Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

Your St. Louis Cardinals Top Prospects List Construction Set

PHOENIX, AZ - JULY 10:  World Future's All-Star Carlos Martinez #27 of the St. Louis Cardinals throws a pitch during the 2011 XM All-Star Futures Game at Chase Field on July 10, 2011 in Phoenix, Arizona.  (Photo by Jeff Gross/Getty Images)

I have terrible news for people who will be compulsively checking Future Redbirds every morning for the next three weeks: The minor league season is basically kaput. As I write Thursday evening the Quad City River Bandits' playoff matchup is the only game going on in the Cardinals' system. 

The good news is that this season's stats are now in the book, so it's time to begin obsessively making top prospect lists. If you're following the Baseball America model and selecting a Top 30 you're going to need at least 45 or 50 candidates; to rank them will require the ability (or at least the will) to make snap judgments about players who are purporting to provide completely different kinds of value. 

I can't help you with the will, though if it comes down to a low-minors middle reliever and a high-minors defensive replacement I suggest tossing a coin; I can provide the players. Enough prologue: Here's the not-especially-official (azruavatar's opinion overrules mine in the evaluation of all baseball players who could not buy and sell the both of us) Viva El Birdos prospect list construction set. (In no order! Aside from the first one.)

Group One: Shelby MillerShelby Miller is your top prospect. The sooner you admit this, presumably while looking at his strikeout-per-inning, 2.7 K:BB run as a 20-year-old in the Springfield Cardinals' Coors-Field-on-the-moon run environment, the sooner you will be able to piss off your readers with your opinions of the rest of the list. 

Group Two: Zack CoxZack Cox is in his own group because I'm still not sure what to make of him. He had a perfectly decent full-season debut in Palm Beach and Springfield, hitting .306/.363/.434 with 13 home runs and 27 doubles, but Springfield was a launching pad this year, he's not extremely young for it (22), and I still don't know what Zack Cox, Three-WAR Third Baseman's skill-set looks like. A .300 average and then what?

Group Three: High-Upside Monster Prospects. Oscar Taveras (20, .386/.444/.584, low-A); Carlos Martinez (20, 10.4 K/9, 85 IP, low-A/high-A); Tyrell Jenkins (19, 8.8 K/9, 3.86 ERA, Rookie)

Star-divide

It's really difficult to overstate how good Taveras was in his 78 games with the Quad Cities. He led the Midwest League in batting by 30 points, in on-base and slugging percentage as well. (The players he outslugged were 23, 22, 22, 24, et cetera.) He finished 16th in the league in hits; the guy who finished 15th played 116 games.

I worry about his health—he had some hamstring problems—but I don't worry about his bat. Neither do the Cardinals, apparently—he's on his way to the AFL. 

Martinez and Jenkins are absurdly young and subject to minute innings limits and sample sizes, but they adjusted without issue to full-season ball and have front-of-the-prospect-list stuff. 

Group Four: 2011 Breakout HPGF Stars. Trevor Rosenthal (22, 9.9 K/9, 3.41 K:BB, low-A), Matt Adams (23, .300/.357/.566, AA), Jordan Swagerty (22, 8.6 K/9, 3.87 K:BB, A-A+-AA) Maikel Cleto (23, 9 K/9, 2.08 K:BB, A+-AA-AAA), Ryan Jackson (24, .278/.334/.415, AA)

Welcome to the Hyperventilating Prospect-Geek Fraternity! Trevor Rosenthal has a mid-90s fastball and capitalized on his preseason buzz by putting together 120 great innings in low-A—not bad for a 21st-round pick. Matt Adams, the big-bodied first baseman who is maybe the most divisive prospect in the system, was more exciting after his .357/.397/.685 first half than his .252/.324/.464 second half; a lot is dependent on what he does in Memphis and what the Cardinals do in St. Louis. 

Jordan Swagerty and Maikel Cleto both made massive jumps through the system and held their own, though Swagerty had to end the season as a reliever for innings reasons and Cleto lost his newfound control in Memphis. Both could end up relievers long-term, but if that's where the Cardinals see them they could be factors as soon as next year.

Ryan Jackson carried his incredible defensive reputation into the high minors and hasn't yet gotten the bat knocked out of his hands; if he keeps up the doubles power or brings his walk rate back up to 2010 levels he could be a younger, less eccentric-slacker-mystic version of Brendan Ryan

Group Five: 2011 Draft Picks. Kolten Wong (21, .335/.401/.510, low-A), Charlie Tilson (19, .333/.400/.407, 8 G, GCL-Rookie), C.J. McElroy (19, .228/.303/.278, GCL), Gary Apelian (21, .298/.343/.502, 29 XBH, Rookie), Kyle Hald (23, 1.84 ERA, 5.25 K:BB, Rookie), Matthew Williams (22, .845 OPS, 20-2 SB-CS, Rookie), Tyler Rahmatulla (22, .314/.390/.545, 27 2B, Rookie)

In the Midwest League Kolten Wong was what I hoped Zack Cox would be—.911 OPS and a second baseman. And age-appropriate! Charlie Tilson signed at the deadline and managed to sneak out of the GCL. C.J. McElroy, a third-rounder with much the same skill set, signed early and did not. Gary Apelian is a big outfielder from the second day of the draft who hit eight home runs in 55 games at Johnson City; he also had eight outfield assists. 

Kyle Hald, Matthew Williams, and Tyler Rahmatulla all dominated leagues they were a little old for. Williams is a shortstop, but he's a few months older than Rahmatulla and dominated a little less.

Group Six: All the Other Pitching Prospects. Joe Kelly (24, 1.92 K:BB, 2.15 GO/AO, A+-AA), John Gast (23, 6.3 K/9, 1.85 K:BB, A+-AA), Boone Whiting (22, 9.2 K/9, 5.08 K:BB, low-A), Nick Additon (24, 7.3 K/9, 2.33 K:BB, AA-AAA), Ryan Copeland (24, 9 K/9, 5.47 K:BB, low-A), Keith Butler (23, 1.23 ERA, 11.9 K/9, A-A+)

Joe Kelly and John Gast are fast-moving recent draft picks without dominant numbers or strikeout stuff. Kelly is the Groundball Rate Guy and Gast is the Awesome Pick-Off Move Guy. Boone Whiting put up an outstanding season but is also a cautionary tale; Ryan Copeland put up a less outstanding season and is also Nick Additon's age, as a college senior drafted in 2010. Nick Additon got to AAA and kept up his strikeout rate despite being cautioned against at every level; at least he might end up a lefty specialist.

Keith Butler is, at the very least, the next Casey Mulligan. He's going to the Arizona Fall League. 

Group Seven: Dinged-Up Top Prospects and Last Year's Models. Tommy Pham (24, .294/.372/.517, AA), Cody Stanley (23, .264/.317/.425, low-A), Daryl Jones (25, .260/.360/.400, AAA-AA), Bryan Anderson (25, .281/.357/.409, AAA), Charles Cutler (25, .333/.398/.475, AA), Seth Blair (23, 5.29 ERA, 1.13 K:BB, low-A), Deryk Hooker (23, 6 K/9, 2.17 K:BB, AA), Adam Reifer (26, catastrophic knee injury, AAA), David Kopp (26, 5.8 K/9, 6.08 ERA, AA-AAA)

Tommy Pham has had excellent hitting numbers and season-ending injuries in each of the last two years. A center fielder, he's got a lot of power and a lot of speed if he ever plays a full season. Cody Stanley failed to impress in 101 games in the Quad Cities, but he's still a catcher. Daryl Jones doesn't strike me as any worse than Adron Chambers, if that's any consolation. Bryan Anderson is invisible no matter what he hits; Charles Cutler hit a ton as a part-time catcher in AA but he's a few months older than Bryan Anderson. 

Seth Blair's minor league debut was awful. Deryk Hooker, one of 2011's big sleeper prospects, slept through an injury-plagued season, but he's just 23. Adam Reifer, yet another mid-90s fastball relief prospect, would have spent at least a month in the Major Leagues in 2011 if he hadn't torn his knee up in April; he has Bryan Augenstein's chance of making next year's team. Some people like David Kopp now that he's been moved to relief.

Group Eight: Players You'll Forget Are Prospects, Technically. Eduardo Sanchez (23, 10.4 K/9, 1.88 ERA, MLB), Lance Lynn (25, 10.4 K/9, 3.12 ERA, MLB), Brandon Dickson (27, 7.1 K/9, 3.88 K:BB, AAA) Matt Carpenter (26, .300/.417/.463, AAA), Adron Chambers (25, .277/.368/.415, AAA), Tony Cruz (25, .258/.333/.339, AAA-MLB)

Vague shoulder injuries terrify me, but Eduardo Sanchez is apparently due back soon. Lance Lynn had about as good a season as you could expect, showing off potential as a reliever and staying in the fifth-starter picture. Brandon Dickson had a fine season for Memphis. 

