Late Night VEB: Cardinals to Become Team Coco?
by bgh on Dec 19, 2011 9:52 PM EST
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PrintThe Cardinals' efforts to sign a free agent outfielder seem to be coming to head. Over the weekend, Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports reported that the club did "extensive background work" on free agent outfielder Carlos Beltran and that Beltran was currently deciding between multiple offers of two and three years in length. In that report, Rosenthal also broke the news that the Redbirds have "expressed interest" in free agents Cody Ross and Coco Crisp.
Steve Henson of Yahoo! tweets tonight that the Cardinals are "in discussions" with Crisp to play center field and bat at the top of the order with Jon Jay shifting to right field while Craig rehabs from the knee surgery he underwent earlier this offseason.
**UPDATE**
Ace Post-Dispatch reporter Derrick Goold has contacted Crisp's agent who refused to characterize discussions, indicated that multiple teams are interested, and that a decision likely wouldn't be imminent. Goold further elaborates that some teams are checking in on Crisp "as an alternative to other outfielders" and included the Cardinals in this group.
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i'd sign any of the three. it would really depend on the terms. ideally, beltran has the most impact.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 19, 2011 9:56 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I grew up on Whitey-Ball....
…so I would love to see a speedy lead-off guy with some pop, especially if he plays a decent CF. Beltran has moore upside – IF he’s healthy. Crisp is a few years younger than Beltran too, although I wouldn’t give either one of them a lot or moore than 2 years with an option for a 3rd. James on FG has Crisp at 2.8 WAR vs Beltran’s 3.4 as projections, with Crisp being a better fielder. I dunno, Beltran’s knees just scare me, I voted for Crisp, 3 years, 18 mil. Stick him in CF until one of the baby birds is ready, slide Jay over to RF until Craig is healthy, and as the new 4th outfielder. Works fer me. Plus, we’d have cereal in the outfield!
:=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
Darvish announcement should be coming soon.
Trade Westbrook
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Dec 19, 2011 9:58 PM EST reply actions
over under 55 million posting fee?
i say over.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 19, 2011 10:03 PM EST up reply actions
Gotta be under...
you give him a 5/50 and your paying $21 million a year for the guy. That’s the fifth highest salary ever for a pitcher, more than Roy Halladay.
Sign Roy O
i'm just saying, rumors are it beats the DiceK fee.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 19, 2011 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
that'd be nuts...
CJ Wilson got a five year deal paying 15.5M a year for five years. He’s actually dominated major league hitters, and you might argue he has less mileage on his arm than Darvish.
Sign Roy O
@JimBowdenESPNxm
Source unconfirmed from Japan…Nippon Ham-Fighters will accept bid from US Club with team to be announced shortly by MLB ….standby….
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
if the bid is anything like the 8-figure numbers tossed around - $40-$50m - i can't imagine them declining.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
also, Ed Wade is now in scouting in the Phillies organization
they’re REALLY fucked for the future now
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
I believe he headed the Philly organization when it drafted Howard, Utley, Rollins, Victorino, Burrell, and Abreu, didn't he?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
oh, did he?
my bad then, maybe that’s the one thing he can do competently.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 19, 2011 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
Spotting talent is a lot different from running an organization.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
He's only good at seeing high school and college talent?
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Dec 19, 2011 10:16 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Abreu was signed by the Stros out of Venezuela.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
...and Zobrist...
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
The Stros really were pioneers there
Freddy Garcia, Richard Hidalgo, et al
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 10:20 PM EST up reply actions
Hildago is my favorite random steroid user.
He was AWESOME that one year!
"He probably misses his old glasses."
2000: .314/.391/.636/1.028
44 HRs, 122 RsBI.
If you’re wondering how much offense has changed in 12 years, he was 9th in WAR (6.6), 20th in MVP votes, 8th in OPS, 4th in HRs, & 7th in RsBI.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
Also, he had a .427 wOBA and was +13 fielding.
And was only 7.5 WAR. That seems low for those two numbers.
I AM ACTUALLY STLCARDSFAN4 JUST TO CLARIFY YOUR POSSIBLE CONFUSION.
The league average wOBA in 2000 was like .360 or something
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
.341
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 19, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
How did he wind up with the Phillies?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Signed by the Rays in the expansion draft.
Traded to the Phillies for some piece of poop by the old idiotic Rays.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
Left available due to Richard Hidalgo IIRC.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Whoops
November 18, 1997: Drafted by the Tampa Bay Devil Rays from the Houston Astros as the 6th pick in the 1997 expansion draft.
November 18, 1997: Traded by the Tampa Bay Devil Rays to the Philadelphia Phillies for Kevin Stocker.
Link
Teach Me How To Torty
by HollidaysofThunder on Dec 19, 2011 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
Shane Victorino was drafted by the Dodgers.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 10:18 PM EST up reply actions
How'd he end up with the Phillies?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Was that when Wade was with Philly or after he had moved on?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
i like this news
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Dec 19, 2011 10:05 PM EST up reply actions
Not sure how he can trade another team's good players to Philadelphia with this move.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Coco Crisp
In his 49 games as a Kansas City Royal before getting injured, he was an absolute joy to watch play center field. I don’t know if the numbers/statistics back me up on this one, but he was a damn fine center fielder.
Also, his father’s (nick)name was Sugar Crisp. No lie.
That being said, Beltran is a much better sign.
Derrick Goold on Coco:
Re: Coco Crisp. Multiple teams interested. Agent doesn’t want to “characterize” discussions. Didn’t expect imminent resolution
Crisp, ’99 Cards draft pick, seeks contender. Some interested teams are checking on him as alternative to other OFs (see: #stlcards).
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
This makes me feel better
Sounds like Mo is simply doing his due diligence on Crisp and letting it leak for leverage on Lozano and Beltran.
I would have no objection to a Crisp signing if Beltran goes elsewhere, but I wouldn’t sign him until that occurs.
Didn't Coco come up with us originally?
