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Around SBN: The Animated GIFs Of January

The Late Bloomer Show

 My first thought on last night's game: only Tony La Russa could have managed to somehow have the pitcher batting cleanup in a game with the designated hitter.

My second thought: Jaime Garcia is awesome.

Third thought: Matt Holliday is pretty awesome, too.

Fourth thought: what the hell happened to Jose Bautista?

And that's where I want to kick off the post proper this morning: with the inexplicable outburst of ridiculousness we've seen from Jose Bautista, who is leading all of baseball in dingers after years of toiling in baseball purgatory. (You may know it as Pittsburgh.)

Star-divide

It would be tough to find anyone who actually predicted this breakout season for Bautista. And by tough, of course, I mean impossible. This is the same Jose Bautista, after all, who posted an OPS+ of 89 from 2004-08, and the same Jose Bautista whose career high in home runs came in 2006, his age 25 season, when he hit 16 homers in 469 trips to the plate.

It's entirely possible this is just an extreme outlier season; possible we'll all look back a couple years down the line and say, "Hey, you remember when Jose Bautista hit like 40 homers that one year, and we all thought he was going to take off and be a top slugger? Man, that was weird, wasn't it? Oh, well, at least it wasn't us who gave him that contract for six years and eighty million." Then we'll laugh on in to the night at Bautista's 2011 and '12 campaigns, when he hit a total of 28 homers and assured himself a spot in the Toronto Blue Jays Hall of Bad Contracts, right next to Vernon Wells and Alex Rios and B.J. Ryan.

Or, on the other hand, Bautista could also serve as a cautionary tale about giving up on a player too early, the same way Ryan Ludwick and Jayson Werth do.

The story isn't the same with all three, of course; both Ludwick and Werth suffered mainly from injury issues early in their careers, and as a result were never able to garner the kind of consistent playing time that leads to star careers. Bautista just wasn't very good, and now suddenly he sort of is. Werth was drafted out of high school in 1997, made his MLB debut in 2002 (with Toronto, no less), and posted an .825 OPS in his first extended look in the big leagues in 2004 with the Dodgers. He dropped off to a .711 the next season, then missed all of 2006 due to injury. The Phillies picked him up off the scrap heap, and the rest is, as they say, history.

Ludwick's trials and tribulations in getting to the majors have been well chronicled by now, and with good reason. It's an impressive story, with lots of adversity and talent and a cameo appearance not once but twice by Juan Gonzalez. The short version is this: extremely talented player drafted out of UNLV in '99, got hurt a little, made his debut in 2002 (interesting, no?), then got hurt. A bunch. Got hurt and hurt and hurt, bouncing around and losing his job to Juan Gonzalez. Picked up by the Cards a couple years ago, called up to bolster a Calista Flockhart thin outfield, fought off another challenge from Juan Gone, and the rest is, as they say, history.

note: I realise Calista Flockhart is only mildly topical, and only because she just married Indiana Jones, but I have good reason for such a reach. The original version of that was with Karen Carpenter instead, but my better nature prevailed and I chose to back away.

I can't quite decide if Ben Zobrist fits into this category or not; he was drafted late by the 'Stros (he was already 23), then got traded along with Mitch Talbot for Aubrey Huff in '06. He looked like a utility infielder, then just exploded with the bat. He was one of the most valuable players in baseball last year, and so certainly seems at home with Luddy and Werth, but he didn't really knock around the hinterlands nearly as long as these other guys.

Chris Carpenter certainly fits; he's another injury case, but also a case of a player whose performance never matched his talent until he grew up and learned his trade a bit more. I wonder if if part of the common thread here might be these players all took off when they got into another organisation.

There's Josh Hamilton, of course, whose story is really on a completely different level than virtually anyone else you can think of, but definitely fits into this demographic.

Half the closers in baseball end up being these guys; failed starters who find their niche throwing just their best stuff for 15-20 pitches at a time. Eric Gagne was awful in the rotation, then had perhaps the greatest season ever by a reliever in 2003.

So is this power explosion from Bautista real? I have no idea, to be honest. His batting average is almost exactly in line with the rest of his career (.239 career BA before this season; .232 this year), his walk rate is up quite a bit, but that's likely a result of the fact he's hitting the ball over the wall at a frightening rate. He's actually striking out a bit more often than in the past; he's basically turning himself into a three-true-outcomes hitter. Such players can be very productive, of course, particularly if that offensive profile doesn't come with Adam Dunn's fielding issues. (And for the record, Bautista is a little below average but not bad in the outfield and probably shouldn't be playing third base. Just in case you were wondering.) There's anecdote/narrative support for his newfound power, of course, as there always seems to be, but only time will tell if this is the Jose Bautista we're going to see from now on.

Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be much in the way of identifying characteristics here, no way of really telling what players might just be waiting for their chance to shine and which really do belong on the scrap heap. Joe Mather looked like a classic late bloomer just two years ago; now just a couple seasons and a whole mess of wrist trouble later he's an afterthought once again.

So, any players you guys think could end up big-time deals off the heap in the next few years? I still like Jeremy Sowers for some bizarre reason; I just wish he would return my calls once in a while.

Anyhow, that's all I've got this morning; it's just too damned hot to think of more than one thing to write about.

The Baron's Playlist for the 23rd of June, 2010 -- With Apologies to Bryan Adams and Don Henley

"Summer Wind" - Frank Sinatra

"It's Summertime" - The Flaming Lips

"Summertime" - Sam Cooke

"All Summer Long" - the Beach Boys

"Summer Snow" - Snow Machine

"Summer Babe" - Pavement

"Summertime" - Girls

"Summer Dress  2" - +/-

"Summer's Over" - Rialto

"Summer Shakedown" - Slow Club

"Summer of Hate" - Crocodiles

"Oslo in the Summertime" - Of Montreal

"Summer Teeth" - Wilco

"Summer's Cauldron" - XTC

"Summertime Clothes" - Animal Collective

"Jogging Gorgeous Summer" - Islands

"Knives of Summertime" - Sparklehorse

"Summer Grof" - the Spinto Band

"Hands Down" - Dashboard Confessional (Okay, so it doesn't really fit, but I don't care. Listen and tell me it doesn't belong here. I don't think you can.) 

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I would not be surprised

if Tony started a lineup without a DH.

by swmofan on Jun 23, 2010 10:45 AM EDT reply actions  

i think he probably respects cito gaston

tony might only make those moves to diss a manager he doesn’t care for, like “look what i can do and you would get fired for”

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Or, in a nod to Billy Martin's Yankees shenanigans

he starts Adam Wainwright as DH.

Then moves Wainwright to left field, meaning he loses the DH for the rest of the game, but enabling those double-switches he so loves.

All before the fifth inning.

by Michael_68_1999 on Jun 23, 2010 10:49 AM EDT reply actions  

WAINO

I will (almost) guarantee Wainwright will be batting at some point in this series. Entire IL roadtrip? Definitely.

by clank on Jun 23, 2010 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

tsk tsk, RB

no A Summer Song by Chad and Jeremy?
Nice list, though. And interesting write-up.

by mattyp on Jun 23, 2010 10:54 AM EDT reply actions  

Oh, come on!

I thought of eighteen actually good songs with summer in the title without even looking at my itunes library! That has to count for something!

That is a good one, though, and probably worth an add.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

Actually, I take that back.

I don’t think I like that song as much as I thought I did.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

fair enough

what you did was quite an impressive feat, and I probably like that song’s association with Rushmore more than I like the song itself.

by mattyp on Jun 23, 2010 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Me too.

It was brilliant in that movie, and not so good everywhere else.

A Summer Song is the musical equivalent of Owen Wilson: only good with Wes Anderson.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

sweet delayed sbn'd.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Heh.

Actually, that one was just my fault. I posted before I had the whole thing I wanted to say down.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

Rec.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

I tried

to send a response to this that got lost. Anyhow, one of my favourites, please supply name of group (memory fail) is hot town, summer in the city….It is not an R&B groups, but early rock group. Another, but nothing to do with summer, was the summer of 68 when I was working suckering tobacco, the hit was working in a coal mine,….which was definitely R&B. Can’t remember if that was Clarence Carter (of Patches fame) or whom.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Lovin' Spoonful.

And not one of my faves, but lots of people love it.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also the band behind other hits such as

“Do You Believe in Magic?” and “Daydream”.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks

Madridbend called it. Who was in the Lovin’ Spoonful? Zal Yanofsky, good old Toronto boy. He left the band, recorded a demented album (so they say), then ran a restaurant in Kingston, Ontario, proud home of 5 penitentiaries. Sadly he died in 2002. In my mind, a true 60’s-70’s Canadian rock icon, along with other guys like David Clayton Thomas of Blood Sweat and Tears, and all of the other bands like Guess Who and so on.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not

to mention Leonard Cohen, as iconoclastic as can get, the Canadian Dylan?

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

he's the man

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

workin' in the coalmine

was by Lee Dorsey (written by Allen Toussaint). There was a version by Devo in the 80’s.

youneverknow

by floodOfLove on Jun 23, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

I recognize

the Allen Toussaint name. But apparently never in a group. The fact that he penned Sneakin’ Sally through the Alley for Robert Palmer wins me over completely. He also did Lady Marmalade. I will have to get the Devo version, still remember Are we not Men?

