Morose Robot is Sad
I don't recap games very often. I struggle to escape the visceral emotions of the moment and analytically look at a game. I'm far better at objectively analyzing large swaths of data that don't carry the emotional baggage of a direct win or loss. So I find myself in an uncommon place. After an unexpectedly long day in the office, I watched the Cardinals game only to witness a series of missteps and poor decisions resulting in a loss. After the game, I watched the UFC 117 fights only to see Anderson Silva, whom I vehemently detest, escape a drubbing in the last half of the 5th and final round of his fight.
The unfortunate confluence of events makes for a morose robot.
The Cardinals seem to be a mistake prone team this year. I have to admit that there's a psychological attachment to mistakes. When the team botches something, it's liable to stick out at you. For every 99 times they do something right, it's that 1 time they don't that stands out.
Matt Holliday gets tossed out at the plate. While this isn't a mistake, and there's statistical evidence to prove that 3B coaches should be aggressive, it proved to be an unfortunate difference maker. Jake Westbrook getting caught after what seemed to be a strikeout pitch to Donnie Murphy only to see the ball go out of the yard was rough. Aaron Miles, moments after singling in the go ahead run, gets caught in an ignorant rundown to end the inning.
Those kinds of events are rotten. They stink. I can usually rationalize them away at the end of the night because they're random events that happen due to split second reactions and decisions. It's the decisions that are made with time and consideration, which are then so blatantly wrong, that I struggle with. For all the faults the club made on the field last night, Tony LaRussa made some foolhardy personnel choices once again in late innings.
The idea that switching Allen Craig in for Colby Rasmus when the Cardinals are up by one inning is undefendable unless Rasmus is escorted off the field on a stretcher. Jon Jay is not a bad defender. He's actually a very good defender. Allen Craig isn't a complete butcher in right field. Regardless, the idea that Jay & Craig is a better late inning arrangement than Rasmus & Jay is patently false. In recent weeks, LaRussa has made the same costly mistake by supplementing Randy Winn for Rasmus.
It's easy to dog on LaRussa when he does things wrong. That's not my point. LaRussa probably doesn't get enough credit for the things he does right. But he has persistent blind spots. Colby Rasmus is one of them. Unless there is an injury or a very infrequent rest day, Rasmus should be on the field every inning of every game.
Besides, arguably, Jon Jay, Rasmus has no outfield peers defensively. Behind Albert Pujols and Matt Holliday, Colby Rasmus, even after fading from his early season highlights, is still the third best offensive component of this team. If you're behind in a close game, he should be there to bat. If you're ahead in a close game, he should be there to field.
Colby Rasmus not playing is a black mark on the manager every time.
Whether or not that affected the specific outcome of last night's game. . . probably not. Could Rasmus have gotten to that ball or would Jay have reached it from RF? Hard to say. Would he have made a better throw than Jay's lollipop? Rasmus might have the stronger arm. Regardless, LaRussa diminished his team late in a close game. That's a bad decision even if it isn't the impetus for the loss.
* * *
One of the earliest moves that John Mozeliak made after being selected as the GM in October of 2007 was to lock up Adam Wainwright to a long term contract. They bought out the remainder of his team controlled years through 2011 and tacked on some club options for 2012. Those options are probably going to get picked up involuntarily at the end of this season. Wainwright has a clause that guarantees both his 2012 option and his 2013 option if he is in the top 5 in Cy Young voting in 2010 or 2011.
With 169.1 innings in 24 starts and potentially another 10 starts to go, Wainwright could rack up something on the order of 60-70 more innings. The Cardinals have to be thrilled with his performance this year has he's surpassed Chris Carpenter as the ace of the squad. With a 2.95 FIP, Wainwright has become one of the premier pitchers in the league given his ability to strikeout batters, not walk many hitters and generate a ton of groundballs.
Mozeliak deserves a heaping of credit for moving fast on this deal. It looks to be a beauty for the team. Here's a rough comparison of the value the Cardinals were paying for (i.e. assume the contract was market value and convert to WAR) versus the actual WAR produced.
| Year | Contract WAR | Actual WAR |
| 2008 | 0.2 | 2.2 |
| 2009 | 1.5 | 5.7 |
| 2010 | 2.0 | 6.5 |
| 2011 | 2.0 | 5.0 |
| 2012 | 2.5 | 4.5 |
| 2013 | 2.5 | 4.0 |
(azru edit: Upon waking this morning I was appalled to find that I had committed one of the most basic sins of projecting future performance. I set Wainwright's true talent level at his current season's performance. Obviously, this is incorrect. Upon fixing that with a basic Marcel weighting, he lost 1 WAR in years 2011-2013. The crux of the argument holds true however. Very team friendly contract.)
