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Brewers imploding?


So the Brewers got beat this past weekend 3 of 4 to the Cubs, and have fallen out of first in the division.  Just in time for the Cardinals to roll into town.

When the Brewers had a rough start both this year and last, Ryan Braun called out his teammates in the press.  Both times this was done the team responded positively.  Yesterday, he went on record to say "They threw the ball a lot better than our starters did," in reference to Cub starters.  And also called out Doug Melvin to make a move to improve the team ""We're at the point right now where it would be important for us to go out there and acquire somebody," Braun said.

The point, here, is that it appears that Mr. Braun is not intentionally doing it, but he is throwing his pitching staff and his GM under the bus.  The last thing a playoff contending team wants is internal strife.  The other players on the team may like and even respect Ryan Braun, but the probably do not appreciate being told that they are not doing a good job in the press by a fellow teammate.  And the worst part about it is that this is the 3rd time Braun has responded this way publicly.


The problem with Braun's actions is that although he is an All Star and one of the best players on the team, you are not supposed to air your dirty laundry in public.  And you don't do things to upset your teammates.  Its a 25 man effort to get to the playoffs and some players may play a more instrumental role in that quest than others, it is still a team effort. 

Would Cardinal fans be alright if Albert Pujols said things like this in the press?  Would Cardinal management be upset if one of its star players told them how to do their job?  Would the Cardinal pitching staff be upset if he were telling them they werent doing a good job?  No, he is a veteran and a professional.  And although Pujols is the best player on the team, he wouldnt deride or talk down to his fellow teammates or call them out. 

Everyone in the game is a professional athlete.  They get paid to do a job.  If they do not execute, they know they are not executing, they dont need teammates to tell them so.  The motivation comes from being a professional, not from words or personal challenges or cheers from fans.

If this action creates the resentment in the Brewer clubhouse that it possibly could, the NL Central will be fought out between the Cards and Cubs.  And although the Brewers need a pitcher to really ramp things up, they have stayed very close in a very competitive divsion, but if it causes resentment, the Brewers will have no one to look beyond than its star player Ryan Braun.

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  • Albert makes things clear to the management all the time. Of course we don’t know if he’s said these things to the management first before talking to the press. All signs point to yes. Also: many, many points for better communication skills. By all accounts El Hombre works pretty hard at his English, something which Mr. Braun might emulate.

Don’t get me wrong, this solidifies in my mind that Ryan Braun=d-bag, but it’s pretty hard to figure out what’s “professionalism” in the cloistered game of baseball. We don’t know where their motivation comes from. We don’t know what they need to do in order to execute. Difficult to judge what ought to be public when we have no idea what goes on in private.

What’s clear as day is that Albert has his priorities straight. He’s quick to praise his teammates and draw attention away from himself. He takes pride in his game but his personality is generally self-effacing. I mean, I disagree when you say “Albert wouldn’t do that” because he has. But I agree that he throws his weight around for the right reasons.

It’ll be a cold day in Hell when Albert doesn’t put the team first.

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jul 6, 2009 11:03 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Pujols

said publicly several times in the off-season that we should go out and get Manny, even though that would’ve been a disaster.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 6, 2009 11:04 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Hate to do this but...

Would Manny really be that bad on the Cardinals? We wouldn’t have had to pay the whole salary because of the suspension, and right now it would be pretty nice to have Manny’s bat in the lineup to protect Pujols. And Rasmus in CF could sort of help cancel out Manny’s lack of anything defensively in LF. Manny on the Cards wouldn’t be a trainwreck.

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 6, 2009 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

he might have been the difference

between Rasmus being allowed to stay in the big leagues and playing in AAA. So no, he wouldn’t have been good with that in mind.

Now, if we had traded Ankiel or Luddy like all the rumors that were rumbling in the offseason, then just maybe . . . but it’s Manny!

On with the (good) youth movement!

by aet15 on Jul 6, 2009 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

he would of probably been brought up next year and maybe later this yearq

With Ankiels struggling, and he might have played next year if we couldnt resign Ankiel

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 6, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

personally, I'm enjoying having him this year

and we don’t have to put up with Manny.

