2012 Draft Preview Ein: Starting Off Sinisterly
Yes, friends, it's that time of year again, when a young man's fancy turns to thoughts of June and amateur baseball players. Well, okay, maybe it's not quite that time of year yet for most of us, but given we're right about five months out from baseball's first-year draft it is that time when I need to get started doing these previews if I'm going to get as many in as I would like.
As always, I'll mostly be covering the players likely to be first-ish round picks, with a few other players of interest thrown in. Since the focus is going to be mostly on likely first rounders, let's take a quick moment to refamiliarise ourselves with the Cards' recent first-round history, shall we?
2011: Kolten Wong, 2B, University of Hawaii -- Panned at draft time by plenty of fans and analysts alike as Pete Kozma II: The Kozmaning, Wong went out and did his level best to prove everyone wrong. He's a hitter, plain and simple, and so far the defense looks good enough. Put him solidly in the results-first bin, and the pure hitter bin as well. Currently the most promising middle infield prospect in the system in terms of possible future impact.
2010: Zack Cox, 3B, University of Arkansas -- A lot like Kolten Wong, except at third instead of second. The bat is the one tool that really stands out, and most agree it plays at any level. There are more questions about Cox than Wong (tee-hee), largely due to the increased offensive expectations of a player relegated to a corner position. Still, while Cox has lost some lustre among prospect watchers, he's still performed at every level so far. Results first, tools second. Pure hitter.
2009: Shelby Miller, RHP, Brownwood HS -- The big departure for the Cards with their first pick. Miller is the organisation's number one prospect, and it isn't a real tough choice. All tools, all projection, no production pick.
2008: Brett Wallace, 3B/1B, Arizona State -- Stop me if you've heard this one: pure hitter, all production, no projection, questionable tools. Wallace hasn't developed at the major league level yet the way most thought he would, but he already brought the Cards all the value he was going to in the Matt Holliday trade. It remains to be seen if he can make the adjustments to big league pitching, and his power seems to have virtually disappeared.
We won't go back any further; four years is plenty long enough for me to think on. The pattern here is fairly clear: the Cardinals value production more than projection. They believe players who can hit will find a path to the big leagues, and in each of the past four drafts they've taken the most valuable player available. Now, that's not necessarily the best player available, but best is really much tougher to define in the baseball draft anyway. If there's a valuable commodity sitting on the board when the Cards pick, chances are they're going to take him.
So what are we going to start with? The least Cardinal-y draft demographic of all: high school left-handed pitchers. Why would I start there after going through the trouble to map out why the Cardinals almost assuredly aren't going to pick one of these guys? Because it's my draft previews, and this is what I feel like doing. Also, I might still be carrying a bit of a Henry Owens torch from last year.
Matthew Smoral, LHP, Solon High School (Ohio)6'8", 225 lbs
Throws: Left
Bats: Left
So, what's so great about this guy?
Matt Smoral is a monster. He's huge. Not only does he stand 6'8", he's got a big frame as well. Broad shoulders, long limbs, just a physically large human being. As you can probably imagine, that extra-large frame comes with some pretty hefty projection, as he has plenty of room to fill out and add on to his body. I think the projection card is often overplayed with young pitchers, particularly in regards to their peak velocities, but Smoral is just the sort of player the term was invented for.
That's not to say Smoral's stuff isn't already buzzworthy; it most definitely is. He works his fastball in the 91-93 range, and will occasionally bump a little higher than that. Obviously, the hope is he'll add to that as he matures, but even if he doesn't and just settles in more consistently at 93 he has plenty of oomph for a lefty. He throws a curveball currently that tends to get slurvy, but I think with his arm slot he'll end up with a slider when it's all said and done. Guys with lower arm slots usually have better luck with sliders than curves, and I have a feeling Smoral will be no exception. His changeup is high school standard, which is to say he's heard of the pitch, and has some idea of how to throw it, but hasn't done a whole of it just yet because he hasn't needed to.
Smoral works from a low three-quarter arm slot, and I actually like his mechanics pretty well. I don't recall where, but I did read a scouting report concerned with the fact he tends to land closed and works across his body, but that seems correctable if it is in fact an issue. It would likely behoove him to try and land a bit more straight on, if only to improve his command. He doesn't have any ugly positions in his arm action, though, and I like both his tempo and his drift through the balance point of his delivery.
Obviously, there are going to be plenty of teams lining up to look at Smoral and imagining him as the next Randy Johnson. That may be too lofty a goal, but it certainly wouldn't be out of the question to see him turn into the next David Price. Where he goes in the draft will depend somewhat on how he performs this spring, of course, but the biggest factor for Smoral is going to be whether he shows any signs of increasing velocity between now and the first week of June.
Max Fried, LHP, Montclair Prep School (California)
6'4", 165 lbs
Throws: Left
Bats: Left
So, what's so great about this guy?
Fried is one of the very few guys whose name is already somewhat known in this draft class. (Actually, known might be too strong a word; he's 'known' to draftniks more than most other potential high school draftees are in January.) If you're looking for the Clayton Kershaw of this year's draft, the smart money is probably on Fried to be it.
Fried has the same projection label as Smoral, and actually has even more room to grow. He's gangly and could easily add 25 pounds without a second thought. And then he could have a second thought and decide to add 15 or 20 more.
Much like Kershaw, Fried's best pitch is his curveball, already a true hammer in the mid-70s he'll throw at any time in any count. The ability to spin a breaking ball so effectively at such a young age is rare, and grabs your attention in a big way. He sets up his curve with a fastball in the low 90s and a fairly advanced changeup. His command of the fastball in particular is a long way from major league ready, but a three-pitch mix of this quality isn't the sort of commodity to go unnoticed in the draft.
I'll be honest; I don't like Fried as well as either of the other two pitchers I'm covering here today. There's something about his delivery that bugs me, but I can't quite put my finger on it. I have to admit, though, he's got a curve you don't often see from kids at this age, and is probably the most advanced pitcher of this group.
Unless something completely unexpected -- like, say, an arm injury -- pops up this sprig, I don't see any way Fried drops very far come June. What will make a difference is what the reports on his velocity say. If he shows signs of inching further into the 90s with his fastball, he could end up a top 10 or even top 5 pick. If he stays right where he is, he'll still be gone before the supplemental round comes along. More polished than your average high school pitcher, Fried should make some team very, very happy come draft day.
Hunter Virant, LHP, Camarillo High School (California)
6'3", 170 lbs
Throws: Left
Bats: Right
So, what's so great about this guy?
It's maybe a little too early in the process to say this, but I'm going to say it anyway. Hunter Virant is probably my favourite player in the entire 2012 draft. Why? Well, partially because I think he's an outstanding prospect, and partially because his name sounds like a miniboss from a Metroid game. But mostly because I think he's an outstanding prospect.
Virant's calling card is his raw athleticism, the same sort of athletic ability that made Tyrell Jenkins so attractive as a pitcher. He's long and loose, with natural actions that can't be taught. When scouts talk about looking for what you can't give a player, they're talking about Hunter Virant's gift for movement. At this time last year there was plenty of debate as to whether he would be more attractive as a pitcher or an OF/1B prospect, but as time has gone on it's becoming more and more clear Virant's future is on the mound.
The repertoire is solid already and projects to get better: a low-90s fastball and a changeup that has shown flashes of brilliance, if not much consistency. His breaking ball right now is basically a slurve, and down the line he (and the team that drafts him), will need to figure out whether to tighten it into a slider or get on top and turn it into a curve. I would personally hope for a curveball, and I'll explain why in a moment.
What I love most about Virant is the delivery, but in an odd way. I love the looseness. I love the arm action on the backside. I love how far he extends out in front of the mound, and how well he finishes out over his front leg. On the other hand, there's plenty in his delivery that could be better. He works from a lower arm slot, but only part of the time. He lands closed with his plant foot. Most of all, he just doesn't repeat the same mechanics consistently time after time.
When Virant stays on top of the ball and keeps his arm slot up, I love love love his delivery. When he drops his arm and slings the ball it gets flat and everything stays up. It's a big part of the reason I said before I hope he ends up with a curveball down the road, too; if I'm drafting Virant I want to see him get his arm slot up and get on top of the ball. He could still throw a slider that way, of course, but a curve would be the more natural pitch for him I think.
If you were to ask me why I feel more strongly about Virant than either of the other two pitchers here, I would be hard pressed to give you a proper reason. Honestly, at this point I would have to call it just a gut feeling. But I've already done a fair bit of research on the players I'm going to be writing about over the next few months, and Hunter Virant is, at this moment, the player whose name I would most like to hear called when the Cardinals go on the clock.
Well, that's one in the bag, folks. Between now and June I'll probably put together about a dozen of these, and hopefully by the time draft day rolls around we'll all have a pretty good idea who the players having their names called are.
See you all next Wednesday.
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Excellent work, Baron
As always
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 11, 2012 11:51 AM EST reply actions
I will say that studying previous drafts doesn't mean that much this year, I don't think
Luhnow and Sig are both gone, and Elias might be gone as well. We have no idea what the new guy prefers in draftees
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Yes, this is a good point
I hope we go best player available rather that team need
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Jan 11, 2012 1:06 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Rather than*
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Jan 11, 2012 1:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
extra picks
the cards also have some extra picks to work with this year. that might make them more open to selecting an ‘upside’ pick.
I disagree
Mozeliak is still the guy making the selections, and with his background as a scouting director, it would seem that our draft strategy probably isn’t going to change all that much.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Yea, I don't think it's a sure thing that it will change, but I wouldn't take it not changing for granted either.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
i'm guessing strategy will be pretty similar as well
… since it’s worked for Moz to date.
of course, that doesn’t mean that the guys making final recommendations to Moz will be nearly as proficient at either following the strategy or finding the best players who match the strategy.
With all the good lefties in this draft
and our completely lack of left handed pitching in the minor leagues along with tons of picks in the top 100, I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Cardinals go after a couple of HS lefties like those mentioned above and try to hit the mother-lode in terms of pitching prospects this decade.
As RB will get to later, this draft is shaping up as a very good one to have a lot of picks in the first 100 players. Good value all the way through the top 100 and lots of good upside picks there as well. Much better than last years draft, imo.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
This.
If anything changes the Redbirds’ draft output, it will be the plethora of top 100 picks, not the change in personnel.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
However, does the scope of the draft
(especially what can be done in the first round) change with the new CBA? And does the restrictions on what can be done internationally affect strategy as well?
In all honestly (and I may be answering my own question here), I really don’t think it does, to a degee. But, on the other hand, I feel the new CBA will only reward those organizations that are really good at talent evaluation. That means more scouts on the ground and more analysts in the office.
I feel at this point, information and the dissection of all forms of information is at a premium. Money has virtually been taken out of the equation and it’s money that covers up flaws. You can’t cover up those flaws anymore, unless I’m missing something about the CBA.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
I disagree
With Mozeliak before, our spots in the field seemed pretty cemented, minus a couple of places. In 2008, a power hitting lefty who could advance quickly was taken in Wallace. It was thought he could play third base. Rolen was gone. In 2010, third base was still an issue because of trading away 2008’s pick. Cox was taken – another hard hitting lefty. In 2011, the only spots the Cardinals needed someone to move through the system quickly was middle infield. I think Mo believes in Ryan Jackson, and Kolten Wong was a quick mover at 2B. He took Wong. (ha ha, I know)
I think that we’re pretty set at most positions and the backups, unless there is a quick moving center fielder or catcher in this draft. If Yadi gets locked up before the June draft, that would take care of the latter. I think this draft could be 4-5 upside picks in the first 100 draft choices.
In hindsight
It seems quite likely that Wallace was taken to be traded. Hot hitting prospect, expected to move through the system quickly, and a team that had a window of opportunity to win. You could say that they took Wallace because he was the best value pick, and they obtained that value by trading him. Or you could say that they took him even though he probably wouldn’t have a position to play in StL with the intention of trading him. Those are pretty much equivalent to me, and taking the most valuable player available at your draft spot seems like a sensible strategy to me because those guys are fungible.
This assumes that we draft according to what we have at the major league level.
I really don’t think that’s what the Cardinals do at all, and I thank Mo every day for that.
Our organization has moved away from drafting for “need” after the whole Kozma debacle and has moved more towards taking the best available talent (Miller, Jenkins, Tilson) as well as filling gaps in our organization chart with fast moving college players (Cox, Wong, Lynn, Swagerty). Better to fill gaps at the major league level by trading from farm depth or signing free agents, then trying to project a draft prospect out two to three years from AA to the big leagues.
Not to mention: We’ve gotten a lot of good value in the middle rounds and from Latin America since Mozeliak took over as scouting director and then moved up to GM.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Wong, yes
But Cox? We’re as deep in cost controlled talent at 3B as any team in the big leagues. He was a perfect example of a “best player available” scenario: a guy who was top 15 talent that dropped to us late in the round due to signability concerns.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
As dmb noted
I think the extra picks make a BIG difference. We’re picking twice in the top 30, and I’d imagine it’s almost certain (as we saw with the Shelby pick a couple of years ago, when we had two supplementals) that we’ll take at least one high upside, high school-type guy in the first round. WIth three supplemental picks as well, it’s pretty clear we CAN (if the org see it as a big need) grab a low-upside college 2B or two as well as taking a few high upside guys. If last year is anything to go by, I’d expect a toolsy, athletic high-school hitter with a lot of speed somewhere in the first five picks as well.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
What's high school called in the UK?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
bangers and mash
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
by mattyp on Jan 11, 2012 11:40 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
heh. sounds like hookers and Jack Daniels
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:06 AM EST up reply actions
Also, you are getting the baseball patois down really, really well.
How long did you live in the US?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
I've never lived in the US.
I travelled around the midwest for a while back in 2003 (or was it 02).
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 12, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
Can someone explain to me
in one sentence; what is the difference between a curveball and a slider?
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
A curveball has a more vertical break and is usually slower,
while a slider is generally tilted more at an angle and is thrown harder.
I can do no wrong, for I do not know what it is.
by the red baron on Jan 11, 2012 11:59 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think
(think, mind you) that a slider is more horizontal and faster than a curveball, and a “slurve” is kind of a pitch that resembles both but is in the middle, so is classifiable as neither.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I always thought slurve was short for slow curve ball.
Like the long, looping kind, not a sharp, drop off a table curve.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
i think its a slider curve combo..
