Hot Corner Futures
So apparently this Matt Holliday guy is pretty decent at playing the baseball, huh?
On the list of least expected wins of this year, I would have to put that one right up near the top. For eight full innings, it felt like the Cards were just going to let the game slip away from them, victims again of poor at-bats and bases left full of runners. Oh well, the collective mind of Cardinal fandom said to itself, you can't win them all, I suppose. Hell, the Cubs haven't actually gained a full game on the Cards since late July; that's a pretty good run. Just one of those days when the team didn't quite get it done.
But Matt Holliday was having none of it. Hey there, collective consciousness, he said, that's loser talk! Why, I'm going to hit this Hall of Fame changeup over that center field wall just to prove to you how wrong you are!
And so he did. And there was much rejoicing.
Oh, and I would like to send my thanks to Tony La Russa for sticking to what I like to call the Grand United David Weathers Theory of Baseball. On second thought, I need a better name for it than that. GUDWTB just doesn't really stick in your mind, does it? Someone help me out with a better name.
I'll be honest with you; there really isn't a whole lot else I can say about last night's game. Smoltz looked very, very shaky in the early going but then seemed to get himself back on track; with his ability to get the strikeout, I think he's going to be a very, very useful weapon for the Cards come playoff time, most likely late in the game. I do think we need to change Blake Hawksworth's nickname to the Lucky Charm. Just saying.
Given the fact today's contest is a day game, I'm going to be brief this morning. Or at least try.
The longer the season goes on, the more convinced I become the Cardinals are probably going to resign Matt Holliday. He's been so good, and such an ideal fit, I just can't see the Cards letting him walk. Never mind the PR disaster; the fans will follow as long as the team wins. But more importantly, I think the organisation is still committed to keeping Tony La Russa on board as the manager, and having Holliday in a Redbird uniform for the near future could go a long way toward helping make Tony's decision whether or not to return in 2010 and beyond much easier. Plus, Scott Boras or no, Holliday seems to be honestly enjoying his time here in St. Louis, enough I think he'll accept a fair deal with relatively little fuss. He isn't going to be giving the Cards a discount, by any means, but I also don't think he's going to hold out and try to get Mark Texeira money. (I was getting ready to make a comment about how good our pie is here in flyover country, but then played it back in my head and decided that maybe wasn't the exact best phrasing I could come up with.)No, to me, the more interesting free agent situation of the offseason for the Cardinals is going to be that of their current third baseman, Mark DeRosa. DeRosa is in a rather unusual position going into the offseason, and it will be very interesting indeed to see if he'll get anything approaching the sort of contract most of us assumed he would be due.
The problem, of course, is DeRosa has problems. Specifically, he has a wrist problem and a status problem. The wrist problem revolves around a tendon sheath and will require surgery in the offseason to repair it. The status problem revolves around the letter A.
As a likely Type A free agent this year, DeRosa will cost any team interested in signing him either their first or second-round draft pick in the 2010 draft. In the past, a player with numbers good enough to qualify as a Type A would generally be the sort of player a team would be perfectly willing to part with a draft pick for, but the math of baseball has changed. Teams are valuing their draft picks much, much more highly than in the past, as we saw this past winter. Players like Juan Cruz and Orlando Hudson found themselves on the market much, much later than anticipated, largely due to the Type A status and accompanying draft cost they were carrying around with them. Of course, Dayton Moore then proved not all teams have quite made it on the bandwagon yet; personally, I'm kind of hoping Moore continues making stupid brilliant moves like that and decided to stick it to his team's cross-state rival by trading them Alex Gordon for a bucket of KFC.
If the only issue for DeRosa were his arbitration status, he would likely be just fine. There would be at least one team out there willing to give up an early draft pick for the offensive upgrade he would immediately give them. Unfortunately for Monsieur du fait de Monter, his wrist issues and rather advanced age make him a bit of a risky bet anyway; add in the loss of a valuable draft pick, and I don't think too very many teams are going to be beating down his door, contract in hand.
Keeping all that in mind, I thought I might look at a few of the more likely candidates to fill the Cardinals' impending opening at the hot corner; give us all a bit better idea of just what's out there.
Mark DeRosa
Pros: Power bat, solid on-base skills. (though those have suffered since coming to St. Louis. Consternant!) Is, by all accounts, a good clubhouse guy. (Valuations may vary.) Gives outstanding interviews. Quite handsome. (Seriously, we've all seen his wife -- and no, I'm not posting pictures -- and I have to say, he might be the good-looking one in that marriage. Just saying.) Cool name. Will likely come on a short-term contract, due to factors outlined above.
Cons: See above. (Wrist, age, etc.)
Pros: Has hit for power in the past, decent on-base skills. Solid defender. A source of significant entertainment even when striking out. Scratch that, especially when striking out. Will likely come on a short-term deal, probably one-year.
Cons: Has missed almost the entire season after having left shoulder surgery, so health is a serious concern going forward. (And let's face it, we've seen what happens to St. Louis third basemen after they have shoulder surgery.) Well on the wrong side of 30, so decline is a concern.
Pros: Very good glove. Young. Has a great story as a native St. Louisan. (Again, valuation may vary.) Has shown good power at the minor league level. Walk rates consistently near 10% at most levels. Making league minimum.
Cons: Unproven. May have lingering concerns about health after having ankle surgery. Was less than forthcoming about the injury with the organisation early on. Has few weaknesses as a player, but also has no real outstanding tools.
Pros: Remarkable plate discipline, plus power to all fields. Should hit early and often. Has good hands. Will be very inexpensive, making league minimum as a rookie. Great nickname already, though he apparently doesn't really like being called the Walrus.
Cons: Not actually an option. (Sniff)
Pros: Hits and hits and hits and hits. Has never posted an OPS below .868 at any full-season minor league stop. Hits for both average and power, with a .921 OPS this year in Memphis. Will make league minimum.