Matt Carpenter was about as Matt Carpenter as you can get, walking 20 times more than he struck out and hitting for a little power besides. I don't see the appeal of Adron Chambers who has to be the slowest super fast player ever inasmuch as it rarely shows up in his numbers. Tony Cruz hits well enough to be a backup catcher but I'm afraid of Tony La Russa someday giving him 50 games at third base.

Group Nine: Low-Minors Lottery Tickets. Nick Longmire (23, .242/.301/.367, low-A), Roberto De La Cruz (20, .264/.299/.542, 1 HR/14.2 AB, Rookie), Anthony Garcia (20, .308/.407/.527, Rookie), Greg Garcia (22, .283/.384/.392, A-A+), Hector Hernandez (21, 8.4 K/9, 2.89 K:BB, A-)

Nick Longmire is a toolsy center fielder who disappointed after a strong short-season debut in 2010. De La Cruz, one of the Cardinals' first big Latin-American signings, walked seven times all and is a butcher at third base, but he also hit 16 home runs in 59 games in his first non-GCL exposure. Anthony Garcia graduated from the GCL and kept hitting in rookie ball, but full-season work in 2012 will tell us a lot more; Greg Garcia is a middle infielder who's walked a ton since being drafted in the seventh round in 2010. 

Hector Hernandez will be 21 when he starts out in Quad Cities in 2012 after three interesting years in short-season ball.

BONUS Group: Dominican Summer League Powerball Tickets. Juan Bautista (19, 7.8 K/9, 3.61 ERA, DSL-Rookie), Robelys Reyes (21, .378/.453/.554, DSL), Amaury Capellan (19, .305/.411/.481, DSL)

Pick the right guy from the DSL's nether-roster of 13-year-old shortstops and 26-year-old junkballers and you will be lauded as a seer all throughout the HPGF. Pick the wrong guy and—nobody will care!

Sincerely,

The erstwhile driver of the Wladimir Mendoza bandwagon. 

Now you have the pieces—anybody have a top 30 to share? 

Comment 396 comments  |  7 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

I feel like Scott Gorgen has been all but forgotten.

Should be in the group of injured prospects. Not sure on his current rehab situation, but I think he had Tommy John or something; actually I’d love to hear an update on him, if anyone knows.

by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2011 9:18 AM EDT reply actions  

He had Tommy John

was rehabbing in Florida. Not sure where he’s at now. Next year is probably make or break for him. His pitching clone (whiting) will be hot on his heels now.

Beware: Velociraptors may be present.

by azruavatar on Sep 9, 2011 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Funny, I think his actual clone (his twin brother in the Rays organization) had TJ too.

Yea, next year is huge, considering he pretty much missed the last two years. I’d be more optimistic about a TJ procedure, but I believe he’s had a few other injuries as well.

by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2011 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

freeman, brown, luna

no where?

I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
...to DFA TLR

by sportsman on Sep 9, 2011 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

I mentioned earlier on this board

that I think Oscar Taveras is the best hitter I’ve seen in 45 years of watching Quad-Cities baseball, and I mean it. But take into account that I’m also the person who hated the Templeton/Ozzie trade when it happened, and was furious when the Blues traded my favorite goalie for a fat kid from Calgary, Brett Hull…..

by Iowa on Sep 9, 2011 10:11 AM EDT reply actions  

There were quite a few quality players in the Quad Cities this season.

I’m impressed by Wong and the pitchers. I think Wong will start in AA in 2012 and I hope he picks up where he left off in Davenport.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

It was a fun bunch to watch

I remember the days when we would feel lucky to have just one prospect on a Q-C team….kudos to the Cardinals for providing many…

by Iowa on Sep 9, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

High A.

I think they’ll be quick to promote him if he continues to hit, though.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

If he hits in high-A, he'll be in AA by mid-season, I bet.

Possibly start 2013 in Memphis. This is all best-case scenario.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

rec'n

annoyed by this bear guy, though.

would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2011 10:28 AM EDT reply actions  

whatever happened to amaury marti cazana?

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 10:36 AM EDT reply actions  

After beating Chuck Norris at chess

He decided to retire atop his own face he hand-carved in the Rockies.

2011 fWAR watch: Theriot = 0.4, Boog = 2.1 as of Sept 05
Bilingual Twitter

by Paulspike on Sep 9, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

You can go there and study his secrets arts with him, as his retainer

But only if you can climb to the top, and survive the 13 deadly tests administered by the captured spirits of his defeated enemies.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

I've heard those spirits call themselves the League of Evil Ex-Enemies.

"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Sep 9, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Each one is stronger than the last

And they all have unique final attacks.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

so that's what's behind the pine trees?

would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hes drinking a Dos Equis

On the Moon

"You may run like Mays, but you hit like sh**."

by Lankford 4 President on Sep 9, 2011 7:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

A little optimistic about Cox, I think.

I don’t see him as clearly slotting above Taveras, Martinez, Wong, etc. Conversely, I don’t think you’re giving Wong full credit. He was excellent on arrival in QC and could clearly have played a level up. I think it’s not premature to be thinking of him as being more than a generic 2011 draft pick.

"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.

by StanTheManFan on Sep 9, 2011 10:39 AM EDT reply actions  

I think we could have an interesting conversations

over who’s more valuable between Cox and Wong.

2011 fWAR watch: Theriot = 0.4, Boog = 2.1 as of Sept 05
Bilingual Twitter

by Paulspike on Sep 9, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

it's not about how valuable

it’s about how you use them

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Indeed.
Enough prologue: Here’s the not-especially-official (azruavatar’s opinion overrules mine in the evaluation of all baseball players who could not buy and sell the both of us) Viva El Birdos prospect list construction set. (In no order! Aside from the first one.)</blockquote>

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

I saw it; I just don't agree with it.

There are Cox comparables in the system. There aren’t Miller comparables, which justifies having him in a tier by himself. Anyway…

"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.

by StanTheManFan on Sep 9, 2011 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'll bite on a top 20

Miller, Taveras, Martinez, Jenkins, Rosenthal
Wong, Jackson, Adams, Carpenter, Lynn
Cox, Sanchez, Cleto, Swagerty, Dickson
Whiting, Additon, Pham, Kelly, Butler

Thanks for the categorizations. There are enough players worth following that keeping them straight without baseball-reference is getting to be challenge.

It’s nice to have a measurable increase in talent across the farm system. Investing the dollars in Latin America and early picks falling due to signability will make for all kinds of roster/payroll flexibility. I hope the FO makes effective decisions that take advantage of it.

by awpierce on Sep 9, 2011 10:40 AM EDT reply actions  

i can't do 30

i’m not going to rate guys like sanchez and lynn because they are big leaguers. and then there’s a lot of guys on that list that i don’t feel are prospects. here is not top, uh, 16. it’s sooper scientific

shelby miller
carlos martinez
kolten wong
oscar taveras
ryan jackson
matt carpenter
tyrell jenkins
zack cox
adron chambers
charlie tilson
jordan swagerty
matt adams
trevor rosenthal
joe kelly
tyle rahmatulla
john gast

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 10:46 AM EDT reply actions  

Your placement of rosenthal disgusts me

"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister

Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of 8/28/2011)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP

by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2011 1:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

color me skeptical

let’s see him do it at a more advanced level and i’ll move him up

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rosenthal is pretty impressive.

He works in a good rythm and pumps a lot of first-pitch strikes. I like his motion well enough. His fastball is impressive, as was his arm strength/conditioning in that his velocity didn’t fall off that much as he worked deep into the game. He needs some work on his offspead pitches, but so does Shelby Miller.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Then why Jenkins at 7?

"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister

Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of 8/28/2011)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP

by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2011 7:09 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Because prospect rankings are 95% arbitrary

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

They are all just chips anyway

As long as TLR and Mo are around, these guys are all just trade bait for older washed-up gritty 0 WAR vets that hit the scrap heap. It is hard to envision this, but what do the Birds look like when the older guys are gone … Carp, Westy, Albert (I hope not), Furcal, Berk, Eriot (please be gone), even Yadi? Do we have the pieces to put forth a Home grown ball club in 2013 or so?

SD

by Gibby45 on Sep 9, 2011 10:57 AM EDT reply actions  

I don't really wanna defend Mo or TLR

but I think Mo has made it pretty clear he does not want to trade any of our top prospects.

FREE TYLER GREENE!
FIRE TLR!

by hittmeier on Sep 9, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

I thought Mo made it pretty clear that we weren't trading Colby...........

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

exactly

you’ll know when we’re about to trade one of these prospects when our beloved manager publicly berates him in the media and severely deflates his trade value.

My favorite words are goodbye, and my favorite color is red

by mattyp on Sep 9, 2011 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

so that means that Miller is on the block, doesn't it?

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

In 2013, the rotation could very well be:

1) Wainwright
2) Garcia
3) Free agent
4) Lynn
5) Miller

As for the infield, it could very well be: Cox (or Carpenter ), 3B; Jackson, SS; Wong, 2B; and a free agent at 1B (Pujols or another).

The outfield will likely be: Holliday, LF; Jay, CF; and Craig, RF.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

freese will be arb-eligible

Wong would have to start at AA (skipping high A) and sail through AAA as well next year.