Sl(ider)©urve
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
Well had I known you copyrighted it, I would not look such the fool.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
by Alxfritz on Jan 11, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yea, that didnt work
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
I actually wondered that for a while too, but started thinking it meant "slider-curve" from usage
It was my best guess, really.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
It definitely means slider/curve
Tends to be a slower pitch with more horizontal break than people usually think of with curveballs.
The Slurve
…should just rename it the Tommy Johnmaker. Maybe that’s just perception though.
by openside on Jan 11, 2012 4:16 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
A slider is thrown much like a fastball
and appears as such until its late, sharp break; whereas a curveball is thrown by turning the wrist and possesses a larger arc to it’s break.
by DeWitt4Torty on Jan 11, 2012 12:35 PM EST up reply actions
Sure.
Bats, they are sick. I cannot hit curveball. Straightball I hit it very much. Curveball, bats are afraid. I ask Jobu to come, take fear from bats. I offer him cigar, rum. He will come.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Jan 11, 2012 12:59 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
haha what is this
"That's what I'm talking about! Strike him blind, Lord!" - Berk
Running list of Molina pick-offs | twit
"Are you in good hands?"

Btw, has anyone ever heard Pablo Francisco do this bit?
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
These commercials are weird
after seeing him as such a badass in The Unit.
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
I was merely acting!!!

This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
by Tackle Box on Jan 11, 2012 1:58 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
You're saying Dennis Haysbert has never killed a man with his bare hands?
I find that hard to believe.
Rec for lovitz
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
Watch The Unit
I’m sure he’s killed plenty with his bare hands
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:01 PM EST up reply actions
Major league
Pedro Cerrano
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Jan 11, 2012 1:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
and today, BVHeck dissapoints all of VEB.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
by RiverRat on Jan 11, 2012 1:20 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
for realz
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
i don't watch a whole lot of movies...
"That's what I'm talking about! Strike him blind, Lord!" - Berk
Running list of Molina pick-offs | twit
You should watch this one.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 12, 2012 5:04 AM EST up reply actions
Should we make it required viewing to be a VEB member?
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
"Suggested" viewing...
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 12, 2012 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
Jose: Chicken bone take the curse off the bat and bring me hits.
Bobby: You a God damn witch? Jose: Yes, a switch-hitting witch. Very common in Puerto Rico. Bobby: Will that work for me? Jose: If you believe in Voodoo. Bobby: I’m 0 for 16! Give me some of that sh*t. Jose: No, that is not belief, that is desperation.
This is right before Crash tells Nuke that strikeouts are boring and fascist, and that groundballs are more democratic.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
Need hats for bats!
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:02 PM EST up reply actions
The difference
A slider is a deceptive pitch that is designed to look like a (slower) fastball but that breaks (or really appears to break) right when the hitter decides to swing at it. Sliders usually break down and away, but some just break down. The direction of break is referred to as “tilt”.
A curveball is more of a hit-it-if-you-can pitch that is thrown, usually in the high to mid 70s, that is effective due to its movement (the more vertical the break the better because it’s harder for the brain to process vertical movement). Great curveballs come in looking like a ball up and then the bottom falls out of them and they drop into the strike zone.
A slurve is something in-between. It’s thrown too slow to be deceptive (it doesn’t look like a fastball) but it doesn’t break enough, or sharply enough, to work as a hit-it-if-you-can pitch.
Boog would have made that play.
Thanks guys
clears up some confusion, and i know get what a ‘slurve’ is.
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
A slider breaks horizontally in the oppositve direction to what you (well, what I, at least) would probably expect
like the “drift” that finger spinners get in cricket through the air (if you’re into cricket at all). A changeup generally breaks the other way, if it moves laterally at all, for reasons I can’t fathom.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:06 PM EST up reply actions
I too wonder sometimes where the line is drawn between a slider and a curve
Brad Lidge’s wipeout slider, for instance, has always looked (break-wise) just like a reasonably fast curveball to me.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:07 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think so.
A screwball (screwgie) will break the opposite way, a slider will break the way you would expect, in the same direction as curve. Hardly anyone throws a screwball anymore, though. I understand that it’s pretty hard on arm.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, it's easier to just run a two seam fastball inside than to throw an actual screwball.
The Reds had a reliever a couple of years ago who threw some kind of screwgy, and Dice-K has one as well.
The last guy with a screwball type pitch that I can remember being successful for a good deal of time with it was Kevin Appier with his “thing”.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Daniel Herrera
Made it to the big leagues for that screwball despite throwing 83.
Not afraid to nitpick
That's who I was think of. Thanks.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
This is wrong
You’re thinking of a screwball, not a slider. A slider breaks in the same direction as a curveball, but with later, sharper break and is thrown much harder than the standard curveball.
For a good demonstration of the difference, go watch Brad Lidge’s slider from back in ‘05 and ’06 (best slider I’ve ever seen) with Bert Blyleven’s curveball, regarded as the best curveball of all time by many.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
No, I know which way a slider breaks
and a curve ball. It is the opposite way I would expect. This is a cricket thing. It’s because an off-break breaks the other way (when it hits the ground) in cricket, and is thrown with a similar spin to a slider. You’re basically cutting your fingers down the right-hand side of the ball, and I’d intuitively expect that (before I started getting into baseball) to make the ball break right, not left.
FYI http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Off-break
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 12, 2012 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
Except that both physics and thermodynamics
would indicate that it would break the way that it actually does. When a slider or curveball hits the dirt, it usually bounces in the manner in which you describe the cricket ball bouncing. But this has nothing to do with the break of the pitch in the air, which is what is being referenced here.
I think your intuitive thought here is a bit at odds with conventional wisdom, cricket or not.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I think your intuitive thought here is a bit at odds with conventional wisdom, cricket or not.
I’m not arguing that it isn’t.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 12, 2012 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
I thought Koufax's
curve was regarded as the best ever….
Ahhh, the joy of trading Colby Rasmus for a World Series. I'll take that every year please.
This is why I love baseball video games, I know all kinds of crazy pitches
i.e. Forkball, and that’s actually the only one I can think of right now, but there are others.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
knucklecurve
screwball
circle change
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
Excellent work, Baron.
I love these.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 12:06 PM EST reply actions
Hunter Virant is a fantastic name, Baron
I think it would also work as a Mega Man X boss or a Metal Gear Solid boss. According to my extensive Google internet research, Virant probably comes from a Slovenian word that has to do with a plant called “wall rue”. So, “Hunter Virant” would be a plant-based boss of some kind.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
by mattybobo on Jan 11, 2012 12:09 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Looking at Fried's delivery
it looks like he gets pretty low on the pitch, like he bends his legs more than most other pitchers, then pops up a little after the pitch is thrown, so he looks a bit herky-jerky.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 12:18 PM EST reply actions
I'm by no means a mechanics expert
But Fried looks a LOT like Cliff Lee to me
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
was this necessary?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
Cliff Lee
Is a very distinctive pitcher.
He’s a stay-tall, step over the wall, short striding, high arm slot guy.
While Fried doesn’t look terrible at a glance, he’s the opposite of Cliff Lee in several ways.
Boog would have made that play.
If you had said that originally, without the snark
It would have served you better
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 11, 2012 3:22 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Should I look forward to this comment being made liberally to posts by all members?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
i was kind of thinking the same thing....
what is veb if not a bunch of baseball with occasional snark?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Isn't it in the guidelines?
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
I was of the understanding
that it was a bunch of snark with occasional baseball.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Wait this isn't footykicks? Crap, I've been misdirected again.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
I usually try to call out snark
Cause I find it silly and deconstructive…I really didn’t even realize it was TPG until I had started to reply
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 11, 2012 6:49 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
19 groundball outs to 10 airball (flyball) outs
Usually used as a ratio instead of GB/FB ratio for minor league pitchers (as it’s more readily available, as far as I can tell).
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions
Not sure to be honest
I imagine LDs are probably portioned into either, but presumably overwhelmingly into the AO column.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:49 PM EST up reply actions
that was the explaination that I got (that it included line outs)
since “air out” covers any out made where the ball is caught before it hits the ground.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
I thought it was interesting that TPG was responding to rui
Next time rui responds with “wat” or that face that shows he’s unimpressed, maybe we’ll see you call it out again.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
wat face?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions
I thought that look was like the glazed eyes look meaning he's stupefied by what was said
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:19 PM EST up reply actions
o_o
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
ahahahaha
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but isn't there one that's more intricate?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
Not from me. Just that one and "wat"
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
-_-
Heh, it’s Asian
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
I use this one frequently, Asian crying face T__T
Alternatively, you can also put more than one T to make it appear you have more than one stream of tears, such as this TT__TT
P.S. I use these for sarcastic purposes.
/emoticonlecture
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:42 PM EST up reply actions
emotenclature?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
Might be thinking of the "look of disapproval"?
ಠ_ಠ
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Haha that one is awesome
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Some VEBer has been using it lately but I can't remember who it is.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I feel like it's a clank thing
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
I 'unno. He's on Twitter
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
And also Mr. Saturn
I figure I have pretty much set alight the DanUp signal, now.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I thought it was funny, personally
but I could see that. I think that when it’s not a known “funny guy” around here, things are taken much more seriously and (in this case) out of context.
However, thepainguy could just be being an ass, but I didn’t think so.
Pretty much...
I guess aesthetically it’s sort of Cliff Lee with the backstep and all, but his actual throwing mechanics aren’t much like Lee’s at all.
Not afraid to nitpick
I actually meant Hunter Virant
But now I don’t see it anymore
So
Here we are
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
by mysterui on Jan 11, 2012 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He appears to be overstriding
If so, his herky-jerkiness would be easy enough to correct.
by DeWitt4Torty on Jan 11, 2012 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
I like Fried's mechanics/motion better than Virant's.
Fried looks like he’s overstriding just a tad. Bet he lets quite a few get away high and outside to RH hitters.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
I dunno...
…after watching Fried and Smoral a few times it seems to me that Fried is a bit moore fluid in his delivery, and strides moore aggressively into his delivery. Smoral doesn’t raise his hands up high enough, IMO, and seems moore ‘slingy’ to me, although it may just be the camera angle. And I gotsta say, I loves me a good, nasty Uncle Charlie, see Carpenter, Chris and Wainwright, Adam. The fact that he’s a lefty, and will hopefuly ‘fill out’ and maybe add a couple of MPH to his fastball means that if I had the chance to draft him, even though he moost likely won’t be there when the Cards pick, I’d pick him over Smoral, though not by a whole lot. Virant seems to have an extra torso-twisty torc in his delivery, as well as a bit moore tuck when he brings his legs up, stuff I am willing to be will be ‘coached out’ of him in the minors. He seems a bit moore raw to me than the udder two, but also promising – but he’d be my third choice, just going off the 3 videos. Frankly, I’d be happy the Cards get any of them, I would LOVE to see us have two good, solid lefty starters by, say, 2014 in the rotation, assuming Jamie stays on his path. Where is our next John Tudor??
:=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
Nice work Mr. RB.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
All three have potential major league names!
Older than any three of you.
by Remember Kenny B on Jan 11, 2012 12:22 PM EST reply actions
Especially if you pronounce Fried
like fried chicken. “Super Cardinal rookie Max Fried fried the Cubs today, taking a perfect game into the ninth, before Rafael Soriano beat out a bunt to ruin the perfecto and the no-no. What a class act that Soriano is…”
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
Please pass the virant fried smorals, mom
Ad Maiorem Tortius Gloriam
by peppermartin on Jan 11, 2012 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
Wild Horse of the Osage!
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
Rafael Soriano is hitting for the cubs in the future?
Theo really fucked that one up
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 11, 2012 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
He's gonna hurt his arm and become the older, anti-Ankiel
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:44 PM EST up reply actions
Oooops, not anti
Well, kind of, but mostly not
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:45 PM EST up reply actions
off topic
but you have the current weirdest avatar
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 8:46 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah that's fair
Not really relevant anymore, though I guess I could just change LaRussa’s face to Mo’s and it’d still work.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:49 PM EST up reply actions
Wholly kow!
Can’t believe I effed that up. Alfonso, uv coarse!
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
This is from a few weeks ago
But everyone should read this Poz piece on FC Lane, who might have invented wOBA 100 years ago (he was obviously inspired by the Fangraphs piece)
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
This is pretty cool so far
I’m about halfway through it… I just got to the end of the part about his second article about batting average, with the “four punches” thing.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
this is incredibly.
i smiled wide when i saw lane’s calculations for how much each hit is worth in terms of runs.
the guy lived until 1984. i wonder if, at that time, he was still following baseball and whether or not he knew it had been shown that his methodology had been almost exactly correct.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
He was Bill James before Bill James was cool.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Hipster Bill James.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
C.J. Wilson preferred F.C. Lane's metrics and research to Bill James'
Before Posnanski wrote an article on it and made it cool
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 8:51 PM EST up reply actions
Very cool article.
My favorite part is when he talks about how easy it is these days to find a list of the longest hitting streaks since 2000, and then says: “That list would have taken F.C. Lane or Ernie Lanigan or John J. Ward or John Lawres or any of the other early writers who loved this kind of stuff months, perhaps even years, to compile. It would have taken Bill James, in his early years of clipping out box scores from The Sporting News, an astonishingly long time, too. But they STILL did it, because there have always been those people who want to get at the heart of baseball, get beyond the clichés and the opinions and the things that SOUND right, and to something resembling truth.”
NO WAY!!!?!?!?!
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Irrelevant.
Since Jason Motte is still under team control and Ryan Madson was a free agent.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
Well, sort of relevant.
It’s relevant because it’s indicative of how silly it is to spend that kind of money on relievers when cost-controlled quality relievers are relatively abundant.
Abundant =/= available
It is probably fair to say that Madson was by far the best available free agent reliever on the market, wouldn’t you agree?
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 2:48 PM EST up reply actions
Do you mean "left on the market" or "available via free agency this offeason?"
Because Papelbon is a better pitcher.
That being said, I think comparing Madson to Motte is relevant since the Cardinals would be signing Madson to displace Motte as the closer.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
That's fair.
I mean, if he’s a 2-WAR player this year, and there were not any other ways for the Reds to improve their roster by that amount or with less money, then they spent their money well. Fine with that; viewed up close this was an okay thing for them to do.
But from 10,000 feet, I’m looking at a team with a ~$80M payroll that just spent 10% of it on a reliever. And that’s just bad roster construction. The comparison to Motte, then, is apt because it amplifies the roster construction issue.
Case in point: Jocketty traded away how many cost-controlled fringy starters this year instead of putting them in the bullpen?
by Pegasus on Jan 11, 2012 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Good analysis
Good roster planning means never having to say you’re sorry. . . or spend $8M on a reliever.