I compensated for arbitration rates in his contract WAR and assumed that pitchers have no true peak and will age immediately. Basically, the Cardinals are making out like bandits in this deal paying well below market value for the production that Adam Wainwright provides. When the contract was signed in 2008, I thought the deal looked good. Now the deal looks great. Adjust the actual WAR totals to your hearts content, the Cardinals come out big winners in any reasonable evaluation of Wainwright's talent.
* * *
You do not get to watch Adam Wainwright this afternoon. You get to watch Jeff Suppan who is coming off of a reasonably good outing in which he pitched 5.1 innings, struck out 5 and walked no one. Beyond that, I don't mutch want to talk about Jeff Suppan and his future chances of success. (Hint: they're slim.)
The Cardinals are 1.5 games back of Cincinnati right now. They could use the Cubs to win a game and they could do themselves a favor by battering Sean West and the Marlins. The Cardinals are still in a good position to make the playoffs at the end of the year but the Reds aren't going away and the Cardinals need to start racking up the wins soon.
Game time is 12:10 CT. Game thread is 12:00 CT.
A quick self programming note. I'm supposed to appear on SiriusXM Radio on Tuesday Night around 7:30 CT. I'll be talking baseball with former Mets GM and ESPN Analyst Steve Phillips.
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Comments
Sticking with his closer...
Even when he doesn’t have good stuff that night is another blind spot.
When you have a fully rested bullpen, why oh why do you try to go two innings with the close that blew the save?
He nearly cost the Cardinals the division in 2006 by sticking with Izzy so much even though he was clearly broken.
yeah
I think that angered me even more than taking Rasmus out.
btw I’d guess that given what I’ve seen so far, that Jay probably has the better or more accurate throwing arm
chief justice
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Aug 8, 2010 3:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Really?
Jay hasn’t screwed up a throw badly, so it’s possible to argue that his arm is more accurate, but it doesn’t seem any stronger than Allen Craig’s. Rasmus definitely has our strongest OF arm now that Ludwick is gone.
"What exactly is that thing? A pessimism meter?" - Bruce McCurdy
the worms agree, he has a strong arm
Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")
i've seen rasmus make two good throws this year
I haven’t seen Jay make a bad throw yet. (of course, i missed the game last night, only heard it. So I don’t know if he made a bad throw.) I’ve also seen Jay throw put people at home from Right and Center. And I’ve seen him throw runners out at third from RF.
Considering a package of strength and accuracy. Jon Jay has a better arm than Colby Rasmus.
Miles, in at third for his defense
so you're saying we need high caliber rifles and not errant bazookas?
Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Jon Jay's skillset doesn't include strength.
"What exactly is that thing? A pessimism meter?" - Bruce McCurdy
Colby's skill set
doesn’t include throwing runners out or keeping them from advancing
Miles, in at third for his defense
He had a few crappy throws this year,
but his arm has been above average over his career, unlike Jay’s.
"What exactly is that thing? A pessimism meter?" - Bruce McCurdy
he had all but two crappy throws this year
and he wasn’t good at it last year either. Until he consistently shows the ability to make get into position and make a strong, accurate throw I’m going to have to give the “who has the better arm” to the guy that does consistently show the ability to get into position and make a strong, accurate throw. Which is Jay.
Miles, in at third for his defense
According to Fangraphs ARM...
the only qualified CF in the major leagues in 2010 with a worse ARM that Colby is Matt Kemp. Austin Jackson and Andrew McCutchen are tied with Colby. Also, he’s had one assist.
I actually think having an “arm” is one of the more overrated factors for outfield defense. Colby has fine arm strength, but he is not good at throwing runners out who are advancing because his accuracy is meh and he has poor mechanics in setting up and preparing to make a throw (which is probably why his accuracy is meh).
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
I disagree about it being overrated.....
It can make a huge difference in some games. Just like tracking down a ball can.
i'd tend to agree that it's overrated
throwing a runner out at the plate is the most exciting thing an outfielder can do. But the chances are so few, I think we are just talking about a couple of outs over the course of a season.
I’d even go so far as to say that having the reputation of possessing a great arm is more beneficial than actually having a great arm. As it keeps runners on 2nd or 3rd instead of attempting to advance.
