The best pitch one can throw
by chuckb on Sep 2, 2009 10:54 PM EDT
517 comments
The Cards’ staff is far and away the league leaders in walks allowed. They’ve only allowed 2.8 BB/9 innings so far this season. The league’s 2nd place team in this category is the Phillies who’ve allowed 3.1 BB/9. League average is 3.5 BB/9. The Cubs’ staff is averaging 3.7 BB/9. The nearly 1 walk per game difference is a big reason why the Cards have a huge lead in the Central right now. I expected, therefore, to look at all NL pitchers and find several Cards among the league leaders in strike % and first strike %.
Using the numbers at baseball-reference, I found that 246 NL pitchers have thrown more than 20 innings so far this season and several of the Cards’ pitchers are, in fact, among the NL leaders in strikes thrown and first pitch strikes.
| Strike % | NL Rank | First strike % | NL Rank | |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Franklin | 68% | 8 | 67% | 8 |
| Pineiro | 67% | 12 | 65% | 13 |
| Carpenter | 66% | 22 | 61% | 51 |
| Thompson | 66% | 27 | 68% | 4 |
| Motte | 65% | 51 | 60% | 81 |
| Miller | 65% | 52 | 61% | 65 |
| Wainwright | 64% | 55 | 63% | 27 |
| Lohse | 63% | 86 | 59% | 92 |
| Hawksworth | 63% | 101 | 56% | 165 |
| Wellemeyer | 62% | 117 | 61% | 53 |
| Reyes | 59% | 218 | 51% | 232 |
| McClellan | 58% | 226 | 57% | 140 |
| Boggs | 58% | 230 | 53% | 210 |
It’s clear that throwing strikes early and often has been probably the main key to Franklin’s and Pineiro’s success this year. Aside from that, we’ve got both Carpenter and Wainwright in the top 10-25% in the league in both categories. Miller’s way up there in throwing strikes and clearly it’s something Boggs needs to work on. I’m impressed that he’s had as much success as he’s had considering his problems throwing strikes – same w/ Reyes, really. Even Lohse is among the top 40% of strike throwers – not bad considering the relatively poor season he’s had.
There’s probably nothing here that’s too surprising but I wanted to see if the numbers would back up what we expected was true. I also wanted to see exactly how high Franklin, Pineiro, and Carpenter were in these categories. The answer: really damned high. Can Franklin and Pineiro, in particular, keep it up? Can they repeat it next year? I have no idea. It’s not an easy skill – being among the league’s best strike throwers. Neither of them have tremendous stuff – as Carp and Wainwright do – so they’re going to have to survive on their strike throwing and a 2-3% dip could have a pretty hefty impact on their overall performance.
Early game today. I’ll be working. Game thread goes up around 1-ish as the Cards go for the sweep!
Notice: I'm an idiot and accidentally pressed publish instead of "schedule to publish" and I can't seem to undo it so I'm interrupting a game thread to publish tomorrow's thread. Have at it! What an idiot!
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Awkward seems like it should be followed by elipses
I can’t recall when I last heard anyone exclaim awkward.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
really?
I read that as more “awk-ward!”
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 8:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't awkward look misspelled?
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's almost like the word personifies the feeling
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 9:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that was a favorite of English teachers
There’d be a big old “AWK” on the margin. It was like they knew I’d written the sentence after 1am.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's a big favorite of all teachers
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's kind of mean
we were all adolescents. don’t tell us we’re awkward!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Haha
“I’m not sure this sentence has correct verb agreement, and are you sure you shouldn’t see a dermatologist for that acne of yours?”
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Also, Sarah wouldn't go to the prom with you in a million years."
by Andyfantastic on Sep 3, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That said
You seem to understand the gist of Holden Caulfield’s struggle with growing up in the context of the society around him. Even though you’re not nearly as cool as Steve Holt.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
/hangs_head
/slow_walk
/Christmas_Time_is_Here
by brackenthebox on Sep 3, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Excellent.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"The genre for the assignment was science fiction, not fantasy"
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No
It just looks awkward
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Way to go, Steve Phillips!
But anyway, it’ll be a while before the game’s over.
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 2, 2009 10:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i thought this was a little odd
but it isn’t a bad thing witha semi blow out game, good read all in all
"Chuck Norris CAN divide by zero"
by elirock83 on Sep 2, 2009 10:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Given that Motte threw 5 SOs Wednesday night
I’m guessing his % was helped a bit.
by JWO on Sep 2, 2009 11:23 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
chuck is the anti red
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 2, 2009 11:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Quit stealing jokes...
Carlos Mencia.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 2, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
people have been stealing my stuff all season long
it’s a freaking epidemic!
how can i steal it if i said it here first?
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 2, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
sorry dude, i didn't see that
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's cool man...
I was just fucking with you.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i will cut you
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
man
shaq’s swing is pathetic
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 2, 2009 11:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It really is.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I finally watched that
pathetic swing, but he did better than I thought he would. I imagine it’s hard to get 7’1" and 350+ lbs to be fluid for a swing.
I found the show entertaining though, shaq is definitely a character (does this mean he should be on USA). oh yeah, and Albert put on a little bit of a show
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
it’s impressive what he can do when he doesn’t have the pressures of the all star game on him
he looked like he was having a hell of a time. huge smile the whole time he was in the box
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, it just means he's welcome there.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
at this rate, we'll start seeing chuck's
Thursday post before RB’s wed post by about march.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 2, 2009 11:56 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
Are we gearing up for the mix tape?
Or are they not going into the clubhouse?
by Ghostrider520 on Sep 2, 2009 11:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think I heard a scrap of Billy Jean
I don’t know if that was a sample before the rap. But I can’t place the rap.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Will I Am did a Billy Jean remix
a couple of years ago on the Thriller re-release.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
LMAO.
Look at the baseball mask above the locker next to Carp.
by Ghostrider520 on Sep 2, 2009 11:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Lugo...?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 2, 2009 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I got nothing on the mix tape, BTW.
Definitely sounded Run DMCish.
by Ghostrider520 on Sep 3, 2009 12:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
yeah, I couldn't pick out a single lyric
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll rewind.
But I got nothing the first time.
by Ghostrider520 on Sep 3, 2009 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if only we could record audio
there are better 80s experts on VEB
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and now that's the cheesiest song I've ever heard.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the hook almost starts like Funky Town, but it's way cheesier than that.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yay, found the first one.
That was playing when Carp was talking.
by Ghostrider520 on Sep 3, 2009 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the rap?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is the first one.
Guns and Cigarettes by Atmosphere.
by Ghostrider520 on Sep 3, 2009 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
nice
I gotta duck out shortly…
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
good luck
we’re all counting on you
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Second one was a newer song
from the Offspring.
by Evilfrog on Sep 3, 2009 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
skip started
with a song from the offspring too. Not sure what it was though.
by Evilfrog on Sep 3, 2009 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wish...
I was a little bit taller. I wish I was a baller. I wish I had a girl I would call her.
by Evilfrog on Sep 3, 2009 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
nice work!
a helluva lot better than my feeble tries
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 7:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Leach confirms
http://twitter.com/MatthewHLeach/status/3726841424
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
a rabbit in a hat with a bat and 6-4 impala
(or something similar to that)
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That song brings back some memories
Am I the only one who spent lots of time watching the JukeBox Network? I looked this song up on YouTube and within a few minutes I was singing along with “I got 5 on it” like an idiot.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
evolution has designed us
to embarrass our future offspring. roll with it.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup
As a young kid I wondered why all these rappers had the exact same parties around their swimming pool and girls with large butts dancing all weird. I mean, are all those girls their girlfriends? And what does “endo” mean? They sure smoke a lot. Etc. There was rock music too (You’re unbelieveable, OOOHHH!) but it seemed like it was mostly rap.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Box ruled
I spent a lot of late nights in 1999/2000 watching that tripe.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone see the new Elias Rankings?
Pineiro isn’t that far away from a Type A free agent. Imagine getting 6 draft picks for (Holliday, Pineiro, and DeRosa)
Quick way to restock the farm system
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 12:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
yes, please.
Actually, we probably ought to keep at least one, but the idea of having four first round picks and three supplemental. . . .
I have to go breathe in a paper bag.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 3, 2009 12:23 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
i would rather have the draft picks
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'll take 4
and keep holliday
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
heck yes
i’d rather have Glaus @$5Mill for one year than DeRo for the same + one or two more years
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
i’m content to let him walk
my only concern would be him accepting arby
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I agree it would be smart to get Glauss on a 1-2 yr contract.
I am not so sure if it is wise to keep Holliday, but given pressure by Pujols and the fan base, it is a safe bet the front office will try.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on Sep 3, 2009 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
with everything they gave up for Lego, they have to keep him
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You guys are crazy
He is going to probably just get stupid money from the Yankee’s
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he's said
he won’t necessarily go where the most money is and that he really wants to sign with the cards
and he’s guaranteed to make less than albert
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only way we resign Holliday is if
We resign Pujols at the same time. I honestly can’t see it happen any other way.
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
If those two guys are willing to do a package-deal type thing I’d be ecstatic.
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Sep 3, 2009 12:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i don't know, it's going to be interesting to say the least
watching this all go down. there’s so many things that could happen. it’s so hard to get a read on Lego. you really can’t tell what he’s thinking & if what he’s saying is crap or not.
i know one thing, if the Yanks open their wallet, no one as walked away from them.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where was it that I heard the Yankees haven't really seemed interested in Holliday yet?
Something about them planning to just hang on to Damon. Of course, if you believe everything that baseball teams say then I’d like to sell you some prime real estate. It’s a bridge located in a nice neighborhood…
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd be SUPER ecstatic
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
in my head
I see the FO going to Albert and saying, we are going to do everything we can to sign Holliday. Now, exactly how much is it going to cost us to have you retire a Cardinal?
I HOPE Moz/DeWitt have an open relationship with the Mang that helps this out.
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Sep 3, 2009 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They have an open relationship.
haha!
