The Brawl and Who Did What In Pictures

If I could give you 1000 recs, I would.

And if I could add my $.02. TLR and Baker, shut up both of you.

1) How do you know about the “motherfucker” comments by Yadi and Phillips? Did that get picked up on some audio, or is it based on how their mouths moved? Or is that just supposed to be the gist of the comments?

2) It seems clear that Carp said something stupid or obnoxious, but I’m amazed at how many people (I guess especially at RR) think he should have been suspended just for saying something. That’s completely detached from the reality of how punishments are normally handed down for stuff like this.

3) I had been under the impression that Rolen’s role had been mainly as peacemaker, but he sure looks pissed in that shot where he’s coming after Carp. Still, he’s definitely someone I would give the benefit of the doubt.

4) “Don’t talk to my coaches” strikes me as an exceptionally silly thing for TLR to say to Dusty.

5) Cueto really is a shit. A seven game suspension for what he did is kind of a joke. And the comment by Gomes (I think) repeated several times at RR that “If you don’t want to get kicked, don’t be within kicking distance” is probably the most pathetic thing I’ve heard said about this whole debacle. How fucked up do you have to be to honestly think that’s a reasonable justification for Cueto’s behavior, especially since Cueto is the one who actively put himself in the position is was in (as opposed to Carp and Larue going after him)? I guess it would have been OK for Pujols to stroll over to the Red’s side of the scrum with a baseball bat and start swinging away – if they don’t want to be beaten, they shouldn’t be within swinging distance.

the braintrust of cincinnati. what a couple of…

he is clearly trying to get Molina’s goat in this picture, knowing full well his public comments had to be known. if he thought that the Cardinals would be bullied through verbal taunts and an aggressive and demeaning behavior towards the opposing team and invading their personal space, it’s amazing he wasn’t suspended as well. I guess it’s possibly that he’s just really stupid, but there’s really no excuse for him inciting a fight. he laid the ground for Carpenter saying whatever he said, which shouldn’t be condoned either, but malicious behavior breeds more malicious behavior.

perhaps the weirdest part is Phillips seems angered by Carp asking for different baseballs to pitch in the early part of the season. very odd.

someone remind me, and I’ll dig out all the threads dissecting this in the game-threads.

:=8)

Thanks D-Dee. Nice summation of events.

i think the only person i have a problem with here is cueto. his nearest teammate to him (nix) is clearly trying to restrain him and i think he’s the one who ended up pulling him out of there

cueto’s suspension is a bit of a joke after all this

Because that really did seem to escalate things quite a bit. Yes, Gomes, Cueto and Hernandez went after Carpenter, but he must have said something pretty obnoxious for those guys to go after him. And yes, Cueto fights like a bitch.

Oh, and I’m a Reds fan, but I’ll never defend Dusty and Phillips. They’re idiots. Seems like just about everybody mentioned acted badly here….only ones that comes out looking OK in my eyes is Rolen and Molina.

All MLB needs to do to crack down on this nonsense is make it an automatic suspension for any player leaving the bench when a fight or a heated exchange breaks out. Leave it to the coaches and umps.

now, how do we get this to the MLB offices? those idiots need to see this, Cueto needs shut down for the year, not just one start. it’s pathetic they don’t have the balls to drop the hammer on that guy. he could have ruined LaRue’s life & he gets off with less than a slap on the wrist.

seriously, we need to alert the media ASAP while it’s still fresh. i’m going to tweet & email Leitch this right now & i suggest everyone at VEB do the same. he’s probably the only Cards fan that could get something done. justice must be served & it’s clear Cueto punishment doesn’t even come close to serving justice

i don’t think it’s what carp said to dusty that set everything off. he barks at dusty, gets the ump and dusty yelling at him and nothing is happening yet. then when dusty is starting to back away and carp starts moving toward him, rolen darts toward carp. this is probably to protect his manager by holding carp back. every sees this as a threat and la rue and supp start diving in to protect carp from rolen and you know how it goes from there. cueto is a little bitch who has to be dragged away from kicking people in the face by his own teammates

Can you break down the Zapruder film next? Excellent work.

The only one at fault during this fight is Johnny Cueto. Why you ask? Because he needs a translator in post-game interviews, right? But he can obviously understand EVERY word that Carpenter said. Enough for him to merit rushing behind the crowd and trying to get at and punch Carpenter. Then you add the kicking, and you got yourself a ‘little bitch’ that Phillips can take to the prom when they grow up.

Also, you don’t go back and tap Yadi’s shinguard a second time after he obviously didn’t want you to tap him the first time. His unprofessional, bush-league comments and his instigating actions during the bottom of the first are representative of what kind of human being he actually is. A little bitch.

Although it’s all getting to be tiring.

