Undead Tuesday Notes
by DanUpBaby on Jul 7, 2009 7:00 AM EDT
586 comments
[EDIT: Mark DeRosa to the DL, Stavinoha called up in his place. Nothing the Cardinals could do to see this coming—he'll be eligible to come off the list right after the all-star game, and hopefully that's all this is, a bit of useful retroactive-off-days manipulation.]
I have to be brief today, because, well—I don't have a lot to talk about today. The off day's got my tongue.
Anyway, maybe tonight will be the matchup to foil the Pitcher's Duel jinx; I long ago stopped predicting low scores for ideal pitching matchups because of how often that expectation seemed to be confounded, and at this point I think I would be pretty mum on the run forecast if Kevin Brown and Brandon Webb toed the mound at Jupiter Stadium. But two first-rank pitchers with minor but unexpected control problems? This could do it. There's just enough probability of the wheels coming off of one of these guys for it to not happen, in a jinxes-all-the-way-down kind of way.
Speaking of the control problem, since April it's completely cleared up, statistically, which eluded me until just now. I guess it's just a hard thing to forgive a pitcher for—when he struggles with the simplest things for a few starts, it's easy to look at every momentary relapse as evidence of his continued loss of command, instead of, well, walking somebody. But the exciting thing is that his strikeouts have continued to hover around eight per nine innings, two more per game than we saw in his first two years as the Cardinals' ace-by-default.
His low strikeout rate was the last thing keeping me off the Wainwright, Future Real Ace bandwagon; eight per nine isn't just enough, it's a lot.
#
Greene down for Barden seems like a fine move to me, although it is changing out one sort-of-redundant piece—the Cardinals' second best plus defender with a shaky offensive history at shortstop—for another redundant piece, the not-quite-shortstop who can play all over the infield and hit a little. These are great bench pieces, useful ones, but they are made less useful when the same model is being pressed into the starting lineup. If you've got 2004 Edgar Renteria or even David Eckstein, established guys with starter cred, Tyler Greene is a vital piece on your bench. If you've got Brendan Ryan, he's the same player as your nominal starter, only stuck in the middle of a slump.
But 25-man machinations aside, it's a good move because there's still just 117 at-bats in Memphis that suggest that Tyler Greene is an MLB-caliber hitter. Since he wasn't doing much to cement the notion in St. Louis, it makes sense to see what another half-season at Memphis does to the notion that he's undergone a long-overdue offensive renaissance. Larger samples can do a lot to confirm those ideas, and they can do a lot to make it seem absurd that we ever had them. Whatever the truth is, the Cardinals will be in a much better position for 2010 when they know it.
#
Finally, generic all-star carping, an evergreen blog staple. In order of crotchety-old-blogger anger:
1. I realize that Ryan Howard is A Star and therefore will go to the All-Star game, but when a star has not played at his star level for a year and a half he is due, at least, some perfunctory grief. With that in mind, let's think of it this way, choir: Ryan Howard is a one dimensional player inside of a one dimensional player, an offense-first first baseman whose one significant offensive contribution is his ability to hit home runs. He is seventh in the National League in home runs. That's all.
2. If you were to have told me that Andrew Bailey had made an all-star team and then asked me which sport he played, I think I would have been right, say, sixty percent of the time. This never happens to me; I was all caught up on Lance Carter before he made his all-star appearance. So I took the news of his existence and subsequent election to the all-star team with a certain amount of emotional distress, but I wish him the best.
3. Pitchers getting in on the basis of not just wins but the fact that the way the all-star game is scheduled makes having ten such a convenient magic number... I don't know. I can't get too mad about it, which is completely out of character for me, card-carrying basement-blogger that I am. But there are three kinds, so if we segment this omnibus category into smaller ones I might be able to work up the form-mandated dander:
- Certainly it will be nice to see Tim Wakefield, determined to keep the knuckling art alive while his acolytes suffer through the mandatory five-to-ten career setbacks before they arrive, fully formed, at thirty, in the all-star game. Wake has been a pretty good pitcher for a very long time, occasionally great, occasionally newsworthy, and he's having a season that's—well, it's good enough. If someone were to run a political attack ad against me they would justly decry me as Soft on Knuckleballers, so maybe this isn't the best year for me to judge this category.
- There's also the way having a lot of wins is used as a Good Pitcher Tiebreaker. I'm fine with this as a general principle, but some of the decisions it makes are repellent to me in other ways.
- But the ones that make me mildly disgruntled are the Jason Marquis picks. Again—I, along with most of the people on this blog, am not quite a disinterested observer in the Man Called Betty's basically average MLB career. But in general I don't like when a pitcher who everybody knows to be just like a million other basically average pitchers is given an all-star appearance based on a stat that is almost certainly not picking up some heretofore unseen talent or skill. I bet Jason Marquis will have a wonderful time at the all-star game, and I hope he does, but he's not Tim Wakefield.
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greene
I think we see greene back by the end of august.
that being said….surely we can find someone better than joe thurston? please?
by mrr on Jul 7, 2009 8:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That really is the key. He’s killing this team. If we have nobody better, we need to go out and get somebody better
by riotmute on Jul 7, 2009 9:13 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
T. or K.?
(Greene)
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
k is on DL t is in memphis
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK, that's what I thought
With this roster it never hurts to ask around and get your bearings.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joe Thurston isn't that bad.....
And dare I say it…..I think his upside is higher than that of Barden or T. Greene, aside from not being able to play SS.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
or run the bases
or play LF or 3B or hit with any power…
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you have to admit
he can really run on all those walks he gets…which reminds me, why do people pitch to Pujols but not to Thurston? It really makes no sense to me at all.
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he's a good second baseman
but unfortunately he hardly ever plays there
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Upside
Joe Thurston was born on September 29, 1979, making him 29-going-on-30. In about 1,700 PAs in AAA over the three seasons prior to this one, he has a BA of about .300 and an OBP of nearly .350. So, he must have some ability to hit, even if he hasn’t shown it since April. He’s hitting .218/.323/.345/.668 this year. About the only reason to keep him on the roster is his ability to walk. The problem occurs when he attempts to the swing the bat and hit the ball.
Tyler Greene was born on August 17, 1983, making him 25-going-on-26. He has only had about 270 PAs in AAA. In the first half of those, last season, he hit horribly. This year, he has hit splendidly (.316/.420/.470/.890). He is far superior with the mit than Thursty Joe, as well. The question, as DanUp notes, is whether or not he has regained his first round form on offense. Can he hit big-league pitching? We’ll find out.
Now, I put to you, who would you place money on as a Cardinal starter in two years? T-Greene or Thursty Joe?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crazy..
I had a comment tee’d up and was literally about to post these same facts but you did it much more eloquently than I. Thank you.
I think that its pretty clear Thurston (and Barden, too) is at his physical peak – not a lot of headroom.
"In the wake of Michael Jackson's passing, all of the players in yesterday's games wore one glove in his memory."
- Craig Calcaterra
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
or you guys the same person?
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Insofar as baseball-hating number-loving robots can be persons,
maybe
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
regardless
I think Tyler needs a little more time in the minors
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obviously.
We weren’t opining that he is MLB ready. Just that he has more upside than Thurston.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so we have two robots here at VEB?
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Downside
You failed to mention Tyler Greene’s stats on the major league roster this season. His walk rate was around a quarter of Joe Thurston’s, his K rate was approaching Mark Reynolds territory at 30%, and his defense was just bad- even worse than Thursty Joe’s defense at the two positions they played in common.
His overall line was 216/261/324/585, but more importantly, there were no encouraging peripherals. Tyler’s BABIP in the majors was .296, a far cry from the unsustainable 375 that supported his aberrant AAA stats. Even more frightening was his absolute inability to make contact- his contact rate was UNDER 70%. These are not the skills of a major leaguer. He wasn’t even above average at shortstop.
Joe Thurston gets a bad rap for being pressed into service at 3B, but he was FAT, and he has been playing badly, but not horrifically. He has had terrible luck with a BABIP in the 260s despite a LD% of 23, and he thinks that bunting for a hit actually works. He has looked bad on the bases a few times, but just because those were conspicuous mistakes doesn’t mean they weren’t a result of bad luck. He has been fine on defense, has a very good eye, and figures to improve and hopefully move to the bench. Joe Thurston has not been our biggest problem- that would be the Ank/Dunc monstrosity, and DFAing him would solve none of our issues. We need a real 3B, and Joe Thurston can’t be blamed for that lack.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The question was upside
I don’t disagree with anything you put forth. This isn’t a question about 2009. It’s a question about the future. Does a career AAAA player in his Age 29/30 season—who you label a career bench part (a notion I wholeheartedly agree with)—have “more upside” than a first-round draft pick in his age 25/26 season? I would argue that Thurston’s upside is a bench player, a role that he could be useful in if not overexposed. I would further argue that T-Greene’s upside is a starting, everyday SS in St. Louis with his downside being a bench part, or, Thurston’s best case scenario. Maybe, in 4 years, T-Greene will be where Joe Thurston is now, a guy with decent AAAA stats who just isn’t good enough to play everyday. Maybe, in 4 years, he’ll be a starting MLB SS. Time will tell.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Draft round is erroneous. Ask Luke Hochevar.
Tyler Greene looked like a AAAA player- that’s the place where people who can’t figure out the strike zone and who are unable to make contact go. While he has upside, I’m also pointing out that he has the potential to be a nightmarish black hole in the lineup and mediocre on the field.
I hope neither of them is a starter in 2011 without some major, major improvements.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He looked like a AAAA player in 112 PAs
He’s also 26 and doesn’t even have a full season’s worth of PAs in AAA. I guess I’m not ready to write him off as having a lower upside than 29 -year-old Joe Thurston after that small of a showing. You see, that’s what I’m arguing, that Tyler Greene has time to make those improvements. He’s not a spring chicken by any means, but he has time to make those improvements. Another half-season at AAA will likely settle this for us.
Joe Thurston has made 10 errors this season, 8 at third and 2 at second. That’s horrendous, even if you don’t think that errors are the end all of defense measuring (which I don’t). How can you can find Thurston to have more upside because Greene has the potential to be mediocre in the field when Thurston has been quite a bit worse than mediocre in the field is beyond me. Thuston’s AAA walk rate is 9.58% over 1,691 PAs. This year, in 231 PAs, it’s 12.12% and that increased walk rate over half of a season seems to be where you are gleaning his offensive value. I just don’t think it’s sustainable. We saw a similar start from Aaron Miles back in 2006 and he fell off considerably.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please stop talking about errors.
I can tell you Thurston’s fielding percentage is higher than Greene’s at third but no one cares. I hate the word upside and I’ve not used it on Joe Thurston so please stop saying I did. I’ve been talking about the sucking, horrible, vacuous downside. The endless downside…
Anyway, I think we basically agree. Except that I think Greene will probably fail to become a good player in AAA where he belongs while you think there is a decent chance that he will become a good player in AAA where he belongs.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right
Today, and for the remainder of 2009, Tyler Greene belongs in AAA. Without question. I also agree that Greene probably does have a more vacuous downside than Thursty Joe, which is why he should be in AAA, so we can get a better idea as to what the up- or down-side is for T-Greene. His time in St. Louis this season has not been adequate to draw any conclusions. Thurston’s probably hasn’t, either.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
high-five!
Too soon?
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, I think a high-five is in order
Having a higher upside and downside as a player is not mutually exclusive. That, I think, is something upon which everyone can agree.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
thurston might be 29
but got to AAA at the same age Greene did. Greene’s got more upside but I’d put serious money on him never being much more than a 1-win player at MLB level, which is what Thursty Joe is now. I don’t like Thurston much either but watching Greene hit is painful.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
there’s some misunderstanding about what a AAAA player is here.
Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.
by liam on Jul 7, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Brad Thompson comes to mind.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If T. Greene is EVER the starting SS in STL.....
for 3/4 of a season, we’ll finish 7+ games back of whoever wins our division.
Book it.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why?
he’d be a cesar izturis type at worst
and with time, he could probably hit a little better than cesar
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We finished 11 games back with CI as our SS
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
and it was all his fault, right?
had nothing to do with a certain bullpen or starting rotation, eh?
pretty ridiculous assertion, sir
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
and TLR was our manager!
Just for fun!
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not only that
We had some chump named Poo-jolz manning first base!!
by soil_illini on Jul 7, 2009 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your grasp of cause and effect
leaves a lot to be desired.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hyperbole aside
Tyler Greene doesn’t fit the roster with Brendan Ryan hitting well and Greene’s bat looking. . .well, like it has through most of the minors.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where did I say.....
T. Greene would be the CAUSE of such a record?
I didn’t. Try harder.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
now, you're just a troll.
you said that if tyler “EVER” becomes the starting SS for 3/4 of the year we’d finish 7 games back. while the words ‘he will cause us to finish 7 games out’ didn’t come out, that’s a normal human reading of the english words.
e.g.: “if we ever let the baby eat three pieces of cake in an evening, she won’t sleep all night”, “if you ever get in a dui accident, you willl not be allowed to drive my car again.”
these statements imply cause and effect. that’s what we mean when we say them. no one would read the above statements and think “well, maybe the night when the baby eats the cake, there will also be loud music, so that would be why the baby won’t sleep.”
you’re being deliberately difficult and making bizarre claims and then trying to weasel out of them. that’s being a troll.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
+1
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll bite - since you are backtracking, let's refute your new claim:
You are arguing that if the franchise is ever in a position to give T. Greene a lot of playing time, they surely must be fielding a terrible team. Our last three division winners have had regular players who more or less sucked:
2006: Ron Belliard/Aaron Miles/Hector Luna: .265/.329/.382/.711(skewed by Luna, who was good)
2005: John Mabry: .240/.295/.407/.701
2004: Marlon Anderson: .237/.269/.379/.649
2009: Tyler Greene: .219/.261/.324/.585
To suggest that one subpar player who gets a lot of PAs undoubtedly will lead to a terrible season is foolish. Also foolish is to consider that you know all about what Tyler Greene can and will produce based on his 112 major league PAs (and his glove is certainly no worse than those mentioned above). One extra 2B or a couple bloopers would have a huge impact on those numbers. Wild variations in his numbers are certainly expected as this is his first cup of coffee and is too small a size to get a real feel for how good he is. I certainly am not “booking” your unsubstantiated scouting report considering he could easily achieve the numbers above without a problem.
His 75% PECOTA projection has him as a 1 WAR player over a full season’s worth of ABs, ascending to nearly a league average batsmen by 2011 (his prime).
Your move.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice try.....
But all of those guys put up better numbers than I’d expect from T. Greene, first of all. Secondly, Mabry didn’t meet my playing time criteria. Nor did Anderson.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 8:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
First of all...
The difference in their statlines and playing time isn’t nearly enough to go from first to at least seven games out.
Secondly, there are tons more examples:
2008 Juan Pierre: 406 PAs, .283/.327/.328/.655 – Dodgers 1st in division
2008 Gary Matthews: 477 PAs, .242/.319/.357/.675 – Angels 1st in division
2007 Julio Lugo: 570 PAs, .237/.294/.349/.643 – Boston WS champs
2007 Stephen Drew: 619 PAs, .238/.313/.370/.683 – Arizona 1st in division
And these are just the handful of bad seasons I can remember off the top of my head from division winners – there are countless more if you include contenders.
I don’t think anyone wants to see the 2009 version of Tyler Greene at SS for 3/4 of a season, but to say if he EVER plays that much we are doomed to be seven games out is hyperbole.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 8, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You made an if-then statement about tyler greene
this type of moving target crap is old. You love to say shit and then spend the next few hours backtracking in convoluted circles until you’ve said nothing of any substance and muddled the issues. It’s ridiculous and troll-ish activity.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you try to stir up annoying arguments?
As AZ states above me, you are a moving target. I mean, I have no problem with an evolving argument over time or changing your mind when you gain a new understanding of facts…but when you say this
If T. Greene is EVER the starting SS in STL…..for 3/4 of a season, we’ll finish 7+ games back of whoever wins our division. Book it.
And then say this:
Where did I say T. Greene would be the CAUSE of such a record? I didn’t. Try harder.
Well…Shit…I mean…I don’t even know what to say!!! This is irritating at best and dishonest at worst.
You set up an If…then statement, and then tried to say that you weren’t trying to imply anything…Well what were you trying to say?!?!
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you certainly implied it
try harder to refute it.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, I didn't.
YOU read into it.
Tookie got it the most right. All I’m saying is that if the Cardinals are in a position where T. Greene starts 3/4 of the season at SS, something went wrong. And if SS went that wrong, I’m sure we screwed the pooch somewhere else as well. We aren’t the Yankees. We can’t BUY two Albert Pujols, or go buy a fix midseason. I don’t think much of T. Greene, and neither did anybody else before this season. What has changed? Nothing.
Could T. Greene be good enough to become a legit starting SS? Sure. Could the Cardinals put a good enough team around T. Greene at SS that even if he is terrible, we still do well? Sure. Would I bet one cent on either of those two things happening? Hell no.
Some of you love jumping on me so much, that you read way too fucking much into what I write sometimes. Simple as that. At least HL finally stopped following me around all day. I don’t bother him much now, and vice versa. Not everybody agrees with me, but just b/c the 5-6 guys that live on this board don’t, doesn’t make me wrong.
Good day.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So
When everyone else on the blog thinks you implied one thing, you take that to mean that everyone else is delusional as to your writing intentions. Sure.
Perhaps—-just perhaps—-you didn’t/don’t make your point clear.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So everyone on the blog
Is 4 or 5 guys?
Gotcha.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
By my count 10
Me, prophetjohn, redbirdnation8206, chuckb, azruavatar, all4tookie, thegodfather, tom s., soil_illini, bgh.
So 10 people saw it one way, but of course it wasn’t you.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't feel like chiming in,
but me, too.
"I usually don’t read other peoples sigs." -Cuttah
by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2009 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would you admit to being wrong and crazy?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
me neither, but i'm always wrong
and more than a little crazy. so it’s a moo point
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 11:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Put down the shovel
You wrote an If-Then statement. According to the English language, these kind of statements imply correlation. If you wanted to say that T. Greene starting would be a symptom of some kind of system-wide disaster, SAY THAT!!!
This isn’t some conspiracy of several posters chasing you around. It’s just that you make these bizarre, confusing statements and then retreat faster than a chess nerd facing down the starting LT on the football team. Perhaps you need to be clearer?
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where did I retreat?
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And for the record.....
My post wasn’t a true “if/then” statement. There is no “then” in it.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are correct, it was not an If-Then statement
The word Then did not appear.
Then again…well, what is that saying about things that walk and quack like ducks?
I apologize that I’m not clever enough to get “If Tyler Greene (who btw was a fairly high draft pick out of Georgia and was highly regarded for his tools if not his polish coming out of college…to me this sounds like a guy that the organization thinks could conceivably be a ML SS) is playing SS that means that a whole bunch of other stuff went wrong too and the team is screwed” out of what you wrote, which was so LIKE an If-Then statement that I actually thought it was the literal definition of one.
You accuse some of reading too much into your posts…well hell there I think people looked at what you wrote pretty damn directly.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's a pretty pathetic argument
“my grammer was bad, so what I said did not mean what I said”.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we ever fall into SoonerfanTUs ridiculously stupid bait arguments again..
this blog is a giant waste of time and we are the dumbest bunch of pseudo-intellectual fans ever.
Not an if-then. Open to interpretation.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 8, 2009 2:05 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well-played.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 8, 2009 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Save your sanctimony
In your post you said “If T. Greene is ever our starting SS for 3/4 of the season, we’ll finish 7+ games behind the leader.” That certainly implies that you’re saying that the fact that our SS is so bad is the cause of our poor finish. Now you’re saying “well, if he’s our SS then we probably have other problems also — maybe our pitching’s bad or Albert gets hurt or …” What do any of those things have to do w/ Greene or the SS position? Absolutely nothing. I didn’t read into anything. You play games w/ your brash predictions and then backtrack whenever you’re called on them. If you believe T. Greene’s so bad that we’ll finish 7 games out w/ him at SS, you ought to at least have the guts to stand behind such a ballsy statement rather than come back and say “well, I didn’t mean that he’s the reason we stunk!” Whatever. I don’t really care but it’s intellectually dishonest to come back and say that you didn’t imply that he was the cause of the poor finish. I don’t mind bold, even brash, predictions. I just don’t get why you refuse to stand behind them.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 9:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course no ONE player can affect a team that much.....
We could put an average 15 year old kid that plays competitive baseball in RF, and if the rest of the team is good enough, we’d still have a chance to do fine.
I’m just saying, with STL’s limited resources, and with the makeup of our team in the next few years, I don’t see it. We won’t be able to overcome having T. Greene start at SS. Is that saying it is ALL TG’s fault if it were to happen? Hell no. I’ve never posted that.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 8, 2009 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What?
Your point is? That team had quality hitters at four spots and could afford to have a defensive ace at one position…that was Izturis. Cesar was nearly a 2 win player last season based on his brilliant work at SS. Sure, he can’t hit, but he was pretty far from the Cardinals’ biggest problem last year.
As AZ said, your understanding of cause-and-effect is pretty horrific. Just because two things happen simultaneously does not mean that one cause the other or that there is even any connection between the two.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
my personal feeling is that izturis is greene's UPSIDE as a hitter
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but i think greene could be a better fielder
izturis’ 2008 with us was a bit of an outlier in terms of fielding goodness. He’s not been hugely above average as a SS in the years immediately before and after…
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
makes a ton of sense.
especially since we won’t know if this mystery division-winning team will have 100 wins or 86. but whatever talent level tyler has, it’s keyed to pull our team seven wins below other teams. okay.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shortstop
How, then, do we explain 2005 and 2007? David Eckstein was the SS. One year, we finished with 105 wins. The other, we finished 78 wins and 7 games back in the division?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
SS as the single determining factor in the final standings
How, then, do we explain 2005 and 2007? David Eckstein was the SS. One year, we finished with 105 wins. The other, we finished 78 wins and 7 games back in the division.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would like to apologize for this.
My browser froze up and then I closed it while attempting to post the first comment. I came back and it hadn’t loaded. Now, both are up. I’m not quite sure what happened.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you made a good point
it didn’t hurt to read it twice
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Jul 7, 2009 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The missing varible
here is Tony’s platoon system. It is crushing to the unformed ego’s of young players. Put into proximity with the Pujols presents, bending space and time and all hopes of normality, a disorienting stress to say the least.
These kids all come here and perform well for a while. They can not sustain a presents because of Tony’s need to manufacture platoon-bots to protect his coaching prerogatives. Colby is in AAA right now if DeWitt does not play so roughly with with Tony. Thats the moves against Shu and Luddy and Ankiel at one point. The power play was the Kennedy assassination and the moving of Joey Bombs to third. He got Colby the playing time, which opened up the gates to the farm system up to the DeRosa signing. Thurston is a Cardinal up until he is replaced by a player with similar marketing possibilities, a truth that we all must bear the weight or witness of. Maybe its just business and or coincidence. Who am I to judge such things. Why I could be completely wrong on that observation, I’m sure many of you would agree.
by OperaCard on Jul 7, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so, you're saying tony la russa was on the grassy knoll?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No Tom, not at all
But there were multiple gunmen, first Tony with the conditions for modifying Shu, and then DeWitt sealing the deal at his expense. The off shoots of this move reverberate to this day in both the outfield and infield.
by OperaCard on Jul 7, 2009 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i've stopped reading your baffling posts
but i still want you to have my babies.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
....i bet most of the straight people
in here don’t know what a chaser is…don’t ask me how I know…
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't vex yourself rock
Its one of Monks most famous bebop charts.
by OperaCard on Jul 7, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's in that "friends in low places" song
something something something beeeeer, chaser
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if this isn't wescoastbirdwatcher
he is definitely giving the legend a run for the money
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Westcoast?
is that you?
