matter. It’s just further evidence that McClellan’s supposed versatility is an illusion.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
spot starting
Carp had a bum elbow in the playoffs. Waino is coming off of TJ. One of the reasons I want to sign Oswalt is to protect that risk. I’d be the happiest guy in the world if our starting five don;t need a lot of spot starts, but I suspect they will. K-MAc ain’t great but he would definitely fill a role if needed.
Just win
The role of being worse than Lance Lynn at filling the same role.
How far down in the minors do you have to go to find a player who would be definitively worse than McClellan as depth? There are literally 10 free agent pitchers who are better than K-Mac still out there, and the majority of our AAA and AA pitching staffs are better than him as well. Who gives a crap if he is a known quantity. He is known to not be good.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
by hazel on Jan 17, 2012 9:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I guess you think any spot start will be made by McClellan.
I don’t. I think any spot-starter will come from the Memphis rotation. This is the Cardinals’ M.O. Last year,they called Lynn up from Memphis for two starts, Dickson for a start, and Cleto for a start. Heck, when McClellan was in the big-league bullpen, they didn’t use him for a spot start against Milwaukee.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
And again, this demonstrates why we shouldn't try to predict the future market when making valuation decisions.
Last year, Westbrook’s deal actually looked pretty good. This year it looks like a ridiculous overpay, because both Piniero and Maholm are better pitchers than he is.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
So is Oswalt.
And Oswalt could be had on a one-year deal for $10MM or so. You could even look at Kuroda’s one-year deal. I didn’t mind the Westbrook signing when it was made, but this offseason’s free agent pitching contracts make it look bad. At least it’s only two years (as opposed to Lohse’s four-year mistake of a contract) and will expire after the 2012 season.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
At least Lohse nearly lived up to his contract last year
fWAR was 2.5, I think last year WAR was valued at, what, $4.25 mil per? So that’s $10.625 mil, and he was paid somewhere between $11.875 and $12.1875 (per BRef). Not a huge overpay, unless you look at the contract as a whole, and the black holes of the ’09 and ’10 seasons.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
I'm looking at the contract as a whole.
I agree, though, that Lohse was perfectly fine last season. I hope he can put up similar numbers in 2012.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Lance Lynn?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
I don't understand how McClellan earned his contract.
He was so bad last season that he was a negative value. He should have paid the Cardinals to play. McClellan was as bad as Miguel Batista was for the Cardinals last season. The Cardinals gave Batista his unconditional release, which they should have done. Rather than learning from signing pitchers worth negative WAR (Batista was worth -0,3 in 2010), the Cardinals repeat the mistake by signing the -0.4 WAR McClellan. This mistake is made worse by the dollar amount. $2.5MM is three times the salary given to Batista and makes it less likely McClellan will be given his unconditional release after he pitches horribly for three months.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
K-Mac's negative value was all in the bullpen
He was worth .3 Wins as a starter and -.9 as a reliever. His arm was probably burned out by the time they put him back in the bullpen.
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 17, 2012 9:18 PM EST up reply actions
He does have a skill...
a 51% GB rate and reasonably decent command. I wouldn’t mind having him as the long man out of the pen, but I’d prefer to sign Oswalt and have Westbrook there, or have Lynn be the #6 starter, or call up Miller.
Sign Roy O
And needless to say we don't need to pay 2.5M to 3M for a 6th starter...
who projects to be worse than both Lynn and Miller
Sign Roy O
my feeling is that if mcclellan isn't starting he would be slightly better
but now I’m questioning that… perhaps he was unlucky in relief, but then again I hope not to see him pitch much at all.
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 9:27 PM EST up reply actions
After ~100 IP as a starter he was done.
That isn’t really his fault, he’d never been asked to pitch that much before. His 140ish total IP are nearly double what he did the year before.