Cons: Struggles in the field, often attempting to catch the ball with an oven mitt. Occasionally tries to get traded in mid-inning to avoid playing defense. Once invited Tony La Russa to a party at Michael Vick's house. Wants to pee in your pool. (Note: none of this is true, but I can't think of any other reasons why Craig is so universally ignored in the organisation.)
Pros: Best nickname ever. Tremendous power, plus athleticism. Versatile; can play third, first, and any outfield position. Inexpensive, making league minimum.
Cons: Is a below-average defender at third. Missed almost all season with wrist issues; it will remain a concern until he proves it is not. Probably going to steal your girlfriend. Better fit in the outfield or as a supersub than an everyday third baseman. (Then again, so is DeRosa, so...)
Pros: Best defensive third baseman on the market; barely a step down from Scott Rolen or Ryan Zimmermann. Younger than you think. Numbers have been depressed in Seattle; may be undervalued. Could come on short-term deal to try and reestablish himself. Enjoys free balling. Possibly a good bet to capture a bit of contract-year lightning in a bottle.
Cons: Health is a concern, as Beltre had season-ending shoulder surgery in July. Doesn't really like the walks so much (career .325 OBP). Scott Boras client. Competitiveness has been questioned at times. May have left his free balling days behind.
Pros: Fun to watch. Seriously. Hits for high average and has become a very good on-base player. Versatile, though truly awful in the outfield. Solid-average defender at third, maybe a little better than that. Walk rates have increased steadily.
Cons: Has little (read: no) power. Aging curve is not kind to speed players over 30. Will likely require long-term contract, and at high dollars. Is a fan favorite in Anaheim (as well as a manager favorite), and seems a fair bet to resign with the Angels. Violates rules of scrappiness by being black.
Pros: Very good defender. Local product (Jeff City), nice story. Strong arm, good hands, plus range.
Cons: Has never been much of a hitter, and is in further decline. Chronic back problems have necessitated multiple surgeries. No longer has much power, and has never had much in the way of plate discipline. Over 30 with serious physical issues.
Pros: Would come cheaply on a short-term deal.
Cons: Is fairly awful. And old. And kind of a jackass. And awful.
And that, folks, is just about it. Technically, there are a few others, guys like Craig Counsell and Rich Aurilia and Nomaaaaaahhhhh, but I just can't really see the Cardinals looking at any of those guys too seriously. I suppose Pedro Feliz might be an option, but I'm not feeling it.
So given the options, what would be your choice? Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Beltre if he came on a one-year deal, and I like Chone Figgins a lot. As far as Figgins goes, though, with the Cards needing to find budget space for Hurricane Holliday as well as the impending Albert mega deal, I doubt he's much of an option. Also, as I said above, I just get the feeling he stays in Anaheim. A guy I would very much be interested in is the player Figgins is blocking, Brandon Wood. Wood has destroyed the minors for several years now, but has struggled to make the transition to the big leagues. I think the Angels' handling of Wood has had a hand in his struggles, as he's never been given much of a chance to prove himself, instead filling in at short or third here and there with inconsistent playing time. He may be a bust, but I think it would certainly be worth finding out.
As for the in-house options, I know there is some sentiment to bring back Glaus, but I would vote no. Maybe if DeRosa does in fact go elsewhere Glaus would be worth it on a one-year low guaranteed deal, but shoulders just scare me. I think DeRosa is a better bet to be productive coming off his postseason surgery than Glaus coming off his long year of rehab. Just my opinion, though.
In the end, DeRosa probably represents the best option, especially if offered arbitration and signed for only a single year. Otherwise, I'm comfortable letting David Freese have first crack at the position in spring training, then look for possible solutions as the season goes on if he struggles. Well, technically, I would probably give Allen Craig first crack at it, but that apparently isn't in the organisation's plans. It is kind of nice to see the Cards giving Craig the chance to break Crash Davis' minor league home run record, though; that's the sort of thing we'll all remember forever. What? What the hell is fiction?
Above all, though, please god no more Joe Thurston. This is one case where I absolutely don't care what the numbers say. I can't take another season of watching him play third base for this team.
What say you, mob? (I would say angry mob, but who can be angry after watching the Douche Crew crash and burn?)
The Baron's Playlist for the 9th of September, 2009
"Poke" - Frightened Rabbit
"Holes" - Mercury Rev
"Blake's View" - M. Ward
"Robot Ponies" - Laura Barrett
"He's Simple, He's Dumb, He's the Pilot" - Grandaddy
0 recs |
203 comments
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Comments
10am? am I dreaming
Did the baron actually get a post up by 10 AM????
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 10:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes, the Baron did.
And I pulled myself out of quite a wonderful absinthe-induced feverdream for you people, so thank me.
I cut the sleeves off because it looks awesome. Now get your head in the game!
by the red baron on Sep 9, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
well thank you!
;)
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
thank you kind sir
now back to your feverdream
Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth.
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 9, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Psssh...
It was 11 AM here. Not impressed.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 9, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I often don't get to read RB's posts until the next day....
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 9, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least he spells the same way as you...
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 9, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you'll find it's "spels".
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As for the 3rd base position
I think offering DeRosa arbitration, and trying to sign Glaus to a 1 year “rehab” type deal should be the first steps (if we end up with DeRo via arbitration in addition to resigning Glaus for one year I don’t have a problem with it). Freese and the two left fielders (Mather/Craig) are your internal options but I have to think they will go looking outside as well though probably won’t find anyone else.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 11:05 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Are you that little voice in my head?
That is almost exactly what I was going to say. And I’m pretty sure I took my meds this morning.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 9, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its what Flim said too
for the most part anyway
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why sign Glaus?