I’d rather have Beltran anyway
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Dec 19, 2011 10:08 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Yes. Drafted 6 rounds before He Who Is Now An Angel.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
Interesting especially if Coco does well and Albert doesn't narrative
but not that much I suppose
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 19, 2011 10:11 PM EST up reply actions
Clearly Coco was the best player in that draft
Also HFS, in the 90’s we drafted Morris, Drew, Ankiel, Coco and accidentally found Albert, how the hell did we start sucking at drafting in the 2000’s?
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Dec 19, 2011 10:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Wasn't that Jockety's job?
Not sure we can blame Tony for that one.
by sgf_stl_cardsfan on Dec 19, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
Lunhow didn't start drafting until 03-04.
And Jocketty just liked to use the farm system as trade fodder.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 12:52 AM EST up reply actions
Beltran, Crisp, and Ross in that order. (assuming reasonable deals are possible)
In other news, has Rashard Mendenhall ever hit the hole hard (on the football field)?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 10:11 PM EST reply actions
Your question is better suited to the last thread.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
heh I saw what you did there
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 19, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
Derrick Goold @dgoold Close
There have been reports of Cubs, Giants, Dodgers, Tigers interested in Crisp. @Ken_Rosenthal linked Crisp/Cards on Sat. Cody Ross also a fit
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
if Coco's looking for a contender
then that’s the Tigres, Giants and us.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
if you're going with "Tigres"
you must also say “Gigantes”
by hangingfromatree on Dec 20, 2011 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
Holliday's FB page is promoting this
Teach Me How To Torty
by HollidaysofThunder on Dec 19, 2011 10:40 PM EST reply actions
double entendre
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 19, 2011 10:44 PM EST up reply actions
Does Crisp Make Any Sense With Schumaker Already Signed
I thought Schumaker was going to be the fourth outfielder. Why resign him and then add Crisp? Schumaker is not a bad option in CF so why not just play him there until Craig is back. I hope this is just talk.
Schumaker is a terrible option in CF.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 19, 2011 10:52 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Schumaker's center field defense is atrocious.
And when I say atrocious, what I mean is — actually, yeah, I just mean atrocious.
He's been pretty bad, especially in the last WS
RE-SIGN EVERYONE
by Notorious PSC on Dec 19, 2011 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
When Skip Schumaker started in CF, we won the World Series
it is what it is
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 19, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I guess physically Schumaker can actually stand in center field and ostensibly play baseball while the other team is hitting
But I would not quite call that playing MLB-quality CF. He has averageish speed at best for all MLBers let alone CFers.
Not afraid to nitpick
masochist
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 12:56 AM EST up reply actions
Jays get Darvish
@BudSeIig
Allan Huber Selig
Its Official, the Toronto Blue Jays have won the bidding for SP Yu Darvish at $52 000 000 (US)
Sweet sassy molassey
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Wait, that's not a real account
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
OR NOT
JeffPassan Jeff Passan
The Texas Rangers have won the posting auction of Japanese right-hander Yu Darvish with a record $51.7M bid, sources tell Yahoo! Sports.
Damn all these AL East AL West teams and their evil empires.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 19, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
heh
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 19, 2011 11:34 PM EST up reply actions
and we've got what? another 5-6 years before we can renegotiate
a tv deal? That really sucks. not that we’re likely to get that much more anyway.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 12:58 AM EST up reply actions
they should get a hell of a lot more than they get now
but it won’t be anything like what LA & Tex have gotten
Balls
maybe.
i don’t see it getting anywhere near 100 mil though.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:14 AM EST up reply actions
oh, c'mon
you don’t think dirt cheap fun fun is going to pay $100 per capita to advertise in STL?
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
by SleepyCA on Dec 20, 2011 1:16 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
heh.
only if it brings every drunk in the bi-state area
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:19 AM EST up reply actions
Using the same math that lets the Angels call theirs "$150M" when it's more 75-80M
The Cards can get $50M a year and that’s “$100M” just the same.
Not afraid to nitpick
I thought they already got around 50?
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:25 AM EST up reply actions
holy shit.
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 19, 2011 11:13 PM EST up reply actions
dumb question, but will the
new MLB draft rules, regarding international free agents, apply to Japanese players next year? If so, the Blue Jays might have tremendous leverage here…
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
Rangers Get Darvish
The Texas Rangers have won the posting auction of Japanese right-hander Yu Darvish with a record $51.7M bid, sources tell Yahoo! Sports.
Sweet sassy molassey
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
by mysterui on Dec 19, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
The Lone Star Ball guys were begging to get him during the WS.
Congrats, guys.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
wouldn't paying wilson have been a better bet
yu hasn’t thrown an inning of mlb
TLR is gone, long live the king
You would think.
The heart wants what the heart wants. Or something.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:18 PM EST up reply actions
wilson is going to be much more affordable which will probably make him a better deal
but I’d be willing to put darvish’s career-long domination of NPB ahead of wilson’s almost equally confusing career if we’re just talking who’ll be better next season.
I would rather have Darvish.
Darvish could be better than Wilson (I think he will be) but he’ll assuredly be worth more to the team in market and business opportunities
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
In Texas?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions
I was under the impression the Jays got him.
In any event, the Rangers will probably sell a million jerseys in Osaka. I’d still rather have Darvish than Wilson.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
I was really hoping the Jays would get him
Now they will feel compelled to spend some money and sign Beltran.
This was probably the watershed moment for his market; I bet he signs somewhere in the next 48 hours.
Even if that's true (which we don't know)
The Jays were probably at least somewhat close to the 50 MM offer by The Rangers, and that money would simply be gone – with no gain whatsoever. I doubt they’d blink too much in giving Beltran 3 years and 40-45 million if they really want him, and if this off-season has taught us anything, its this: Money Talks.
The money isn't gone
They get to keep the posting fee if they don’t sign Darvish.
(Heading this off at the pass: no, they can’t just put up a ridiculous bid and lowball him. They have to negotiate in good faith.)
Not afraid to nitpick
Sure it is
if they sign Darvish, they still have to negotiate a contract with him and pay him that amount. I guess you could make the argument that it simply gets added to Darvish’s total contract value, but it amounts to dead money.
Yes, IF they sign Darvish
Hell, Beltran might even wait 30 days to see if they actually do sign Darvish. Boras has never lacked patience.