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Allen Toussaint

… is a legendary piano player/songwriter from New Orleans.

youneverknow

by floodOfLove on Jun 23, 2010 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, pretty big name down here in the easy

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Everyone should check him out.

Allen Toussaint is one of the all-time greats up there with Stevie Wonder imo. /heresy

(Insert Your Own Joke)

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jun 23, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

working in a coal mine

I think that was Lee Dorsey and it was an Allen Toussaint song, if he didn’t write it , he arranged it for Dorsey

"How can a Mexican lose the ball in the sun" ? Harry Caray

by bigchieftootiemontana on Jun 23, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Summer in the City? Loving Spoonful?

Hot town – summer in the city
Back of my neck getting dirty and gritty

Cool cat looking for a kitty
Gonna look in every corner of the city

by madridbend on Jun 23, 2010 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hate that song.

Also don’t like Summer Breeze. I might consider the Type O Negative cover from the Scream 2 soundtrack, but not the original. Blech.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

Mixed

view on Summer Breeze. It is pretty syrupy, but evocative of a certain time period. In the end, I guess I didn’t mind the lyrics, and liked their harmonizing. Oh well.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I Like that Summer Breeze has a toy piano on it

I like the song ok, but am older than dirt, so there you have it.

youneverknow

by floodOfLove on Jun 23, 2010 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Post fail

my dirt is probably older. Anyhow, like we do, I associate that song with a certain road trip, so it is not so much the about the music as the memories. And not such great memories, but I still have the album.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you thinking of I Know What You Did Last Summer?

I don’t think it was in Scream 2.

"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jun 23, 2010 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Possibly.

I have the album somewhere, but haven’t bothered digging it out to look. You might be right. I know Scream 2 had the great Less Than Jake cover of “I Think I Love You”, but I could be wrong on Summer Breeze.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

How about Summertime Blues?

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

good call

but do you go Eddie Cochran, Blue Cheer, or Who? (just noticed that Ceech Marin and The Beach Boys have versions too!)

youneverknow

by floodOfLove on Jun 23, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is Eddie Cochran the original?

I’d just go with that for historical purposes.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I knew the Beach Boys had done it

but I was unaware just how many people had covered it.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

yep, Eddie Cochran did the original

I’m kinda partial to the Who’s version, but agree to have to give props to Eddie for writing the song.

youneverknow

by floodOfLove on Jun 23, 2010 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know

the song, but can’t remember the version that I have heard. I guess Eddie, but I would sure like to hear the Blue Cheer version, and the Who one, which somehow I just don’t recall.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I heard the Who's versions for probably 35 years

Finally heard Eddie Cochran’s the other day and finally understood why the kid couldn’t get the car that night

by BCinVA on Jun 23, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

endless summer nights?

richard marx?

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok this was a joke.

but what about Summertime – Billie Holiday

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I like the Zombies too

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

i do like that sublime version a lot

but thought maybe that wasn’t baron’s style

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

(Doin' Time)

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes. That's it.

I was too stoned to memorize their song titles.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not the correct name of the song.

Totally thought of that one, though.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't want to start a new thread, so I'll just say it here. Pavement is the perfect summer band.

Also that is a great list of songs and an even more impressive memory.

(Insert Your Own Joke)

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jun 23, 2010 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

um

summer crane – avanlanches
summertime – coltrane
long summer day – two gallants
summer – mogwai
summer goth 2 – wavves

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

alvalanches!!

coltrane, mogwai; great call.

by clank on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'll take

celebrated summer – Husker Du

for a thousand, Alex

"Yeah, you can write, you can feel, you can think. Whaddaya want, a medal?" - Paul Westerberg

by Edbird on Jun 23, 2010 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Got the Avalanches song,

but I don’t really like that one. If I want a summer song off Since I Left You it has to be the title track. Summeriest thing evereverever.

Good call on the Coltraneand Mogwai tracks; those I did not remember.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

seriously, USA.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:14 AM EDT reply actions  

What happened now?

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

blue balls.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

I've lost count.

I’m now assuming the shot will not go in, or will be disallowed.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm hoping for FIFA overcompensation

apology-style.

…yeah, totally sounds like FIFA.

by clank on Jun 23, 2010 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

they can't even get the other team to do an own-goal.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

C'mon guys...

All you have to do is score a goal.

by Ghostrider520 on Jun 23, 2010 11:36 AM EDT reply actions  

Dempsey's bleeding.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

ain't no card?

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

another mysterious call

handball that isn’t

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

Late bloomers

before testing was semi-serious and semi-accurate, there were a lot of late bloomers.

a few years ago, i would have suspected that of Bautista, but maybe he’s just a guy who is fortunate to play in a bandbox and has hit a run of good luck.

by madridbend on Jun 23, 2010 11:44 AM EDT reply actions  

FINALLY

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:48 AM EDT reply actions  

TWSS

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Score?????

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

that happened ages ago

i was only watching the game then. Only came on here after full time.

Still bitching to contact.

by Felonius_Monk on Jun 23, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just sayin'

As an Englishman, you should probably have been hoping for a draw between US-Algeria (which would allow England an easier path to the final)

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

The ball. It went into the net.

Whoa.

I'm out of champagna. How about some 7-Up and Mad Dog 20/20?

by The Continental on Jun 23, 2010 11:49 AM EDT reply actions  

I am not

watching. If they win, do they go to the final 16?

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

they won, and yes

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

We have a MUCH MUCH MUCH easier road to the Finals now, too

If Germany wins, we get Serbia/Ghana, Uruguay, and South Korea

If we got 2nd in the pool, we would’ve gotten Germany, Argentina, and Mexica

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Uruguay

Haven’t they been unstoppable? Or am I thinking of Paraguay?

I get the guays mixed up.

by paposse on Jun 23, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Uruguay's been good, sure

I’d still rather face them than Germany or Argentina

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

this is a question for guayzimi

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow

traveling around, with sporadic connections, I totally missed this. I saw the draws and thought that they weren’t making it.great, I will now cheer for USA!

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well done guys

bit of a nailbiter for england too. It would’ve been a travesty if you hadn’t gone through given how u dominated against ALgeria and got robbed vs Slovenia.

Two teams I wanted through, going through. Nice.

Still bitching to contact.

by Felonius_Monk on Jun 23, 2010 11:50 AM EDT reply actions  

Not sure the USA deserved it, but

it would have been a travesty for Slovenia to go forward on that phantom disallowed goal.

by madridbend on Jun 23, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

USA deserved it for sure

you hit the post what, twice today? And that goal that was disallowed for offside today (a bit like England’s today, but more so) was VERY close. And you “beat” Slovenia. I think the best two teams went through.

Still bitching to contact.

by Felonius_Monk on Jun 23, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

we didn't lose a match - how is that not deserving?

and it’s not like we benefited from some bogus calls.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

this commentary is hilarious

man stew time

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:52 AM EDT reply actions  

Yep. Better goal differential than England, I believe.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oops

You’re right, that one

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

HAHAHAHAHA

oh my God do you look SUCH an idiot right now. I dunno how you’ll live that one down. I guess you’re going to have to get a new user ID or something now.

Still bitching to contact.

by Felonius_Monk on Jun 23, 2010 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

did the usa win the group?

the graphic on fespn showed england the winner, usa runner-up.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

USA wins the group

ESPN know nuuuuu-thing.

Still bitching to contact.

by Felonius_Monk on Jun 23, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

as usual.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

First time in 80 years

that they’ve won their group.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow

Must have been that 1930 one where we took third or something?

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also the first time the U.S. has scored a goal in the third game in group play.

"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jun 23, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

GOOOAAALLLL

Better late than never, right?

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 11:54 AM EDT reply actions  

FYI the Germans are behind the announcers filming the match.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:54 AM EDT reply actions  

then they get to talk to Jeremy Schaap

poor guys.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

now everyone plays with wee Landon

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

HEH....

Wife left him for an alternate on the US Curling team.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Never saw these before

Guess I need to read more Teh Onion. Here’s Albert’s.

"I actually used about nine pitches--two different fastballs, two sliders, a curve, a changeup, knockdown, brushback, and hit-batsman" - Bob Gibson

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jun 23, 2010 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

So I guess we could conceivably be playing any of the teams in Group D

depending on how this afternoon’s games shake out. Serbia seems like the most likely though (assuming they beat Australia and Germany beats Ghana, and Germany still leads on goal differential).

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 12:05 PM EDT reply actions  

don't forget

that the pitcher batting 4th with a DH in the lineup came after some CHEESE

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 12:10 PM EDT reply actions  

Liveblogging news

the Guardian inexplicably liveblogging mcchrystal’s white house meeting.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 12:13 PM EDT reply actions  

longest match ever at Wimbledon, it seems.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 12:15 PM EDT reply actions  

/turns fespn off

thanks for reminding me, the headache is gone now.

I am the Batman .
@CodeeG

by CodyG on Jun 23, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

29 all in the 5th - incredible

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

And they're _still_ playing!

It’s now 39-38. Apparently it’s gone past 7 hours.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

May I make a confession?

given the choice, I’d rather watch this tennis match than any WC game. (There, am I weird?)

by ArkansasTravs on Jun 23, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

I mean, some people prefer tennis to soccer. That's fine.