So what does that leave as his role? Relief only? The Cards already have cheaper options there that should be at least as good, and possibly better. 5th/6th starter? For a while, but not for a long stretch. Lynn seems like a better fit there anyway.
KMac’s highest fWAR was 0.4 in 2008. Sanchez had that last season in 30IP.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:38 PM EST up reply actions
I also think McClellan's a good bet for an injury.
He had this fatigue problem back during his rookie season, too. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him go down with a bum shoulder or something. That’s another reason I hope we trade him.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
this
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 18, 2012 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
Definitely true,
but, if there is a silver lining, then it is that we will have an open roster spot for a stud rookie pitcher to claim the AW role on our playoff push.
by RasmustheRipper on Jan 18, 2012 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
He's got a major timing problem
Thus the dead arm.
I think all of the gnashing of teeth is going to be a moot point.
An expensive moot point, but a moot point nonetheless.
Boog would have made that play.
Your subject line really isn't correct.
Kmac’s best month by far last year was August, after he had pitched 113 innings through the end of July.
Kmac’s main problem is that he gave up a shit load of home runs in Sept. There’s not much evidence that it was because he was a starter earlier in the year. Although his velocity declined throughout the year, this was consistent with other years. When he was a reliever, it also declined as the year dragged on. And, though in general his average velocity has gone down since he came into the league, we should expect this since a pitcher’s velocity goes down as he gets older.
Basically what I’m saying is that the whole “KMac struggled late in the year because he was tired from being a starter” is a narrative without much basis in fact (IMO).
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
I won't deny that I'm hastily building a narrative without looking deeper.
So, let me look deeper (insofar as my meager understand of this stuff allows). In Aug he faced, Mil (2), Fla (2), Col (2), Pit (3), Chi, LA. That’s a lot of games against bad to mediocre offenses. There’s no question that he was very effective for those 17 innings. 6.88 K/9, good walk rate. .265 BABIP with a 16% LD rate seems a little low / lucky.
But, OK he wasn’t worn out. At least not right as he went into the pen. As you say, the wheels came off in Sept. HRs were a big part of it, but he also walked more and struck out fewer.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
The reason why he was so "successful" in August
Was his ridiculously lucky strand rate of 97% (but also his improved k/BB).
But as far as his arm being tired, his K% in sept was basically unchanged from May-July.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
Think that you're right about the staring be inconsequential. Thinks it's more cumulative innings combined with teams knowing what to expect from him.
That he piled up innings in clumps at the start of the season, probably accelerated the decline. . .
Thanks for the stats, what were his August numbers? Enjoy your posts, keep them up. . .
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
guessing he's the new puppy kicker
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 18, 2012 12:07 AM EST up reply actions
I'm surprised you didn't go with the conspiracy angle. Matheny and McClellan are close....TLR, errrrr, Matheny has got to have his favorites on the team....
Meanwhile, pitcher Kyle McClellan referred to Matheny as an influential figure in his own development. “My situation, I think, might be a little different from some,” McClellan said. "[Chris Carpenter] played with him … But to me, Mike was a huge mentor for me. It’s not rare for me at all to call him after a ballgame, talk about a situation….
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 9:11 PM EST reply actions
you're just trying to ruin my "no more conspiracy theories" new year's resolution, aren't you!
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
Oh my goodness.
That’s nauseating. Matheny has mentored McClellan to replacementdom.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
#intrigue
(I just threw up a little in my mouth typing that)
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 9:15 PM EST up reply actions
Matheny's interview yesterday was good at least
hard to say what he’ll do, but I feel reassured after watching it.
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 9:29 PM EST up reply actions
towards the end it got worse though
it sounds like he’s considering tyler much as tlr did (he can play wherever). plus he said “we all know what skip can do” /hopehewasbeingsarcastic
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 17, 2012 9:35 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, we all know what Skip can do: nothing well.
So why did the Cardinals sign him to a two-year contract?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
cheerleader!