Poor roster planning sometimes means that spending $8M on a reliever is the best move you can make, or at least a defensible one. (And signing Madson may or may not be the best available move for the Reds roster for the money – there’s not a whole lot of talent left – but it is certainly defensible.)
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
I think it does a pretty good job
I would guess that Kmbrel is worth about Buerhle or Gio Gonzalez.
Also, A) Who is David Holland and B) Why have I not heard of him until now? 11.50 K/9 for the Royals last year, worth 2.0 WAR.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
agreed
but we’ve had that conversation many times- isn’t the consensus that if it does, it’s pretty minor?
mumble mumble Peter Bourjos mumble mumble
See, I think it undervalues consistently good relievers
But overvalues relievers in general. It doesn’t do me much good to know that a reliever was worth 4 WAR last year if he’s worth 0 WAR the next year. And considering that relief pitchers (specifically middle relief pitchers) seem to appear and disappear frequently from year to year, I think it makes it tough to evaluate how “valuable” they actually are.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I still think Homer Bailey ends up in the bullpen at some point
And becomes a closer.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Yeah they got rid of Boxberger...
in the Latos trade. The Reds had high ceiling guys lined up to be their ace – Cueto, Volquez, Bailey, Chapman – and it hasn’t worked out. So they traded for what couldn’t be acquired on the FA market and signed a legit closer to a one year deal. This seems reasonable to me. Personally, I would’ve trade Votto for the pieces the Reds lacked and put Alonso at first, but once they decided to “go for it” they made all the right moves to support that strategy.
Sign Roy O
i pretty much agree with this analysis.
i’m sceptical that they’ve done enough to win the central, but i think they’ve done what they have well.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
If they can get 130 games out of Rolen
they’ll be in good shape offensively. I think Stubbs is better than he showed in ‘11 and will be closer to his 2010 self next year, and Devin Mesoraco will give them a ton of pop from behind the dish. I also think that Todd Frazier is going to get 400 PA’s as a utility guy spotting SS, 3B, and LF and will hit 10-15 homers while doing it. A lot like what Allen Craig did for us last year.
I still think they need one more starting arm. But if Cueto and Latos can solidify the top of the rotation and Arroyo can take every turn and not completely stink (remains to be seen) it’s not a terrible thing to have Bailey, Leake, Chapman and Brackman to throw at those last two spots in the rotation. I’d rather have those guys for $2M combined than Lohse and Wesbrook for $18M more, if you know what I mean.
Their bullpen should be solid: They’ve added Marshall and Madson this offseason, and Arredondo, Masset, Ondrusek and LeCure are solid. Aroldis Chapman remains the wild-card.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I think they'll give up on arroyo before he's made 20 starts
the guy just cannot pitch anymore. In that bandbox an increasingly flyball-heavy control pitcher who doesn’t strike anyone out with an 84mph fastball is just going to get destroyed.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:16 PM EST up reply actions
agreed
they should have let milwaukee sign him to 4/40 three years ago
and we won the world series.
by YesWeOquendo on Jan 11, 2012 7:55 PM EST up reply actions
I also think that Todd Frazier is going to get 400 PA’s as a utility guy spotting SS, 3B, and LF and will hit 10-15 homers while doing it. A lot like what Allen Craig did for us last year.
Well I bet Todd Frazier doesn’t have an awesome, magical pet turtle.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 9:09 PM EST up reply actions
At least we hope not anyway.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Is Drew Stubbs related in some way to
Stubby Clapp? Or Franklin Stubbs? Please answer in the affirmative.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
Yes
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 6:14 AM EST up reply actions
I can see the rationale for it, yes.
But I agree with the Votto strategy, as he would have brought back much more in trade. But perhaps they shopped him and found that they couldn’t get back two good pieces and decided to make a two year run by trading Alonso instead.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I kind of think they're screwed after this year...
they’ll subtract Phillips, Rolen, Marshall, and Madson ($31M) but then Votto, Cueto, Bruce, Masset, Stubbs, Heisey, Bailey, Leake and Latos all get raises totaling $25-30M. And it’s not even clear that the owner can keep the payroll at $90M, where it is after the Madson signing. Keep in mind a year ago, Jocketty had to extend Arroyo just to free up a few million to pay arbitration raises. And now, after a crappy season with bad attendance, they blow past their previous payroll cap by $9M to sign a reliever? Does not compute.
I suppose Frazier, Juan Francisco, Chapman, and Masset will replace Phillips, Rolen, Marshall, and Madson. This is a huge step back. To make up for it some combination of Mesoraco, Bailey, Leake, Stubbs, and Heisey will have to become core guys. I don’t really like the odds of that happening.
Sign Roy O
I don't disagree with this,
but they also have a lot of guys in the low minors that will get playing time at AA and AAA this season, so they could have some legit prospects on the way to fill some of those gaps after next season. I don’t think it’s a stretch to say that Rolen will sign a lower than market deal to stay there and finish his career should he have a good season in 2012 — he already did it once. Phillips is the big loss, but Frazier can play 2B (although not as well) and he’s got a stick that’s pretty similar to Phillips in all reality. Marshall and Madson aren’t huge losses, imo, and will bring back draft compensation.
The big mistake that Jocketty might make would be to trade multiple young assets to “go for it” if they’re in the hunt in July, thereby setting the franchise back another 3-4 seasons. If their pitching staff doesn’t come together and they’re 10 games out at the deadline, I expect to see Votto, Marshall, and Madson on the block.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I think they'll be moderately solid for a couple of years to come
probably an 85-ish win team this year, and I think they’ll remain a winning team for a little bit longer. I just don’t see them ever becoming a juggernaut in the near future. Once more, I think Milwaukee might be marginally our most dangerous opponent.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
This
Because I think Gamel/Ramirez will just about equal the value of Fielder/McGeehee next year. And Corey Hart is in a contract year as well.
If I’m Milwaukee though, I’d be concerned about starting pitching. They are two DL stints away from 20 starts from sub-replacement level pitchers.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I'm kind of high on Michael Fiers
As solid rotation depth. But yeah, the Brewers got very lucky on that front in 2011, and it’s got to be a concern in 2012, especially with the way Marcum finished the season.
by Cheeseandcorn on Jan 12, 2012 11:09 AM EST up reply actions
Oh man,
I think there is a reasonable chance that we might be in on Philips when the time comes
by RasmustheRipper on Jan 11, 2012 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
no, but he wouldn't replace motte
maybe he would replace him as closer, but madson is better than the last guy in the pen, so it would reason that the pen would improve. the price is still high, though, i agree.
I'm pretty confident that #1 on Mo's mid-season shopping list will be a closer.
Sign somebody.
by EinFesteBusch on Jan 11, 2012 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
no confidence in motte?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
is there a reason?
i mean, he was awesome last year
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
And I suspect that the Plans B, C, D, and E
will all be internal options, given the Cardinals’ plethora of useful bullpenners, also just like last year (i.e. Sanchez, Salas, Motte).
I strongly suspect that the Birds will not trade for a closer next season.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 5:28 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, excellent point.
if motte fails, there are two or three others who can step in
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
hmmm so what happens first?
cards trade for a closer
or shelby miller wins the role?
and we won the world series.
by YesWeOquendo on Jan 11, 2012 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
Lance Lynn.
He’ll be the closer by the end of the year.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 7:58 PM EST up reply actions
Curious as to why
you think he will displace Motte? Or you think we might trade him?
Al: You know what they call a butterfly without wings Dan?
Dan: ...What, Al?
Al: A Butter-walk!
Dan:..........
by liars&thieves on Jan 11, 2012 8:41 PM EST up reply actions
I could see this happening
but then again, I could also see Motte keeping the role on lockdown. unless you think Motte is about to get injured.
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 8:43 PM EST up reply actions
that would be stupid
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
Also, Motte's arbitration eligible
so probably gets $1.5-2m or so.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:13 PM EST up reply actions
Nice move for the Reds.
No downside other than the owner coughs up more money this year for payroll.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
I wonder if the owner will take that out of future payroll...
he was pretty adamant about sticking to a lower payroll.
Sign Roy O
This makes me wonder what Oswalt and Ross are seeking in salary.
It seems that the Reds could use $8.5MM in LF or the rotation more than in the 9th inning.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I think they're fine in LF.
Heisey had a .343 wOBA last year, and that is projected to go up by Bill James and Rotochamp. Madson is a much better pickup than Ross, IMO.
As for Oswalt, don’t know that he’s ready to sign for the money that Madson got. Plus, there was more “room” and a “defined role” waiting in the Reds bullpen. The rotation looks set with Latos, Cueto, Leake, Bailey, and Arroyo. Arroyo is awful but we’ve got the same problem with Westbrook and it’s why we’re not a real player for Oswalt either.
The Reds bullpen is pretty dang good now – Marshall and Madson are both very good.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 5:15 PM EST up reply actions
Projectability
I always laugh when people talk about projectability, especially when talking about a kid who’s 6’8" and 225. I’m not sure how much bigger he could get.
One of the best pitchers ever, Greg Maddux, came up throwing 93 but made his living around 90.
Too often, when you try to get a little extra out of a pitcher (e.g. Kopp and Lynn) you end up screwing something up. Maybe they can end up a reliever, but you have to make compromises to get them above their natural velocity.
Most guys who get drafted are physically mature, and they are who they are.
Boog would have made that play.
I also think a lot of people get caught up in projecting players to get better, faster, etc when it's unrealistic.
However, these are all high school lefties, and velocity doesn’t usually peak until the early twenties.
Also, velocity reports are generally exaggerated so I usually automatically discount the reports to the lowest reported velocity without further evidence.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
Rates of Maturation
Most high school pitchers are early maturers, which is why they are so good, and get drafted, in high school. By and large, that means that their growing is usually done. As a result, and barring a huge mechanical inefficiency, they are unlikely to dramatically increase their natural peak velocity.
Of course, it’s possible to teach someone to throw beyond their peak velocity, but that is usually done via tricks that overload the shoulder and/or the elbow (e.g. the various inverted arm actions).
IMO, that’s what happened to both Lynn and Kopp, both of whose mechanics I loved when they were drafted and who started to have injury problems shortly after increases in their velocity.
Boog would have made that play.
At the risk of continuing a dangerous line of discussion,
because most of the common pitching injuries are overuse injuries, an injury shortly after a velocity increase is correlation without causation: Consider the number of injuries that came after a velocity decrease- Kazmir, Capuano, Vasquez, Sanchez, etc.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
this is dangerous?
anyway, i always thought a decrease and then a serious injury was more an indication that the injury was present earlier, which caused the decrease, and then more or less blew up. it’s always hard to say in hindsight if it was caused by mechanics, bad luck, or just something else, though.
That's exactly right: The injury causes the decrease.
The cause of the injury is tough to pinpoint and especially to speak to broadly, and talking about injured players in hindsight is always a recipe for exaggeration.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
another interesting thing
is when one injury ‘causes’ another. for example, a bad plant leg might cause a pitcher to compensate by throwing more with his arm. the ugly details of that don’t need to be spelled out.
the projectability wasn't about his size obviously
it’s that one could expect him to gain velocity as he matures (he is only a high schooler after all, not a college senior) considering how large he is and that he is only sitting in the low 90s right now. i don’t think the baron meant anything more complex than that about smoral.
i always laugh when people use maddux as a comp for pretty much anything considering that not only is he one of the best pitchers ever, but that very few great pitchers threw as slow as he did. he was a freak of nature with his control, movement, and intelligence. it’s not fair to anyone to be compared with maddux.
i don’t necessarily agree with your point about screwing up pitchers. the question boils down to whether or not a pitcher actually has reached his ‘natural velocity’ or not. it’s not viable to increase velocity while losing control, but some pitchers can bulk up and not lose velocity. like you said, it happens more often with relievers, but it can happen with starters as well. it depends on like on the particular pitcher’s profile i believe.
If he's that big as a high-schooler...
…then he’s probably just an early maturer.
People mature at different rates.
Some people are fully grown by 16 whereas others are still growing at 26.
In my case, I got tall early. However, I didn’t get my shoulders until I was 26 or so (which sucked because I had to buy all new suits).
Differential rates of maturation also explain why the 1st grade stud often still isn’t the stud in 9th grade.
Boog would have made that play.
i don't disagree with that
but he has room on his frame to add bulk, as baron said. his height ‘is what it is,’ but in the video you can see that he has room to grow out, which could add velocity. maybe i wasn’t clear before, but my maturing what i meant was adding bulk to his frame. considering that he is only a teenager and hasn’t been in his current frame too long i would suppose, you can easily imagine that he could throw harder if he bulks up. so yes, i would still say he is quite projectable.
Bur what is that bulk supposed to contrubute
You don’t throw the ball with your biceps or triceps, for example.
You throw the ball with your hips and your core.
Boog would have made that play.
Added size and strength DO help hitters
Which is why people take steroids and why they get better when they take them.
However, it’s arguable how, exactly, steroids are supposed to help pitchers (aside from improving healing and recovery time).
Boog would have made that play.
that aside is a pretty big deal, i think,
considering how often pitchers get hurt and how many of them took or were associated with steroids.
so add bulk to your hips and core?
seems straightforward. you could add to the arms with less effect, as you mentioned, but it wouldn’t be a bad idea as long as he retains flexibility.
You're not suggesting that adding flexibility and core strength
through training does nothing for increasing velocity are you? It may not help as much as a lot of people think, but I think it’s silly to state that it does nothing.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Especially when you imagine just a 2-3% increase in strength/efficiency
is going to mean a pitcher going from low-90s to mid-90s comfort with their fastball.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
See, this doesn't hold any water without some evidence:
If he’s that big as a high-schooler…then he’s probably just an early maturer.
How do you know that? There are numerous kids who are 6’8" tall as a junior in high school and end up close to 7’ tall as college freshman. It’s not unheard of. Secondly, it’s clear from the video that none of these guys have great mechanics or have been enrolled in a professional level strength and conditioning program. Adding strength to the legs and core while improving timing mechanics can unlock significant amounts of velocity.
I think you’re making a lot of noise but not really saying anything substantial, and that’s coming from someone who defends you a lot on this board.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Lets go over some names...
…of guys who picked up significant velocity after being drafted.
Strasburg doesn’t really fit the mold because he had to drop pounds rather than gaining pounds and filling out (which is what people are talking about when they talk about projecting pitchers).