Isn’t DeRo and 3 potential youngsters enough?
by sdrone on Sep 9, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yup
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 9, 2009 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes but
if we offer them both contracts we don’t have to play the “wait and see” game, if we end up with both it isn’t a problem to me, or it is really a problem I don’t mind having compared to the one where we don’t get either because we waited too long on Glaus and never offered arbitration or some such nonsense.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you can also
trade glaus or Dero as well…traid bait
Pujols takes out "I" in BIG and "A" in MAC, previously considered to be an unyielding, consonant threat
by DESTROYER on Sep 9, 2009 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Between DeRo and Glaus, take whichever one is cheaper
and then let him duke it out with Freese, Craig, Mather, T. Greene, and whomever else.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Areed....
….although Gordon for a bucket of Extra Crispy would be a great coup, if we cud pull it off…
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 9, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we should offer DeRosa arbitration
If he declines let him walk for the 2 picks. If he accepts ink him to a one year deal. (I think he will decline in this weak 3rd base market). I think we should resign Glaus to a one year deal if he can recover at all during the last month and playoffs. Even for all his time missed he is still a Type A free agent. I would like to ink him to a one year deal than let him walk after 2010 for 2 draft picks.
Beltre seems like a guy that has some upside but he has been quite terrible this year. Maybe a chance of scenery will do him good.
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 9, 2009 11:06 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I also stand by my thoughts
That in no way we can resign Holliday without resigning Pujols at the same time.
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 9, 2009 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it is a requirement
but I do think it needs to be done. Ink Pujols and Holliday both soon after the playoffs are finished and I will be a happy camper till spring training
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Zactly
Holliday is getting >16M, the general consensus is that Pujols would apparently get jealous and hissy if there was a higher salary on the team. Would 5/90 for Holliday and 5/115 for Pujols be too much to ask for? (I know the answer is yes but I live in a fantasy world)
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
5 year contracts outside of Pujols
Scares me. I don’t want a crippling contract
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 9, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's what it's gonna take for Holliday
That’d take him to his age 34 season before you’d expect any massive aging decline for a LFer. He’s trended better in BB-rate, K-rate is down this year. He’s a high BABIP guy, don’t know the real aging curves on that but anecdotally Edmonds took till age 36 to really decline in CF, Manny is still going strong, Bernie Williams fell off age 34 in CF, Larry Walker was good up until the end, Chipper Jones is still good…it seems hitting the ball hard in play ages pretty well.
Not saying it’s ideal to give him 5 years but the next option is probably 4/80 or 3/60somethin. Dude’s been a ~6-8 win player for the past 3 years, gotta give him something.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm digging the two five year deals...
I’d like to see MH signed for a little less, and would give Pujols as many years as we wants </= 10…especially if more years = lower annual salary. If Holliday won’t sign for $18M per or less I hope we let him walk.
"Don't do anything till I get back!" - Jesus to the Cubs
by cardzfanbub on Sep 9, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd rather pay more per year for less years
That way there’s less of a chance of it being an albatross at any point in time.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 9, 2009 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would be thrilled with a deal that is only 5 years in duration for Holliday. Thrilled.
I was under the impression, we’d be talking six or seven, at a minimum.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Sep 9, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I could go to 6
7 is pushing it. He seems to have a skillset that ages fairly gracefully.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 9, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if we get him for less than 6y/$100m, i think it's a triumph.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 9, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that 6Y$85M is definitely possible
I really do. I think he’s happy here and knows that the market has changed since his extension offer last year in Colorado. It would take some doing though, and I don’t think that Mo is really going to be up to it when dealing with Boras. So far, negotiating contracts has not been one of his strong suits.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 9, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would jump at that
that would be a really nice coup, and probably make the Wallace loss a bit more palatable (as it’s not much more than the Rockies offered him last year).
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crippling contract?
You mean like one that pays a struggling, bad-defense, poor-OBP left fielder 18 million for each of the next 5 seasons?
Silly Cubs.
by mojowo11 on Sep 9, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well when one of them is Pujols it's pretty much 4 players
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
when one of those players is an over 8 WAR player, and the other is a 5+WAR player
its ok to do that kind of deal
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pujols is currently worth nearly $40m/yr on his own
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 9, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
a 5 year contract would essentially us
Paying Pujols $27.66M/year 2012 to 2014
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 9, 2009 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Backloaded money on this deal is a sunk cost...
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If We Sign Holliday..
….for 5 years Pujols will NOT get all pissy and want o leave, it will keep him in St. Louis because he knows the combo of him and Holiday and Ludwick (and Skip!), with Carp and Wainy, keeps the Cards in the WS hunt year after year.
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 9, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
shame shame shame
no mention of joe thurston or khalil greene.
It’s incompetent posts like this that give internet commentary a bad name.
by dugmartsch on Sep 9, 2009 11:08 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
he mentioned thurston
by saying, “please no joe thurston”
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, he said "please god no more joe thurston"
It’s important that the big guy know we’re talking to him.
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 9, 2009 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he knows
omniscience, remember?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Add Please No KBot...
:=8/
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 9, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Personally
I wouldn’t mind having Khalil back as a bench bat on the super-cheap, if he’s willing to take that kind of thing.
by mojowo11 on Sep 9, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
are you tring to piss off the bear?
he said please no to joe. if you ask the bear, he’s not going to be that nice about it.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I hate the curse of Scott Rolen.
Now I can’t choose …
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:10 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
WTF
Why is this posted in the AM? I need my RB fix at 3 PM!
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 9, 2009 11:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone else think that APu casually remarked to Mo
“Hey Mo. This one. He’s funny. I like him. Look, he makes Colby smile.” and then the front office proceeded to freak out?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:14 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
"Look, he makes Colby smile..."
LOL.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 9, 2009 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's funny because it's true!