On with the (good) youth movement!

by aet15 on Jul 6, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't get me wrong

Ankiel is one of my favorite stories ever. 2nd favorite player in the MLB to me

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 7, 2009 2:27 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i think

he was talking about colby

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 2:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Manny obviously is a great player...

…but 2 years / $45 million is a steep price to pay, even if you consider the ~$8m savings from his suspension. The question is this: is ~30 games of roided Manny + ~240 games of non-roided Manny worth ~$37 million?

I think that that is a huge gamble to take considering no one is certain just how much his performance was inflated and how he will do now that he is presumably clean. This of course doesn’t even touch all the headaches and shame associated with his steroid abuse and Manny being Manny.

"In the wake of Michael Jackson's passing, all of the players in yesterday's games wore one glove in his memory."
- Craig Calcaterra

by all4tookie on Jul 6, 2009 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The question is

how much do you think Manny will regress due to a lack of steroids? If you are a good hitter you still we remain a good hitter post steroids. Steroids can’t give you natural ability. It is fair to assume Manny will regress some but how much no one can tell. Let’s assume Manny is half as valuable as he has been this season: 1.4 WAR in 99 AB’s and 30 games. With the 30 games pre-suspension and the 82 games post suspension Manny would be a 3.3 WAR player, that is assuming that Manny does exactly half as bad without steroids. That 3.3 is a major upgrade over whatever Duncan/Ankiel bring to the table. People are saying Rasmus would have been left down in AAA, but there is no way to know that for sure so I’m going to assume the FO pushed Rasmus on TLR. How is this for the starters:
1B: Pujols, 2B: Schumaker/Hoffpauir(platoon), SS: Ryan, 3B: DeRosa, LF: Manny Ramirez, CF: Rasmus, RF:Ludwick.
Then when and if Glaus gets back we can move him for prospects or switch around the lineup any which way TLR feels fit. Anyway I think it would be nice to have a grounded best 3 OF and a pretty obvious best lineup.

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 7, 2009 2:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh I left out

Molina, but of course he would be starting catcher.

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 7, 2009 2:52 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we wanted a 3.3 win upgrade over Dunc/Ank

we could’ve just traded for Holliday I suppose.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah but this way

the Cards wouldn’t have given up Ludwick, Wallace, and whatever else of a king’s ransom Colorado/Beane would want. Plus I really don’t believe Manny will cut his production in half because of lack of use. And then maybe the Cards wouldn’t have taken the chance on K. Greene.

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 7, 2009 5:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just think there are better ways to spend $37 million

For instance, we could have spent the money on a true 2B (Orlando Hudson?) and let Skip stay at his home in the outfield. For the price (<$4m), we could have realized a 2-4 WAR gain (combining Skip and Hudson), which is in the realm of what Ramirez in ~110 games is likely to produce for $17m.

If you think it is unlikely that we could have signed Hudson (or wanted to, due to his wrist), Grudzielanek and Durham are still available for the league minimum. Hudson would have cost a first rounder while Grudzielanek and Durham are free – hardly a king’s ransom.

"In the wake of Michael Jackson's passing, all of the players in yesterday's games wore one glove in his memory."
- Craig Calcaterra

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If we grabbed Hudson,

we get no Shelby Miller. I’d rather have had a Ray Durham/Skippy platoon for free.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I wake up a little more scared everyday that he isn't signed.

"In the wake of Michael Jackson's passing, all of the players in yesterday's games wore one glove in his memory."
- Craig Calcaterra

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know it's not a lock,

but I have a good feeling about this one getting done. Not worried.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ray Durham

was apparently asking for similar to what Hudson ended up getting in the spring (~$4-5m). I don’t think either he or Grudz will sign on for the league min, even now, but we could probably get either the rest of the way for ~2m, which would be good business in my book. I was all over Durham in the winter…

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good point...

…I don’t know why I thought two vets would pack up and move to a new town for peanuts just because they want to play after raking in some serious coin over their careers. D’oh!