Miles, in at third for his defense
+1
But you have to show said arm to get said reputation. Right now, Raz had the reputation of “you can run all day on him”.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Really?
I think there are as many chances to throw out runners, or stop them from advancing, as there are balls hit to gaps that Raz will get to, and say, Holliday or Craig wouldn’t. I think THAT is overrated. I just don’t see Raz getting to more than a handful of balls this season that most decent CF’s, or even decent OF’s are getting to.
I wouldn't say it's over-rated.
But as you pointed out, his approach to the ball and getting into a good throwing position just sucks.
But you certainly wouldn’t want him to have an arm like, say, Johnny Damon. You set-up perfectly everytime and with an arm like that, still not throw anybody out.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
why the f is that the case
for someone who has played professional baseball for so many years, even one year?
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
...to DFA TLR
slow learner?
Minor league system not doing their job?
When stuff like this happens you can see why TLR may be hesitant to “play the kids” If they can’t get into position correctly to make a throw, are missing signs, not communicating with other players like they should, etc etc etc.
Miles, in at third for his defense
i suspect this is true to some extent, but it speaks to a deficiency
in the system that jmo needs to address asap
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
...to DFA TLR
agreed
the only time this should ever show up is if a guy is rushed to the majors, if he spends a full season in A, AA, and AAA he should have this stuff worked out.
Wait, did Colby have a full season in AAA? I remember his last one was cut short due to injury. Did he have a season before that?
Miles, in at third for his defense
I thought he was at least in Memphis the year before, but maybe not.
Maybe it wasn’t the whole year.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
2008, 90 games in Memphis.
Spent all of 2007 in Springfield.
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
Thanks.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
the organization has admitted
that Rasmus’ poor throws early in the season were made as a result of an adjustment made at the major league level, where Rasmus was instructed and schooled on throwing the ball to 2nd base as a cutoff. Rather than practicing throws to the plate, he was throwing the ball to 2nd. Thus, when he got in a game situation where he had to throw home, he ended up bouncing it 3 times. This training was done not in the minors but by the major league staff. If TLR is “hesitant to play the kids” as a result of 3-4 poor throws by Rasmus, perhaps he needs to readjust his training regimen rather than blaming the “kids.”
by chuckb on Aug 8, 2010 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
adjustments made at the major league level
are made because someone failed to make them at the minor league level.
Miles, in at third for his defense
It's way overrated
according to UZR, the difference between the best and worst CF arms is less than 8 runs for the entire season. There’s no way Rasmus shouldn’t have been in there. It is my belief that the organization will soon have to choose between La Russa and Rasmus b/c La Russa does not value Rasmus the way he should. A “persistent blind spot” is a good way to describe it.
It's time for Tony to go
and if the team fails to make the playoffs this year, hopefully he’ll make the right decision.
I think the threshold is the NLCS.
But maybe not…
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
i doubt if DeWitt sees it that way
No way DeWitt would choose Rasmus over Tony.
Miles, in at third for his defense
then it's time for DeWitt & Co to sell the team
because they are no longer fully committed to a winning team if they can’t even have a guy in the dugout who will play the best players
Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing can be made
I think you should check DeWitt's record on winning
as well as the methods that they’ve used.
Feel free to compare it to the rest of the NL since he has been here.
Miles, in at third for his defense
i get that, i do, i'm sick of the same stuff from TLR
i can’t even follow the team that closely & if i’m this aggravated with him & his antics i can’t imagine how upset you all are
Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing can be made
Not to be simplistic
but has anyone thought that maybe wet field conditions and Colby’s two leg injuries this season might have had something to do with today’s lineup?
And for the record, I don’t agree with Colby being pulled in last night’s game.
The real question is whose dad would win in a fight?
Colby’s or Chief’s?
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
jaybird seems to have an accurate, but not real strong, arm
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
...to DFA TLR
the Waino contract has to be one of the best deals for any ballclub
chief justice
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Aug 8, 2010 3:50 AM EDT reply actions
evan longoria and david wright were pretty good
"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker, on Jason Motte
That guy has a handlebar mustache on his head
Maybe it’s some sort of parasite.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Ye olde monk look.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
forehead mustache!
chief justice
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Aug 8, 2010 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
We talked briefly about this in yesterday's thread
but who does everyone think gets called up in September. Walters, Stav, Robertson, Anderson. Gotay. Any thoughts?
Just win
Perhaps Sanchez sees time.