Not afraid to nitpick
Doesn;t matter anyway
the Rangers got Darvish so this is a moot point.
I was just saying that the Jays were willing to burn around 50 million on Darvish, which is money they now have back. I would not be at all surprised to see them throw stupid money at Beltran now.
it's been widely reported he does not want to play there
and if he goes the Jays will DH him because of his knees.
money does in fact talk so if they offer him that much he’ll be singing O Canada & sipping on some Tim Horton’s coffee like he was born there
Balls
Oh I haven't seen the reports saying he doesn't want to play there
Have the links on hand? I’m curious
ugh, don't make me do work man, can't you trust me?
i’m not your normal internet poster who just throws things up against the walls
Balls
I trust ya man!
I’m genuinely curious as to what exactly the reports say; often the wording infers things.
I can't imagine a MLB franchise just has $51.7M in cash laying around (well, if they do they are stupid)
I have to imagine they have to finance that much of a lump sum with a loan or something.
Not afraid to nitpick
I mean yes, but no
The description of a 20-year deal as being $150M AAV is incredibly misleading. It’s more like 75 mil for 2012 growing at 6% per year.
Not afraid to nitpick
Well
The sum of 75 million growing at 6% (i.e. year 2 is $80mil, year 3 is $85mil etc) over 20 years is about $3 billion. They list it at that as a dick swinging thing.
Not afraid to nitpick
The Jays have the richest owners in MLB
Also, even if they had the money, they’d still finance it. Presumably the posting fee could be financed over a very long term.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
Have you heard of the Miami Marlins?
And their profit-sharing techniques
by Cheeseballs on Dec 20, 2011 12:49 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Now can someone answer this question for me?
Is Darvish now compelled to sign with the Rangers?
If not, doesn’t that give him insane negotiating leverage? Seems like a team would just get taken to town on this deal with 50 MM already riding on it.
They don't pay the fee if they don't reach a deal.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
Ok, that makes much more sense.
From what I had read before, I thought the fee was not returned if negotiations fell through.
He can either sign with the Rangers or go back to the Fighters.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
Just a new guy I think
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
that's what I always thought
but it’s Grand Daddy Mac or something.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, i was really dumb when i was 17
but it was the 90’s & everyone wanted to be a rapper. especially white suburban guys in ohio
Balls
I thought everyone wanted to be grunge?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 19, 2011 11:44 PM EST up reply actions
that's pretty much how it works with most musicians, really.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
Action Jaxon is a VEBer.
Action Jackson is a Carl Weathers movie, and among the greatest films of all time:
Schumaker
You guys make Schumaker sound horrible. He did start the final game in the WS. I understand he is not your longterm solution out there but I thought that this was a temporary need until Craig came back. If it is not a temporary solution then they are crazy if they do not add a bat. Crisp in CF and Jay in RF is not good at all.
I would also like to suggest that the most obvious need is for at least one and maybe two durable starting pitchers. Wainright certainly helps but I am not sure where the durable innings are going to come from after Wainright and even Wainright is coming back after major surgery. Carpenter is aging, Garcia maybe matures some, but Lohose and Westbrook have not been very durable at all. I really think that starting pitching is the real weak link on this team.
Lohse and Westbrook are actually pretty good 4 and 5 starters
And can you please elaborate on why Schumaker is a better player than Crisp?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
crisp into cereal, while
skippy is into footwear, which is much more expensive and useful in baseball
TLR is gone, long live the king
can always bring a memphian up for a start here and there
and they probaby should
cleto could take 1 of ww’s starts each month
TLR is gone, long live the king
You forgot "it is what it is"
Seriously the fact that he started the final game is nothing but an indictment of our OF depth and TLR’s decisionmaking. If that’s the best argument for his ability, then I suppose we don’t have to worry about his baseball skills: He has none.
"Congratulations to the Cardinals! Such a fun world series." - Salman Rushdie
the starting pitching depth is mostly in relief next year
I would certainly hope to see rzepczynski or lynn in the mix at some point no matter how healthy everybody else is, and maikel cleto shouldn’t be considered a sure-fire reliever either after his nice year in three minor league rotations.
with the top prospects on the way after that, starting with shelby miller, I don’t think the cardinals should sign a starter unless he’s clearly better than (and replacing on the payroll) westbrook or lohse.
FWIW if i had been healthy & didnt have a noodle for an arm i would have started game 7
he started CF by default. that’s not really a good point to argue his usefulness
Balls
I do agree that if we are priced out of the beltran
Market, starting pitching might be the easiest place to upgrade the team substantially. The trick would be to improve the team without tying the team down for more than one year.
I do not agree that schumaker is a good or even decent option in centerfield. Almost any defensive measure would say that jay + crisp is much better than jay + schumaker.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 20, 2011 12:18 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Darvish Right
As I understand the 50 MM gives the Rangers the exclusive negotiating rights only.
thought they ate some of the posting fee?
because TLR
by punchinjudy on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
So are the b-jays Gonna double down on Beltran now?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Dec 19, 2011 11:20 PM EST via mobile reply actions
hopefully they decide to go in on prince now or something else
but yeah this could screw us in terms of beltran
Also
Werent the rangers bankrupt…..like yesterday?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Dec 19, 2011 11:21 PM EST via mobile reply actions
They got bought out by another ownership group and got a giant TV deal
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Posting system:
Under this system, when an NPB player is “posted”, MLB holds a four-day-long silent auction during which MLB teams can submit sealed bids in an attempt to win the exclusive rights to negotiate with the player for a period of 30 days. If the MLB team with the winning bid and the NPB player agree on contract terms before the 30-day period has expired, the NPB team receives the bid amount as a transfer fee, and the player is free to play in MLB. If the MLB team cannot come to a contract agreement with the posted player, then no fee is paid, and the player’s rights revert to his NPB team.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
thank you.
someone here a couple days ago just about had me convinced otherwise
HAPPY FLIGHT!!!
Running list of Molina pick-offs | twit
i don't know if fink is around tonight...
but he’s going down next week.