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 18, 2012 12:08 AM EST up reply actions
Wait, we signed Skip for two years?
Damn it, I had forgotten that!
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Mmmmmm
Just made a Chiptole-Honey whole chicken in the pressure cooker. It is has a great sweet and spicy blend
welp, i this is pretty much going to be what VEB's like for the next 3 weeks or so, right?
can i have baseball back yet
How's your job
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i like it
i’d rather be doing it that going to school, i think. or at least today was pretty boring, but maybe it was just syllabus week
Yeah, I think I enjoy what I'm doing more than academia too
And this computer is ballin’ my face off
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i have bad news for you, rui.
turns out you’re not a soccer analyst, and that’s not a computer.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 17, 2012 10:04 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Why are you so mean to me
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
anybody who uses the phrase "ballin my face off"
Deserves what they get.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 17, 2012 11:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
Well, now, the angels want to wear my red shoes
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 1:07 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah they are
They took the computer I requested, and just upgraded everything (minus SSD because a larger hard drive was probably more necessary)
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i really wanted the SSD at first
but 1) it would’ve taken about 2 weeks longer to get it. 2) when i played with them in the store, boot times weren’t that much faster with an SSD, which is where you’re going to see it the most
the RAM is user upgradable, so i’ll do that myself $45 whenever i feel the need instead of paying $200 or whatever to have some high school student do it for me
by prophetjohn on Jan 17, 2012 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
This high-res screen is so much cooler than I thought it'd be
So much real estate
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
My computer boots in under 10 secs after Bios with my SSD
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 17, 2012 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
i timed mine just now
power button to looking at my desktop is 38 seconds. that’s good enough considering that i rarely turn off this laptop. it returns from sleep — what i normally do — as fast as i can type in my password.
and a 20-second boot time difference wasn’t worth $100 and 600GB of storage to me
by prophetjohn on Jan 17, 2012 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
I guess with a laptop
I would never want a laptop to be my main computer though. I have SSD’s in my laptop and my desktop. Makes a huge difference in overall speed of progams. Not a lot of storage but I don’t need it for storage. Just for mobility
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 17, 2012 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
my laptop isn't my main computer either
and the only time i shut down my desktop is when windows has been bugging me for a week to restart to finish installing updates
and, i dunno, i don’t see what programs i use regularly that will see a performance increase from an SSD. i guess my computing just isn’t very disk I/O intensive
i probably will install an SSD on this thing at some point, though.
by prophetjohn on Jan 17, 2012 11:29 PM EST up reply actions
not yet dude
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 18, 2012 12:09 AM EST up reply actions
jeff francis, jon garland, rich harden, livan hernandez, kevin millwood, todd coffey -- any number of guys are still
available who would likely surpass mcclellan’s value and might go for something in the vicinity of $2.5m (garland would be a touch more).
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
suppan's probably up to the "task".
What do you have against the ring-tailed lemur?
by threadkiller on Jan 17, 2012 9:38 PM EST up reply actions
I have wanted us to sign Garland for years
Just so I could say “I, Garland, will knock you all down!” every time he appeared for us.
… I mean, I already did that if he ever pitched against the Cardinals, but he had mostly been an AL pitcher so there were few opportunities.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
No, no, no.
There is nothing harsh about calling McClellan a crappy player and this a crappy signing. Kyle McClellan is literally the worst pitcher on our staff, and he is making more than anyone else in the bullpen. He is also making more than Joel Pineiro, who would be worth more than a spot start and is likely better than Westbroke as well.
In addition, there are plenty of middling “depth” pitchers hanging around who could still be hired. This is not a depth signing unless the definition of depth is how much better value your minor leaguers are than your major leaguers.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
LangoschMLB: For the #STLCards followers who have asked, arb-eligible Jason Motte has asked for $2.4 million, while Cards filed a $1.5 million figure.
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
now everybody goes out to an expensive dinner on the cardinals' dime and they settle on $1.9m.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
The Cardinals will pay Kyle McClellan more than Jason Motte.