Boog would have made that play.
cherrypick names if you want
but you haven’t actually responded to fourstick’s point, which is valid. the idea that he is a tall high schooler who, with better conditioning and training, could add some speed to his pitches is completely reasonable. will it surely happen? no, of course not. but that’s the idea behind calling him projectable. i fail to see how this argument is overly complicated or clearly wrong.
Where's the historical evidence?
What I see is an assumption that people are just accepting (despite at least some evidence to the contrary).
I thought the whole point of Moneyball was to challenge assumptions?
At least, that’s how I read it.
The idea of projectability isn’t a huge thing, just one of those old school scouting ideas that might be better left abandoned.
Boog would have made that play.
What I see is an assumption that people are just accepting (despite at least some evidence to the contrary).
This is the least self-aware post ever made in the history of VEB.
Also, I’m relatively certain that you were the one who made a general declaration first. I don’t really care who is right but you started the sub thread with the premise that players aren’t projectable (or, at a minimum, they won’t pick up velocity — parse the semantics as you wish).
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
Is that always the case?
People often thin out after growing a few inches.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 5:00 PM EST up reply actions
I'll gladly debate you when you provide some evidence of your original assertion.
As yet, you’ve not done that. I’ll wait, patiently, for you do so.
I’m not falling for the trick where I now have to prove a negative and you get to shit all over everything I post. You do this frequently: Make an assertion without any evidence and then beg off those who disagree by making THEM prove that you’re wrong.
That’s no way to have a civil debate about a topic. If you have evidence to back up what you say, then demonstrate so. Otherwise, maybe it’s best you say nothing.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Dude, for the one thousandth time:
ONE GUY IS NOT STATISTICAL EVIDENCE OF AN OVERALL TREND. Especially when that one guy also happens to be one of the elite pitchers in the history of the game.
Again, Andres Torres is not “proof” that changing batting mechanics alone can make you a major league hitter, and Greg Maddux not throwing harder at age 22 than at age 18 is not “proof” that high school draftee pitchers don’t pick up velocity after they are drafted.
It seems you need a cursory knowledge of what would be necessary to prove causation statistically with evidence. You seem to think that anecdotal evidence of ONE PLAYER is it. It’s not. And it won’t ever be.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Last I checked, one = some
It’s not a big thing.
I’m just not a fan of assumptions and this seems like a big one.
I can’t figure out how to track this easily.
Boog would have made that play.
I don't know what is being "assumed" here.
There’s plenty of evidence that pitchers can add velocity after high school. I don’t think anyone is assuming this WILL happen, just that it CAN happen, and has happened to quite a few pitchers over the years.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
So, you want him to give you a lengthy list of every single "Projectable" high-schooler who never gained velocity as a professional?
That seems an unreasonable length to go to in order to have to prove his point.
This seems more like a difference of opinion than an argument. I don’t think anyone is going to “prove” anything one way or the other with a list of anecdotes.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:24 PM EST up reply actions
Well sure,
except that I have tons of proof as to my point. He’s not exhibited any to this point outside of a one-off comment about Greg Maddux. And the burden of proof is on him because he’s the one that made the original comment.
I’m not asking for lists and lists of players. I’m asking for some evidence as to why he feels this way. He’s provide NONE. So why am I the one being unreasonable? I’m simply asking him to prove that his assumption is more than just mere conjecture and opinion.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Really? You don't know of people who have picked up significant velocity after HS?
But despite a low-90s fastball and increasingly good control, Justin Verlander failed to attract serious attention from big league scouts. With no contract in the offing, he decided to play college ball. He only throws 101 now.
We were all bigger than [Tim Lincecum] in high school," says Webster, a former high school teammate, "but nobody could throw like him. He went from throwing in the low 80s his junior year to the low 90s He’d go on to top out at 99.
David Price: MOST FB 89-91 ALL NIGHT. Make that 92-98
[Brandon Morrow] was in the upper 80s in high school, and then the low 90s as a freshman. Make that 92-99.
Forsaking economy for power and balance for speed, Scherzer “touched 90.” Make that 91-98.
Aaron Crow topped out at 89-90 his freshman year at Mizzou and was hitting 96 the next year.
How many more examples would you like?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jan 11, 2012 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
oh, please, keep going.
i like a well-cited evisceration.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Sure why not
Daniel Hudson 89-93 as a college junior. 90-96 as a MLBer.
Garza 90-94 as a college junior.
Michael Pineda 88-93 as recently as 2009
Ubaldo Jimenez was 93-95 and his FB actually declined to 88-93 before he stepped up to elite velo.
Jordan Zimmerman “sat 91-92 touched 94” Now sits 92-95 touching 96.
That fastball traveled in the low 80 mph range, which most certainly would have doomed him to life in baseball’s slow lane had he not had the good fortune to be invited to Wallace State Community College, which bills itself as “a power in the Alabama Community College Conference.”…..Both preached the importance of challenging hitters. Almost overnight, the pitcher’s velocity rose to a more respectable 90 mph.Now 92-97.
That’s documented significant velocity increases on 10 of the 15 hardest throwing starters in the big leagues last year + Lincecum + Crow who is throwing 8-9 mph harder than he did in HS. Oh and Strasburg who throws harder than anyone.
Ogando wasn’t even a pitcher when he was 18 so I’m doubting he threw 98. Edwin Jackson was a 6th rounder so I doubt he was hitting 98 then. That would be 12/15, but I’ll only take credit for the documented 10.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jan 11, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Nice work
I had a bunch of links to throw out there as well, but didn’t want this conversation to turn into TPG picking apart my argument instead of the other way around.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Well I mean this one is just ridiculous
Virtually every 18 year old adds at least a mph or two, and there’s just a comical number of pitchers who add 5-6+—-at least among the group that aren’t already hitting 97+. Even then, the HSer sitting 90-93 touching 97 (which is to say: a 1st rounder) fills out and is then able to sit 92-94 touching 97 (Kershaw comes to mind).
The assertion that velocity peaks at 18 years old is……..wow.
Not afraid to nitpick
I agree, it's a really bad assertion
Thing is, I’ve learned on this blog that throwing out a ton of contrary evidence usually ends up with the other person attacking your argument, rather than you attacking the blanket assumption that they just made without providing in evidence to back it up.
So I usually wait, and it usually saves me a shitload of time posting links, because they generally don’t have a pot to piss in in terms of facts to back up their assertions.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
prince fielder will suck because he's fat, and his dad was fat and he sucked at one point too!
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and Dave Parker sucked late in his career because he was fat!
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Do you have some proof of this besides the snarky subjective opinions and comparisons to one of the best pitchers of the last 50 years?
I mean, demonstrate that 18 year old kids that throw in the low-90’s don’t, in fact, improve to 94-95 on average when they hit age 20-22. Because I can name numerous pitchers (Stephen Strasburg being one) who were throwing around 90-93 and then jumped to 95+ when they filled out a bit more.
All the pitchers listed above are still lanky and haven’t filled out their bodies yet, specifically core and leg strength, which can (and does) improve velocity. So I see no reason to suspect that they might not pick up 2-3 mph more on their fastball when they begin training professionally (i.e. like it’s their job) and getting into a professional throwing program.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I wonder if Fried and Virant feel as goofy as they look pitching in those pajama pants.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
If we're talking mechanics, I've gotta say I most prefer Smoral.
Fried looks like he’s tightening up late and is pretty max-effort. He also does some weird stuff- look at the pitch he starts at 1:17. Pretty inconsistent.
Virant gets really low and looks like he might be getting under the ball. We can’t see the end points but I swore a few times watching him that we would hear the ball hit the backstop.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
Virant gets his arm way behind his body before he starts to move forward, kind of like Jaime Garcia.
Maybe that’s why to like him so much.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
Agreed
Smoral looks pretty damn good.
As RB said though, Virant is athletic, so mechanics changes are probably going to be easier for him than either of the other two.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Well, they may be
“less athletic” but they’re not total klutzes. Why couldn’t they fix their mechanics just as well?
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 11, 2012 4:09 PM EST up reply actions
There's a line of thought
that if you aren’t a great “athlete” and basically just pitch a baseball that it’s harder to make mechanics changes because your body is conditioned and built to throw the ball a certain way.
I don’t know how much truth there is to this since there’s a lot of parking lot science out there about pitching mechanics.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I have nothing to base my opinion on, but that argument seems very dubious to me
You can sorta make the opposite case — it would go something like “athletic guys are harder to make mechanics changes with because they’re athletic enough to ‘cheat’ their mechanics, and thus frequently do.”
I don't know who's right or who's wrong on this point, honestly
It’s just something I pick up frequently when looking at scouting reports. I have no idea if there’s any truth to it at all or whether it’s just an old wives tale.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Love the look of smoral.
Just the sheer spectacle of seeing a guy powering the ball down from that height is cool, too. I wonder if he ends up near 7 feet?
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
Woohoo!
I love these posts. Thanks RB!
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 11, 2012 1:59 PM EST via mobile reply actions
speaking of past drafts...
has anyone heard anything on Austin Wilson recently and how he’s doing at Stanford? I haven’t kept up with him since he decided to choose Stanford over the Stl. Cards. How I wanted him to sign with us. I’m curious if he’ll be a draft eligible sophomore this year. I’m sure he plans to stay in school and finish his degree though, since he and his family were so enamored with him graduating from Stanford.
I'm sure the power is still there.
Having a guy like him in the lower minors would have made Pujols leaving a bit easier for me to swallow.
Maybe it is, but Stanford's also got a lousy reputation w/r/t hitters.
Good for him for going to school, but I was more excited about him as a prospect before he went.
i agree
at the risk of starting this debate again, i would have taken the chance to play Baseball.
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
damnit, that sounds abiguous
i mean, baseball-y baseball. the one with more hookers and less learning.
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
by Aranathor on Jan 11, 2012 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
so would i
you can always go back to college. he will never be valued as high as he was.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Depends on if you're valuing the college education or the college experience.
Personally, I think much of what is considered the college experience can stem from living away from your parents for the first time, not necessarily from going to college.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
i agree completely.
however, the professional baseball experience has to beat out the college experience every time, right? maybe its just me. my view on this has actually changed since i have gotten older. i think college is incredibly valuable for a lot of reasons. but so very few people are talented enough and lucky enough to even have a chance at playing professional baseball. to give that up to go to college seems akin to throwing away that opportunity.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Plus it's a rare opportunity to make 7-8 figures (I can't remember what he was being offered) in a relatively short amount of time.
There are lots of arguments both ways, but in the end I just don’t see how the opportunities to grow and learn new things that makes college special for people wouldn’t have presented themselves to Austin Jackson eventually without going straight to Stanford.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
Professional baseball experience?
The low-minors professional baseball experience sucks. You’re riding buses from one crap town to another, you have to wake up early, you can’t be getting drunk because your team is watching + you have to play well, and half the team doesn’t speak english (that’s not xenophobic that’s just a true statement affecting any potential fun). Being in rookie or A-ball would be awful.
Not afraid to nitpick
Agreed.
so very few people are talented enough and lucky enough to even have a chance at playing professional baseball.
It’s just not that uncommon, especially among guys who grew up playing for all-star Colt/Palomino teams and it means nothing to a guy like Wilson. There might a question as to whether he could sign for the same money after Stanford as he could have gotten after HS, but there’s very little doubt he’ll get his chance to play pro ball.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
You can't always go back to Stanford, though.
And there’s plenty of prospects that are as highly drafted or thought of after going to college as they are as high schoolers. Just about every year there are HS’ers who don’t sign for 1st or 2nd round money and instead go to school.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
and how many of them do you ever hear about again
i mean i honestly don’t know
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I don't have a study to present, though I wouldn't expect it to be hard to make one
Gerrit Cole come to mind. He was drafted 28th by the Yankees in 2008 out of HS, then went to UCLA and was drafted first overall last year (and made a LOT of money by college).
From last year, Tyler Beede didn’t sign to go to college. In 2010, Whitson and Covey didn’t sign to go to school. (these are 1st rounders)
And of course, there are tons of guys in lower rounds who get drafted but don’t sign and go on to play college ball.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 6:05 PM EST up reply actions
It's certainly not unheard of, but neither is the converse
especially among hitters at Stanford. The Stanford swing does not have a good rep.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 6:54 PM EST up reply actions
.311/.348/.423
5 hrs and 7 doubles
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
goold reports that beltran will make his first public appearance on monday
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
i assume he will take 15 from jay right?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
damnit
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Since my resposnse doesn't make sense...
Furcal took 15 from Jay (although it should be unofficially retired). Beltran has more service time than Furkel, though, so the number is Beltran’s if he wants it.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
i knew what you meant
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
so i wonder if he will try to get it from furcal.
beltran has technically been around longer
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
We really need to stop giving number fucking 15 to people.
That’s gonna be, what, the FOURTH guy who’s had it since Edmonds? Ridiculous.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:30 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
AGREED
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
this is honestly an interesting discussion.
do the cardinals retire #5 no matter freaking what or only if albert goes into the HOF as a cardinal?
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
my thought was that he has to go in as a cardinal to get that honor
but since the HOF picks the team, and not the player, i don’t know that its fair of the cardinals to deny that honor when it wasn’t albert’s call.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Plus the Cardinals would have to wait 5 more years after his induction to do the ceremony...
"He probably misses his old glasses."
What if he goes in as a Cardinals but says he wishes he could go in as an Angel?
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 4:16 PM EST up reply actions
then he's an asshole.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
by RiverRat on Jan 11, 2012 4:18 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
He might already be an asshole
but, you’re right, that would definitely confirm it.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
I thought it was already confirmed?
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:13 PM EST up reply actions
saw/read links earlier and seems he was a complete ass
So yes it’s pretty much confirmed … although I was unaware until then
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
i think this opinion is unmerited.
he does a great deal of good in the world through his charity, and calling him an asshole based primarily on a hypothetical future claim seems to me to be a bit silly.
i mean, can you be an asshole and help a great deal of people?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
/reply fail, thought this sub-thread was about Puckett
feeling sheepish
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:31 PM EST up reply actions
i certainly agree that people have engaged in too-casual name-calling directed at pujols in the last month.
which i understand, in part, but which i still think is a terrible idea.
but on a larger level, i absolutely believe the answer to your last question is yes. there are a lot of people who do great things in the world who are positively insufferable in person.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
after thinking about it some,
i guess what i mean is that if you’re helping a lot of people and you’re a total dick to deal with, it sort of balances out, thereby making you not an asshole but still insufferable. maybe this doesn’t really make any sense.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Yes, you can.