But if we behaved like a small- to mid-market team, we would seriously be considering this scenario.

by awpierce on Sep 9, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

I could see Wong getting a callup to Memphis mid-season, too, if he hits in Springfield.

He’s a pretty well-developed player so there isn’t as much of a need to move him slowly. In 2013, the second baseman could just as likely be a scrap heap veteran of the type so common in the La Russa era.

I hope we get rid of Freese this offseason. His entire value appears to be tied to him hitting .300+ and I’m very worried about his ability to continue to do so. I have to keep reminding myself that he has only had about one full season’s worth of PA’s in the big leagues.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

I also think the book is still out on Freese

we all know he hasn’t played a full year or anything close to it – in fact, I think that is a lot of the reason Carpenter wasn’t recalled – I think the Cards want to play Freese as much as possible to get a better idea what they have there

by CRay on Sep 9, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

This hitting profile scares me too

But he had some pop throughout the minors, posting ISOs over .200 nearly every year. And he has legit oppo power even now. I wonder why he doesn’t pull the ball more regularly. I’d like to see him going to the opposite field less often with less than 2 strikes.

by awpierce on Sep 9, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

no chance freese is traded this offseason

they’ll wait until he replicates mcgehee’s 2011 when he has very little value before they’d listen, i suspect

i’m not overly confident we have someone who will be better waiting behind him, though

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'm low on carpenter/cox

in that i’m not sure either of them would be an upgrade. between the 3 3B, i think we have a window of expected production between 1 and 4 WAR. carpenter’s defense will be at least average, but if he doesn’t walk a ton – which he may not – he’s not that valuable. cox will be above average offensively, but may not be very good defensively. i think freese is average-ish overall at worst

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

i find this very hard to believe

if for no reason other than that MLB pitchers are much better and much less likely to submit a walk. i will bet real internet money that if matt capenter gets at least 300 MLB PAs next season, he will not have walk rate within 85% of his 2011 rate

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

so? Freese is almost 30

has a terrible walk rate to go along with a 20% K rate.
not to mention the injuries, I’d rather sell high on him.

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'd rather not trade away the 3B

without knowing there’s a competent replacement. it’s not like freese costs big money

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

There are internal options in Carpenter, Cox, Descalso, Greene (last two won't get many excited)

It’s not like Freese is a proven player because he have a .340 wOBA with a .360ish BABIP in a season’s worth of PAs spread out over 3 years.

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

he is the surest best

of the 3 potentially viable options. i don’t see any benefit in just handing the job to matt carpenter.

i think it’s also important to be mindful that PCL league avaerage slash line is .299/.366/.455

so carpenter has a 110 OPS+ in AAA and projects to be average defensively. i’m just not that confident in his ability to be better than or as good as freese at the major league level

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

did that wrong

that’s robinson’s line. league is .286/.359/.449 giving carpenter a 111 OPS+. the point remains

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm still not convinced that we should expect Freese to hit any better than Carpenter

Matt Carpenter’s wRC+ numbers in the minors, according to Fangraphs, are very comparable to Freese’s.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'm not sure what you're doing

are you comparing carpenter’s AAA number to freese’s AAA numbers from 4 years ago or are you comparing them to freese’s MLB numbers? either approach is extremely flawed

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

If that's how you put it, then there's no way to compare the two

when Freese is injured a lot, and when he does it’s at an unsustainable level of luck.

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

you could make reasonable projections for the two

and compare the projections. i think doing so favors freese

yes, injury and BABIP are red flags on freese. i’m not arguing that freese will defenitely be the best player of the three options next year. i’m arguing that it’s unwise to make a bet that matt carpenter will be the best of the three

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think this is a pretty reasonable point of view

I just don’t see it as clear cut. The more options the better as far as I’m concerned. I was kinda leaning towards trading Freese for a while but I’m not really there anymore.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

the more options the better

is pretty much exactly what i’m saying. in this context “betting on carpenter” means “trading freese”

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm not making a bet though, I'm using what I know

about MILB translations, and what I know about both Carpenter and Freese to determine that neither has that much of an edge on each other in terms of future performance expectancy. (probably in terms of wins, the difference is almost negligible.)
I also know Cox will probably need to see time in AAA next year, and with that he’ll start taking up Capernter’s PAs.
Freese’s value won’t be higher than what it is IMO, so I’d like to see him moved for a useful piece to our future instead of trying to be cute with our depth and keep it the same as it is now.

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

if you trade freese

you’re either betting on carpenter being our best option at 3B or you’re comfortable with a loss in production at a position that’s filled for free

i mean, i get the appeal to selling high on freese, but it’s not like we’re the only ones that see the problems with him. we’re not going to get a great package for him. i would expect a B prospect or an extra major leaguer in return. i don’t see that as being worth the risk

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I realize this is all flawed but here is what I am (trying, perhaps badly) todo

Freese as a 25 year old in 2008 had a 127 wRC+ in Memphis.
(Freese as a 26 year old in 2009 had a 133 wRC+ in Memphis.)
Carpenter as a 25 year old in 2011 had a 125 wRC+ in Memphis.

That’s all. It’s hard to compare, but I think Matt Carpenter ends up looking pretty decent offensively. The shape of their offense is very different.

I think it might come down to defense.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm still shocked by Freese's lack of power for St. Louis.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I realize his power was lackng

even before the wrist injury, but I’m hoping that had something to do with it this year and he’ll post better power numbers next year. Probably over optimistic, but eh…

My favorite words are goodbye, and my favorite color is red

by mattyp on Sep 9, 2011 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you referring to his injury this season?

I thought he broke a bond in his hand and not his wrist?

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

matt carpenter is the paradigmatic case of someone who

Should be evaluated by wOBA, not OPS.

"the less I think of it, the more certain I am." beckett

by tom s. on Sep 9, 2011 5:39 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

that's a frequent mistake.

one point of wOBA is more signficant than one point of OPS. and, as a proportion of the baseline wOBA, that one point of wOBA

albert pujols has an OPS+ of 153 and a wOBA+ of 129.
matt holliday has an OPS+ of 159 and a wOBA+ of 130.

the two stats are not on the same scale, so it makes no sense to say “the difference was only two points.”

"the less I think of it, the more certain I am." beckett

by tom s. on Sep 10, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

you realize OPS overvalues slugging, right?

which is why citing OPS+ isn’t the best approach when discussing a OBP guy like Carpenter.
/small tidbit

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Carpenter's wOBA+

is 113. Freese posted a wOBA+ of 114 and 117 for Memphis in ‘08 and ’09 although both were at a wOBA level a bit lower than Carpenter’s this year.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

nice

though i don’t remember people being too confident about freese, given his age, being able to put up competent number at the MLB level

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was optimistic about Freese.

Then he went and had success in a way I didn’t think he would, hitting for a high average with not all that much power. I’m still suprised by his hitting profile. I never thought he’d become a BABIP-dependent hitter with a low walk rate and only moderate power.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think the jury is still out on the power

he was kind of rushed back this season, then missed time with a broken hand and a concussion. i think his power numbers would have been better without that, but his OBP will take a hit if he doesn’t improve his walk rate

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Now, for a comparison of small sample sizes

Freese’s first and second halves of the season
These are each roughly for 150 PA, and while the amount is too small to be very useful, it’s interesting in that his BABIP reached human levels in the second half, and it’s interesting to see the effect in the statistics.

Still not a werewolf.

by clank on Sep 9, 2011 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't point this out to IHeartBoog...

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

if you have league wOBA numbers for PCL

i’d be happy to use them. it’s not going to be a significant difference, though

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

okay

then yes, i’m aware that wOBA is a better measure of offensive contribution than OPS

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Of course you do

but using OPS+ is probably a bad way of going about it, his stat line would’ve be just as helpful if you didn’t know where to find wOBA+

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

his stat line is not just as helpful

because it doesn’t tell me anything about the fact that the PCL has a ridiculous league average. one might think shane robinson were having some sort of breakout year without that kind of context

fortunately bgh knew where to find wOBA+ numbers and it turns out that the difference was two. i think his OPS+ is more representative than his OPS

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

on Freese

He was quoted recently as saying doctors told him it would be a full year before he was over his surgery of last summer. He’s just past that point now and Freese has also been quoted as saying he plans to try to increase his flexibility in his legs/ankles this off-season. I just don’t think we know what we have with Freese yet.

by CRay on Sep 9, 2011 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm not sure we get enough back to justify the risk...

of going with Carpenter at 3B. Freese is a high injury risk with low power and walk rates. He’s a solid defender whose offensive value is propped up on a high batting average that many doubt is sustainable.

All that said I expect him to show more power next year, and with an injury free season (hoping) I think his value could be higher next year than it is right now.

"Progress always involves risk; you can't steal second base and keep your foot on first base." - Frederick Wilcox

by cardzfanbub on Sep 9, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm confused.

I thought Carpenter walked in about 15% of his minor-league PAs? How many times has he posted a 20% walk rate?