But the quality of tennis in this match isn’t great, and we just watched the US score the latest goal in WC history, to win the group for the first time since 1930

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, I'm happy enough for the US team

I’ve just never, ever been able to get into soccer. I don’t have a problem, really, with all the hype. This IS the World Cup, after all. I just think it a bit weird, sometimes, that I kind of, secretly, like tennis more than one would think someone who never played it would.

by ArkansasTravs on Jun 23, 2010 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

No shame there. Tennis is a beautiful sport. Played it all throughout high school

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

nothing wrong with tennis

love the mano a mano. remember last year’s wimby final, with fed and roddick?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

maybe they get tea breaks, like cricket

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

none of that.

they get a minute to rest after every game.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Every two games

And it’s not THAT tiring when you’re just acing the other guy 70% of the time

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

i wonder if they are in cahoots, got some freaky bet down in vegas

tennis is funny like that

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

brilliant list.

the only additions I can quickly recall:
“A Summer Wasting” – Belle & Sebastian
“Summer Days” – Bob Dylan

by clank on Jun 23, 2010 12:24 PM EDT reply actions  

Crap.

Summer Wasting I totally wish I had remembered. Summer Days is just okay. Not one of my favourite Dylans, and I might have left it off even if I had thought of it. The B&S one I’m kicking myself for though.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

agree on the Dylan.

But I figure mediocre Dylan is generally worth an honorable mention.

by clank on Jun 23, 2010 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's probably true.

Death needs time for what it kills to grow in.

by the red baron on Jun 23, 2010 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

The ladies all agree!!!

It’s so weird seeing my name that many times. Thanks for the compliment though!

check out VEB on facebook...just search groups for Viva El Birdos

by Dttl89 on Jun 23, 2010 5:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

eric gagne

Hmm, how ever did he have one of the greatest seasons by a reliever ever? Hard work and perseverance after struggling for years as a starter?

Oh, no, steroids.

Sorry, it may be unfair, but anytime a guy goes from a 10 homer average to 40 the mind instantly goes to steroids. Sorry jose, but that’s the way it goes.

Jose fits in a class of brady anderson and gary matthews jr…not ludwick and werth.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:25 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

according to baseball

It doesn’t have to be proved. Mark McGwire never tested positive for a substance banned by MLB during his playing days but that didn’t stop him from being blackballed by the Hall.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:28 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

there wasn't any testing, was there?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

He admitted it later.

I forgot you were a troll. Carry on.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes, he admitted to taking performance enhancers

If you read any of his interviews he never states what we took and everyone and their mother knew he was taking Andro, but it wasn’t a substance banned by the league at the time.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:35 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

sighs....

dude can we please not go into the whole steroids/mac/performance/HOF thing that always happens.

I am the Batman .
@CodeeG

by CodyG on Jun 23, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

he has admitted to taking steriods

he didn’t give names but:

McGwire did not name specific drugs that he took.

“The names I don’t remember, but I did injectables,” McGwire told Costas. “I preferred the orals. The steroids I took were on a very low dosage.”

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4816607

by Evilfrog on Jun 23, 2010 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

i like that im a troll

Because my opinion differs from yours.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:45 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

and the writer of this post

Compared jose bautista to eric gagne, not me. Whether intentional or not, its funny that he is compared to a guy who admitted he was only good while on the juice.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:31 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

sounds like you defend mac but knock gagne for the same thing

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

not at all

I defend all the guys from the steroid era who did everything they could to get a leg up on their competition, because hey, if its the difference between making a mil a year and 10 mil a year and you know the mlb league office doesn’t care, why wouldn’t you?

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

not at all

I defend all the guys from the steroid era who did everything they could to get a leg up on their competition, because hey, if its the difference between making a mil a year and 10 mil a year and you know the mlb league office doesn’t care, why wouldn’t you?

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:38 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

ach, double post!

Sorry. Can’t delete the extra one from my blackberry. Dumb POST button.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

i'm not going to judge whether they should have or not

but there are consequences.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

i agree

Sadly for players in the late 90s, MLB did not tell them what those consequences were.

That would be like your parents never setting a rule for how late you can watch tv, so you spend 5 years staying up til midnight watching tv and then all the sudden one night your father walks in a paddles the hell out of your backside and says you never shouldve been watching tv past 10pm.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:43 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

i think it's more like your parents setting a rule

but never enforcing it until the one night your father walks in.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

i can go with that

So long as we add that you have the tv blaring and you know your father can hear it every night yet waits 5 years to walk in and then proceeds to punish you for all those nights.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:59 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

haha, yeah, guess i agree with that description

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

that would be tough to do with testing

how does he beat it?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

who knows

I’m no scientist but they found ways to create performance enhancers that were near impossible to test 5-10 years ago, what’s stopping someone from doing it again?

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 12:30 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

This assumes that players aren't using substances for which a test has not yet been developed.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

BALCO

Sure, Victor Conte is a provocateur, but I think there is some truth to him basically mocking the testing for PEDs because the drugs will always be a step ahead of the testing.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

hasn't testing learned and made great strides though?

i think they’ve closed the gap in time. if a player is doing something that can’t be detected today, isn’t there a good chance it will be detectable within a year, or less?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Assuming it is still in the player's system, which is a big assumption.

This is why some have called for MLB to preserve samples for future testing. I believe they do this in cycling. Basically, the theory goes that the way to stay ahead of PED development is to preserve samples so that, when a test is developed, they can test old samples. I think the FBI may have seized some old MLB samples in a raid. Does anyone remember if this is true?

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

huh, i would have thought that mlb already preserved samples

why wouldn’t they – is there player’s union opposition?

i know the fbi seized balco samples, but i thought they only seized testing results from mlb? although there could have been samples – i know mlb was supposed to destroy something per confidentiality agreement, but unsure if it was the results, samples, or both.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't be okay with it, if I were an employee.

I wouldn’t trust that there were procedural safeguards to prevent contamination and ensure that the samples belonged to the person to whom gave it, especially if my reputation hinged on it.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think this is related

to the 100 player list, in which the MLBPA agreed to random, unnamed testing, and then never verified that the samples were destroyed as per the agreement. Then the FBI got them. I found this, seems it’s all related to Bonds / BALCO prosecution.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

they recently seized a lot of stuff from Galea

The doc who treated arod after hip surgery. But he seems more connected to the nfl than anything else.

by lopey986 on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

and tiger woods

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also sadly

This is my first thought when the topic of Bautista comes up. How can it not after the last decade? I hope not because he’s another awesome story. I saw him play many a time in steel town and he never had that kind of power. Good for him though, I hope he’s legit and I hope he keeps it up. (although not against StL)

But you can’t fault anyone these days for making that ugly assumption on an extreme outlier.

by paposse on Jun 23, 2010 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

thanks for reminding me of that great XTC song...

… from a great album “Skylarking”. Thanks a little bit less for reminding me of “Summer Wind” by Frank (mixed memories of playing in a Wedding Band in the late 90’s).

youneverknow

by floodOfLove on Jun 23, 2010 12:25 PM EDT reply actions  

It seems that the real Matt Holliday is standing up.

2009 wOBA: .390
2010 wOBA: .390
Career wOBA: .399

2009 OPS: .909
2010 OPS: .891
Career OPS: .930

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 12:34 PM EDT reply actions  

along that line

Do you think the Matt Holliday we have seen thus far this year is the one that we gave a massive contract?
Are you ok with his level of production per dollar spent this season?

Just curious…

by sociopath on Jun 23, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

if he hits close to his career numbers for the first few seasons

then I am okay with it. Because that is what the front office valued his contract at. It’s not like the expected him to hit well above his career numbers when they signed him.

by Evilfrog on Jun 23, 2010 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, i suppose they bought this matt holliday

he’ll probably have a typical year, around his career averages – i just don’t think that rates his contract, especially in terms of length. five years would have been ok, even though i don’t think he’ll be quite the same player in five years. seven years is something i thought only the yankees did.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you disappointed in the contract?

I can’t tell where you stand.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

you'll be better off if you just accept that

if he hits his career numbers, that justifies the contract because that’s what the FO paid him to do.

Otherwise it’s going to be a rough 7 years.

by Evilfrog on Jun 23, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

actually, and maybe i'm wrong

but if he hits his career numbers for the first few years of the contract, aren’t we underpaying him for that performance? so in theory, it evens out over the years?

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, we'd be underpaying

And if his presence brings a higher probability of making the playoffs (which Steve Sommer, I believed, proved that he did, at least last year), then it’s been show that playoff appearances are worth an average of an extra $20 million in revenue

And that doesn’t even count for the externality that his presence might convince Albert to sign her long term

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

i don't think that albert signing is contingent on holliday at all, per se

because signing werth or crawford or any other good player as a commitment to win would have the same effect.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

its not holliday specifically

but the fact that the cards signed a very good player long-term.

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes.

If he gives us 5-WAR seasons, we are underpaying him, according to my abuse of Fangraphs’s valuations. My hope is for five 5-WAR seasons out of the contract, but I don’t have my hopes up for that.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think this is possible, actually.

he’s only 30. so you’re hoping he puts up 5-WAR years through age 34. edmonds did that.

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right.