Oh, the world is cruel and capricious.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
by hazel on Jan 17, 2012 9:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I like how VEB doesn't use the verbs "make" or "earn" in regards to McClellan's salary.
It’s “the Cardinals will pay” or “McClellan will receive.”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
world don't make sense
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 18, 2012 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
Because Kyle McClellan is the only person on earth. . .
who earns more than more talented contemporaries mainly on the basis of seniority.
And, you know, wars, pestilence and hunger, those are pretty bad, too.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
Because other people on earth earn more than more talented contemporaries on the basis of seniority,
this is how the Cardinals should construct their roster? Why?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Assuming for the moment. . .
that the Cardinals have made a less than optimal choice regarding their 24th/25th roster spot hardly makes the world a cruel and capricious place.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
I wonder if Sauce came up with that number
before or after the K-Mac signing.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 9:45 PM EST up reply actions
aren't there rules in place to make sure this doesn't happen?
"Alright, you caught me. I was wearing the clear heels"
-azruavatar
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 17, 2012 10:17 PM EST up reply actions
Not sure.
I don’t know how you could keep agents from using previous contracts to base their own upon.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 10:22 PM EST up reply actions
Paying McClellan more than Motte does not make any sense.
If the Cardinals are so focused on optimum distribution of salary across positions, how does this happen?
Who's got it better than us? NOBODY!
Well, this is Motte's first arb year and Kmac's second, so the primary difference is service time.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 17, 2012 10:46 PM EST up reply actions
Also, they look at the prior years
not what role they are anticipating in the future. SP/IP + service time=k$>m$
by RasmustheRipper on Jan 18, 2012 12:05 AM EST up reply actions
So glad Peanut's okay, you guys
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Curse you SuperTheo
Cespedes: Cubs Are Leading Suitors
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 10:36 PM EST reply actions
Theo will do great until the Cubs faithful
start screaming for big name talent, then he’ll fall apart.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 17, 2012 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
If he getws anywhere near $30M as a "signing bonus". . .
then this can only be good. . . for the Cardinals.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 10:32 AM EST up reply actions
Are you talking about allergies or something?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
DOOOOOOMED
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
an interesting read for our music lovers
whether or not you like his style of music, you have to respect what he has accomplished.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 17, 2012 10:59 PM EST reply actions
My dad loves Flatt and Scruggs.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 11:16 PM EST up reply actions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xdn6htjkx0
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
I always have loved that piece.
never realized just how fast it moved until that article
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 18, 2012 3:55 AM EST up reply actions
That's a nice write-up.
Thanks for the link.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 17, 2012 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
I am
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i thought you might
You should do a fanpost or something when you get back
by FlimtotheFlam on Jan 17, 2012 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
Nah... if it were a personal trip, I would, but it's for work
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
wow, I was gonna say maybe that'd be fun to drop by, being here in Boston and all
and then I looked at the price…
Do you have a .edu address?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
No
and that web page makes it look like they’ll actually check student status; I doubt my old student id with its 2008 expiration date and picture of me 8 years ago is going to be fooling too many people.
Oh, mine doesn't have an expiration date
Also, I’m going to look like I’m 22 for at least 15 more years, so this is going to be awesome
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Just picked up a few of last weekends NFL playoff games.
Will watch the Patriots dismantling of the Broncos… Missed it live…
Also got the NO at SF game.
Haven’t caught to many games this year so this should be goood.
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 12:47 AM EST reply actions
Does anyone know anything about Mandelbrot sets?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
6-4, 6-0?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
Yes, I remember going to lecture about them and falling asleep.