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

i was looking at his BB rate in his 19 st louis PAs on accident

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

"average at best" is probably wrong

i’d say right around average is a good bet. i think freese is the better defender, easily, though

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

How have Freese's defensive numbers been this year?

Maybe it’s just my eyes fooling me, but Freese hasn’t really looked at all impressive defensively this year to me.

by bailorg on Sep 9, 2011 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

ah, i see my error

his walk rate in memphis is 15%, not 20%

so i’d say ZiPS is close to what i’d project. maybe give him closer to a .310 wOBA

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

The wOBA is low.

If Matt Carpenter were going to have a 15% walk rate, he’d have to have like a .240 batting average to go with it to ensure that low of a wOBA.

Beware: Velociraptors may be present.

by azruavatar on Sep 9, 2011 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

wait, now

.330 is low?

i don’t think a .240 BA is unrealistic given his 20% K rate. i do think him maintaining his 15% walk rate is very unlikely, though

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Should we be holding a 20% K rate against Carpenter and not against Freese?

Freese struck out in 21.8% and 22.7% of his PA’s in Memphis and has stuck out in 21.9% and 20.0% of his PA’s in St. Louis.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

huh?

i never said i thought freese would hit .300 going forward. what i’m saying is that a high K rate makes a low BA a reasonable expectation. freese is going to have more power, so i would peg him higher than .240

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's not like i'm making a particularly definitive statement here

i’m saying it’s unwise to trade freese because he is free and we don’t know that cox or carpenter can match his level of production

i’ve said repeatedly that i wouldn’t be surprised by a casey mcgehee-like drop in production for freese (probably not as drastic; mcgehee has only a .265 BABIP). i’m still not confident that matt capenter is better than 2011 mgehee-with-normal-luck, though

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was confused because Carpenter's strikeout rates have

generally been lower than Freese’s in the minors.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

BB rate, as in, he will still walk 21% of the time in MLB

i don’t actually know, but i really doubt it. he may have a similar or proportional isolated patience, but he won’t have a .400+ OBP in a full season of MLB work

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think I'd like us to trade either Freese or MCarp before next year.

1. I don’t think Freese brings much in a trade, so there’s little point.
2. MCarp isn’t obviously better than Freese and isn’t obviously going to be a really valuable ML player, so there’s considerable risk without considerable upside.
3. Freese’s play (either because of injury or required rest) leaves room for a left-hand hitting 3B on the roster – I’d rather Carp was that player than Descalso.
4. Cox won’t be ready by next year.

Might as well sit tight and let Freese and MCarp be cheap insurance for each other next year.

by Willie McGee's Twin on Sep 9, 2011 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

STOP SAYING THAT

You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein

Secretary of the (VEB) Tyler Greene Fan Club

In addition, IHeartFreesie

by IHeartBoog on Sep 9, 2011 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Only managing a .298 BA with a .350 BABIP terrifies me moving forward.

That being said, he does have a high LD rate. I haven’t run his numbers through an xBABIP calculator so I don’t know if my fears are misguided.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

What about Colby?

He managed only a .276 BA with a .354 BABIP

Yet people acted like he was the greatest hitter ever, and Jay was terrible, even though Colby’s BABIP was higher than Jay last year…

by DiscoJer on Sep 9, 2011 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

What about Colby?

I suppose we can resurrect the great Jay vs. Rasmus BABIP debate that has gone on all season.

For starters, I don’t think it’s fair to cast the people skeptical of Jay as believe Jay was terrible. I also think it’s a tad hypbolic to cast the pro-Rasmus crowd as believing Rasmus to be “the greatest hitter ever.” That’s simply not the case.

That being said, there was reason to be more skeptical of Rasmus’s output last season even if his 23 homers were included in his BA but not his BABIP.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who said Jay was terrible?

More accurately many believed he was a fine player unlikely to carry the high numbers that go with a high BABIP.

"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby

by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2011 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Freese is a must-trade

But this organization seems to have no concept of “trading high.” A guy plays well, the organization thinks he’s the only person capable of playing well, and therefore he is never traded.

"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby

by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2011 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, perhaps not a must trade

More of a must-think-about-trading.

"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby

by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2011 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very true.

I think it would most likely be on the infield, perhaps at shortstop. However, I think we have enough options internally at third and second that it wouldn’t be at either of those positions.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agree

Other than Jose their aren’t really other big SS to go after though right?

FREE TYLER GREENE!
FIRE TLR!

by hittmeier on Sep 9, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think I would want Rollins (depending on what the condract was).

I think his best days are behind him. He has had an ok year this year nothing to write home about. Maybe i’m overestimating the contract he will get though.

FREE TYLER GREENE!
FIRE TLR!

by hittmeier on Sep 9, 2011 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Reyes

I think they actually go after Reyes and potentially let Albert walk.

As much as I want Albert to stay I think the length of contract that is being tossed around is absurd. Reyes could potentially be had for $20m per and 6 years. Given the fact that he is younger, solves a defensive problem, and probably will get a shorter contract this feals like a better option for the team long term.

by BigJawnMize on Sep 9, 2011 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really...

I don’t think Reyes is even on the radar. I think the team intends to resign Furcal as the starting shortstop hoping to pass the reigns to Greene or Jackson in 2013. Not saying what should happen, just saying I don’t think the Cards will be in on Reyes.

"Progress always involves risk; you can't steal second base and keep your foot on first base." - Frederick Wilcox

by cardzfanbub on Sep 9, 2011 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

A "should"...

…missing between the “they” and “actually”.

I agree that I dont think this is on the radar…especially noting how Mo doesn’t think outside the box.

by BigJawnMize on Sep 9, 2011 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

would not do that

or even close

I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
...to DFA TLR

by sportsman on Sep 9, 2011 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

the thing is

they’re likely to try and sign furcal as soon as possible, so they’ll have to position filled well before they know whether or not they should be going after jose reyes. in fact, pujols very well may be the very last significant free agent to sign

it will be a very interesting off season. i don’t envy mo’s responsibilty of developing a strategy for it

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know.

I think we give Albert our best offer and if he declines move on.

FREE TYLER GREENE!
FIRE TLR!

by hittmeier on Sep 9, 2011 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I view their reported entreaties at re-signing Furcal & Berkman as an enticement for Pujols to re-sign.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

i can see that on berkman

i think he’s most likely to be the odd man out in the payroll crunch. i genuinely think furcal would be good sign and i think the front office knows it. jackson isn’t ready and no one except the fan club would be comfortable declaring greene the starter on opening day. descalso isn’t a shortstop and now we’re out of options, unless seattle has someone they would send our way for a young power arm with control issues

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm more enthusiastic about re-signing Furcal than Berkman,

because of what I anticipate the amount and length of each of their respective deals to be.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

what do you think they sign for?

i see furcal getting a guranteed $4MM for 1 year including a option/buyout and appearance incentives that could bring him into the $6-7MM range.

berkman, i dunno. 2 year contract worth $20-25MM? i’m kind of ambivalent on berkman to be honest. i feel like we kind of hit the jackpot on signing him this year. anything more than another one-year deal is pushing our luck, i beleive. i would take him on a 1-year deal worth $10-13MM including and option/buyout, though. maybe closer to 10 if we give him a blanket NTC

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

I had anticipated a higher salary for Furcal.

But, not by much. I was thinking $5-6MM guaranteed, up to $9MM with incentives, and a club option for 2013 with a low buyout.

With Berkman, I think you’re about right. I’m also not wild about anything longer than a year but Berkman will get at least two years somewhere, if not three.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

i just think this season really hurt furcal's value

he missed almost the whole thing and his offensive line hasn’t really been that good since coming back. i hope the cardinals aren’t paying him $9MM next year

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really?

That’s pretty awesome. When did he say it?
I kind of fear the team would offer him more than that anyway because they’re oh-so-nice.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

“One year suits me fine,” he said. “I just want it to be in a good situation. I’ve played in good situations pretty much my entire career. I don’t want to change that now.”

Read more: http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/article_9070c13e-08ba-5d24-a98c-9f96823b5751.html#ixzz1XUdt3yTE

by Willie McGee's Twin on Sep 9, 2011 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Awesome

A one year deal would be fine with me, assuming it’s not for 18 million dollars or something like that. Craig will get playing time filling in at various positions and maybe Berkman will rest more gradual age/platoon issues, freeing up more PAs for Craig.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm worried about pushing out luck with Berkman too

I’m really torn on signing him again. Before I heard the first rumors that we might sign him, Berkman being a Cardinal was one of those things I thought would be really cool but would absolutely never happen for obvious reasons. “Man, wouldn’t it be cool if Berkman converted back into an outfielder, and then we somehow got him, and then Berkman and Pujols could be on the same team? On a totally unrelated note, this Matt Holliday guy always seems to hit awesome against us.” Etc.
So having Berkman is like a small dream fulfilled. I can’t be 100% rational about that sort of thing, as a fan.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

("our", not "out")

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly

Rationally, I suspect we should quit well we’re ahead and hey, look, here’s Allen Craig, totally serviceable right fielder.