I think my head just exploded.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, no it's not
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
gdm, is that you?
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, no it's not
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
*variable
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
awesome
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just placed
my left hand on the counter, picked up a hammer with my right hand and proceeded to beat it mercilessly. Confused? Well, it still made more sense than this post.
HE SAID WITH A SMIRK
by Dave Barry on Jul 7, 2009 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i don't know how someone can make this little sense.
i was going to quote the line about pujols, but then i realized that nothing in the post actually makes sense. i am, however, compelled to agree with him. as he says, he’s sure many of us would agree.
OperaCard—making us laugh/cry since 6/14/2009.
cardinals are the things with feathers that perch within the soul.
by ilrosso on Jul 7, 2009 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It goes back much further than that.
At least a year, maybe a year and a half.
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, seriously
What in the fuck are you talking about?
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Thurston is a Cardinal up until he is replaced by a player with similar marketing possibilities"
So, Joe Thruston is only playing because he’s black?
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i think he's trying to say that
black players are the new market inefficiency.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I will not try to clarifiy
all comments. Some are meant only to stimulate perception. This message was part of the above thread concerning Thurston, Barden, Greene and some of the AAA gang. What is implied is that Tony is very active in his quest to stimulate management into getting him seasoned players. As we are aware, B. DeWitt is very interested in establishing a new talent base free of the “open market place”. This game was played very aggressively in 08 with the loser being Tony and the Cardinals. Bill did alright. This year, attempts by management to restrict Tony’s options on field have been incredibly fortunate for Bill. Lucky he is so far, with the Cubs struggling.. Tony began the season with 4 outfielders and 5 middle infielders. The weakness has been obvious. Tony knows he won’t be winning any playoff games with no offense, so he plays platoon master with all his players, exploring ways of winning without establishing any of the young players. ( He platoons no one that has a multi year deal). Colby has established himself just in the last week along with the failure of the weak links, Duncan and Ankiel. Can anyone guess how Ludwick got back to a balanced stance after being led down the H.Mc road to nowhere. Another time. There was a sense of opportunity for young players. Many have dreamed of making it for years. (Barden/Thurston) When they discover that regardless of performance, they haven’t even earned a position, they go flat. They go flat when opposing scouts recognize their training wheels. T Greene looked fantastic when Ryan and K Greene failed. The games pile up, their inability to make veteran adjustments becomes apparent, and they’re off to Memphis. DeWitt’s luck started to be wear out in recent weeks, and regardless of his master plan, made a play on a possible injured DeRosa. He hasn’t hit since he arrived so I can’t say he didn’t start saying ouch only now for career reasons. This team would be okay if it didn’t have to tolerate the Ankiel / Duncan at bats. In the end, Thurston will be the lone utility man at 2nd and 3rd. He will play much less and possible contribute more. The move of Shu back to the outfield should be a real possibility. The team could benifit from DeRosa playing second or third if Barden brings something to the table again. With so much tactical planning surrounding the support of the Pujols battle wagon, much is being lost by the diversion of reason caused by the Tony / DeWitt contest. I know the winner right now because both are playing a no loss scenario for the fulfillment of their own personal goals. The true definition of winning is lost in the noise.
by OperaCard on Jul 8, 2009 3:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 8, 2009 8:21 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I didn't even attempt to read it.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 8, 2009 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A brief message
If you don’t think businessman William DeWitt doesn’t have an active contingency plan concerning Pujols and LaRussa, you would be missing the news. If you don’t think Tony is aware of his present future options and opportunities, you would be missing the News. The contract making Dave the highest paid assistant in baseball this year with its one year option to control possible costs indicates a complex bargaining position by Tony, contingent on many issues that may be revealed in the 2009 season. Also, don’t forget that Albert’s desire to talk was ignored. I hope that the Brewers continue to dive because the sale in Chicago is bound to bring them help.
by OperaCard on Jul 8, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't read it
because it’s a solid wall of text and it makes my eyes bleed. I’m not panicking.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 8, 2009 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
insert Huey Lewis joke
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 8, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
does not belong on the Cardinals
fin
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
QED
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm trying to let go, i really am
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Totally dude...
Totally. The guy is hitting .218, leads the team in errors, and leads the world in baserunning gaffes. Oh, but he draws walks now and again!
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Jul 7, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You used batting average? Really?
We had a poster defending RBI and you are now using BA. This isn’t 1972.
Thurston has been unlucky on his balls in play this season and actually draws walks at a higher rate than the average major league player. This isn’t to say that if he’d had better breaks he’d be Ichiro or something…all I’m saying is that he’s a better offensive player than his results would indicate. He’s got a .323 OBP, which is terrible, but that also means he’s recorded outs at a lower rate than Ryan Ludwick, who most have no problem hitting 4th, and Colby Rasmus, who probably will wind up a ROY candidate.
You note his number of errors…well is it really surprising that moving a career 2nd baseman to 3rd, largely out of necessity, would result is a large number of errors? Is it really his fault that Glaus, Mather, DeRosa, and K. Greene can’t play right now or that T. Greene and Barden didn’t play well? Because THAT’S why he’s playing 3rd.
My point isn’t that he’s a great player…he’s not. But to poo-poo the guy based on his batting average…I mean BA, really?…and his errors and to just ignore the fact that he can actually take a pitch is an egregious oversight.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
wat
BA may not tell the whole story, but it’s not a worthless stat like fielding percent. it’s actually pretty relevant and should be included in any offensive measure
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fielding percent
leads the team in errors
Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.
by liam on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure, but OBP is way more meaningful
…and in any case my comment was designed to point out that Luke should not simply dismiss Thurston’s walks because his BA is low. This is a remarkably unsophisticated interpretation of Thurston’s season to this point. Furthermore, Thurston has been the victim of some bad luck (note .262 babip) and as such his BA should be better than it is now. He’s not a good player, but he’s not nearly as bad as he appears right now either.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
obp is more important,
yes
but both are necessary in accurately gauging offensive output
decent obp usn’t sustainable with awful BA. eventually pitchers will figure out he can’t hit and it’ll level out
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That only works if you assume that pitchers will tube the ball every time Thurston hits
Thurston’s line since his OPS peak on May 4th is .176/.297/.275. Clearly he hasn’t hit well, but he’s still drawing walks. With the sophistication of ML-level advanced scouting I think most guys realize that Thurston isn’t a great player at this point…however he has still shown the ability to walk, which makes him to some level useful.
Furthermore, Thurston is the victim of some bad luck. Despite a normal LD-rate, his BABIP is a low .262. With all of this taken into consideration, a reasonable projection of his performance from here on out is an increased BA with a reduced isolated-patience (OBP-BA), totalling to a player who will probably be fairly bad but not nearly as bad as his out-of-context BA would suggest.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, i agree with this
and i’m not one the true thurston haters. i think he has some use (though i think greene’s defense makes him more useful) and you’re probably right about his luck to some extent (.260 isn’t that low) but even with his decent ld rate, watching him, i know he’s been hitting the ball very weakly lately and .260-.280 is probably about right for his babip going forward
all things considered, he’s close to 1 WAR over a full season and that’s good enough for me with what we have
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why?
It has very little correlation to runs scored, and is very dependent on luck.
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
Batting average is completely worthless. 100%. I’m pretty sure I never said it was the ultimate measure of a hitter’s ability, or anything close to it. But ANYONE hitting .218 with no power is not very good. I’m not sure how that can even be debated. And I’m fairly certain I didn’t ignore that he can “actually take a pitch”, regardless of the sarcasm. If you want to blame his errors on playing 3rd, then I can make the same senseless argument in the other direction. Skip has fewer errors than any of the every day infielders, so does that make him a good second basemen?
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Jul 7, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But ANYONE hitting .218 with no power is not very good. I’m not sure how that can even be debated.
It certainly can be debated when you consider that for the season he’s hit a normal number of line drives and yet has a below-average BABIP. That’s being unlucky. If you take issue with the data, than it should be taken up with those who record what constitutes a line-drive for record keeping purposes. Now, I’m not going to suggest that Thurston would turn into Ichiro given better luck…nothing of the sort…but merely that his .218 BA shouldn’t be that low and as such shouldn’t be a starting point for an attack on his qualities as a player. This is and always will be a fundametally flawed argument because it begins and ends with the assumption that BA is a good tool for measuring a baseball player. It isn’t. You’re building a mansion on a beach here.
If you want to blame his errors on playing 3rd, then I can make the same senseless argument in the other direction. Skip has fewer errors than any of the every day infielders, so does that make him a good second basemen?
Bill James has been arguing since his first Baseball Abstracts that the error is a fundamentally flawed statistic. This is hardly a new concept. Again, you are using severely flawed evidence to support your argument. Skip is a bad 2nd baseman not because he makes few errors…he is a bad 2nd baseman because he doesn’t get to many balls and convert them into outs. Due to the fact that he gets to a smaller number of balls than a normal 2nd baseman should, he will by default make fewer errors. Fewer opportunities=fewer errors. As for Thurston…well he’s still a bad 3rd baseman but his inequities result in errors, whereas Skip’s tend to result in a ball rolling slowly into center, right-center, or right field. If you don’t agree with these arguments, I suggest you head over to fangraphs and check out THIS page. You will see that Skip Schumaker, the 2nd base version, is the team’s worst fielder using UZR (Admittedly, it’s not perfect, but also is 35,000x more sophisticated than errors) and Joe Thurston, the 3rd baseman, is also one of the worst. It’s no surprise to me that an outfielder and a 2nd baseman don’t convert well to 2nd and 3rd base. You should note that Thurston, in a tiny tiny sample, has actually done well at 2nd.
Here’s my larger point. Joe Thurston is a mediocre at best player. However he’s become the victim of a level of scorn that he does not deserve. The fact of the matter is that he’s a career AAAA 2nd baseman who has been asked in his rookie season to switch spots. Sure, he’s done poorly as a 3rd baseman, but he’s arguably been Tony La Russa’s 7th or 8th choice at that spot (Glaus, Mather, Freese,K and T Greene, Barden, DeRosa). He’s not hit well, but you also have to note he’s one of the few players on the team who can actually take a walk and has also been the victim of bad luck. He’s certainly not a good player…but he’s better than he’s been made out to be.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
thurston's BABIP is low because
he has a 25% IFFB (IE, he hits a lot of balls on a trajectory with an expected BABIP of 0.00), and because he’s 2 for 12 in bunt attempts. He’s basically one LD hit away from having a league-average batting average on line drives.
That’s not bad luck, that’s being a bad hitter.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's still been getting unlucky
prOPS has him a .736 with a .364 OBP.
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which sort of affirms what I've been saying
Bad…but not worthy of unholy scorn. He’s a bench player…maybe.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'll agree w/ that
I think a lot of the scorn directed at Thurston is sort of misplaced. He’s a bench player forced into too much duty. It’s sort of the same scorn we directed at Miles for playing too often. He’s an ok guy to have as your 24th or 25th man but when he’s playing 4-5 times a week, he’s pretty bad.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's always been my gripe with him too
He, like others of his ilk, gets used far too much, given his skillset.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The baserunning gaffes have really tarnished ol' Go-Go-Joe in my eyes
I don’t see any reason for a bench player whose game is premised on hustle, grit, and fundamentals to find so many ways to run into outs.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thurston = Miles
We’ve been having this conversation for 4 some years now.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
except that
I’ll allow that Tony’s been, more or less, forced to play Thurston whereas he CHOSE to play Miles. It’s true that Allen Craig could’ve been given a chance at 3rd, but w/ all the injuries there really hasn’t been that many options.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
gotta wonder why
amauri marti hasn’t been taking ground balls at 3B in mexico.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure.