So the main thing I know about them is that they’re very boring. Also, I believe they’re used in making tie dye shirts.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 18, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
If only learning about fractal stuff was as fun as looking at cool pictures of them.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Watch White Collar on USA
#SSCF’sSoleKnowledgeofFractals
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 18, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
I want to read Mandlebrot's book
wikipedia says he relates it all back to nature.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
Do they have any point
or are they just made to be a complicated fractal?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
I have no idea -
the lecture was for a math class about discrete systems. I still have no idea what the relationship was between the lecture and the class. I literally fell asleep at the lecture and the only thing I remember were the funky fractal pictures.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 18, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions
Least shocking news of the day
B.J. Rains @BJRains
For those wondering, the show on ABC that David Freese filmed an episode for was canceled after two episodes. His show will not be aired.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 18, 2012 1:23 AM EST reply actions
My god it looked awful
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 18, 2012 8:44 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Not even a clutch appearance by David Freese could save it?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Haven't got to that one yet, but plan on it, I've have been watching Hell on Wheels, though.
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 1:36 AM EST up reply actions
How is that?
The promos looked kinda cheesy but I was kinda intrigued by the idea
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 18, 2012 1:38 AM EST up reply actions
I just like westerns for some odd reason.
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 1:42 AM EST up reply actions
Westerns might be my favorite genre
I’ve seen a handful of old Clint Eastwood movies but not all of them. I generally try to see whatever new ones come out
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 18, 2012 1:45 AM EST up reply actions
It's worth watching.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 18, 2012 3:59 AM EST up reply actions
Been lookin forward to that one for a while
I have faith it will continue to be one of the best things on tv.
Ya me to, waiting to get Blackthorn with Sam Shepard, new western just came out recently.
Clint a good choice, Silverado is a good non Clint western. Wild Bunch and The Professionals are some of my all time most viewed westerns though.
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 1:51 AM EST reply actions
From what I've seen, Both True Grits, as well as Good Bad and the Ugly
There’s a few I’m forgetting
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 18, 2012 2:11 AM EST up reply actions
Oh! I really liked Assassination of Jesse James but that isn't as much of a western
Kind of a psychological look at Jesse James and Robert Ford, if you haven’t seen it
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 18, 2012 2:15 AM EST up reply actions
I saw it
it kind of dragged on, but I love Casey Affleck.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 2:18 AM EST up reply actions
Yep I sure did, and really liked it as well, kinda liked the slow pace of the film.
If I remember right, Pynchon has a small sentence to Ford, in his sprawling novel Against the Day. It was like the next night after seeing the movie, that I came across the Ford reference and went like went holy crap how weird is that..
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 4:08 AM EST up reply actions
I've never read any Pynchon
but have been meaning to give him a shot. Which book should I start with?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 18, 2012 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
I would say
Crying of Lot 49 is his most approachable, Gravity’s Rainbow his best by a good margin, among the ones I’ve read. So either of those would be a good choice.
Gravity's Rainbow was something else for a WWII type story and pretty damn good, my favorite that I
have liked reading is Against the Day, starts off in the 1890’s, it’s kinda like 3 genre’s rolled into one, there is the western, detective, and early 20th century action adventure, each with it’s own story arc, has a ton of characters with some historical one’s thrown in the mix, along with Vectorists and Quaternions. The prose is something I soaked up, some sentence’s went on for seemingly like paragraph lengths and it took me a long time to read it.
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
Fistful of Dollars and a Few Dollars More
The Shootist, Rooster Cogburn and The Cowboys. I always liked Jimmy Stewart and Glenn Ford westerns as well.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 18, 2012 4:03 AM EST up reply actions
Ya all those are great ones most of my top westerns come out of the 60's, along with, Gregory
Peck, Heston (especially in Major Dundee), the list goes on and on. But I think since I was growing up at that time, I have to put The Good the Bad and the Ugly as my all time top western, I know lot of people put the Searchers up there, and thats in my top 5..
by Tuning in from Korea on Jan 18, 2012 4:20 AM EST up reply actions
The Searchers
hit on some pretty heavy themes for being a little cornball. Still an amazing movie.