Emotionally, it’s Lance Berkman! He’s my favorite player on the team this year, and he totally carried the whole squad on his back at a few points! How could we let him go?…

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

The only way Berk should come back for longer than one year...

is if AP doesn’t.

"Progress always involves risk; you can't steal second base and keep your foot on first base." - Frederick Wilcox

by cardzfanbub on Sep 9, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh come on. That's not really true at all Gibby.

This year’s team featured David Freese (who we traded an older washed-up veteran FOR), Allen Craig, Lance Lynn, Skip Schumaker, Dan Descalso, Jaime Garcia, Jason Motte, Mitch Boggs, Albert Pujols, Yadier Molina, Jon Jay, Kyle McClellan, Fernando Salas, ? Sanchez, Tyler Greene, and the list goes on.

In 2013, we could have this:
 1b- Adams
2b- Craig
3b-Freese
SS-Jackson if he hits next year or mabye Greene if he can get his bat together too
lf-Holliday
cf-Jay
rf-Chambers/Brown/insert free agent
c-Yadi/Perez

Bench of Descalso, Greene, Perez, and one of Chambers/Brown/free agent

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on Sep 9, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but I think that team could win as many games as

this one did. I think that’s an 85 win team. That gives us a hell of a base to build from.

I don’t think they would score a ton of runs, but Jackson profiles as the only substandard bat in the lineup. Of course we’d need help at RF, but that’s pretty much it and our rotation looks pretty stout for 2013 if we can retain WW.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on Sep 9, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

you could put

Craig in right (where he probably belongs) and Wong at second

by CRay on Sep 9, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but I don't think Wong will be with the big club by 2013.

I think Craig will be fine at 2b, and Descalso will be a fine defensive replacement for him anyway.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on Sep 9, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

worst band name ever!

HPGF-friendly, though. I’m in.

by mikey_mac on Sep 9, 2011 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

How about

Lego and the Sharecroppers

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Good point on the total roster

My concern is that most of the heavy lifting on the club is done by aging vets who may not return. Plus, history shows that Mo and TLR are happy to employ the likes of Randy Wynn, Miles, Farnklin, Batista, Trevor Miller, Tallet, etc. I am hopeful that the contributions of Salas, Freese, etc. have turned a page at StL to give the youth a chance. But, we do have a great deal to replace … the heart of the order, our number 1 pitcher, an older and mediocre middle infield … if not this year, within a couple of years.

SD

by Gibby45 on Sep 9, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's weird how Matt Adams' end of year line looks remarkably similar to the line he put up last year

The pessimist in me says that he just had a hot start and then basically did what we should have expected him to do.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 10:58 AM EDT reply actions  

the lines are quite similar

But he did skip a level so he kept the same output while being bit young for his league. I think we potentially have the most to learn about Adams of all the AFL players.

by awpierce on Sep 9, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, after thinking about it it wasn't quite fair to say he "did what we should have expected"

because he replicated a set of numbers at a higher level. That’s definitely a positive. If he keeps replicating that line all through the majors then he’ll basically hit like Albert did this year (obviously Albert is actually a good defensive 1B and a good base runner too and had the awful start, etc. etc.) and that’s not too shabby. And he’s two years younger than the average AA hitter, so that’s a big plus also.
It’s just crazy how different the two halves were. That’s baseball for you.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I've said it before, but I'll say it again.

I hope the Cardinals shop Adams this winter because I think he is at his maximum value right now.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

THIS

FREE TYLER GREENE!
FIRE TLR!

by hittmeier on Sep 9, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, that's kind of how I feel

His hitting so far doesn’t look too too different from Allen Craig. I think he’s a tad younger at each level, a little lower average, a few less walks, probably a bit more power/ISO. Only, Craig can at least pretend to play multiple positions and nobody seems to have that illusion about Adams. Good trade candidate I think, a sell-high scenario.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Could work out nicely

if we retain Pujols and he has a good AFL. There’ll never be a better moment to move him.

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ramirez is older than you think he is.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

And by "you" I meant the figurative "you" and not "you" specifically, CodyG.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's entering his age 30 season.

For some reason I thought he was Pujols’s age. My mistake.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I must have confused him with another player.

For the life of me, I can’t remember who it was, though.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe

36-year old Alex Ramirez, who hasn’t played in the majors since 2000, and who was horrible when he did play?

"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Sep 9, 2011 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

No. Not that guy.

It’s an active player. This is really bothering me now.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's only listed as 29 this hear

Tagged for 4+ fWAR the last two years. Just about average hitting + good defense + SS = pretty good player.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great Post!

I am a sucker for the prospect lists and really enjoy the way you put this together… I will read it today and then three or four more times before next season starts…

by Lawless on Sep 9, 2011 11:15 AM EDT reply actions  

congrats also, Mr. Up

after reading many top 20 (or 30) lists in order, I really liked the way you put your list together – fun (and informative) reading

by CRay on Sep 9, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not to be that guy, but

is the first number listed for Taveras his age? Isn’t he only 19? Doesn’t this make him even more awesomer?

by ebo on Sep 9, 2011 11:16 AM EDT reply actions  

It is

and he is most awesomest.

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

sorry, should say "he is"

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Crazy

He could be a post-First Gulf War baby. He was too young to really watch Tiny Toons when it was originally on. Madness!

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

VEB "we like em young"

"Let us go forth awhile, and get better air in our lungs. Let us leave our close rooms...the game of ball is glorious." Whitman

by pattimagee on Sep 9, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Heh

I was actually looking at the data for the Pacific League, Midwest League, and Texas league just now on B-Ref. Our teams are definitely very young for their leagues.

Memphis’ pitching staff is the youngest in the Pacific League, and their hitters are the third youngest. Springfield has the youngest pitching staff in the Texas League (the only team whose pitchers’ average age is below 23 years) and the second youngest hitters (23.5 years versus 23.4 for the Travelers). The Quad Cities pitching staff is middle of the road, but the hitters are the second youngest in the Midwest League.

Not sure what this all means. Some of the differences seem pretty significant to me since we’re talking about data for entire teams. There are obviously going to be some different organizational philosophies at work too. Just thought it was interesting.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

also, why in the world is Memphis in a league called

“The Pacific Coast League?”

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on Sep 9, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

And the same reason the Big Ten has twelve teams and

the Pacific Athletic Conference has Colorado (and may soon have Oklahoma): expansion/consolidation.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

the question was rhetorical

but thanks for the informative answer. One would think they would take these things into consideration when naming leagues/conferences

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on Sep 9, 2011 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't understand why they don't re-name conferences after consolidation.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

makes too much sense

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on Sep 9, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Branding

i.e. the Big 10 has spent a lot of money developing the Big 10 brand and trademark. However, I think if you end up with the Super Conferences there may be some re-naming.

by OCCardsFan on Sep 9, 2011 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

I understand that college football is all about tradition, etc.

Didn’t the Big12Ten start out as the Big 6? I think it’d be funny if they had simply stuck with that name throughout.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also, the "Legends" and "Leaders" division names are dumb.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

The worst.

FREE TYLER GREENE!
FIRE TLR!

by hittmeier on Sep 9, 2011 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

At least Springfield is within a few hours/hundred miles of Texas...

The Pacific coast is what 24+ hr drive and 1500+ miles from Memphis.

"Progress always involves risk; you can't steal second base and keep your foot on first base." - Frederick Wilcox

by cardzfanbub on Sep 9, 2011 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

I want a swap between Utah, New Orleans, and Charlotte.

Utah Bobcats, New Orleans Jazz, and the Charlotte Hornets.
Perfect.

Still not a werewolf.

by clank on Sep 9, 2011 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Utah Hives would be hilarious.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

The ages are presented in a confusing way, IMO

And make most of the prospects appear a year older than what they are. For example, Hector Hernandez is 20 and his stats are for his age 20 season. Next year his stats will be for his age 21 season. So, it’s confusing (at least to me) to list his age 20 stats but call him 21, because that’s how old he’ll be when starting next year. Same thing for Anthony Garcia, Nick Longmire and many of the others listed.

by Willie McGee's Twin on Sep 9, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

if I did it right

everyone’s age is his 2012 “baseball age,” which is how he’ll be listed in a 2012 prospect list.

by DanUpBaby on Sep 9, 2011 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice

If he makes it up to Springfield next year he could put up pretty insane numbers in that park.

by ebo on Sep 9, 2011 11:29 AM EDT reply actions  

Maybe Franciso Samuel?

/assuming we’re just randomly listing power-armed Latino pitchers who can’t find the plate

by Willie McGee's Twin on Sep 9, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Richard Mendoza

/ i have no idea about his stuff but in 8.2 IP he has 19 walks and 20 wild pitches.

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

No I'm not!!!