The contract isn’t that bad. Just pray that he is not injured. Scott Rolen was 29 in 2004, and was coming off of four seasons of 6.1, 7.3, 6.7, and 8.8 WAR. He was a surefire bet for a few more 6+ WAR season and a few more above 5 WAR as well. Then, he suffered a shoulder injury in 2005. He was a 5.5-WAR player in ‘06, but hasn’t been above 4.0 WAR in any other year since 2004’s MV3 season. Of course, this year Rolen is on pace to re-visit his pre-shoulder injury production levels, but that doesn’t change the cautionary nature of long-term mega deals.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

true, but i feel better about a long term deal fro holliday

more than most any other player. mainly just because he is a fitness freak. because of that he’s less of an injury risk and more likely to sustain production later into his career

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree.

Holliday has a higher level of fitness than almost any other long-term contract recipient, but that doesn’t eliminate the freak injury possibility, like the Cintron and Choi incidents with Rolen.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Albert is pretty fit

or at least his cover on Muscle & Fitness awhile back led me to believe…

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah? well where is HIS cover of Muscle & Fitness?

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

See?

(just a crop, but whatev)

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

just getting ready to post that...

Albert’s tricep keeps staring at me, however

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

M & F

link

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

nothing beats the other AP's cover though...

holy shoulders, Freese

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought he was fast and strong on TV

and then I saw him play live…wow

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

you doubt the maching's triceps?

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's a magazine cover

They probably blew his arms up to 5 times their normal size and made them extra shiny.

by mojowo11 on Jun 23, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think it was that photoshopped.

They definitely greased him up, though.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, they just got him after a workout, all pumped

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Someone far smarter than I could do the calculation

But you’d have to account for inflation (both economic inflation and inflation of baseball contracts)

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

What are the Cardinals paying for? The market is still working itself out, but assuming an average market value of $4.4 million per marginal win, seven percent annual salary inflation, and 0.5 WAR a year decline, seven years, $120 million dollars indicates a 4.5 WAR player for 2010. With that number in mind, what is a reasonable projection for Holliday?

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/holliday-returns-to-the-cardinals/

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

OK

so 120M divided by 4.4M/win = ~27.3ish wins? So 27.3 / 7 years = ~3.9 wins per year.

So (neglecting inflation) he’s got to average 4 WAR/yr over the life of the contract for the Cards to break even. If he beats that, the Cards are underpaying. I think he can do that…..

FWIW right now FG has him @ 3.3 WAR already for 2010.

by nota bene on Jun 23, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think you have to figure the discount in like fangraphs does

a 7-year deal means you are looking at production beyond 17 mil per year. it’s different than 7 separate 1-yr deals. don’t know their formula, but you are probably looking at getting production of 140 mil or more rather than 120.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

when you give a long-term deal

their is a discount rate – in exchange for the security. it’s different than a one-year deal for 17 mil, then another, then another, etc.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

are we using 17 mil?

shouldn’t we be using 15 mil? I know Cots has him at 17, but i could have sworn 2 mil was deferred…

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

your right

but they figure the 2 million deffered into the payroll for this year so it technically counts

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Only when ownership needs to flaunt how much they are spending

I absolutely stone cold guarantee their actual accounting reflects that money as being discounted since it is deferred.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

*it's either discounted for the present value

Or they don’t even put it on the books until it is actually paid out. There is a zero percent chance they count that 2M in full each year it is deferred from.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

so depending how they are investing the money,

the present value of that deferred money could be like .5 mil

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

if not, to account for the deferred money he would

have to put up some WAR when retired.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

The discount basically means,

in return for a longer contract, Holliday accepts a lower annual salary.

I'm one of those "I don't care how you killed the cow; just serve me a great steak" guys. If the results are logical and easy to understand, I'm pouring some A1 sauce on that formula and eating it. UZR qualifies. -Bill Simmons

by hazel on Jun 23, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

got it

but I wasn’t asking about the AAV. My question was about the total # of WAR over 7 years needed to justify the entire contract.

by nota bene on Jun 23, 2010 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

fangraphs always figures it in when discussing contracts

and WAR values. for instance, holliday could have signed for 1 yr, 20 mil, but for 2-3 yrs he’d get 19 per, for 3-4 it’d be 18 per, and for 5-6 it’d be 17 per, and 7 yrs maybe requires some deferred money – the player gives up something per year for the long-term security of the contract. so a club would have to value holliday at 20mil per year to give him 17mil per year for seven years, which means they would expect 20mil of production, however you want to calculate the cost of 1WAR – i think it fluctuates somewhat.
(i’m just making the numbers up to illustrate.)

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

would you figure the discount into that?

in other words, they are paying for more than 17mil per in production by dint of the 7-yr deal.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

depends on how you value it

maybe for individual years he is underpayed, but for a seven-year deal there is a discount per year. you shouldn’t look at it as 7 one-year contracts and then sum it up.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

this had better continue for a long while

before we can say we’re getting our money’s worth.

by clank on Jun 23, 2010 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes

Yes…outside of the RISP issues which has detracted from his value so far but there is ZERO reason to expect it to continue.

Free agents are expensive.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

We had quite a discussion about this in the offseason.

I wrote three pieces dealing with other long-term LFers, Holliday’s historically similar comparisons, and other Ten-Millionaires. But, there is more and a lot of it was better than mine.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

it is nice to have him back

but I did do that fanpost about how he gets better as the season progresses, so I’m not that surprised.

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

derp forgot the link

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703438604575314763366028050.html

it’s about the minor league lancaster jethawks and their ridiculous stadium

Signatures are overrated.

by hr on Jun 23, 2010 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Remember that time the US soccer team scored in the 91st minute to win the pool and stave off elimination?

That was cool

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 12:56 PM EDT reply actions  

do you know how they did it in 1930 -

was there drama, or did the third match even matter?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Stav off elimination?

they did it from their knees?

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

whoops. don't mind me

i seem to have misplaced my baseball blog

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:00 PM EDT reply actions  

Funny huh....

this looks exactly like the one I’ve lurched around nearly everyday for the past 4 years…same posters and everything. Just that this is apparently a soccer blog. It’s like an alternate universe or something.

If you see a guy open the car door for his girlfriend, either the car is new or the girlfriend is.

by cardzfanbub on Jun 23, 2010 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

You know...

It’s only for a month or so. It’s only every 4 years. And it’s not even talked about everyday.

March Madness and NFL/college football on the other hand… That shit got old.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

plus everyone is rooting for the same team

most everyone, anyway

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

go indonesia!

fuck yeah!

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kenapa

pak? Tidak ada yang punya, apanya, tidak ada orang orang yang bisa main. Lebih baik main badminton!

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cant argue with that logic

Also, made me think of Will Smith from MIB2.

by JWO on Jun 23, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha

i like how this one poster on bcb picks all cards on his fantasy team because no one else will pick them. then he just forgets all about fantasy and roots for the cubs. if they don’t win the division, he says he knows at least he won his fantasy league without even checking.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not me

I’m an Argentina fan. If other people here were Argentina fans, I could talk. As it is, I could care less.

babip giveth... and babip taketh away

by purple_haze on Jun 23, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't really care...

found it more humorous than anything. Other than the first couple of posts, I read 50 about the World Cup before getting back to baseball. It likely won’t shorten my life any.

If you see a guy open the car door for his girlfriend, either the car is new or the girlfriend is.

by cardzfanbub on Jun 23, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

maybe we should try to fit in

goal? am i doing it right?

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nobody's asking you to

It’s not that hard to skip over the chatter you don’t care about. Yes, this is a baseball blog, but I think we, as a community, have gotten tight enough that we can discuss other things

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

have you seen

the music thread? I believe you even posted in it….

by cdb on Jun 23, 2010 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Futbol!

I much prefer it over the indy/alt/faux-rock chatter.

Gooooooooaallllll!

by paposse on Jun 23, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

allow me one more soccer question then, please

I admit that this US world cup team has been an exciting surprise, but how come whenever I watch the US or other teams composed of the most elite soccer athletes in the world, there’s always at least a couple plays where the ball is sitting in front of a giant, gaping open net and some player kicks it wide or hits the post or, even more commonly, boots it over the net by about 60 feet?

by mattyp on Jun 23, 2010 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nerves or suckiness.

Also it’s really hard to get a good angle on the ball moving that fast.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, if you look at Jozy's missed goal from point-blank range today

The ball is traveling downwards, he has to kick high to meet the ball, then try and keep the ball under the crossbar. Simple physics says that the ball is going to want to travel upwards

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

From an early age,

Soccer players get screamed at for exactly this. It’s like a golfer missing a 4 ft putt or an outfielder dropping an easy fly. Some combination of pressure, inattention, luck, and other things imperceptable to the audience.

I'm one of those "I don't care how you killed the cow; just serve me a great steak" guys. If the results are logical and easy to understand, I'm pouring some A1 sauce on that formula and eating it. UZR qualifies. -Bill Simmons

by hazel on Jun 23, 2010 1:29 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

...

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

flagged

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I had to...

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

We could combine the two,

and remember Matt Holliday getting hit in the groin by Dan Haren. I’m not really sure how that would help though….