Maybe Roberston comes up to be a LOOGY for a few innings. Most of the other people are basically known mediocrities.
"What exactly is that thing? A pessimism meter?" - Bruce McCurdy
If Robertson isn't called up by Aug. 23, he can opt out.
So he may not even be around for September call-ups.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Not a chance.....
unless we’ve fallen out of the race. Tony isn’t going to want a bench full of kids if we’re trying to win important games down the stretch. We may call up more than usual, given we have a lot of folks in AAA that have played in the majors this year, or are probably close, but don’t expect more than 5-6, I’d imagine.
I hope one is a catcher
probably Anderson, who is a better hitting than Pags.
And can we please start taking Yadi out in late innings of blow-out games?
I’m convinced Molina’s batting slumps are directly related to fatigue.
My 10 year old son said last night:
“Dad, why is he taking Colby out? Isn’t he a better fielder than Craig? Why wouldn’t he just pinch hit for Franklin if it goes to extra innings?”
“I don’t know son, maybe he is playing for the tie.”
by Mr. Wilson on Aug 8, 2010 9:19 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Brilliant.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions
for our use...

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Aug 8, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Good post, even if the robot was morose.
Congrats on getting on the radio, sorry it’s with El Idioso, or however that’s spelled. Too bad I don’t have Sirius, I would love to hear what a real live robot sounds like.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 9:36 AM EDT reply actions
Lohse apparently is not happy about having to do another rehab
As i’m getting ready to watch Suppan pitch, I’m not happy either.
Miles, in at third for his defense
perhaps lohse...
should have worried about getting AA players out, instead of just “working on stuff.” He needed to treat that last rehab start as a full rehearsal.
I suspect he was trying to get people out, he was just failing.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm not sure how he is rationalizing to himself that he is ready to face major-league hitters.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
it's a competitiveness that all major leaguers should have
and I for one would worry if he didn’t want to be in the majors now instead of rehabbing in the minors.
Miles, in at third for his defense
Which is fine...but he needs to understand that decisions are made based on results.
And he didn’t do anything to show management that he’s ready to face major-league hitters.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
he knows he's still better than jeff suppan.
"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker, on Jason Motte
not happy to see more soup, but
klohse needs to get his shit in a group and pitch better or he’ll end up looking like soup when he does
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
...to DFA TLR
Bubbles needs to STFU & start pitching well again before he gets his rotation spot back
dude hasn’t been health in two f’ing seasons now, there’s no reason why the team should put him back in the rotation after his last two dogshit starts in the minors. he needs to stop thinking he’s a good pitcher & actually become a good pitcher
Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing can be made
by gdm426 on Aug 8, 2010 11:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
amusing exchange between dgoold and JohnMarecek on twitter
Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
too long to cut/paste.
now Marecek’s commenting on the callers for TLR, and goold’s making light of BJ Rains. latter seems to be a daily occurrence now.
Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Oddly enough,
Rains has earned that.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions
was surprised it took them all summer.
Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Fun fact
Stavinoha and Craig have the same about of walks. Stavinoha has over twice the number of PAs
Miles, in at third for his defense
That's two fun facts.
>Pitcher Change: Felipe Lopez replaces Ryan Franklin, batting 7th, replacing third baseman Felipe Lopez
Adam Wainwright reaches on force attempt, throwing error by Aaron Heilman. Jaime Garcia scores. Brendan Ryan to 3rd. Adam Wainwright to 2nd. None out.
I don't recall anybody suggesting.....
that Stav would have been a better player, as a starter in the majors, then Craig. There were/are a few, however, that think if we’re healthy, and when we had Luddy, that Stav would be better in a strictly pinch hitting role, and that Craig needed everyday AB’s.
Now that some time has opened up, and Craig can get starts and multiple AB’s…..I don’t see anybody bitching about him being up, and Stav not.
i don't recall that either
I just noticed it and decided to share because I like sharing.
I think that’s the least evilest thing i’ve ever said. “I like sharing”
Miles, in at third for his defense
Lineups
per Goold
The lineups:
Cardinals
Lopez 3b
Jay cf
Pujols 1b
Holliday lf
Craig rf
Molina c
Miles 2b
Suppan p
Ryan ss
Florida:
Ramirez ss
Bonifacio cf
Morrison lf
Uggla 2b
Stanton rf
Tracy 1b
Murphy 3b
Paulino c
West p
"They're so stunned they didn't even boo!"
John Rooney 5/3/10 referring to Philly fans on Cards 5-run 7th inning
Yeah, but he's hurt.