It’s still hard for fans (myself included) to get on board with these players that have pretty bad flaws (baserunning, Joe!) but are, at worst, replacement level. So they’re not really the problem with the team but they seem like such a great place to try and make marginal upgrades.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but he benched Barden right after he won rookie of the month
because thurston hits left handed. he hasn’t been forced to play thurston, he chose to.
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bingo!!!!
Tony’s prerogative, because he did not want the 3rd base problem resolved by a hot streak. He did it to Ludwick last year because he wanted to continue platooning Duncan and others.
by OperaCard on Jul 8, 2009 1:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no full-time decisions
should be made on the basis of a hot streak…ever.
by chuckb on Jul 8, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
do you honestly
see Barden as being any better than Thurston? Honestly?
by chuckb on Jul 8, 2009 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
both show
an immaturity when it comes to recognizing obstacles to their success. Thurston thinks he is in a desperate situation right now, thus the abandoning of his compact swing and a realistic strike zone. He is trying to just get lucky instead of good. His strike Zone has sucked for a month. He has the better tools. I look for Barden to have reset after his trip to Memphis. He may produce for a few weeks. Whether or not it is sustainable is the question. He would need to make a pretty big splash to stay into August.
by OperaCard on Jul 8, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
honestly i do
but it’s not like i think he’d set the world on fire & take over 3rd. i just think it will not be that hard to play better than one of the worst players in baseball. yes, thurston is one of the worst, not the worst, but one of. he’s a better hitter, a better defender & i don’t think it’s too big of a stretch to say he’s a much better runner on the base paths.
am i the only one who thinks he got a raw deal? i mean all he did was go out & be a rookie of the month, and Tony benched him. on what other team would that happen?
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 9, 2009 3:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
props considers bunts to be ground balls
and does not differentiate between IFFB and other types of fly balls. It’s a terrible tool to use to try to predict performance for a guy like thurston.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and does not differentiate between IFFB and other types of fly balls.
Source?
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This was the only PrOPS article I could find (http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/introducing-props/) and it just mentions that GB:FB ratio is used but doesn’t mention, that I saw anyway, if they remove IFFBs or leave them in.
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if it broke them out
it would mention it.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No it would be the opposite
Breaking them apart is the obvious thing to do. If they didn’t they would mention it.
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why?
Fly balls are fly balls, breaking out line drives is obvious but infield flys are usually considered fly ball outs when you talk GB:FB ratios
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Given that is a stat specifically introduced to take luck out the equation
And it is published by THT, one of the most respected and thorough sites out there, I will bet you 100 dollars it separates infield and outfield fly balls.
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
do you think he'll have a .736 OPS going forward?
I would personally be suprised by that. He’s never in his life had an MLE over .700, and he’s only had a SPLIT mle vs RHP higher than .740 once in his minor league career.
When I get home from work I’ll email JC and ask about IFFB’s.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not saying I think he will
I’m just pointing out that he has hit reasonably well this year.
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but that's what PrOPS is for.
“it’s a formula for predicting what a player’s OPS is likely to be in the future based on his batted balls, strikeouts, home runs and walks.” -link
So by quoting PrOPS, and using it to say “he’s been unlucky”, you are saying that.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I'm not mistaken
PrOPS doesn’t actually predict future performance. If you read the primer on it, here, it’s clear that the goal is just to have a luck independent batting stat.
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, that's how THT defines it.
And that’s exactly what it tries to do. The idea is to eliminate bad luck or good luck from past performance to establish a measure of true talent.
Going forward, true talent is the mean and good and bad luck are deviations from that, so if you have a good measure of true talent and a decent sample size it should be a useful tool for predicting future performance within the window of a short period of time (IE, no requirement to apply aging curves or injury corrections).
If you read the full article, which was published in May, the author was trying to identify players who would bounce back because they had back luck in the first 40ish games or so.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
response from JC
1) Do you consider IFFB avoidance to be a skill for batters? IE, does PrOPS separate infield fly balls out of the GB/FB ratio it uses?
Answer: No
2) Do you consider HR as FB?
Answer: Yes
3) How are bunts/bunt hits/sacrifice flies handled? Fangraphs considers them to be GB, B-R has a seperate category, and THT is unclear
Answer: "Not sure how BIS handles them. I suspect bunts are a separate category, and SF are FB.
Another note. I developed PrOPS many years ago using data that may not be relevant today. It is still useful, but I suspect it is less precise than it once was."
the end of every half inning IS a turning point. -Evilfrog
by SleepyCA on Jul 8, 2009 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where can you find league averages for batted ball data?
I mean, is such data available?
I ask because I have a thought…not an argument…just sort of thinking out loud here. If Thurston hits a normal number of weak pop-ups, and his line drive numbers correspond okay with his LD BA, maybe his un-luck actually comes from unluck on groundballs?
In any case…maybe I’m just arguing that Thurston’s performance should be better to make myself feel better. Plus, when someone throws out an argument, kidding or not, formulated around out-of-context BA, I tend to flip the eff out. What can I say but I use all of my patience on my daughters, my schnauzers, and my HS students!!!
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
go to B-R
click on “league batting”, then “splits”, then scroll down to the “ball in play” types.
You have to do some additional work to compare it to other sites like fangraphs because they get data from different sources and use different definitions for things like fly balls, line drives, etc.
Yes, Thurston has a lower BABIP on ground balls than would be expected, by about 2.3 hits worth (0.230-0.197)*71 PA. But you have to use some common sense, too- he’s not hitting the ball that hard when he hits it on the ground.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fair Enough
Looking at the data, Joe Thurston’s batted ball data indicates a player whose luck isn’t as bad as I thought, he’s just sort of a poor hitter who, unlike our other crappy hitters, can actually take a walk here and there. I think, or hope, o ojala que, that Thurston isn’t quite this bad. Once again…he’s no Ichiro but not the absolute worst hitter ever in the history of everness…I hope.
However, just to bring this full circle…As bad as Thurston has been, I’m still going to defend him to the extent of saying that he’s not a starting-caliber third baseman so it’s not really fair to crush him (except when he does bizarre baserunning things because that’s indefensible). More imprortantly, he wouldn’t be playing that position if other players had been healthy or emerged when given the opportunity. Maybe Barden will stick this time.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
For what it's worth...
…his RoS ZiPS line is .265/.329/.377. That’s pretty poor. Sounds like a AAAAer to me.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd be shocked if he puts up a .706 OPS going forward
and that’s actually not THAT bad for a good defensive 2B making the league min, and it’s fine for a defensive sub type. Problem is we’ve been forced to play him every day, and he’s made some dumb mistakes on the basepaths.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2009 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But ANYONE hitting .218 with no power is not very good.
Batting average doesn’t tell you how much power they have, though ;)
by astrostl on Jul 7, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
I’m saying the abysmal average in conjunction with the absence of power makes for a poor hitter…
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Jul 7, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now and again?
He is 3rd on the team in walks, despite being 8th in AB’s.
Look, he has his faults, that is for sure. And while he shouldn’t be starting at 3B on a playoff team (though we currently have no better options), I wouldn’t mind him being my starting 2B.
He needs to stop with the stupid *&%^ on the bases, but there is no reason to think that won’t happen. He has speed. He has a good eye. He plays a good 2B, and an acceptable 3B.
Say you were standing with one foot in the oven and one foot in an ice bucket. According to the percentage people, you should be perfectly comfortable." - Manager Bobby Bragan
by SoonerfanTU on Jul 7, 2009 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to be pedantic,
but wouldn’t we expect someone with lots of walks to have fewer ABs? Or did you mean plate appearances?
by Ray Lankford on Jul 7, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
was going to ask the same thing
BBs don’t count as ABs
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's second on the team in BB/PA
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thurston
Ugh. Get rid of him already.
TLR: Please start Colby!
by zoomzoomj88 on Jul 7, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's certainly not higher
than Greene’s. Greene can field, is athletic, and has power. What he lacks is plate discipline. But his upside is certainly considerably higher than Thurston’s.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Dan Haren is available
Just wanted to throw that out there. Heh.
by sdrone on Jul 7, 2009 9:16 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
God...yes....
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Apparently...
So is Roy Halladay.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well then it looks like I just declared
Brett Wallace is available along with many, many more.
by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 7, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no way
too expensive
price considered, haren > halladay
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
dang
I’d love to have Haren back on the Cards
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
me too
and i don’t know off hand what haren’s contract is
i was saying no way to halladay. dude is as close to an undisputed best in baseball as it gets and he will not come cheap
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
we’d probably get a much better deal on Haren, and he’s younger too and seems to match up well with Duncan
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
really, haren is probably too expensive, also
i say the only pitcher i trade wallace for now is lincecum
and fat chance there
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought the Giants
would trade Lincecum for Duncan?
Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.
by liam on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
where do i sign
hell, i’ll throw in a fruit basket if they include cain, too
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They WERE looking for a LH 1bman!
Supposedly they’d rather have a RH 1bman now. I guess the Travis Ishikawa experiment isn’t working.
I think Ishikawa actually translates to “I get out a lot and have little power.”
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Price Tag
I was thinking that might make Haren more expensive in terms of prospects, thus making Holliday more palatable.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wonder if we could resign Mulder and make that trade
by rencelas on Jul 7, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
rec
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
last I heard he wasn't
huh
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don't you tease me like this
don’t you dare f’ing tease me. that’s not funny
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mo wouldn't get him
Heck, I’m surprised he got DeRo
TLR: Please start Colby!
by zoomzoomj88 on Jul 7, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ryan Howard
is pulling a Yadi, except on defense. Except he’s starting from … no defense, so he may just arrive at not-sucking. Or not-Uggla. Give him time. I have a feeling underestimating him will just buy a world of hurt, especially since his off-season training partner is one Albert Pujols.
I cannot explain Jason Marquis.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 9:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Ryan Howard is a native. . .
so, regardless of him having robbed Prince Albert of an MVP award, I’m fine with him getting the invite. It’s not like he’s robbing Albert of a starting spot or anything.
Oh, and enough with all of the McCann over Yadi tripe from the press. McCann missed 20 games this season. Yes, his offensive numbers are good, but missing 20 games can and should be a reason for him to be denied the starting spot.
Jason Marquis? Ewwwww.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jul 7, 2009 9:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm also glad we're not the Mets.
ESPN’s not-top-ten is all Metropolitans.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 9:51 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I just watched that..
It was the first time I’ve ever LOLed at anything on Sportscenter…They really have been terrible this year…
Dick and Dunk, the answer to your pitcher's problems...
by The_teague on Jul 7, 2009 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, when i saw that betty was selected to pitch in the asg
i threw up in my mouth a little bit…
I want to be the no-talent ass clown!
by RosevilleRedbird on Jul 7, 2009 10:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
BiPolar Betty
Actual converastion with a stranger at a bar:
Me: looks up at espn announcing the pitchers HOLY CRAP!! WTF IS JASON MARQUIS DOING ON THAT LIST?!?!
Some Dude: He’s having a GREAT YEAR!!
Me: Really?!!? He’s horrible, is he on fire or something??
Dude: He’s got 10 wins!!!
Me: Stupid look
Dude: Disbelieved my stupid look-look
Me: ….soooo outside of run support has he done anything that leads anybody to believe he’s having a good year?
Dude: He’s.got.10.wins.
Me: Check please.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 10:01 AM EDT reply actions 3 recs
And that stranger was...
