Let Us Rejoice, For the St. Louis Cardinals Are World Series Champs
by bgh on Oct 31, 2011 7:00 AM EDT
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PrintFor me, it began in 1987. In ways I can't remember my Cardinals fandom started before then but that was the fall when my parents first allowed me to stay up past my bedtime for October baseball. Immediately after the NLCS taught me that the good guys vanquish the villains the World Series taught me the heroes don't always win in the end. Like Crash Davis and Rick Blaine in fiction the '87 Redbirds will always be my favorite.
I didn't know that team as well as I have any team of the last decade. There was no cable, let alone Fox Sports Midwest. We didn't have SportsCenter or Baseball Tonight broadcasting daily highlights, either. The games took place for me in the following day's box score. It was a rare treat when the Des Moines Register ran an AP photograph of a Cardinal. I was aware of the Cardinals but the familiarity of the twenty-first century baseball fan was an impossibility.
In 2011, that familiarity bred a guardedness (if not contempt) for many fans in regard to our Redbirds. The offensive explosion of the early season that propelled the Cardinals to baseball's best record was quickly masked by a June swoon that carried over into July. Living and breathing summer months of sub-.500 baseball made us all too familiar with the club's inadequacies on defense, at shortstop, in the bullpen, and in the rotation. After management made the trades to address these weaknesses, the Brewers took off like a rocket and left our Hometown Nine in their wake, beyond even shouting distance in the standings. The Cardinals were nearly mathematically eliminated from postseason contention before the calendar turned to September. Understandably, the grumbling had begun with some even conducting a post mortem.
The corpse that had been pronounced dead at the scene of the National League Central race proved a zombie. It burst through the morgue's double doors, tore up its death certificate and set out on a hunt with the Braves as its quarry. Zombies are of course not real and so it was difficult for us to believe in this undead team. A .692 September winning percentage and an epic Braves collapse were not enough to tear down the guardrails protecting our hearts from being broken by a club who had vividly instilled in our memories its legion of faults. And yet, somehow, they won the Wild Card and punched their postseason ticket.
The vaunted Phillies with their embarrassment of starting pitching riches seemed certain to snuff out the season of the Wild Cards, who were only in Philly because the NL East champions had ended the Braves' season with an extra-innings victory in Game No. 162. Yet, the Cardinals went toe-to-toe with Philly and forced a Game 5, a game for the ages in which Chris Carpenter out-dueled Roy Halladay 1-0. It was at that point during this most of this wildest of rides that the swamp gas became house money which was then invested with heart and soul into a flawed ball club. That's when I was all-in. Like the five-year-old me in '87, I was yelling at the television during games, becoming nervousness for the night's game in the mid-afternoon.
The NLCS was a merciless bludgeoning of the Milwaukee Brewers, a franchise whose October history will forever be inextricably linked to the storied St. Louis Cardinals. The two greatest seasons in Milwaukee's franchise history each ended with a loss to the St. Louis Cardinals. We can now intersperse our "1982 World Series Champions" garb with "2011 World Series Champions" apparel during the fifteen-to-eighteen games we play Milwaukee each year.
The 2011 Cardinals secured a place in this fan's heart in Game 1, the first World Series game I attended in my life, with a thrilling 3-2 win at Busch Stadium. The thought of the atmosphere within the city and the stadium that day give me goosebumps even as I type this. Temperatures in the forties and winds in the thirties and I could not have cared less. My seat neighbor, a polite lady in her fifties, explained @TortyCraig to me. I let her. Chris Carpenter made the greatest defensive play I've ever seen in person. Allen Craig did Torty proud. The Cardinals won. Being in Busch Stadium and St. Louis for that win is the single greatest experience of my Cardinals fandom. The positive energy was palpable; there was no doubt in my mind the Cards would win the Series. Then there was Game 5. And the first seven innings of Game 6.
I'm still scolding myself for believing that the Gods of Baseball would allow the Cardinals to lose a Game 6 in St. Louis before which Stan Musial took the field during the pre-game ceremonies. The errors and overall uninspired play erased the emotional return of Musial and caused a crisis in faith. Then Allen Craig's eighth-inning homer relit hope's fuse. Even as this club-- these cardiac Cardinals--were backed to the cliff's edge of their final strike not once but twice, we believed. That belief, once abandoned in the dusk of summer, was rewarded once by Lance Berkman and twice by David Freese. The comeback marks what may be the greatest game in Cardinals World Series history.
A World Series championship makes you want to listen to music too loud, drive to fast, and drink a bit too much, sing your club's praises to the rooftops. It makes you call your friends and relatives as well as your friends and relatives call you. Shared fandom is a tie that binds, that reaches across state lines, time zones, and oceans. We are all Cardinals fans, united by our love of a baseball club that has given us yet another magical championship run. Let us bask in the glow of this improbable World Series championship. For today, tomorrow, and every single day of this offseason our St. Louis Cardinals are and will be the reigning World Series champions.
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Goosebumps . . .
I watched Game 7 in my living room in Hong Kong. My oldest friend in world was at Game 7 and sent me a text. Moments after the final out, wife gave me a hug. Soon after that my father called from Taiwan. Within a half hour, my mother in St. Louis sent me an email. Yep, Baseball is very special.
Who's faster home to first? Yadi or Torty?
I began to believe again when we swept the Braves
at that point I was thinking “3.5 back is doable. We’re in this thing at least”.
I live about 170 miles from my brother and we usually shoot an email back and forth now and again when something exciting is happening, but for those last few weeks of the season, neither of us said anything to one another. Not as we got down the final weekend, not as we tied the wild card and controlled our own destiny.
A few seconds after the Braves/Phillies final out, our emails cris-crossed through cyberspace. “That completes the comeback. We’re in the post-season! I haven’t said anything because I didn’t want to jinx it”
I believed all year.
My September 1 comment, when we were still 7.5 games behind Milawukee, and 8.5 behind Atlanta.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Oct 31, 2011 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Odd, this isn't showing up on the front page yet.
My seat neighbor, a polite lady in her fifties, explained @TortyCraig to me. I let her.
LOL
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
by TBender on Oct 31, 2011 9:08 AM EDT reply actions 5 recs
and then bgh shared with her that he was in fact @tortycraig
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I like to imagine
that he pulled off a mask to reveal that he was, in fact, a turtle.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
by Aranathor on Oct 31, 2011 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
IS THAT BGH'S MUSIC?!?!?!
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Oct 31, 2011 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
tortoise, it's a tortoise.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions
same difference
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
don't be dissin torty like that
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
A teenage mutant ninja tortoise
to be precise.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Oct 31, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
you are a sharp one
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
he should've just told her it was him
she wouldn’t believe him anyway
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
This is some sort of hidden, double top secret thread.
For your eyes only.
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 9:09 AM EDT reply actions
It's the prize in the bottom of my cereal
I had to get to the end of the last thread to find it.
Still not a werewolf.
just wait for the crushing disappointment
when you realize its just a lame temporary tattoo
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Did you just call a temporary tattoo a crushing disappointment?
At the game in Arlington, I was so disappointed that the prize in my cracker jack wasn’t a temporary tattoo.
Still not a werewolf.
screw the temp tattoos!
i want a sweet plastic toy.
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 9:29 AM EDT up reply actions
So, there's a 9am presser today and Rains is speculating...
Molina extension?
Pujols re-signing?
TLR re-signing?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
retirement maybe?
(fingers crossed)
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
by pattimagee on Oct 31, 2011 9:25 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
my speculation
Duncan retiring due to wife’s health problems
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
I don't want it to happen
but I wouldnt be surpised
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
I mean....
what else can the guy accomplish? Go spend time with your wife Mr. Duncan.
Grit != flat out sucking.
I win!
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
what do you get ?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions
a new manager
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Oct 31, 2011 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
best christmas ever.
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
Last year we got Berkman
that’s gonna be hard to top
I smacked Rickey right in the face when he told me this idea.
Berkman for Berkmanager
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Oct 31, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Be careful what you wish for.
You just might get it.
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
you mean VEB bein' all over the place? I thought everyone knew.
or do you mean the secret club
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
At first this thread wasn't on the front page
you had to go in the secret entrance.
Still not a werewolf.
I... am gonna stop right here.
yep. yep.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, its good to be the champs...
;=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
So we enjoy it for five months
and then it’s back to worrying about next year’s Series.
The life of the fan of a successful team is a precarious thing. A lot better than being the fan of a bad team, though.
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
by StanTheManFan on Oct 31, 2011 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Enjoy it for 5 months?
I’m already on the Hot Stove fun
bollocks
by SecondHalfMatt on Oct 31, 2011 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions
do love me some trade rumors.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
subject line
Yet, the Cardinals went toe-to-toe with Philly and forced a Game 5, a game for the ages in which Chris Carpenter out-dueled Roy Halladay 1-0. It was at that point during this most of this wildest of rides that the swamp gas became house money which was then invested with heart and soul into a flawed ball club. That’s when I was all-in. Like the five-year-old me in ‘87, I was yelling at the television during games, becoming nervousness for the night’s game in the mid-afternoon.
this is exactly how it felt for me. but you said it way better than i ever could.
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 9:52 AM EDT reply actions
So
what do the Cardinals need to do in the offseason (that isn’t resigning Albert Pujols) ?
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
well, payroll is around $86M, so there's not a whole lot of room to do stuff in free agency.
nontender the following players: skip schumaker, ryan theriot, k-mac
let the following players walk: octavio dotel, edwin jackson, arthur rhodes, corey patterson
sign pujols and furcal for a combined $30M. payroll is at $116M
lineup:
furcal, ss
jay, cf
pujols, 1b
holliday, lf
berkman, rf
freese, 3b
molina, c
descalso, 2b
bench:
craig (4th OF, can sub at 2b, platoon with berkman)
chambers
greene
some dude from memphis
laird/who cares
bullpen:
R: motte, salas, sanchez, lynn, boggs, cleto/free agent
L: scrabble
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions
rotation: wainwright, carpenter, garcia, lohse, westbrook
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions
How about Cruz instead of Lard, and can we get a RH-CF please?
Not necessarily a starter, but a def-sub and platoon partner for the Chief Justice. some dude from memphis=M. Carpenter? (I think M Carp gets traded, but that’s just my speculation)
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe trade out Adron Chambers for Tommy Pham?
I know he’s coming off an injury, but he’s right-handed, and a pretty good hitter. If Adron makes the ML roster, Pham might get moved up to Memphis. See what he does there.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Oct 31, 2011 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I like Pham too.
Might start at aa tho. Might take over cf entirely by 2013.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 4:05 PM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
You didn't mention Nick Punto.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Oct 31, 2011 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Plenty.
Thank Theriot for his time, congratulate Rhodes on retirement, renegotiate with Furcal (I can’t see any team wanting to sign him at $12.5mil, but I’d love to see him back), get a psychiatrist to prod around Tyler Greene’s head and make him play consistently in the majors…
I am really interested to see what they do with the starting rotation. You’ll have Wainright, Carp, Garcia locked as the 1-3. Lohse and Westbrook both have another year on their deals, I think? And Jackson showed some promise (when he can focus), but was most likely just a rent. So Jackson is likely gone, and between Lohse and Westbrook, I wouldn’t be surprised to see one of them leave, with all the talk of possibly bringing up Miller around the ASG. Lynn is also a candidate for conversion to starter.
WWCD? CDGAF.
Scrabble could start, too
Might be wroth seeing if someone would take Lohse after his bounceback season if we agree to pay some of his salary.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
Tyler Greene had very close to the exact same offensive season this year as Skip and Theriot (by wOBA)
Why don’t Skip and Theriot need psychologists? Are they “consistent”? If so, why is that a good thing?
In other words, Tyler Greene – right now – is cheaper, a better fielder, a better baserunner, and the same hitter (though with more potential) — when compared to Skip and Theriot.