Also, I still miss Scotty. I always loved his intensity. I stood next to him in 05 when I went to a series at Busch II and was surprised at how big he was. Whether a big boy like him was trying to restrain Carp or go after him it’s probably irrelevant in that moment.

I don’t really have anything new to add to the discussion at this point. I think this goes pretty far in making it clear what really happened.

I would like to point out that I am pretty sure that Brandon said something about being surprised that the Reds didn’t have a bigger lead in the central because the Cardinals aren’t very good sometime well before the all star break.

Thank you for taking the time.

I knew I was going to be disappointed with the League FO’s decision, given the rampant stupidity there. Talking about setting the precedent bar low….if repeatedly and viciously kicking someone in the head with metal spikes only costs you 1 start, what does it take to get more than that? Imagine a batter, after getting beaned, rushing the mound and taking a bat to the pitcher. How is this any less serious? I submit a that a fucking metal cleated boot to the head could, under some circumstances, do about as much damage as a bat to the head. So are we to assume players can now charge the mound, bat in hand, assault the pitcher, and still only expect to miss a couple games?

Also, I don’t know if this has been posted: Deadspin’s take on the “brawl”

i love the way some of the cards just sacrificed themselves for Carp…and for soup this is a better way to help the team than pitching..ouch

i missed the brawl, but fortunately thanks to the media showing it 50,000 times, i was able to see it, but nothing so detailed as this

glad cardinals came out on top

aka the man stew lives. check out Carp’s use of possessive.

"He can say whatever he wants," Carpenter said. "He came in there with intent to do something because he came in from the back side when you look at it. I was in the same position. I was in a worse position. I had people grabbing on top of me and holding me and I didn’t start kicking people and doing all that stuff.

"All this stuff that happened – the yelling, the pushing, the fighting and everything else – there was nobody throwing punches. There was nobody doing any of that. I don’t care how scared you are, I don’t care what the deal is. Whatever excuse you have, you don’t start doing that. If you did that on the street, he would end up being…That’s serious stuff."

LaRue got kicked in the face by Cueto and was placed on the disabled list Friday with a concussion. He was also kicked repeatedly in the midsection and X-rays determined that he had severely bruised ribs.

The catcher had stitches near his lip and has cuts near both eyes. Replays showed a group of Reds players surrounding Cueto, not Cardinals as he and Baker indicated.

"I don’t know what’s fair and what’s not," Carpenter said of Cueto’s suspension. "I stand by my comments that I said before. He was very close, a millimeter or centimeter, away from not only ending my catcher’s career, but really injuring him and doing things that can ruin parts of his life."

LaRue smiled and declined comment when asked about his Cueto’s suspension.

link

but the slow-down of that really helped me see it. of course, it was going on so fast that it was hard to see. cueto should have gotten suspended for more than one start. justice was not served enough when it came to the final decision, in terms of cueto’s suspension.

If Cueto was really panicked, he would’ve have just kicked straight out including his own teammates, but he seemed to do a pretty good job at making sure that he kicked only Cardinals. He’s surrounded by his teammates except on his left side, and sure enough, he’s kicking over to his left side.
I think his suspension is a joke as well, because they are just making him miss his start against the 46-71 Diamondbacks and then he gets to come back to pitch in a much tougher game against the 59-57 Dodgers. So I don’t really see how that’s hurting them. MLB is just saving him for a series against a team that is actually good. Not really a punishment in my mind.

Cueto’s damn lucky i don’t play for the Cards because there’s no telling what i’d do to him the next time i saw him

http://www.baseballthinkfactory.org/files/newsstand/discussion/chris_carpenter_no_excuse_for_cuetos_kicking_fit/

There is a special place in baseball hell for douchebags like these (it’s called being a fan of the Pirates, but at least they aren’t little assholes).

Frank Robinson, the guy who handed out the punishment to Cueto, did not know the extent of LaRue’s injuries at the time that they decided the punishment. And admits he would have had more of a suspension if they had

The process worked against stiffer action against Cueto as Robinson admitted he was unaware of the extent of LaRue’s injuries before announcing discipline. La Rue did not see team medical supervisor Dr. George Paletta until almost 24 hours after MLB levied the suspensions and fines. An agreement between the commissioner’s office and Players Association stipulates punishment for on-field incidents should be handed down within 48 hours.

“Sometimes we may miss something like (LaRue’s case) because of that,” Robinson said. “If we had not acted, it would probably have been more severe. But as is, we really can’t take a starting pitcher beyond five, six or seven days because this individual may hurt himself being laid off for a longer amount of time. We didn’t know the extent of LaRue’s injuries until later on.”

thanks for putting this together

once the reds players pull larue out of range of cueto’s kicking, he goes back to kicking carpenter, who is trying to be pulled away from cueto by cardinal players

it looks like Nix (#17) is trying to push Carp and i guess LaRue away from Cueto in order to get him space to get off the net, but then sees Cueto starting to kick and has to jump back in to stop him