Jason Marquis
by cloistermaximus on Jul 7, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ASG-related Question
I managed to snag a ticket with a buddy of mine to all the events, but it is SRO. My buddy has the tickets so I am not sure exactly what they say on them, but are there multiple SRO areas? Where are they? And if there are multiple areas, are there specific, designated “SRO” areas (i.e., will our tickets be for a certain SRO area or will we be able to get into any/all SRO areas?)
Thanks for any help you can provide.
Lou Brock loves Lamp.
by birdjam on Jul 7, 2009 10:04 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes
there are painted lines on the concrete around a lot of the entry areas to sections designated for SRO.
The best thing to do w/ SRO is to go up to the casino queen party porch and try to get a railing in front of the stairs going up, or just hang out at the bar.
"I usually don’t read other peoples sigs." -Cuttah
by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Thank you very much
I bet that porch will be slammed with people for the HR derby.
Lou Brock loves Lamp.
by birdjam on Jul 7, 2009 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey...
Mobile commenting – well this is new. Now if I only had something relevant to add…
by mattyp on Jul 7, 2009 10:17 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
Wow
There’s a little info bit about it on the “Post A Comment” bar, too. Now, you can comment from the game (as opposed to simply talking on the phone with or texting or pixing someone).
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hah
might as well comment, I already check the VEB game thread 2 or 3 times whenever I’m attending a game just to see what posters’ thoughts were on a certain play or player.
by mattyp on Jul 7, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
is there a mobile site
because each time i try and load VEB from my phone it chokes
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
mobile.vivaelbirdos.com
…just tried from my iphone…waiting to see…
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just type in vivaelbirdos.com
on my iphone (actually made it a home screen icon) and it automatically takes me to the mobile site. Now SB Nation just needs to add an edit function so I can go back and make my first comment a little more memorable. I admit, it was pretty weak for being as far as I know the first ever mobile post on VEB. I had my shot at glory and I blew it.
by mattyp on Jul 7, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
yeah i shoulda waited
until i was sloppy drunk at the game and getting my VEB commenting and my booty call txting mixed up…would have been EPIC.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
sorry it wasn't :(
the reply to the first post says “via mobile” after the timestamp and was about an hour earlier than you :)
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i posted from my iphone on here
months ago
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Testing
Boom! Side note: veb loads much faster on my iPhone than IE. I’d like to post from games but pre drinking at hrboskys and Shannon rules I’m way too drunk by the 3rd to be coherent.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 10:43 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
someone actually goes to Hrabosky’s? Seriously though, how is it? I am thinking it pretty decent since chances are AL is never there before the games.
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Jul 7, 2009 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hottest hired guns (girls that are paid to be hot) around the stadium.
I dated one that worked there a while…allegedly some big names go there (she named dropped Jed and Johnny Damon).
The two way mirror in the bathroom his hilarious. There is this meat cart at the entrance…I don’t know if it has anything to do with Al’s but it’s the best beef briscuit EVAR.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two way mirror in the bathroom?
I’ve only seen one of those once, in a little island-themed shithole near Roger Dean. It was a little surprising to look up from my business to find myself with a view behind the bar. Then it was quite creepy. Then it just seemed like an extraordinary security risk.
Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.
by liam on Jul 7, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
too bad
you can’t see replies indented in single column view :(
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 11:16 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
it also seems that mobile posts by you
won’t auto load…i posted the above from my mobile but it didn’t show up till i refreshed, though that isn’t a problem 99% of the time.
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They aren't
indented, but there are lines separating the mini-threads.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was thinking
the same thing. I am such a nerd.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm going to need a new battery for my blackberry
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I carry a spare inmy purse.
I might actually have to use it now.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In the Phillies 10 run 1st inning last night where they batted around +3
Howard made 2 outs.
I really, really don’t like the guy, for all the obvious reasons. If he gets an AB in the ASG I hope he strikes out swinging so hard the wind knocks a beer out of the hands of a guy in the first row.
Of course, the ASG game is in St. Louis where he turns into Babe Ruth, so I’m sure he’ll hit a 12 run home run into the Mississippi.
by cloistermaximus on Jul 7, 2009 10:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I just
want to see the NL win for a change.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
how long has it been? I guess this is payback for when I was a kid and the NL always won.
youneverknow
by floodOfLove on Jul 7, 2009 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The NL is 6-18-1 in my lifetime in the ASG
Barf.
I also wish I could be in the AL locker room to hear Ichiro’s speech about the NL.
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?" - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Jul 7, 2009 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
or Pujols bitching about being benched
…and I understood spanish.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can't believe there is no footage of that anywhere.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The man is an international treasure
[Compulsory article link]
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "5.7 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ichiro's speech is always considered the highlight for the AL All Stars.
The brotherhood of baseball players will never let the contents of the speech out. Never. It’s their secret weapon. I think the AL keeps winning until Ichiro disappears.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on Jul 7, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe it involves a sword
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dan Haren, Roy Halladay and the Rule V draft.
Could trading for one of these two help us with our upcoming Rule V problems? I’m sure the package for either would have to be large, but both of them figure to improve moving to STL. Halladay is signed until 2010, Haren until 2013, and both figure to outperform their salaries. I know the arguments against spending lots of cash, but these are both Cy-young pitchers.
Wallace is probably the starting point though I’m not sure where he fits on the D-Backs. Maybe we can use this to get something for Bryan Anderson. Perhaps Tyler Greene can make his exit with this trade as well, and then the remaining talent comes from our minor league pitching/OF group.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
this has been Mo's plan all along
that crafty bastard! Well Played Mo, well played.
Now if I could only decided who I wanted more. I would go with Haren, but having him here would just remind me of the Mulder years, so I have to go with Halladay.
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Jul 7, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who would I want more?
Haren. For the simple fact that he’s signed longer. I’d be happy either way, though.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think I could forget
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
anderson is injured.
Season ending shoulder surgery iirc.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 12:49 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
does anyone think that
Rasmus may still be the starting point? young, cost-controlled and impressing as a rookie.
by longhornscardinals on Jul 7, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not from the Cards point of view
Need a cost controlled CF to offset all the $$ going to the starters and Albert over the next few years.
by ubeddie on Jul 7, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i will flip my fucking lid
if they trade rasmus for less than hanley and jesus christ on steroids
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
wasn't saying the Cards would do it...
just saying, teams may be asking for him as a centerpiece.
by longhornscardinals on Jul 7, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh yeah
teams would love to have him
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we already have him
his jersey is #5
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can see the flames licking at your toes ProJ
But don’t worry, I’ll go easy on you.
by OperaCard on Jul 7, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
NO.
and get out of my car
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if I had Dan Haren to trade
I’d ask for no less than Rasmus+. Haren is having a cy young season. I don’t see Haren as a possibility. They’ll be asking more than the Cards are willing to pay for Hallady as well.
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 1:33 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Haren is on a 4YR/45M deal. If we get him, we’d have to pay him that and would hope that he performs and stays sufficiently healthy to make the 15M club option for a fifth year worthwhile.
Rasmus is on pace to be worth over 5 wins above replacement this year despite seeing plenty of bench time, on pace for an estimated market value of about 24M and a league minimum salary. He’s under team control for the next five years, 3-4 of which will be in arbitration.
If we give Rasmus lower estimates and call him a 4 WAR player for the next 5 years that’s about 90M of estimated present-day market value. So looking at it that way Dan Haren could cost over 30M/YR if you traded Rasmus to get him, less the amount that you would have paid Rasmus. If Rasmus performs equal to or better than his 22 year-old rookie year, it gets more expensive. If your 28 year-old pitcher gets injured, it gets a LOT more expensive :)
by astrostl on Jul 7, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
There is exactly
0 chance of the Cardinals taking on more pitching with the potential salaries you’re talking about.
by OperaCard on Jul 7, 2009 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not advocating it!
Just expanding on how crazy “Rasmus+” projections could cost in estimated USD.
by astrostl on Jul 7, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you for your rationality.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and to add some irrationality
I can’t imagine ANYTHING that would be funnier to the GOB than to see us trade our young future-ace SP for an injured ex-ace SP, and then turn around and trade our future MVP-caliber CF for our own ex-future-ace SP, who is about to become injured (because that’s what pitchers do).
Please, Mo, for both our sake AND Dan Haren’s, please don’t do this. It’s the GM equivalent of stepping on a crack, scuffing the first base line, spitting into the wind, bragging about your no-hitter in the 6th inning, etc.
- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc
by SleepyCA on Jul 8, 2009 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Toss a big pu-pu platter of our marginal prospects...
…and toss in a big name for Haren or Halladay? I like it!
Wallace, T. Greene, Anderson, and RANDOM PITCHER?
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Per Joe Strauss' Twitter
He’s cleared to play and will join the team in Milwaukee
by mysterui on Jul 7, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hooray!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?" - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Jul 7, 2009 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hooray beer
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
mmm, beer
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i got a tweet...
from bernie saying hes going to the DL and stavi is coming up
by bigmcq16 on Jul 7, 2009 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
not something I'd brag about
on this, or any, forum. Tweeted by Bernie! Oooohhh, I’m all a-twitter!
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh, official site
and DanUp’s note above both say he’s on the DL, back after ASG.
by ArkansasTravs on Jul 7, 2009 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why am I not surprised?
by the DeRosa news?
Proud sponsor of the Official 2009 StL Cardinal theme song: Reason to Believe
by gocards62 on Jul 7, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have to ask, DanUp
Do you and rb share a definition of “brief”? Has he been rubbing off on you?
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?" - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Jul 7, 2009 11:42 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
was wondering the same thing
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
red have been brief lately
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh Howard
What I’m kinda looking forward too with him is when 0 teams offer him the mega contract he’s looking for (and would be on track for given his arbitration wins) based on the praised bestowed upon him by people living outside their mother’s basements. Then again there’s always a Bill Bavasi or Dayton Moore lurking in the shadows of stupidity.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 11:53 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The Royals will go after him...
I mean, they only had Kila, Gload, Butler, and Guillen battling it out for the 1B/DH spot, so they had to go trade for Mike Jacobs…right?
by stlfan on Jul 8, 2009 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmmm
Cubs have finally figured out not to bat Soriano in leadoff, and to put Fukudome and Theriot ahead of Lee, A-Ram, Board Game, and Alf. this kind of worries me…. but at least Ramirez will take a while to get back to his normal self (if he even does) and heh, Milton Bradley.
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It won't work
Soriano will huff and puff and do like crap wherever they put him…Cause you know hes a lead off hitter…and a second baseman.
by RiverRat on Jul 7, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's funny
Soriano is not really that much different than Ankiel (if Ank played at Wrigley more he’d probably have more home runs)
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fuk's OBP was .266 in July
What DOES worry me is that it’s starting to look like Lee has found some bat speed. Some of his swings are looking pretty good lately, and obviously he’s found some power.
by sdrone on Jul 7, 2009 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Barden does not excite me.
Neither do any of the other options…But, Stav did infect us with a pretty good ability to hit with RISP. I would rather see him as a bench bat.
(cant believe I just said that)
The only one who liked the Cardinals so much he became a St. Louis Cardinals football fan.
by coachnick39 on Jul 7, 2009 1:08 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
3B against LHP
so DeRosa can play LF and Ank, Duncan and Thurston can man the bench.
by ubeddie on Jul 7, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe Barden will kill the Cubs again this weekend
then we send him back down
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
stavinoha as a bench bat is nonsense.
stavinoha had 15 hits. a few of them came when he had risp. but that’s chance, not a skill.
stavinoha’s slash lines this year w/ risp:.316/.333/.474
his slash lines last year w/ risp: .063/.111/.063
in both 2008 & 2009, nick had about 60 PA’s.
Overall, he’s a terrible hitter (this year on the whole — .234/.242/.359). there’s no reason to put nick stavinoha on a major league team. there’s none.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is Craig having THAT bad a year
that he can’t be considered instead of Stavinoha? We’ve already seen what Stav can/can’t do.