Can’t wait for Tyler Greene to be a starter at 2B next year, with Furcal at SS.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
odds on a TG and Craig MIF?
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
I'd say pretty low unless the Cards are COMPLETELY out of money after signing Albert.
I think Craig will get 450-500 PAs next year replacing Pujols, Holliday, Berkman, PH’ing opps, the occasional start in CF, and interleague play. I’d much rather see us sign Furcal and install TG at 2B or in a platoon with Descalso. MCarp can be a bench player and back up Freese at 3B.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions
I like this idea.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
I dont see how you could watch what Craig did in the postseason (while already seeing his bat in the regular season)
and slot him as a backup. I think he has to be slotted as a starter somewhere.
And if you had to bet $100 on Furcal making 400 PA next year would you take the over/under? Id take the under.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I have this thing about me.
I want good defense up the middle. I don’t to see a Skippy clone playing 2B, that would just give me heartburn. Let’s face it, Pujols isn’t getting younger(if we sign him), Berkman is older yet, Holliday will need the occasional day off and injuries happen. So how about let’s make sure that we have the most competent back-up possible rather than some journeyman that is just there to fill a hole. Pujols may go someplace else and this whole discussion just goes away.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
If Pujols leaves its moot for sure.
And I agree with everything you said. I just would like to go into ST knowing Craig is going to play somewhere everyday. We still need a RH OF to platoon with Jay and that player can spot Holliday and Puma. Craigs bat is plus. Skips never was and I would be fine with Freese and Craig playing innings 1-7 and DD and Punto playing 8-9.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
If Craig is a RH platoon with Jay
and gives days off to Berk and Holliday and ph’s and does plays in interleague games, that covers a lot of games. It’s not the 8-9 innings that bother me, it would be the innings leading up to the 8-9 that could expose a problem. Craig is going to have to put in a ton of work to get to a really competent level of 2B defense. I have a feeling that it will be like watching Skippy, regardless of his bat. Meaning that he’ll move like he’s got a dogsled tied to his ass.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
so you dont want Craig at 2B but youre ok with him in CF?
I think even if he put in a ton of work hed still be a bad CF.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's my point for the platoon
How many left handed starters does each team have? One? maybe two? and that’s even if you catch them in a series. That’s not a great ton of starts. But you’re talking about putting Craig at 2B everyday, that’s a lot more exposure that could go seriously wrong.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't want Craig to be in a platoon with Jay in CF.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Craig should not platoon with anyone
Craig should just hit…..everyday
Older than any three of you.
by Remember Kenny B on Oct 31, 2011 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I just don't see him being an everyday player on this team next year unless Albert doesn't come back.
He can get 400-500 PAs next year without being an everyday player (but could be with serious injuries to Holliday, Berk, or Albert) and can take over for Berkman in 2013.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
The only difference between Tyler Greene and Ben Zobrist in the minor leagues is contact rate.
Which is extremely important, but still, if he can somehow not strike out 30% of the time in the big leagues he’s a very valuable player.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
never unlikely
Skip schumaker was only the second time an outfielder moved to second in the Majors in like 50 years, TLR is really the only manager who would attempt that.
Grit != flat out sucking.
at least they gave him his own truck and didnt stick him with Corey Patterson.
poor Tony Cruz.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
ISOLATION.
Greene’s truck was actually driving through Fairview Heights.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
It was a joke.
I agree, Greene was easily as good as those two were this year, and I think he can easily be better once he settles in.
aka INTERNET HUMORZ.
WWCD? CDGAF.
haven't you heard?
VEB doesn’t do jokes anymore
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions
you've been looking in Kelly's yearbook, I guess?
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Wong will come up next September. Say hello to our new second baseman.
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Oct 31, 2011 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Finding a new manager
apparently.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Cardinals called a news conference for 9am CDT
have not said what it is about
Grit != flat out sucking.
as far as i can see
there are 2 things that might actually happen:
1) Announcing that Yadi’s option has been picked up (and maybe others, i.e. Waino)
2) Retirement of Duncan
But then again, could be a good bye to TLR.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
yeah
but there hasn’t been an official announcement
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Yadi's and Wainwright's were already picked up
seems funny to announce it again.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Hmm...
Moz extension?
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Being aired live
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
hey you!
how shall i get your forfeit sig to you? Rather than just announce it here, i want to be subtle about it.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Perhaps an email?
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
can do
what’s your email?
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
pablohermes@gmail
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
..
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
you should be.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Albert filed for free agency before the parade.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
it's not treachery till Thursday
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Did the 2011 Cardinals save baseball?
Hyperbole, I know but man, we made baseball pretty damn relevant to the masses
by Hardcore Legend on Oct 31, 2011 10:05 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
the masses will forget within a week and be on to X Factor or whatever the next big reality TV series is
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
HOLY SHIT LARUSSA IS RETIRING
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:08 AM EDT reply actions
NO, REALLY
Tony La Russa is retiring. #stlcards
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
HFS NO WAY!
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
http://twitter.com/#!/BJRains/status/131009482619748353
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
THERE ARE SO MANY ASTOUNDED SWEAR WORDS IN MY BRAIN
Still not a werewolf.
by clank on Oct 31, 2011 10:08 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
tlr retires
I feel weird.
Piss off Tony, get shipped to Canada.
by beer me on Oct 31, 2011 10:09 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 1 recs
Holy shit!
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
TERRYFRANCONATERRYFRANCONATERRYFRANCONATERRYFRANCONATERRYFRANCONA
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:09 AM EDT reply actions 7 recs
And by "hell no"
you mean, Do It Yesterday!
"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Oct 31, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow
Just wow.
"The world is made for people who aren't cursed with self awareness." - Annie Savoy
by redbirdbluedevil on Oct 31, 2011 10:09 AM EDT reply actions
End of an era.
I’m honestly a little choked up.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 10:09 AM EDT reply actions
I just don't know what to say
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
I am moore than a little sad....
…say what u want but TLR has been a great Cardinal. The jury is still out about being a great manager, because how do you really figure such things, but he is THE Cardinals manager. Thanks for everything, TLR, and for giving us your everything.
:=8)
Would REALLY hate to see both him and Duncan go, but it wouldn’t surprise me given Dunc’s wife’s health.
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
No, I think the jury is in
TLR was great. You may not have liked it. Kind of like someone can watch The Godfather and appreciate Michael Corleone but not like the character for who he is – But TLR was a master. My impression of the whole phone mess in Texas in game 5: TLR took the heat, drew all the press away from his players, especially the ones who attended the LOBsterfest, and motivated his players to keep going. He did that often – drawing the ire of people outside of the clubhouse to be loyal to the players inside the clubhouse. It was his style and it didn’t always pay dividends (oh, how I loves me some Scott Rolen…), but it was much more effective than any TLR detractors would even recognize, less care to admit.
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
It's a little easier to say that now
that he’s not double-switching the pitcher into the 4 slot in the 8th inning of a 1 run game.
Or having Allen Craig bunt Yadi to third with 1 out.
I love LaRussa too, but he definitely had his share of WTF moments.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
All true.
I think TLR’s biggest fault was over-thinking and attempting to re-invent things. He seemed like a Dr. Frankenstein with line-ups, double-switches, etc. But, really, wasn’t it more about experimentation and attempting to get a statistical advantage rather than pure madness?
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
WHOA
It’s not even a Wednesday! Red Baron didn’t get upstaged!!
Still not a werewolf.
by clank on Oct 31, 2011 10:10 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Funny. I feel kinda sad.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Kinda had a feeling this was going to happen.
Gotta imagine Dunc is going, too. Had some TLR criticisms over the year, but can’t help but feel like this is a sad day.
WWCD? CDGAF.
seriously: holy. fucking. shit.
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:11 AM EDT reply actions
He will be on Letterman, opposite Freese?
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
That's why it's opposite.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
so ironically
a WS might induce Albert to stay
a WS might push Tony to go
but if Tony goes…
mind blown!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
This is St. Louis
and compare what TLR and Whitey would do.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
I'm an iconoclast
I compare what Torre would do. It probably involves Bernard Gilkey.
by Houdinimachine on Oct 31, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
well I'm less concerned with that as I am how the coaching structure will continue
the players can demonstrably win despite bad decisions at the top
the coaches on the other hand have shown that it’s really “how to emulate Tony”. it’s such a long-standing cult of personality, other than the mysterious hitting coach position.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm worried Marky Mark goes back to retirement...
As well as what everyone else has said about Dunc … CHRIS Duncan for pitching coach!
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions
That's going out on top.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
....BITCHES
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
that's what I was thinking
the only thing left at this point was to try to slide up another spot on the wins/championships list but the man has had a good career and is probably tired of half the city calling for his head when he wins us multiple championships
Oh sure trade our future for shit and then make the decision to retire...
LITERALLY A WEEK OR TWO LATER… Outrageous.
dude we won the world series.
Piss off Tony, get shipped to Canada.
by beer me on Oct 31, 2011 10:14 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
is guay
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
is not a joke...
He traded Rasmus in late July and made his intention to retire known to the FO “sometime in August.”
We traded our top young player because he couldn’t get along with a manager who wasn’t staying.
I think it's entirely possible that Colby Rasmus is just an asshole.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
Also his dad IS an asshole.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
It is what it is.
We know this.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
by TBender on Oct 31, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I'm a jerkass, not an asshole.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
by Alxfritz on Oct 31, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
And with the sharpest of knives,
he split the hair.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Oct 31, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
well said
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
Maybe...
but it was sold as a clash of personalities – one of those personalities was leaving. Problem solved. Now we have a big hole in CF. Skip Schumaker started out there in an elimination game.
clearly
this frees us up to sign Francona, who will then lure Ellsbury and Pedroia to come play for us at below market rates, filling all our biggest holes in one fell swoop. (After years of reading about their great relationship in the Boston media, I can almost make myself believe this.)
Championship
Stop whining! Humble yourself for a moment and think about how this trade won us the WS.
by albertrodgers on Oct 31, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions
well, it didn't, so, um..
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
i'm not really sure it did.
but this can be hotly contested forever with no definitive answer.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I don't know that this can really be hotly contested
They don’t make the playoffs with McClellan in the rotation, Rasmus pouting his way to a .524 OPS, Miller/Tallet not being Scrabble and no Dotel.
Not afraid to nitpick
There is no way we win the WS without this trade.
I’ll stake my reputation on it.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
by Aranathor on Oct 31, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
no! not your sterling reputation
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I fear that i must
If i lose then i will be forced to sell my estate in dishonour to Sir Evilington and my fine daughters will be forced to marry against their will. my wife will leave me for that strapping young chauffer boy and i will be forced to move to a lesser country house and live out my life in disgrace.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
zounds!!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No way they win the WS without A trade.
Hard to second guess a GM about available trade opportunities, but I don’t think it’s fair to say this was the only possible trade to put the team in position to win.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
it probably cannot be contested.
but its possible Mo makes different moves to improve the pen and post-deadline Rasmus feels secure and goes on a 2 month rampage, which he has done before.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
but thats a very optimistic view
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Yes.
The Cards winning the WS at any point through game 162 was very optimistic.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions
I think the actual x factor was the starters not being able to go long.
if they can turn in more QS, the bullpen is not needed as much.
but they didn’t/couldn’t. and then that trade is indispensable.
so it’s a 3rd, apparently uncontrollable factor, dating back to losing Waino.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions
"Skip Schumaker started out there in an elimination game."
LOL Check and mate. Arguement over. We needs a CF NOW!
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
and in exchange
we won a world series. I think that justifies every roster move. Unless your argument is “but I didn’t want a WS this year, I wanted one later”
Um
That’s a pretty poor argument. Yes, the trade may have helped us win the World Series. But we might have won the World Series without the trade as well. It’s impossible to know.