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST reply actions
Is that a euphemism?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions
Wanna bet a sig?
VEB WINTER MEET-UP DISCUSSION
SIGN CARLOS BELTRAN
by a fink on Dec 19, 2011 11:57 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
oh, absolutely.
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 19, 2011 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
Two weeks, starting immediately after our game is over?
VEB WINTER MEET-UP DISCUSSION
SIGN CARLOS BELTRAN
absolutely.
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2011 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
Schumaker vs Crisp
Not saying that Schumaker is a better option than Crisp. Just saying that it is supposedly a short term solution until Craig returns. I would rather have Jay than Crisp and seems like that is what this would eventually come down to.
I don't make the connection with jay
crisp has had persistent injury problems, and jay is cheap and left-handed. there’ll be plenty of playing time for whoever’s the fourth outfielder.
Well I'd rather have Crisp starting in the outfield when/if
Holliday/Craig/Jay/Berkman get hurt (with Craig moving to 1B if Lance was out) as opposed to Skip.
honestly, if they don't get beltran
i don’t think any of the other fa options will make any real difference for the one month they are likely to start
TLR is gone, long live the king
Goddamn you motherfuckers like to talk
by purple_haze on Dec 19, 2011 11:26 PM EST via mobile reply actions
too flashy
though i wouldn’t necessarily call that my dream car. it’s something that i could reasonably afford in the next few years
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:34 PM EST up reply actions
its only money
but i’d compromise on S4
best performance/dollar value they have
TLR is gone, long live the king
good for the environment right?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:36 AM EST up reply actions
I don't know that much about tesla motors, but
Elon Musk, who founded both Tesla Motors and SpaceX, is an incredibly interesting figure. Without rehashing the details, he’s basically a modern-day Howard Roarke- a true visionary, driven to do extraordinary things, unwilling to settle for the mediocre. He founded SpaceX with the goal of going to Mars, and if we’re ever going to go into space, really, without massive government expenditures, it’s going to be because of people like him.
I toured SpaceX in Hawthorne a couple weeks back, and it’s very clear that they are on the right track in a lot of ways. To massively oversimplify: underrate your system, design the system, not, “not to fail”, but, “it’s OK if it fails, as long as it’s one or two, no more than a third of our engines, at once”, and, simultaneously, “none of them blow up”. Add some minimal esoteric capabilities (like gimbaling thrusters, even if it’s only a couple of degrees), minimize the number of mission-critical components, design out the critical failure modes (no O-rings, here), apply good SE practices and evaluate them closely, and build everything critical in-house, with no major subcontractors who cut corners, you can get away with having a rocket-science version of “google culture”, with 24 year old kids with long hair and metallica shirts running around the factory stitching 0.1X0 thickness 7-series heat treated aluminum together (instead of $$$ .0XX titanium alloys, for single engine rockets), with minimal oversight, while maintaining man-rated mission assurance levels. And, btw, you can also massively reduce test and integration costs.
It was amazingly refreshing.
Anyway, unless there is a very unlucky launch event in the near future, or the gov’t bureaucracy prevents them from doing business, SpaceX will be able to beat the ULA’s of the world by a factor of 10X in cost, just by designing smart systems. And the OODA loop for the big companies is so huge, SpaceX has a 10-ish year jump. Not sure if that has anything to do with Musk’s management, but if it does, and he runs Tesla anywhere nearly as well as he runs SpaceX (and also, assuming Tesla’s competitors are as incompetent as the major space systems companies), Tesla motors won’t be a joke for long.
Plus, their cars are sexy as hell.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
by SleepyCA on Dec 20, 2011 2:39 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
tesla motors is on life support from toyota & the fed government
both have given them millions & they are still about dead. they keep making promises they can’t keep. their cars look awesome, but a vast majority of them don’t work & constantly break down.
Balls
where did you get your info
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 8:00 PM EST up reply actions
It would be cool and all if those companies could come up with something viable
But the technology just isn’t there yet. And then there’s the issue of mass producing the batteries and replacing them, and the extra burden on the grid that truly widespread usage would cause, etc. etc.
"I'll be deep in the cold, cold ground before I recognize Missoura!"
even the very popular prius causes way more damage to earth
than every one built could ever undo with all the gas savings they do. electric cars are just not viable options right now.
Balls
They stopped taking orders
for new ones mid-2011, and the cost was somehting close to $110K.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2011 1:58 AM EST up reply actions
i prefer things that are simple and elegant
also, i’m mainly thinking about things that i can reasonably afford in the next few years
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
you sound like every accountant i sold a car to, they all wanted a very simple & basic car that wasn't ugly
there’s nothing wrong with that. most car buyers want the same thing
Balls
i don't want something basic, i want something elegant
i think there’s a big difference between a passat and a corolla
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:39 PM EST up reply actions
here's another example of what i mean by simple and elegant
i’m also more than a few years away from this being a wise purchase, probably
http://www.bmwusa.com/standard/content/vehicles/2012/5/535ixdrivesedan/default.aspx
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:40 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, it's pretty damn sharp
but not too flashy like that audi up there
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:43 PM EST up reply actions
I like Audi A4s
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
me too
i’m actually looking at a 2003 to buy right now
http://austin.craigslist.org/cto/2746469338.html
miles are a little higher than i was wanting, though
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions
that's a lot of miles but it should run forever
it looks in good shape too, i’d offer $5700 if you’re serious about it & see what they think
Balls
problem is, every housewife in LA has one.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
pretty much the interchangable yuppimobile parade, yeah.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
I don't like the new passat
it’s a really crass attempt by VW to make an “american” car, and it seems to be working. I’d rather just buy the new malibu or the next fusion and call it a day.
i don't really know what that means
but i think that fusions are pretty nice, too, so i guess i’m part of the problem
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
for the new jetta and passat they created big, decontented american versions
to replace the smaller, “european” models that hadn’t been selling.
and I drive a (beat-up, old) fusion, so more power to you.
the V6, which was the kind of mistake you make when you're 19
it’s not especially punchy, but the transmission is great, so I just nurse it into a really high gear as much as possible and pretend I’m not getting terrible gas mileage.
that's how I felt until gas went up
now I’m more interested in weird hybrid and CNG tech than power. it’s kind of a gutless v6 anyway, the post-refresh 3.0 or the 3.5 would be a different story.
very true, i've driven a few Lexus hybrid's & they aren't too bad
those are the only hybrids ive been around, the Ford hybrid is supposed to be pretty good
i have a big Corvette derived V8 in my truck & freaking love the way it sounds. i think i’d get better mileage driving a bus in the city though
Balls
Anyone know of a 2-door that actually has a pretty big trunk?