Still, I think that by upgrading our defense massively at 2B (not to mention the benefits of Skip being in the OF and keeping Ank/Dunc off the field) – even at the cost of a few million – we could have pretty easily matched ManRam’s contribution for a small fraction of the cost.

And of course I remember you bringing up Durham all year – where do you think I get my ideas from? Originality is overrated.

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

NEVER SPEAK OF THIS AGAIN

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 8, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

but skippy is our 2b of the FUTURE!!!

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on Jul 8, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i missed something, apparently.

wasn’t manny taking female fertility drugs? i.e., not steroids?

cardinals are the things with feathers that perch within the soul.

by ilrosso on Jul 7, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The female fertility drugs is what he got caught for...

But the reason a player takes those drugs is to compensate for decreased testosterone production as a result of coming off a steriod cycle.

Also, I read an article about how Manny initially tested positive in spring training for a different drug, and on the re-test failed with the female fertility thing, leaving him with 2 drugs to answer for (which is one reason he may have quietly accepted the suspension without appeal, so he didn’t have to answer the steroid question directly). I will try to track that down.

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i remember that too

he was taking testosterone

and then took the hcg (or whatever) to cover up after his positive test

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Found it..

Link

Good parts:

ESPN reported earlier that testing showed Ramirez had used hCG, which is typically used by steroid users to restart their bodies’ natural testosterone production as they come off a steroid cycle. It is similar to Clomid, the drug Barry Bonds, Jason Giambi and others used as clients of BALCO.

Ramirez’s case was set off when a test in spring training revealed he had elevated levels of testosterone in his body. MLB followed up with a more comprehensive test that confirmed the testosterone had to come from an artificial source, the sources said.

While investigating, MLB obtained documents that indicated Ramirez’s use of hCG, and it was those documents that formally were used to hand down the 50-game suspension. Baseball decided to suspend Ramirez for only hCG because, in the end, he would have been suspended for just the 50 games either way. There was a chance Ramirez could have proved that the testosterone did not come from a banned substance, the MLB source said.

The hCG use, a doping expert told ESPN, would have been separate from the use of the artificial testosterone reflected by MLB’s testing.

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

huh. okay.

thanks for the info. i guess i find it hard to believe that people still dope, but i really shouldn’t.

by the way, nice sig.

cardinals are the things with feathers that perch within the soul.

by ilrosso on Jul 7, 2009 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Manny

Manny Ramirez might be the only player in baseball who would classify as “protection” for Albert Pujols.

I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.

by Tackle Box on Jul 6, 2009 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Financial and PR disaster, yes

But we’d be a lot better offensive team right now with Manny Ramirez, there’s absolutely no question about it.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on Jul 9, 2009 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

also, it doesn't matter if the Brewers implode

If our defense minus Albert sucks donkeys.

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jul 6, 2009 11:04 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

offense, lol

man these comments need an Edit Button!

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jul 6, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No kidding

I still love you Skip.

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 6, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Also

I think the Brewers should be far more worried that their rotation has FOUR (so far) replacement-level pitchers in it, than they should about “resentment in the clubhouse”.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 6, 2009 11:05 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Imploding or not, the Brewers have a good chance to sweep

if the epic offensive “struggle of the non-Alberts” continues.

You have to give the edge to Gallardo and the Brewers offense in game 1, while the other two games favor the Brewers if, once again, the Cardinals can’t hit the mediocre cast-off Cardinal pitchers they send out there (which they haven’t in the past).

by olddomination on Jul 6, 2009 12:43 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Let's hope

Ludwick really is coming around, Colby is for real, and DeRo comes back healthy and hitting. Go Cards! Man, I know they’re necessary, but I hate off days. I start going through withdrawals.

"Baseball has been good to me since I quit trying to play it." - Whitey Herzog

by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Jul 6, 2009 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Brewers rotation is not good, it is true.

Gallardo and two adequate starters and nothing and nothing.

You are correct -you can never count out a team that has that much offensive power. I bet they make some kind of deal to strengthen that starting rotation before all is said and done. It’s not like they didn’t realize it was a problem before Braun brought it up.