I have a hard time believing that one in fact led directly to the other, so I don’t judge the trade based on whether we won the World Series later on that season. I base the trade on whether it was a good trade in terms of value, and that’s yet to be determined. I DO think that the addition of Dotel and Rzep and Jackson made us a better team this year, but the trade itself cannot be valued until we see:
- Who the PTBNL are, if there are any.
- How Scrabble does long term as either a starter or middle relief LOOGY.
- Whether Rasmus realizes his full potential as a baseball player.
It’s quite possible that his deal is lose-lose long term for both teams, with the Cardinals getting 2 month rentals out of Dotel and Jackson and making a crazy run to a title with help from those players.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
Scrabble = middle-late relief LEFTY
The dude is not a LOOGY. I suspect you know this, but we should be careful to make that distinction.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions
EVERY roster move?
Corey Patterson says hi.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Mo traded Rasmus
I’m pretty sure the Cardinals organization was just done with the situation. Tony Rasmus started calling out the cardinals back when Rasmus was still in AAA.
Also, I think it reached the point where the Cardinals were no longer 100% sure that Rasmus has what it takes to be an every day player.
Grit != flat out sucking.
...
I can’t find the tweet right now
there was disagreement within the org — it wasn’t moot to begin with
the statement ends with “we concluded it was for the best”
FWIW
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh come on
One year he was good and the next year he was not so good, therefore his first year must be indicitive of his true talent. For serious?
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
dammit clankbot
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
how dare you question VEB's groupthink!
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
exactly. that is what i was trying to say. it could be very likely that 112 is not a down year for him.
and guay, his STL ops + in 2011 was 110. oh, and in toronto it was thirty-freakin’-seven.
he had an 89 OPS+ this year
Which is his second full season with an 89 OPS+.
He did have an awesome 132 OPS+ season, but that was with a .354 BABIP
Grit != flat out sucking.
Can we just forget about Rasmus?
Bad trade, shouldn’t have worked…..BUT IT DID and we won the fucking World Series as a fairly direct consequence.
Not afraid to nitpick
Trading a promising player b/c he can't get along with the manager is bad enough..
but we just learned that LaRussa knew he was leaving AT THE TIME THE TRADE WAS MADE (or very soon after). That’s ridiculous. The solution to the Rasmus-LaRussa problem existed prior to the trade being made. LaRussa was retiring!
WE WON THE WORLD SERIES
Some of the key pieces involved were things we got back in the trade. EJax pitched worse than his stats would indicate.
And there was no promise that Rasmus will ever be successful. He may still be, or he may still just be a streaky hitter that never manages to keep on replicating the high points.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
Everyone is focused on results...
I’m talking process. The process here was nuts.
Why did we trade Rasmus for crap?
The most plausible answer has been “he couldn’t get along with Tony.” That’s no longer plausible.
I think you're being a little hyperbolic
we traded Colby for at least 50 cents on the dollar. that is different than crap, and the closer you value what we got back to what Colby’s actual value is, the more explanations open up.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
I do...
since the process is still in place, the FO is the same, and this kind of thing seems likely to happen again in the future.
This miracle run has papered over an amazingly slipshod FO.
What's the point of MLB baseball?
Winning the world series. We were a better team with greater odds of winning a playoff spot after the trade than we were before the trade.
We would not be hanging a world series banner with Colby Rasmus on this team.
We could have kept Colby, watched him blossom into a fine player, and STILL never won a World Series.
How can this trade have NOT been worth it. We’ll get a draft pick out of EJax, and Scrabble may have several good years with this team yet.
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
what would you be saying if david freese had struck out?
your argument is entirely based on the fact we won the world series, which we almost did not do.
We would not be hanging a world series banner with Colby Rasmus on this team.this is not a good argument. here’s a blockquote for you:
We could have made this trade and still not be hanging a world series banner.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
but isn't that true of every "win now" trade deadline deal
and inherently of risk, in general?
A team gives up a piece (or pieces) that will be valuable in the future for short-term gain. It’s a big risk and typically short-sighted in that it is done with one outcome in mind.
Like with any risk, if it fails then it has negatively affected you in some way. If it succeeds, the risk paid off. Isn’t that what makes it risk in the first place?
he's arguing in a way that makes it seem he feels
this trade guaranteed a world series win. which is patently false.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
arguing that
the trade “guaranteed” a world series win is not the same thing as saying but for the trade, we would not have won the world series.
I don’t think he’s saying what you’re ascribing to him (indeed, he said the trade gave us “greater odds” of grabbing a playoff spot)
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
this is the part i thought was dumb:
We would not be hanging a world series banner with Colby Rasmus on this team.
We could have kept Colby, watched him blossom into a fine player, and STILL never won a World Series.
but this IS all crystal ball gazing and what-not, and there will never be definitive proof one way or another. it didn’t happen. it is what it is. WORLD SERIES WOOOOOOOOOO
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
ending your argument with a dismissive note doesn't make it more persuasive.
the primary people with the crystal balls are the ones who say “who knows whether we would have won the WS had we kept Colby Rasmus.” Sure, of course. Who can ever know with certainty what happens in that alternate universe. But that is not a persuasive or good argument that the trade was a bad one or not a good one (if you accept that the goal of a team is to win the WS).
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
i agree it was an attempt to exit a debate
after you called another’s comments “dumb.” Not sure it was an attempt to do so graciously.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
it was my exceedingly poor attempt
to exit a debate graciously.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Look at all the teams that traded young center fielders with tons of upside...
The Marlins with Cameron Maybin, the Mariners with Adam Jones, the Dodgers with Matt Kemp (almost in 2010), the DBacks with Justin Upton (almost last offseason).
The difference between us and them is nothing more than luck.
The difference betwen us and them is not "nothing more than luck."
Mo made the trade with the idea that it gave the Cards a better chance of winning the WS. Lo and behold, it did give the Cards a better chance, and they did win.
The alternate universe game that is going on to judge the trade is a fruitless exercise.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
There are tons of differences here.
Maybin was pretty much seen as a busted prospect, Jones hadn’t seen hardly any time in the majors, Dodgers and D-backs were less clearly competitors in my mind. Also, Upton hasn’t been a CF in the majors ever.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions
for many people the regular season is as much the point of MLB baseball.
They live their calendars by the season. The postseason is a complete crapshoot. You cannot expect anything out of it except seeing a few more games. So I can understand placing a premium on seeing players over 6 months as opposed to leveraging that for a chance to enter a lottery in October.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Cause we wanted to win a world series. . .
I didn’t like the trade at the time either. But when shit works, you can’t keep hiding behind numbers.
by EddieHarsch on Oct 31, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I saw a women hit on 19...
the other week and pull a two to win $100.
I’m going to play cards with some buds on Wednesday. Do you think I should adopt what works or hide behind “numbers”?
The win now team always gets less value in these trades
That’s the nature of trading current value for expected value. Yes, Rasmus was probably worth more in an ‘evenhanded’ trade. But the team needed to fill the holes that they filled through the Rasmus trade, and filling those holes resulted in a world series championship.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
Well there was a win now aspect too.
But I agree that the team never should have put itself in a position where it had to trade Colby and everyone in the baseball world knew it. That was dumb. The fact that Tony soon after mentioned his pending retirement does make things worse.
Still, I don’t entirely hate what we received in return. Say what one will about Mo, but he closed up the holes in this team pretty well. Trade specifics aside, I don’t think there’s any chance the Cards in the Series without those holes patched up.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
you know what this means:
Trading a promising player b/c he can’t get along with the manager is bad enough..
but we just learned that LaRussa knew he was leaving AT THE TIME THE TRADE WAS MADE
That rasmus was traded for more reasons than he just that he couldn’t get along with the manager.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Yup...
but what were those reasons? Do they really think his performance was “bad” in 2011 or overall in his career?
If Jon Jay could be guaranteed to hit 250/330/430 with average-ish defense, questionable work habits, and annoying family members, wouldn’t we take that compared to rolling the dice?
if jay hits 250/330/430
and we have someone right behind him who can hit the same, I’d be okay with moving him.
Grit != flat out sucking.
The NL average for CFers in an insanely good year at the postion...
was around 260/330/410. That’s the point. Rasmus had a historically great 2010 as a 23 year old and then declined to slightly above league average at the position for the first four months of 2011.
That’s why the argument that he was moved because of a lack of production is so unconvincing.
When talking about Rasmus' 2011
talking about the “first 4 months” is deceptive, he was historically good for two months and then historically awful for the next two.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
I thought it was said that Tony made his intent to retire clear in August.
IE AFTER the trade deadline. So unless he let them know in advance that retirement was more than likely but uncertain, it could still very well be just a TLR-RasmusFamily issue.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Rasmus was stinky rotten
I’m sure MO asked for the moon and stars and got E. Jackson and some bullpen help. That’s all he got. Did the trade look like it really, really sucked? Yeah, it did. But that’s what Rasmus was apparently worth to the rest of MLB. I think the word was out on Rasmus that he was the K-Mart version of, say, J.D. Drew. Can Colby be great? Sometimes, but guaranteed not all of the time. Combine that with a sourpuss attitude and an over involved father and you’ve got a headache left with many distractions off the field that overplay the unpredictable performance on the field.
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
I hate this argument
It’s how you end up with 40 year old Derek Jeter making $22M a season or with Jim Hendry as your GM running your organization into the ground for a half decade. You don’t make value judgments based on results based analysis.
I got called an “asshole” by some Cub fan over the weekend for not wanting La Russa brought back for 2012. His reasoning? “Only an asshole would want his manager fired after winning the World Series.”
What a crappy way of thinking about it.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
Looking at the numbers
Jeter’s 2011 salary was 14,729,365 which is 7.48% of the NYY 196,854,630 salary.
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
Yes, yes, and yes.
Can we all agree to do a couple of things?
1) Enjoy this wonderful World Series we won
2) Get over Colby Rasmus
Don't forget the HRs when dropping the BABIP bomb.
Also, OPS undervalues OBP so OPS undervalues walks.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
we could switch to wOBA if you want
But I don’t think it matters. Rasmus was traded. We won the world series. We’ll either be playing for it over the next two years (Rasmus can be a free agent in two years right?) Or he’ll continue to be a sub-par centerfielder.
Or maybe, he’ll become a good starting centerfielder over those few years. And the Cardinals will get about the same production from Jay over that same period. (for less)
Grit != flat out sucking.
Why split the sample...
he’s a 104 career ops+ during his age 22-24 seasons while playing CF. That’s really freaking good.
because splitting the sample allows him to completely disregard data he wants to disregard because of BABIP
but then show that 89 OPS+ as the “real” value.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Chester Rasmussen
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
oh you mean Allen Craig.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
no, not Craig Allen!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Please please please
confuse those two again.
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
I am pretty sure...
…Mo made that trade…
:=8/
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
Seriously, we won the world series.
Get. Over. It.
Most fans will go most of their adult lives witout this experience.
And for the record, the Rasmus trade was SO worth it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
i agree, but the same recycled arguments get really old, really fast.
i’d rather everyone just stopped saying the same thing they have been saying for 3 months.
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah.
we’ve pretty much said all there is to say on this topic. hell, the trade is what pulled me back into VEB after a long absence. but as long as people keep making the same ill-informed statements, other people will keep making ill-informed counter-arguments.
for what it’s worth, while i’ve cooled on the trade and am no longer fucking hulksmash about it, i still don’t think it was an objectively good decision. however, i can understand how it is even more justifiable in some people’s minds given the world series win. i’d even go so far as to say i am incapable of caring very much about rasmus now. the world series washed my feelings away. i can still argue it was a bad idea, though.
whatever. this is tired. you’re right. WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS WHAT UP WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Oct 31, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I agree with everything you said, rosie.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
good post.
well put.
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Just be glad he's leaving before
he can chase off Tyler Greene.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow...