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

the way haren is hitting, i could see that

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'll give you a rec

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think a lot of players are still getting used to the ball this time, too

Not everybody has used it a lot before, and it apparently is designed to spin less and “knuckle” more, in baseball terms (I think, feel free to correct me on this guys). I think the Germans used it in their league last year but they are in the minority.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

leave it to the Germans to do the smart thing

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's really hard to square up a moving soccer ball

Seriously, try it some time. These guys are pros, yes, but they’re also trying to do it in the midst of defensive pressure from all sides and a closing window of opportunity.

by mojowo11 on Jun 23, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

how far can a soccer ball be kicked in the air - 70 yards?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Tim Howard regularly kicks it 90 yards, I'd say

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't know about that

He usually gets it past midfield, but not 90 yards.

I would guess 90 yards is probably the absolute max for the strongest legged dudes.

by mojowo11 on Jun 23, 2010 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeahhhh, there was some rough meter-to-yard converting in there

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

hey, there was a separate fanshot for this

everyone moved over here.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

stupid soccer

at least I haven’t had to see any of it, but it’s all over facebook and baseball blogs

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 1:28 PM EDT reply actions  

and the twittersphere

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

no u

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

i gathered that much i just don't get it

or just didn’t have a witty response

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fine. I'll do it.

They’re actually a relegated team in the EPL, and it stands for Nottingham United. F. Tuck is known as one of the best goalies nobody knows about, L. John is a bear of a defender, and R. Hood is known to be one of the foxiest strikers in the league, famous for his snipes from long range

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

and Maid Marian is in a short dress

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ooh da lolly

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wait, the US has other Soccer fans?

I thought my species was extinct!

In baseball the object is to go home! And to be safe! "I hope I'll be safe at home!"
-George Carlin (RIP)

by Taskmaster on Jun 23, 2010 6:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Crap, can't think of any biological metaphor.

Not like soccer fans have a mating season every 4 years….

In baseball the object is to go home! And to be safe! "I hope I'll be safe at home!"
-George Carlin (RIP)

by Taskmaster on Jun 23, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

what's this ad, then?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2FRXmjfVaE

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

the cicadas that come out every - i think it was 17 years

i was in chicago for it, and the noise was like attending the world cup. really, it drives you nuts when it starts up, and they are just everywhere.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

hey let's talk about the gonzalez firing, that should keep your mind off soccer

i said it earlier and now Jon heyman is saying Gonzalez is top candidate to take over braves in ’11

I am the Batman .
@CodeeG

by CodyG on Jun 23, 2010 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

fredi got fired?

if so, yeah he’d probably get the atlanta job, depending on what else was open. why was he fired?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

just read the article

it said he led them to a franchise-record 87 wins last year. that is very surprising, considering the two world series. and he’s replaced by the AAA manager mid-season? kind of strange.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

article said the owner wanted to fire him at the end of last year

because they didn’t make the playoffs. then he was ready to fire him again this year just before the hanley incident, so they held off because they didn’t want to appear to be supporting hanley at all. so i doubt hanley had anything to do with it. loria said he expects this team to compete for a championship, and they are under .500.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I said this in the earlier thread, how can they expect to compete?

sure the talent is there but with the braves/ phillies beating them with depth and the mets with salary, how can they expect to win? they’re just out of luck, if they were in the central they’d probably be ahead of the reds.

I am the Batman .
@CodeeG

by CodyG on Jun 23, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

thats just not true

they won 92 games in 1997 and won the WS, then won 91 games in 03 and another WS

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, i thought it sounded messed up

it’s the sb nation article at the bottom of the right margin

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

do you have a link to the article?

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice post again, RB.

also, how about the Aquabats "Hot Summer Nights (Won’t Last Forever)?

Cardinals Baseball 2010: Why have only one 25th man when you can have four?

by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Jun 23, 2010 1:34 PM EDT reply actions  

so last night's game was cool

the outcome and all, but am i the only one who thought it was kind of boring playing toronto? the must have been like 30 people in attendance

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 1:34 PM EDT reply actions  

at least we didn't have to play in oakland at the mausoleum

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

it makes me sad to see empty baseball stadiums

it would suck to be a toronto fan. even when they’re good, they’re still not good because of the AL east.

the field is so weird, too. the OF looks gigantic because there’s hardly any dirt in the IF.

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

One of my sons

lives in TO and is a Jays fan. It must be frustrating to have a better WPC than us and be in 4th place. We don’t talk about it.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jun 23, 2010 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

hehehe

Wimbledon commentator just compared Isner’s swing-and-miss to a batsman facing a doosra. They really need to pick up some baseball metaphors.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 1:55 PM EDT reply actions  

is that match still going?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah 41-41. Ridiculous.

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oops 42-41 Isner right now

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

it just stays on serve, right?

nobody is getting broken and breaking back?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Correct

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Apparently no one's even close to breaking

From what I read Mahut hasn’t had a break point all set, and Isner hasn’t had one since it was 33-32 (now 46-45). This is just goofy – at some point they have to find a way to end it.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

paper rock scissors, best of three

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was thinking roshambo,

but your suggestion is probably more appropriate for Wimbledon.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

wat

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

because I said it wrong and the drive on the wrong side of the road

Blaine Matthew Burns: Albert Pujols' biggest fan (his first words will for sure be "Albert Pujols is RIDICULOUS")

by STLRegalia on Jun 23, 2010 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

someone will pass out eventually

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jose Bautista!?!

I find the Bautista story is interesting because it parallels the story of a hitter I have worked with, Andres Torres of the Giants (LF), who has seen a pop over the past 2 years. People have been wondering what happened and, as I explain in this piece…

My Experience With Andres Torres

…it has a lot to do with Torres’ finally getting good information about how good hitters actually swing the bat.

I don’t know Bautista, but I wonder if something similar happened to Bautista, especially since both he and Pujols are from the DR and Pujols is very willing to talk hitting if asked.

P.S. I think this whole bad hitting information thing is relevant to the idea of the AAAA player, at least on the hitting side.

P.P.S. Is the AAAA phenomenon just applicable to hitters or does it also apply to pitchers?

by thepainguy on Jun 23, 2010 2:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Evan MacLane, Oneli Perez, possibly even PJ Walters

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think it applies MORE to pitchers than hitters

Seems a lot of guys can get by with 87 mph at AAA but don’t get it done in the bigs.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

RT @ RobRains
  

An earthquake hit Toronto and just shook the Cardinals team hotel for 30 seconds. Email from John Rooney said everything is OK.

I am the Batman .
@CodeeG

by CodyG on Jun 23, 2010 2:11 PM EDT reply actions  

I want to hear what the California guys said

last time they were in town for an earthquake, they shrugged it off

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

5.5

http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsww/Quakes/us2010xwa7.php

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

scary

hope they are ok

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

clearly next one at Philly.

 RobRains Rooney say there are no indications of damage or injuries yet, but a lot of confusion. The Blue Jays were in San Diego earthquake last week. 6 minutes ago via web

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

dang

they are the earthquake team!

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Geez 44-44 now.

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 2:17 PM EDT reply actions  

highest scoring game ever?

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

off espn2

the next matches have started in S Africa

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Got moved to ESPNU and ESPN3.com

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

And now they've reached the century mark

50-50. That’s like two whole matches’ worth of games in one interminable set.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, i was just doing the math on that

this set is like a typical 5-set tough match, in number of games played. isner just saved 2 break points, but he looks like a zombie. i don’t give him much longer.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good gravy

I checked the interwebs to see who had won. It is absolutely flabbergasting that it is still going.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

espn3.com is showing it

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just started streaming it

One of the announcers said “Texas Leaguer.” Yay for baseball metaphors!

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

the chair ump announced the score in disbelief

9 hours.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

tiebreaker once it hits 50 all - but who envisioned that?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

I had actually forgotten that a match couldn't end in a tie breaker until just a couple days ago

Maybe my brain is psychic.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

At Wimbledon, yes

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, not in the 4 majors

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

False, US Open

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

don't believe so

not in the fifth set – pretty sure that’s for all the majors, no?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

From Wikipedia
he tiebreak is sometimes not employed for the final set of a match, so that the deciding set must be played until one player or team has won two more games than the opponent. This is true in three of the four major tennis championships, all except the United States Open where a tiebreak is played even in the deciding set (fifth set for the men, third set for the women) at 6–6.

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Coolness

VEB is so educational.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

huh

i believe that is a more recent change. i used to live in new york and attended every year, and i recall a great night match with patrick mcenroe that i’m almost certain went long into the fifth. also recall sampras puking in the fifth at like 8-8.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

the sampras incident

which was more than once that set, may have had something to do with the change.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

this could only happen at wimbledon

where you can win every service game and don’t have to deal with the heat of new york or down under

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good point

Different weather could make this unbearable.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

johnny mac shown taking the match in

the queen should be there soon

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

she won't make it then

match point…saved. she can get there by tomorrow if it continues – the sun has pretty much set.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Totally Random and Worthless Observations

a) US World Cup Team survives – woot!
b) Tony Larussa’s daughter is pretty darn hot
c) If Holliday maintains his current pace from the past four games, he will finish the season with approximately 155 HRs and a .750 Average.

by JWO on Jun 23, 2010 2:52 PM EDT reply actions  

123 HRs

i’m calling it now!

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

stav is hitting cleanup tonight wat

lopez
holliday
pujols
stavinoha
freese
rasmus
molina
winn
ryan

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 3:09 PM EDT reply actions  

haha

tony must do this to get a reaction

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is a joke, right?