So what can you do…
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Cry
>Pitcher Change: Felipe Lopez replaces Ryan Franklin, batting 7th, replacing third baseman Felipe Lopez
Adam Wainwright reaches on force attempt, throwing error by Aaron Heilman. Jaime Garcia scores. Brendan Ryan to 3rd. Adam Wainwright to 2nd. None out.
still hurting, I guess
No Colby either :(
"They're so stunned they didn't even boo!"
John Rooney 5/3/10 referring to Philly fans on Cards 5-run 7th inning
That's just f'ing retarded.
So what if he doesn’t leftys as well. He has shown more ability to hit them this year. Let the kid play, Tony!
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions
which makes it even more frustrating that he won't play
the best player our minor league system has produced in a while, the player the organization banked on and made untouchable while he was there. I seriously think Tony’s constant tinkering is threatening to fuck with Colby’s development at this point.
a bit of an overreaction, no?
colby, and his numbers, are “progressing nicely” in his second year as a young CF. It’s difficult to square that “his numbers are better than expected this year” and “his development is getting fucked with.”
Assuming he’s healthy today, he should be playing. It’s frustrating that he’s not. But it’s doubtful missing 40 or 50 PA’s and the associated innings are “threatening to fuck with colby’s development” permanently.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Disagree
We’ve seen this over and over under LaRussa. These kids are brought up and not given playing time even when they demonstrate that they should be given a shot (see also: Allen Craig). This DOES fuck with their development over time because it erodes their confidence, as well as their timing. How can Colby or Craig or anyone else ever develop a consistent approach at the plate if they sit every other game?? Or if they’re told they can’t hit lefties when the stats show otherwise??
see allen craig is a really bad example
of Tony not giving a guy playing time. Because Craig has been given the lion share of starts when he is up.
Miles, in at third for his defense
whatever.
colby doesn’t sit every other game. go look at the game logs. craig just got called up and doesn’t even have a starting spot – of course he’s sitting every other game.
I love these “erodes their confidence” bs rationales. this is akin to all the “I can see it with my eyes” and ""grit": it’s there but doesn’t show up in the boxscores" arguments.
go look at colby’s numbers last year and then this year and make the argument his “development” is going astray.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think there's anybody on this site
would deny that there intangibles that don’t show up in the boxscore that affect the game; just that you can’t quantify them so they shouldn’t be part of a statistic-minded analysis. So no, you cant quantify messing with his development, but I don’t think it’s total bs to suggest the possibility.
if you're going to "suggest the possibility"
then you might want to back it up with something, anything.
Because what evidence there is – i.e. the marked improvement in Colby’s numbers from last year to this year, and better numbers this year than could have been reasonably expected, suggest that his development is going just fine.
if you think he should play today, fine, but it’s an overreaction to say that not playing is fucking with colby’s development long-term.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I said it was "threatening to fuck"
which out of context is an interesting quote but I digress. And I gave an example: his decreased number of PAs against lefties. If Colby is going to be an everyday LF, he needs to be able to hit lefties. How does him sitting against lefties not threaten to mess with his development in that case?
does he have a decreased number of PA's against LHP?
haven’t they gone up this year in number and quality in comparison to last year?
if so, why isn’t his “development” against LHP doing just fine?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Albert has about 40 more PAs
against Lefties. As far as I’m concerned, Colby should be an everyday player just like Albert. Getting PAs against lefties is an important part of his development, and when Tony takes those PAs away I don’t think it’s entirely an overreaction to say he’s hampering that development.
there seems to be a gif for these situations
Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Good lord...
Rasmus sits, Miles and Soup start. And there are people here defending Tony La Russa???
Fire La Russa!
Sigh.
No one else can play second.
Unless you put Craig at third, blah blah, not happening…etc. etc. etc.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
No one else in the entire world?
No one in the organization? No one on the trade market? No one in anyone else’s organization that is expendable?
La Russa makes a crap sandwich for lunch and you’re arguing that there’s nothing to be done but eat it.
Fire La Russa!
Sadly,
There really is no one else. There aren’t any cheap waiver pick-ups to be had either. I don’t think.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
felipe lopez. with ruben gotay at third.