You don’t even have to think very hard. Just look at every single robber baron. Look how many libraries Andrew Carnegie’s name is on, then look at the kind of tactics he used against striking workers. Or Rockefeller. Terrible human being in a myriad of ways, unfair business practices and a whole slew of other things, but he also has an enormously charitable foundation named after him because he paid for it.
Just because someone cares deeply about something doesn’t mean they can’t be an awful human being in regards to virtually everything else.
I can do no wrong, for I do not know what it is.
by the red baron on Jan 12, 2012 2:54 AM EST up reply actions
i have wondered if the HOF will let him do both.
like wear a cardinals jersey and an angels hat or something. he will end up playing almost the same time for both franchises, and even though he will have better overall #s in STL, he will hit all his milestones as an angel.
has this ever happened before, where there is such a split between two teams?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
the bust only shows the hat.
And, fwiw, I think this is what people refer to when they say “go in to the Hall as a……”
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
Didn't Carter want to go in as a Met but the Hall trumped him?
by Forsch's2nohitters on Jan 11, 2012 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
yes
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
The HOF didn't make him sign the new 20-year contract with someone else.
Having your number retired is one of the highest honors a team can give to a player. A player’s signing with another team (even if it is economically reasonable) means giving up a potential legacy with the original team. It is the cost of moving on.
If Beltran wants #5, give it to him.
Play ball!
by IL and StL Fan on Jan 11, 2012 9:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
what is a higher honer that retiring your number?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 6:17 AM EST up reply actions
#5 is retired
I don’t know why this is a discussion. He’s 3rd all-time in Cardinals WAR.
Not afraid to nitpick
It may be "retired"
but I doubt it’s going up on the wall anytime soon.
Plus, if he plays out that 10 year contract, on the West Coast, in the other League….well, that’s a lot of time for people to just forget about the guy. Or to dissociate themselves from him.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
dollars tro donuts, apu isn;t a starter in 10 yrs, at dh or elswhere
TLR is gone, long live the king
but until they actually retire it, will they let people wear it?
i mean, i guess the cardinals don’t think edmonds is going into the hall then. or rolen.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I highly doubt it.
He was too much of the franchise to do that. Eventually they will. But it’ll be a long time.
Hell, I still think of Jack Clark when I see anyone wear 22.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
sure, but i mean it seems problematic to let someone wear a number of a player that has a good HOF chance
because what if the player wearing the number ends up with an HOF career? i mean i guess then you just have two names written under one number on the wall. anyway, whatever. i think edmonds should have already been unofficially retired. kind of BS that its not
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
the Cubs retired the same number (31)
for Greg Maddux and Fergie Jenkins
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:15 PM EST up reply actions
also
The Expos retired #10 for Andre Dawson and Rusty Staub
Yankees retired #8 for Bill Dickey and Yogi Berra
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:49 PM EST up reply actions
keep in mind, we're talking about the cubs here.....
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
because of the way it ended.
his number should absolutely be retired from a baseball standpoint. not really arguing that.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 4:59 PM EST up reply actions
There is no way on this earth that Albert DOESN'T end up in the HOF as a Cardinal
You might as well book it now.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:31 PM EST up reply actions
I would be extremely disappointed in the Cardinals if they didn't retire #5
As soon as he goes in the hall he should go up on the wall.
He’s still the best Cardinal since Stan. Him leaving now doesn’t change that.
Can someone please explain
or point me in the direction of something that will. How Draft-pick compensation will work henceforth? I.e. from next offseason? Is it just a simple matter of all FAs being either ‘Type A’ or ‘Not any sort of type’ and teams get picks for Type A FAs as they do now? Any ideas how this classification works? Is it different to the current system?
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
Henceforth, draft pick compensation will be determined according to an ancient rite found in the Necrolecctive Bargaining Agreemenonicon
Prior to the start of the draft, Bud Selig will declare,
“Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn!”
And the black-robed owners will sacrifice the general manager of the team who fell furthest below the luxury tax threshold by casting him into the eternal fire that burns beneath Wrigley Field. This act will serve to weaken the foundations of reality to allow an ancient and incomprehensible entity to cross the threshold into our reality. All press in attendance will instantly be driven mad by the sight of the being, and as ESPN cuts away in an effort to spare some of the human race from the madness, the being will begin to call out the arcane rules of compensation, assigning picks and draft order to the deserving teams in turn.
With its task completed, the creature’s own paradoxical existence will become clear as it casts itself into the fires below, a torment to be repeated yearly on the first day of each MLB draft. ESPN will return from commercial and the draft will proceed as scheduled.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
by hazel on Jan 11, 2012 2:47 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
it's something like the team decides
that is, the team of the soon to be free agent has to decide to make some sort of offer to the player. if they do, they’ll get compensation. if not, they won’t. i don’t remember any details beyond that and i had trouble tracking it down in less than 60 seconds on the internet. regardless, the new system is much better, imo: no arbitrary system of rankings, and now the teams have control. this helps smarter teams, which is always good.
Just read two more parts of Future Redbirds' excellent Prospects Top 20
Is there any reason we shouldn’t expect Jackson and Wong to be manning the MIF in a few years time?
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
Because Jackson might not be quite good enough.
Or he might. But I think there’s enough uncertainty about him that I wouldn’t go as far as “expect.”
I think it's more a question of whether he'll hit enough, but maybe that's what you meant.
I don’t think there’s any doubt that he was good enough defensively when we drafted him out of Miami.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I'll be surprised (pleasantly) if Jackson becomes a starting ML SS.
I’ll be surprised if Wong is not the starting 2B sometime in 2013.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
Because Jackson is a shitty hitter and Wong is a small-bodied college guy who spent the end of last year beating up on younger players in A ball, and who has defensive question marks and limited power.
/pessimism.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
oh FFS
@JonHeymanCBS #reds and #rays are in on ryan theriot, a versatile infielder with a excellent bat. #astros also have some interest
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
if by "excellent" you mean "shitty," then yes, you are correct jon heyman
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
and by "versatile" you mean "sucks everywhere, but sucks a little less at second"
then yes
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
That's versatile. He can suck anywhere.
by dmiles on Jan 11, 2012 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Even TLR knew better than to let him suck in the outfield
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:17 PM EST up reply actions
nice article / subject agreement there
#endofliteracyisnigh
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
The hashtag makes this funny.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:20 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Why do Jon Heyman tweets about Ryan Theriot read like advertisements?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
auditioning as Eriot's agent?
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Or maybe scratching the back of Theriot's agent for previously providing information?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Even thinking about Theriot in terms Heyman accepts...
Theriot stinks. He hit 271 last year with no power and no speed on the bases. He had 47 rbis and was 4 for 10 in steals.
Sign Roy O
Wait, I thought the Rays' GM was smart?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
We solved the case
"He probably misses his old glasses."
by Alxfritz on Jan 11, 2012 3:31 PM EST up reply actions 10 recs
lolzies
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
Heyman
has a post on the free agent market for the middle infielders still available. He writes this about Theriot:
Theriot, a vesatile player with a good stick, is being looked at by the Reds and Rays after hitting .271 and earning a ring with the Cardinals.
His “excellent bat” is now a “good stick.” Still misuing adjectives as Theriot’s bat is neither “excellent” nor “good.”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
well, in this case, he's referring to a branch that Theriot picked up one day while walking in Forest Park
it’s pretty good for whacking the heads off dandelions, and you can balance it on your hand (though it’s pretty hard to keep it up for more than a few seconds). It’s called Mr. Stick. He keeps it in his closet.
so did colby rasmus!
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
or the white house.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:00 PM EST up reply actions
#lazyrasmus only showed up at the White Castle
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 11, 2012 5:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The only ring ceremony Rasmus would have shown up for
is the chicken ring ceremony.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Ryan Franklin is a World Series winning closer!
Miguel Batista has a ring as a setup man. So much talent!
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
puke.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:00 PM EST up reply actions
maybe stick is a euphemism
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
But he "earned a ring"
It is what it is.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
by fourstick on Jan 11, 2012 4:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
alright!
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:40 AM EST up reply actions
Well, maybe Jon Heyman just has total, incomprehensible blind spots when it comes to evaluating certain favorite players of his.
On a completely unrelated note, does anybody know if Heyman had anything to say recently about Jack Morris and the Hall of Fame?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
i don't understand how theriot can become someone's favorite player
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
can we all pitch in a get that guy relocated to the north side of Chicago?
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
i like to think
that he already had all of the other jersesys. Or it was a bet.
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
You can even BUY a Theriot jersey?
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
subject line
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:41 PM EST up reply actions
there are plenty to choose from so you don't have to rush
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 1:17 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe theriots agent paid him off lol
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 4:25 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
so i guess rb didn't stick around after his post today.
too bad, i was looking for some fashion advice.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
wear a skinny tie.
Goes with everything.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Unless you're fat
Then you look like a Blues Brother….
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
by fourstick on Jan 11, 2012 4:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
the skinny tie can make other things look.....um....thicker
like the Blues Brothers….and other stuff.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
And boat shoes
but not loafers.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 11, 2012 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
"just wear the dress from that facebook picture"
-azruavatar
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
well since you guys know so much about fashion, i will just ask you
do you think that “boot season” ends with a particular month, or with particular weather? in other words, its january, but its like 70 degrees out. can i still get away with wearing knee-high boots?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I think knee-high boots are always good.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
very much agreed.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
depends on what would be worn under the boots, i would think, not the weather
if jeans, then knee-high boots are always appropriate as well. if you’re going with a skirt, you prolly don’t want to wear the boots.
*this opinion has not been field-tested
always skirt or dress
rarely jeans
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
huh. i'm in chicago. every woman is wearing knee-high boots and tight jeans here.
it’s like there was a law passed.
no, that is definitely a legitimate thing
i just don’t do it personally.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I don't know what the difference is
Is that like the difference between a hipster and hipster doofus?
Those aren’t exactly equivalent (unless they are).
Boog would have made that play.
um. i meant that it is a perfectly acceptable fashion trend
it is simply one that i don’t personally follow because i can’t pull it off.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
you should never wear knee high boots.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
i know. i wanted to express my opinion on knee high boots though.
this is america, after all.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:23 PM EST up reply actions
can you elaborate on your position
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
he's wrong. it's a bad opinion and he should feel sad.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Jan 11, 2012 5:28 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
i just don't like the look.
this girl who i find extremely attractive walked into class today with a dress, a nice sweater thing to go over it, and knee high boots. the boots just ruined it all for me.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:28 PM EST up reply actions
...
…
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 11, 2012 5:29 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
hmm
personally my favorite wintertime outfit is a turtleneck with a wool skirt and knee high boots.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
by IHeartBoog on Jan 11, 2012 5:29 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
even though i know little-to-nothing about you...
i will say that is a good choice.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Seems like a fashionable choice
And also incredibly warm.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
yeah this is what led to my question about months vs. temperatures
but its always freezing in my office.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I've always been someone who believes more in function that arbitrary fashion cutoff dates.
If wearing a wool skirt, knee-high boots, and a turtleneck keeps you warm at your office, then feel free to wear that outfit. I believe this is especially true in the month of January. It was about 60 degrees here in Iowa yesterday (which is crazy for the month of January) and those types of outfits were common around town.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
As someone who believes in arbitrary fashion cutoff dates
more than function, it’s seasonal and directly dependent on that day’s weather. Boots are permissible.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
how can something be both "seasonal" and directly dependant on that day's weather?
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
hmmmm
forgot a negative. I meant that it was not directly dependent on that day’s weather.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
i'm sure you look great.
just not my thing.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:45 PM EST up reply actions
this is an utterly strange thing to say.
i don’t doubt it’s true, because each individual has strange quirks of taste, but an attractive girl becomes unattractive to you when wearing boots?
…i just…
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
i won't say unattractive, just less attractive.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
Agree.
The only women who should wear them must make their living receiving 1 dollar bills.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Jan 11, 2012 6:04 PM EST up reply actions
so you are basically saying i look like a stripper
unnecessarily rude
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
All women who wear those boats look like a stripper, to me.
My opinion.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Jan 11, 2012 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
this is completely asinine.
knee-high boots != stripper
huge clear plastic high heels, maybe.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
So my personal opinion is asinine?
But if I agree with you I would be right.
You personify this site to a t.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Jan 11, 2012 6:15 PM EST up reply actions
sorry. perhaps i was a bit too strong.
what you just did is something i have very little tolerance for, and i reacted in a knee-jerk way.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
You don't need to apologize
Calling out asinine opinions is the right thing to do.
And personifying this site should be something to be proud of!
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
That's no longer a stripper and now becomes a pimp.
This life's hard, man, but it's harder if you're stupid.
- Jackie Brown
Or Disco Stu
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
by lightbulb on Jan 11, 2012 6:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
When we went to Vegas last,
one of the bouncers at a club asked my friend if she was working that night. After some confusion, he explained the clear plastic high heel rule.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
If she was wearing clear high heels,
friend should be in quotes.
And with that I will log off and get my warning / banning.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
by RiverRat on Jan 11, 2012 10:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
subjunctive fail.
you have lost the right to correct others.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
I don't care about your subjunctive.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
i don't care about you!
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
So, are you calling fang
a resident of this society?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
that is not right
he is talking about a past event that actually happened. therefore he can use “was”
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
negative.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
she was wearing boots
she were wearing boots?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
no
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 12:30 AM EST up reply actions
she used to be wearing boots
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:10 AM EST up reply actions
Key word, I believe, is "if"
which makes it subjunctive. From Wiki:
the subjunctive mood (abbreviated sjv or sbjv) is a verb mood typically used in subordinate clauses to express various states of irreality such as wish, emotion, possibility, judgment, opinion, necessity, or action that has not yet occurred.(Empahsis mine)
The word “if” makes it a possibility.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
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by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:27 AM EST up reply actions
the only time you need to use were instead of was
is if you are discussing something that is contrary to fact. if you are discussing something that is unknown, then was is proper
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
therefore this is correct
“If Mike’s mother was alive, she did not want anyone to know her whereabouts.”
and so is this:
“If Mike’s mother were alive, she would still be correcting his grammar.”
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I think whoever wrote the Wiki article would disagree.
Either one sounds okay to me.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
and not worth correcting
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
IHB nails it.
English “subjunctive”, so-called, is not actually subjunctive but irrealis.