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I don't know that kind of open relationship
I want baseball monogamy.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
lol
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In this afternoons, that is, yesterday afternoon
random thread, it was said the Yankees have indicated little interest for Holliday, instead looking to keep Damon. That would seem to, perhaps, make it easier for us to keep him.
by ArkansasTravs on Sep 3, 2009 1:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That would seem perhaps
to be a really bad idea if you’re the Yankees, which means I don’t buy it for a second. I think they’ll go after Jason Bay because he’ll get a shorter deal than Holliday will most likely.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The will be silly
not to have an all LH hitting lineup.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 8:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
they could just sign all the good LH pitchers, ensuring that they never have to face them in a game. I wouldn’t put it past them, they are, in fact, the fucking Yankees!!!!
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the idea was that having Damon on a one-year deal would allow them to develop Austin Jackson
And then he would take over.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno
This is my personal opinion, but I think the only reason Austin Jackson gets as much hype as he does is because he’s a Yankee prospect. If they think that Austin Jackson > Matt Holliday, I simply don’t agree.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Looking at the stats I'm inclined to agree
He really hasn’t hit like a top prospect outside of half a season 2 years ago. He’s young for the leagues but not THAT young.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ding ding ding
Dude, nearly EVERY player who comes up from a big-market club’s minors is “the next big thing.” It is absurd. Joba is amazing, yet they can’t figure out if he’s a 4 inning starter, a set-up guy, a closer-in-training, etc. Now they yank him after 35 pitches, yet a few years ago, Joba was "untouchable.’
Also see Phil Hughes and Ian Kennedy. By many reports, those guys were untouchable prospects too. Think the Yanks wouldn’t like a do-over on a few of the reported possible trades involving any of those dudes?
Same with Lastings Milledge (sp?). Remember how awesome that guy was gonna be and how the Mets wouldn’t move him in a number of deals?
Pretty annoying.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Felix Pie!
But seriously, it would be even worse with the Cubs, but they’ve got a horrible farm system.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jeff Frickin Samardzija
He has 96 with life and absolutely no other redeeming quality as a major league pitcher. He’s been this way the entirety of his career, yet he got all kinds of hype because of the ND thing and Cubs dumbasses.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was gonna say the same thing
Except you got his name wrong. The correct spelling, I believe, is “Samardnijisazxhzhaqpora”
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly...
great examples with Pie and Samab;bvlakajsdbza
It brings up another issue though: In terms of “perceived value” of prospects, aren’t smaller-market teams at an inherent disadvantage? I mean, they can’t really crank up the hype machine like the big boys do, so yeah, everyone sends their scouts and junk, but as a GM, having the Yankees throw HYPED PROSPECT A into a deal has gotta make you feel better than having the Cards throw in Mitchell Boggs or the like, right?
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Austin Jackson's salary < Matt Holliday's salary
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
True
but this is the Yankees. It’d be weird if they were really trying to save money in that way, I would think. I remember lots of people saying they weren’t gonna go for Teixeira because they already got a bargain on Swisher.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think they choose their spots.
After all, they have kept Cano, Hughes, Kennedy, Joba, and they did develop Jeter, Mo, and Posada originally.
I’m not saying we won’t see them spend big again in the future, but they kind of had a spree last year, signing the two biggest FA (CC and Tex), plus Burnett.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Could be
It’s just hard to say with them, because they’re so much better equipped to spend lavishly than everyone else. I thought they had a lot of money coming off the books, but maybe that was 2008-2009 instead of 2009-2010.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, I'm not saying Holliday is in the bag
But let’s not dismiss out of hand, simply because the Yankees have an opening.
They’ll probably drive the price up on us a bit, I think.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, if the yankees indicated interest
in holliday now, it would be tampering, and there would be hand-slapping. They have to wait until the free agent period to express interest.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 3, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just hope we don't end up holding the bag like the Brewers.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Sep 3, 2009 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
I’m sure Brewers fans were saying the same thing last offseason.
by OCCardsFan on Sep 3, 2009 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Holliday is the highest ranked FA in terms of Elias
We can’t get fucked we do the fucking.
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Picturesque description there, Flim
I’m feeling pretty good about this all the way around.
by random on Sep 3, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
whoa, Motte got a K record.
not that I could understand what they said
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:04 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It's Like Gaving Tomorrow Today Last Night!
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 12:12 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Ooops, that would be 'Having'. Darn hooves...
:=8/
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you eat beef?
Drink milk?
Wear leather?
I’m just curious as to the depth of this persona.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
uh, cows wear leather ALL the time
and drink milk when they are cow puppies…
Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth.
by RosevilleRedbird on Sep 3, 2009 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Love The Moo Juice! :=8D
Cows gotta get milked, after all. But I don’t eat beef (well, moostly…), and its tough to find non-leather shows, although they use horse hide as well.
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 7:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
who tipped over the cow & woke him up?
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
anyone smarter or more resourceful than me
that knows how to find most shutouts by a team in a single season?
i tried like hell to figure it out on b-r.com and i just can’t do it
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
awesome
i even tried the almanac, but it was my first time using it
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
me too
:-(
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh shit
Did you know that on September 26, 1908, Ed Reulbach tossed both ends of a doubleheader, earned both victories and became the first and only pitcher to throw two complete game shutouts on the same day.
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i really hope the guys in the truck don't tell AL this
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know...
Ed Reulbach makes Al look like a pussy.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, but AL won't spin it that way
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You should cut Al...
Not me.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have never found anything confirming or deny this.
But there was a story about Satchel Page pitching both games of a DH first one RH and the second LH and won both and at least one was a shutout if not both.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 3, 2009 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
On the baseball almanac
the name of Rip Sewell came up. He developed and used with good effect the “efuesus” pitch. I was actually listening to a Mutual game of the day radio broadcast in 1949 and he was throwing the thing with great success; never saw him though. The link below tells about him the pitchers that also threw it, including some now playing but I’ve never seen one. At least now like Sewell threw it by all reports.
What we need is a good ephsus pitcher like Sewell.
by ridgesee on Sep 3, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't one of the Hernadez brothers throw that pitch a few times in the early aughts?
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Sep 3, 2009 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wiki-p says
that both Livan and El Duque threw the eephus, but I only remember Livan’s & I don’t entirely trust Wiki-p.
by random on Sep 3, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Remember Dave LaRoche's eephus
Called it “LaLob.” Best I remember, though, was Steve Hamilton’s “folly floater.” Hamilton, LaRoche, Spaceman Lee: does it help to be really strange to throw an eephus?
by random on Sep 3, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Max Scherzer's separately-colored eyes...
are creepy as shit. How was I not aware of this?
I would wear some colored contacts.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:29 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Isn't he a Parkway Central Alum?
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on Sep 3, 2009 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ya he was
I was a freshmen at Parkway Central when he was a senior. I got to play catch with him that baseball season. He threw hard back then too.
....my quick smells like french toast...
by mstreeter06 on Sep 3, 2009 4:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I played football with him
before he quit the team to focus on baseball. He wasn’t a very good quarterback…
Albert Pujols is ridiculous.
by stlhulsey on Sep 3, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i dunno
kinda cool
bet the chicks dig it
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would always look at the blue one, I think.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i have two blues eyes
/dooood she’s married! her husband will kill you. dead. with one arm tied behind his back.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now YOU'RE the one who's gonna get cut...
Ha!
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, worse
i’m gonna end up buried in concrete in the foundation of some building
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 1:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably...
Something tells me he can probably deadlift more than Laynce Nix.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's been a hell of a ride VEB
who wants my Xbox?
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 2:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know about that!
He doesn’t lift weights anymore b/c it would be overkill.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In soviet russia, weights lift you!
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's no question
My pickup line to every girl in every bar would be “Look into my eyes and tell me what you see”. Well that or “I’m a big leaguer, let’s just go ahead and skip the particulars.”
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i guess technically
since he’s on the 40-man
but he’s never made his ML debut has he?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
SHERZER!
not scherer
whoops
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Weird. David Bowie has differently colored eyes too.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There are others.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, good ole Byzantine Emperor Anastasius I!
What a guy. I have to admire someone who lowered taxes and could at least keep the Sassanids in check, even though his miaphysite Christology is sort of hard to wrap my head around.
(I love Wikipedia)
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's No Theodosius...;=
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Same Color...
…iris is WAYYYYYY bigger in the one. It’s like “here is your eye, here is your eye on crack”…
:=8/
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, apparently it's disputed
It could just be a permanently dilated pupil that makes it look different. Still, it’s creepy looking.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Max Scherzer is David Bowie!?
And, therefore, The Sovereign?!?
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
!!!
Goold did say he pitched for us without even being on our team.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT...How did Brian Boitano
manage to make money off of South Park making fun of him?
"Obviously, tipping pitches didn't help" - John Smotzl
"If you disrespect the Baseball Gods, you'll get slapped." - TLR
by RiverRat on Sep 3, 2009 12:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Do you know how happy it makes me...
that the Hallmark Channel runs four straight episodes of Cheers at 1:00 am each night?
A little too happy.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:52 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Probably not as happy
as it makes me. I fucking love Cheers. Best show ever.
by cdc81 on Sep 4, 2009 2:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shaq v. Pujols
Probably been written here before, but the video is up on Hulu
http://www.hulu.com/watch/93323/shaq-vs-shaq-vs-albert-pujols
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on Sep 3, 2009 1:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
By the way..
I wonder how fast that guy could throw a baseball. It wouldn’t surprise me if he could hit 90 without trying.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on Sep 3, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
lol
shaq looks so awkward sitting next to mrs. pujols (6:30). Like he’s scared of her.
But this is great:
Albert looks tiny standing next to him.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 3, 2009 2:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was in the upper decks that day
Albert looked like a dwarf. When Shaq puts his hand on his shoulder, I thought he was going to pick him up off the ground.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 7:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anybody want a peanut?
Any idiot would know that.
by Epic on Sep 3, 2009 8:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wanted to get a shaq fat head
to put next to my pujols fat head, but the room isn’t tall enough and my wife won’t let me put them in the living room where the vaulted ceilings are
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did anyone else think of this?