I’ve seen Colby smile once when it didn’t involve a walk-off homer. He spontaneously mentioned DeRosa when asked a general question about the clubhouse.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if Albert starts hugging & tickling Cody, that would be awesome
it’d be even more awesome if he did it to Boog
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it could happen

"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
moot?
http://yourenotagolfer.mlblogs.com/archives/2009/09/tuesday_tidbits_derosa_ludwick.html
Also, John Mozeliak said this afternoon that the club has in fact had some very preliminary discussions with DeRosa’s representation about keeping him beyond this year — though he emphasized not to over-sell those discussions.
“In this specific case,” Mozeliak said, “we do have some dialogue but I want to leave it at that.”
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:19 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That was actually what inspired me to write about third base this morning.
Then, of course, I forgot to actually mention the article in question.
I cut the sleeves off because it looks awesome. Now get your head in the game!
by the red baron on Sep 9, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, in your defense, you were in an absinthe-induced feverdream coma
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If they go past a 2 year deal when with the Type A thing they have ALL the leverage...
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are we sure DeRosa
still qualifies as a Type A? I know he was a Type A at one time, but this list has him as a B. I think that’s where he belongs.
by Toddius on Sep 9, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he's right on the line between A and B
and should come up a bit, since his BA is improving and BA rank is a major factor in 2B/3B/SS rank…
If he IS an A, we have to offer arbitration, since 2 draft picks is worth >> DeRosa would be next year.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 9, 2009 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Vote for the best all time 9
http://mlb.mlb.com/fan_forum/all_time_nine/index.jsp?c_id=stl
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 11:20 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
OT: this picture of Ank is full of grief and poignancy and what might have been
thanks Y2S for the fanpost link a few days ago
I'm going to anticipate Albert being walked if Babe Ruth is hitting behind him -Holliday
by slash2049 on Sep 9, 2009 11:22 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
link fail?
I'm going to anticipate Albert being walked if Babe Ruth is hitting behind him -Holliday
by slash2049 on Sep 9, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I keep going back to that photostream
A lot of those photos are just so striking.
Still only 3 recs! /shameless
(…well mostly I think it’s much more deserving than my scary Fredbird photoshop.)
(I’m also amused that there are none of Colby. He can’t even sell that.)
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's odd in hindsight
There are lots of Ankiel, lots of Ludwick. There are tons of Skip. There are a few with Barton and even one with Thurston who wasn’t even in the system until the offseason. But nothing of Cody. Er, Kobe. I mean, Coltrane? Coxby? Conrad.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well he is associated w/ the ad agency
So presumably these are the guys that sell.
Though you know… there’s no Chris Duncan.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Makes sense
Ankiel was still kinda the hot thing when those were made. And I would have loved for him to repeat his 2008 season. Ah well.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
to be honest, I'm mostly concerned that he's pulled an Edmonds vs. that wall.
Wouldn’t wish that on anybody.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
When did that happen anyway?
I’ve forgotten exactly when that took place.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don't run full speed at the warning track, mattybobo!
May 4.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought it was later than that
He actually had a decent start to the year with the bat, now that I look back at his stats.
Also, he’s been Ted Williams as a pinch hitter, in 20 whole plate appearances. .353/.450/.765.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brief?
Do you own a dictionary? Count me in the offer arbitration to derosa and work out a one year deal with Glaus if his shoulder holds up for september / playoffs. Then see what kind of AAA guys you can fill with the rule 5 draft/ minor league free-agent signings in the off season.
by Evilfrog on Sep 9, 2009 11:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
does height matter?
Is anyone else concerned that DeRosa is just too short for third base? I mean, 6’1" vs. 6’5" doesn’t seem like a huge deal until you’ve seen all those balls fly over his vertical leap…
Is it dumb to want Santa in there because of that?
Freese and Craig and Crede are 2" over, Beltre and Mora are 1" under, Chone is 4" under six feet. Only big Joe Mather is 4" over.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:36 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
oh and *especially* if we keep Holliday. I'm none too impressed by his range.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it matters much
But I will say that Santa Glaus is an enormous human being. He’s just a large piece of man.
by mojowo11 on Sep 9, 2009 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
with large tracts of land?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
huge great ones.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i've noted many times this year during games how many balls Santa would have gotten to
DeRo is nice, but a full time 3rd baseman he is not. i’d much rather have a healthy Glaus over a healthy DeRo. but it looks like once again, i can’t have what i want.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i have heard it said, that although one cannot get what one wants all the time,
if one tries, one might find, that one gets what one needs.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 9, 2009 9:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice Pic
I like LaRussa, not every move, but on the whole I am of the faction that believes a manager plays a critical role in the game, for better or worse, and I appreciate the results. The fact he has been beating the drum for Holliday for quite a piece of time now and then finally gets what he wanted, and the Cards have functioned better since that point compared with the previous half-season, leads to the conclusion, SSS, that he knew what he was talking about in that instance. I was skeptical of trading away our top prospect++, but the immediate dividends seem worthwhile. How in the hell did he know that this 1 guy, who had performed so well at Coors Field, then declined a bit with the A’s, would explode with us? In retrospect, it seems obvious, but realistically, he has Vision – the way Brett Hull saw the total game on the ice. It’s a nice thing to see.
Other mysteries remain. TL
by BKKCard on Sep 9, 2009 11:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I was always beating the
“we don’t need Holliday” drum. We have Ludwick, we have Ankiel, we have an up and coming allstar CF. What do we need Holliday for? Why are we trading away Wallace for Holliday?!?
But then we got him. And I get to watch him play every day. And I understand. He his for power to all fields. He gets infield singles. He steals. He runs the bases well. He plays LF better than Duncan and Ankiel. If Albert makes an out our chances at scoring are not longer over. If Albert is walked he deposits the Hall of Fame change up over the centerfield wall for a Cardinal Victory.