Je n'ai fait celle-ci plus longue parceque je n'ai pas eu le loisir de la faire plus courte
that's funny because it is perfectly acceptable business attire where i come from
but whatever. i still think you probably could have just said you don’t like them without calling me a stripper
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
besides what you said,
i’ve never seen a woman wearing boats anyway. seems like that would be cumbersome footwear.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
i mean there is nothing you can say to a man that is the same as calling a woman a stripper/prostitute/whore
so i can’t even explain why it is so offensive
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
yeah, i completely understand.
i was just trying to inject some ill-advised levity into the situation.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
It's a personal attack
Couched with some passive-aggressive bullshit by saying “all women”.
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
Last reply I'll do on all this
Fang paraphrased: I don’t like boots, that’s just my opinion
You paraphrased: I don’t like because they make women look like strippers, that’s just my opinion.
There is a difference there, it’s unfortunate you can’t see that.
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
Sexist AND insulting!
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
You took my opinion.
And turned it into me calling you a whore.
I don’t pay attention to user names except yours because of your negative and insulting replies. I make a point to ignore you and will try to do better.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Jan 11, 2012 6:41 PM EST up reply actions
wat
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
O-o
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
O-o = mind boogled?
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
oh, now i get it!
IHB: can i still get away with wearing knee-high boots?
clearly indicating she has at some time in the past worn knee-high boots
F2NH: the only women who wear them should be counting one dollar bills
clearly implying that they are strippers or prostitutes
IHB: you called me a whore/stripper.
F2NH: no, i didn’t, and also you’re the worst.
i take my retraction back. you’re being asinine.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I think that everyone would be better off
not personalizing statements made by people you have NEVER met. If one of my friends flippantly said what F2NH said, we would laugh about it and move on (even the girls). It clearly wasn’t a personal attack at IHB. It may be stupid, asinine or whatever but he didn’t call IHB a whore. Some of this is because he doesn’t have the history of other posters (clearly some posters could say this and it wouldn’t be perceived this way) but some of it is because it immediately got twisted beyond the words themselves. Prostitute and whore are two words (different from stripper) that were never uttered by F2NH.
And then the VEB mob got involved.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Jan 11, 2012 8:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think that's a little glib.
The context is what matters. I don’t like neck tattoos, and wouldn’t hesitate to say I think neck tattoos look bad. and I don’t think there’s anything wrong, in the abstract, in expressing a negative opinion on neck tattoos. However, I would never say to someone who has a neck tattoo: “god, neck tattoos are stupid.”
In the abstract, there’s no problem with me thinking or saying to my friends that the supporters of politician X are stupid jerks. But if somebody says they like politician X, and I reply that everybody who likes politician X is a stupid jerk, they’ll rightly take my comment personally.
Even a generically framed comment in the right context can be a personal attack. And I don’t think most people would make those comments in face-to-face conversation.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 12, 2012 12:13 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
You whore.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
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by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
wow.
i honestly do not believe i have ever personally insulted anyone on this site, other than as an obvious joke. ever. if i have personally insulted you at some point, i guarantee it was unintentional and i apologize for that.
i told you that i wear knee high boots. you told me that you think all women who wear knee high boots look like strippers. that was offensive to me. i don’t care if it’s just your opinion or not. it is still offensive. if i came on this site and opined that all black people were stupid, that would just be my opinion, too. yet it would be incredibly offensive to almost everyone.
i can’t explain it better than that, and i don’t really think i should have to – it should be obvious. i also do not think i personally insulted you at all during this entire subthread and am actually shocked by your response above.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I think there's a difference
Between saying “all black people are stupid” and a flippant “boots make women look like strippers”. Not that he couldn’t have expressed his opinion in a less vulgar fashion, but come on.
Al: You know what they call a butterfly without wings Dan?
Dan: ...What, Al?
Al: A Butter-walk!
Dan:..........
by liars&thieves on Jan 11, 2012 9:02 PM EST up reply actions
Annnnnnnnnnnnd fin
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
-30-
mumble mumble Peter Bourjos mumble mumble
by tehzachatak on Jan 11, 2012 9:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
so, what I'm gathering from this
IHB is a high end African American stripper that uses “lawyer” as her cover.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Jan 11, 2012 11:25 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
she's trying to pay off law school as quickly as possible
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:14 AM EST up reply actions
I have no idea where this came from but I thought
you were being unfairly characterized right up until this comment.
Know when to disengage people.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
There's no good place to hide any of this thread
without decontextualizing most of it but most of this seems absurd when I read through it after the fact. Worse, it seems avoidable.
So everyone hug … not me, get the fuck away from me. I meant hug each other. Ok. There you go.
Alright, carry on. I’m going to get a beer.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
I'm hugging you the next time I see you
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
by mysterui on Jan 11, 2012 9:05 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I wanna be there to see it.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 11, 2012 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
would an asian guy hugging a robot
really seem so weird?
> tebow
by cschepers on Jan 11, 2012 10:32 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
no
but it would be so much fun to walk in with a boombox and play Mr. Roboto while they were doing it. Don’t you agree?
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 11, 2012 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 11, 2012 9:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Gigolo?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
Man whore? Man slut?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:41 AM EST up reply actions
nope
i should stay out of this subthread.
but just curious isgigra – what is the worst thing you personally can imagine being called? and this is not in relation to the above comments, it is just something i have always wondered about men.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
a dumbass, gross, virgin
or something…
It’s pretty easy to insult someone.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
you're a dumbassed, gross virgin, VEP.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 12:46 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
None of these are particularly insulting to me
mostly because I’ve been those things at one time or another.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
looks like a list of things a teenager would find insulting
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
I'm not sure how those parallel whore at all.
President of the Tyler Greene fanclub - Wikipedia Proof, Tumblr Page, and finally Baseball-reference
Twitter
by stlcardsfan4 on Jan 12, 2012 1:27 AM EST up reply actions
I think virgin does
That’s a direct parallel to whore.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:30 AM EST up reply actions
that's like the antonym of whore.
and it is in no way gender specific.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
then neither is whore
according to your logic. a man can be a whore.
look, calling a man a virgin is a much more oft used insult than calling a woman a virgin. See fang.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:33 AM EST up reply actions
I haven't heard a guy called a virgin in a derogatory way since high school.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 1:36 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
fang?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:37 AM EST up reply actions
Seen, but not heard.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 12, 2012 5:15 AM EST up reply actions
Ok whatever.
I’m not even sure most of the male race would be offended by being called a virgin.
1) There are some guys that are virgins because they want to wait
2) There are some guys who aren’t virgins therefore laugh at that man’s childlike insult.
I mean whore is an insult to almost every woman. Virgin should not be an insult… at all.
President of the Tyler Greene fanclub - Wikipedia Proof, Tumblr Page, and finally Baseball-reference
Twitter
by stlcardsfan4 on Jan 12, 2012 1:35 AM EST up reply actions
Uh
1) Few guys are virgins because they want to wait. At least in America.
2) There are some girls who aren’t whores that laugh at that woman’s childish insult.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:36 AM EST up reply actions
I honestly can't believe I'm even having this conversation.
I’m just going to stop now. We clearly aren’t going anywhere and I just flat out disagree with almost everything you’re saying.
President of the Tyler Greene fanclub - Wikipedia Proof, Tumblr Page, and finally Baseball-reference
Twitter
by stlcardsfan4 on Jan 12, 2012 1:38 AM EST up reply actions
Great
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:39 AM EST up reply actions
you're vastly simplifying this
to the point of absurdity.
see you later, veb.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I think you'll come to find out -
or maybe you won’t – that “whore” and “slut” are the kind of slurs that are difficult for most younger women to laugh off. And once a reputation is established, whether based in fact or not, it can be difficult to shake. Since you are in college, I’d recommend taking a women’s studies class. Gender politics are interesting.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 1:40 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
I agree that kids often have self esteem issues
And I also agree that those issues are more often found in woman because society is still generally sexist.
I’m just saying that there are things that are only insults to men, and men deal with similar attacks on their self image, although not to the same degree as woman.
Strength is another one. No one is going to insult a woman by calling her weak (physically). Plenty of times someone is going to insult a guy by calling him a weakling. Same with height.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:44 AM EST up reply actions
I agree that there are insults that are
more damaging to men.
Anyway, I like my insults to be super personal and not limited to just gender. Gotta really size a person up, figure out their motivations and then cut them down. It’s a lost art.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 1:51 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
remind me not to actually piss you off..
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:53 AM EST up reply actions
I'd like to see
you and one of my brothers throwdown sometime. Dude’s a fucking razor blade. I can be, just actively don’t do it anymore.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:25 AM EST up reply actions
More like perpendicular to whore, really.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 12, 2012 5:15 AM EST up reply actions
there isn't a specific word you could call
me that would significantly hurt my feelings. attacking my self worth, implying i am not worthy of meaningful relationships, insulting my family, attacking my intelligence…
i think “worthless” is probably the most hurtful one word for me.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Yeah, that would be pretty harsh.
Being called a lousy father or husband would also be very insulting, and would probably make me either cry or get extremely defensive, depending on who the name-caller was.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
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by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:50 AM EST up reply actions
heh, that wouldn't bother me at all
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:50 AM EST up reply actions
really?
what’s the most insulting thing someone could call you?
for me “worthless” implies that you don’t even deserve to exist, that you are a net drag on humanity, and that the world would be better off without you. that’s pretty much the worst pejorative i can imagine.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Well I'm more or less self centered
so someone saying I’m worthless to humanity as a whole wouldn’t really bother me, especially because “worth to humanity” is such a subjective thing to each person.
Spants is right, just attack something I’m prideful of.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
I think being called
an excellent case for retroactive abortion could be up there for an insult. Very close to being called worthless, maybe even worse, because of how volatile the word ‘abortion’ is.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:58 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
What?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 1:04 AM EST up reply actions
i just mean that's probably
one of the most hurtful insults i can imagine.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Jane you ignorant slut …
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 6:48 AM EST up reply actions
My apologies for above
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 7:48 AM EST up reply actions
win
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 12, 2012 1:04 AM EST up reply actions
worthless is pretty bad
got called that in grade school by a basketball coach who was trying to ‘motivate’ me. Didn’t really work like he planned, it made me worse not better. I actually never cared much for him after that.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:20 AM EST up reply actions
Well, I'm Jewish (in a historical sense).
No one’s ever called me a kike, but I’d probably take some offense to that. Less so for ‘hebe’, probably. I dunno, I’ve never liked being called an asshole, even though I’ve been one on occasion. Depends on the situation, I suppose.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
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by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:48 AM EST up reply actions
Don't do it fang!
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:48 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
I'm Jewish
And I wouldn’t take offense to being called a kike, because its a really dumb insult.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:49 AM EST up reply actions
YOU JEW!
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 12:53 AM EST up reply actions
You rang?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:59 AM EST up reply actions
ignorant-assed redneck is pretty high up for me
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:15 AM EST up reply actions
You have to attack men in a different way.
Go after the things they’re prideful about, usually strength, intelligence, “manliness,” etc. Also, implying or out right declaring that their penis isn’t good enough in myriad ways.
I hope this was helpful.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:43 AM EST via Android app up reply actions 2 recs
oh that was helpful, thanks!
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Anytime.
I’m always here for your insult needs.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:46 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Also available for
knife fight lessons, should insults not do the trick.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
yeah, implying a lack of sexual prowess
will hurt most men’s feelings.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
to clarify, i don't want to hurt anyone's feelings
but i do think there are words that are specific to women that are terrible words that simply don’t have an equivalent male counterpart. i don’t want to insult any man, i just want men to understand that certain words are weighted. and it is hard to explain that to someone who has never been called a weighted word.
and that is the last thing i am going to say in this subthread. maybe even on veb for awhile.
sorry mods, i will let it go now.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
there really aren't.
all of the gender specific pejoratives i can think of are female related. it’s one of the great residual linguistic flaws of patriarchy.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Jan 12, 2012 12:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
for
great residual linguistic flaws
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:55 AM EST up reply actions
um, what?
douchebag
virgin
asshole
There are plenty of words that only apply to men, and there are plenty of words that are only insults to men.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:05 AM EST up reply actions
a douchebag is a feminine product.
it’s insulting to men because it basically means “you need to clean your vagina” (the same sort of insult as pussy, though the words imply different things). both those words are directed primarily at men, but are only “insulting” because they imply the man is comparable to a woman, which basically implies a view of women as inferior.
i’m not saying that calling someone a douchebag is misogyny, but i hardly think it’s fair to claim that it only insults men in its use.
virgin and asshole are hardly gender specific.
i’m not sure how far i want to go down this tunnel.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
No, douchebag its insulting because its comparing men to something that a woman uses to wash her privates
If you called someone a penis-wipe would that be any better?
Virgin is an insult when applied to men, and a virtue when applied to woman – usually across history. In the past century or so, its became more equal accross genders, but its still much more of an insult when applied to me.
Virgin is to a man as whore is to a woman.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:30 AM EST up reply actions
Note, I'm not saying that calling a man a virgin is as insulting as calling a woman a whore
And there are far more colorful synonyms to whore as well.
But virgin is something that’s really only insulting to a man.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:32 AM EST up reply actions
At your age that is probably true.
At my age it’s weird to be a virgin no matter your gender.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 1:35 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Agreed
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:35 AM EST up reply actions
This from the non-nun.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
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by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
Not sure I could ever be insulted being called a virgin.
There’s just too much (8/1/2) proof to the contrary. (Eight former girlfriends, 1 wife, 2 kids).
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
This is why I rarely, if ever, insult anyone, male or female.
And when I do, it is someone I know will know I’m kidding. Like calling azru a whore above. I almost said “rec whore”, but felt like it wasn’t quite as funny. j/k, azru!
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
I find this whole conversation to be remarkably
amusing, mainly because it once again features VEP out on a limb of crazy. There are those with religious beliefs (myself included) who refrain from being whores intentionally. None of the above really bother me overly much.
As spants noted, personalizing the insults is far more effective. Tailoring isn’t just for tailors.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Jan 12, 2012 9:28 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Also, heathens are only whores if they accept money or goods in exchange for sex.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 11:20 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
OK, now you're bringing economic theory into it, which is politics
Clearly this is not appropriate at VEB!
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Maybe you try a little of that reading comprehension Azru
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 6:03 PM EST up reply actions
Doesn't this only apply to people you've been with though?
If a random girl threatens a guy’s sexual prowess, I mean I guess they can take offense, but it’d be stupid because there’s no way for that girl to know.
However, I tend to over-analyze these type of situations and overestimate the average male.