Also, to anyone who hasn’t/no one in particular watch every Clint Eastwood western and end it with The Outlaw Josey Wales, then wait a day and watch Unforgiven. Can’t go wrong.
by openside on Jan 18, 2012 9:13 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
I can't believe I left those off.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 18, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
Wild Bunch is awesome
Total bloodbath. The blood flowed like Sam Peckinpah’s whiskey.
"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby
by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 18, 2012 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
Is your house on an indian burial ground?
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 18, 2012 8:28 AM EST up reply actions
I'm not happy with Mo here, but it sure could be worse
Sabean’s decision to pick up Affeldt’s $5M option and give Javier Lopez $4.25M this year means that those two lefties who combined for 114.2 IP in 2011 will cost about $2.5M more than the entire Cardinals bullpen combined.
Good ol' Sabes.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Wait a minute
I thought “sabes” was Strauss’ go-to derogatory term for statheads?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Could Sabean be a closet "sabe"???
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
No.
I’m using Billy Beane’s nickname for Sabean in the Moneyball movie. Now that I think about it, the nickname may have been “Sabey Sabes.” Which is even better.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Did he really call him that?
I had forgotten. Anyway, that’s awesome.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
(I was completely non-serious about Sabean being a closet SABR guy, if that was not clear)
(I mean, come on.)
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Keep hoping that Mo has some indication that someone wants KMac, so hopes to recover more in trade value.
Hamlet: Perchance to dream
Adultery is the application of democracy to love.
H. L. Mencken
He might be playing some Billy Beane Ball
He keeps a so-so reliever around and available, and swaps him for prospect parts during the season (in a “needs area” for the club). Crazier things have happened…
There's a lot to be earned
by a GM willing to sell high on a reliever having a ‘good year’ based on small sample size.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
So if Albert would have played for Anaheim last year...
He would have hit 16 more deepers.
But that’s with pitching aside.
by Cheeseballs on Jan 18, 2012 3:30 AM EST via mobile reply actions
He gets to play an unbalanced schedule's worth of games in Arlington now
Though I guess that gets balanced by Seattle and Oakland.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
source?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 18, 2012 3:57 AM EST up reply actions
Here it is
Don’t know if it’ll link via mobile
http://angels.ocregister.com/2012/01/17/albert-pujols-and-angel-stadium-and-home-runs/115689/
by Cheeseballs on Jan 18, 2012 4:06 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
misleading GIF is misleading
pencil in Pujols for the new single season HR record of 150.
I have no idea if that worked. I’m at work and all I see is a box with a red X in it.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
I see a box with a little red X, too.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Best SOPA protest blackout page
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
by Hootie Who on Jan 18, 2012 9:43 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Purely non-political post:
I have discovered that you can get around the Wikipedia blackout if you stop loading the page quick enough. In Chrome anyway. When I try to access a Wiki page, it starts to load the article and then jumps to the blackout page after a moment. So Wikipedia is still usable today. Hooray!
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I hardly ever use Wikipedia.
I was surprised with the Twitter buzz about it going dark. Do that many people use it?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
It's pretty useful for a wide range of stuff, so yeah, I'd imagine people use it a lot
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Its a great tool
For procrastination…
Piss off Tony, get shipped to Canada.
by beer me on Jan 18, 2012 10:05 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
#6 website in the world according to Alexa
(Insert Mariners joke here)
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 18, 2012 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
you can access the german wiki and have chrome translate it
It’s not perfect, but it will work for a day
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
Heh
Honestly though, stopping the page from loading isn’t hard at all. It’s way, way less work than translating the page.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
you can also disable javascript on your browser
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Jan 18, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
But how will I play RBI Baseball on VirtualNES???