I have no need for a 4-door but I can’t stand the thought of the itsy bitsy trunks most of those things come with.
Not afraid to nitpick
the current accord is pretty enormous
there just aren’t many coupes out anymore that aren’t purpose built as sports/ponycars.
I wish owning a sports car wasn't so strongly associated with being a person I don't like
Apparently the Challenger’s trunk is even bigger.
Not afraid to nitpick
if you drive a Challenger drive the V6 before you drive the HEMI
before i was fired i actually was able to do a better burnout with the PentaStar V6 than i could in the HEMI
Balls
I have no intentions of driving a V8, ever
I’m a dangerous enough driver as is.
Not afraid to nitpick
so what were you fired for ... if it's not to personal
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 20, 2011 7:23 AM EST up reply actions
the used car manager told me i was too honest to sell cars
and he fired me when i wouldn’t lie to customers. if i’m too honest to sell cars, i can live with that
Balls
good for you!
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 21, 2011 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
me want this
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2011 2:01 AM EST up reply actions
one of my brothers has one. he loves it.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 2:04 AM EST up reply actions
1/32 scale?
Actually a friend of mine had one, 06 or 07 model. Had nothing but problems with it and when transmission went out in something like under 2 years, it was out of warranty and they wouldn’t replace it. IIR cost him like $4.5K to replace.
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 20, 2011 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
1/32 scale would be about all I could afford new
I don’t look at reliable cars. Just fun ones while they are working.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Jags are definitely sexy looking
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 20, 2011 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
I watched Black Swan last night
It was a lot better than I thought it would be, but I don’t think I’d watch it again. Not exactly the most subtle movie.
Saw Sherlocke Holmes today and that was pretty good. Better than the first one IMO.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
MI4 is awesome
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
The new Michael Bay movie looks awesome
And by awesome I mean the exact same thing as the last three transformers movies. I throw my milk duds at the screen after the preview ended.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 19, 2011 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
Michael Bay ESPLOSIONS!!!!
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Dec 20, 2011 12:12 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
The preview said "by the studio that brought you transformers"
So it’s probably not Michael Bay – just a clone.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
If I could pull in a billion on every shitty movie I made
I’d be making a lot of shitty movies.
Not afraid to nitpick
I've heard this elsewhere and I almost can't believe it
The second one was so bad I never finished it, and never gave the third one a chance.
It has a 95 on rotten tomatoes
Although I have like no trust in them anymore.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
So it is now speculated that it will take an approximation of Cj Wilson's contract to sign Darvish, which is 77.5 MM
add in the 50 million posting bid, and that’s 127 million dollars.
If I were the Rangers, I definitely would have taken that sum and offered Fielder 5 years at 25.5 per year. I bet Fielder ends up with higher WAR total over that span than Darvish does.
At this point the talking heads are wondering if he will accept a 2-3 year deal because his market is so soft
If he got that offer from the Rangers he would sign it in a heartbeat. They are ultra-competitive, and his addition would give them the best lineup in the game – without question.
The market for Fielder seems REALLY soft...
I could be totally wrong here, maybe he gets his 100m+, but this was a horrible year for him to hit FA. The Yankees and R.Sox are out, both LA teams are out, and so are the Mets. With the Rangers winning the bid on Darvish, I would be shocked if they continue to pursue Prince (plus they have Napoli, Hamilton and Kinsler all going into the last year of their deals).
That really only leaves a few teams left to bid on him. The Cubs maybe, but they seem to have so many holes, signing Fielder doesn’t make a whole lot of sense….plus with Garza on the trade block it seems more likely that Epstein is going to try and rebuild.
Does Fielder really wanna play in SEA or TOR? I doubt it, unless one of those teams decides to overpay to get him. Maybe a mystery team like WAS or SF (extremely unlikely with Cain and Lincecum both needing new deals) decides to step in if the market doesn’t heat up, but I really think he may just settle for a short term deal, and if thats the case, I think the Cardinals should be interested. Maybe thats why we are reluctant to sign Beltran….i don’t think we intended on going after Price once we lost Albert, but without any big spender to bid against, the FO may feel like they have a chance. I don’t think it would be a bad decision for Prince either. He could take a 3yr deal with a high AV and still only be 30 when he hits FA again.
by mick311 on Dec 20, 2011 12:16 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
sbnation app for android is pretty nice
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Dec 19, 2011 11:48 PM EST via Android app reply actions
the sbnation app
just released on the android market. evidently one of the developers is someone I’ve known through various android things for a while.
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Dec 19, 2011 11:51 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
VEB is one of the screenshots in its Market entry. NIce.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
no landscape?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:58 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
i guess it can't tell which messages
I’ve read on another device. Also, directional pad doesn’t work. Still better than mobile.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 12:00 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Yeah, I'm getting a lot of force closes
But it’s a lot better than mobile
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Dec 20, 2011 12:01 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
i wonder if it's being pushed out incrementally
because that isn’t pushing to my phone
by prophetjohn on Dec 19, 2011 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I can't get it on my tablet either.
They must be restricting by hardware or something.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 12:06 AM EST up reply actions
yeah, it's pretty cool so far
hard to type without landscape, though. the rest of stuff is pretty smooth
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2011 12:07 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
cool.
got it for nookie through the link. thanks
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 1:08 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
Can't follow links in the app?
Or is that just me?
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 1:11 AM EST up reply actions
oh yeah, this is out apparently
they’ll be running an “advertorial” in the second posting slot about it all day tomorrow, for anyone who hasn’t seen it yet.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Dec 20, 2011 12:20 AM EST via Android app up reply actions
just downloaded it
not too shabby,I must say. I really didn’t like the mobile site that much, and following comments on the full site on a phone kind of sucked.