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Jul 6, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not even sure they have two other adequate starters

Suppan is basically replacement level now and probably shouldn’t be even a #5 starter on a contender. Looper has been balls this year. Parra was in AAA last time I looked after totally sucking. I’ve always thought Dave Bush is an adequate back-of-the-rotation option but he’s been very poor also. Maybe Bush and Looper will come around a bit.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gallardo is probably the only person on this planet

that can make Albert look that silly on a curveball. That thing is sick…

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 7, 2009 5:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's hope we never find out.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+355850684424161

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Braun & Pu

Braun is just being a whiner. He’s afraid that Milwaukee may implode (like last year, when they fired Yost), but it’s too early to tell. It’s the middle of July, not the middle of September!

I would be very frustrated if Albert were to say things like Braun did. I know that Albert wanted us to get Manny (and most are glad that it didn’t happen), and that he wants to be on a winning team. Albert mostly keeps the thoughts to himself, and I highly doubt he would complain in the middle of July like Braun did.

TLR: Please start Colby!

by zoomzoomj88 on Jul 6, 2009 3:02 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Uh, how exactly did the Brewers implode when they fired Yost last year?

Yost was a lousy manager, and they made the playoffs. Didn’t fair very well once they got there though, mostly because their rotation fell apart at the end of the season…

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 6, 2009 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i'm not surprised by anything El Douchey does

but this isn’t a big deal. they always bend over for the flubs, and play the Cards super tough. until our pitchers can wipe the grin off his douchey face & stop them from un-tucking their shirts, i wouldn’t say they are anywhere close to imploding.

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2009 5:00 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

as long as it the Cardinals that are doing the running, i'll be OK with it

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2009 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

if it's going to be any team,

it will be the cardinals

unless the brewers make a pitching trade (lol, with what pieces?) or aram hits like his shoulder never exploded (do we have any experience in that department?) and soriano, fukudome, bradley and aaron miles all remember how to hit

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 6, 2009 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Please...

… the question isn’t whether the Brewers have the pieces to deal for pitching. The questions are whether there is pitching available and whether they want to give up what the other team wants. There are lots of ways to criticize the Brewers organization, but if you think it’s that they don’t have the organizational depth to deal for pitching, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 6, 2009 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

what do they have

to trade that would garner a front of the rotation starter besides one of their MLB starters and maybe mat gamel? either way, gamel isn’t on the table and i highly doubt they’re dealing braun to get a danny haren type.

i expect a pretty good response considering your unnecessarily inflammatory response to my opinion

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 1:27 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Heard of Alcides Escobar?

One of the top SS prospects in the nation?

Regardless, the Brewers have said they wont trade either Escobar or Gamel for pitching, so its a moot point.

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 7, 2009 2:30 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

yes

i didn’t include him because i couldn’t remember his name

and exactly

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 2:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, exactly.

Escobar and Gamel are pieces they could trade for pitching, as is at least one of their current starters at the big league levels (no, not Braun). You said they didn’t have the pieces to deal for pitching. My point, which I made clear enough was that they did have the pieces to do so, but that they might opt not to make those pieces available and that there might not be pitching available. So the fact that Escobar and Gamel are (at least from Melvin’s public comments) no available in trade proves my point and not yours.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 8:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

They have the talent to get someone like Doug Davis or Jarrod Washburn. That’s not Danny Haren, but it’s no joke.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

if they have the

pieces, but aren’t going to use them, i was right

and i still doubt that a prospect like gamel, even when paired with escobar, is going to land you dan haren. mat gamel isn’t exactly colby rasmus, brett wallace or matt laporta. and a #5 guy isn’t what the brewers need. last i saw the rotation was comprised of an ace or #2 and four #5-6 guys

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Its interesting the way LaPorta's reputation has grown

Once a reach without a position in the field, and following a pretty good, although brief minor league performance, he’s now the cream of the crop. FWIW, most of the chatter including coming from the respective GMs was that Gamel was the preference of the Indians. Wallace’s future seems a bit uncertain. I read it as excellent bat and may or may not stick at 3rd.

by ol Pete on Jul 7, 2009 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i may be wrong on laporta

i just know what the buzz was about him

and you’re absolutely right about wallace. all-star bat first baseman that the cards hope and pray can stick at third

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gamel plus Escobar

would land pretty much anyone in baseball (outside of the top 10 or 20 or so cost-controlled talents, and guys like Pujols, Utley, HanRam etc.). I’m sure it’d be enough for Haren.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

nah

not with the position of power that the dbacks find themelves in

they could charge something similar, though maybe not quite as extravagant, for doug davis considering what’s available

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No way

Most GM’s are smart and do look at peripherals. Davis has never been much better than an average starter.