I love me some Holliday. And I was wrong. (but still glad we didn’t traded ludwick.)
by Evilfrog on Sep 9, 2009 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I deeply enjoy Luddy's outfield defense
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
side note in the derosa extension article
Cards plan to go year to year with luddy
Goes against RB’s(?) offseason GM plan of signing him to a 3 year deal….but i actually am ok with going year to year with him….he’s older than your typical arby guy, and has shown time and again that injuries are problematic for him(though not as severe as his minor league record)
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes
I’d like to see Luddy make another All Star Game. Crazy, I know.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think now would be the ideal time to sign him to a longer-term deal
because he’ll be coming off a slight down year. I’m sure we can ink 3 more years for ~$20m, which would represent pretty good value IMO. Beyond that, I’d probably let him walk – like you say he’s been banged up a little and will be probably entering a decline phase after that.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 9, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't a fan of the Ludwick Gambit
And didn’t like to see it go public. Ever since I’ve seen him at the plate, I liked his presence. So we kept Luddy for something we were hyped about and will likely only see as a 3-year A’s trading chip. That over-full outfield of spring-training always seemed like a paper lion deep down inside – now it’s just half-flooded and the potential (this year-end) looks better than ever.
Other mysteries remain. TL
by BKKCard on Sep 9, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understood most of that
somehow
Albert Pujols is ridiculous.
by stlhulsey on Sep 9, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wood
I wonder if Craig would have any interest to the Angels? If Holliday is resigned I don’t see much of a role for Craig, especially if Mather is healthy and can take the 4th OF role for a departed Ankiel.
Otherwise I would think the Cards could fleece the Padres for Kouzmanoff. He is very undervalued there. He is not an all-star but would give pretty good defense and solid offensive value. I think on a team with Albert and Holliday he would be a good role player.
by OCCardsFan on Sep 9, 2009 12:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not so wild about Kouz
or indeed trading for any mid-level 3B. Guys like Beltre, DeRo and Glaus are available without giving up any talent, so I wouldn’t be keen to give up anything much for Kouz.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 9, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like DeRo and Glaus
But I have absolutely no confidence in the Cards medical staff’s ability to evaluate their injuries and the likelihood that they will be able to return to full strength.
by OCCardsFan on Sep 9, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
sad but true.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kouzy's nothing to write home about, nothing at all
no thanks
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Beltre
did not have season-ending shoulder surgery in July. He missed a chunk of time after the surgery but came back (and then missed another chunk of time after taking his nut shot).
by holden on Sep 9, 2009 12:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Were you at the Mars Volta show last night RB?
If so , do they always play such a short set?
Started at 8, no other bands playing before them , I was expecting atleast 2 1/2 hours of Mars Volta goodness. Instead it was only about 1 1/2 (Granted, it was 1 1/2 hours of pure awesomeness)
by dcfcblues on Sep 9, 2009 12:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
1 and a half hours isn't exactly a short set...
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 9, 2009 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It is when you are the only band playing
and a couple of buddies who had seen them live a few times before led me to believe that it would be closer to 3 hours.
by dcfcblues on Sep 9, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, unfortunately I wasn't able to go. Very disappointing.
I cut the sleeves off because it looks awesome. Now get your head in the game!
by the red baron on Sep 10, 2009 7:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Non-Cards
Watching Bumgarner last night I couldn’t help but be confused by the hype machine. Not even the results, he was 86-91 according to PITCHf/x, a usable slurvy sorta thing and a NotAFastball changeup. BA has him touching 97 regularly last year. He’s had a 5.8 K/9 at AA this year, granted he’s 20 but what am I missing here?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 12:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i remember reading something earlier this year
and the writer basically said he thinks bumgarner is hurt and needs to be shut down
sorry, no link, but i’m pretty sure i’m not completely making it up
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No shit.
He was fine, but that was absolutely not what I had read about him. Literally worked around 88 for the entire night, some 10 MPH slower than he was reputed to throw. Command was good, I guess, but he wasn’t getting swings and misses, just a lot of ground balls on a lot of fastballs in the fat.
If he turns into a lefty Joel Pineiro, that’s one thing, but he was billed as a lefty Tim Lincecum.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kevin Goldstein mentioned that
he’d lost some serious velocity and it was a cause for concern. Damaged goods?
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 9, 2009 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's 20.
He need to let his growth plates close and take some junior college classes and steal some beer signs and work in a fast food restaurant.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
OMP
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i hope not
i hate to see young pitchers with promise flop due to injury
i hated mark prior, but it still sucked to see his career derailed
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully it's just fatigue.
He’s pitched almost 150 innings this season.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stats at AA make me think otherwise
Posted 24 K’s in 23 innings in May after being promoted, then a 4.82 K/9 from June onward. Yikes. Do the Giants not pay attention to their pitching prospects? I don’t care what he’s tellin me, if a 20 year old stud who touched 98 is reaching back for 91, he’s getting shut down. Let alone called up to the big leagues.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But they NEED to win that AA Championship!!!!!
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait, he's really getting called up to the majors?
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He pitched last night against the Padres
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, just read that at FanGraphs
That’s ridiculous. In his last two MiL starts he struck out 3 in 14 innings. Why would he get called up?
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Blown away
Even if Allen’s guess that PITCHf/x was slow (which I doubt anyway), he’s still 87-90 reaching back for 92.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"It's professional baseball!"
“It’s the Texas League! It ain’t intramurals!”
/Hawkins’d
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 9, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
While there's a lot of intrigue and upside surrounding 3B,
it seems pretty unlikely that next season will bring anything but DeRo. That’s not terrible- it should guarantee that Ankiel is gone, and it’s something blah and predictable if it comes with some downside and no spectacular upside. I’m a bit scared of what DeRo might cost, and I would really prefer him on a 1-year deal. He’s a nice guy and all, but if the choice is him or Smoltz (or if his salary begins to approach what Pineiro gets) then that choice is too easy. Our pitching has been good, but it’s still injury-prone, and I’d rather keep the $8M in the rotation.