> tebow
by cschepers on Dec 20, 2011 12:37 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Your daily December Christmas song:
Vince Guaraldi Trio – Christmas Time Is Here (Instrumental)
And a nice vocal treatment of same:
Diana Krall – Christmas Time Is Here
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 19, 2011 11:52 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
Vince's Merry Christmas, Charlie Brown album
is my all-time fave xmas album.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2011 2:06 AM EST up reply actions
I prefer the vocal version of
the original Guaraldi recording, but only unremastered. Whoever did the remastering just ruined the choral part. Cut off all the top ends and tried to make it smoother, I think, but what you get instead is just hacked-up dross.
I can do no wrong, for I do not know what it is.
by the red baron on Dec 20, 2011 3:36 AM EST up reply actions
so is MO just checking in on crisp
In hopes that Beltran and Lozano will hear about it and hopefully get something done?
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Dec 20, 2011 12:00 AM EST via Android app reply actions
I sure hope so
I just don’t think the Cards need yet another “leadoff” type hitter. We have Furcal, Jay & Schumaker already. There is no need for Crisp unless they plan to trade Jay for something. I would like to see Mo try and get another power bat if possible.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
we can't count on Raffy to play 150 games effectively though
i’d be happy with 110-120 healthy games from him
Balls
I feel like some people are having a hard time processing what kind of player Skip Schumaker is.
So I’m going to list other ML players that have been about as good as Schumaker over the last two years in about the same amount of playing time:
Ryan Theriot
Ty Wiggington
Raul Ibanez
Jose Lopez
Chris Johnson
Justin Smoak (that’s for rui)
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 20, 2011 12:02 AM EST reply actions
Smoak is who Alonso is going to end up being for SD in Petco
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Time to set up the train set.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 12:13 AM EST reply actions
jealous
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2011 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
i have half a handle of Old Crow left
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 20, 2011 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
Zach how much do you love me?
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
GUYS I THINK HE'S DRUNK TWEETING
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
not that much, you have a peener and no chest beefers
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 20, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You are the butt police of asstown
Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!' -- Whittier
Twitter
Yes, butt does he have the knowledge?
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 20, 2011 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
Oh Rui definitely has chest beefers, just not the good kind
They do look great in an argyle sweater though.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
rec'd
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 20, 2011 12:36 AM EST up reply actions
the skinny tie probably looks great in his cleavage too
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 20, 2011 12:36 AM EST up reply actions
man cleave always looks great under a skinny tie
Balls
by gdm426 on Dec 20, 2011 12:38 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
and you don't need a tie tack to keep them in place
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
this is a winning post.
"He’s not a great golden god come from the sky. He’s a fucking baseball player."
-the red baron
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2011 12:53 AM EST up reply actions
Quick, send us all of your money
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 12:30 AM EST up reply actions
it is what it is
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 20, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
I should be so lucky
the godawful skeleton-snake things guarding doors on stage 10.
as a mega man player I lack the discipline to not plow through everything.
If you want to feel good about yourself again just play Mega Man II on normal difficulty for a while
And then conveniently forget how easy it is.
what the hell man
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 12:32 AM EST up reply actions
who's EA?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
I was at a football game she called a few years ago
I think she got more applause than the teams did.
Play ball!
by IL and StL Fan on Dec 20, 2011 12:43 AM EST up reply actions
i think she's pretty, but a bit overrated because she's the first one in the new media to break out
i’d still like to meet & talk to her about sports & stuff
Balls
I could have met her and the Gameday guys when they were at Mizzou last year
But I was far too hungover and tired to hang around for another 2 hours.
Not afraid to nitpick
She's actually hotter in person
I saw her up close during the 2006 WS. There’s something about being on TV that makes us hypercritical of your looks. Once you see her in person, you’re like, “Oh yeah, she’s a real person…and by the way, holy crap she’s hot.”
is this abnormal?
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:00 AM EST up reply actions
yeah pretty much
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:07 AM EST up reply actions
this is why my sister wouldn't let me work the VS company party
she worked it & knew i’d make an ass of myself around the Angels so she never even told me she could have done it till she quit that job. i’ll never forgive her for that
Balls
Grading finally done, now for bed! And Theraflu.
Maybe some of the grading would have been better with the Theraflu first…
Play ball!
by IL and StL Fan on Dec 20, 2011 12:42 AM EST reply actions
Now that I have a good computer, I'm going to buy all sorts of old games I missed out on from Steam
And I’m going to get hundreds of hours of quality gaming for like 30 bucks. WOOOOO
Does anyone know if there is anything NPB
Could do to sweeten the deal for Darvish to sign with the Rangers? I bet their owners would be pissed if the two didn’t come to agreement. Do they have to stay out because if the exclusive negotiating rights?
by Cheeseballs on Dec 20, 2011 12:56 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I think about the only thing they can do
is award the rights to Darvish to the runner-up bidder if they feel like the Rangers aren’t negotiating in good faith.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 12:59 AM EST up reply actions
no
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
by tehzachatak on Dec 20, 2011 12:56 AM EST up reply actions
i hated them, but we have a really crappy BK & i never go there anyway
i always got onion rings on the off chance i’d go there
side note, WTH is a Double Whopper meal $7 damn dollars now? there’s no f’ing way i’m paying $7bucks for a f’ing Whopper
Balls
no thanks to crisp
shitty obp
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 12:57 AM EST reply actions
don't hold back
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:01 AM EST up reply actions
I guess andruw jones is the only CF that seems appealing
even though I’m not thrilled about that prospect either. at least he’s got a somewhat decent obp projection, and he’s not an atrocity in cf. crisp probably wouldn’t be too much worse though, unless jones has a resurgence.
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:23 AM EST up reply actions
ugh jones?