Derosa.

by vivaelpujols on Jul 8, 2009 5:39 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Matt Gamel = Brett Wallace

They are both lefty third baseman with bad gloves and great bats. I’ll agree with Felonius… Escobar + Gamel would get nearly anyone in baseball.

Derosa.

by vivaelpujols on Jul 8, 2009 5:41 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you don't include people because you can't remember their names

I think its safe to say, there might be players you are unaware of.

by ol Pete on Jul 7, 2009 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

unnecessary.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

obvious.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

nouns.

Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation

by azruavatar on Jul 7, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

fail.

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 7, 2009 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Brick!

“Yeah, there were horses, and a man on fire, and I killed a guy with a trident.”

"Baseball has been good to me since I quit trying to play it." - Whitey Herzog

by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Jul 7, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Brick...

Where did you get a hand grenade?

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 7, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I realized after I typed this they weren't nouns.

O, wait — are we still doing one word answers.

Adjectives!

Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation

by azruavatar on Jul 8, 2009 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or maybe

Predicates!

Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation

by azruavatar on Jul 8, 2009 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Adverbs!

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 9, 2009 6:20 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ADJECTIVES

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 9, 2009 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

and yet i was right

the gamble worked out

funny, huh

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

not knowing

a AA prospects name off hand is an error?

i think you’re trying a little too hard to act like i insulted your org and stand up for it

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I smell troll on this one,

best keep your distance and only reply with one word answers.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Profile says

Brewers fan

Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation

by azruavatar on Jul 8, 2009 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Banned

He’s actually been banned from Brew Crew Ball. I heard on the Cub board that he was a moderator even on BCB.

by backtocali on Jul 8, 2009 9:40 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thing is, who gives a crap if you're a Brewers fan,

Cards fan, Mets fan, whatever. People get banned every day for coming into threads and doing nothing but posting inflammatory one-liners.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 8, 2009 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

is that the point

or are you just trying to be a huge douche?

let’s go back to square one so you can understand.

the brewers two best prospect are off the table. with what pieces is a deal going to be made for a front of the rotation starter?

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Actually, if you go back to square one...

… you’ll see that you never mentioned the fact that the Brewers HAD the pieces to deal for pitching and just wouldn’t do it. You said they didn’t have the pieces. The line I responded to was:

“unless the brewers make a pitching trade (lol, with what pieces?)”

As you can see, there was no mention of them having the players to deal but not wanting to do it, and there was no attempt to restrict your comment to a front of rotation starter. That’s the comment I responded to with disdain, because it’s just wrong.

Now, if you meant that they had the pieces but wouldn’t use them, and you were actually talking about an ace or a #2, we probably don’t have much in the way of a disagreement, particularly since there are few (or none) #1’s or #2’s available thus far.

Fair enough?

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

you are correct

that i didn’t specify one way or another whether i thought they had the pieces, what they were looking for and whether they were willing to deal the pieces they have. of course they can go pick up kip wells from the free agent market. and of course they could get any pitcher on the market if they wanted to. hell, every team has the pieces to deal for pitching, so it was safe to assume that i meant that they didn’t have a surplus from which they were willing to deal. of course, if you were unsure, it would’ve been quite alright had you asked

that’s why it’s annyong that you took it upon yourself to fill in the voids and assume what i meant and then act all superior. as if i actually care about the brewers’ farm system

i could very well have been wrong. about all i know about the situation (and care about for that matter) is what i’ve read on mlb tr. turns out once out things look a little different from your high horse and none of my points are actually in contention. right?