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's not funny.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's because the joke is on us.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

wtf is stav doing on our team

freakin retarded

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

WTF: Tonight's Lineup

Lopez 2B
Holliday LF
Pujols 1B
Stavinoha DH
Freese 3B
Rasmus CF
Molina C
Winn RF
Ryan SS

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 3:09 PM EDT reply actions  

o noez

ludwick should be DHing if he’s not going to be playing

"Did you just grow a mustache?"
"While SPINNING."

by IHeartBoog on Jun 23, 2010 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

There goes that "rest the regulars with the DH spot" idea.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

misinformation

see, he had the jays preparing for that, and he pulled the switcheroo – genius.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Jays' pitchers are all scared saying to themselves,

“Crap, I thought we were gonna see Ludwick tonight, but now we have to face Stavinoha? We’ve got no chance! And Randy Winn is just overkill!”
I actually don’t mind Winn playing at all.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

At least he's in the proper batting order.

You want to DH Stav? Fine. Bat him 7th.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

or they are over-confident

tony is lulling them

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

man.

I’m okay with Ludwick sitting and DHing. I’m just not really OK with Staivnoha batting 4th when Colby and Freese are in the same lineup.

by Evilfrog on Jun 23, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

they have a lefty tonite?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he wants to APu catch Barry's Bases loaded IBB record

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

he does keep batting pitchers fourth, doesn't he

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I sure am glad that Stavinfection is the everyday DH.

Ya know, because there aren’t any better options.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

tweeters of VEB

post your things. i made a new one that i may actually use to tweet about gadgets and baseball and such. we’ll see. i’m not real good at all this social networking stuff, but this is at least way less creepy than facebook

https://twitter.com/jclark512

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 3:16 PM EDT reply actions  

...

http://www.twitter.com/rui_xu

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

rockstark73

"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"

by rocKStark5 on Jun 23, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

holy crap

i think i broke twitter

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

the crowd keeps growing at the isner match

it’s a spectacle. i wonder how many have been there from the outset.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

i wonder if carp and waino can serve heat

they have the height and the arms – roddick supposedly has a good fastball.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn't realize that the 5th set started today.

They stopped the game yesterday because of darkness.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

this match is a continuation?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ggGGiBtrewAj42Es30E6cTKAhSIAD9GH4SA00

Still, the 5th set is approaching 7 hours, and is already the longest ever played.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, but it makes it a little less impressive to me now

just a little, because that’s a long time. isner is delirious, might not know where he is. the other guy is bouncing around. the umpire just stumbled over the announcing of the score – sure he’s never dealt with such big numbers before.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm also a little less impressed.

But it’s still a remarkable amount of tennis. And Isner was supposed to play doubles today, too. Whoops.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

i hope it was rescheduled and not a forfeit

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, that would be pretty unfair to him

“I’m still playing in another official Wimbledon match” seems like a pretty solid excuse….

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, i don't know the rules on that

and isner’s partner might be one of those doubles-only guys, so this is his payday.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

They think they're playing ping pong

and they’re wondering how their paddles got so big, man. Also, they think they are still in Vietnam.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think this is live streaming

http://espn.go.com/espn3/player?id=6367&league=Wimbledon

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

this might get stopped for darkness again

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

time out at 58-all

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

...I believe the crowd is doing the wave.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, they are delirious too

this is a huge crowd for this matchup

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

mahut selling it

diving for a ball

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'm relying on audio

no hope of getting a proper video stream on this comp

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

controversy

might call it here.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

to be continued

mahut wanted it stopped, isner acted pissed by the decision

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha, wow.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Twitter

@stlhugo

"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."

by StLHugo on Jun 23, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

i don't get the lists thing

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

It gets useful

Once you’re following a lot of people. Keeps teh twitterz organized and easier to read all the unread tweets.

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

@gbowles

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

jacksonian215

"I told you, I don't like to be manhandled!"

by jacksonian on Jun 23, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

...

mstreeter06

....my quick smells like french toast...

Twitter: @mstreeter06

by mstreeter06 on Jun 23, 2010 3:21 PM EDT reply actions  

So now will you haters vote for Holliday for the All-Star team?

or must he surpass .300/.400/.500 w/ RISP first?

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 3:31 PM EDT reply actions  

i didn't realize people here weren't voting for holliday

still, i think rasmus and luddy are more deserving at this point. holliday won’t get voted in anyway, but if he is deserving in a month’s time then i’m sure the manager and coaches will select him.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I refuse to vote for the

stain on baseball that is the all star game, but that’s just me.

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

with the expanded roster i think there should always be one spot for these cases

the commish should put griffey in, let him be in the homer derby, get a farewell. i know a lot of people are opposed, but i think of ripken’s last all-star game.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm opposed.

It actually matters (WS home field) and such gestures are just awkward and weird (the Ripken/A-Rod thing was just bizarre)

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

if it matters so much then the fans shouldn't vote either

he doesn’t have to actually play. the rosters are what now, over 30?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, fan voting is stupid too

but otherwise, the managerial selections are at times dumb as well (see Charlie Manuel last year)

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've never voted for the ASG either

I almost want to just vote for all Phillies players, though.

Just to prove how inane the current system has become.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just be careful

Selig might hear you and decide to “fix” it. We all know how well he does when he steps in to fix things.
Before too long, the Elias folks will be deciding the All-Star roster with a (not very) modified version of their free agent rankings. The year after that the draft will use the system to pre-determine all draft choices and slot bonuses to improve parity.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

ambiguous answer

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Germany finally breaks through

So if it stays like this we’ll be getting Ghana next round…? I think they’d win the tiebreaker against Serbia with one more goal scored.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 3:49 PM EDT reply actions  

Holy cow - it's now slightly plausible that Australia makes it through

They’re up 2-0 on Serbia. If they score one more and Germany scores one more, Australia beats Ghana on goals scored.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

tonight's lineup

does not compute

   1. Lopez, 2B
   2. Holliday, LF
   3. Pujols, 1B
   4. Stavinoha, DH
   5. Freese, 3B
   6. Rasmus, CF
   7. Molina, C
   8. Winn, RF
   9. Ryan, SS

by jeff_abs on Jun 23, 2010 3:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Abort, Retry, or Fail

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

its been so long since i used to play with dos as a kid

but what was the difference between Abort and Fail?

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Effectively?

nothing. In my experience, choosing any of the three choices usually resulted in the same outcome, the Abort, Retry, or Fail choice appearing once again.

by ArkansasTravs on Jun 23, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ludwick left the game early last night

Do you think there is something wrong? I hope it is just Tony showing off his geniusness again.

"I've had pretty good success with Stan (Musial) by throwing him my best pitch and backing up third." - Carl Erskine

by spfldbird on Jun 23, 2010 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

who knows

Frankie getting pulled the other night turned out to be a lingering sinus infection

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, he sucked too

maybe because of the infection, but sucking like that will get you pulled even if healthy

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

fixed

Frankie getting pulled the other night turned out to be a lingering sinus stav infection.

by swmofan on Jun 23, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Tony is concerned about Luddy's health

It’s easy to be snarky from the outside looking in on day-to-day lineup oddities, but it usually makes sense down the road.

Except for Aaron Miles starting at 3B/SS… that never makes sense.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

thank you

for reminding me that it could be worse.

by jeff_abs on Jun 23, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

4th!

We’re batting our 7th best hitter 4th!

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think Colby is allowed to bat 4th... too good at baserunning maybe?

Freese… not enough raw power…

Molina? That’s so 09.

I feel a 3K, 1 HR (from his knees) kind of night for Stav.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lopez would have been 4th

Yadi would have been better 4th.
Freeeze and Rasmus would definitely have been better 4th.
Skip Schumaker would have been better 4th.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Miles?

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

probably boog and skip

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

skip's not in the lineup

must mean boog and pujols.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes, that.

;lakhf0oa40lkdga;lkhga;d!!!1

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

you think stav is our seventh best hitter?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

skip is where we disagree then

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think they are about even

Skip was only able to be a not terrible offensive player because of a .325 career BABIP. Based on his hitting a ton of grounders and flairs and not having great speed, I’m thinking that number is lucky.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because Skip has only had 1,700 career plate appearances

and 1,400 balls in play. And BABIP stabilizes (meaning past performance predicts future performance at 50%) at 1500 balls in play, so that means Skip’s past BABIP will only predict his future BABIP around 45% of the time, which means their is a 55% chance that Skip’s BABIP will be lower than .325 going forward (not really how it works, but it’s close enough) which means that their is around a 30% chance that Skips current BABIP is .325 without any skill involved.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

without any skill?

i don’t see how this is possible…. if you’re saying he should be closer to .300 than .325 then i get what you’re saying i guess…

how does this make stavinoha better skip?

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm saying there is a very decent chance that Skip's BABIP is .325 if he has *no* BABIP skill whatsoever

But my rough math, I’m going to say that number is around 15%. And it’s very, very likely that his BABIP going forward will be in between .300 and .325, siding slighltly on the .300 side.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Australia up 2-0 over Serbia

If they score two more, or if Germany scores two more, or if both Australia and Germany score one more, then Australia can make it out of their pool

This shit is nutstarded

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 4:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Welp, that about does it for my Australia dream scenario

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wait, one more goal by Serbia puts THEM through now

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

insane

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is what happens

when so many games in your sport end in ties.

by Michael_68_1999 on Jun 23, 2010 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you trying to insinuate that ties are bad?