We WON A WORLD SERIES BECAUSE OF THAT TRADE!
by EddieHarsch on Oct 31, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
ive only been around VEB for a few seasons but Im pretty sure guay is a longtime resident
his perspective is about the journey as much as the destination. Losing Rasmus is still losing a 5 WAR CF before his prime. Making the trade resulted in a Championship. Im not arguing for or against anyone, Im just saying hes entitled to his opinion on the trade. You are also entitled to yours.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
can't a person declare the obvious in all-caps anymore?
y’all are touchy.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
YOU THINK VEB WONT GO STRAIGHT TO FREAK OUT MODE WHEN A BIG ANNOUNCEMENT IS MADE?
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Oct 31, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
DOOOOOOOOOOMED!
Stupid UCL's.
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Oct 31, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
glibness is not your strength, bobo
meanwhile, your bar reply to me should be green up there
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree & disagree
I think the trade for Rasmus was not good, even though it helped us win this world series. With Rasmus’ value, it probably should’ve helped us win this world series and provided more value down the line.
I do not agree that it was JUST TLR’s fault he was traded.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
If you have to trade the most valuable asset in your entire organization because he can't get along with your manager...
shouldn’t you find out if your manager is planning on retiring?
I'm guessing it was the opposite reason
Mo knew that not only was this possibly his last chance to win another title with Pujols, but now also La Russa, and went all-in.
If we fizzle out and finish at .500 and La Russa and Pujols leave, Mo could very well lose his job. I’m guessing that was his personal justification.
by matt man on Oct 31, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
This is actually an excellent point.
The FO motivation isn’t ALWAYS “Win a Championship”. It is fairly often “Don’t get fired.”
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Shelby Miller.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
I would disagree with that...
given the disparity in ML exposure and the position player/pitcher disparity…. But I could be wrong.
TINSTAAPP -- but I still agree.
People are treating this trade as though Raz was the next Pujols just waiting to happen. It is entirely clear by now that he wasn’t. He could yet turn out to be an occasional-All-Star-caliber center fielder, although I rather suspect he won’t. That doesn’t make him Pujolsian.
Shelby, by contrast, has “ace” written all over him, and those are very hard to find.
To put it differently: stipulate, for the moment, that obtaining Scrabble and Jackson and Dotel was necessary to winning the Series. Which player would you rather have sent Toronto to secure that win — Raz or Shelby?
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
by StanTheManFan on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Miller, Martinez, Cox
Rasmus no longer has less years of team control than those guys. Raising their trade value about his.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Still Pujols.
If that guy gets pissed about anything the FO does and the perception is leaves because of it, everyone gets fired. Period. If the owners give them a season before firing them, the only way to stay employed is by winning the whole damn thing.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
What if he counldn't get along with
any manager? I’ve heard a LOT of unsubstanciated rumors about his, umm, personal habits and how he’s really not much of a team player. And while he’s a good player, he’s not Barry Bonds-good. His bat and glove can’t write a check big enough for his personality to cash right now.
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
yay, unsubstantiated rumours!
let’s base points on them!
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
no smoke without fire
rumour is always rumour for a reason, its existence is as importance as its veracity in many cases.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
that il rosso guy?
i heard he does smack.
this is why rumours are bad sources for arguments
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Bad example
i know rumours are bad sources, but thats not the point. If Rasmus was seen as being lazy, lollygagging etc. by the players, by TLR, by the FO, whoever. It doesn’t matter what the truth is, what matters is that Colby has a bad reputation, and those things are hard to lose. Especially when TLR called Colby out about his refusal to listen to cardinals coaching, (which he probably should have been considering that on May 20th Colby’s BA dipped below .300 for the first time, on July 26th he was traded; in those 2 months he batted below .200). Seems to prove the truthfulness of said rumours.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
the issues with Rasmus and the Cardinals
Started before Rasmus made it to the majors, and those rumors are being repeated in Toronto.
Tony should have done a better job with Rasmus, But I don’t think it’s fair to put the whole trade on him. Oh, and if we do put the whole trade on him, and Rasmus doesn’t turn out to be the player some people think he is. Then we’ll have to start thanking TLR for trading him.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Here's what I don't get:
My problem is that WAR, OPS+, UZR, value – these are all tools to evaluate players. They help in the evaluation; but they are not the total evaluation. In a trade you will hardly ever get perfect values coming in and going out. If we are going to filet guys for not making statistically-based value assessments when they fail, we have to acknowledge the limits of our evaluation tools when our assessment parameters don’t work out. In this instance, “knowing the team,” “chemistry concerns,” overvaluation of bullpen arms – this all equaled a playoff run that likely would not have occurred in the alternative (particularly given how Colby played in Toronto.) I think it is a more open-minded approach to consider the strengths of evaluation systems that are not 100% statistically oriented, rather than excoriate them. This worked out – whether that was luck or not – fine. . . But the fact of the matter is; it worked.
by EddieHarsch on Oct 31, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
youre probably going to struggle with this around here
I think it is a more open-minded approach to consider the strengths of evaluation systems that are not 100% statistically oriented
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
methinks you make assumptions about the totality of VEB.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
no one argues that you have to have a 100% statistically minded approach.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
generalization sure.
But I think more of the regulars around here are statisically based in their posts and moreover the daily threads are statistical in nature.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions
statistics are the best way to judge most things.
so we should be based in statistical analysis. that’s a far cry from being 100%.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
statistics are historical records of the facts. they are what they are.
things outside of statistics are subjective, and therefore built on narrative or perception or conjecture. Any argument about these intangibles can’t be proven (if it could be proven, it could be measured – and therefore a statistic).
The problem is (a largely false, imo) perception that statheads don’t acknowledge the existence of “intangibles.” I (and most stat-friendly posters here, I think) will give you that there are other immeasurable factors that impact a game, but if we can’t measure or predict them, how can we gauge their importance? Why should we worry about things we can’t possibly begin to understand?
The only thing of definitive substance that we have to work with are (admittedly imperfect, but becoming less and less so) statistics. The best way for us to make judgments as fans is to analyze the factual record and then determine the likelihood of unknown material information that would alter that analysis.
/end rant
I agree.
However, ten years ago, if you followed the leading thinkers on statistical analysis in baseball, you would have found most guys believing that defense doesn’t matter. I’m not saying we need to argue intangibles. But I do think we can argue that statistical derivatives are not always the best measure of player impact.
well offseason is definitely goin gto be intesting
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
live stream
http://www.fox2now.com/news/livestreaming/
"The world is made for people who aren't cursed with self awareness." - Annie Savoy
by redbirdbluedevil on Oct 31, 2011 10:14 AM EDT reply actions
I would like Oquendo
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
heh
BUT WHO’S GOING TO OVERMANAGE THE NL ALL-STAR GAME NEXT YEAR???
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 10:15 AM EDT reply actions
the real reason he called it quits
He doesn’t want to manage the all-start game
I think we still get to do it, actually
It’ll just be our new guy
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
i think roenike gets to do it.
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Really?
Wow, that’s too bad.
Wikipedia doesn’t have a great answer, but the general answer appears to be “it’s the manager, not the team.” But if the manager is not there, I guess it could go to the next manager who was closest to the World Series, in which case it’s Roenike.
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
i think this worked in larussa's favor one time.
didn’t someone retire/resign/get hired by someone else the year after we lost the NLCS and tony got to manage the world series?
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions
upon further review, i'm an idiot.
never happened.
do subjunctive better
by stlcardinalsfang on Oct 31, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Id love that.
Brewers fans – this could have been something you earned, but its only happening because you lost.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
WOW
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
WHAT THE FUCK
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
Why not come back for second place on the win list, effectively first
since Mack has a big fat asterisk by his name? It’s sort of modest of him. I’m truly surprised.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
I suspect there might be health concerns and family concerns involved.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
I also suspect that MO and a lot of the front office
were not exactly begging Tony to come back. The discord erupts, mayhaps now we’ll get all unified.
Mark McGwire for Manager.
by infallibleopiniongenerator on Oct 31, 2011 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
YOU SHUT YOUR MOUTH
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
what the fudge, man?
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
flagged
"I wonder if I put on a uniform and told La Russa I wanted to play for him if I could be a big leaguer too?"
"that all depends. are you gritty?" "You would need a mediocre decade of MLB experience first" "do you have a goatee, are you short, and do you try really hard?" "Are you willing to play four positions terribly?"
I'll say this for Valentine: He picked the Cardinals all the way.
And that’s all I’ll say for him.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Or ingratiate himself, having picked up on TLR retirement rumors
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
don't worry everyone
SportsCenter is still talking handegg.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
We should hire Ryne Sandburg
just to piss off the Cubs
hehe
would be funny, but you know, he’s probably gonna be a shit manager considering he has all of… NO experience.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
But is he as smart as 90% of VEB?
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
in the minors right?
not exactly the same.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
that's more
experience than many managers in the MLB when they started. Ventura for the White Sox has never managed.
by WyoCardsFan on Oct 31, 2011 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions
You know who else started with no experience?
John McGraw. Sparky Anderson. Connie Mack. They seemed to do just fine.
I think managers are incredibly overvalued in terms of what they do and they get scapegoated a lot for things that aren’t their fault because it’s easier to fire the manager than to trade the player who’s playing piss poor baseball.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
I think the game was different back then, and there was not as much player turnover or possible front-office connections.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
TLR is retiring
WOW
Cards fan in Seoul.
Albert Pujols is the hero st. louis deserves.
by letsgostlcardinals on Oct 31, 2011 10:16 AM EDT reply actions
I said that this team had zero chance to make the postseason.
No qualifiers. Zero chance.
I said that La Russa would be back again, without question.
Let me say this: Scarlet Johanson will never ever, ever become my love slave / sugar momma. Never happen.
by The Continental on Oct 31, 2011 10:17 AM EDT reply actions 19 recs
ha ha ha
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions
Sorry....
..she’s already part of the MooCow herd – I called firsties…
;=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
One of of three ain't bad
As a hitter, you would make the Hall of Fame at that rate.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Oct 31, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Natalie Portman...
just gave me a come hither glance…
St. Louis Cardinals: 11 World Championships.
Ric Flair: 16 World Championships.
she's mine, dude
back off!
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Natalie Portman doesn't look that good up close. Bony and awkward.
And she doesn’t comport herself with much sex appeal. The wonders of film editing …
by hangingfromatree on Oct 31, 2011 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
especially when getting her LaRussa munched on by Mila...
too far?
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
let's agree to disagree, please.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I think bony and awkward is hot.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
yeah I would have probably gambled more than I could afford to lose
on LaRussa coming back.
I truly thought he wouldn’t be able to walk away from this roster, even without Pujols.
by infallibleopiniongenerator on Oct 31, 2011 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I am not sure why
I am so stunned. Been pretty critical of tlr but damn I’m gona miss him.
Piss off Tony, get shipped to Canada.
by beer me on Oct 31, 2011 10:17 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Agree
Just told my wife yesterday that I was happy for the WS and all, but hoped TLR wouldn’t be back next year. Now that he’s gone, I’m a tiny bit sad.
Stupid UCL's.
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Oct 31, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Between this and his wife's health,
goodbye Dave Duncan. I love you.
Still not a werewolf.
by clank on Oct 31, 2011 10:18 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I hated him.
I loved him.
I miss him already.
by Hardcore Legend on Oct 31, 2011 10:18 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 30 recs
yep.
When he was good, he was brilliant.
When he was bad, he was too brilliant.
Good and bad, I’ll miss him too.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
totally agree with that wonderfully conflicted sentiment
i wish he would have announced he was retiring at the end of next season, and done the whole farewell tour thing (i assume the players would have liked that). but that just isn’t Tony’s style, now is it?
Exactly.
This year I felt like it was finally time for Tony to go. I still really like Tony even though I often hate him. I thought for sure he would stay at least a couple more years, and after our crazy run I figured it was a foregone conclusion. I will miss the guy too but I’m still happy. This is a wonderful way for him to go out.
Unless it turns out there is some sort of health or family issue, in which case it could end up being more bittersweet.
by mattybobo on Oct 31, 2011 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Exactly.