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Just so you know, you're arguing with two Brewers fans,

both of which have only even commented VEB on this thread. Best we just move on to Prince Fielder is fat jokes.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ol pete

has been around before.

"I usually don’t read other peoples sigs." -Cuttah

by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

really

i’m impressed that he’s able to hit for such average. i would’ve thought he’d have a ryan howard type bat at best

i still that body will take its toll on him as his career goes forward, though

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

reply fail

supposed t be pointed to the .310 avg post

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Probably true.

And I’m surprised by the .310 as well. Never thought I’d see his average that high this late in the year, though he’s always said that one of his goals was to improve as a hitter so he could bat over .300. But yeah, his body will probably start to cause problems for him eventually and he’s probably destined for the AL long term.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

hahaha

that’s great

i just didn’t want to look like i got punked out by some brewer fans in my own backyard

me:ted simmons::pujols:villanueva

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

did some body say doughnuts?

Homer is totally picking up what Big Veg is dropping down

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 7, 2009 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The only thing I assumed...

… was that you communicated precisely the idea you wanted to. I’m not certain why you’re so outraged that I took you at your word.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

it's just a habit

i’m accustomed to people who can read between the lines. y’know people who don’t take “brewers don’t have trade pieces” to mean “ryan braun, yovani gallardo, and prince fielder can’t land melvin mora in a trade deal if the brewers eat 75% of the salary”

deductive reasoning and such.

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

OMG WUT ABOT EGGS ODDOORRIZZIII

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 7, 2009 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i got a new waino avvy

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 7:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Which would be a fair point...

… if I thought for a second you were talking about Braun, Gallardo and Fielder, which I didn’t. Nor did I ever suggest as much.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

not really the point is it

if they’re not willing to deal the pieces they need to to get a pitcher that can legitimately help, it doesn’t matter if i say braun, gamel, longoria or any other player not available to be traded by the brewers.

what i’m talking about is a lack of surplus from which to deal from. where’s it at?

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 7, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Once again you're changing your statement...

… but to answer your question, the surplus is as SS, and going deeper in the system, and to a lesser degree, 3B (Gamel, Green), catcher (Salome, Lucroy) and 2B (Lawrie).

Now, absent a willingness to trade Escobar and Gamel is that likely to bring a #1 or #2 starter? Not this year, from all appearances, though it might have in previous seasons.

Like I said, I think in the end, we agree on a lot, but I responded to the actual statement you made originally (not the ever-changing ones you claim to have made since).

Oh, and by the way, the Brewers don’t have a significant prospect named Longoria in their system, so I ASSUMED you meant Escobar.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 8, 2009 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Longoria is not available to be traded by the Brewers,

so he’s as fair game as Gamel.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 8, 2009 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

*yawn*

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 8, 2009 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i was referring to

hot young third baseman of the tampa bay devil rays evan longoria. not to be confused with sexy actress eva longoria (though i guess she fits my point just as well)

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 8, 2009 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

If I was a Brewer's fan I'd be upset...

if they traded their prospects away. They had a star (quite literally) team in AA Huntsville last year (I enjoy going to their games).
08 Roster included:
Alcides Escobar – SS
Mat Gamel – 3B
Matt LaPorta (Indians) – LF
Angel Salome – C
Nearly half a team ready to play in 2010, all of whom are potential impact MLB players, IMO.

by Schnurdog on Jul 8, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agreed with or understood almost every thing in your post

but this comment couldn’t be any more wrong.

The motivation comes from being a professional

I think we’d all like to think the paycheck is motivation enough, but it isn’t.

I have a very, umm...photographic brain. A lot like Ansel Adams but in color and with a lot more, uh.....insertion and pubic hair.

by Tackle Box on Jul 6, 2009 5:54 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

This just in:

Vindication:

Comments from Doug Melvin today on Ryan Brauns statements about the pitching staff and his desire for DM to make a move:

"It was inappropriate for him to say what he said, and I’m not happy about it," Melvin said.

"To make the statements he made and also get on his teammates like that, it was irresponsible on his part. It just ticked me off."