"We were men - flesh and blood - and we played baseball in the sunshine. We hit doubles off the wall, slid hard into second base. We had fights, and we made love. We sang songs and prayed on Sundays. . . . We felt pain. And we felt joy. There was a lot wrong with the world. But we weren't sad, man. We had the times of our lives." Buck O'Neil, from "The Soul of Baseball: A Road Trip Through Buck O'Neil's America."
by tom s. on Aug 8, 2010 2:11 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
There are so many...
replacement level options with higher ceilings than Jeff Suppan. The whole idea behind replacement level is that they are easily signed/acquired and are available at any time. I could go through 32 minor league rosters and the FA market and pick off a bunch of names, but I’m sure you acknowledge the existence of a huge pool of replacement level players that are available to any team that wants them.
Suppan was sub-replacement level in 2008. He was sub-replacement level in 2009. He was sub-replacement level with the Brewers in 2010. He has been sub-replacement level with the Cardinals in 2010.
Miles posted a top-50 worst season in 2009 for players with 150 or more plate appearances. His walk rate and isolated power are worse this year than in 2010. Fortunately a few of his bloop hits have eluded the opposing infielders in his time with the Cardinals. This is not a skill. He swings at 40% of pitches out of the strike zone. Vladimir Guerrero’s career rate is 39%. He’s reaching base on 10% of his infield hits. Michael Bourn is reaching base on 10% of his infield hits.
A slow, stocky little squirt like Aaron Miles hacking like Vlad and relying on the same number of infield hits as the fastest player in baseball is not a reasonable plan.
Fire La Russa!
WHY IS COLBY NOT PLAYING??
The time has come for Mo to have a long discussion with LaRussa about organizational politics and philosophy. LaRussa is purposely destroying that kid.
hahaha
Like that will ever happen.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
A guy can dream, can't he?
Colby’s going to be on the bench muttering, “Um, okay, I’ll just sit my 18 homers on the bench and relax for a while … you boys have fun!”
personally destroying that kid?
Seriously? It’s not like he is forcing him to eat white castle after 10pm.
Colby has started in the last 8 games. Yeah tony had double switched him out of two games. Mainly because he was the last outfielder to make an out. Something he has done with ludwick and Holliday before. Colby has not been durable. He gets off days. Until he shows his body can play every day he is going to get off days. And most of those off days will come against lefties. (as they should)
Miles, in at third for his defense
Nope
Colby’s stats against lefties aren’t that bad, especially in relation to the other 24 guys on this team that mysteriously seem unable to hit lefties well. Colby is our starting center fielder. He should be in there every single day.
Why does Colby require these magical days off that you're insisting on?
I see Yadi is in there for his 14th start in a row. When was gimpy APu’s last day off? Holliday is in there, too. And when did the marvelous Aaron Fucking Miles last have a day off?
Gimme a break.
because it's been three years
since Colby’s body has lasted a full season?
Miles has had the following injuries ahead of him:
Freese
Greene
Skippy
Colby has had the following injuries ahead of him:
Miles, in at third for his defense
The Miles point is a joke
Because we all know he doesn’t NEED to be in there. If LaRussa would actually do what the majority of Cardinals fans think is the better option – Craig at third, Lopez at second – then Miles could have a day off to recharge those gritty batteries.
Let's fire every member of Cardinals management and let an oligarchy of the fans run the Cardinals.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
why?
He wasn’t the one who decided Craig can’t play 3rd.
That was Pop Warner and Ludnow.
Miles, in at third for his defense
great minds think a like
…so do average ones and stupid ones though.
:(
Miles, in at third for his defense
I agree that his position was changed in the minors
But he had been a natural third baseman throughout his career until then. And we have a crisis at third base. Seems pretty obvious to me.
a man named Pop Warner should never be questioned
Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing can be made
I understand that TLR has a lot of influence...
But if you think that he makes his decisions against the prevailing organizational opinion (i.e. Rasmus playing time, Craig/3B, etc.), that is not correct.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I bet you're wrong about Rasmus
Tony plays who he wants to play. I don’t believe for a second that the organization brought Rasmus up so he could sit on the bench every third game or against lefties. No way.
He has the 4th most plate appearances on the team (375).
Behind Pujols, Holliday, and Molina.
Molina only has 3 more PAs than Colby.
I don’t see how this equates to Colby “sitting the bench”.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
You just named the only three "givens" on this team
The rest of the team is in flux, driven by the whims of LaRussa’s lineups, injuries, etc. Colby is not considered by LaRussa to be THE CENTER FIELDER as APu is considered THE FIRST BASEMAN or Yadi is THE CATCHER.
That is especially weird considering how many other components on this team or either not working physically or offensively. A team that traded away Ludwick and has consistently shown an inability to score runs should have their number three offensive tool in there every day.