I will say I’m enough of a sap that this playoff run swung me back to actually wanting him to come back.
Also, I"M SO AFRAID OF THE ALTERNATIVES.
Mark McGwire for manager.
by infallibleopiniongenerator on Oct 31, 2011 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
oh it will
wonder if we get to use a #Poached hashtag when it happens?
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
Best statement of the day
Older than any three of you.
by Remember Kenny B on Oct 31, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Being 20,
Tony is really the only manager I’ve ever known This is going to be weird hearing any name but La Russa.
2006, best year of my life. StL Cardinals AND Indy Colts win their championships.
I hated him.
I loved him.
I miss him already.
by Hardcore Legend on Oct 31, 2011 10:19 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 7 recs
wow.
really don’t know what to even think right now.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
reply fail
rec was fro
<Ihated hims, I loved him, I miss him already>
Dear Tony,
PLEASE DON’T BE DICK VERMEIL.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
go to kansas city and manage a royals team that smashes
a league leading number of home runs but wins nothing of note?
well actually that would be amusing.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Did Carp *know* about this when he gave that speech in the players-only meeting?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:21 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
been wondering that myself.
My guess is yes.
by infallibleopiniongenerator on Oct 31, 2011 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
If this has been on since August,
then it doesn’t mean he’s going because Albert is going , , , does it? . . .does it?
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
No, it means he's going becuase
Brendan and Colby are coming back
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
Brendan?
Doesn’t this mean that Ozzie can be our starting SS again?
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
nope. a mattybobo puppet account.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 4:20 PM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
nope. a mattybobo puppet account.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 4:20 PM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
so....terry francona?
I’d love that
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Oct 31, 2011 10:22 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Did Strauss have a "developing"?
because if not, hahaha.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:22 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
so do we think there is any chance Duncan stays?
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
it may well depend on Jeanine
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions
my guess would be
TLR based his decision partly on Duncan’s.
maybe buy a minor league club
did he say that ?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
pre-Kindle
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
GOOOOO GRIZZLIES!!
Well, they had Danny Cox anyway.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Whoa
This feels odd, certainly lacks the satisfaction I thought I’d feel when Tony finally moved on. Probably has something to do with that whole winning the WS thing. Im still heartened by this development, but I can’t say Tony went out with anything but class. Ultimately, we went to three world series in the last 8 years, and any way you slice it that spells success.
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
by mattyp on Oct 31, 2011 10:23 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
100%
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
how about Albert Pujols player-manager?
He’s already calling his own hit and run plays
I crawled the earth, but now I'm higher, 2010 watch it go to fire!
by First mammal to wear pants on Oct 31, 2011 12:07 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
pull out the shot so we can see Mozeliak's headache
THIS BIG
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Tony retired
TLR= smarter than Brett Favre
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Oct 31, 2011 10:24 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
SO FAR.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Good point
"IF CARDS CAN SIGN SUPPAN THEY CAN GIVE ME A HOME"
by Buddhasillegitimatechild38 on Oct 31, 2011 10:30 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It's all a sham.
He’s not quitting managing, he’s going to replace Spagnulo when Spags gets canned. It’s all because he went to that Rams game yesterday and realized that in the NFL, you get to SWITCH PEOPLE ALL GAME LONG.
… Yeah, I am going to miss TLR. Damn.
WWCD? CDGAF.
by JStymie on Oct 31, 2011 10:24 AM EDT reply actions 6 recs
i wonder what kind of effect
TLR’s retirement will have on albert returning and maybe even duncan coming back as pitching coach
THEY DID IT FOR TORTY! 2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
twitter
duncans decision depends more on his wife i would say
I don’t understand the whole Albert thing. If he leaves he’s playing for a new manager anyway so why not do it in a city he knows.
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Oct 31, 2011 10:26 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm not sure it means he won't be back, but I think some would argue
That he would for sure come back for TLR. not saying he would leave bcos Tony left or anything like that.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 3:46 PM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
I'd wager Dunc is gone
Mckay too.
Oquendo and McGwire may want to stay
by bobohilario on Oct 31, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions
what the hell do we do now?!?!?!
"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78
...baby...making?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'll get started on this now...
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
Oppo research
to get our bitching all lined up for Opening Day.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
scream at Mo for making stupid moves?
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
So if the ONLY way you could open Viva El Bar was to partner with Tony La Russa
would you do it ?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
I dunno
I guess it would depend on how he sided in the beer selection split within the business side. There was friction between the old guard guys who liked to stock the bar with dependable but expensive imports, and the new guard who saw that the future was through smart and cheaper craft picks.
by mattybobo on Oct 31, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Yeah, I was kinda thinking this comment had green potential
Which is not to say I’m disappointed, really. I mean, 6 recs is all-star caliber commenting. 3 recs is very solid and valuable.
see why I don't update the glossary.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
no.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
imagine if I'd spent a week hunting down every Colby Rasmus meme.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions
but you're inside the blog
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
no I'm not!
that’s just a dream I sell clank
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm not getting paid !
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions
NO!
BECAUSE TLR
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Next announcement
Albert Pujols will be player-manager
by jeff_abs on Oct 31, 2011 10:27 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
this just in: there is crying in baseball.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
MLBN is carrying it
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Well, Damn.
I’ve cussed him so many times, and wondered what the hell he was thinking, but this feels weird.
Guys it's all a big misunderstanding/podium mic mistake
he said Motte
by rdub on Oct 31, 2011 10:29 AM EDT reply actions 13 recs
hah
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Our season wasn't to edge of the cliff in Game 6.
It was over the edge. It was like Indiana Jones: The Last Crusade, when Indy goes cascading off the random cliff as a passenger of that doomed tank. As we sat, wordless, having just witnessed the end of this magical season. Yet, these Cardinals scrambled back over to our shock! Still dazed, by what had transpired, David Freese’s homerun sent Dr. Jones’ famed hat back into our lap, for one last push towards the Holy Grail.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
Hopeful thought just entered my head
Does this mean we’ve seen the end of five roster spots for “gritty veteranness”??? Please say yes.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
TLR's direct quote from the weekend was...
The coaching staff and I have always gotten turned on by veterans
So if it’s an internal promote, probably not.
Honestly...
…I hope he is talking about hot MILFy types instead of players.
depends on the next manager
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Oct 31, 2011 10:36 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
they all decided not to discuss their futures
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Joe Maddon, anyone?
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
why not
don’t see why he’d leave the Rays just yet though.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
because the Cardinals
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Because the braintrust isn't going to be there forever
- Andrew Friedman (GM) is the front runner for every open GM job, including Anaheim and Houston where he has ties to the owner.
- Dan Feinstein recently moved back to Oakland to become their director of scouting and development — he was the arbitration and contract guru for Friedman and responsible for the fantastic Longoria contract and the other arbitration buyouts that the TB front office have made. He was considered the successor of Friedman should he leave Tampa.
They have a ton of talent in their front office, but it’s not like you can lose a lot of people and still win on a budget of 1/5 what the other teams in your division are capable of spending.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
works for me
the glasses let you know he’s a smart guy.
by DJ Jazzy Jeff Weaver on Oct 31, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
don't you get my hopes up any further
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
So, we're used to that.
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Do not want emo-TLR
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Oct 31, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
he just needs a lozenge.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
There's a lot of detail in "The Extra 2%"
about Maddon growing up a huge Cardinals fan.
Ya, Rains mentioned it on Patrick too
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
we need to tell him about all the good biking paths in STL!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Does he like Trader Joe's?
I’ll bet he probably does, look at those cool glasses! We have, like, at least two of those here!
hahahahaha
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
I'm not sure
I like the cut of his jib but in my limited exposure to his in-game managing I’ve been left pretty baffled.
by infallibleopiniongenerator on Oct 31, 2011 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
So...
I’ve been trying to wait until Free agency starts to worry about the hotstove. But let’s kick it off.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Totally Mixed Feelings...
Just like so many of the posters above. I loved to curse his decisions, but at the end of the day, I always recognized that the man had forgotten more about baseball than I could ever hope to know. 8 Division Titles, 1 Wild Card Berth, 7 NLCS appearances, 3 NL Pennants, 2 World Series. The end of an era, and the end of an often frustrating, but totally brilliant career.
awwww so that's why Mo looked kind of sad during the parade.
i thought he was just waving like a nerdy attorney
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
THIS JUST IN
Tony LaRussa to open Bookstore.
Called ‘Sacrifice Books’
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
those are still overpriced, last I checked
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Manager Search begins this afternoon!
Get a suit, VEB!!!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
not sure. might need a skinny tie.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
red of course!
"There's only one way to play baseball, "the Cardinals' way." - George Kissell 1920-2008
by Supergus on Oct 31, 2011 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
plush even......
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
This is too surreal.
I’ve spent the last few years wishing he’d take a walk and now he is. ON WHOM AM I SUPPOSED TO RAGE NOW???!!!!!!!!!!!!
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
the.... dying of the light ?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
It's positively Shakespearian.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
and Thomasian
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
I drew a blank, Shakespeare was the only thing that would come to mind.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Think TLR gets that one
“this rough magic I here abjure”
The Mang does more than Milton can
To justify God's ways to man.
by alberich on Oct 31, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
seriously!
i’m pissed. not sure where i will direct my Cardinals-related invective next year.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
but we don't know who that is yet, dammit.
this doesn’t help me today
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
probably not $2-4 mil a year though
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
someone ask Mo about Duncan and Pujols
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
i can almost hear somewhere in the distance
Jim Riggleman typing up his resume
"I still don’t understand what commercial is better than having me on tv" – Chris Carpenter
2011: Boog would've count 78
has to be the most desired job in baseball.
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
Yeah, it probably is.
Yanks/Cubs/RedSox all come with too much negative baggage.
RE-SIGN ALBERT PUJOLS!
But, um
We just won the world series. So, whoever the new manager is has to deal with a lot of irrational expectation. It wouldn’t last long, but it would be a tough act to follow, so to speak.
Internal hire feel right then
Feels right right now anyway. If we take a guy from within the organization, he’s at least a part of making us the champs. As you say, an outsider would have enormous expectations upon him. He’s been handed a championship team.
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
Successful organizations promote from within.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Oct 31, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Competitive club year after year
right off a championship, plenty of ownership support, decent payroll, and the media is not nearly as ferocious as the big market clubs.
Tomorrow the Cardinals will call a press conference
and announce that yes, Riggleman is in fact Stan Musial’s long-lost nephew. And our new manager.
To pay full respect for Tony LaRussa, the 2012 Cardinals will have 7 Co-Player-managers
Pujols
Oquendo
Miles
Franklin
Schumaker
McGwire
Edmonds
Carpenter!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions
(@#($@)U$#) Pitching Coach
#HappySeason
by The Continental on Oct 31, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
hey, all that injury time, he studied The Binder.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
Carp as manager:
“So, Carp, should we try a hit-and-run here?”
“IDGAF”
“So, Carp, looks like a good time for a sac bunt, huh?”
“IDGAF”
“So, Carp, Lohse looks like he’s lost it. How about we get Dotel in there?”
“IDGAF”
by DJ Jazzy Jeff Weaver on Oct 31, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
do you guys think TLR's retirement
will have any effect on where Albert ends up?
Rent this for cheap!!
If it has any affect at all
it will be to increase the chance he goes to another club
so don't think it will have a significant impact?
just wondering…. we could use a 1B =)
Rent this for cheap!!
by Bowling_Guy25 on Oct 31, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Really hard to say
probably will come down to the numbers/offers more than anything else
hopefully not
If Tony didn’t retire this year, I’m sure albert knew at some point he would be playing for a different manager here in St. Louis
Grit != flat out sucking.
Mozeliak Heartburn Level Alpha
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
well, he didn't immediately say Duncan is leaving!