President of the Tyler Greene fanclub - Wikipedia Proof, Tumblr Page, and finally Baseball-reference
Twitter
by stlcardsfan4 on Jan 12, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
yeah I agree
it’s only insutling when it comes from someone you care about or are trying to impress.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 1:34 AM EST up reply actions
this may sounds creepy...
in fact it probably does…but i’m going to say it anyway: you’re really awesome
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 12:58 AM EST up reply actions
Why thank you.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 1:18 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
to clarify: stripper has nothing to do with my general dislike.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
women of the world take note of this subthread
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 12, 2012 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
...
women wearing boats are hot.
My opinion.
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
I think you're expecting too much to come to a baseball fan site and get legitimate women's fashion advice.
You don’t need this site’s opinion on knee high boots (and do you mean over-the-knee boots, because boots up to the knee are so common as to not be worth asking about).
Doesn’t every mildly-fashion conscious women between the ages of 20-40 wear riding boots today? And Hunter boots when it’s raining?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
you know it was just something kind of fun and random and i was really just seeking rb's opinion anyway
of course i don’t need this site’s opinion and i am genuinely sorry i brought it up.
rb talks fashion a lot and i think it’s fun.
i also don’t think it was expecting too much to come to a baseball fan site and talk about something off-topic during the off season that has been discussed on numerous occasions while everyone remains civil.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
certainly entertaining as I was just a voyeur through the whole process
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
as did i.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:14 PM EST up reply actions
No, I meant don't worry about dumbshit comments like the one above about strippers
because you’re not likely to find all productive, helpful or appropriate comments from a bunch of random dudes (mainly) on the internet.
You should certainly not be sorry you brought it up – but I’d recommend not wasting any energy on responding to dumb commentary.
Anyway, I’m thinking you misconstrued the thrust of my comment.
Moreover – isn’t wearing knee-high boots (assuming you didn’t mean over-the-knee) extremely common? I live in a warm climate and I probably saw 20+ women just today wearing boots. (and I work in a skyscraper full of law firms, investment firms, F500 companies, etc.)
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 7:23 PM EST up reply actions
i think i misconstrued your comment, as well. sorry about that.
and i agree with you. some things you just have to let go. sometimes i get worked up thinking it’s my job as a woman to root out biases and sexism and whatever, but it’s a futile fight. and you’re right – a bad one to make on a baseball blog.
also, yes the boots are common. in phoenix, though, the weather gets so warm so early. i brought it up because a woman commented to me earlier, “aren’t you sad boot season is almost over?!” and i was like, “it is? NNOOOOOOooooooooo”
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I don't wear boots except during fall and winter
but that is because I only wear them with longish skirts which I only wear in cooler weather. I don’t like the look of a skirt with boots that is above the top of the boot, but that is just a personal preference. I think it is perfectly acceptable to wear boots at anytime you please.
"I don’t like the feeling of losing."---Chris Carpenter
ok, I now need to catalogue another lady poster
with a username that doesn’t give it away.
damnit.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
#Humblebrag?
and I work in a skyscraper full of law firms, investment firms, F500 companies, etc.)
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
No, only saying that I didn't work in a strip club when I saw the 20+ ladies.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 12, 2012 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
I know, I was just giving you a hard time.
This thread needed more humor….
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
I don't even comment very often
but I think the ability of people on this blog to bring up topics that could be personal while remaining mostly anonymous is one of the reasons why you all feel a certain level of community. People who get uncomfortable or can’t manage to participate in the dialog properly should stick to the baseball only discussions, but I don’t think the blog should target the lowest common denominator.
by RasmustheRipper on Jan 11, 2012 8:56 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know if this is stripper hate or cashier hate
Both of which are ridiculous.
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
what the hell is wrong with you?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:42 AM EST up reply actions
I strongly disagree.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Welp
Im gonna have to sell my boots. Hha kj i dont have any boots
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 7:04 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
wat
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
i also disagree with you.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
hey that's okay. i know i don't have a popular opinion.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 5:29 PM EST up reply actions
well, to each his/her own...
even if his/her own is totally stupid!
(i’m kidding)
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
You have proven many time over that you have no taste.
I present Imo’s and lunchables as evidence.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
As far as I'm concerned, you can wear knee high boots whenever you want
as long as you don’t ever, EVER wear those stupid Ugg looking slipper boots that every girl seems to have four pairs of these days
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
agreed.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
I see we agree
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 7:05 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
You guys had a fashion subthread without me?!
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
I was actually in our war room preparing for the draft tomorrow!
We are, indeed, not looking for jeans models! #moneyball
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
So there's a soccer draft?
That just seems kinda… wrong.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:42 PM EST up reply actions
How else would you disperse college talent?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Inviting fang to sorority party?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Jan 11, 2012 7:48 PM EST up reply actions 20 recs
oh my god...
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:50 PM EST up reply actions
Green in 15 minutes
under/over?
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
done
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Soccer players don't go to COLLEGE. They are stupid as shit. Don't you know anything on that side of the pond?!?
I think there have been two professional footballers in my lifetime in the UK who had a university education.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
I'm guessing most professional athletes around the rest of the world don't go to college
But in the U.S. it’s nearly required unless you play baseball or hockey.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
its not too late to weigh in
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Wear them whenever you want
I’ve seen plenty of girls in a summer skirt and boots during the day, or skinny jeans and boots when going out at night
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i'm with rui here.
this doesn’t seem to be a fashion that is seasonable
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
really?
you think its okay to wear knee high boots in august?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
i'm more conservative, fashion-wise.
i’d think it’s seasonally appropriate, regardless of weather during that particular season, but i’d shy away from wearing them in the summer time.
however, i think the other position (wear them whenever the fuck you feel) is a valid one, and i know many people who hold to it.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Yes
If that is all you wear.
Older than any three of you.
by Remember Kenny B on Jan 11, 2012 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
Just remember, I am starting to look like a Blues Brother
And not the tall one.
Older than any three of you.
by Remember Kenny B on Jan 11, 2012 6:38 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
yes, i think it would look just fine.
I don’t know how comfortable it would be for you though
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
It's not the look: it's the statement.
Knee-high boots and a wool skirt covering the knees in January is dashing and intelligent, because it suggests a personality in which fashion sense and comfort are integrated. Knee-high boots and a wool skirt covering the knees in August suggests a settled but possibly inflexible persoality somewhat alienated from reality. Knee-high boots with shorts, or a short skirt, in August suggests a misaligned personality, and may be interpreted as an insecure and meretricious groping after effect.
Je n'ai fait celle-ci plus longue parceque je n'ai pas eu le loisir de la faire plus courte
Fashion-wise, I think this is fine
In terms of comfort? I think you could do better with a summer dress and nice sandals, which is a more attractive look anyway, imo.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Just remember rui
Boat shoes make you look like a stripper and a whore.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:43 PM EST up reply actions
This went well.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
by Alxfritz on Jan 12, 2012 10:32 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Luhnow now stealing coaches...
Brian McTaggart @brianmctaggart Close
Astros replace Al Pedrique with Joe Pettini as bench coach story link
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
let him do it
the more reason I have to root for them in 2013
by hr on Jan 11, 2012 5:09 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, the astros need all the help they can get
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
this seems to be getting a little ridiculous
didn’t the Cards release Luhnow from his contract to take the Astros job? Wouldn’t professional courtesy dictate that you don’t immediately turn around and raid the organization you just left?
I heard he cleaned out the office supply cabinet too.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
by TBender on Jan 11, 2012 5:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Pettini was let go by the Birds wasn't he?
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jan 11, 2012 5:18 PM EST up reply actions
actually, now that you mention it...i think he was.
either that or it was the “other duties within the organisation” mumbo.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
REVERSE THE INDIGNATION ENGINES!
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Jan 11, 2012 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
I CANNAE DO IT CAP'N
THE ENGINES WON’T HOLD EM
Bursting into song.
Get it? Do You?... cuz he's gay. - VolsnCards5
by Aranathor on Jan 11, 2012 5:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Nice thanks for the chuckle
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
Pettini wasn't going to be the bench coach here next year
So he moved out of the org to take a better position. That’s called “business” not “raiding the closet”.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
But it is reminding me of Jockety except with coaches and FO staff (do you call decision sciences guys FO guys?)
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:02 PM EST up reply actions
if he liked the cardinals so much why didn't he marry them?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOBs!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Apparently people really want BELL-TRON to wear #5
And they’re getting all worked up about it and stuff.
Am I the only one who doesn’t care at all about jersey numbers? I literally don’t know the jersey number of anyone on the team. It’s not important information and my brain does not retain it.
i think from a player and team history perspective
numbers have some manner of significance. i think this is partly due to the perception that if a player plays well enough for the team, he has “earned” that number.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I'm for retiring a number of a great player
But up until they’re both great and approaching retirement, I could not possibly care less about their number.
i don't like the idea at all.
i’m not ready to say one way or the other what we should ultimately do about #5, but we didn’t let anyone wear 25 after big mac (did we?) and i have not liked anyone wearing 15.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
that one should be shelved for a while ... like 4+ years
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
not that he's a 1st ballot or even makes it in the end, though but you get the point
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:05 PM EST up reply actions
i mean, out of respect for jimmy and what he did and how awesome he was
it would have been nice to shelf it for a few years.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
i think we are saying the same thing actually
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Yes that's my point as well
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
o/
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
\o
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
The people legitimately wanting Beltran to wear #5 are complete morons with no sense of history or appreciation of the last 11 years of Cardinals baseball
Fact, not opinion.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jan 11, 2012 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Sounds pretty opinionated to me ... but Beltran or anyone else immediately wearing #5 would be wrong in my opinion
Also, should be shelved for at least a while, then lets see how we feel about it later
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:25 PM EST up reply actions
Wait
You don’t know joker IMA!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:47 AM EST up reply actions
I'm much the same
now that Pujols has gone I literally know the numbers of two current players (Holliday and Molina) and two former players (Rolen and Edmonds) off the top of my head. I think Carp might be 22 (?). That’s it.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:45 PM EST up reply actions
29
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
when i waited tables we would do a fun game with the cooks where they would call out the table number
but instead of saying, for example “25” they would say “barry bonds!”
we would try to stump each other. and that is why i know ray lankford was number 16
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
that's awesome.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:53 PM EST up reply actions
my dad can still remember uniform numbers of players from the 50's and 60's
from multiple teams. Although that would be easier from that era since teams stayed together longer.
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 7:52 PM EST up reply actions
This seems like a knee-jerk reaction to me
And I really don’t think that Beltran or the organization should put themselves in that position.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
we've actually dealt with the topic before
with no difficulty.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
because 99% of us are men
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Jan 12, 2012 12:47 AM EST up reply actions
Who do you think designs 50-75% of women's clothes?
It’s plenty reasonable to comment or give advice on women’s attire if you’re a man, since a lot of women like to know what a man’s opinion is on what they’re wearing. Where you get into trouble is when you make misogynistic statements about said attire with no thought as to the other person’s feelings.
You’re view of this, reading the above thread, seems to be formed directly from watching sit-coms or listening to stand up comedy. Which is a pretty cynical view of male/female relationships.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Apparently, Aaron Rogers has never been to a funeral
How is that possible?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 11, 2012 7:03 PM EST via mobile reply actions
its possible he just didn't go
or is he saying no one has ever died? i mean that’s pretty amazing.
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
He's such a natural leader that people around him never give up
So they’re all still alive.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I never attended a funeral until I was 26
The only funeral I theoretically could have been invited to before then was the funeral of my great-grandmother who lived in England, however, due to religious rules requiring burial as soon as possible, traveling there in time for the funeral would have practically impossible.
Looking like a drunk laundry/cleanup night, you guys
Just ran through 3 straight weeks where we had people stay with us.
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i have no sense of motivation to clean house while drunk.
i’d probably decide to make a giant pile of my dirty laundry and jump in it.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
this. who the hell cleans when they're drunk?
also, this at least the second time rui has posted “looks like a drunken (insert domestic activity here) night, you guys”
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
i mean, apparently rui does.
perhaps alcohol brings out a desire for self-improvement of his environment.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Cleaning drunk > cleaning sober
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
sober sex > drunk sex
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:24 PM EST up reply actions
his sample size may not be statistically significant,
leading him to an erroneous conclusion.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Jan 11, 2012 7:28 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
you don't know me, joker
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
twas.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
Disagree
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
like most things cool, it depends how drunk you are
gotta be in the zone
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 7:27 PM EST up reply actions
i'm gonna agree with fang as a general rule, but there are certainly exceptions
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Nah drunk sex is awesome. You're both uninhibited and it usually comes spontaneously which makes it awesome
Brownout/blackout sex is terrible
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
but you don't remember how awful it was,
which is… not really a positive. never mind.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
and it usually comes spontaneously
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:35 PM EST up reply actions
as opposed to being scheduled in advance?
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
All I need is two minutes
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
a normal tuesday night with rui
9:00 PM: begin drinking
9:11 PM: be drunk
9:13 PM: begin sex with wife
9:15 PM: end sex with wife
9:16 PM: pass out
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Nah she's at work bro
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
i said tuesday night!
wednesday night is “drunk domestic activity, you guys” night.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:49 PM EST up reply actions
Where's the cleaning and laundry portions of the evening?
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Agreed
Buzzed sex is good sex
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Jan 11, 2012 11:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
correction
Buzzedany sex is good sex
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:32 AM EST up reply actions
my wife and I.
It makes hosting parties awesome. Everything’s cleaned up in the morning and you can enjoy your hangover in peace.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
Mildly interesting fact of the day
Homicide dropped out of the top 15 causes of death in the US last year, for the first time since 1965. It was replaced by choking on vomit.
bud light nation.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:21 PM EST up reply actions
you have to be kidding
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 7:27 PM EST up reply actions
well, to be clear
that’s mostly caused by old age/illness, not drunkenness. I still find it to be an amusing stat.
For the first time in American history
Crime actually dropped during a recession.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
imbibing a Stone smoked porter tonight
pretty good, pretty good
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 7:27 PM EST reply actions
DON'T CHOKE ON YOUR OWN VOMIT.
Or die in a homicide.
Or call someone a whore for wearing boots.
Those three little nuggets of wisdom I give to you, ABSOLUTELY FREE.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:48 PM EST up reply actions
go to bed, brit.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 7:50 PM EST up reply actions
Heh. Well it is 1am and I think I might be getting up in five hours so I can take my fiancee to work.
so; yeah – goodnight all.
Still bitching to contact.
by Felonius_Monk on Jan 11, 2012 7:53 PM EST up reply actions
boots do not affect me
unless I am wearing them, and they start to give my feet claustrophobia. my feet hate that.