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Albert's shield bears a lambda
For the ’Lou
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, and I'm Thankful...
:=8.
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Random thought I had during Tuesday's game
as I saw Coffee sprint in to take over from Weathers while Fielder looked on from 1B…
Do you suppose they have to be sure those three don’t sit too close together on trips? You know, so as not to unbalance the plane?
by ArkansasTravs on Sep 3, 2009 1:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Submarine Life
On submarines, it is the Chief of the Watch’s responsibility to maintain the trim of the boat. He does this by pumping water in or out of ballast tanks. When someone is learning that job, a group of 20-30 guys (called a trim party) will run to one side of the boat and wait until the COW trims the submarine level, then run to the other side and keep fucking with him until they get bored or some CPO comes aft to break it up.
After a few weeks away from port, something as silly as this starts to look like fun.
Don't argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. - anon.
by Solanus on Sep 4, 2009 9:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stan Verrette on the west side SC just said what we've all known for years
ALBERT PUJOLS IS RIDICULOUS
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Sep 3, 2009 1:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Gotta love the west coast SC...
Stan and Neil bring back old school SC memories. THE best show to wake up to in the morning…
Any idiot would know that.
by Epic on Sep 3, 2009 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the midday SC is actually closer to decent
They actually call the highlights instead of going on rambling tangents.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 8:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chuck...
… i know you didn’t exactly mean it this way, but if you’d set out to write a post titled “In Defense of Dave Duncan” i’m not sure you could have done any better.
by kindred on Sep 3, 2009 3:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
yeah, I'm looking for blog posts stickin' it to the Sauks
Like his brother in chains, John Smoltz, he’s been freed by the burden of pitching for Red Sox Nation. Brad Penny and his 97-mph fastball have returned to the Motherland NL to dominate.
- big league stew
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 7:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Forget "tipping pitches"
By shutting down “mighty” Philly, all this illustrates is the vast, vast, discrepency in talent between the AL and the NL. Your BABIPs and FIPs aren’t going to explain it—you might as well be calculating those stats for Penny in the Taiwan Industrial League versus the majors.
The only prize at the end of the tunnel is getting swept by New York or Boston (Detroit is the NL’s only hope)
by olddomination on Sep 3, 2009 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yep, them's the ones.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please learn math.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sage Steele straightened her hair!
oh … wow. somebody told her to look like Halle.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 9:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
if there are any twits around
Leach has a new tag:
http://twitter.com/search?q=%23FreeAllenCraig
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 9:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Frrreeeedom!
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Sep 3, 2009 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
call Mo
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/83/cardinalsfreeallencraig.jpg
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it took me a while to find him
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I Still Keep Calling Him...
…Craig Allen
:=8/
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's his own fault for having two first names.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm Going With...
…Craigity Craig-Craig from now on…
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don't know MooCow....
that sounds like a dead battery.
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Sep 3, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I Can't use Allen
it makes me think of wrenches and Neil Allen
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Craig-In-All?
He’s like the C.I.A. ….. can’t be seen for fear of Cardinal Nation security risk.
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Sep 3, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Personally...
God bless him, but I never ever want to think of Neil Allen again. Million dollar arm, ten cent head.
by random on Sep 3, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
9 cents too many...
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good one, Moo, and probably more accurate
And I hate the Yankees, perhaps even more than you do.
HATE.THE.YANKEES.
by random on Sep 3, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Random idea:
Was just reading on FanGraphs about Buster Posey finally being called up, and some Giants fans were concerned that putting him behind the dish for the last month of the season was risky for the pitching staff’s performance.
Has anyone seen anything that studies how pitching staffs perform when multiple catchers are used for an extended period of time during the season (injury, trade, promotion/demotion, etc)? I realize that a few seasons like that are not enough to draw a solid conclusion, and there are some other problems (can’t just use backup backstops because they are often paired with certain guys in the rotation), but enough data could shed some light on just how big of an impact catchers have on the pitching staff’s performance.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Sep 3, 2009 10:18 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
any time you step off from a Molina
you’re steppin’ down.
That study may never happen. Some catchers totally control the game, some flash the signs and let the pitchers go. Some find out what the pitches are and let it fly, and some are sitting in on game-planning. So much of it has to do with organizational philosophy and what each catcher’s responsibilities are. IMO it might be possible to get an idea of their contribution to that pitching staff, but it won’t be comparable across all pitching staffs.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Molinas are unique
and Yadi is one-of-a-kind.
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
are you suggesting that some
teams use personal catchers?
"Obviously, tipping pitches didn't help" - John Smotzl
"If you disrespect the Baseball Gods, you'll get slapped." - TLR
by RiverRat on Sep 3, 2009 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Personal catchers? I don't believe they exist
[Jason LaRue jumps out of nowhere and proceeds to maul mattybobo half to death]
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sausages
[race down the track, blocks Stache’s path, and rescue mattybobo]
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
by totalloser on Sep 3, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think a simple fire spurt is gonna take down LaRue
so good luck with that
by brackenthebox on Sep 3, 2009 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What LaRue doesn't know
is that I don’t actually pitch left handed!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also, I'd imagine that LaRue isn't used to fighting just one person
so you’ve got that going for you
by brackenthebox on Sep 3, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone notice the Cardinals are tied with Dodgers?
For best Record in the NL?
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 10:23 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I hadn't
That is cool, Philly is 1 game behind and we are 6.5 games behind the Yanks for best in baseball (tied for 2nd with LAA and LAD)
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 3, 2009 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so it probably didn't matter that the AL won the all star game
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
only if we play the Yankees :)
Personally I would rather have interleague record or overall WP decide home field advantage over the all star game.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
by StLHugo on Sep 3, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cool
Let’s have the best record in the NL!
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
/Buzz Killington
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
meh - not really any meaningful
Difference in outcomes at 26 v. 30. The big difference is for slots in the top 10.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 3, 2009 11:05 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Ya, but the Phillies have us
by one game in the loss column.
"Obviously, tipping pitches didn't help" - John Smotzl
"If you disrespect the Baseball Gods, you'll get slapped." - TLR
by RiverRat on Sep 3, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ONE GAME IN HAND
ONE GAME IN HAND
ONE GAME IN HAND
by mojowo11 on Sep 3, 2009 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn you, loss column
why must you thwart our destiny so?
"Baseball has been good to me since I quit trying to play it." - Whitey Herzog
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Sep 3, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we do end up being the #1 seed in the playoffs
Who would you rather play? Rockies or the Giants?
I am going to go ahead and say the Rockies. The Giants just seem to scare me. Lincecum, Cain, Zito, hell even Penny and Sanchez can just plain shtu down an offense on any given day. The staff for the Rockies really doesn’t seem to scare me.
Man, with this outfield, need to get rid of that Rasmus, no Ankiel, wait no, Rasmus wait...To hell with Ankiel FREE KOBE RAMSIS
by Taskmaster on Sep 3, 2009 10:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
that's the one
sigh.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even though the Giants offense is horrible
I would rather take my chance with the Rockies vs the Giants pitching staff
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
now there's a catcher's duel
Yadi implied that he didn’t want to be in the bullpen when they called up the All-Stars, especially if he knew the pitcher. And he said he knew the pitcher. I have no doubt Yadi and Bengie know each other’s staffs and can dissect them pretty well.
The downside is that Yadi has worse numbers offensively than Bengie when they’re head to head.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
See, I don't know
The Rockies have a very solid staff overall. And Matt Cain’s FIP is only 3.96, which isn’t bad at all. But the Rox top four starters have the following FIP: Jimenez 3.38, Hammel 3.73, de la Rosa 3.93, Marquis 3.98. Then the Giants: Lincecum 2.23, Cain 3.96, Sanchez 4.02, Zito 4.20.
Obviously Lincecum is righteous, and it’s too early to know what Penny would bring. His FIP in the NL based on 8 whole innings is 2.96 but who knows what his true level is right now. Anyway, the Rockies are no slouches and their offense is way better than the Giants.
I still don’t think anybody has a clearly better 1-2-3 than Carp, Wainwright, Piñeiro in the NL.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
with our luck
they’ll go to coors and Kelpie Rummerson will faint from the altitude.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's got the vapors!
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly what I was going to say
I think Ubaldo is just as scary as Lincecum in a short series, Hammel’s FIP on the road is ridiculous, and Marquis has been solid, and we’re leaving out Aaron Cook, who was their ace at the beginning of the season. I’d rather face a team with a horrible offense like the Giants than a team with a good offense like the Rockies.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Either way, its an interesting matchup.
I think WW + Carp > Lincecum + Cain. The Good Pinata and The Good Zito are a toss up. A big game from Pujols or Holliday would likely be enough to outscore the Giants by itself.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Sep 3, 2009 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I suggest we all root for the Braves to overtake both of them for the WC
I think we would dominate, plus I’d have a chance to watch the Cardinals in the postseason!
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this can be a mixed blessing
/boston_transplant_since_2004
by brackenthebox on Sep 3, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the Braves could be surprising
Fangraphs just did a great piece on their pitching. And they can field an offense that does not really have many weak spots even though they don’t really have any overwhelming hitters.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here are the FIP numbers
Vasquez 2.83, Jurrjens 3.75, Lowe 3.73, Hanson 3.98, Kawakami 4.30. The Braves and Rockies seem similar to me. They just seem like they can put a solid team out top to bottom and surprise you. And Vasquez is awesome.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just got Hudson back, too
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Braves might get 75% capacity...
in a home game. Impressive.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Home PLAYOFF game...
Joke fail.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thing is
we’ll struggle to hit Lincecum, but against the Giants’ offence, I really expect Carpenter to go 7 innings or so with barely anyone getting the ball out of the infield. Lincecum’s marginally the better pitcher when they’re both “on” but I think we could get 2 or 3 runs, possibly, which really should be enough against their offence.