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
first thought: when do all these VEB people work?
second thought: i’ve done nothing but read VEB for the past week
seriously! don't you know most of us work for free? some of us even pay to work!
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions
me too, man, me too.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
upside: waaaayyyy better than the real world
downside: still poor
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
Take it from someone with a doctorate
BAD IDEA.
Get a masters, or a JD, or something with a fixed beginning and end point. Grad school is just an evil monster that eats your 20s.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
haha i'm thinking about law school ...
but that might not be the best idea right now. but hell, it worked for tlr, right?
1. Law school
2. Become manager of Cardinals
3. Implement sacrifice bunts
4. Profit!!!!
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
"get a JD so I can become an MLB manager"
may in fact be the only career plan worse than the “spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a JD so that I can do…something” plan I’ve watched all too many friends put into action.
this is precisely why I have not yet decided to get a JD :P
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
basically unless you can get almost a full ride,
it’s a really bad choice right now.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
or really, really want to be a lawyer
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions
it's probably still a good idea if you can get into a top 5-10 school.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I went to school with a lot of people whose identity was pretty tied up in being "good at school"
logically enough, many of them have the desire to go back and do…more school. I’ve taken on the role of repeatedly asking the question “why exactly do you want this degree? What are you going to do with it?” If you have a good answer to that, by all means go for it, but otherwise really consider whether you want to spend the time and money.
yeah.
i’ve had a lot of people suggest law school to me because i had a quite good undergrad GPA and i absolutely kill standardized tests, so people say i could get into a quite good law school. then i try to explain i don’t want to be a lawyer, and they say “oh, you can do so many things with a law degree”.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
i heard you can make fire out of it. without a lighter!
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
You could even
be the manager of the St. Louis Cardinals!
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah
I know where you’re coming from. My mother actually got as far as purchasing a bunch of LSAT books and giving them to me “just in case.”
My advice is to spend some time in the working world first, at the least. It’ll help you figure out what you might want to do, and whether you’d need a degree to do it.
well i've been working at a law firm
as a paralegal and it hasn’t totally scared me off yet
Both of my brothers are lawyers
their advice to me? Don’t be a lawyer.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
i can see how working as a paralegal could be fine though
get to work in a nice office, don’t have the same ridiculous hours, still a pretty decent wage.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Don't do law school "just because"
You’ll be suicidal within 2 months. You have to really effing want to do law/need law in what you plan on doing.
/AnonymousAdvice
Not afraid to nitpick
As a 3L, I can agree with this.
I’ve survived out of pure denial.
by Houdinimachine on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah but
don’t you guys know tlr is a lawyer?!
NO FUCKING WAY.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
and Theo Epstein went to law school
and so did Scott Boras. So if you go to law school, you’re either gonna end up a hall of fame manager, a GM/Director of Operations, or a high-powered agent. Seems to me it can’t go wrong.
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
or a disillusioned poster on a baseball blog
and that’s not even so bad
my favorite words are goodbye and my favorite color is red
Or a greasy politician
that gets caught banging interns/campaign volunteers.
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
ahhhh dreams.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
don't go to law school just because.
go to law school because you want to be like this guy!
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
(un)fortunately, my 930 patient was a no show
and my 900 came in early. So, I’m sitting here waiting on people to show up for their appointments.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
Really glad this came after a championship
because it would have sucked way worse without that high
I was 6 last time the Cardinals had a different manager
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
Corey Patterson for manager!
Cards fan in Seoul.
Albert Pujols is the hero st. louis deserves.
by letsgostlcardinals on Oct 31, 2011 10:44 AM EDT reply actions
Oquendo or Francona or Torre, I hear.
by RedAllOver on Oct 31, 2011 10:45 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
I want Oquendo, to be honest.
2011 will be a season for the ages. Los Cardenales de San Luis, Campeones del Béisbol!
Bilingual Twitter
me too.
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
Torre would be absolutely WONDERFUL
but that’s not gonna happen.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Pop Warner, please.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
by azruavatar on Oct 31, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
I was coming to suggest exactly this.
No thanks on Oquendo, btw.
I think we'll reconcile it by winning!
-Kim English
this
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
okay, someone explain who pop warner is.
apparently he is not a coach for tiny football players?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
AA Springfield manager.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
I think he's the best internal candidate including the major league coaching staff.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
alright. so the robot says, and i trust you.
what’s your thought on oquendo? i’m not big on him, personally.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Not a fan.
Too close to certain players imo but I don’t know much about him firsthand. I’ve liked the way Pop has handled the AA team but he’s probably still a “traditional” manager.
Beware: Velociraptors may be present.
He's that guy in Legally Blonde.
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
this is appealing
and it would certainly fit with a front office that obviously would love to have a low salary manager.
by infallibleopiniongenerator on Oct 31, 2011 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't have mixed emotions.
I am sad to see Tony retire. He could be incredibly frustrating, and he definitely had some major flaws, but I think the Cardinals will be hard-pressed to find a better manager. I know I am in the minority here.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
wouldn't be so sure you're in a minority
Sure TLR was frustrating at times, but some of that is familiarity breeding contempt. and some of that is because its much easier to sit here and yell than actually manage a game.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
fact
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
a true fact
even
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Plus, he was just so damn good looking.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
by SheckieZx on Oct 31, 2011 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
maddening at times and obviously struggled with some personalities,
there’s good and bad in everyone.
The bad – Rolen and Edmonds and Rasmus. Over-managing.
The good – I never doubted he did all he could to prepare the team and give them the best chance to win each game. 3 WS apperances and 2 championships.
Hard to argue the bad outweighed the good.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions
What did he do wrong to Edmonds?
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
Edmonds requested the trade to San Diego, apparently
when he heard he wasn’t going to be a starter.
It’s funny to see the Ankiel pitching thing drop off of the radar of “things that TLR fucked up”
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
Also funny to see Rolen keep popping up
like what happened with him in Philly (and Toronto) never happened.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
I don't see how that was bad
Edmonds was clearly not an everyday centerfielder at that point in his career.
Grit != flat out sucking.
and it brought us Freese so yeah. my bad.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah.
I didn’t always love him, but he built good teams, made the right calls much of the time, and was part of a whole lot of great, entertaining baseball seasons. He will be hard to replace.
or maybe the 'calls' arent as important as people want to believe
the right or wrong of TLR is probably what makes him so polarizing. Lineups and pitching changes aside, I was just glad he gave his best effort and led his teams to do the same.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions
I look at it this way:
The overall success or failure of a team long term is strongly tied to the consolidated statistics of each individual player. This is why the Phillies have 102 wins.
However, the manager’s job is to maximize those chances by the decisions he makes in each individual instance, analyzing the statistics and setting things up to ensure the best possible chances for success.
Looking at it like a poker game: the cards do the work, but someone still has to play them in a way that maximizes their chances and balances risk and reward for the best possible outcome.
Sometimes TLR was really good at that. Other times, not so much. I’ll still miss him.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
except in poker as often as not, the cards dont mean anything.
Lineup optimization is likely a myth and at a minimum misapplied. All in all, Im happy with the job that TLR did because of the results.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Phillies won 102 games
Because they had the best pitching staff in the league.
Grit != flat out sucking.
Yes, that's what I was getting at.
Statistics matter over 162.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
maybe he'll unblock me on twitter now
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
Great
Now I will have to put up with him calling baseball with Tim Mcarver during playoffs. That will be ear rape.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Oct 31, 2011 10:48 AM EDT reply actions
Hey...... another Forschie.
I really don’t see Tony as the in-booth type personality. He’s not exactly a garrulous individual.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
well he's 2.
see how that works.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Actually, he's 3.
There is another.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
it's not in order
numbers are kind of arbitrary. like uniform numbers.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
except that I can't be 31
the other Forsch has that one. I’ll just have to settle for witty
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
did the sound cut out for anyone else in mid-applause?
it was surreal
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
well one way it will impact the Pujols situation
all that salary is now freed from our grid o’ payroll.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Yea - it was like 5M right?
how much to 1st time managers make!? 800K-900K?
"I don't know, but it works. Doin it for Torty works... He brings us luck and we're gonna roll with it." Allen Craig
This parallels Johnny Keane in 1964
We win the series then our manager leaves.
In 1964 Keane went on to manage teh NY Yankees and we hireed Red to manage.
Catchy tagline needed
oh geez, DP Show, why do you gotta choose BJ Rains.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
I LIKE PRIZES
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
mm... pies
oh you said prizes? thats good too i guess.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
Jedi master you seek
wars not make one great, hmmm.
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
WOW
I did not see that coming. I mean, had Tony moved into second place on the all time win’s list, and then won the WS, maybe. I just figured he really wanted second place.
Some may disagree, but I think this really hurts us when it comes to resigning Tony. Gonna be interesting to see who they bring in, and what assistants that guy brings in. You gotta think guys like Carp and Waino, and Yadi, have a pretty specific way they like to do things at this point. Wonder how open to change they will be? That is why I almost hope we promote Oquendo (though he doesn’t thrill me), b/c it would keep certain things the same.
Enjoy retirement Tony. Not everybody agrees, but I think you are one of the best managers ever, and I’ve enjoyed your time in STL. You are Cardinal family now, and forever.
i dont see that it does.
the money is going to make that decision. If they offer Albert 90% of the highest offer and hire Tom Brunansky as manager, Albert stays. If they offer him 70% of the highest offer and hire Oquendo he leaves.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
re-read what clank said.
but yes, it does hinder our chances to re-sign Tony.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
yeah, i was replying to stanley1
my bad clank. didnt mean to get in the way of joke.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions
i think it was a humorous observation
that it is, in fact, more difficult to re-sign the man who just retired.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
this really concerns me with regards to albert.
i’m freaking out now.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
In the end, I don't think this matters. Nobody thought TLR was going to stay more than another year or two anyway.
RE-SIGN ALBERT PUJOLS!
You've got a good point
and I hope you’re right.
yay, it's VEB's resident talk-us-off-a-ledge-man!
i guess that’s right, i always figured tony would be gone after next year anyway. i just feel like this will have some repercussions. i think duncan is probably gone as well and i don’t know quite what that means for our pitching staff.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Well, Tony retiring
and not going to another team is probably favorable as far as keeping Duncan—Dunc can’t go and follow Tony, except to retirement.
I do have a bad feeling in my mouth about Oquendo as a manager. It’s hard for me to think of a team’s ex-player coming back to manage and having that relationship go smoothly. Pete Rose is the closest I get in my half-assed memory-based survey.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
How about Red?
how long had he been retired from playing when he was named manager in ’65? He seemed to get along well with the players, was fairly successful, etc.
by ArkansasTravs on Oct 31, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions
as long as they keep the Mafia core and address the obvious holes in the roster
I’m not concerned with the outcome one way or another. I remain, and shall remain, a Cardinals fan.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions
well, of course.
i will always be a fan of the team. this just leaves a lot of questions for right now.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Making Oquendo the manager
Probably would make Albert very happy.
by Hardcore Legend on Oct 31, 2011 11:05 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
True, but I hope we re-sign him before we even name a new manager
so it doesn’t become an issue.
by DJ Jazzy Jeff Weaver on Oct 31, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
That's not going to happen
because Pujols holds all the cards in his negotiation. The team must move forward and take care of it’s business regardless. Pujols will then have to make his decision.