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
by mattybobo on Jan 18, 2012 10:11 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
oooh
I do love RBI Baseball.. not RBI2 or 3 though. I’ve got nesdroid on my galaxy nexus and I hook it up to the tv and play it that way
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Jan 18, 2012 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
RBI 2 and 3 just don't feel the same to me
For all I know the mechanics are exactly the same, but I just don’t believe that the skinny players hit or throw the ball the same as the chunky players in the original.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
the mechanics feel slightly different
but I agree, I don’t care much for the art style.
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Jan 18, 2012 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I think there are at least some tweaks in the gameplay
I think defenders can jump and dive in 2 and 3, etc. Anyway, I will always wonder why they abandoned the “fat guy” look, since the whimsical style is a huge part of the appeal.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
you should get two recs
one for RBI Baseball and one for VirtualNES, but sadly all rec’s are weighted the same
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
I saw somewhere that you can access Wiki
by disabling javascript in your browser as well.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 18, 2012 10:18 AM EST up reply actions
Another great SOPA related thing
the herpderpedia Twitter account After reading all the RT, this is how I feel:
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Jan 18, 2012 9:58 AM EST up reply actions
I had to close the tab
it was getting too depressing
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Jan 18, 2012 10:09 AM EST up reply actions
funny in that it's amazing that people can't click a link to find out why wiki is down
depressing in that the majority of these people can vote and if they’re too lazy to click a link to learn more, what does that mean when they have to read about candidate a or b’s policies, beliefs, etc.?
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Jan 18, 2012 10:17 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Actually I wouldn't be surprised if a number of them were high school kids who can't vote yet
But I understand where you’re coming from. All of this was true before today, though, so I will continue to just laugh at it.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
most sounded like high school kids
But those kinds of people don’t get significantly smarter as the years go on
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 18, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
That is fantastic.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 18, 2012 10:17 AM EST up reply actions
You're falling into fangraphs' trap
They seem to think that strikeouts counts twice as much as grounders. They refuse to accept that some pitchers can induce soft contact and get hitters out that way.
I’m not saying McClellan is great by any means but he’s been a really good reliever. You’re not giving him enough credit for that because you’re blinded by strikeouts. By the way, he doesn’t walk too many. He’s about average in that area in his career. You only think he walks to many because… you only compared his walks to his strikeouts.
Tony LaRussa- resident genius
There's a strong relationship between strikeout rates and softness of contact induced.
You should read Mike Fast’s articles at Baseball Prospectus on the subject. Pitchers with high strikeout rates typically have a lower than average BABIP because they induce weaker contact. It’s a finding that makes intuitive sense. If you get more swings-and-misses and more strikeouts, you should induce weaker contact. McClellan has a low strikeout rate and a low BABIP. I don’t see much of a reason to believe this will continue. Maybe you do.
As I state in the main post, I didn’t mind McClellan so much when he was making less than $500,000 to practice his smoke-and-mirrors act. It’s when the organization is paying him $2.5MM to pitch in the bullpen over better, cheaper pitchers than I have a problem with it. Good organizations don’t pay dime-a-dozen righty relievers like McClellan $2.5MM when they can throw a stone at camp during Spring Training and hit a pitcher who can give them the same result for the league minimum.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Do you have evidence to suggest that KMac is one of this group: bq. some pitchers can induce soft contact and get hitters out that way.
"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby
by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 18, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
Format fail
some pitchers can induce soft contact and get hitters out that way.
"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby
by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 18, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
OT
The lady I work with talks so fucking loud. Instead of just listening to people she talks louder and louder to talk over them. It grinds my fucking gears…
Piss off Tony, get shipped to Canada.
by beer me on Jan 18, 2012 10:34 AM EST via mobile reply actions
he always looks like he has balls on his chin
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 18, 2012 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
beer me
"Alright, you caught me. I was wearing the clear heels"
-azruavatar
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 18, 2012 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
KMac wasn't bad in 2010 or 2009 as a reliever
While I think McClellan is overpaid now, he wasn’t a terrible reliever. He pitched twice as many innings as he’s used to last year, so thats the reason he had “dead arm” late in the year in my opinion. In 2010, McClellan was one of the Cardinals best relievers compiling a 2.27 ERA and a 1.08 WHIP. Also, I don’t see how Mitchell Boggs is any better than K-Mac. McClellan was better than him in 2008, 2009, and 2010 and they are both the same age.