It leads to hugely interesting scenarios in group play, and there’re no ties in the knockout rounds

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, i've changed my mind on the ties in the group play

it keeps more teams alive, which makes it more interesting – like pennant races.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't remind me.

At least I get to see Greinke pitch. I get to see Suppan and Hawksworth as our starters. Ugh.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on Jun 23, 2010 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

take heart

you won’t have to watch suppan for long.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ouch

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's true

but if he can pitch an effective half-game, that’s fine – not ideal, but with two starters injured, not so bad.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wasn't disputing

I just hate to think of when Suppan might blow up. It could be ugly.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

new P-D online goes live

old bj rains slapfight on twitter. heh. (bring unicorns).

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 4:24 PM EDT reply actions  

Ooh, Strasburg's pitching right now.

Sports are conspiring to prevent me from getting anything done today.

by BTown Birds fan on Jun 23, 2010 4:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Yes.

Strasburg vs. the contact-happy slap-hitting Royals on MLB network.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

reds up 2-0 in 4th in oakland

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

effin sports!

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

still...

I would really, really, really like to see a fanpost comparing and contrasting the different defensive metrics. really.

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

how do we get stavinoha and miles off the team

is a question worth pondering. hmmmm.

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 4:57 PM EDT reply actions  

mulling

the only way to do it…pondering just doesn’t work.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

mull, ponder, call it what you will

there must be a way to remove the staviles

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

mulling has a specific meaning here

maybe you’ve been mulling so much you’ve forgotten?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

memesplanation

buster olney ‘reporting’ that the phillies were mulling over howard for pujols

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

ah

I missed that particular

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

so, olney was obviously high

but i think it was more the phils front office doing the mulling, now that i think about it.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why would you want Stav off the team?

He’s one of the better bench players in the NL as far as hitting goes.

It looks ugly, but he has gotten results.

You want to DFA a player hitting .309/.345/.455? Really? He won’t end the season hitting over .300, but a SLG of .450+ is within his reach, which is above-average for PH-focused bench players.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

ya

my VEB inclinations and his performance to this point this season really have me conflicted on how to react

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

i know

it’s not likely to continue forward.
however, he HAS been effective so far this season. just take that at face value.

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

At face value it means we can breathe a sigh of relief and then DFA him for someone talented.

I'm one of those "I don't care how you killed the cow; just serve me a great steak" guys. If the results are logical and easy to understand, I'm pouring some A1 sauce on that formula and eating it. UZR qualifies. -Bill Simmons

by hazel on Jun 23, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

basically

there’s a difference between results and potential.
stav has only some of the former.

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

No it's not

He’s striking out in 30% of his PAs, swinging at 40% of balls out of zone→essentially has zero plate discipline and doesn’t really have light tower power to make up for that massive deficiency. He’s gotten extremely lucky so far and if he had a .300 BABIP would be hitting something like .235/.260/.350

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

So ride him while he is lucky, which could be most of the season.

Fernando Tatis is hitting .175/.254/.333 for the Mets and getting similar playing time as Stav.

Is a bad player playing above his head more frustrating than a historically average player flailing badly? I dunno. But while he is playing over his head I will enjoy it.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ride him while he's lucky?

That’s like saying ride a quarter because it’s flipping heads a lot. Getting grounders to go through the hole is not a skill. His underlying stats are bad and anyone should project him going forward for being bad. It’s a joke that he is DHing and even bigger that he is batting 4th.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Illogical.

No guarantees that the luck will stay. The best assumption is that from here on out, his BABIP will be average, that is around .300 (generous, since he doesn’t hit a lot of line drives). If that’s his babip from here on out, he’ll suck. “Ride him while he’s lucky” isn’t the same as “ride him while he’s hot”, and we shouldn’t be doing it.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

ride him til he's lucky

then watch him strike out in every postseason appearance

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

while

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I generally consider hot to = lucky

Though I understand there is a difference. Seeing the ball better is different than grounders finding gaps to be sure.

I simply maintain that he is perfectly suitable for PH duty on a major league team. He shouldn’t be batting 4th in a starting lineup (not even on the orioles or pirates), and he shouldn’t make a start on defense except in an emergency capacity.

Of course, these things happen, but I fail to see how that should make us want to get rid of Stavinoha just because he is being used improperly. Miles is another story.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Question

If Stav was hitting .235/.260/.350 like he “should” be, would you say the same?

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Probably not.

But you can’t make roster moves based on where players should be. A lot of it comes down to the mental state of a player, and if they are playing over their heads they can stay on a roll, and the opposite seems to be true as well (see: Allen Craig in 2010).

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just can't process this

Yes you can and yes you should.

If you see a guy in craps go bet $100 on Yo-11 and hit twice in a row, you don’t think “holy cow, let’s bet with this guy on Yo-11”, you think “holy cow that guy was lucky, let’s never let THAT GUY handle my money!”

Stavinoha is apparently in a good mental state…..and still has TERRIBLE underlying stats that are seemingly getting worse. Those are what you should be using to judge what he’s really done if you are trying to guess what he will be going forward. Just because he’s gotten lucky so far has just zero relevance as to what we should expect from him this point onward.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

the fact he was on the roster to begin with

shows they don’t care about his underlying stats.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Baseball luck and craps luck are two different animals.

Flipping a quarter is complete luck.

Craps is complete luck.

There is certainly a lot of luck in hitting grounders through the hole, but there is still some skill involved.

Nick Stavinoha is a bad baseball player, but he is OK at PH’ing because he usually does so in late innings and he seems to have a mysterious power over average-to-crappy relievers.

I do not want Nick on the roster next year, and when the September call-ups come along, I think he should be a benchwarmer.

I just don’t think he should be DFA’d in the middle of the season when he’s humming along at about average for his role in the NL.

"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro

by Toppins on Jun 23, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

How about this

Stavinoha should not ever be seeing the field as a DH when Allen Craig is better than him and on the 40-man.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

he doesn't have a mysterious power IT'S CALLED LUCK

Why should we wait for him to suck before letting him go? We already know he’s not good at baseball.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

again, they knew what he was to begin with (i hope)

yet rostered him out of spring training. why would they cut him now?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because maybe they realized how stupid they were being in the first place?

And decided to stop being stupid? They are a FO after all, being stupid should not be the norm, just the occasional mistake.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

it might not be the front-office

i don’t think they are stupid. not that i think tony is stupid, but i believe he wants stav here.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right I don't think they are stupid either, which is why I think the Stav move was a mistake that they should have the will to abort

The only reason they aren’t doing it would be Tony’s confirmation bias in how well he is hitting and perhaps risk of fan unhappiness (although I can’t imagine people would care much if Stav were to leave – I doubt he has any kind of cult following, he’s just not cool enough).

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think you underrate how people remember the Hoffman HR

I made some money the other day betting some moron that Stav wouldn’t hit .300 the rest of the year…

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yep.

In baseball the object is to go home! And to be safe! "I hope I'll be safe at home!"
-George Carlin (RIP)

by Taskmaster on Jun 23, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

let's just say that I'm not real confident in the guy's hitting going forward

and he can’t defend, so, there’s that.

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

also

small sample size

*now with more veterany veteranness and a higher grit factor

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jun 23, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

wow college recruiting is pathetic

Lake Forest College sent me a postcard with fans in Wrigley Field wearing Cubs jerseys… on the back it says that the the college is connected to the city and go in city and whatnot

ironic…. a school trying to get me to go there because they might just go to Wrigley Field… (for non-Cubs fans, I don’t get this… the product on the field is poor and not worth watching)

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 5:04 PM EDT reply actions  

2 of em are Bannister looking like an AL pitcher though

His velo is down today. Though I actually like his changeup 87-90 when he’s throwing 95-98 better than the 91-93 when he was 97-100

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I seriously don't see why

Isn’t the differential the only thing that matters?

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm totally guessing

But I think he’s getting more movement with it #1 (if not by spin, by the fact that it has a couple split seconds to break) and then also it’s not dead in the normal zone of fastballs—-hitters have 90-93 timed in their heads pretty well.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

probably a pretty reasonable guess

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Those reasons both make sense

But I would still rather seen some evidence before I believe that. I’ll see if I can take a look at it.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah

I just like to think that way since that’s what I’ve been thinking all year and then he’s backed it down the past couple of starts and gotten a Insane® number of swinging strikes on it…

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very few, but that's why I'd be comparing intra-pitcher instead of across all pitchers

I can probably find at least 10 pitchers with a change that hits 92 and varying degrees of fastball velocity.

And if not, I can just use lower velocities and extrapolate from the difference.

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah

I wouldn’t be using anyone averaging less than 94 on the fastball though, that’s gonna get past the point where what I’m saying will matter.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

ubaldo

does zumaya throw a change? it wouldn’t matter if they are relievers, right, because i think there would be more relievers. verlander too.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

announcers talking about the ank meltdown

in nats game – showed that graphic about the 10 k games without a walk.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 5:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Ank

I’d like to see Ank as a Loogy and backup outfielder. He’d probably be quite valuable in that role in that he could hit for himself, would probably eat left handers alive, and essentially be a fourth outfielder. The potential for double and triple switches by TLR would almost infinite

Just win

by The Duke on Jun 23, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

i'd love to see it too

but probably somewhere else.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Strasburg

looked pretty good, but has given up 5 line drives in the 5th inning. Lucky only 1 run scored.