"We all work every day from 9 a.m. to midnight, and basically 12 months a year," said Melvin, referring to his baseball staff. "I’ll be glad to have Ryan help if he wants to. I’ll give him a badge and he can be my deputy.

"I don’t know his motivation for saying it. It demoralizes the people in the organization at a time when we should be pulling together. It puts a bad taste in our mouths. That’s a pretty strong statement.

"I understand that maybe he thinks it’s taking a leadership role. I don’t know if he’s trying to tell me I’m not doing my job. We need to stick together as an organization. We’re all trying to win."

I think he made a fundamental mistake," said Melvin. "I didn’t hear our pitchers complaining when we lost a 1-0 game (to New York last week) or the 2-1 game in 10 innings in Chicago.

"They didn’t say the hitters weren’t doing their job. He’s hitting in front of one of the best hitters (Prince Fielder) in the game."

Melvin said he already was upset about derogatory comments from Braun about the hitting conditions at Miller Park during day games, where shadows make it tough. Braun said players "hope for rain and clouds" so the retractable roof will be closed during day games there, and those comments got national play.

Melvin also mentioned comments he read from Braun about hitters not having scouting reports last week on San Francisco newcomer Ryan Sadowski, who shut them out for six innings in a 7-0 Giants victory. Melvin said the team had scouting reports on Sadowski, who pitched seven shutout innings against Houston in his next outing.

"I don’t like criticizing players; it’s out of character for me," said Melvin. "But I’m tired of it and I need to protect the people under us. Everybody’s working as hard as they can to make this a winning organization.

"He’s too talented a player to be doing this so early in his career. He just has to be careful about what he says."

by backtocali on Jul 6, 2009 9:29 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

sounds like MO should call up doug & offer to take el douchey off his hands

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2009 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

seriously GDM

that is very close to being flagworthy, knock that crap off.
I

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 8, 2009 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

alllright

/slinks back into the basement with his scotch

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 9, 2009 3:59 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

they couldn't make enough Scotch

I would definitely be needing a new liver if Braun became a Card

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 9, 2009 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

But his mom works for Anheuser Busch!

It's official. Cardinals third basemen are jinxed.

by YesWeOquendo on Jul 9, 2009 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’ll be glad to have Ryan help if he wants to. I’ll give him a badge and he can be my deputy.

hahahahaha

punked the fuck out

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 6, 2009 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah that is awesome

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:53 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's from the Milwaukee Journal/Sentinel online, by the way, from beat writer Tom Haudricourt.

backtocali never likes to source his material, usually because he likes to make people think the work is his own. This time, it’s probably just an oversite.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 6, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

to be fair, i don't think anyone

thought backtocali interviewed Melvin himself.

cardinals are the things with feathers that perch within the soul.

by ilrosso on Jul 6, 2009 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I love your sig

Ted Simmons is one of my all time favorites and my leading candidate to be the next Cardinals manager. I’m absolutely shocked that Simmons is not managing for some major league team. He’d be perfect.

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Jul 7, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Me too.

I didn’t become a Simmons fan until he played for the Brewers in the late 80’s, but I loved watching him play.

As for why he’s not a manager, I’m not always convinced that he wants it. He seems to be one of those guys who’s waiting for the perfect situation to come along and it never quite does. There were plenty of Brewer fans who thought he would end up managing in Milwaukee when he worked for Yost last year. Then Yost got canned. There were some rumors (completely unconfirmed) that He was offered the interim job and he rejected it when Yost was fired in September. Whatever happened, there was a complete mutual disinterest when the Brewers began shopping for a permanent replacement in the offseason….

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whoops.

I meant early 80s, of course.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, I hope the right situation comes along.

He’s already done everything-catcher/outfielder, great hitter, scout, general manager, bench coach, special assistant, wise man, and great explainer of what and why to those who don’t know or understand.

Perhaps he wants the freedom to do what he does; perhaps is health is not as good as it should be-he has had problems in the past. I really hope he becomes a manager someday for my own selfish reasons.

Good day to you, sir.

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Jul 7, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hope so too.