I don’t want him back in the rotation, but he filled in when the club needed him last year. He didn’t pitch great, but he wasn’t awful either. Hopefully he can regain his form and be a good long man in 2012. Plus, he’s a hometown guy so I’m not as upset about this as some of you are.
2010
In 2010, McClellan had a 90% LOB rate. There’s abolutely no reason to believe this will ever happen again. The league average LOB% is typically around 75%. McClellan’s career LOB% (including his 90% 2010) is 76.7%. In 2008, it was 72.6%; in 2009, it was 75.2%; and, last season, it was 74.4%. His ERAs those seasons were 4.04, 3.38, and 4.19. Not good and not horrible. Certainly not worth a roster spot at the cost of $2.5MM.
As for McClellan starting last season, it was not a selfless act. I don’t understand why folks seem to view him as a team-oriented player who took to the rotation for the good of the team. It’s as if everyone has forgotten his whininess when Garcia beat him out for the fifth rotation spot entering 2010. McClellan wants to be a starter. Every year he prepares for it and is sure to get quoted about he’s prepared to be a starter. Thankfully, the club has kept him from starting every year except last year (and they corrected that mistake at the trade deadline).
In terms of projecting a pitcher’s ERA, the two stats with the highest correlation are K/9 and FIP. The higher the K/9, the lower the likely ERA. The lower the FIP, the lower the likely ERA. Dead-Arm’s 2011 K/9 was 4.83 and his 2011 FIP was 4.92. Maybe I’m a bit pessimistic in expecting a forthcoming implosion a la Ryan Franklin, but it seems highly probable to me.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Franklin
I don’t expect him to be that bad this year, remember Franklin is 10 years older and lost his command last season. Its possible that McClellan never comes close to his 2010 campaign, but I don’t see why he can’t be just as good or better than his 2009 version now that he’s strictly a reliever. I’m not the biggest believer in FIP myself, considering it doesn’t account for outs made via defense.
I agree that he’s overpaid, but I don’t think he’s going to be Franklin/Batista bad. I think he will at least be a serviceable reliever in 2012.
That's a fair point on their respective ages.
Nonetheless, I’m worried about McClellan cratering out because he is so dependent on batted-ball luck. Even if he doesn’t implode like Franklin, if he’s as good as projection systems expect him to be—which is typically in the 3.70-4.10 ERA range—he’s not worth the money. In isolation, $2.5MM isn’t that bad. But when you waste $1.5 here on Schumaker and $2.5MM there on McClellan, you’ve got the salary of a decent player that could help the team (or, the partial salary of an impact player like a Roy Oswalt).
My problem is more with paying a perfectly replaceable pitcher like McClellan more than $500,000. There just isn’t any reason to do it. Especially when there are a half-doze players capable of putting up similar numbers for the league minimum already on the 40-man roster.
You may not like FIP but that doesn’t change the fact that it has a higher correlation to the next year’s ERA than one year’s ERA has to the next year’s ERA.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Oswalt
I’d be more than happy to dump K-Mac and Skip for extra money to sign Oswalt. Skip is a role player better suited for bench duty imo. However, the Cards would still need to trade either Westbrook(8 mil) or Lohse(12 mil) to open a spot for him. Both have no trade clauses and both are overpaid. I wouldn’t want the Cards spending 8-10 mil on Oswalt, and have Westbrook be a 8 mil reliever.
Hopefully, the Cardinals have learned their lesson on signing average to mediocre starting pitchers to long term deals. I think they might considering they haven’t tried to re-sign Jackson.
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