IMO, allowing Pujols a voice in who the next manager is would be a VERY BAD IDEA.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
don't look now, but I think hr is just now finding out.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
a person. presumably.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions
a rather dashing young fellow, I'd say
by hr on Oct 31, 2011 11:04 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
low blow
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions
That's
What got Reynolds into trouble to begin with.
by Forsch's2nohitters on Oct 31, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
i was in class all morning and i get on my pjone to check what you bastards are up to
and TLR out of fucking nowhere. wow.
by hr on Oct 31, 2011 11:07 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
you can't leave us alone
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions
worst of all, one of my novelty accounts is now completely useless
I mean,…
by hr on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
I can, but then I'd have to kill you
and then I would get b& trying to show you
by hr on Oct 31, 2011 11:26 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions 3 recs
I'm rec'ing this post solely because of "b&"
also, wtf, sbn? clank’s having issues.
probably a werewolf.
the one you aren't allowed to post with
because it will be banned? yeah, that’s not really that big a deal. haha
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
DON'T YOU TELL HIM WHAT TO FEEL
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
banned *on veb*
i had a deal for my account all lined up to a guy on RR and now thanks to this, it doesn’t look like it’ll happen anymore
by hr on Oct 31, 2011 11:23 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
I have bad feelings about Oquendo as manager
For one, he has no experience.
The other is I remember him in his later playing days, and he used to bat with this horrible open stance that made me believe he was the worst hitter in the world and when he would come to bat I would grumble and think “Why is he on our roster?”
Are you saying you don't want Oquendo as batting coach?
bollocks
by SecondHalfMatt on Oct 31, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
He did manage Puerto Rico in the World Baseball Classic
That was international competition! That’s the highest level!
With my Freese ray I will STOP...
…the World.
I once shot a man just to see him die...then I got distracted and missed it.
Wait, today is Halloween.....
maybe this is just a bad joke. Tony’s way of scaring us. Or me, at least. lol
This really is the best of all possible worlds.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 11:04 AM EDT reply actions
I'd have to put some more thought into it.
I liked TLR because he was interesting and I thought his team management was good/underrated (underrated by VEB). I thought his in-game managing/lineup construction/roster machinations were inconsistent/overrated (overrated by the outside media).
I will say that having lived in Boston for several years while Tito was managing was the Red Sox, I do not want him.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
i'm curious aboyt your last sentence.
for what reason do you not want tito?
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Tito was constrained by AL rules and the BOS front office.
Left to his own devices, I have little doubt Tito would be a sac-bunting, grit-loving, dumb double-switching machine.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
so basically, he'd be TLR all over again.
i think tito is a really good manager of people and personalities. on-field tactics are less important, and therefore less important to me. i have no question that he would drive us nuts here with his in-game decision.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
Zaxby's!
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
Given some of thoughts put out here...
There is no good hire.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
VEB
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
How did this announcement not happen shortly after a RB post?
bollocks
by SecondHalfMatt on Oct 31, 2011 11:07 AM EDT reply actions
so shocked!
this has been a baseball year of surprises
it’s like Surprise
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Kurkjian i do not like you anymore
do NOT mention Bobby Valentine
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
ha
“Or the best guy out there, bobby Valentine”
I spit out my coffee laughing so hard. The best guy out there is francona, Tim
by CarpIsMyManCrush on Oct 31, 2011 11:09 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
the best guy out there now is TLR
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Why do people like Francona?
Baffled by this. . .
by EddieHarsch on Oct 31, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
The arguments can be summed up thusly
Against Francona: Are not
For: Are too
by dmiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Francona could be considered the polar opposite of TLR as manager
He leaves his pitchers in several batters (or innings!) too long and his occasional attempts to dabble in small ball are ham-handed.
Personality-wise, he’s laid back and easy going, perfect for managing a team with outspoken personalities (which I don’t consider the Cardinals).
On the other hand, Francona’s been known to tinker with the lineup on a daily basis, so that’s one thing the two have in common.
by olddomination on Oct 31, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Ugh...
I was looking forward to listening to the radio all morning and hearing everyone’s stories from the Series…what they did, who they celebrated with, what kind of emotion they felt, etc…
Now everyone is talking about La Russa’s legacy and getting former players to come on and talk about his character. Shit.
I once shot a man just to see him die...then I got distracted and missed it.
BECAUSE TLR
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Awww...
…will that still be a thing?
I once shot a man just to see him die...then I got distracted and missed it.
yeah, except it will be
because TLR (new manager)
THEY DID IT FOR TORTY! 2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
twitter
by zoomzoomj88 on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
i was giving it a last spin.
but it’ll probably return ironically, if i know my vebness.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
/already waiting to pounce
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
i feel the final words were already written
http://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2011/10/17/2495036/im-tony-la-russa-bitch
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:13 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
...
What up, haters? Remember me? I’m the guy who traded that hot, young prospect for a bunch of old-ass pitchers and three-month rentals. How’d that shit work out? What? I can’t hear you over ALL THE CHAMPAGNE BEING POURED IN MY EARS.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Guys that have already txt'd Mo this morning
1.) Mark Burhle
2.) Mike Jorgensen
3.) Mike Quade
4.) Tony Sparano
That's impossible
Tony Sparano died. The last scene of the show totally foreshadowed it. I read it on the internet.
DON'T STOP
blackness
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Man I am sick and tired
of hearing about Colby Rasmus..
"When a pitcher's throwing a spitball, don't worry and don't complain, just hit the dry side like I do." - Stan Musial
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
"Son, what kind of pitch would you like to miss." - Dizzy Dean
by shadetree on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
who
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
cody ramos
THEY DID IT FOR TORTY! 2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
twitter
by zoomzoomj88 on Oct 31, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Brendan Ryan
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Oct 31, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Corky Ramses
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
i'm sicker of hearing that AP
won’t be coming back b/c TLR’s now retired.
THEY DID IT FOR TORTY! 2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
twitter
by zoomzoomj88 on Oct 31, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
you'll be hearing about him for a while here.
we do not get over our prospect losses easily. see .
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
i do think it's ironic and comical that even in announcing his departure,
which is something most Rasmus supporters wanted, he draws their wrath.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
it's only natural, and it makes sense.
colby is gone, due in large part to his inability to get along with tony. the front office knew tony was retiring all the way back in august. so why move colby?
i think there is a large possibility that colby couldn’t get along with anyone, but that’s just speculation and team chemistry doesn’t really matter that much.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
im not disagreeing. Just saying the guy (TLR) cannot ride the middle, even in leaving.
For the record, I was completely against the trade. Also for the record, knowing what I know now I would pull the trigger on the deal.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
because
colby is gone, due in large part to his inability to get along with tony. the front office knew tony was retiring all the way back in august. so why move colby?
The bold part might not be completely true.
Grit != flat out sucking.
remember how we all loved each other
and were plotting man-babies ?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
I thought that was man-boobies...
;=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
Aranathor picked it up
are you in school? are you playing hooky or something ?
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
waaaaaavvvesssss
~~~~~~~~~~
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
cue TBender's sig
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
Hm, I should probably go to school now
seeing as how I’m going to be late for Discrete now, too
probably a werewolf.
I wonder if Mo & DeWitt
will ask or have asked Tony for advise on who replaces him. They have known about this for a couple of months. I kind of wonder if they have had some kind of plan in the works since this doesn’t seem to be unexpected by Mo & DeWitt. I bet Oquendo & Pettini will be high on the list if Tony has a say. I also think McGwire might be considered as well.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
Man, if people screamed
when McGuire became the hitting coach, imagine the outcry if he became manger.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
and how much more McGwire
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
loloops.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
that is actually why I use Mac
in sleep-dep and/or inebriation, i can’t spell it gud.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, if they scream, screw 'em.
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
by StanTheManFan on Oct 31, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
I am soooo hoping for Oquendo..
but it would be kinda awesome to score Socia or Maddon
"When a pitcher's throwing a spitball, don't worry and don't complain, just hit the dry side like I do." - Stan Musial
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
"Son, what kind of pitch would you like to miss." - Dizzy Dean
my vote goes to oquendo
but after that, francona, then maddon.
THEY DID IT FOR TORTY! 2011 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!
twitter
by zoomzoomj88 on Oct 31, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
screw it name Torty the manager..
Craig starts every game.
"When a pitcher's throwing a spitball, don't worry and don't complain, just hit the dry side like I do." - Stan Musial
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
"Son, what kind of pitch would you like to miss." - Dizzy Dean
sciosia?
oh hell to the no. remember mike napoli? sciosia basically pulled a tlr on that whole situation and forced a trade that not only got rid of an all-star catcher, but also saddled the angels with vernon wells’ contract.
he’s terrible.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
So can we get a grassroots
“Hire Pop Warner” movement going?
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:22 AM EDT reply actions
But would he want to?
There are much bigger egos to go with the bigger paychecks.
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
true
more of a pipe dream for me i spose, everything i’ve read and watched about him has been positive
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow.
This is what happens when I sleep in on my day off. Wow. Just wow. Say what you will but I for one will miss Tony…he’s the only manager I can really remember. Next year will be odd.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
Future Mrs. David Freese ♥
St. Louis Cardinals 2011 World Series Champions
We did not expect this.
NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!!!!!
by The Spanish Inquisition on Oct 31, 2011 11:24 AM EDT reply actions 11 recs
But nobody expects....
well, u know.
;=8)
2011 World Series Champions!
And that is NERTLERB!!!!!!!!!!
:=8D
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh boy...
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
BRING OUT THE COMFY CHAIR!
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
News travels fast
It’s such big news that my brother actually called me from a tractor in the middle of a field to let me know that TLR resigned (I’m up in Chicagoland).
had a mutual option with the team though
And they said they would love to have him.
by Cardinals645 on Oct 31, 2011 5:02 PM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
that's good
we need communication during the zombocalypse
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
My poor sports-widower husband
Asked me last night if he could have his wife back, now that the WS is over & I’ve re-watched each game at least once on MLBN.
I promised him I’d stop obsessing about the Cardinals today….
you could have warned 'em about Hot Stove.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
is he not smart enough to look up
“st. louis cardinals lingerie” on the internet and talk to you about supporting your team with the appropriate attire?
for those of us without the twitterz
have there been any good reactions there?
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
#MaddonSTL
trying to trend it.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
I think the main reporters were going to take a day off today.
since the Albert stuff wouldn’t kick in for a few days, and they’ve been on constant assignment.
so the locals basically consist of… the Rainses.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
i think leach and strauss are still sleeping.
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Jon Jay had something nice to say.
DO YOU THINK IT'S NOT GOING TO BE WHAT IT IS?!!
by Vindicator9000 on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Well..
this should be an EXCITING offseason. Let’s hope it doesn’t turn into a sad offseason.
Do you guys think Mo is still looking for some 20 homerun guys?
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
So does Ozzie rejoin the Cards organization now?
The general impression I’ve always had is that Ozzie has stayed away from coaching or participating in FO-related things while TLR was here. Is that accurate?
Maybe now he comes back in some capacity, assuming he wants in.
Kumar: I don't know man, I lose my touch, man.
Dignan: Did you ever have a touch to lose, man?
I certainly wouldn't mind
but somehow I still find this unlikely
by LandSickness on Oct 31, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
I've seen Ozzie a couple times at games this year
Willie McGee bobblehead night and one of the WS games. I was surprised to see him at either.
bollocks
by SecondHalfMatt on Oct 31, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
that's what i was sayin'
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Is this assuming that the next manager
works pro bono?
by LandSickness on Oct 31, 2011 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
if you look at the average salary for most every other manager....
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
and playing TG at SS adds around another 8 million.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
here's the tweetpersons
dgoold Derrick Goold
Mozeliak has has a list of manager candidates who intrigue him in his desk drawer for at least three years. Now gets to use it. #STLcards9 minutes ago
Ackerman1120 Tom Ackerman
La Russa and his wife, Elaine, hustled to the airport after the press conference to make a flight to NYC. He’ll be on Letterman tonight.12 minutes ago
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
in other words
Tony La Russa has left the building.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
he ain't nothing but a hound dog
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
I wonder what this means for McGuire?
Will a new manager keep him?
So says, Titus Pullo (formerly The Dude)
By all accounts, he did a good job with the hitters this year
so I hate to see him leave, but whomever they hire may have his own guy he wants
Whoa,
weren’t you just accusing others of making irrational justifications for the Colby trade? McGwire is a fine coach, I suppose. The players like him. But maybe the fact that we had some really talented players had more to do with our OPS+ than any coaching that McGwire did.