I’m thinking of the pride of Pima Community College.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=delgad001ram

This guy could be the best pitcher from PCC since DJ Carrasco.

by guayzimi on Sep 9, 2011 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Geez, we get it, you have a total crush on this guy

(Totally kidding)

Anyway, thanks for linking to that, I don’t know if I had ever looked him up before or even heard of him.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ever since Jared Lee Loughner...

we need someone to make it big and change the narrative.

by guayzimi on Sep 9, 2011 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

As if on cue after my expressing my dislike for Roddick (even though he is an American) because of the way he carries himself,

Roddick flips out at the U.S. Open over a wet court.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 1:40 PM EDT reply actions  

I read that he yelled at the U.S. Open official that it's always about the money and not players' health or something.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Sep 9, 2011 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

But he won

And he’s awesome

"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister

Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of 8/28/2011)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP

by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2011 1:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I think you forgot...

…Roddicks first name – “Life Winner”

by BigJawnMize on Sep 9, 2011 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

please.

roddick’s job is to play tennis. they weren’t giving him adequate working conditions, so he got pissed.

fire tony larussa

by stlcardinalsfang on Sep 9, 2011 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

i just dropped ALL my keys down the elevator shaft.. how crafty am i!

fuuuuuuuuu

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 2:24 PM EDT reply actions  

Awesome

I’m sure the building management will get right on with retrieving them for you

bollocks

by SecondHalfMatt on Sep 9, 2011 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

wow

i’m not even sure how that’s possible

i think i would be upset, though

by prophetjohn on Sep 9, 2011 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Go make a pan of brownies

then find the maintenance guys. They just need to stop the elevator then go open the bottom doors.

by sdrone on Sep 9, 2011 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

What

How

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

She was trying to push the dead body down the shaft

and ….

I’ve said too much already.

Beware: Velociraptors may be present.

by azruavatar on Sep 9, 2011 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

No bad deed goes unpunished.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is not true

The Brewers acquired Yuni Betancourt and apparently are still going to win the NL Central.

by mojowo11 on Sep 9, 2011 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

at least you're not my brother

he broke his ankle going down some rainy stairs today

low in the zone

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 9, 2011 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

oh, that sucks

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

is that going to be a big problem with his job and such?

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, at least that's good

i hope he has a pujolsian type of recovery
and tell him to stay out of the weight room

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

thank you

my little brother thinks that I hate him but I’d probably take a bullet for him

low in the zone

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 10, 2011 3:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Can he walk or hit the one batter he faces?

If there is one thing I’ve learned this year from our LOOGYs is that is what they are brought in to do

bollocks

by SecondHalfMatt on Sep 9, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

I feel like I went to school with a guy by that name

Granted that was decades ago.

"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby

by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2011 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am on the Boone Whiting band wagon

solely because that is a great baseball name. I’m changing my name to Boone Whiting.

"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Sep 9, 2011 3:46 PM EDT reply actions  

Stavinoha had the most GIDP this year with 19

obviously he deserved to be up here with the rest of the team.

THE BATMAN|TOWEL BOY.|VP of TG Fanclub
Twitter|Google+|FREE TYLER GREENE!

by CodyG on Sep 9, 2011 4:12 PM EDT reply actions  

I mean

There are a million different arguments you can make that Stavinoha shouldn’t be on the September roster (personally, I don’t really care if he’s here or not)

But that’s a really shitty argument, considering who leads our major league team in GIDP

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh wait I think I misunderstood

CARRY ON

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

To be fair, that was very misleading of you, Mr. G

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

whatever. point to cody.

if you’re not careful, he will begin his march to victory.

would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2011 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nyjer Morgan

Chris Carpenter’s response

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on Sep 9, 2011 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

We need to draft more guys

 like Albert Pujols in all the rounds instead of just one late round.

by OKCardsfan on Sep 9, 2011 4:39 PM EDT reply actions  

That's a really good idea

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know right!?

On a completely semi-related off topic note is it – (right!? or right?!)?

by OKCardsfan on Sep 9, 2011 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

I honestly don't understand why the Cardinals haven't come up with this idea

I mean, we’re not geniuses and we can see it as clear as day.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

It seems

such a basic idea like see the ball, hit the ball type of stuff.

by OKCardsfan on Sep 9, 2011 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just another reason

not to go to Wrigley

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on Sep 9, 2011 4:47 PM EDT reply actions  

See, Chicago's bad food safety is so great due to the peculiar nature of the city itself

A smorgasbord (pun intended!) of various ethnic neighborhoods provides a rich diversity, giving rise to a veritable melting pot of culinary sanitation and quality negligence.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

history

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Jungle

would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2011 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

the smell that hit me in the face when they opened the wrigley gates

was enough to make me say no to any food
i’m now glad i did

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think

this is my new favorite shot
too bad i gotta get rid of my camera this winter

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:22 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

i'm selling everything - body, wide angle lens, telephoto, lens hoods, extra batteries, filters, remote trigger

i want to upgrade to a canon d7 but don’t know that i’ll be able to afford it by spring (i’ll do my damnest, that’s for sure)
however, i wouldn’t sell it to you, i’ve got at least some 40,000 shots on it. estimated shutter life for a 550d is around 50,000
it would be good enough for some occasional shooting for someone but not for a heavy user. i’d be doing you a disservice

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

damn. and here I was being really impressed with the

Nikon Coolpix P500 my in-laws just gave my wife and I for a joint birthday present. J/K I actually love the thing and i just got it. it’s the first ‘real’ camera I’ve ever had.

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's a very decent camera, i'd probably like to have it as a secondary

i just like to overdo things for no reason – i heard “moisture resistant magnesium alloy body” and i started salivating over the canon 7d

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well

its a Cannon anyway so it won’t work with the Nikon. Mainly looking for lenses. My wife wants every lens you just mentioned. Maybe I should buy the lenses from you and buy a new camera!

by OKCardsfan on Sep 9, 2011 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

did you know that you can use nikon lenses on canon cameras (with a small adapter wing)

but not the other way around
try to buy new lenses if possible, because focus starts to creep the more you use them. and always buy image stabilized (vibration resistant) lenses
i wouldn’t sell you any of my equipment because although it’s in great condition, it’s seen heavy use

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

You mean "get rid of" get frid of?

or ’you’re getting a new one’, get rid of?

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is awesome.

They must be combining power for some sort of double attack.

Possibly taught to them by Amaury Marti Cazana.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Amaury knows how to do the double (and triple) attack all by himself

But he swore an oath never to teach that to anybody, because the world wasn’t ready.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

today i saw a license plate that said

AMIRITE

You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein

Secretary of the (VEB) Tyler Greene Fan Club

In addition, IHeartFreesie

by IHeartBoog on Sep 9, 2011 5:38 PM EDT reply actions  

heh.

Did you watch the season finale of Suits? Now I have to wait til next summer to see what happens next. 9 months is too effing long.

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

its on my DVR

no spoilers!

i hope it comes back next year.

You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein

Secretary of the (VEB) Tyler Greene Fan Club

In addition, IHeartFreesie

by IHeartBoog on Sep 9, 2011 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

it was too good not to.

Besides they left a helluva cliffhanger.

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

lineup

Furcal 6
Jay 8
Pujols 3
Holliday 7
Berkman 8
Freese 5
Schumaker 4
Molina 2
Jackson 9

I’m going to the game and really hoped Greene would start…. poop. Hopefully the rain won’t cause any delays.

by adiueordie on Sep 9, 2011 5:41 PM EDT reply actions  

wait

berk is in right, correct? not jackson?

You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein

Secretary of the (VEB) Tyler Greene Fan Club

In addition, IHeartFreesie

by IHeartBoog on Sep 9, 2011 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's TLR's most experimental lineup to date

two center fielders, pitcher in right

Schumaker will be pitching from somewhere in between first and second

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

element of surprise ftw

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

typos in the lineup are a playground for the imagination

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

who the hell is pitching?

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Molina is going to toss the ball from behind them.

Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.

by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2011 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

i didn't mean to be snotty. i would not be at all surprised if berkman started at cf these days

You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein

Secretary of the (VEB) Tyler Greene Fan Club

In addition, IHeartFreesie

by IHeartBoog on Sep 9, 2011 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Goold on twitter:
Big O: Oscar Taveras officially awarded Midwest League batting title at .351

Taveras hit .386 overall but lacked plate apps to qualify for title. As in MLB they add “hitless” at-bats to get to minimum PAs. Hence .351

Holy crap did he have a monster season. By my back-of-the-envelope calculation, they added on 31 imaginary hitless plate appearances to his tally, and he still took the title.

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 5:58 PM EDT reply actions  

what does Walton's response mean?
BA adjusted from .386 to .351. RT @dgoold: Oscar Taveras officially awarded Midwest League batting title at .369. #stlminors #STLcards

by BVHeck on Sep 9, 2011 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

argg nvm
Derrick Goold
Taveras hit .386 overall but lacked plate apps to qualify for title. As in MLB they add “hitless” at-bats to get to minimum PAs. Hence .351.

by BVHeck on Sep 9, 2011 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

im dumb

i saw goold initial tweet that had a typo in it and they didn’t match up – thought you had posted that one, plus i hadnt seen the corrected tweet.
nothing to see here

by BVHeck on Sep 9, 2011 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

He could have just stood there and not done anything for as many extra PAs as he needed to qualify

and he still would have won the batting title?