It’s more and more annoying that Craig obviously has no shot at 3B. Naturally, there’s no guarantee that Craig would come up and be any better than Joe Thurston, but until I see some sort of evidence that he’s not worth calling up, I won’t believe it. The org’s resistance to even mention him by name is mind-boggling.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
to be fair
craig was hurt/slumping for the first half of the season…once we go derosa and holliday, calling him up to play everday was not an option…i actually am ok with leaving him down in AAA until the playoffs are over, but after that, he needs to come up for a cup of coffee and be our RH power bat of the bench next season(or, in a worse case scenario, our LF if holiday doesn’t re-sign)
of course he is hurt right now
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
groin i believe
i know he hasn’t played the last few days…and i heard rumor at FR that he would miss the AAA playoffs, though i don’t know if that was fact or speculation
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
pulled a muscle in 3rd to last game IIRC
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 9, 2009 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
just saw on 10@10 that he will be back
also Descalso is heading to Team USA and will miss the playoffs.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 9, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
when descalso was given regular playing time
he played pretty well at memphis…but he didn’t really get regular playing time often…they should have left him at Springfield
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even when he was mediocre during the start of the season, Dunc and Ank were absolutely awful in LF.
Then, predictably, he got hot and has turned in yet another stellar offensive season. Meanwhile, Ank/Dunc remained awful and one of them is just above replacement level while the other doesn’t have a job.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
true
but we both know there is no way he’d get the call and playing time over the two “sons”
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
photo caption made me uncomfortable
They call him Lego. And he will destroy all you hold dear.
Baron; don’t call me dear.
by _pistol_ on Sep 9, 2009 12:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not in public, anyway.
"I’m going to come after you." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 9, 2009 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
okay, I vote for Joe Mather
Joe Mather started the 2007 season with Springfield, but he was called up to Triple-A Memphis long before the Cardinals advanced to the playoffs that year.
So when the rehabbing major leaguer found out he would be spending the 2009 playoffs in Springfield, he decided to buy the entire team T-shirts.
The red shirts have the phrase “Give me that freaking ring” in white letters on the back. Mather handed out the shirts on Friday.
“I think I always wanted somebody to do that for me,” Mather said. "So now that I have the chance, I thought, ‘Why not?’ "
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He's like a taller mark derosa.
With hair.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
get better soon, Joey Bombs
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Someday, I'll have a wife twice as hot as Mrs. Derosa..."

"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he'll probably have two
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm in.
"I’m going to come after you." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 9, 2009 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you think you're better looking than Mrs DeRo?
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha
no. just getting in line.
"I’m going to come after you." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 9, 2009 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Every one loves The Bombs.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm seeing a distinct resemblance to Jim from The Office here
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 10, 2009 1:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cross John Krasinski with... wait for it...
John Bon Jovi, and you get Joe Mather.
I cut the sleeves off because it looks awesome. Now get your head in the game!
by the red baron on Sep 10, 2009 8:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Allen Craig
I am not so sure he’ll continue to be ignored.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on Sep 9, 2009 12:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Sometimes I think that maybe we're just jumping to conspiratorial conclusions.
But then I get a chain letter about water fluoridation turning everyone into mindless Derosa-loving zombies and it all makes sense…
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 9, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How's that for youre post-WAR Cardinals conspiracy
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
put out the milk cartons

"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
allen, is that you?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey, is it still Jaime Garcia Day?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
it is 9/9/9 day
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 9, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, since no one's tried it yet,
how about the Weathers Underground Doctrine?
by splhcb67 on Sep 9, 2009 12:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The Weathers Front
don’t be frontin’.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lineup - I approve of this message
Schumaker, 2b
Rasmus, cf
Pujols, 1b
Holliday, lf
Ludwick, rf
DeRosa, 3B
Molina, c
Ryan, ss
Wainwright, p
by OCCardsFan on Sep 9, 2009 12:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'll still bitch
Would rather have DeRosa and Rasmus switch spots. If Rasmus is in front of Molina he can try to steal to get out of the GIDP situation and it splits up the lefties for the late game hijinks.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm with you, joker
Molina & Rasmus hit and run is a better combination, too, as DeRosa strikes out about one in five PAs.
by random on Sep 9, 2009 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Feast on Soup
today, boys!
Proud sponsor of the Official 2009 StL Cardinal theme song: Reason to Believe
by gocards62 on Sep 9, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Best lineup EVAR!
I am happy in my pants.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 9, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
best comment ever.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's a playoff lineup if i ever saw one.
"F@*& Lidge and the horse he rode in on!"
-Cards Fan in Chitown, via text message shortly after the VEB Get Together Day.
by Tackle Box on Sep 9, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is this an actual lineup or just your prediction?
I thought Colby was supposed to nurse the heal until at least the weekend?
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
actual
The P-D notes that he was day to day and on this day he can play.
by OCCardsFan on Sep 9, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, coolness
Thanks for the info
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Assuming we resign Holliday.....
I’d just offer DeRosa arbitration. I think the plus to signing him early, is that you have some backup should we not be able to bring Holliday back.
I wonder how the MI is going to shake out next year with Skip, Ryan, and Lugo all around?
Matt Holliday. Nuff said.
by SoonerfanTU on Sep 9, 2009 1:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
MIF...
I think similar to how it’s being handled this year. Skip and Lugo platoon at 2B (both pretty much suck vs. same handed throwers), and Lugo spelling Ryan at SS. My question is where does T. Greene fit into this? Backup for injury/flop? I’m coming around to it, but I’m not convinced that Ryan is this good a hitter.