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 5:49 PM EDT reply actions  

ynoa finally threw his first pro pitch

only took a couple years. and sano is tearing it up – wonder why we didn’t go after him instead of mateo? i think the money was about the same.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/scouting-the-short-season-leagues/

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:10 PM EDT reply actions  

I think a lot of it has to do with connections

Who we have down there, which Dominican instructors they’re familiar with, etc.

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, i could see that

they all have those reps who are a bit shady too – anyone recall what they are called, these coach/agent types, in spanish?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Extorshionist?

Asshattery: it's an epidemic.
Also, Dave Concepcion.

by RiverRat on Jun 23, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

ha

i can’t come up with the word, but it’s used as commonly in baseball as bodega is used in new york.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

it was one million more than mateo, highest at time

and i believe the a’s set the precedent for signing players like this

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

ynoa

and for an extra mil, i’ll take sano, but like mysterui said above, maybe we didn’t have a chance.

2 nats thrown out at the plate this game, 1-0 royals. but the last guy was safe.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

i was just commenting on a horrible call

as bad as joyce’s – well, actually worse because it could change the outcome.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not really

Butler’s “line drive” was a floater, Guillen’s “line drive” landed 10 feet past the infield. Callapso in the 2nd and the out to end the 5th and DeJesus are the only ones that jump off my head that were really hit hard.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess you're kind of right - he's better than his WHIP for this outing.

Still, I felt that he was giving up more hard-hit balls than in his previous outings. Maybe something to do with his velocity?

blarg

by chalk on Jun 23, 2010 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

asn't there an argument on VEB about Strasburg

comparing him to a SEC pitcher? I seem to remember the commenter was arguing that Strasburg was over rated because this other pitcher had put up similar numbers in a tougher conference

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jebus.

Regression, bitches.

by spants on Jun 23, 2010 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is Sarchasm like sarcasm but really deep?

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

don't be so quick to dismiss man

I feel the birth of a meme relating to peoples inability to filter internet sarcasm

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

which will then fail because it's not obvious enough

/meme-forecast.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

what if it was used descriptively

Wow, really fell into the sarchasm there

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

it could be tried

I just observe the effects.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess I just don't understand why people complain about the hype.

barring injury, or some sort of bizarre Ankiel-like meltdown, he’s going to be f’ing awesome. I don’t see why I shouldn’t be excited by this.

by Willie McGee's Twin on Jun 23, 2010 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

He is amazing and just what that franchise(and MLB) needs

there seems to be a lot of young exciting players entering baseball right now, it could be perception but it seems that 7 of the top 10 pitchers in baseball are 27 or under.

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

It is so good to be a cards fan right now

barring freak injuries or mental meltdowns
- 900+OPS in all three outfield spots(solid to spectacular D)
-1000+ OPS from 1B
-the best defensive catcher in baseball(who is also solid offensively)
-a potential ROY candidate at 3B
-the best super U in baseball
and when healthy the best rotation in MLB

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 7:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

i feel i should say something nice about the rocks now

so, i hope you guys can get and stay healthy. what a run of bad luck with the injuries.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

where do you get that?

i just said they’ve been getting hit by injuries.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

On the pitching side

I will use a Stat that I know you respect. and that without our number 2 starter or closer so far.
The offense is really in flux right now we have four OF with around a .500 slugging average the team would be better if Hawpe went back to 1B like he was in college, and we hadn’t just lost our franchise player for two monthes.

The Cards(and Spants) are coming to Denver right before the ASB we will see how that goes, either this team implodes around the Tulo injury or starts getting it together and playing up to expectation and get a late season lift from Tulo’s return

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah the DLR and Street thing was bad enough

but losing a 900+ OPS SS is a luxury this team does not have. On the silver lining side maybe Chris Nelson pushes barmes to super U

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I get the feeling he's going to be the most frustrating pitcher in baseball when he's 38

He’s going to be throwing 85 but still beating people with sliders/cutters/changeups/and a 66 mph curveball.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jun 23, 2010 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

color me unimpressed

i could do that if i wanted – just give me his height, pitch arsenal, control, and demeanor – then its a piece of cake

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

he seriously looks like a badass on the mound...

sure its helps that he’s King over 9 per inning

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

catcher can't catch, obviously

f’n pudge.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

you put per inning rather than per game

messing with you.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

the pierogi was rehired, so everyone can stop worrying about him, or it

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:28 PM EDT reply actions  

lol

what a overblown mess.

"He’s in his own world out there. He says he doesn’t cuss. I disagree." - Skip Schumaker on Jason Motte
Austin Wilson, please don't be a tease!

by BVHeck on Jun 23, 2010 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Boggs is hilarious

he has the full report on the beards. he says his is because it makes him look like a gentleman.
motte’s apparently changes all the time.
I missed one — “he has a good one, but he just won’t commit”

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:35 PM EDT reply actions  

making fun of Hawksworth's Canadianness.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

that was a classic pre-game.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

he said Hawks came out of the hotel dressed like a Mountie

I am skeptical, but that’s a funny image.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

boggs, the southern gent

totally see that, his family being so prominent in atlanta and all.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

his father has some huge firm in atlanta

they probably have a plantation or something. anyway, some of his detractors from atlanta figure daddy is paying the cards to keep him – some posters on talking chop went to high school with him, and the general population of that site knows of his family, so the clan must be a pretty big deal.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Huh

I guess the fastball he can dial up to 98 has nothing to do with why the Cards are keeping him. Must be the rich daddy.
It’s amazing what kind of crazy logic people will resort to.

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jun 23, 2010 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

moar

great comment on Skip

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 24, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ludwick is apparently cramping up. that's why the sitting out.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:36 PM EDT reply actions  

there's probably a joke there somewhere

if RFL wasn’t beloved.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

dibble talking about strasburg being put on the final five list by the commish

to be voted on by fans to determine the final all-star roster spot.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:40 PM EDT reply actions  

just wondering but uhh...

what would be the appropriate contract given to Jaime Garcia at this point? For the record, I’m talking about a Waino/Longoria type contract where its longer term…

what should be done… a Waino like deal filtered with options or something completely different because of his shoulder injury?

Rasmus can hit lefties
cardinalred
St. Louis Sports blog

by stlcardsfan4 on Jun 23, 2010 6:44 PM EDT reply actions  

yeah, no reason to do that

razzums, otoh…should have done it in the off-season

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

iw ould give him league min for two more years

and then go to arbitration with him

"Moneyball: It's kind of like communism."

by prophetjohn on Jun 23, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

at least the two more years, definitely

then they could see where they’re at – maybe arb, maybe a deal

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

earthquake update

yeah, the SoCal guys were not terribly bothered.
1. the guys on the early bus didn’t feel it… the guys who lingered for the late bus were at the hotel and did
2. Aaron Miles felt it… and was immediately called up by Brendan Ryan.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 6:56 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm in SoCal

There was an earthquake? Miles lives in fucking SoCal?

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

keep up

there was an earthquake in Canada

and yes, Miles lives in the Bay Area. that’s how he got scooped up… right after a series with the Giants.

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Boy that would be awkward

“hey (nicks friend) look it’s that Miles guy who I was telling you is like the worst baseball player in the hisotyr of of the game”

by vivaelpujols on Jun 23, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

you're in LA aren't you?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

miles is from the bay area, so was just curious

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haha

That’s like asking if someone was from STL and saying, “Oh, because he’s from Chicago”

Of all sad words of tongue or pen; the saddest are these: 'It might have been!'

by mysterui on Jun 23, 2010 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, yadi2 said miles from the bay area, and vep said

he might run into him then, and i wondered why – san fran and la don’t lead me to this conclusion.

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

why wasn't miles on the early bus - doesn't he have anything to work on?

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

he is kind of what he is

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

someone has to make sure Boog gets out of bed

Lick that shoulder—you're in the doghouse now.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there..." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jun 23, 2010 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

but it was a really impressive loss

Time is the best teacher; Unfortunately it kills all its students

by TomCat009 on Jun 23, 2010 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

the umpire blew a call at the plate badly

like the usa/slovenia game, which would have given strasburg a no-decision

"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."

by cardball on Jun 23, 2010 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just wanted to drop in and say...

AMERICA! FUCK YEAH!

That goal was like Nick Stavinoha hitting a 2-out, 2-strike, down three runs grand slam in the 9th inning off of 2003-era Eric Gagne to put the Cardinals in the World Series. So improbable. Beat Ghana.

by jd is legend on Jun 23, 2010 9:24 PM EDT reply actions  

two comments:

Salvaged scrap-heapers? How about franklin, pineiro, and lopez to name three players close to our hearts.

Also “summer lies” by the magnetic fields; “summer of the shark” by yo la tengo, neither are great songs, just fine.

"We were men - flesh and blood - and we played baseball in the sunshine. We hit doubles off the wall, slid hard into second base. We had fights, and we made love. We sang songs and prayed on Sundays. . . . We felt pain. And we felt joy. There was a lot wrong with the world. But we weren't sad, man. We had the times of our lives." Buck O'Neil, from "The Soul of Baseball: A Road Trip Through Buck O'Neil's America."

by tom s. on Jun 24, 2010 3:47 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

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