Crisp and ross are way better than Jones dude.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:23 AM EST up reply actions
well, he's projected at at least .330 obp next season
and he wasn’t that bad at defense last year
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:25 AM EST up reply actions
ok, I don't like any of the cf options heh
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:28 AM EST up reply actions
I think Crisp is pretty good
He’s around league average offensively and a bit below average defensively. About a 2 WAR player over a full seaosn.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:29 AM EST up reply actions
he had a really yucky obp last year though
I couldn’t stand seeing a lineup with both him and skip in it…. which probably won’t happen, but the possibility would exist
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
Last year, Jones, .286/.384/.540 (.924 OPS) vs LHP.
I’ll take that, for, eh, the $2M he signed for last year, every time.
He could get 250 PA’s/yr for the next 7-8 years (he’s only 35 next season!) and still possibly make the HOF, if he does what he did last year, going forward. And he was a +7.3 UZR/150 RF’er last year, to go with a +9.4, the year before. Career +18ish OF, and he’s NEVER had a negative UZR data point for a full season, in his whole career. He was well above average, last year, and the only really scary data point was an awful 230ish innings with the white sox in 2010 ( where he finished with a positive UZR/150, overall).
I think he’s a great option, if nothing else, to fill RF until Craig comes back. For what, $2M? $4M? That’s a quarter to half of what we gave Berk last year. Platoon Skip and AJ in RF, you’ve got a nice fill-in.
Hell, sign him and Coco both, platoon them both.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
Jones is probably an absolute atrocity in CF
not sure why you’d think otherwise. Crisp will be plus defense in CF, Jones will be minus minus defense in CF. maybe his bat would make up for it, but i doubt it.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
what is the consensus on endy chavez?
I was just looking at Jones’ numbers from last year, didn’t realize he didn’t play in cf at all. whoops.
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:27 AM EST up reply actions
who the heck is this guy?
Yoenis Cespedes
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:29 AM EST up reply actions
go watch his promo video
Cuban defector- positional equivalent to Aroldis Chapman
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
"positional equivalent to Aroldis Chapman"
So we put him in center and watch him throw 5 balls a game over the backstop into the press box?
"Nothing Motte does is quiet. It's mostly screamy and intense." - sheckiezx
"I'm a graduate of the Mike Shannon School of Diction" - Al Hrabosky
by monkeysareblue on Dec 20, 2011 2:06 AM EST up reply actions
he doesn't throw as well.
but he can jump really high.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
hmm.
That throws a wrench in it. Maybe offer a couple of years, with weight/performance incentives?
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
he's perfect for Yankee stadium though
small LF for him to run around & he can hit 25HR’s there easily
Balls
he was better in RF than in LF last year, though.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
ack n/m. messed up on fangraphs.
Either way, he was way positive in the corner OF last year. To the point that he should be at least acceptable in CF. And all of his history, except for one short period, indicates that he should be a plus CF.
"Our son Dick was sitting in his high chair, and I looked at that money, and I knew I could never look my son in the face again, if I took that money" (to leave the Cardinals) -Stan Musial, 1946
Why trade "The Mang"for "El Salmon", for less than $2M/yr, after taxes?
patterson and ankiel are still out there...
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:30 AM EST up reply actions
OMG DICK ANKEIL IS STILL OUT THERE????
YOU KNOW WHAT YOU MUST DO MO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Balls
Yes. Sign him up to be the 2nd LOOGY.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 1:32 AM EST up reply actions
that'd be nice
maybe trick him into coming back, then be like, no you gotta be a kickass pitcher dude
SIGN CARLOS
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2011 1:33 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
to quote DanUp
And nobody can hit him.
"Nothing Motte does is quiet. It's mostly screamy and intense." - sheckiezx
"I'm a graduate of the Mike Shannon School of Diction" - Al Hrabosky
by monkeysareblue on Dec 20, 2011 2:04 AM EST up reply actions
Coachella Lineup looks pretty good
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/19/coachella-2012-lineup_n_1158681.html#s265188&title=Blake_Miller_of
Modest Mouse, Radiohead and Tom Waits on the third day.
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
heh, yeah
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:17 AM EST up reply actions
first- no way Binary Star plays and is in the bottom tier. second- no way Daft Punk plays and is not the headliner for their day. third- if Coachelala ever booked LMFAO, half the regular attendees would lose all respect.
i’ll believe it when i see it, this is just one of the hundreds of fake lineups that gets released every year.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
i could keep picking- no way in HELL Bon Iver is in the bottom tier while Big Sean and Snow Patrol are in the middle tier.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
when does the actual lineup get realeased?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:19 AM EST up reply actions
don't know the date
IIRC, Radiohead and No Doubt are already 100% confirmed though.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
As long as Modest Mouse is in I'm happy
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:22 AM EST up reply actions
is johnny marr still with them?
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 20, 2011 1:48 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
no, some guy named jim fairchild replaced him
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:59 AM EST up reply actions
FWIW- Daft Punk is rumored for every festival ever. i'll believe it when i see it.
Sign Hong-Chih Kuo, Trade for Peter Bourjos
Time for that old Christmas tradition
Guinness and cookies.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 1:20 AM EST reply actions
late night gin-and-tonic!
Best mix yet.
i used to be disgusted, but now i try to be amused . . . - macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 20, 2011 2:41 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
This is for a friend's son
that died earlier tonite from burns sustained saving his son from their burning house.Go rest high on that mountain, kid. you did good.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:24 AM EST reply actions
thanks
our families grew up together
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:30 AM EST up reply actions
that's awful, sorry
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:36 AM EST up reply actions
good news is that his son seems to be pulling through so far.
he got burned pretty badly but he’s responding and i think he’s even talking some. Take what you can get at this point.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 1:54 AM EST up reply actions
how old is he?
Secretary of WAR and Defense of the Tyler Greene Fanclub.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2011 1:59 AM EST up reply actions
5
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 2:01 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah
Its ok. I had a Kraftig Light and it was ok. It’s of the same mold as bud/bud light but a little tastier. The new bud light platinum is also pretty good. I’m more of a microbrew person but BL platinum will definitely be my new “pound 30 beers on the lake” beer.
Keep seeing that at the store. Will have to pick some up next time.
Made a trip to the store last night to restock the beer fridge and the bill was … extreme.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
from the RFT article i read yesterday people said what cardsray said, it's a better Budweiser
how big is your beef fridge?