"Don't do anything till I get back!" - Jesus to the Cubs
by cardzfanbub on Sep 9, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Skip and Lugo platoon at 2B (both pretty much suck vs. same handed throwers)
Actually, Lugo has a very, very mild platoon split (career) and basically no platoon split the last couple of years, IIRC. He’s probably (in that case) not the ideal sort of guy you want in a platoon.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Expanding on that
I’d actually start Lugo at SS quite often vs tough righties because Ryan is appalling at hitting RHP (pretty serviceable vs lefties). I guess this would be a better move with someone like Smoltz on the mound (if we re-sign him) as he’s more of a K/flyball guy than someone like Pineiro or Carp (with an extreme groundballer, I’d want Boog at SS regardless, platoon splits be damned).
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd imagine exactly the same
Ryan as the mostly everyday SS with Lugo as backup, Skip starting against every righty and sitting against every lefty with Lugo in his place if possible. Seems to be an effective situation.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ryan needs a backup
You can lose him instantly on almost any of his plays. Or when Albert finally cracks and glares to maim.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the question mark in the MIF is whether Tyler Greene wins a spot
as a super IF sub. both lugo and ryan have some health question marks.
it all depends on how tyler hits in ST, I think. he had a great year in AAA, and really sucked in the major league stints he had. i imagine tony will be watching to see if he’s showing signs of adapting to the ML level or signs of being a AAAA player going forward.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 9, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lugo and TGreene
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 9, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, I'd take Lugo and Greene as MIF subs.
Plus Greene can take some time at 3B depending on how that shakes out.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
one's free and one's making league minimum
pretty good deal
Proud sponsor of the Official 2009 StL Cardinal theme song: Reason to Believe
by gocards62 on Sep 9, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
K-Mac currently brown-nosing Tony
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 1:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
observation: our Christian contingent is huge.
also they all love Mike Matheny.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you elaborate?
Not sure who you mean.
by random on Sep 9, 2009 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
really?
I’ve lost count. Albert, Yadi, Wainwright, K-Mac, Holliday… Jo-El, I think. Not just casually, but guys who mention it regularly.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks, now I'm wondering how that got past me
Need to start thinking more about baseball & less about work, I’d guess.
by random on Sep 9, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I kinda agree with the consensus here on most points
Holliday – try to get him signed. I still think there might be better ways to build the roster but realistically he’s the best player we can get with our budget next year and if it’s something like 5-6 years at $16 or $17m per, it’s probably a reasonable deal.
I’m assuming that’ll leave us somewhere between $10m and $15m left to spend, presuming no major payroll bump (I guess it’s possible they might bump it a bit if we go far in the post-season – a WS appearance is supposed to be worth like $50m to a franchise).
I spend the rest of the money on high-upside slightly-damaged-goods vets – offer DeRo arby, if he accepts, I expect him to be <$8m for the year to play 3B. If not, I let him walk and take whatever picks come our way. Plan B is Glaus on a one-year, incentive laden deal with maybe a base salary of about $5m.
Somewhat departing from the consensus, I’d actually sign Khalil Greene on a one-year deal, possibly a minor league one (though we can always send him to Memphis following any more “health” issues I guess) – I can’t see him getting more than $1m or so anywhere else, and that’s a fair amount to gamble on a guy who could be really good. He’s a backup to a couple of positions and I wonder if staying in the same place might be the best idea for him, in terms of his mental health. Of course, he may just decide to take a break from baseball (not a bad idea) but I’d be happy to give him another chance, at a massive paycut, to work through his problems.
Any cash we’ve got left I spend on trying desperately to get Smoltz to stay. Unless we bump payroll, I can’t see Pineiro being affordable, and I think a healthy Smoltz might even out-perform him next year. I’m hoping he costs about $5m but I guess time will tell; again, we could go all incentive-laden on his ass.
If Smoltz decides to retire, I try to pick up another high-ceiling, slightly risky, short-term comeback guy for the rotation – Penny might be expensive but he’d be high on my list, the other guy I really like is Justin Duchscherer.
So I want Holliday back, Smoltz back, and one of the two vets (cheaply) at 3B. We take the picks for Pineiro, and DeRosa (if he declines arby).
I would also ideally like to add a decent arm to the pen – possibly someone like LaTroy Hawkins, as I think our RHRP is rather weak.
If cash is too tight, probably the first thing I’d do is go cheap on 3B by turning it over to the youngsters (with K Greene as a possible option if he figures things out). I am not prepared to go cheap on the rotation with Garcia and Boggs as 4 & 5, because I feel that leaves us badly exposed in case of any injuries – ideally we turn over one spot to the youngsters and keep a little depth at AAA.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 9, 2009 1:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
+1 on K Greene
When he’s healthy, he’s been useful for the Cards. He’s done everything they’ve asked him to do. If it’s cheap and doable, go ahead and give him a little room to work things out. It’s hypocritical to let Ankiel work out all his issues then cut bait on Khalil.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm betting Khalil retires...
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 9, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope he does whatever's best for his health
The guy needs to buy a convertible and take a road trip.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 9, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
All he needs are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and he's fine?
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 9, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm with gocards62, no KBot
Tyler Greene can do a pretty fair approximation of anything Khalil can at this point. I wish Khalil all the best, but there’s no sense in spending money on something you already have.
I’d love to have Smoltz back, with Jaime being the fifth starter. Let Pineiro and Wellemeyer walk.
Another name for RHRP I’m going to throw out there: Kiko Calero. We all love him, we love his name, and as an injury concern he could be cheap. Hawkins is good too, but could be expensive, esp. since he accumulated saves.