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
I hope they keep him
I think I have decided that McGwire’s approach is a sound and logical one. He considers himself a psychologist for hitters instead of some sort of tinkerer or mechanic. He basically does cognitive behavioral therapy on the hitters (and I for one actually suspect he might have been a CBT patient at one time, because some of the quotes from him read a lot like the “gist” of cognitive therapy).
He keeps saying that he isn’t interested in trying to adjust hitters’ mechanics and swings, because they clearly are able to be successful with what they have been doing. He tries to get hitters to stop thinking that they can do things that they cannot do. If you’re striking out on some low pitch over and over again, don’t start thinking you need to change your swing or something. Instead, it’s a lot more logical to stop swinging at pitchers’ pitches. He is interested in adjusting the hitters’ thinking, which is what a therapist does. For all the talk of “dinger camp” he basically sees it as his job to help each hitter make the most of his particular approach and skills, which seems so obvious… but in that kind of job one wonders if common sense is really all that common.
didn't he rather famously adjust holliday's swing?
and that failed? i hope he doesn’t do that anymore, but the results this year seem to indicate that he knows what he’s doing as a hitting coach.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
maybe hes just not a mechanincs guy. Dunc certainly isnt.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
except he famously taught David Freese how to go the other way.
you know, the MVP.
he’s had quite a while to smooth out his approach from personal hitting coach to the hitting coach of a pro team. the results don’t look too bad. a MacRae team might not have been patient enough to work 41 walks.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions
he taught Freese to go the other way?
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, I can't dig it out right now
but McGwire was the one working with Freese. there are quotes from both parties.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Freese goes both ways?
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
I thought such news would fill VEB with renewed optimism!
I guess y’all were just saying that during the Series.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, my point was related to bobo's statemement that mcgwire wasn't a tinkerer.
he has tinkered in the past. and it didn’t work out. now he doesn’t seem to be doing that.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
I don't think we have enough information, either way, il rosso.
I’m an anecdote-digger and methinks you need more meat than that to say that for sure.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
anecdotes
link, just so there is some proof what i am saying is at least anecdotal. warning: asshat quotes.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
2009!
it’s 2011. I’m talking
now he doesn’t seem to be doing that.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think that's really the question
The question is: Will he want to work for anyone else? Tony was instrumental in bringing him back to baseball, so I could totally buy it if he wanted to go back to private instruction, considering he’d be trading on his name AND his success with the 2011 Cardinals at this point.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
Maddon
I could get behind him. Seems to get a lot of out his players. Alot of the other veteran managers that are being mentioned, I woudn’t be overly happy with.
I’m not nearly as high on Oquendo as a lot of you are, but I’m wondering if he doesn’t make sense for continuity.
Dang. Next year is going to be crazy different.
Agree
Maddon is the best in the business
by olddomination on Oct 31, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Chris Carpenter to address media! THIS IS NOT A DRILL
oh my heart can’t take this
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
I refuse to speculate now
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
"Despite media reports to the contrary....
by DJ Jazzy Jeff Weaver on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
damn beat me to it.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
"Good morning ladies and gentleman."
“I am Chris Carpenter, and I don’t give a f*ck. That is all. Goodbyee”
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
by SheckieZx on Oct 31, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Carp yesterday
so was he just really emotional, drunk, or both?
cause it was goofy/awesome.
BRAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNSS
by OurSaviorAaronMiles on Oct 31, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
that maybe
(whisper) normal Carp
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah, I speculated drunkeness.
Mike Shannon: "That strikeout was brought to you by...by...well, I don't know what it was brought to you by!"
John Rooney: "It wasn't brought to you by anything Mike."
he's addressing right now but I guess we don't get it.
http://lockerz.com/s/152044536
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions
That guy from Nickleback is a real asshole.
"He probably misses his old glasses."
by Alxfritz on Oct 31, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
rec'd
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
I think he's more of a jerkass myself
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
we're still bitching to contact.
there’ll be plenty, don’t worry.
it is what it is, not what we thought it'd be
by il rosso on Oct 31, 2011 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
also rec'd
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Rainsface, king of blockquotes, is the twitter to watch if you want insta-quotes.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
link
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
B(J)RAAAAAAAAIIIIINNNNSSSSSSS
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm on it.
Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Second base….I’ve played second base, how hard can it be? -TLR
Also, Dave Concepcion.
by RiverRat on Oct 31, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
isn't he busy working for MLB?
2011 Cardinals GIDPs: 169
NL Record: 2011 Cardinals, 169
ML Record: 1990 Red Sox, 174
he seems to enjoy being the righter of wrongs
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Next question:
Did Francona know about TLR’s decision when HE decided he wouldn’t be back?
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
Agree, seems unlikely, but
if we’re going to go for conspiracy theories, why not go all-in?
"That’s what a baseball player does: he uses the glove half of the time." -- Rick Horton regarding the DH.
by StanTheManFan on Oct 31, 2011 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
can't imagine that was related
Terry was, in all likelyhood, gone from Boston whether or not he wanted.
Here’s to the crazy ones. The rebels. The troublemakers. The ones who see things differently. While some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do.
by tehzachatak on Oct 31, 2011 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Lemme criticize TLR some more
I’ve really got to complain about the timing of this announcement. I was all into the warm fuzzy feelings of being Champs and all that. We all know that the Yankees blow, which makes the Cardinals the undisputed GREATEST TEAM IN BASEBALL. If you need more evidence, Game 6 basically proved that beyond an indecisive, scientific, ethical society atheist’s ability to doubt.
And what do I feel now? I feel scared.
Just when I thought re-signing Pujols was in the bag, just when I was envisioning this team going back-to-back with Wainwright at the head of the rotation, I get this stupid announcement.
What? He could’t wait until after Thanksgiving so I could say a few heart-felt words over a perfectly roasted turkey and a side of stuffing?
Tony’s timing is baffling. Thanks for stealing my afterglow man!
So says, Titus Pullo (formerly The Dude)
by Titus Pullo on Oct 31, 2011 11:54 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
On the other hand, it lots Mo get on this immediately
instead of say in December.
You think Pujols wouldn't know he was retiring?
by olddomination on Oct 31, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
I was wondering the same thing
I wonder if we’ll ever know.
you guys, the timing was covered in the presser.
The entire team decided not to discuss anything of the future, including free-agent stuff. Because it went to Game 7 of the World Series, it was not discussed at all. Tony told his long-standing coaches a little bit earlier, as in a few days early. He told the organization a month before the end of the regular season so they could prepare for it.
He told the team last night in the weight room of Busch Stadium.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
And it was even made clear that the TLR decision would be a quick one this year, before he headed to the Bay
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Surprises me even more.....
I kind of figured winning it all is one of the reasons he is walking away. You are saying he made that call a month ago.
I hope he didn’t make this decision because the team was playing bad, and he though he lost them. That obviously wasn’t the case.
Aw, did he harsh your buzz?
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
just watch the next postseason marathon on MLB network.
Youll feel warm and fuzzy again.
PUT TYLER ON THE GREENE!! update - .341/.430/.621!!!!
Public Relations Officer of the Tyler Greene Fan Club.
by Stash Musial on Oct 31, 2011 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I beleive TLR only had a couple of days to decide whether he'd pick up his half of the mutual option to come back.
so, no, he couldn’t have waited until thanksgiving.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Oct 31, 2011 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions
it would have crippled the organization to wait that long.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Oct 31, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the moves the front office made down the stretch
With regards to the likes of Berkman, Carpenter, and Wainwright will have as much or more to do with Pujols staying than whether Tony had stayed.
by olddomination on Oct 31, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
timing is a must
otherwise, the organization would be handcuffed in finding a new manager
Grit != flat out sucking.
Yeah, but what about the turkey?
You have to admit, they shoulda taken that into consideration!
So says, Titus Pullo (formerly The Dude)
by Titus Pullo on Oct 31, 2011 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm the opposite
I’m glad it’s done. Think if he had done the Brett Favre thing — bled it out repeatedly until the last days before spring training and then retired. Fuck, that would have been awful — we’d be a team in transition for the entire next year. I think this is the least selfish way for him to have done it, actually, and by far the most professional.
Pujols or not Pujols. That is the question.
how odd to think of what was going on simultaneously. what a timeline.
as we watched the parade, Albert had already filed for free agency.
after the players filed out from the stadium ceremony, Tony gathered them in the weight room to announce his retirement.
we were walking to the parking lot or getting the metrolink or watching on tv.
weird to check the liveblog on VEB at the time.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
it's an overload of baseball happenings
to muse on…
Champs again!!
Oh nos, what about Albert!?!?
Wait, what!? La Russa retired. Hooray! One final awesome run and now I don’t have to get annoyed with him again.
Wait a minute, who’s the new manager going to be? What if he’s worse? ach!!
I mean, that’s just a lot to process lol
new tweet watch
is now live-tweeting.
the presser is on KMOX currently, I think.
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Underlines the fact that Carp is team leader
"What I said is what I said. At the time, the moment was heated. Maybe I shouldn't have said it. But it is what it is." -- Nyjer Morgan
Mo is on Bernie's radio show
Says he has had a head start on thinking about a new manager. He has a long list of guys to replace Tony. It doesn’t sound like he has a certain name in mind but I doubt if he did he would hint at it on Bernie’s show. He doesn’t think this will impact Albert at all.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
1987 was the year that did it for me, too (I was 9)
and I can clearly remember the sting of disappointment when they lost to the Twins. My dad and I were sitting on the couch, distraught with head in hands. Then my mom walks in to see the Twins celebrating and says “oh, how nice for the Twins.”
I love my mom, but I’ve never been able to forgive her for that. The heifer.
Nyjer Morgan Fan Club President
So Albert likes to call the hit-and-run
Can we just roll the manager salary into his and let him be player-manager? Heck, with AP managing we could even let third base coach position remain open, since everyone would be under a standing order to run through all stop signs anyway.
by DaMang on Oct 31, 2011 12:23 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Why isn't there more mention of Joe Pettini
to replace TLR? Check out his resume. 7 years as a minor league manager. Minor league field coordinator for 5 years. 9 years as bench coach. All with the Cards. 56 years old. I’d bet he gets short-listed.
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Oct 31, 2011 12:25 PM EDT reply actions
Pettini and Oquendo are both on the short list
bollocks
by SecondHalfMatt on Oct 31, 2011 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Is there a list ?
Who else is on it ? Or is it just your list ?
Beer and Baseball. Baseball and Beer. It's not hard to reevaluate your priorities when you only have two.
by PugetSoundCardsAddict on Oct 31, 2011 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
There is a list.
Mozeliak, of course, will not be sharing it.
But feel sure those two are on it.
The negative waves. Always with the negative waves...
Elation. Sadness. Mayhem. Champagne. Sleepless fury. Never been a night like it. - Joe Posnanski
It is October in St. Louis, and there is baseball to be played. - Red Baron
I'm thinking they are on the list because
They were co-managers when Tony was out with shingles.
bollocks
by SecondHalfMatt on Oct 31, 2011 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I bet he is going to get serious consideration.
And wouldn’t suprise me if he is the new skipper. Oquendo as well.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
Jim Riggleman wouldn't suprise me either.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
TLR Resignation Thread
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Wow
I think, for the first time in my life, I have mixed emotions about something
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Trevor Rosenthal Update (as of end of regular season)
120 1/3IP, 133 K, 52 BB/HBP, 55 ER, 7 HR, 3.04 FIP
Postseason: 2 Starts- 15 IP, 9 H, 10 K, 2 BB, 3 ER, 19:10 GO:AO
by VolsnCards5 on Oct 31, 2011 12:52 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
what about that night in Guadalajara
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
you sure it wasn't Tiajuanna?
Johnny Gomes could not be reached for comment
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Oct 31, 2011 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions
pretty sure 'e regrets that
would've.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
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