Damn.

Ceterum censeo La Russa ire necesse est.

by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2011 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well at least he was honest

I read an article the other day about the best way to eliminate Morgan was to get inside his head a little, a-la Zambrano, and that Morgan would take care of the rest.

I’m not defending Carp, as he’s been known to show emotion on the mound, but perhaps Morgan had it coming. I don’t have a problem with Carp showing emotion, just as I don’t have a problem with a batter getting a key hit in a game, but I’ve watched all the games this year, especially with the Brewers, and Carpenter has a point about Morgan. While the cameras don’t catch every single detail, I’ve noticed more than once Morgan running his mouth and Carpenter not saying anything about it.

Morgan has to learn to just deal with things and conquer his short-man syndrome. He’s playing above-average this year, which is the reason that I believe no one has really put any attention on his “cute” alter-egos. He’s a nutcase and always has been, and when he production dips, whether this year or next, the real Nyjer will come out.

by CarpIsMyManCrush on Sep 9, 2011 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nyjer Morgan may actually have a problem

In the same sense that Big Z and Milton Bradley may actually have problems.

"...Or we could make L.A.N.C.E. into a recursive acronym, like, 'Lance: Adam Needs Cartilage from your Elbow." -- Quote by our very own DanUpBaby

by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2011 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah

He prefers to attack his own teammates, like Ryan.

by DiscoJer on Sep 9, 2011 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

wat

You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity. No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball. --Albert Einstein

Secretary of the (VEB) Tyler Greene Fan Club

In addition, IHeartFreesie

by IHeartBoog on Sep 9, 2011 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

+ever

My favorite words are goodbye, and my favorite color is red

by mattyp on Sep 9, 2011 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Trevor rosenthal will have more successful ML

Career than Tyrell Jenkins.

True or False

"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister

Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of 8/28/2011)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP

by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2011 7:16 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

That's just a silly question

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think it's genius

"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister

Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of 8/28/2011)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP

by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2011 8:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

False

just because I know you want the opposite answer. :)

by stlfan on Sep 10, 2011 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

(((((((((((((((((((((((OHCO

Is Jon Jay the next Willie McGee? Is Arthur Rhodes the next Arthur Rhodes?

by a fink on Sep 9, 2011 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

(the halls of VEB do strange things)

Is Jon Jay the next Willie McGee? Is Arthur Rhodes the next Arthur Rhodes?

by a fink on Sep 9, 2011 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

oh man

I got to see a Sun Ra based music project at jazz fest on sunday. absolutely amazing

low in the zone

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 9, 2011 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very cool! I've been listening to Heliocentric Worlds. Good stuff!

Is Jon Jay the next Willie McGee? Is Arthur Rhodes the next Arthur Rhodes?

by a fink on Sep 9, 2011 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Carp pitching to Sponge Bob, huh?

"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78

by d-dee on Sep 9, 2011 7:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Top 10 Im watching (or favs I guess)

Miller
Martinez
Tavarez
R.Jackson
Cox
Wong
Tilson
McElroy
Swaggerty
Cleto

"You may run like Mays, but you hit like sh**."

by Lankford 4 President on Sep 9, 2011 7:58 PM EDT reply actions  

So uh

Who has access to ESPN3 and wants to be generous and help me get remote access to it?

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 7:59 PM EDT reply actions  

To elaborate

All that needs to happen is you log in to my ESPN account, go to espn3.com, click “Remote Access,” and then sync up your ISP to my ESPN account. I have TimeWarner internet, but not cable, so I can’t get ESPN 3 =(

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

What's a little altruism between internet strangers?

Eh?

Eh?!

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

do you still need this?

What is Corey Patterson doing in Tyler Greene's spot on the 25-man roster?

by Robth on Sep 9, 2011 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh hey we're playing

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:17 PM EDT reply actions  

Miss Colby =(

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

How the crap did Berk catch that

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Edwin has been pretty bad for us

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

What a great jump by Albert!

I’m watching him do everything!

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well

Except “not hit into eight thousand double plays”

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Goddammit Holliday

Actually, where was the 3B

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter | Gas House Graphs

by mysterui on Sep 9, 2011 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ryan Howard big fly

Phils up on Brewers 3-0 in 1st

by BCinVA on Sep 9, 2011 8:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Amount of empty seats is disappointing

"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister

Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of 8/28/2011)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP

by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2011 8:25 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Way to take the walk Furcal!

And work on his pitch count early on btw

11 in '11

Carp on Brendan

by I-Musial-ly-Am on Sep 9, 2011 8:31 PM EDT reply actions  

I'd like to keep him around next season.

Him and Punto up the middle sounds good to me.

by illcowboy on Sep 9, 2011 8:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

They would probably need to platoon with the injuries

I mean spelling each other while on DL. Unless they occur all together like several this season. But yes perhaps.

11 in '11

Carp on Brendan

by I-Musial-ly-Am on Sep 9, 2011 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why not

But he may not be “Green” much longer. They needed to play him much earlier. Would have been better the the Erroriot or at least no worse.

11 in '11

Carp on Brendan

by I-Musial-ly-Am on Sep 9, 2011 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

aw sad

With that formatting fail, I take my leave.

by mojowo11 on Sep 9, 2011 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Game thread

over here.

Much like the Cardinals I’m suffering from some lapses in fundamentals in September.

by DanUpBaby on Sep 9, 2011 8:40 PM EDT reply actions  

I'll take you up on your challenge!

1. Shelby Miller – As if there were any doubt.
2. Oscar Taveras – This kid can hit and he’s not even taking it seriously yet.
3. Carlos Martinez – There’s a ‘heat wave’ blowing through the Cardinal system and his name isn’t Matias.
4. Lance Lynn – I couldn’t be more impressed with him. He’s got starter stuff.
5. Tyrell Jenkins – Had a good feeling about this kid from day one.
6. Kolten Wong – Who drafts a 2b in the first round?! We did and he’s damn good!
7. Zack Cox – Still think he’s over-rated, but there’s talent there.
8. Jordan Swagerty – Closer of the future.
9. Eduardo Sanchez – He may have something to say about that.
10. Matt Adams – Power bat who can hit to all fields.
11. Charlie Tilson – He’s from Chicago…………..keep the expectations on ice.
12. Matt Carpenter – Only if he’s traded.
13. Maikel Cleto – Lucky 13, still not sold on him.
14. Trevor Rosenthal – This guy just keeps growing on me.
15. Boone Whiting – Liked him from the start and he keeps getting better.
16. Ryan Jackson – Solid defense and under-rated bat.
17. Tony Cruz – Larussa has a man-crush on him for a reason.
18. Deryk Hooker – My dark horse pick to really excel next season.
19. Bryan Anderson – For god sake Mozeliak, the man has earned a chance, trade him!
20. Keith Butler – So the man’s unhitable as a reliever. Look it up.
21. Scott Gorgen – I got to believe he’ll be back with a vengence.
22. Anthony Ferrara – Better then he’s given credit for.
23. Eric Fornataro – Interchangable with Ferrara.
24. Adron Chambers – Vastly over-rated with no outstanding skill set.
25. Thomas Pham – Better then Chambers when healthy.
26. Steven Hill – Due for a monster year in memphis.
27. Roberto De La Cruz – May have to switch to 1b, but 2012 break-through POY.
28. Justin Wright – Why can no one hit this little guy???
29. Joe Kelly – Haven’t bought into the hype on this dude yet.
30. Tyler Rahmatulla – He’s in the top 5 of a lot of hitting categories.

and there you have it. Discuss amongst yourselves. I’m going to bed.

by Wileyvet on Sep 10, 2011 3:05 AM EDT reply actions   4 recs

Glad you approve

I think this was what you were looking for when you started the post.

by Wileyvet on Sep 10, 2011 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

i am overwhelmed by the kelly skepticism. i don't get it at all.

not just from you, willeyvet, but just from any number of posters.

"the less I think of it, the more certain I am." beckett

by tom s. on Sep 10, 2011 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I saw him when they came to San Antonio

He wasn’t especially dominant; however, this was against a team that went 94-46 for 2011. I’m no scout, but he looked good, and didn’t unravel in the least after a rattling injury that left him lying on the ground for a few worrisome minutes. He just went right back to work, and actually looked better afterward.

Still not a werewolf.

by clank on Sep 10, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry tom s. but,

Let me start by saying I have never personally seen Joe Kelly pitch, however, I see absolutely no dominance in his game. Reportedly he has a great arm with above average pitches, which he has a hard time keeping in the strike zone. In his minor league career he’s averaged 9 hits and 4 walks per game for a 1.42 whip and that doesn’t include hit batters (never understood why that’s not included in the whip. Do they assume a hit batter is too injured to run therefore they don’t count???) The bottom line is Joe Kelly hasn’t overwhelmed anyone……….yet. Keep the faith though, he may justify your belief in him next season and prove me totally wrong. Right now I could see players like Sam Gaviglio, CJ McElroy, Lance Jeffries, Nick Additon, John Gast, Michael Maness, Cody Stanley, Hector Hernandez, Javier Avendano, Breyvic Valera, Chase Reid, Jose, Greg and Anthony Garcia, Starlin and John Rodriguez, Charles Cutler, Matt Williams etc; all passing him on the list if he doesn’t show marked improvement in his control.

by Wileyvet on Sep 10, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't know if this has been said yet, haven't sifted through...