I guess I don't get what you want...
A team has 25 players on it. Not many teams have 8 players that are capable of playing 162 games a year. Teams also like to have other good players that may not start, but deserve to play a lot (Lopez, Jay, Craig, etc.). So tell me how you give Colby 500 PAs and play other quality players in the outfield as well. Keep in mind, Holliday is starting every day in left.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's what I want
Holliday in left, Colby in center, and Jay in right EVERY DAY. Since we have a mysteriously short bench (anyone know why this pitching staff has 13 pitchers on it??), keep Craig there if he cannot play third for the inevitable LaRussa pitching change/pinch-hitting to come in the fifth inning.
i love how Yadi is a "given"
with almost the exact same numbers of games and PAs but colby is not a “given.” How does one become a given if not related to games played and PA taken? Sounds like by personal perception.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Yadi is a catcher
And that is the most physically demanding position on the field. He needs days off or the guy is going to die.
Keep in mind also that Yadi hits lower in the lineup, reducing his PA’s over a seaon.
so Yadi is a shark... needs to keep swinging... hmmm.
Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT
Right so you fail to mention how many PAs the other
two critical components of the team are actually getting. Holliday has 75 more PA and Pujols has 108 more. So Colby’s missing out on a lot of playing time regardless of having the 4th most PA on the team.
Silly humans, this world is for robots.
i don't remember Pujols or Holliday getting hurt...
Adjusting for Colby’s missed time for injuries, how many PAs is that?
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions
He strained a hammy
he didn’t have a leg amputated. It was right before the ASB too. Maybe that’s 15 PA. Maybe.
There’s a disparity between the way Colby is treated and Pujols/Holliday are treated. TLR needs to realize that Colby is just as important to the team as those two.
Silly humans, this world is for robots.
Are you really saying.....
that Raz should be getting the AB’s that AP and Holliday get? That is laughable.
Rasmus has the third highest SLG of MLB CFers
He’s on pace for a ~25 HR season and is a good defender. He’s a potentially elite center fielder with All-Star level skills. Why is it laughable that he get as many AB’s as the other elite players on this team?
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Aug 8, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
You're comment isn't clear.
I’m not suggesting that Rasmus take away at bats from Pujols/Holliday. I’m suggesting he should have as many as Pujols/Holliday.
Silly humans, this world is for robots.
he hasn't set every third game
he has started in 91 of or 111 games. (counting today). He is set in 18% of our games. Closer to 1 out of 5 games. And this isn’t even taking in account for the two times he has missed several games due to injury.
Miles, in at third for his defense
9 times
For reference
Ludwick has been pulled 7 times
Holliday has been pulled 14 times.
Albert has been pulled 7 times
Double switch means that someone in the outfield is coming out. And that someone is going to be guy who’s next PA the farthest away.
Miles, in at third for his defense
OMG-
TLR hates Holliday!
This is going to seriously fuck with Holliday’s development.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Why are we paying so much for a guy who can't finish a game!
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
just to add something
Tony will switch out infielders on double switches also. We just don’t have any right now.
Miles, in at third for his defense
Hmm that's interesting
I didn’t know that about Holliday or Pujols. I would have guessed higher for Luddy, actually (prolly woulda been higher had he not been injured).
Well, it may be perception, I guess. It just doesn’t seem that LaRussa has been playing Colby the same as the other guys.
Colby is way down on the list as far as PAs
for CF in MLB, but how many other teams have a “fourth outfielder” (Jay) that is hitting .371 and is deserving of some playing time?
Colby’s days off are as much about other players needing to play as they are about him “struggling” or needing a break or whatever.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Again, with Craig at 3B
It’s not just TLR, it’s the entire organization.
Until they change their mind en masse, Craig is an outfielder.
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
Majortiy of Cardinal fans think that
Craig at third over Lopez is a good idea?
Maybe Craig at 3rd over Miles. But not Craig at 3rd over lopez.
Miles, in at third for his defense
And to be clear, I don't like Miles on the roster (and neither does any other VEB, I believe)
But, he’s there, so with the three injuries, he’s playing.
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
As Bernie pointed out recently
Craig’s defense at third is rated just slightly below Lopez. But Craig’s bat could (potentially, if given the chance for once) best Lopez or Miles. Lopez at second is a much better option than Miles in any department. Are you starting to see how this works?
Craig's AA 3B defense versus Lopez's ML 3B defense?