Proud sponsor of the Official 2009 StL Cardinal theme song: Reason to Believe
by gocards62 on Jul 7, 2009 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
stavinoha simply isn't a major league player
he offers the team nothing in terms of hitting ability, positional flexibility, defense, speed or even much power. I’d rather have Robinson and he’s not a major league ballplayer either.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can't believe you did either.
Considering being better with RISP is not a repeatable skill and he had a whopping 21 PAs in said scenario. He also has a .650 OPS in games he has entered as a PH or sub, which is not exactly a valuable asset on the bench (13 PAs).
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I did not say that I liked or agreed with saying what I said.
We now have the black hole of MLB offense...×5. Barden, Stavi, Thurston, Ank, and Dunc. I do not feel encouraged that to go along with that group we have LaRue and Hoffpauir.
…Ummm, Help! Somebody, Please!
The only one who liked the Cardinals so much he became a St. Louis Cardinals football fan.
by coachnick39 on Jul 7, 2009 1:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
A few notes...
- I actually really like Ryan Howard. I met the guy in person and he’s a really good man. Now, he can’t field and insists on stretching with two hands at first, which I can only assume he does because he literally can’t catch. He’s also become a dramatically worse hitter in recent seasons…he was once a guy who could use all fields (and really hit the ball to left better IMO) but he’s turned into a true pull-donkey. He’s got a .325 OBP this year, which is ghastly considering he’s supposed to be one of the game’s elite players. With all of that said, he is one of the faces of baseball and the ASG is in his home town, so I’m not surprised he got a roster spot. I don’t think he should be, and I doubt he plays beyond a PH. I don’t see some Rowand-for-Pujols move coming from HIS manager!
- Jason Marquis and Tim Wakefield should not be All-Stars. As I say this, I notice that Marquis threw 8 IN of 1 R ball yesterday…but still. Marquis has a 4.11 FIP and his team already has Brad Hawpe going. Why does Marquis need to be there? He might actually get booed! Wakefield has been a good pitcher and a fun guy for baseball to have, but he’s not an elite-type player. I heard Maddon argue that Wakefield has earned it as a career achievement award…bullshit! Hell he took a spot from his teammate, Jon Lester…Lester’s ERA isn’t great, but he’s got a 10+ K-rate…Cliff Lee has an argument too with his 3.31 FIP. Whatever.
- The Phillies won 22-1 yesterday. 22-1. I made this comment last night, but that game’s Win Probability graph looked like one half of Uluru, better known by its English name Ayers Rock (note…I HATE using English names for natively named landmarks…It’s not Mt. McKinley, it’s Denali, it’s not Mt. Everest, it’s Chomolungma…puting away the soap box). Here’s the original comment.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 1:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Manuel chose Howard
I don’t understand all the harumph about Howard. He’s from St. Louis, he hits the sh*t out of the ball at Busch and his manager is the National League AS Mgr. Wow – what a surprise.
And Marquis pitched quite well last night, which I realize does not a season make. I think I have a soft spot for the guy since I watched him beat the Yanks and Wang at old Busch way back when 8-1. And his team makes the playoffs every stinking year. I’d take him instead of welly or pinata, who take away those 2 met games, ain’t all that good statistically speaking this year.
Sometimes the sabres display just as much annoying conceit as the stubborn joe morgan’s of the world. it’s annoying.
by bagofballs on Jul 7, 2009 1:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I wonder which pitcher should have made it over Marquis
too lazy to look it up right now
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Javier Vazquez
for one
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
carp?
Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.
by liam on Jul 7, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's got a case too...
…so does A.D.A.M.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Forgot that he wasn’t on it. Silly stupid.
Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.
by liam on Jul 7, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
TLR would hint strongly against it
He’d just get Charlie to bench them.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am sort of ambivalent
would have been nice to see Carp there, but at the same time it’s nice to have him resting
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh yeah
that guy should have made it for sure
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ubaldo Jimenez on his own team would be 1000x more fun
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did you read Erik Manning's article about that on FanGraphs?
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ubaldo Jimenez
To channel Erik.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's not surprising
It’s disappointing that a player who isn’t very good got chosen.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Derosa to the DL
Stavinhoa up. Per Strauss Twitter.
FUCK
THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!
by stltrav09 on Jul 7, 2009 1:37 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i think we need a stronger swear word.
“fuck” doesn’t seem to cut it.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
BraunHarenMulder!
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Super-fuck? Fucktastic?
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
didn't strauss
just report that he was fine?
by cdb on Jul 7, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He reported that Derosa was still scheduled to join the team today.
He never said anything about him being cleared to play.
THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!
by stltrav09 on Jul 7, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
stl today
GOB must really like seeing Thursty on the field.
by ubeddie on Jul 7, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Retroactive to the 1st
Which means he’ll be off the DL in time for our first post-ASG contest. Smart move by the club.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm going to try to be optimistic -- almost always a mistake with injuries and this club -
and just say this is done to give him the max amount of rest. as a precaution. and not because it’s worse than we were first told.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good point
Hopefully, this isn’t the Cards organization following its modus operandi to a “t.”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This injury doesn't just vanish
He will have Cortisone, rest, and then live on anti inflammatory meds the rest of the year. It will no doubt cut his power in half. We need base runners anyway. Maybe he will begin doing a stroke and slap attack. It might work out for the best. This is also silver lining BS.
by OperaCard on Jul 8, 2009 2:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
bastards coated bastards with bastard filling
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why stavinoha? why not give jay a try? or see shane again? at least those guys can play defense.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
holy f
we are cursed with the injuries! the guy didn’t even get a hit as a Cardinal yet!
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least the DL trip can be retro'ed
since they never made him pinch run.
"I usually don’t read other peoples sigs." -Cuttah
by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so
when’s the earliest he can return?
it has to have been 10 days already
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
has to have been less than 10 days...
so he can return post ASG
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I posted above
But, it’s retroactive to July 1, meaning he’ll be able to come back, assuming he’s healthy, on our first game after the All-Star Break. I think it’s a good move by the organization. (Not Stav, mind you, just DL’ing DeRo.)
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh, GOB.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
god.
damnit.
no fucking breaks
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
was this intentionally ironic?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i hope not
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ryan Howard should not be an all-star.
Charlie Manual hand picked Howard to be on the team to “take care of his guy.” It is completely ridiculous to have 4 first basemen on the roster when the voted starter is the best player in the game AND playing the ASG in his home stadium. As a Cards fan, I would be very disappointed if Albert plays less than 4 innings in the game. As a manager for a team competing for the playoffs, Charlie Manual should be setting his roster to win the ASG for home field advantage in the WS (but since the Phillies haven’t been good at home this year, maybe Manual is throwing it).
by Jumsy on Jul 7, 2009 1:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
my thoughts were on this yesterday too
and I have come to some of my own conclusions.
1. Pujols will get a minimum of two at-bats, but i think Manuel will want him to get through 5 innings or 3ABs so the crowd and the game feel satisfied.
2. Gonzalez or Fielder will be the first in to replace him.
3. The other will be the first pinch hitter used for the pitcher’s spot, depending on which AL hurler is on the mound, and will NOT enter the game defensively.
Since there will be no DH, and no manager would ever want any pitcher hurt in an all-star game at the plate, I would be very surprised if ANY pitcher batted at all in this game, unless it was after the 10th/11th innings, and benches were depleted.
4. Howard will be used as a late inning PH, and will enter the game defensively if extra innings look probable.
I think Manuel will do this for the following reasons….he knows Pujols deserves multiple ABs, as do ALL the starters, and that the home crowd should be rewarded with that as well; he feels that Gonzalez/Fielder deserve to play next ahead of Howard; and the benefit of not having to play Howard as much actually benefits his own team—a la TLR / Pujols 2007 all-star game. He also will be able to put Howard in to hit a long ball deep in the game, when it may be needed most, therefore his decision can be looked at as the right one to be made.
To be honest, I’m more worried about what the NL Outfield is going to look like with no Beltran/Ibanez potentially. Victorino/Kemp will be the only CF players, that is if Victorino makes it as the last fan vote player.
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Jul 7, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pujols should just play the entire game and all the other first basemen should be the designated hitters.
As in, every time the pitcher’s spot comes up.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
now, that I could swallow.
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Jul 7, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Resists.......urge........
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Me too...
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just do it - it'll feel so good
=)
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There are times when it is so hard to hold it in
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
hahahaha
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!
There, I feel better.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
[Cathartic rec]
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That strikes me as a very sensible idea
I mean, why not leave your best hitter in the whole game, and why let any pitchers bat in the all-star game? Replacing pitchers with Fielder and Gonzalez (and that other guy, what’s his name?) would be pretty sweet and we get to keep Albert in there. It makes so much sense it probably will never happen.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
PTBNL Rules
I believe I read that the PTBNL has to be “agreed upon” between the two clubs.
Is this true?
In other words.. we could say “Derosa was on and off the DL for 3 months.. no way in hell you’re getting Todd or Samuel!” : D
THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!
by stltrav09 on Jul 7, 2009 1:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
They usually create a short list of players to choose from..
and then agree later on from there (within six months). If no agreement is reached, a cash settlement can be made.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
Usually there is a list from which the acquiring team can pick. I doubt the Cards will have any ability to “agree.” Cleveland must just pick before the agreed upon deadline.
by OCCardsFan on Jul 7, 2009 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the list is already made
we’ve already agreed to the players on the list. They get time to select the player they want. They’re not going to be nice to us just b/c DeRosa’s hurt. That’s our problem.
by chuckb on Jul 7, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mentioned by Jon Heyman yesterday:
Pedro Martinez intends to sign with a team within a week, and the Cards are “on the periphery” of teams thought to possibly be involved.
by BTown Birds fan on Jul 7, 2009 1:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
If he signs for 5MM pro-rated
It’s highway robbery.
THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!
by stltrav09 on Jul 7, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
let's stay on the periphery and let somebody else get burned.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
Unless he’s gonna pull a Marquis.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
MooCow, please insert comment here...
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Jul 7, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Moo Cow's out in the pasture, grazing somewhere
by ridgesee on Jul 7, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks... that figures....
he says his statement 6 times today and the one time I try to catch a ride on his coat tail, he’s out chewing cud somewhere….. oh well.
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Jul 7, 2009 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
im posting
I don’t have internet at home only on my phone…so for months and months I have read the blog and comments as a wannabe eager looking in like the little kid that the older kids won’t let play! But today everything has changed! And after all this time in silence I can now voice my opinion. And this is what I have to say…yeah I really got nothing.
by bmoorelikealbert on Jul 7, 2009 2:43 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
welcome
sounds like a freedom story…someone call hallmark…
Dick and Dunk, the answer to your pitcher's problems...
by The_teague on Jul 7, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
welcome!
and “got nothing” doesn’t stop lots of people (self included) from rambling on here… don’t let that stop you.
"He ran hard, but he didn't run fast. He runs like he's mad at the ground." - opposing broadcaster describing Yadi's speed.
by TNTinCO on Jul 7, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you're already a better poster than GDM
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you have a lot of baseball knowledge
just not the advanced stats stuff
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
thanks dude
i’m trying to learn, i really am.
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i rely on the advanced stats folks
I’m a bit of a stat nerd, but just don’t have the time/willpower to make the real points I want to make. I’d rather make “Shawon Dunston had a better arm than Dwight Gooden” jokes, and let the real pros take over.
So, thank you, real stat nerd pros. Now, back to my 12-sided dice.
by Expatcardfan on Jul 7, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
all about the franklins
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/all-about-franklins
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 2:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
"Mr. Awesome Chin-Hair has been the de facto closer ever since. And now, he's an All-Star."
And there it is.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the HECK does this mean?
“This pitch is 89 MPH. The pitch also has 3 inches of higher vertical movement than his slider. "
does “higher vertical movement” mean it drops LESS than his slider?