I enjoy just listening to him talk about the game and I miss him hearing from him in the press as much as I did last year.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 7, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

braun.

smacked down.

cardinals are the things with feathers that perch within the soul.

by ilrosso on Jul 6, 2009 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I like Melvin

That’s pretty strong move on his part to ‘fire back’. But I definitely like seeing him take Braun to task for it.

by paposse on Jul 7, 2009 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

well, braun is signed (at WAY below market, though the price is irrelevant)

through friggin 2015. it’s pretty safe to say whatever you want to the schmuck, at this point. He literally has no recourse, other than whining in the paper and/or untucking his shirt in public. For which he can be fined an arbitrary amount, if they decide to play hardball.

- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc

by SleepyCA on Jul 8, 2009 2:12 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not sure how I feel about his comments

I mean it’s a asshole thing to say in public… but he does have a point. Once you get past Gallardo, the rest of their staff is essentially replacement level. I’m sure the Brewers FO know this, so it was probably redundant and rude for Braun to say it, but it is a problem.

Derosa.

by vivaelpujols on Jul 8, 2009 5:48 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

this strikes me as the kind of quote that people use to justify any ultimate result.

if the brewers tank, they’ll say “this was a sign of how demoralized and downtrodden they were. the boys in the clubhouse were on edge, at each others’ throats, blaming each other for failure,” etc., etc.

if the brewers win the division, people will say “this was the spark they needed, he called them out, and they responded, what a great clubhouse leader,” etc., etc.

this is why i hate appeals to leadership and chemistry and all that.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on Jul 6, 2009 9:50 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I nearly peed myself from this comment by Melvin

""We all work every day from 9 a.m. to midnight, and basically 12 months a year," said Melvin, referring to his baseball staff. “I’ll be glad to have Ryan help if he wants to. I’ll give him a badge and he can be my deputy.”

I hope Braun has a little gold badge on his uniform tomorrow that says Deputy GM

by dcfcblues on Jul 6, 2009 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I shot the sheriff...

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on Jul 6, 2009 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think leadershp and chemistry in the clubhouse is important

the problem is the press has no real way of knowing who are good club house guys when the team is going through it’s ups and downs. You have to be a part of the clubhouse to really get it.

by Evilfrog on Jul 6, 2009 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

isn't leadership and chemistry

what separates you from "this was the spark they needed, he called them out, and they responded, what a great clubhouse leader," and "this was a sign of how demoralized and downtrodden they were. the boys in the clubhouse were on edge, at each others’ throats, blaming each other for failure,"

or maybe it’s just that they don’t have very good starting pitching, heh (let’s hope Braun isn’t in the right here)

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 7, 2009 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i'm gonna go with the starting pitching...

from what I hear I think they’re generally a pretty tight group (the brewers).

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 7, 2009 4:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Depends if its Prince Fielder or not.

My avatar is 3 years into the future for sure...

by Taskmaster on Jul 7, 2009 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

how does this

only have my rec?

"I'll be glad to have Ryan [Braun] help if he wants to. I'll give him a badge and he can be my deputy." - Doug Melvin

by all4tookie on Jul 8, 2009 1:52 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

because your the only one who understands it?

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 8, 2009 3:59 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

+1

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 8, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

what

the image isn’t clickable

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 8, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Right click

and view image. You’ll see the image title in the address bar.

"If I prepare myself, my stuff is good and I'm going to get outs. That is a fact." - Chris Carpenter

by spants on Jul 8, 2009 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

ah

nice

Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.

by prophetjohn on Jul 8, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

still don't get it

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on Jul 9, 2009 3:57 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

A black donut hole

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jul 9, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

I don't know why

but I spent a good 2 minutes laughing at this.

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 9, 2009 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

As soon as I posed it I got all nervous

because I was sure somebody would think it’s racist or something. Glad somebody found it funny!

Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.

by mattybobo on Jul 10, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

he's a STAR ballplayer, he's a big ,big guy

it must be a stellar-mass black hole

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 9, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's just "big boned"

"Baseball has been good to me since I quit trying to play it." - Whitey Herzog

by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Jul 8, 2009 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

mmm...it's green.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 8, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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