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 8:15 PM EST up reply actions
so i guess selig is staying on for awhile as the commissioner
i has a sad.
Jon Heyman @JonHeymanCBS
selig extension approved. announcement tomorrow. #MLB
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Yeah, I had heard some chatter a while back about this
pointing out that literally no preparation had actually been done for his stepping down. So the unofficial, but inevitable, conclusion was that there was no actual intention of him stepping down, and it was basically a foregone conclusion he would be extended.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
that sucks
i’m over bud and his crappy ideas
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
GAHHHHHH!!!!!
Won’t he ever go away??
>=8/
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
He. Just. Will. Not. Go. Away
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 6:56 AM EST up reply actions
yay
big surprise
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 8:21 PM EST up reply actions
I'm actually ok with this
Better the clown you know than the clown you don’t. And, FWIW, monetarily he’s been good for both players and ownership. I don’t agree with everything he does, but I’m not going to agree with everything any commissioner does anyway.
He’s been a far better steward of the game than Bowie Kuhn ever was, and that fucking clown is in the Hall of Fame.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Agreed.
If you read John Helyar’s “Lords of the Realm”, you’ll find that Selig is actually probably the best Commish in the game’s history. He has a lot of public gaffes, but the sport has done really really well since he took over.
Chief Economist of Tyler Greene Fanclub
by Cardinals645 on Jan 12, 2012 4:02 PM EST up reply actions
So, I should just Shift-A this whole thing?
Thanks for the warning, Twitterverse.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 11, 2012 8:55 PM EST reply actions
there's a great discussion about clear plastic high heels above, i think you'll be missing out man.
mumble mumble Peter Bourjos mumble mumble
yes
maybe I need to start following people on twitter so I know when to avoid some of this crap.
> tebow
by cschepers on Jan 11, 2012 8:58 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
February 20th needs to arrive quickly.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
You don't want to miss the emoticon discussion, do you?
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
sorry you guys
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
The only thing that I can really add to this thread
is that the AC/DC song is great to sing along with drunk in a bar.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
Every time they say "Thunderstruck"
take a drink
by RasmustheRipper on Jan 11, 2012 9:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No, no
Take a drink on “thunder”, start a waterfall on “thunderstruck”
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Hmmmm....
1. Follow mattybobo’s advice
2. Die choking on vomit
3. Become death statistic which pushes homicide out of the top 15 causes of death
4. ….
5. Profit?
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
If only I had laid down some cash betting on crime statistics!
For the record, though, I only condone playing silly drinking games with beer, preferably easy lagers in the 4-5% alcohol range. Anything over that is ridiculously stupid in my opinion.
(i.e., taking a drink on “thunder” means taking a sip of beer)
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
Friends in Low Places
is the best drunk song ever.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 11, 2012 9:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well it's right up there anyway
no, it’s the best I can think of
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 11, 2012 9:20 PM EST up reply actions
unless you despise country music
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 9:31 PM EST up reply actions
No, even then.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 11, 2012 9:38 PM EST up reply actions
This is a very legitimate point.
Also, Piano Man can be quite enjoyable in large, less-than-sober groups.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Sweet Caroline is another fave.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Jan 11, 2012 9:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
the "every dive bar in america" song!
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
The Red sox ruined that for me.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Dixie Chicken!
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 11, 2012 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
Irish bar I go to on occasion likes to play Dropkick Murphys
not my favorite but some of the regulars eat that shit up.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
the one christmas song by mariah carey is wonderful.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
Bohemian Rhapsody
disagrees
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 11, 2012 10:15 PM EST up reply actions
I'll not have you sully Freddie's masterwork
with your drunken shenanigans.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 11, 2012 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
Perhaps you've never been in a convertible
with a group of drunk friends with different people/groups singing the roles of the different characters at top volume.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 11, 2012 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, it's a fine drunk song,
but it probably isn’t even the best Queen drunk song. And doesn’t top FiLP in my book.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason #ImFeelingBetterThough
by The Continental on Jan 11, 2012 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
Cecilia
Simon and Garfunkel.
Seriously. Try it.
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
I can see this.
Also now, Me and Julio Down by Schoolyard.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
yeah, thats a good one
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
indeed
get a bunch of people drunkenly screaming, “Ceeeeeeeeeeciiiiiiiiiiiiiilllllllllliiiiiiiaaaaaaaaaa, I’m down on my knees, I’m begging you please to come home, COME ON HOME” …..and it’s automatically a good time.
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
don't stop believing
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
also, you lost that lovin feeling
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
The Sound of Silence
is a fantastic ironic song to be playing when your roommate is throwing up after a night of hard drinking.
For you college age people, try it some time.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
agreed.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 9:24 PM EST up reply actions
Jimmy Buffet,
Let’s get Drunk.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
you mean
Why Don’t We Get Drunk and Screw, perhaps?
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Jan 11, 2012 11:03 PM EST up reply actions
perhaps
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
Why don't we get drunk...
…and moooooo?
;=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
by The MooCow on Jan 12, 2012 3:06 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Just about any Buffet song will work.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:35 AM EST up reply actions
Isn't the the theme of every Jimmy Buffet song?
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
A lot of college friends of mine
had a drunken sing-along obsession with “El Scorcho” by Weezer.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
That sounds fun!
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 11:21 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
question I read on twitter
what would ryan madson have got in arbitration?
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 9:19 PM EST reply actions
Hey VEB
I just met this creepy orphan who thinks I’m an Assassin, and he wants me to kill the woman who runs his orphanage, because she’s a total bitch. Should I do it?
Also, this is in Skyrim
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
I met
a weird jester stalled outside a farm. but I’m only 7th level on the cusp of 8th. as for your dilemma, that’s a tough question. make sure you know all the angles.
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 11, 2012 9:25 PM EST up reply actions
He's just an orphan who wants to kill the woman because she's mean
He’s really creepy too
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 11, 2012 9:27 PM EST up reply actions
Before you mentioned Skyrim,
I assumed that clank was punking you hardcore.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Jan 11, 2012 9:51 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Do it.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 10:01 PM EST up reply actions
Also, I killed a mammoth today at only level 5. I was pretty proud of myself
Archery FTW!
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 10:02 PM EST up reply actions
I tried to do it at like 8 (33 now) and it was really hard
I generally stay away from Giants
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Jan 11, 2012 10:03 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I've heard they're really hard to kill, but I haven't actually encountered one yet.
"Let me tell you something kid; Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes. You shouldn't let it go by."
"Remember kid, there's heroes and there's legends. Heroes get remembered but legends never die, follow your heart kid, and you'll never go wrong."
-Babe Ruth in the movie "Sandlot"
by cardinalswsbound on Jan 11, 2012 10:08 PM EST up reply actions
I'd stay away from Giants too
Barry Bonds and Jeff Kent were both assholes.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
speaking of skyrim, i am about to start a new character
i haven’t played it in a few weeks, i burned out once my guy got to the point where i was basically untouchable. if you enchanting to level 100 it turns it into god mode.
got new heatsink/fan and 4GB of RAM today
heatsink/fan was WAY more work than i expected it to be to change. had to almost completely disassemble to get the motherboard out. the thing is also huge and my case doesn’t properly close anymore, but it is goddamn silent, which is why i bought it. stock AMD fan sounded like a damn jet engine and now i have blissful silence
and the 4GB of RAM i got is exactly the same as the 4 i got when i built this computer in february ’09. price then: $109. price this time: $30. nice
i bought that lenovo, btw.
works like a charm and is ultra-fast. i was worried about chiclet keyboard (and the fact that the very handy number pad makes everything a little more cramped than on my last one) at first but have gotten used to it very quickly.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, it looked like a pretty nice laptop
by prophetjohn on Jan 11, 2012 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
i expect i'll get some sort of new ultraportable by the end of the weekend.
probably going to be a macbook air, but i’ll have to look around and research the new ultrabooks
kind of surprising, though, that i’ll probably own an apple computer within a week
by prophetjohn on Jan 11, 2012 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
four digit laptops aren't really my thing.
but that’s exciting.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 10:31 PM EST up reply actions
it's true
but i need something small and the netbook i have just doesn’t cut it. it’s way too slow. i can’t get real work done on it
but all of the laptops in that same category are around or above the $1000 price
by prophetjohn on Jan 11, 2012 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
i understand.
i’m sure you need way more out of one than i do.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 11, 2012 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
I really like the new Acer Timeline Ultrabooks
and the new ASUS ones I’m seeing at CES are pretty damn nice too.
That said, hard to beat a MacBook Air for portability and ease of use, especially if you still use iTunes for music.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
the new samsung series 9
is probably the macbook air’s first “real” competitor in the “ultrabook” space.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
That crushes the MacBook Air, actually
But you’re paying the price for it: another $400-$500 on top of what the Air costs.
I’m seeing ultrabooks from ASUS and Acer in the $700-$900 range of pricepoints that feature Core i5 (which is what he Air runs on) and 4GB RAM. Some even have 128 GB SSD’s, which is remarkable when you consider the HD alone would run $200.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
And you'd be fucking crazy not the buy the 15" laptop here for $100 more
considering it comes with 8 GB of RAM instead of 4 GB.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Yeah
I’ve pretty well gotten away from assembling computers anymore just due to the Heat Sink on the new processors. I just pay someone else $50 to put the damn thing together now since they’re insured against breaking the processor or motherboard trying to get the fucking thing installed.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
On this date in 1973, the American League adopted the abomination known as the designated hitter rule.
The sport has been off-kilter ever since.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Jan 11, 2012 10:17 PM EST reply actions
selig earns 22 million a year as commissioner.
i had no idea he was paid so much.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
May what a great gig
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 7:00 AM EST up reply actions
Yup
And do you realize that had he remained the owner of the Brewers franchise instead of becoming commissioner that he would be worth $200M more than he is now, even with that huge salary?
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
hahahaha
Joe Buck @Buck
GOING TO BED!! yelled that! Sleeping in my Giants hat, Packers coat, Phillies jersey, Red Sox socks, in my Yankee sheets, and Cardinal bed
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
Joe Buck on Twitter has made me like Joe Buck.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:40 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
nice long explanation of his call of the tyree catch
makes sense. <3 you joe buck
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
I KNEW IT, I KNEW HE WAS BIASED
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
I have no clue where the app will put this comment,
but I actually read all the comments in this thread. Okay, okay. I glossed over the Skyrim crap.
Anyway.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:37 AM EST via Android app reply actions
the app successfully put it at the bottom of the page.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
i also skipped over the skyrim thread
i still don’t really know what skyrim is
You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein
2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
it's a video game, and a very good one.
i play very, very few video games, and i enjoyed skyrim a lot.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
+1
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 12, 2012 12:42 AM EST up reply actions
I figured it out!
Android app users: if you want to start a comment thread and you’ve already commented in an existing thread, back out first. When you reenter the thread, making a new comment works as it should.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:40 AM EST via Android app up reply actions 1 recs
But if you haven't read all the other comments
do you lose the ability to ‘z’ through unread comments? Or is that even part of the app?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 12:42 AM EST up reply actions
you can jump to comments with a button
but the problem is that it doesn’t know what you’ve done on your computer and vice versa
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 12, 2012 12:43 AM EST up reply actions
If you catch up on the phone
just Shift-A and immediately switch to computer.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:47 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
yeah that's what I've been doing
not a big deal, just at first I was mildly disappointed
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 12, 2012 1:05 AM EST up reply actions
It let's you back out without marking comments as read.
It’s awesome. You actually have to navigate through them or Mark All as Read.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 12:44 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
danke
I wanted to play baseball!
-Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jan 12, 2012 12:42 AM EST up reply actions
thank you, this was really annoying.
THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!
It sure as hell was.
2011 - Year of Our Berk
by spants on Jan 12, 2012 7:25 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
happy yadi2second anniversary, you guys.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 1:12 AM EST reply actions
yes.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 1:24 AM EST up reply actions
oh wait never mind.
i blew it. y-day will be saturday.
If I was going on a picnic, I'd invite Ryan Theriot, and I would ask him to bring the lunchables.
by stlcardinalsfang on Jan 12, 2012 1:24 AM EST up reply actions
Please come back Y2S!
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Jan 12, 2012 2:39 AM EST up reply actions
Yes we miss you!
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 7:03 AM EST up reply actions
Agreeeeeee!!!!
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
signs that the mayan apocalypse may be nigh, vol. 27
“Whitney” and “are you there, chelsea?” Running consecutively on wednesday.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Jan 12, 2012 3:27 AM EST via mobile reply actions
If Two and Half Men moves to Wednesdays, you may be on to something.
Question Answered: Not Pujols. Not Luhnow either. WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO MY TEAM?!?!?!
Showing my age
He lost me on “fuckstick”
Je n'ai fait celle-ci plus longue parceque je n'ai pas eu le loisir de la faire plus courte
Use your “Imag-inaaaaation” … starts with a “Deh” sound
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 7:30 AM EST up reply actions
Just when you thought the subthread had been mercifully put down
It gets restarted.
Let’s not, please.
Cards fan in Middle East
you are correct ... done
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 7:45 AM EST up reply actions
Just remember what happened the last time he reported to Jupiter.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Aliens stole his love-child?
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 9:18 AM EST up reply actions
No
The Cards won the World Series!
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Without him
I do not want that to happen this year! 12 in ’12! But with Waino leading the charge, please.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
Sign Mark Prior!
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 12, 2012 9:20 AM EST up reply actions
I think we can safely say
that the ’12 Cardinals have already experienced the equivalent of losing Waino last year.
I guess we’re a shoo-in for a repeat.
Cards fan in Middle East
Attn.--Long time Cardinal fans
I’ve been a Cardinal fan since 1935. Has anyone got me beat?
by gus w on Jan 12, 2012 1:52 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
ridgesee maybe..
I’d ask in today’s thread to be sure. there were some unpleasantries last night that folks will likely be avoiding here.
also, welcome!
> tebow
by cschepers on Jan 12, 2012 1:58 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
how old were you then? And can you remember Dizzy and Daffy Dean?
Tell us stories about what you remember, lots and lots of us love them.
Also, we are over here on new main post for the day click here
11 in 11' √
"2011 is dead. Long live 2012!." ... azruavatar
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Jan 12, 2012 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, we'd love to read a fan post
about your memories. I’d like to hear about the great ‘40s teams, and I’m curious about the 50’s teams that didn’t win any championships … we don’t hear much about the best players from those teams.
And of course the Browns … don’t get me started!
by MdRedbirdFreak on Jan 12, 2012 3:25 PM EST up reply actions

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