Other than that, I pretty much agree with everything else you said. I’d like to see a bit of a competition for third between whomever we bring back and the Freese/Craig/Greene/Mather crew, with Glaus/DeRo as the obvious favorite.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i agree
t-greene is better than k-greene and he’s cheaper to boot
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's probably reasonable actually
although I would still take a flyer on K Greene if we have to go cheap on 3B (i.e. turn it over to Freese/Craig due to all the $ going on Holliday and pitching) as I think he has more of a bat (even with his struggles) than Tyler’s ever going to have. I see Tyler as a middle infield backup; also, he lets us perhaps use Lugo for some spot starts at 3B (another option no-one’s really noted – Lugo probably has the arm and glove to be at least average there, and he’s still probably somewhere in the ballpark of a league-average hitter; he could be a 2-win 3Bman for free).
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
R.J. Anderson just did a little blurb about Calero at Fangraphs
Could be interesting. That would be a really cool cheap risky pick up for the bullpen.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, that's where I got it from
He’s been on my NL-only fantasy team all year, but I didn’t know he was going to be a FA until this morning.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Another name for RHRP I’m going to throw out there: Kiko Calero. We all love him, we love his name, and as an injury concern he could be cheap. Hawkins is good too, but could be expensive, esp. since he accumulated saves.
I really like this idea. Calero’s been really good last couple of years.
The other guy I like (who I mentioned in a fanpost some time back with some analysis) is Russ Springer. He’s coming off a down year by trad stats (ERA etc) but has actually been very good – lots of Ks, not too many walks, acceptable FIP. He’s very hard on righties and before he left for Oakland (on, I guess, good terms) it was generally accepted that St Louis was his first choice as one of his kids is being treated for some condition (mental, I think?) at one of the medical centres in the area, so he was reluctant to move his family. That being the case, I think we can get him for way less than the $4-5m that was rumoured last year. A 1yr, $2m contract might just do it, and he’d be worth more than that as a ROOGY.
At least with Miller (maybe Reyes) and Springer we have a couple of guys who are REALLY hard on same-handed hitters, so we can make some sort of Frankenstein set-up guy out of them, without having to go spend money on a Hawkins or trade with the WhiteSox for one of their many decent arms.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Like what you said
except maybe for K-bot.
I would also ideally like to add a decent arm to the pen – possibly someone like LaTroy Hawkins, as I think our RHRP is rather weak.
Will AA fireballers to get a look? Do we have to go outside for RHRP?
Proud sponsor of the Official 2009 StL Cardinal theme song: Reason to Believe
by gocards62 on Sep 9, 2009 1:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
reply fail to Felonius
Proud sponsor of the Official 2009 StL Cardinal theme song: Reason to Believe
by gocards62 on Sep 9, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you look outside for RHRP, but ultimately it depends on price.
Nothing more than $1.5 mill.-ish. $2 mill. is an absolute max.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that restricts us a lot
the “known quality” bullpen arms are gonna get $4m at least IMO. The “proven closer” guys probably $6m+.
I’m in agreement, though – $2m or so is a fair price for a RH set-up guy, and I’d be reluctant to spend more than that when we could be throwing that money at Holliday, or into the pot for Albert’s extension (or, ideally, buying out all of Colby’s arbitration and a couple of FA years). It probably restricts us to re-treads and guys like Russ Springer who might take a discount. If Mo’s sufficiently good at identifying cheap talent (the jury’s still out…) I feel we could manage that.
Still, if someone like Calero (who is genuinely good) or, say, Octavio Dotel is available for a bit more (say, $3m) I’d probably make that move. Dotel’s been a bit shaky this year but strikes out a ton and moving to an easier league (and a better flyball pitchers’ park) should help him out.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 10, 2009 5:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, Hello! Didn't see ya there!

Hello Cardinals fans, I’d like to introduce myself. My name is Allen Craig and I’m a member of a team some of you may have heard of on occasion called the Memphis Redbirds.
I was born in 1984 in the town of Mission Viejo, California (that’s out west of the Kansas desert for those unfamiliar). I came to be a member of your beloved franchise in 2006 when I was drafted in the 8th round.
I began my career modestly, as any young rook’ should do. I played in 48 games for the State College Spikes before beginning the 2007 season with the Palm Beach Cardinals. During my two-thirds of a season with Palm Beach, I caused eight (six by official count, but I contest the numbers) pitchers to soil themselves throughout the duration of my 21 home run campaign, as well as squeezing out 3 more in the 7 games I played with Springfield that season.
My trend of mashing the shit out of baseballs continued on through the 2008 campaign and stays true through this 2009 season as well. You will find my line of .322/.374/.557 and 26 Home Runs to be well deserving of a spot on the 2010 St Louis Cardinals.
So, Cardinals fans, when you make your voice heard for the vacancy at third base in the upcoming season, keep this in mind…
When you think about…
Hitting the Shit Out of Baseballs

Catching the Shit Out of Baseballs

…and Running the Shit Out of Basepaths
Think of me, Allen Craig. Ballplayer, Friend, and Defender of the Everyman.

(This advertisement paid for by the Everyman for Allen Craig committee)
by mynameistyler on Sep 9, 2009 1:53 PM EDT reply actions 23 recs
rec'd
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Sep 9, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a serious comment.
"I believe he’s been reincarnated, that he played before, in the twenties and thirties, and he’s back to prove something." - Former teammate Mark McGwire about Albert Pujols
by cardzfan24 on Sep 9, 2009 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
2xSerious +1
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good thing this has a subject line.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 9, 2009 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Never heard of him.
Are you sure you’re not thinking of the comedian Craig Allen?
Just kidding, and rec’d.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 9, 2009 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
brilliant!
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 9, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
plus, he totally looks like Pepper Martin
How can you not love a man with ears like that?
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 9, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i love that more than i probably should
and i’m not afraid to say that
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 9, 2009 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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