Balls
Thanks for getting us off the K-Mac and Skip meme...
Hopfuly we sign Beltran and we start talking about Yadi’s contract.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
From mlb.com: Hey, Yu'all! Rangers win bidding
Ugh. I knew we’d see a bunch of terrible Yu-pun headlines, but that is awful.
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 1:43 AM EST reply actions
I'm actually more afraid
of the inevitable “Heh heh, Texans are racist therefore a Japanese/Iranian player will have problems there” articles.
I didn't see this linked during the day thread
but Goold had a good article about the Card’s definition of “core players”
HAPPY FLIGHT!!!
Running list of Molina pick-offs | twit
Wow.
Made the mistake of reading the comments section. People seem to really like speed, and one dude wants to trade for Jacoby Ellsbury using Lohse, Westbrook, Boggs, McClellan, Cruz or Anderson and a High A prospect. Also, the Cards are cheap and never sign anyone, so why would anyone ever expect them to?
Most recent comment projects the Cards as a second division team and thinks the next championship will come never.
It was a rather unfortunate read.
I can do no wrong, for I do not know what it is.
by the red baron on Dec 20, 2011 4:10 AM EST up reply actions
Good grief, rb.
as masochistic as I am, I never read P-D comments. Well, I won’t say I never have, but I make a conscious effort not to anymore.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 4:13 AM EST up reply actions
I know.
I should know better, but the call of comments always gets me. I read 1800 comments about Jerry Sandusky on a Yahoo! article a month or so ago, then had to take eleven showers before I felt clean again.
It’s weird. I know the comment sections of internet articles are the very worst of humanity, but I hardly ever manage to not at least glance through. Very depressing. And possibly explains much of my own worsening nihilism.
I can do no wrong, for I do not know what it is.
by the red baron on Dec 20, 2011 4:16 AM EST up reply actions
It's almost de-humanizing.
if the people that comment like they do there live their lives like that , it’s no wonder the world is as fucked up as it is.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2011 4:21 AM EST up reply actions
I hold onto hope only with the help of John Gabriels' Internet Dickwad Theory.
Otherwise, all is darkness.
I can do no wrong, for I do not know what it is.
by the red baron on Dec 20, 2011 4:34 AM EST up reply actions
Anybody see the prices for autographs at the WWU?
They seemed a little skewed to me.
$100- Berkman
$75- Freese, Holliday, Molina
$50- CARPENTER?!
The Carpenter and Holliday prices confuse me.
But I am also easily confused.
Also, $5 for Kyle Lohse
by Cheeseballs on Dec 20, 2011 2:14 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Perhaps different players will be signing for different periods of time?
So even if there is high demand for certain players, the price comes down for players signing for a longer period of time.
Perhaps.
But you could easily double your money on a Lohse autograph
by Cheeseballs on Dec 20, 2011 2:28 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'll bet Berk demanded to have his autographs be the highest priced on the team
It’s always about the money.
no
It’s about respect. And you know how much respect you have by how much money you have. Originally the Cardinals asked Berkman to do it for $75…. but he started crying so they upped it.
Grit != flat out sucking.
He couldn't believe what was happening
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 20, 2011 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
Oh man, now a whole slew of Cardinals crying parodies are roiling around in my head
Berkman cried when he realized he was out of Captain Crunch but forgot to get some at the store
Wainwright cried when he couldn’t find a Zaxby’s anywhere in St. Louis
Holliday cried when David Freese just made him so proud
Berkman autograph: ₨100
#HappySeason #SadOffSeason
by The Continental on Dec 20, 2011 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
Confused
Why is Crisp ahead of Ross on the poll? He doesn’t get on base often enough to justify being a top of the order bat and has no power. Ross has some upside in that there might still be a bit of power left in his bat.
I really really want Yoenis Cespedes
Let’s sign Crisp or Ross or Jones or Beltran(but probably not Beltran in this scenario)
And let’s sign Cespedes. This way Cespedes can have some time in the minors if needed, but when he’s ready, we have a solid bench guy in whoever we sign.
I’m leaning towards Ross, because he would be my best option to start RF, until Craig is healthy. Not including Beltran, who probably doesn’t want to take a bench/platoon role. Ross could play RF until Craig was healthy, then Craig could move in to right and Ross could sub out any of the 3 spots and provide a great bat off the bench.
Beltran could obviously do the same, but he’s not going to sign somewhere that he’s not gonna be an everyday guy and he’s expensive. Cespedes gives us a wild card factor, no one knows how good he’s going to be.
by rumors on Dec 20, 2011 4:00 AM EST via mobile reply actions
After Craig returns
Would Crisp be intended to take over full CF from Jay? Or would this be a platoon setup?
Cards fan in Middle East
Just say no to Coco Crisp
His splits against LHP are awful.
http://www.fangraphs.com/statsplits.aspx?playerid=1572&position=OF&season=2011
"I don’t like the feeling of losing."---Chris Carpenter
by cardsfan59 on Dec 20, 2011 8:09 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Career he is .273 vs L and .276 vs R
Not awesome but consistent overall. Don’t know what happened last few years
11 in '11, Check.
12 in 12, WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
by I-Musial-ly-Am on Dec 20, 2011 8:41 AM EST up reply actions
His split are not awful against LHP.
Technically in 2011, he faired poorly against them with the help of a .224 BABIP. However, just as recently as last year, he had a .407 wOBA. Is that likely to continue? Well no he had 87 plate appearances, but neither is the .263 wOBA of last year where he had 191.
For his career he has a .325 wOBA with a .303 BABIP. (That’s 1,325 plate appearances). Jon Jay on the other hand has a .320 woBA with a .351 BABIP against lefties. That’s in 180 plate appearances so it’s not very likely to continue whereas Crisp can reasonably be assumed to continue his .325 wOBA. Plus, I’d be willing to be Crisp is a better fielder than Schumaker. (Against righties, Jay is obviously better but that’s a different thing)
I AM ACTUALLY STLCARDSFAN4 JUST TO CLARIFY YOUR POSSIBLE CONFUSION.
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