TBH, I’m happy with anyone but Philly in the NLDS.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 3, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we play the Giants in the first round
Maybe Lincecum will have jitters for his first playoff start similar to what he experienced starting the ASG
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Roctober scares me
I know it’s irrational, but the Rockies have been unbeatable since the managerial change, and I don’t wanna see them.
by mojowo11 on Sep 3, 2009 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brad Penny pitched 8IP of 5H no Run baseball last night vs the Phillies
Red Sox are oorrly run
by FlimtotheFlam on Sep 3, 2009 10:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah that one made no sense at all
Tazawa has gotten bombed.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I asked my fiance what was up with her team,
oddly enough, she didn’t wanna talk about it.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 3, 2009 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We really should've got Penny :-(
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Sep 3, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It'll be a while before I'm back on the gamethreads
I’m playing golf (in a golf league) during today’s game and will be on vacation Friday-Sunday. The next time I’ll show on a gamethread will be Monday. I start my senior year of HS on Tuesday, so after Monday, I have no idea when I’ll be on the threads (other than weekends).
Go ahead and express your joy or sorrow.
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I can solve
this dilemma and simply ban you now.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That'd be cruel
:’(
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shoot a low score!
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll do my best
I love this team.
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who remembers this game?
April 23, 1999 — Tatis hits two grands slams in a single inning against Chan Ho Park. Jeebus! Courtesy of my Cardinals Daily Calender.
So says, Titus Pullo (formerly The Dude)
by Titus Pullo on Sep 3, 2009 10:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I was 7 then and don't recall
I just remember the piece of history that involved Tatis.
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was a sweet piece of history.
I remember seeing the highlights from it that day.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 3, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Screw you, kid
I was in college.
;-)
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
College?
I was outta college seven years before that. lol
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 3, 2009 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was the coolest.
I think I was a freshman in high school. Just about every conversation that day started with “holy crap, did you see the game last night??? Tatis hit two grand slams. In the same inning! The same inning! Holy crap!”
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait...
Am I old for this site now?
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You and me both
Holy crap. I was out of college, married and expecting my first child.
But yes, I remember it well.
by paposse on Sep 3, 2009 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was just then kicking off the pony league season.
Pony. League.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Sep 3, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Out of college,
well, at least the first two times, already had my first kid who’d already had her sixth birthday.
I do remember the game. Don’t recall why I got to watch it deep in the heart of Texas at the time…
by ArkansasTravs on Sep 3, 2009 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You weren't a senior then?
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
year after I graduated.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Me too
I was 3 weeks away from taking my permit exam
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was always one of the youngins in my class
since I had a late May birthday. I don’t think I was even old enough to get a license until my sophomore exams were over.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Haha I'm older than you
By like two weeks
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bastards
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Look at it this way
they’ll be officially “old” before you.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Sep 3, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your calender is way behind.
It’s September.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this is why I hate memory
I could’ve sworn that was a day game. Guess I’ll have to rely on my other falsified memories.
by brackenthebox on Sep 3, 2009 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I remember it like it was yesterday
high point in a pretty ugly season.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
BJ Rains tweets
that the A in Big Mac Land that was damaged by Lego is being fixed.
Rasmus >>>>> Ankiel
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 10:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
those effers.
well, at least it’ll give them something to aim at.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe they should worry about the pitcher's mound first.
by Andyfantastic on Sep 3, 2009 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
THOSE EFFERS.
luggage them.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The game was fun last night -- I was down the left field line.
1). Colby needs to eat more. He’s still my favorite (and they finally had a t-shirt jersey in my size at the stadium) but he looks soooooo much smaller than earlier in the offseason.
2). Rick Ankiel swings and hopes for the best. Even when he was drawing walks he would swing at some crazy pitch outside the zone. (checks fangraphs) Rick Ankiel swings at pitches outside the zone 8% MORE often than average and makes contact with those pitches 12% LESS than average. I have no desire to see him on the team again next year but unless Jon Jay or Tyler Henley are ready to step up, we’re still going to need a back up CF.
3). Troy Glaus is being paid 2.5M per pitch so far this season.
4). Someone wore a Cubs jersey to a Brewers Cardinals game. I yelled at them. Repeatedly.
5) The choir director for God Bless America had a Larry Walker jersey. I smiled.
6). For some reason, I’ve become a huge Mark DeRosa fan. I can’t explain it but he’s one of my favorite players on the team.
7). I never should have shown my friends the “Fire Burning” Rasmus video. All night at the game, they kept quoting it.
8). I still love Colby.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 11:02 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Also
The softball field formerly known as Lake DeWitt is the biggest POS I’ve ever seen. It’s got a cheap outfield fence and has a completely random feeling seeing it by its lonesome in downtown. It’s a horrible eyesore and the Cardinals should be ashamed of it.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You gotta admit it is a step up from the lake, though.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Put some bass in the lake and you're good to go
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That would be awesome
You could combine tailgating and fishing!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My Pocket Fisherman (TM) is packed and ready
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still don't get it
How is there not someone rich who wants to develop something in the most prime bar/retail area in the entire friggin city.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the mob.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait, so Jimmy Hoffa was buried in Busch II?
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lake DeWitt suddenly filled in by a "parking lot"...
also, see below. Goold’s thinking of you.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
was that gutair playing kid out there after the game?
I guess school has started though
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
1. WASTING AWAY
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ludwick = backup CF
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, but
Luddy has had hamstring injuries and is 31. I’d place him as an emergency CF.
by random on Sep 3, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
Luddy is not that great of a CF, but passable
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't say it was ideal, but it's a possibility
Besides, Rasmus should play 150-160 games a year, starting next year
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
JD, what I'm trying to say is
I don’t think playing Ludwick in CF in other than emergency conditions is a good idea given his age and injury history & the importance of having his bat in the lineup.
Rasmus has had an assortment of injuries himself & hasn’t yet shown he can play in more than 130 games in a year. I’m not saying he’s J.D. Drew, but he’s not Curt Flood, either and I wouldn’t count on him playing 150-160 games. If Rasmus plays in as many as 140 games, leaves around 200 innings for the backup CF, or somewhat more given late game pinch hitting and extra innings. For that reason, I’m w/ azru in thinking someone other than Luddy is needed if Jay or Henley aren’t ready. Nobody’s big on Schumaker’s CF defense, but I suppose he’s an option.
by random on Sep 3, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The game was fun last night
Colby will be good next year. Ank most likely won’t be around, and neither will Glaus. I don’t blame you for yelling at a guy wearing a Cubs jersey to the game. I’d do the exact same thing if I were you. DeRo is awesome, as was Larry Walker. As for the “Fire Burning” vid, I think most of us here at VEB have sadly watched it.
I love this team.
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
2) skip schumaker
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ludwick would be a better option than Skip
and Robinson or Jay would be a better option than both of them. I still think that Allen Craig should be on the roster next year in the Spiezio role: Backup 1B/3B/LF/RF, RH pinch hitter. On days where Colby needs a rest, you just move Ludwick over to CF for a game and stick Craig in RF.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this amuses me
BCB brings you a mix of science and religion.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I like the line about our army of Pujolses
Weren’t they watching Shaq Vs.? We’ve already started cloning the Mang.
Pretty much FML any time Todd Wellemeyer touches a baseball or Joe Thurston runs the bases.
by Cardinals645 on Sep 3, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone seen this rather pathetic attempt to fake a HBP?
Doesn’t look like the ball’s within three inches of his arm, but boy is he in pain….
by BTown Birds fan on Sep 3, 2009 11:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
hey painguy!
Goold is looking out for you! #6
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:14 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
THX
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
sound familiar?
Despite falling to 3-6 overall with a 6.47 ERA,-insisted he felt fine physically.
“Ironically, I felt pretty good out there,” he said. “I’m just struggling to put it all together. That’s the frustrating part. I’m just not quite in the groove I’d like to be.”
….says Dave Bush.
On a totally unrelated note, did Welley really pitch for Memphis and then end the day in the Cards clubhouse? Do I have my days wrong?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:22 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
this is an insane action shot
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
this is also
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's a pretty good picture description for how he plays defense
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's a pretty good microcosm of how he lives his life, really
by mojowo11 on Sep 3, 2009 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
would anyone live his (or her) life like Boog?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This...
article about Hanley Ramirez is the most condescending thing I’ve read in a while. Ramirez has played 158, 154, and 153 games since joining the Fish, and this year he has played 124 of 133 games. What’s the problem? Dan Uggla in that span has actually played one fewer games than Ramirez. Of course, Uggla, being fat and white has a much higher GORP over that time period.
Please take this comment in the spirit it was intended.
by guayzimi on Sep 3, 2009 11:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don't know what the deal is in FLA
but it’s not good for two superstars on that team to be bitching at each other.
I love this team.
by zoomzoomj88 on Sep 3, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Man, that article is sort of dumb isn't it.
I hate the whole “yeah sure he’s talented and plays at an elite level, but does he have the drive to be truly great???” trash that writers keep falling back on. Hanley is already one of the best in baseball. He’s already truly great. I couldn’t read past that part.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I truly think it's a race/culture...
issue.
Young, flashy Dominican gets the monster contract while not “gritting it out” when injured, even though he has played more regularly than his Joe Lunchbucket partner over at 2nd. You can’t let pesky facts get in the way of a narrative that everyone can quickly latch on to.
The media did the same thing with Bolt in the Olympics. Flashy, young black kid runs the greatest race in the history of sprinting, and it’s all about how he could be truly great if he got serious.
Please take this comment in the spirit it was intended.
by guayzimi on Sep 3, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There might be something to that
but then I think of J.D. Drew. I don’t think I have heard a casual fan say anything nice about Drew since his rookie year. It’s always “that guy could be great but he just doesn’t care.” Now Drew has missed a hell of a lot more time due to injuries than Hanley, I’ll grant you that. However, it is hilarious how easily white players get labeled as “hard working blue collar” guys, especially since some Latin players come from economic situations that are almost unthinkable in the United States. Talk about working your way to the top.