Man why can’t these people just talk about left/right up/down movement.
by sdrone on Jul 7, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
might want to point it out
Author dealing with two under-five-year-olds.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
Convoluted for sure, but that was the intention
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Depends on your reference point
The designated reference point for PITCHf/xers tends to be 0,0 whereas the typical reference point for people is a fastball which is at something like -5,8. So relative to the fastball it drops less than his slider yeah but relative to a non-spinning ball his cutter “rises” more.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's like you people are working together
to mess with me.
by sdrone on Jul 7, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We've got a club.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll be honest
I literally am in my parents basement.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do they know you're there?
or did they lock you in?
by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Jul 7, 2009 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've pretty well locked myself in
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jul 7, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Higher vertical movement means up
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 7, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
eh
Stavinoha…. he reminds me of some random player on the 90s Cards teams
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 2:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
paquette?
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
pretty good comparison
probably not that good a player though
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jimmy agrees
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder why Prince Fielder's and Ryan Braun's BABIP is so high
might be a good thing for us!
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 2:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I have an "outside the box" thought
What would it cost us to get Eckstein back? I know that I am dreaming, but I can’t help it.
I say K. Green, Duncan, and Ank + a million dollars. Then we tie up Moz in his big leather office chair and let Ecks beat him unconscious with a nerf bat….just a thought.
by cardfanndeboonies on Jul 7, 2009 2:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
please go back in your box.
david eckstein is no longer good at baseball.
i thought that memo went out.
and Mo, despite some gaffes, is a pretty good GM.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Moz is a good GM
get it straight
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is a joke, right?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Groan. . .
Generally, his worse moves (and there haven’t really been any killers) have been forced by TLR or upstairs, so yeah, I think he’s a pretty good GM.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Jul 7, 2009 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
exactly
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I saw a poll in a semi recent SI in the waiting room of the Dentist's Office
And I think TLR was 3rd on the list of managers players would least like to play for based on info from a players poll. I think #1 was Lou Pinella.
by TheBirds on Jul 7, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yup
and Ozzie Guillen was #2.
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Judging by your comment
and the fact that you joined VEB on 7/4/09, I’m gonna venture to guess that you came over from the P-D boards.
Comments like that won’t buy you many cyber-friends, that’s for sure.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's definitely outside the box.
If by box you mean sanity.
Also, Mo is cool.
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he's the man in the box
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He IS the box.
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
???
Strange comment.
David Eckstein is pretty bad. The term “marginal upgrade at best” comes to mind.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ummmm.... I was only kidding
Next time I will send everyone a telegram stating such. I was only expressing my frustration at watching a team that should be good and plays like they are sleep walking way too much.
by cardfanndeboonies on Jul 7, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
WHAT'S IN THE BOX????
WHAT’S IN THE BOX?
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
step one
cut a hole in the box.
2. put your junk in that box
3. make her open the box
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i was going for 7
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh I know....
but like I can pass up a d*ck in a box.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I gotta admit that was pretty good
by cardfanndeboonies on Jul 7, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes, yes it was
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this DeRosa news is so typical of this season
And this team. I’m sooooo pissed. Couldn’t have happened at a worse time either with the “hundred year suck” getting healthy and hot. Ankiel and Duncan had better figure out how to drive in runs over the next 6 days or the Cards could fall all the way to 3rd place.
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 3:12 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
so if I understand you correctly
it’s the Cardinal’s fault that DeRosa wrist didn’t heal fast enough?
also, we’re going to fall all the way to 3rd place? Really? It seems to me that were were able to climb into first place without DeRosa, so I doubt not having him for another week is what will make or break our season.
Albert Pujols is ridiculous.
by stlhulsey on Jul 7, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no no no let me clarify
I wasn’t trying to blame anyone. Just expressing anger at the bad luck. And maybe a little anger at two underperforming outfielders. I didn’t say anything about the season being over either. But 3rd place is a realistic possibility before the all star break. Let’s not kid ourselves. Am I the only one who thinks the team has had a string of bad luck when it comes to the front line starters? Glaus, KGreene, Carp, Lohse, now DeRo. This is a very important 6 days and I was really hoping to watch DeRosa get mass rbi in wrigley over the weekend. You might understand my angst better if you lived in Chicago and had to deal with abuse from Cubs fans everyday. I really really hate the Cubs and they ARE showing signs of life.
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 3:33 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
at least it's just a sprain (I hope)
and he is getting extra time off to heal and come back as a bad ass mofo
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but he is missing the series at Wrigley
Eliminates the chance of DeRo having the game winning hit in just one of the four games. Guess we’ll have to settle for a playoff berth instead.
by ubeddie on Jul 7, 2009 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
heh
yeah, it would have been nice to see him go to Wrigley in a Cards uni, fo sho
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chicago hasn't had the best luck either
Harden, Zambrano, and Ramirez have all lost time. It’s the nature of the game. You have to play through injuries. If anything, we should feel fortunate that we’ll have Carp for this stretch of games. Saturday, he’s slated to face Lilly.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
remember when we were all groaning about Carp getting injured while batting?
ah, those were the days
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
zambrano lost time because he's a jackass
And harden was only ever expected to make 20-25 starts. They did loose Aram and Guzman and Reed Johnson to injuries but all 3 came back yesterday. As I said the timing really sucks.
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 3:58 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
We've also had bad luck
with players just forgetting how to hit. Mather, Duncan, Ankiel, Ludwick, Freese, Craig
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
stupid amnesia-inducing chili bowl
Lucky Rasmus only got gastritis.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mather = wrist injury
Freese also hurt
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well they both started the season
healthy, sucked, then got hurt.
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
how does that compute?
freese’s injury was from a car accident in January. how was he not injured in April? and mather couldn’t hit back in ST as a result of off-season wrist injuries. they both started the season not on the DL, but that is hardly the same as not being injured.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes, neither one of those guys were healthy at the start of the season
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let me clarify.
They both started the season “healthy”, sucked, then went on the DL.
Just because these are injuries that existed before the season started does not mean that they were considered injured when the season began. No one here expected Freese or Mather to go on the DL when spring training started. That’s why we all expected one or both to make the team. Freese played in 32 games between Memphis and STL, and Mather played in 39 games for Memphis. The team must have viewed them as healthy enough to play, because they did. That’s why I said they started out healthy. Maybe they were healthy like Pujols’ elbow is healthy, but they were still supposed to be playing.
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes, but we only thought that because we were lead to believe
their injuries were not as bad as they are. it still doesn’t change the fact that at the beginning of the season both guys were hurt.
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Arguing in circles...
What you say is correct. That’s what I’m saying.
We were lead to believe they were fine, so we thought they were healthy enough to play. The team said they were healthy. Only when they didn’t play well did the team realize, “hey, maybe they aren’t actually healthy.” At that point, they went on the DL. If you look at how the organization handles their situations, they were: “healthy”, the didn’t perform, then the went on the DL.
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the injuries sure didn't help their performance
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know.
But the team only realized that the injuries were serious when they didn’t perform. We only realized that the injuries were serious when they didn’t perform. Obviously the injuries hurt their performance.
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
just think if we had a good way to not let injured players play while injured
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
then how would you know
if they had grit?
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
by giveml on Jul 7, 2009 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So I am officially done
reading royals review, i tried to at least root for a home town team since i moved from st loui 8 yrs ago, i am undoubtably a cards fan tattoo pic if anyone wants to see, but i at least tried to root for them seeing as theyre in the AL, but anyone else think im crazy when i say royals fans are completely classless? I am so glad the majority of us do not resort to the crap they throw at each other and other fans
Pujols takes out "I" in BIG and "A" in MAC, previously considered to be an unyielding, consonant threat
by DESTROYER on Jul 7, 2009 3:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It all depends
I know some intelligent and thoughtful Royals fans. I also imagine that there are some classless Cards fans.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
undecided
I had a good time at Kauffman. They did seem to really like their karaoke, though.
However, they did send their color guy to quiz morans outside Busch Stadium with brain teasers like what’s the longest river, what’s the third planet from the sun, what happened in 1492. Put it up on the big screen throughout the game. (The Missouri has a bigger watershed and which sun, exactly? 1492 is soooo Eurocentric.)
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
GET A BRAIN, MORANS!!!!!!!!!!
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
as far as I could tell
The mixed-population of tailgaters was lively and peaceable. Stadium was really nice, though I raised my brows at 1) lack of vendors and lots of ushers, 2) the message at the beginning begging fans to be civil. But man, if we had a sweet scoreboard like that, I don’t think Busch would spend a lot of time with a video package mocking Cubs fans or something.
I mean, they kind of take care of that themselves.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope you know I was referring to this:
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
...so was I.
Check my spelling m
:p
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sign or bandana?
Which is better?
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Go USA sign
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not the "Free Rick" one?
Must have been taken in May
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it isn't a Free Ryan Ludwick sign?
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh my mistake
That’s an “i”. I thought it was a random sparkly thing.
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sparkly things aren't random.
That shit was calculated. Coldly.
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
is that like TLR's double-switches?
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder if this dude knows how to spell moron now
heh
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
no
He has to learn to use the intertubes first.
It’s like the Amish. We wouldn’t still be joking about him if he were online. [looks around for g…]
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I dunno
I think I’d wager he’s seen this by now
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so which one of us is he?
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've seen this pic in a few different places
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You got me.
It’s me. I live in deep southern Illinois, and I’m from the single-wide livin’, 4-wheelin’, monster-truck drivin’ capital of the USA.
You all are a bunch of morans!!! Geez, git a brain!
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
by Eckstreem on Jul 7, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
awesome
that is all
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Jul 7, 2009 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Missouri river drains more than the 1/3 of the U.S. that the Mississippi
river drains?
I’m know the Missouri is a longer river, but the Mississippi is supposed to have the 3rd largest basin in the world.
by sdrone on Jul 7, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the confusion comes from a bit of a geographic misnomer.
river names are supposed to follow the name of the longest branch. so, following conventional geography terms, the Mississippi should be a tributary of the Missouri, and the stretch of river flowing from Alton to New Orleans ought to be the Missouri River, because the distance from central montana to alton is longer than the distance from central minnesota to alton. historically, we mapped the mississippi long before the missouri, so we called the alton-new orleans strip of river the mississippi instead.
so, you’ll often see smart-ass geographers calling the mississippi basin the missouri-mississippi or something.
regardless, the longest river in the world is the Nile.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wanna party with a smart-ass geographer...
I can’t imagine all the tomfoolery and/or ballyhoo.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
found one
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
hahaah
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Never knew all of this
Interesting.
VivaElBirdos...Scoring less, but more frequently since approximately 1903.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 7, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but more water comes into the Mississippi at Cairo from the Ohio
than from the Mississippi itself. I don’t know about overall length, but the Ohio drains more water than either the Mississippi or the Missouri (or both combined).
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
by Eckstreem on Jul 7, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
damn those dams
The Ohio also has two fairly large lakes damed up behind it via the Tennessee River (Kentucky Lake) and Cumberland River (Lake Barkley).
Interesting side note about the Ohio, my grandfather helped start a “cross river swim” right across the point where the Tennessee and Ohio Rivers finally merge for good. The current here is damn strong so you have to swim upstream and nearly doubles the amount you actually swim compared to the distance across.
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ohio sucks
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sick of AAAA players on the Cards
I know there aren’t many options right now, but seriously, Stav and Barden again? Barden has managed a .252 wOBA while he was in Memphis. Of course DeRosa would get hurt right after we trade for him… grumble
The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.
by thegodfather on Jul 7, 2009 3:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
So I am listening to The Fastlane
And Bob Ramsey is saying that the Derosa Era is already over because of the wrist injury… can anybody explain to me what he is talking about? I don’t understand what a wrist strain has to do with him re-signing at the end of the year.