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
you mean “average” defense in AA is NOT the same thing as “average” defense in the majors? Are you suggesting the populations that the word “average” is being compared against are different? tell me more….
/agreeing with you
by Willie McGee's Twin on Aug 8, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't see how you can "rate" defense between someone who has played a handful of innings of major-league 3B
and someone who has played over 1,000.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
And by handful, you mean
ONE.
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
exactly
the Cardinals have seen craig play 3rd in over 300 games and have decided. “this isn’t going to work.”
If anything the Cardinals should fire Tony for trying Craig at third, because he has started him there, and is having him take ground balls over there, after the organization had tony them that Craig can’t play 3rd.
Miles, in at third for his defense
Greene's injury is more a function of the team
not willing to part with Aaron Miles than it is him being actually injured. He called his agent because he was going to be sent down and the club didn’t have a strong case to keep him off the DL. It’s an injury he was playing through and could have continued to do so.
Silly humans, this world is for robots.
Skip hurt, Greene hurt, Lopez at third...no one else can play second...
hence Aaron Miles. Yadi is starting all those games because LaRue is just not good. Albert doesn’t get days off, he’s Albert. Holliday doesn’t get days off either.
Bad comparisons.
Colby gets days off because there are other capable outfielders who need to play every once and a while.
by Ghostrider520 on Aug 8, 2010 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
This and the Frog's
Would make my comment a triplet.
>While Albert Pujols batting, This Signature picked off second. Three out.
hopefulness?
I have a feeling – mind you, totally gut feeling with no statistical data being presented or thought about – that the Cards are going to absolutely tear apart Sean West today.
How can someone hate Anderson Silva?
Silva is like Ric Flair and The Rock, only 20 times more awesome because he refuses to speak English during interviews.
And looks like he's on a cocktail of depressant drugs for 22 minutes and still wins
Not afraid to nitpick
His ribs hurt.
He was sad.
If only he was ready for a fight so he could dance around the GD ring some more.
Silly humans, this world is for robots.
I just watched a show on the History Channel titled "How Bruce Lee Changed the World".
It was mostly about how he broke down racial barriers and basically founded MMA. They also said that he was the first action actor to not need video enhancement. He could do all the things you saw him do and that fast. I would’ve loved to have seen him get in on the UFC.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Aug 8, 2010 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
robot, you're making me sad too
so i’m gonna need you to go aheeead and make us a game thread so we don’t have to think about this anymore, mkaaay good
..i miss ludriguez-wick..
Coments on being there
I was at the game the past two nights and it was great. to see Waino throw a shut out and see Albert drop a three run bomb was phenominal. Last nigth hurt. Especially being around barely baseball fans of the Marlins. Now i know you guys have been talkimg about why TLR did this and that, but they were not bad. Beijngn at the game and watching the HR that Murphy hit was embarasing to CFing and Jim Edmonds would not approve. Colby took a terrible angel to the ball and barely threw his glove up to make that catch. the ball got over the wall by couple inches. there seemed to be hardly any effort and i myself at the time was pissed and missing Jimmy Boy out there. So if you are not in good terms with your manager and you lolligag to ball that could have easily been caught (not saying he would,but very very good chance) that would probably mean you are gonna be out. even then, that isn’t what hurt us. you can’t throw a ball over the middle of the plate to the most dangerous hitter on their team and you can’t throw a cock shot in the inning before to a guy NOTORIUOS for swinging for the fences and a fastball hitter and the second best hitter on the team. don’t know if it was Yadi making the calls or Dave D, but there should have beeen some better decision making there! That’s what cost us. Westbrook did a great job of eating innings and keeping us in it. It’s hard to leave a win on the field when facing the other teams best pitcher!
Ozzie is, was, and always will be the greatest Cardinal!
Dwight Howard is inviting you to the BLOCK party!
Is Gerald the real McCoy?
to discojer's first comment
the words “Izzy” and “2006” in the same sentence did something to my stomach.
Where’s the Pepto?
Franklin doesn’t live on the same street as Mr. Interestinghausen, but he’s in the neighborhood; at least as metered by my stomach when Franklin enters with a one-run lead..
i too thought ball 3 was close to murphy...but it was a ball
just unfortunate…also…can it become an absolute truth now that everyone dislikes miles therefore no one should discuss this matter anymore, it pains me to even discuss/readabout options on the team
yep, bad weekend, bad f'in weekend


Out of the crooked timber of humanity, no straight thing can be made

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