Anyway, in general I totally agree with you about race/culture affecting the media’s branding of players. I think Jose Reyes benefited greatly from being Latin during the “most exciting player in baseball” period. I think if he were a black kid he’d be cocky instead of dynamic. I could be wrong about that.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Overestimating
I think Jose Reyes benefited greatly from being Latin during the "most exciting player in baseball" period. I think if he were a black kid he’d be cocky instead of dynamic. I could be wrong about that.
That greatly overestimates the MSM’s being able to differentiate him from a black player like Jimmy Rollins even when his last name is Reyes. My uncle thought Reggie Willits was black until he saw him play on TV.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Reggie Cleveland all stars!
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought Sammy Sosa was just a regular black dude until like 1996...
Of course I was still 9 years old or so.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Funny comment
but I think it’s a legit issue.
We always hear about how African American players aren’t really in MLB in very representative numbers. Then we hear about all the steps MLB takes to remedy this situation (e.g., the RBI program aimed at getting young African American kids interested and involved in baseball).
However, what we really don’t ever hear is how “White” American players aren’t really in the NBA in very representative numbers. Whenever this is brought up, people point to guys like Ginobili, Dirk, and Nash but really, saying these guys “count” as White American players in the NBA is just as closed-minded as saying dark Latin guys should “count” as African American players in MLB.
I look at MLB’s RBI efforts as a proactive move but where’s the outcry about how Whites aren’t represented in the NBA? Where is the NBA’s equivalent of the RBI program?
/end rant
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well...
People look at basketball, and they realize black people are generally much better at it, and they realize nothing is out of whack with the demographics of the NBA. I think the same can be said for the NFL. But with baseball, it’s obvious that black people are perfectly capable of playing the game at a high level, but their community has just lost interest in the game over the past few decades for whatever reason. But the part that annoys me is that whenever the discussion arises, it seems to be swept under the rug that baseball is still the most diverse of the 4 major sports leagues in this country. With the Latin players, black players, and Asian players, none of the other leagues even come close.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the most glaring example that most people have caught on to
is the discussion of athleticism vs. skill. I’ve got to find that commentary… I think it was Leach, talking about someone at the Mothership trying to say something about an all-black outfield and how athletic it would be. He had a word with his editor and it was fixed.
It’s subtle, but that’s among the worst kinds — the ones no one thinks twice about. When that makes it into NFL editorials, there’s something there. These sports all take strength and smarts. All the [insert race here] don’t have a monopoly on either. It also confuses any discussion on culture, and vice versa.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You don't believe that black people hold a virtual monopoly...
as the most physically-gifted basketball players in the world? And the majority of positions on the football field?
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, I did not say that.
It’s the omission of talking about a guy’s skills and smarts because he’s a certain race, and likewise, the omission of talking about a guy’s strength and conditioning because he’s a certain race.
That’s not just a stereotype, that’s ignoring 50% of what makes an athlete great. It’s a tendency that needs to be checked by the media, because it’s 1) just not true, 2) sends a subtle and damaging message to young people.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh okay...
I think we were on the same page then.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you also need to look at the context, which is what any -ism discussion is about
I happen to know there are a lot of incredibly gifted basketball players from Asia.
The context is: do they get the opportunity to play in the NBA?
To make a blanket statement like that is to succumb to those assumptions about race — it’s like saying rich guys are better at diving. It’s a false correlation. It’s ignoring that rich guys can afford scuba gear.
If there’s ignorance or omission of the “scuba gear” — the access to the opportunities, that’s pretty close to messing with the realm of truthiness.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's all kinds of factors that you can throw into the equation...
I’m sure there are some good basketball players in Asia, but to think they don’t have a significant presence in the NBA due to access seems a little naive. White Americans have plenty of access to the NBA, but their numbers in the NBA have dwindled because they simply offer nowhere near the number of elite players as the black community. Are Asians better basketball players than white people? There is no reason to believe that the NBA isn’t representing the best basketball players in the world.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
wow...
That’s precisely what I was talking about.
Until you look up what it takes to actually buy a plane ticket in local prices from any number of Asian countries, I don’t think you’re understanding what I mean by lack of access.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dude...
This is a matter of physical ability. Black people dominate basketball because in many cases, they are more physically-gifted athletes. That is not racism, it is a fact.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow...
That is not racism, it is a fact.
Read The Mismeasure of Man by Stephen J. Gould. It will take you a while (loooong, technical read) but it is a good tool for recognizing how “facts” just as susceptible to racism as plain ol’ opinions.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good lord...
Please enlighten me:
Why are the fastest sprinters in the world black?
Why is the NBA dominated by black people?
Why is the NFL dominated by black people?
This is the highest level of athletic competition in the world. If you don’t believe black athletes hold a physical advantage, then I don’t know what would prove it to you.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I gotta run...
Hopefully I can check in on this later. I’m sure someone will have something to say on this before I can respond.
Suggesting you read that book wasn’t meant to be argumentative or elitist.
I will leave you with a similar “fact:”
Black people are more promiscuous because they have “advantages” in the genital regions.*
*note that I do not actually believe this
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't have a clue what the point of that was
And in any case I’m pretty sure this has gone past the VEB political meter red zone.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The point of it was to
point out the flaw in the “facts” and how people use commonly-held beliefs as “facts” all the time to fit in with their preconceived notions of reality.
Yeah, it certainly turned into something in the “red zone” of political/social commentary, but I’m glad to see hazel and BTown come with the solid points.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone have an explanation
As to why it’s been black guys from various countries around the world who have held the World Record in the 100M dash since (by my count) 1964? Is there really a societal (across multiple countries) reason as to why exclusively black guys have been the fastest individuals in the world for the last 45 years? Not one White, Asian or Latino…that’s a coincidence?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's not a coincidence...
But we’re racist for thinking that way. Shame on us.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There are socio-economic reasons for this.
If you live in a poor African nation, and you have nothing, running is the cheapest hing you could do.
Further, if you’re poor in America, it’s cheap to play basketball compared to other sports.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There hasn't been a single African champion
It’s been USA, Jamaica and Canada. Are white Americans really discouraged economically or culturally from running fast? There’s way more poor white Americans than there are poor black americans.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
those Kenyans never win any running events.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats the only running event now?
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's the only one I was talking about, read my post
In part because it has nothing to do with the poverty in Africa. Nothing.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So the only thing you care about is the 100M?
Thats the only gauge of speed?
I really have no idea what the point of any of this converstaion is, I just wonder why you cherry picked only one event.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why I cherry picked one event
It’s the most prestigious track and field event. Usain Bolt wouldn’t be famous if he shattered the 800M race. An any case, you want me to go and find the 200M record holders? The 200M has had one white record holder since 1960. Black people have utterly dominated the sport of track top to bottom from several different countries. This is undebateable. If you want to argue the semantics of the 100M 200M and 400M and whether they measure speed I don’t even know what to tell you. I don’t know why you are trying to debate that.
Back on topic, saying ‘there are socio-economic factors that affect a specific race’s worldwide ability to run fast in a straight line’ doesn’t make a lick of sense to me. I’m not set in my view here, but no one has made anywhere near a convincing argument that there’s something that happens to black people across several countries that does not happen to say the poor Balkan countries or in white trailer parks across this country.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd argue
the marathon has been more prestigious over the course of history.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 4, 2009 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Alex...
You are missing the point of the whole argument. He brought up the 100M because we were talking about pure speed. Marathon runners don’t make for great football players, but guys that run like the wind usually do.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again what you are arguing is pointless
Why do black people utterly dominate 100M and 200M and 400M races?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 4, 2009 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know?
Why do Asians dominate badmitten?
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 4, 2009 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you just fucking with us at this point?
You must be.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
We’re done if you’re putting that up as a straw man.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 4, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Considering its striking similarity to Luke's "evidence",
perhaps you shouldn’t so quickly label it a straw man.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh boy
Here’s the difference: everyone in the world who is capable of standing up has run. How many people have tried to play badmitten competitively? It’s not even close and if you can’t see that I don’t even know what to tell ya.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 4, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, fine, that was exageration for effect
but I do wonder why the marathon argument is “pointless” but arguing about the 100M is right on point?
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 4, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Indeed, he even cherry-picks his running events.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't even bring up the 100M...
But please continue to act like an asshole about it.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again...
This whole debate was centered around sports like football that emphasize speed. That’s why joker used the 100M and 200M. That is relevant to the argument at hand, the marathon and badminton are not. So who is the one cherry-picking events?
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My problem with the whole argument started with this:
“As to why it’s been black guys from various countries around the world who have held the World Record in the 100M dash since (by my count) 1964? Is there really a societal (across multiple countries) reason as to why exclusively black guys have been the fastest individuals in the world for the last 45 years? Not one White, Asian or Latino…that’s a coincidence?”
Which has nothing to do with football.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 4, 2009 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
First of all...
I didn’t bring up the track thing. But we’re talking about speed, and that is indisputably relevant in regards to football. Outside of sprinting events themselves, no sport in the world requires great speed from so many positions on the field. Not one sport. So doesn’t it stand to reason that if you have a group of people that excel at running fast, they’re going to excel at playing football? Do you realize how many starting cornerbacks in the NFL are white? Zero. You have a handful of slot receivers that are white, but not one of them would be considered the biggest deep threat on his team. Look at the safety position, look at the linebackers, look at the defensive line, especially defensive ends, and they are all predominantly black. The only positions that still have a significant presence of white guys are quarterbacks, offensive line, and kickers/punters. Those require less speed than any position on the field. That is not a coincidence. So yes, the fact that the world’s fastest men have been black as A LOT to do with football.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are insufferable...
I’ve offered more evidence than you’ve even thought about offering. You know and I know who’s playing these sports, that there’s more white kids playing than black kids. You know and I both know who’s excelling. You and I both know that it’s at BEST an even playing field, if not tilted in favor of the white kids. I don’t think you even believe what you’re saying. Turn on your TV tomorrow and watch some college football. Tell me what you see.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do blacks not dominate EVERY sport then?
Swimming, cycling, baseball, wrestling, lifting.
Hell, blacks can’t even quarterback in a sport that they “dominate”. It’s a bullshit stereotype.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay...
They. Do. Not. Play. Those. Sports.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seeing as how it’s Kenyan black people who dominate that too so you’re not exactly making a semblance of counterpoint. But I "cherry picked" sprint events because there’s the least amount of confounding in them because there’s pretty exclusively American, Canadian and Jamaican black sprinters who win. Are you guys really saying there are socio-economic factors that prevent white American and Canadians from running fast? And remember there are way, way more poor white Americans than there are poor black Americans. What is it that is causing poor black people to run fast that doesn’t cause poor white guys to do the same?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 4, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe b/c they don't have
track spikes or tracks in most of Africa?
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you serious?
Dominican kids play baseball with sticks and rolled up socks, and it’s not keeping them out of the major leagues, is it? It doesn’t take spikes and tracks to say, “Hey, this guy can fucking run.”
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That raises an interesting point.
Why do Domincans play so much baseball? There is a financial incentive, of course, but there’s also a cultural basis for playing. Perhaps there are social or cultural reasons for focusing on running in Africa, or sprinting among black people.
Like you said, black men have dominated the 100m dash since the 60s. Perhaps those men inspire other black men to run.
I am not black, or male, or African, or an athlete. But there can be more than one reason to do something, or dedicate our lives to something.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 4, 2009 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We're talking about speed, not endurance...
I’m just having a hard time believing that you guys can’t look at what’s in front of you and see a correlation. Black people make up less than 13% of the population in this country, yet they dominate sports like football, basketball, track, etc. White kids are playing these same sports. Every high school in America has a basketball and football team, and the vast majority of those players are white. But it doesn’t transfer to major college and professional athletics. These kids are playing the SAME sports, the exact same ones. The white kids want to play in college and professionally just as bad as the black kids do.
The reason MLB has programs like RBI is because black people clearly have the ability to play the game, but the numbers are dwindling because fewer and fewer black kids are picking the game up. It’s the same reason soccer, hockey, golf, and tennis are so white. Black kids don’t play those sports. But when you look at the flip side, white kids DO play basketball, and they DO play football, and they DO run track, but the kids that rise above the pack are black in the vast majority of instances. I just don’t see how that can be played off as being due to societal factors. White kids aren’t putting less effort into athletics because they know they can fall back on education. That is just not true. There are millions of white kids in this country that want nothing more than to play football or basketball at the college level. I just don’t see the missing link.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Luke, you aren't showing any evidence for your point.
You’re showing a correlation in two sports (Basketball and football) and you’re saying that means blacks are more athletic. This is not enough evidence to form a conclusion, but you’ve also neglected to notice that whites form the bulk of the players of every other sport. Because blacks don’t have fields or equipment for most sports, the entire black population is concentrated into two sports. More importantly, their circumstances often see them setting goals like pro basketball player or famous rapper rather than doctor or lawyer.
You don’t care to dispute the correlation between whiteness and a medical or law degree. How is that correlation any less salient than the correlation between blacks and basketball/football?
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As you pointed out...
And I agreed with, blacks are at a disadvantage in matters of educational and economic opportunity. There’s no denying that, and in turn, white people have a built in societal advantage when it comes to obtaining high level degrees in law, medicine, etc. I have never once disagreed with that. But you’re comparing apples and oranges.
Because when you look at athletics, unlike with the educational advantages white people have, black people do not have an advantage at the start based on external societal factors. That’s my entire point. White kids play basketball, and white kids play football. For every black football or basketball player in an American high school, there are (conservatively) twice as many white kids playing the same sports. But who are the kids that are playing major college basketball? Major college football? The NBA and NFL? And the reason I chose the sports I chose is because those are the only sports that the overwhelming majority of black kids play.
So what is it? Like I said, the excuse that white kids can fall back on education and opportunity is utter bullshit. There are millions of white kids that would give ANYTHING to play football or basketball in college or professionally, and they aren’t giving up because they know they can have a good life with a regular career regardless of sports. Most of them just can’t keep up at that high a level. Black kids aren’t outworking white kids on the field and in the weight room because they need it more.
When it comes to external factors, you are comparing something with an uneven playing field to something with an even playing field. That’s why it’s not even close to being the same thing.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also...
I realize black kids are playing mostly basketball and football because of opportunity. That’s fine, and I’m not debating that either. But you can not explain away the fact that there are substantially more white kids playing the same sports, often with better access to equipment, coaching etc., and the black kids are STILL the ones that excel. Again, the idea that black kids are working harder athletically because they need to succeed more than the white kids is utterly ridiculous.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Evidence.
You continue to fail to present any actual evidence to support your points, while you ignore contrary evidence as “comparing apples to oranges”.
Please address the following points:
1. Blacks excel in some sports in large proportions, yet they are completely absent in others. Why is this the case if they are genetically more athletic?
2. Educational opportunity is inversely related with athletic ambition. Middle and upper class families of any race produce a smaller proportion of professional athletes than working class families- why is this the case?
3. Your argument- blacks comprise most of the professional basketball/football population is a correlation that is exactly related to the opposite racial composition of the population of doctors and lawyers. How, by your logic, does this not mean that blacks are genetically less intelligent than whites?
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Holy fucking shit...
1) Black people generally DO NOT PLAY OTHER SPORTS. That is the entire point of the RBI program (which was the original source of this debate), to stimulate baseball in the inner city. Black people used to have a substantial presence in baseball and they were very good at it. Like you’ve pointed out, they don’t play other sports because of opportunity, but that doesn’t mean they wouldn’t be very good. They’re good at every sport they have a significant presence in. How do you not understand that?
2) Middle and upper class families are generally WHITE. Are we supposed to ignore that? Am I also supposed to ignore that these white kids are competing against the black kids in high schools all across America? Am I then supposed to ignore that the black kids are receiving the college scholarships to play these sports, even when they’re usually more high-risk academically? Maybe because they’re better than the white kids? Do you really think college coaches are in the business of NOT recruiting the best players?
3) For the 15th time, black people are at at economic and educational DISADVANTAGE, so there is a factor preventing them from obtaining high level degrees at the same rate as white people. White people ARE NOT an at societal disadvantage that prevents them from competing with black people athletically, so there is no excuse. What is so hard about that?
You are not even paying attention to what I am saying.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Luke, Blacks also fail to graduate high school at much higher rates than whites,
and the proportion of college and advanced degrees earned by blacks is much lower than the proportion of blacks to whites in society. By your monstrously bad logic, whites are smarter than blacks.
You’re failing to account for the fact that they’re two sides of the same coin. Less education, less opportunity, more sports.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So education opportunity is holding black people back...
True. So there is a factor holding black people back from obtaining high degrees. What is holding white people back from the NBA and NFL? Because black people are better at sports because they aren’t focusing as much on education? What? How is my logic flawed compared to that? In case you didn’t know, almost every NFL and NBA player was at one time enrolled a university. They all graduated high school.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your logic is abominable.
Please take a cursory glance at HS graduation rates for blacks, percentage of the black population that earn 4-year degrees, and average household income. Poverty affects education by reducing property taxes and lowering school funding.
And as for the point about star athletes graduating high school, star athletes get noticed in school, get more attention from coaches (who need them to succeed) and teachers (who receive pressure from the administration), and their classmates are much more likely to fall through the cracks. And considering the standardized testing scores, many of them should not be attending universities- they are for reasons that cannot not accurately be labeled “scholarship”.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was not debating education opportunity for blacks...
I was agreeing with that.
I am asking you what is holding white people back from the same athletic opportunities?
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whites live in the suburbs,
and can afford to play sports like tennis, baseball, golf, where their numbers are just happen to be much higher. And they go to college and graduate in much higher numbers as well.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Every suburban high school in America...
has football and basketball teams full of white kids. Very few turn into D-1 players, much less professional players. But that’s because they play tennis and golf.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But I'm done discussing this...
It boggles my mind that anyone can watch the NBA and NFL, and come to the conclusion that the predominant presence of black players is due more to societal factors than athletic ability.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're taking biased observation and conventional wisdom,
to a moronic conclusion.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe I'll one day be as intelligent as you...
But until then, don’t fall off your high horse tough guy.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're the one that said you were done discussing this.
But, of course not being racist and falling for confirmation biases is something only the self-righteous are capable of.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm exposed now!
I am a hate-spewing racist because when I watch professional football and basketball, I think maybe, just maybe, black guys are generally superior athletes.
But now I’m inspired. I too can cover Randy Moss!
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're the one that's resorted to one-liners.
You have not shown any evidence. Please read a bit about correlation, look into the socioeconomic evidence, notice the concentration in two sports and complete absence in almost all others.
And quit being a whining douche.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes...
Right after you’re fancy one-liner about my “moronic conclusion”.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You posted the obligatory, trollish "I'm done with this argument"
and then I pointed out that your conclusion was moronic. Not the other way around.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
check it out:
http://www.eugenics.net/papers/jprnr.html
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please explain the reason you posted a link,
to some poorly-researched tripe from the national review, republished on a a website called EUGENICS.NET, a bastion of such espousers of pseudoscientific racism as Glayde Whitney.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I Posted it..
…because I thought it was interesting. but honestly, I don’t know enough about the subject to make a value judgment either way.
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I stopped reading at this sentence:
In contrast, the evolutionary biologists with whom I have discussed his work tend to see him as a man whose ideas are so confused as to be hardly worth bothering with….
I’m a practicing evolutionary biologist, and this statement is not even remotely accurate with regard to the general view of Gould in the field. There are certainly a lot of people who disagree with various theories of his, but the idea that he was “a man whose ideas are so confused as to be hardly worth bothering with” could hardly be further from the truth. Didn’t give me a whole lot of confidence in the rest of what that author had to say.
by BTown Birds fan on Sep 3, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Navigate onto the main page,
and you can actually see that Rushton is probably the most reputable writer on there. Ugh.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
too bad you guys got all whiny and defensive about this
there was a good discussion going on
there’s definitely no logical conclusion to be made from the evidence we have. but the evidence also shouldn’t be outright dismissed. it’s unfortunate that the topic is so un-pc and sensitive. it’s interesting
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
reply fail
this was supposed to be in response to the athletic ability with regards to race debate
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was interesting when it was about newscaster stereotypes,
but when people say things like,
People look at basketball, and they realize black people are generally much better at it, and they realize nothing is out of whack with the demographics of the NBA. I think the same can be said for the NFL.
They should expect to be called out on logical and evidence-based grounds. The fact that two different people have now called me a whiner because I refuse to accept that correlation does not imply causation, has perhaps made me a bit over-sensitive.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 4, 2009 9:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm getting out of the tiny sidebar
This is a reply to AlxFritz “My problem with the whole argument started with this:”
Speed has a ton to do with football, and we’re basically saying that for whatever reason black guys seem to be faster than white guys at least at the top end of the gene pools. The sprint events are relevant in that it is IMO the purest measure of speed, and additionally they’re also the type of speed that is applicable to Football (fast short distances…40-yard times) as opposed to marathon running. It’s undeniable that black guys have been the fastest people in the world in track and field sprint events, and no one has put forth, or even attempted a real argument as to why that’s the result of socio-economic factors.
If you want to do it pure football, the fastest 10 times (at least) in 40-yard at the 2009 combine were by black guys. Black guys are objectively faster—-which has a lot to do with football—-the only counterpoint to be made is that it’s a result of socio-economic factors, which as I said I just can’t see. White guys try at these sports too.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 4, 2009 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we're wasting our breath...
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I honestly don't know...
why are most american soccer players, which require very similar skill sets, white?
There are probably a variety of reasons. Just saying “race A” is more athletic than “race b” seems rather simplistic to me.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 4, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We're going in circles...
Very few black kids play soccer, less than even baseball.
If I’m not mistaken, some of the world’s best players in Europe are black.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A little off point...
But the funny thing about this debate? Basketball, football, sprinting, etc. all used to be dominated (obviously) by white people before blacks were allowed to participate. So what happened? Did all the white people quit and just give those sports up because they decided they’d rather be doctors or lawyers? Give me a fucking break.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 4, 2009 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It seems simplistic yeah but what other option is there?
I can come up with good reasons why there aren’t black guys in American soccer, it’s a cultural thing. Not many black guys play soccer. I don’t know about you, but playing soccer when I was young I might as well have been in rural Utah judging by the demographics of the teams. (And even then, arguably the US national team’s two most athletic players are probably Davies and Altidore though I could be wrong about that.) I just can’t come up with any reason as to why black people are faster.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 4, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Although i agree with much of what you said
I simply don’t buy this:
People look at basketball, and they realize black people are generally much better at it
MAYBE that’s the perception, but to say that people “realize black people are better” at basketball is misguided, grossly oversimplified, and just wrong.
Go to any random pick-up game at a Y, a rec center, park, etc. Just average people playing a pick-up game of basketball. Now depending on where you live, you’re likely to see any variety of “colors” playing ball.
For illustration though, say you see a pick-up game of all white guys. Hell, maybe you’re playing in it. Now, toss one black guy into the game. In terms of “skill,” this new guy is just as good/bad/uncoordinated/experienced as everyone who’s already on the court. Now, see how the white guys react, particularly the white guy guarding/being guarded by the new black dude.
This is where you can see your comment about people realizing that black people are better at basketball in action. Unfortunately, it’s that sort of thinking that gets us to “realize nothing is out of whack with the demographics of the NBA.” People simply assume that all black people are skilled at basketball and pretty much discount the possibility that some white kid would ever be able to be as successful in this sport as his black peer.
And if this is the way the world’s supposed to be well, why should anyone bother trying to address this discrepancy? The white kids will go and play their baseball and wrestle and golf and hockey and the black kids will stick to the basketball and football.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Luke
I also meant to say that I totally agree with you about MLB not getting enough credit for being the most diverse and integrated sport. Everyone’s always quick to throw Selig and MLB under the bus but on this front the sport does a decent job.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know, man...
It’s really hard to look at the make-up of major Division 1 basketball programs and the NBA, and then think that white people are just being unfairly perceived as lesser basketball players. There are plenty of very good white basketball players, but the vast majority of ELITE players that even sniff the NBA are black.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry
Maybe it wasn’t clear. I think your statement was “wrong” in that it is problematic…not necessarily that the perception you described isn’t the case. I just think it oversimplifies things and is too broad.
I happen to think saying so-and-so are better at whatever is cognitively lazy but that’s not to say this type of mindset isn’t prevalent.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Luke,
by your logic, whites are the smartest race because they graduate high school and college at higher rates than blacks. You’re entirely missing the systemic causes behind things like the racial composition of the NBA. The reason blacks play basketball is because the vast majority of them live in cities where they are in walking distance of a court but couldn’t get to a baseball diamond without a lot of effort. They also don’t play crickett- are you going to attribute a racial cause to that discrepancy as well?
Your logic is simply bad. The fact is, thanks to property taxes, cocaine, law enforcement, and racism, blacks proportionately more often attend shit schools, live in shit neighborhoods, and have shit for opportunities. No fucking wonder they play more basketball.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 3, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I used to play pick up games at the Y on a regular basis
I didn’t change how I played depending on who I was guarding, but I can tell you there is a different level of quickness and athleticism that wasn’t just my perception.
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It doesn't affect me either
but I see it in the other guys who played with me regularly.
I organized this Sunday morning pick-up basketball league while I was in grad school. It was a bunch of grad and med students (mostly white and/or middle-eastern dudes), all mid-late 20s. No one was particularly skilled but we played and were competitive with one another and had a good time with it.
However, anytime some random guy would call “next” it totally seemed to matter what color he was. If it was a black dude, no matter how good/bad “he” actually was, it was like everyone expected “him” to be nasty. Guys tended to be less aggressive with him, tended to constantly pass to him and look for him to take the shot.
I’ve lived a few places and have played pick-up in a bunch of different environments. Seems like this thing happens A LOT and like you, I never really let it alter what I did but I certainly saw a difference in others.
(oh and to your point about the “quickness and athleticism” I would just explain that away by saying that we were a bunch of mid-late 20-something, out of shape grad students vs. 18-20 y/o kids who get to workout a lot)
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was an 18-20 y/o who worked out a lot
depressing now that I think about what I’ve become. but I’ve worked out 3 days in a row now, which is a post 2009 record I think.
by STLRegalia on Sep 3, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well done...
I need to get back into working out.
I was playing ball 3 days a week over the summer, but now I’m teaching effing classes when they play, so I have to wait until Spring semester to get back into regular hoops.
by goodymobb on Sep 3, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lindsey Hunter
sounds like it should be Rachel Hunter’s supermodel sister, and then you realize he’s a black NBA point guard.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lindsey Graham would be Heather Graham's sister
Heh.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ashley Lelie All Stars!
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
But at the same time it’s probably preconceived from Hanley’s legitimately lazy fielding in his early days. When a guy with his tools is airmailing 1st base because he’s slinging it flatfooted, it’s going to leave a mark.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno
Would you ever hear any teammate say anything like that about Pujols? I mean, ever? Albert played hurt more times than I can count, is a clubhouse leader, leads by example most of the time, and would be out there every day on half a leg if Tony would let him.
Do I think it’s unfair to label him “soft” or “not team oriented”? Yes.
Do I think that they might have a point? Yes, I do, but this is a poorly worded complaint.
Uggla has played nearly as many games as Hanley over the past three seasons, that’s true, but I think there may be something to his complaints about Ramirez. He may not show up on time, take enough ground balls before games, attend video sessions or scouting reports, we just don’t know. I would venture to say that if there’s a bunch of guys on that team upset about his work ethic then there’s probably something to that. I think the article’s premise is interesting, but it’s poorly executed, imo.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess...
the nub of the issue is this: can a player be lazy, miss too many games, and have a great pool of untapped potential when 1) he plays 150+ games a year and B) he has a higher WAR than Albert Pujols. I don’t think that’s possible.
I don’t blame Dan Uggla for being jealous or resentful. That’s normal teammate stuff. The problem here is with the writer.
Please take this comment in the spirit it was intended.
by guayzimi on Sep 3, 2009 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He is a Rally-Killer Though....
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's No Willie Keeler...
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
I would love to have that lazy, 95% of games-playing, heavy-hitting SS on my team.
"But as the leadoff guy that inning, my job is to get on base and let guys drive me in." - Albert Pujols 8/20/09, base-clogger.
by lightbulb on Sep 3, 2009 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Somebody figure out what kind of pie he likes
Then we’ll manufacture a fake “get rid of Hanley Ramirez” movement in Florida. Cross your fingers people, we can do this.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
read moar fanshots
http://www.vivaelbirdos.com/fanshots
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 11:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
But not on Sundays.
They’re not open on Sundays.
/too obtuse a reference?
by splhcb67 on Sep 3, 2009 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Goedekers's Superstore
The highest technology—at the lowest price!
Please visit us everyday but Sunday, the Lord’s day.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I played softball
against his daughter. He was the coach. He kept yelling at me – and about me to his players – from the dugout. The man is crazy intense.
He didn’t get into my head at all, but I was so pissed that he was trying to that I almost single-handedly kicked his team’s ass.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope you didn't play on Sundays.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was CYC, so I think we played Saturdays.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Sep 3, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How the hell are the Twins gonna play in an outdoor stadium?
I know baseball is a game made for the outdoors, but it seems to me cities like Minneapolis/ St Paul need a roof, perferably retractable, over their field.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on Sep 3, 2009 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
heated grass
For 6. I stopped by Twinkie Town to find out. They seem excited, so…
The heating effect of being in the middle of Minneapolis may play a factor. To be honest, I think their main concern should be summer tornadoes more than snow. If the grass is heated and the drainage is good, it won’t be snow or ice to be concerned about, but how warm the players and crowd can stay.
They could also do what Cleveland does, which is request scheduling for earlier games along the west coast. The further post-season gets pushed, though, the more iffy that will be re: October.
I’m still concerned. If we lose Wainwright for a year because of frostbite, for instance, that will be nigh unforgivable. Just sayin’.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, okay. maybe not a whole year.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You'd be excited to
if you finally got to watch a home game outside of the Metrodome. Great place for football, terrible for baseball.
Still, the fact that they didn’t put a retractable roof in really doesn’t make any sense. It gets witch-tit cold up there by the end of September (take it from a Vikings fan that has tailgated for a Monday Night game the first week of October) and with the World Series starting the last two weeks of October it will be a horrible environment for postseason play, should they get that far in the near future.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
On the other hand, it will practically guarantee home-field advantage. Minnesota fans have specialized winter gear for such occasions. And I take it from wiki they are planning to build warming shelters.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is it me or am I the only one who's TOTALLY into the Colby Fire Burning video?
I can’t stop watching it.
Is that wrong?
Well, I'm from Texas and my mama taught me to not piss all over myself.
by thepainguy on Sep 3, 2009 11:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That depends on why you're watching it.
I never would slip you Mickey! It is merely rhinoceros horn. This makes the champagna bubble.
by The Continental on Sep 3, 2009 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm going to say that it's wrong regardless
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's ok to have these urges
Just don’t park outside her house.
by sdrone on Sep 3, 2009 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your daughter will be her age shortly...
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
8 year olds Dude.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
it is hard to stop watching a trainwreck like that.
In related news:
- William Hung has sold more than 1,000,000 records.
- Kevin Federline still has paparazzi following him.
- Lindsey Lohan reportedly getting $900,000 to pose for Playboy.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lindsey Lohan?
attsa lotta udder action…
:=8/
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Those crazy gingers
/needless perpetuation of silly memes
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Go Cards...
But on another note…
This is the description of a fan shot…
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
My polarizing "fan post " does not fit that description. Also I do apologize for the jealous bitch line that was a little much. I should have found a more politically correct way to express that emotion.
I take offense to someone calling it PD quality. First of all it was spelled correctly and well written no matter what some may think.
Second of all I think that it is pretty weak that it was locked down and shut down. There were posters that liked and enjoyed what I said. In the end this sport is all about entertainment value and I provided that and stand behind what I said in the post.
Finally, again I think it was weak that it was shut down just because a few felt a need to bash away and cry that it was a waste of space just because it was not their cup of tea.
I think this sets a precedent that anytime you see a fanpost you don’t like all you have to do is start a flame war and it will get taken down.
I conceded it was a little rich and some of my language (jealous bitch) was over the top but it was not a fanshot.
Do as you will with my comments.
I won’t bring it up again unless someone cares to discuss it with me without lashing out with baseless insults.
Holliday.
Uh huh, oh yeah.
Holliday.
He will be so nice.
by Red Blazer on Sep 3, 2009 12:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The problem was that
it was nothing more than a comment which should have been put into one of the numerous threads already about the Dunc situation. It was just you (oddly worded) opinion of the situation. A comment, if you will.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is pretty funny...
According to studies, Dan McLaughlin needs to shut up for once.
Only Vin Scully talks more, and he doesn’t have a partner.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was not meant as a reply...
Goddamnit.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it worked better that way.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Response:
1) It would have been better off as a comment.
2) The mob mentality of ganging up on posters when people don’t agree isn’t right and it needs to be addressed when it happens. People also need to not intentionally bait others with phrases like “jealous bitch”.
3) There’s no precedent and if people consistently start flamewars they’ll be handled. Likewise, if there’s a consistent lack of quality to fanposts, they’ll be removed.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Sep 3, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I already apologized for the jealous bitch line. I realize I went to far and was a bit of a tool with that line.
But a fanpost is a fan who is posting . Why should we judge his thoughts on the team he loves? I crossed the line a bit but not much.
Holliday.
Uh huh, oh yeah.
Holliday.
He will be so nice.
by Red Blazer on Sep 3, 2009 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you know that most people here like stats in their fanposts
and that you were starting something with your wording. it’s fine that you have a lot of respect for Dave Duncan, but the situation is pretty strange right now with him. I’d like to see him stay, but change is a consistent in life, and it would be his choice to go (which seems to be based on his son getting traded for a player that has helped us much more than Chris has this season)
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know what you mean...
I should start every post with pie divided by three squared and I would be a rock star if it equated to cardinal success.
Holliday.
Uh huh, oh yeah.
Holliday.
He will be so nice.
by Red Blazer on Sep 3, 2009 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
uh, yeah, ok
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 4, 2009 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone know if fangraphs wOBA is park adjusted?
I’m having a hard time figuring out how Pujols can be winning handily on OBP/SLG over Utley, and the wOBA is in the same range of better despite the dramatic park difference.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 12:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don't think that it is...
VEP would know better than I would though.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on Sep 3, 2009 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think so
but I’m pretty sure their wRAA is.
by chuckb on Sep 3, 2009 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even then
How is an extra 150 points of OPS in 1/2 games in a pitcher’s park vs. hitters park not worth more than 14 runs?
Utley leads Howard by .032 points of wOBA and is 14.8 runs up on him. Pujols leads Utley by .029 points of wOBA and is 14.5 runs up on him. So I’m pretty sure they’re either both park adjusted or neither are, and just eyeballing it something seems awry.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
neither wOBA or wRAA are park adjusted
but they do include stolen bases and CS’s. Utley is 17-0, (and somehow Ryan Howard is 5-0) while pujols is 14-4. That shouldn’t make such a dramatic difference either, but it’s some difference.
OTOH WAR is park adjusted, but they use a wonky park factor.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 3, 2009 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don't think wOBA includes steals
(0.72xNIBB + 0.75xHBP + 0.90×1B + 0.92xRBOE + 1.24×2B + 1.56×3B + 1.95xHR) / PA
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
fangraphs wOBA does.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 3, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ugh
link.
And I agree, they shouldn’t call it wOBA, but it’s better than the vanilla formula as long as they do it right (not enough info published to know that).
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 3, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh cool
i was arguing a while back that i thought that woba incuded SBs and everyone was like lol no
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Sep 3, 2009 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That blows my mind
How is the most “advanced” generic stat not park adjusted.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Sep 3, 2009 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i would prefer
that they offer a non-adjusted AND an adjusted, like OPS/OPS+. That way you can apply your own park factors if you wish.
But yeah, that’s one big reason i prefer THT’s GPA stat. That, and I can do it in my head.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Sep 3, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what are the chances we win 100 games?
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 1:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Very slim
I think we have something like 26 games left, I actually looked this up this morning. We’d pretty much have to repeat our August performance only a little better, and against harder competition.
I think… someone feel free to correct my math if I’m wrong.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We would need to go...
21-7 the rest of the way.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Sep 3, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oops
Luke is right, it’s 28 games, not 26. Still, we’d basically have to do as well as we did in August but without getting to play crappy teams the whole month.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ooooh, .750 ball, I dunno...
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Blackjack and Craps...... got to be a joke in there somewhere?
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Sep 3, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
blackjack has the best odds
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I also wonder
what are the chances that the Yankees do not win 100 games?
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it would be interesting
mainly because they didn’t have a very good start to the season
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
including games after Oct. 2?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 3, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, silly
;)
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I Am Terrified..
…of a Cards-Yankees series, ’cause if we loose to the hated, despised, and udder loathed Yankees I would have to offer myself right to the glue factory – or the butrcher, whichever came first. I Hate the Yankees!!!!
>=8O
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm only terrified because C.C. and José may have inside info on us
José Molina, that is.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It Would Be Interesting...
..to watch a Moolina a’ Moolina showdown, cort of like Rock ’em Sock ’em Moolinas!
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bengie beats Yadi's numbers at the plate
That unnerves me about San Fran, to be honest. They may be the key to that potential series.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Sep 3, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
not to mentioned all the ESPN highlights that would go with it.....
but first, they have to get there.
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Sep 3, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Scare for Yankee fans
per mlb.com Mariano to rest with tightness in left groin
by ubeddie on Sep 3, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
somebody tell him you're supposed to call the doctor if it lasts more than four hours!
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 3, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe We Cud...
…get Michael Jackson’s doctor to take a look at him…
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you REALLY don't like the Yanks, huh, moo?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 3, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nope.
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has more than one groin?
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Groin =/= penis
Groin = muscle on inside of thigh
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think of groin as crotch
It’s either tight or it’s not. I don’t need to know the details of whats going on down there.
Shut up, Fritz™.
by Alxfritz on Sep 3, 2009 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please say it's the butcher
Then we could all eat MooCow steak for the next VEB get together
/even I’m creeped out by that comment
"You just keep pounding balls into the gap. The one thing you don’t want to do is hit a home run. That’s a rally-killer." - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Sep 3, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
:=8P
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lineup today
didn’t see this yet
Ryan – ss
Lugo – 2b
Pujols – 1b
Holliday – LF
Ludwick – RF
DeRosa – 3b
Molina – C
Ankiel – CF
Smoltz – P
by ubeddie on Sep 3, 2009 1:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
looks like an official "late 2009 cardinals v. leftie" lineup.
the only suspense is who’s starting in center. and i’m too tired to complain about that anymore.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Sep 3, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep
If only Ank was AnK yesterday. He actually took some good at bats. TLR acknowleged that Luddy gets the best at bats out of the 3 (Ank, Colby), but he needs to keep all of them sharp by playing them regularly. I still want Colby 24/7, but I guess I sort of see TLRs reasoning.
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
by totalloser on Sep 3, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes and the royals don't play today so i get to watch it
w000000000000000000000000000000000000000000t
Chuck Norris doesn't need a bat.
he just roundhouse kicks the ball out of the park.
by bearcatcardfan on Sep 3, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
~1 PM I think.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Sep 3, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So That's
2:15 East Coast Bias Time…
;=8)
My hovercraft is full of eels!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Sep 3, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
awesome
lugo at second rulz
Positronic Upgraded Juggernaut Optimized for Logical Sabotage
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Sep 3, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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