Oscar Taveras had a .440 BABIP to get to those final stats.

by stlfan on Sep 10, 2011 11:07 AM EDT reply actions  

Part of what I wrote up on a blog:

Before the 2011 season started, Fangraphs’ top 10 for the St. Louis Cardinals looked like this:
 
1) Shelby Miller – RH SP – 20 years old on opening day – started in High A this season – #13 overall prospect in MLB via Baseball America
A+ ball – 2-3, 2.89 ERA, 1.82 FIP, 9 starts, 53 IP (5.89 IP/start), 81 K, 20 BB, .330 BABIP
AA ball – 9-3, 2.70 ERA, 2.73 FIP, 16 starts, 86 2/3 IP (5.42 IP/start), 89 K, 33 BB, .308 BABIP
Miller dominated until being asked to get away from his explosive fastball and work on his breaking pitches more. Miller also got suspended for violating policy as a minor (in the legal sense) at the end of the year.
 
2) Zack Cox – 3B – 22 – High A – #62 via BA
A+ ball – .335/.380/.439/.819 in 180 plate appearances – 8 doubles, 3 homers, 11:29 BB:K, 2 SB, 2 CS, .388 BABIP
AA ball – .293/.355/.432/.787 in 389 plate appearances – 19 doubles, 10 homers, 29:69 BB:K, 0 SB, 1 CS, .338 BABIP
Only thing I really heard about Cox was that he struggled initially in AA, but he and the hitting coach found a flaw in his swing and he starting hitting better than he did in A+ ball until the end of the season at that point.
 
3) Joe Kelly – RH SP – 22 – High A
A+ ball – 5-2, 2.60 ERA, 3.41 FIP, 11 starts (12 G), 72 2/3 IP (6.06 IP/start), 62 K, 34 BB, .275 BABIP
AA ball – 6-4, 5.01 ERA, 4.53 FIP, 11 starts, 59 1/3 IP (5.39 IP/start), 51 K, 25 BB, .358 BABIP
Interesting numbers at those levels. He’ll have time to work in the minors to see just what he can become. AA is a hitters’ paradise and they hit him well there.
 
4) Carlos (Matias) Martinez – RH SP – 19 – A
A ball – 3-2, 2.33 ERA, 2.35 FIP, 8 starts, 38 2/3 IP (4.83 IP/start), 78 K, 14 BB, .299 BABIP
A+ ball – 3-3, 5.28 ERA, 4.03 FIP, 10 starts, 46 IP (4.6 IP/start), 50 K, 14 BB, .351 BABIP
Jumped his way into the top 5-10 prospects in the nation with his amazing season of 128 K and 28 BB in just under 85 IP.
 
5) Tyrell Jenkins – RH SP – 18 – Rookie 2
Rk2 – 4-2, 3.86 ERA, 2.79 FIP, 11 starts, 56 IP (5.09 IP/start), 55 K, 13 BB, .373 BABIP
Having a .373 BABIP against you and getting through over 5 innings a start with about a K an inning and a low walk rate, especially having given up as few runs as he did, is VERY impressive. Even his LOB% (61.5%) was low, this is why his FIP is so much lower than his ERA (over a full point.) He pitched like an ace in his first full season. I love to see it, but he’s a long way off.
 
6) Seth Blair – RH SP – 22 – A
A ball – 6-3, 5.29 ERA, 5.71 FIP, 21 starts, 81 2/3 IP (3.89 IP/start), 70 K, 62 BB, .298 BABIP
This is pretty much the opposite of Tyrell Jenkins. :(
 
7) Lance Lynn – RH SP – 23 – AAA
AAA ball – 7-3, 3.84 ERA, 2.92 FIP, 12 starts, 75 IP (6.25 IP/start), 64 K, 25 BB, .344 BABIP
MLB – 1-1, 1 save, 3.12 ERA, 2.88 FIP, 2 starts (18 games), 34 2/3 IP, 40 K, 11 BB, .272 BABIP
I am super high on Lance Lynn after this year. I think he either needs to have a chance to start or close next year.
 
8) Eduardo Sanchez – RH RP – 22 – AAA
AAA ball – 1-0, 0.00 ERA, 1.20 FIP, 2 games, 3 IP, 3 K, 0 BB, .000 BABIP
MLB – 2-1, 5 saves, 1.88 ERA, 3.16 FIP, 25 games, 28 2/3 IP, 33 K, 16 BB, .213 BABIP
I’m also super high on Sanchez. His “stuff” is some of the best I’ve ever seen. He needs to seriously work on his control in the offseason, once his shoulder is healthy.
 
9) Oscar Taveras – OF (CF/RF/LF) – 18 – A
A ball – .386/.444/.584/1.028 in 347 PAs, 27 doubles, 5 triples, 8 HR, 32:52 BB:K, 1 SB, 4 CS, .440 BABIP
Great year helped by a HUGE BABIP.
 
10) (Matthew) Jordan Swagerty – RHP (starter and reliever) – 21 – A
A ball – 3-1, 1.50 ERA, 2.27 FIP, 5 starts, 30 IP (6 IP/start), 30 K, 2 BB, .229 BABIP
A+ ball – 2-2, 5 saves, 1.82 ERA, 2.52 FIP, 7 starts (22 games), 52 K, 16 BB, .279 BABIP
AA ball – 0-0, 3 saves, 2.89 ERA, 4.70 FIP, 9 games, 7 K, 5 BB, .250 BABIP
Swagerty jumped two levels this year. That’s kinda strange to do, I believe, but he did it well until his short stint in AA – a hitters’ paradise.
 
*All MLB #s are not complete.
 
Statistical Leaders
All players above rookie ball had to have at least 200 plate appearances to make the leaderboards.
All players at rookie ball 1 or below had to have at least 100 plate appearances to make the leaderboards.
(Note: The formatting looked much better when I originally typed it up. Sorry. Looks ugly now.)
 
Average/OBP/SLG
AAA – Mark Hamilton – .345/Mark Hamilton – .439/Tyler Greene – .579
AA – Charles Cutler – .333/Jermaine Curtis – .414/Matt Adams – .566
A+ – Greg Garcia – .290/Greg Garcia – .400/Xavier Scruggs – .494
A – Oscar Taveras – .386/Oscar Taveras – .444/Oscar Taveras – .584
A- – Jeremy Patton – .292/David Medina – .382/David Medina – .452
Rk1 – Luis Perez – .296/Ildemaro Vargas – .391/Luis Perez – .478
Rk2 – Tyler Rahmatulla – .314/Anthony Garcia – .407/Tyler Rahmatula – .545
FRk – Robelys Reyes – .378/Robelys Reyes – .453/Robelys Reyes – .554
 
OPS/Doubles/Home Runs
AAA – Tyler Greene – 1.001/Nick Stavinoha – 30/Nick Stavinoha – 28
AA – *Matt Adams – .923/Ryan Jackson – 34/Matt Adams – 32
A+ – Xavier Scruggs – .834/Xavier Scruggs – 27/Xavier Scruggs – 21
A – Oscar Taveras – 1.028/Oscar Taveras & Jonathan Rodriguez – 27/Jonathan Rodriguez – 20
A- – David Medina – .834/Jeremy Patton & Romulo Ruiz – 20/David Medina – 8
Rk1 – Luis Perez – .843 Ildemaro Vargas – 11 Michael Knox – 5
Rk2 – Tyler Rahmatulla & Anthony Garcia – .935/Tyler Rahmatulla – 27/Roberto De La Cruz – 16
FRk – Robelys Reyes – 1.007/Robelys Reyes – 11/Robelys Reyes – 6
*Adams finished second, but Alex Castellanos was traded and is no longer in the organizations.
 
Triples/Steals
AAA – Adron Chambers – 5/Adron Chambers – 22
AA – Four tied – 3/Jose Garcia – 19
A+ – Rainel Rosario – 6/Rainel Rosario – 15
A – Chris Edmondson – 6/Ronny Gil – 18
A- – Virgil Hill – 6/Cesar Valera – 10
Rk1 – Jem Argenal – 3/Lance Jeffries – 12
Rk2 – Anthony Garcia & Ronard Castillo – 4/Matthew Williams – 20
FRk – Robelys Reyes & Fernando Baez – 5/Robelys Reyes – 22

by stlfan on Sep 10, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

The Internet's #1 St. Louis Cardinals blog.
Yahoo_full_count

Managers

Jack_benny__1__small DanUpBaby

Editors

Bendermad_small azruavatar

Trigun_001_small the red baron

Images_small tom s.

Authors

1989_bgh_cropped_small bgh

Valverde_medium_small vivaelpujols