SlamalamaJackADongWick cares very little about your draft pick standing-by gdm426
by FredbirdisaDork on Jul 7, 2009 4:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
he's trying to drum up controversy for ratings
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that what i was thinking
he is saying that Derosa is certainly going to have surgery after the season… I normally like him, but I just did not agree that this is as big of a deal as he says it is
SlamalamaJackADongWick cares very little about your draft pick standing-by gdm426
by FredbirdisaDork on Jul 7, 2009 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he is just making sure
he isn’t set up to be disappointed. If you don’t expect anything from DeRosa you wont be disappointed if he doesn’t come back.
by Evilfrog on Jul 7, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
we need more mentions of liches, ghouls, wights, vampires, mummies, zombies, and wraiths in this topic
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
PEGACORN
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmm
I like the idea of an undead pegacorn. sort of a Night Mare unicorn mix
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmm
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Jul 7, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now I'm gonna have Night Mares
about Zombiecorns! It’s like playing a game of Magic: The Gathering while having a bad acid trip and you’re in your underwear.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
sounds familiar
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
heh
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
leave it to the True Blood guy to bring up
effin’ vampires…..
;-)
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey
I didn’t name the post Undead Tuesday. Liches are far more powerful than vampires dude.
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
just effin' with you...
got into a huge True Blood faux debate over the weekend, so it’s fresh in my mind.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am on episode 4, it's pretty good
not amazing, but pretty good
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
drink it in, Chitown
(vampire style)
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes
I am one of them! born in 1752
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll take any excuse to bring up Buffy
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I always preferred willow
Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.
Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU
by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
gotta buy that movie still
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Liches are far more powerful than vampires dude."
And Pujols is a far better baseball player than Ryan Howard. I mean, duh!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
now that would be a weird art piece
having Pujols as a lich destroying vampire Howard
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
how I forgot ghosts, ghasts, spectres and revenants in that list is beyond me
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's what I was thinking
but before I responded I actually (for the first time) read the entire thread saving me from the embarrassment of having pointed this out after you realized it.
Whew. Dodged a FLAGGING there I’m sure of it.
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
heh
I have been known not to read whole threads before too
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rest easy gentleman
Nick Stavinoha is here. No more wasting playing time on that Ramus kid.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 7, 2009 4:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Cody Ramus was a punk anyways
Always lollygagging.
by TheBirds on Jul 7, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
HA...
I missed where the “Ramus” reference (if it was intentional) comes from.
However, TLR DEFINITELY referred to C-O-L-B-Y as “Cody” in one of his “why are you even bothering to ask questions” post-game thingamajigs. Brought back memories of a certain “Young Pitcher.”
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hardcore may have just made a typo
But I like the idea of never getting his name right. So that is going to be my new nick for him.
by TheBirds on Jul 7, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I saw no typo
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh wait
I missed it
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My lady calls him that
she knows his name is Rasmus but prefers Ramus. As in ‘Ray-mus’.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 7, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I should've known you had a reason...
other than, say, to keep him from getting too big a head.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Protoge of Jim Edwards
defy, cards, defy. hey logic --- you suck.
by effin fisk on Jul 7, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stavinoha
IS BACK!
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The GOBs will be pleased
Sometimes I think all these injuries in StL and Memphis are part of a devious plot by them to get Stavi MLB playing time.
Is Sugar Shane hurt? At least he can play ok defense.
by TheBirds on Jul 7, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
would have rather seen a number of different outfielders before Stavi
but hey, I guess he’s got more ML experience
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No kidding
Ramus really hasn’t made anything memorable since Groundhog Day
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Harold Ramis has a new Ghostbusters movie coming out.
Dick and Dunk, the answer to your pitcher's problems...
by The_teague on Jul 7, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually I've heard a little about it
I’m intrigued! If imdb.com is correct a lot of the original people will be in it, hopefully they won’t mess it up. Indiana Jones left me feeling kinda “eh” and it would be nice to see an 80’s revival movie that is really good.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 7, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Indy 5 is coming up I heard
and I heard Ford will be back…..
Also George Clooney is rumored to have an interest in playing Jack Ryan
"People call me El Hombre," Pujols said. "But only Stan is the Man."
by StLHugo on Jul 7, 2009 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Speaking of effing up movies:
I can’t believe just how awful the new GI Joe looks. My. God.
How could you take something as good and holy as GI Joe and turn it into this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abQM31QCufI
not to mention that the kid from 3rd Rock from the Sun (Joseph Gordon-Levitt) and Marlon Wayans apparently have major roles.
A little piece of me died when I saw this.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joseph-Gordon Levitt
is awesome, which is why it’s HORRIBLE that he’s in this movie.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he's done some better stuff in recent memory, i agree
but he’ll always be that dude from 3rd rock in some circles.
Still can’t believe just how absolutely horrendous the GI Joe trailer looks. Kinda makes me ashamed to admit I played with Joes like it was my job back in the day.
by goodymobb on Jul 7, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
never be ashamed because idiots ruined something awesome
It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan
by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My nickname for years at school was "3rd Rock"
because Gordon Levitt was my doppelganger for a while. Random people at the store or what have you would tell me “you know who you look like, that kid from 3rd Rock From the Sun!”
Also, he was totally awesome in Brick, but nobody saw that movie.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 8, 2009 7:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I fucking love that movie.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 8, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK, nobody except spants and I saw it!
It was a really cool little movie. Not only that, but he was still eerily like me in many ways—the brown shoes, old man jacket combo, the shorter hair cut. Of course I didn’t talk like 30’s noir sleuth in high school, but whatevs.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 8, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm excited to see
500 Days of Summer. I have a girl-crush on Zooey Deschanel.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 8, 2009 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hm
Looks kind of interesting, though I know nothing about it other than my imdb.com perusal just now. These days I’m not very informed about movies, I admittedly only saw Brick because my buddy basically made me borrow it and watch it.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Jul 8, 2009 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have a regular crush on Zooey
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?" - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Jul 8, 2009 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
per chicago sports radio
Ryan dempster just put on DL with fractured toe.
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 4:38 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
I was just about to say that
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
do you listen to the score?
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 4:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
tackle box informed me about it
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess he will be out at least 8 weeks
maybe twice as long as that
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing's official
Just speculation. The thinking is he might have done it in his last start or it’s a stress fracture and he just needs a little time off, however the cubs are not, repeat not, setting the date retroactively back to his last start. So, his DL stint starts today and not a few days ago.
According to a pediatrist who called in to the radio station, if it’s a stress fracture, it’ll probably be 4 weeks. If it’s an actual fracture of the big toe (it’s on his right foot, ie, his push foot) he probably won’t run for 8 weeks and could possibly be out 12 to 15 weeks.
Someone then emailed in this wikipedia story about Dizzy Dean which contains this story.
While pitching for the NL in the 1937 All-Star Game, Dean faced Earl Averill of the Cleveland Indians, batting for the American League. Averill hit a line drive back at the mound, hitting Dean on the foot. Told that his big toe was “fractured,” Dean said, “Fractured, hell, the damn thing’s broken!” Dean came back too soon, and changed his pitching motion in a way that favored his sore toe. In so doing, he hurt his arm, losing his great fastball.
By 1938, Dean’s arm was largely gone.
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
weird. why wouldn't you set it back to the last game played?
there’s nothing to be gained by that kind of decision. i can think of cases where it would be immaterial — if they were sure he would be out for 4-8 weeks — but it would never be better for the club to delay the onset of the DL.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My opinion?
they know he’s going to be out a long time (month or longer) so it really doesn’t matter. But yeah, I was under the impression you just always retroactivated (is that a word? eh, it works here) it. But they aren’t in this case.
I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.
by Tackle Box on Jul 7, 2009 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I heard more on the radio on the way home
Non-baseball injury. Broke it hopping over the dugout railing to hi-five teammates after a game.
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
now that's some bad luck, heh
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder
if he “tripped” over his “luggage?” Or maybe, just maybe, he kicked Ryan Ludwick in the face.
"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter
by spants on Jul 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i was gonna ask if lou piniella has a bruise on his ass.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Jul 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Would you rather:
Watch the Dempster glove jive on loop or the Soriano fly-ball hop?
"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin
by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd rather watch Aramis Ramirez take fly balls off the top of his head on the infield...
One of my favorite cub moments…
I’d also rather watch Alou kick and scream at Bartman…
Dick and Dunk, the answer to your pitcher's problems...
by The_teague on Jul 7, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd rather watch both than a Kevin Youkalis AB
If I was a pitcher I’d drill him in the ear every chance I get just so I didn’t have to watch the Sit and Wiggle while he gives the bat a handy.
I don’t care if it’s bot 9th tied bases loaded…right in his ear.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Jul 7, 2009 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In terms of this weekends series,
we’ll now be facing:
Harden on friday, Lilly on saturday, and Zambrano and Randy Wells on sunday.
THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!
by stltrav09 on Jul 7, 2009 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A 7 game winning streak to close the first half of the season
would be glorious.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 7, 2009 4:44 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
lets make it an 8 game streak by winning the next 7
Heh
by Walking Underwear on Jul 7, 2009 4:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
What 7 games?
There are only 6 before the ASB.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 7, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well
since the allstar game is in stl maybe that counts
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mobile test
This probably screws up seeing what is new on my pc.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 7, 2009 5:45 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Doubleheader in Chicago on Sunday...
So 3 with the Untuckers, 4 with the Cubs…
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Jul 7, 2009 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yep
4B - beer baseball bands blog
DeRosa>MB
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't it weird we haven't been to Minute Maid yet this year?
I’m not complaining, because I freaking hate that place. But still…
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Jul 7, 2009 5:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
As an addendum...
we only only play 6 games there in the 2nd half, and we play 2 more with the Mets at Citi Field. So we’ll play as many games in New York as we do in Houston. That is retarded.
V, b.
by LukeMP1186 on Jul 7, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The only thing I like about that place
is b/c that’s where Albert hit that homer off Lidge in Game 5 of the 05 NLCS. I can still remember the reactions….
TLR: Please start Colby!
by zoomzoomj88 on Jul 7, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
George Bush Sr. behind the plate...
Standing Ovation….SMACK!….Smiles turned into snarls…And George Bush’s face…priceless.
Dick and Dunk, the answer to your pitcher's problems...
by The_teague on Jul 7, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lineup?
I wish mobile showed the new comments in yellow and let me scroll to them.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 7, 2009 6:08 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
The only thing Cardinal Beat has told me is that:
TLR has dropped his suit v. Twitter. Hopefully this means that “TLR” will return and continue to tweet.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
by bgh on Jul 7, 2009 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
does mobile update new comments in real time?
Guess its time for some testing…
defy, cards, defy. hey logic --- you suck.
by effin fisk on Jul 7, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure
Womack 2B
Renteria SS
Pujols 1B
Rolen 3B
Sanders RF
Edmonds CF
Matheny C
Taguchi LF
Williams P
Oh wait, that was 5 years ago :(
"If on-base percentage is so important, then why don't they put it up on the scoreboard?" - Jeff Francouer
by jd is legend on Jul 7, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
In todays lineup Woody would be batting 4th to protect Pujols
gonna need more franklins to get through this one.
by hoofhearted-pujols on Jul 7, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lineup - Same as Sunday
I’d swap Thurston and Wainwright.
2B Skip Schumaker
CF Colby Rasmus
1B Albert Pujols
RF Ryan Ludwick
LF Rick Ankiel
C Yadier Molina
3B Joe Thurston
P Adam Wainwright
SS Brendan Ryan
Also a new story up about DeRosa which makes it sound more serious than before.
by OCCardsFan on Jul 7, 2009 7:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
holy fucking shit.
"I usually don’t read other peoples sigs." -Cuttah
by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2009 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hindsight and all
but i think we gonna kick ourselves about losing 2 MLB ready arms for another extended injury problem
sigh
by FunkeeC on Jul 7, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs