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Mark Teahen as an alternative to Holliday

He'd cost considerably less (no Wallace), he's only making 3.5 million this year, he can play first, second, third, or either corner OF spot.  He's an average defensive 3B and a league average hitter who will give us basically identical splits against righties and lefties

 

LH : 302/.348/.421

RH: 292/.354/464

 

As you can see, he has a little more power against righties, but still gets on at the same clip against either type of pitcher. Tony would love his versatility, and I can't imagine he'd cost any more than say Boggs/Mortensen and a C+ prospect.

 

That would give you an everyday lineup of:

1. 2B/LF Skip

2. 2B/3B/LF. Teahen

3. 1B. Pujols

4. RF. Ludwick

5. 2B/3B/LF DeRosa

6. CF. Rasmus

7. C Molina

8. P

9. SS Ryan

 

With Lugo, Ankiel, LaRue, Thurston, and Stavinoha rounding out your bench.

0 recs  |  Comment 29 comments

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Not a bad thought...

but after looking at his numbers, I’d say thanks but no thanks.

His K and BB rates are about like Ankiel’s. He’s hitting, but with help from a .360+ BABIP. And he appears to be quite a bad defensive third baseman. He could play left, but I think if we’re giving up a Mortenson or Boggs we could probably do better.

by guayzimi on Jul 23, 2009 3:01 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Just to add...

his UZR/150 after 2800 innings at third is -9 and zips has him as a 330 woba guy going forward. Better to go big (Willingham) or just let Lugo give us this.

by guayzimi on Jul 23, 2009 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's a fair rebuttal

I will say that from being in an area that broadcasts Royals and Cards games nightly, he is one of the few players on that team with a clue. At the very least, you could stick him in left and then you can hide Skip against lefties.

His LD% is in line with career norms (right at 20%), and his BABIP is identical to his 2007 season, but you could argue that was artificially inflated due to a hot second half.

Is very bad to steal A-Pu's rum...is very bad.

by Power Slurve on Jul 23, 2009 3:12 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

glad someone else brought it up

i really like the idea of teahan in a cards uniform. the biggest problem people seem to have is that he is an average player what we forget is that average is a huge upgrade for us you surround albert pujols with a bunch of average players and you have a good lineup. i think the problem we’re going to run into is that the front office is almost obligated to see what glaus will give us this year. meaning teahan would have to pass through waivers and i don’t thinkl he would. considering he’d be a good fit for several teams

by callmesir on Jul 23, 2009 3:45 PM EDT via mobile reply actions   0 recs

why would teahan have to pass through waivers?

I can’t see how/why we’d ever let that happen if we traded for the guy.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 24, 2009 5:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

because the waiver deadline is coming up before glaus would be back and i think the front office has to see if he can produce before making another trade

by callmesir on Jul 24, 2009 9:09 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

you do realise we have to DFA Teahan for him to go through waivers, right?

there’s no way we trade for a guy then instantly designate (or outright waive) them…

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 26, 2009 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

good solution

anything that doesnt cost much and gets dick out of the line up is a good thing in my book.

by PujolsDynasty on Jul 23, 2009 4:42 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Teahan and DeRosa on the same team

The lineup possibilities would be endless. The mere thought of all the tinkering he could do would make Tony’s baseball pants a little tighter, that’s for sure.

by mikedallas45 on Jul 23, 2009 4:45 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

No thanks

He’s not a good defender at any of those positions. He’s a poor man’s Mark Derosa — less power, lower OBP over the last 3+ seasons.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on Jul 23, 2009 4:52 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

He's a career 1.3 UZR/150 in the outfield. He can play either corner spot.

I don’t think it’s fair to say he’s not good at any of those positions.

He’s a 1.5 WAR player so far this year. That’s far better than a lot of alternative that we are running out there.

Is very bad to steal A-Pu's rum...is very bad.

by Power Slurve on Jul 23, 2009 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He is?

He’s better than Holliday, Willingham, and Elijah Dukes? No, he’s not. Holliday and Willingham are better and Dukes would be cheaper and has a much higher upside.

A 1.5 UZR/150 is the definition of league average. FWIW, Derosa is a career 15.5 UZR/150 in the outfield. Derosa’s also been a better hitter as he’s posted an average wOBA of .353 over the last 4 seasons. Teahen’s been around .336 over that period.

As I said, he’s a poor man’s Mark Derosa. He can play three different positions, but we already have Mark Derosa, who can also play 3 positions. What we need is someone who can play either 3B or LF and provide us good offense and not kill us on defense. Teahen simply isn’t a good fit for us.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on Jul 24, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good little article over at

Royals Review the other day shows that they should get back as much for Teahen as Cleveland got for DeRosa, so unless we want to give Motte and a top reliever PTBNL for him…no thanks!

by stlfan on Jul 23, 2009 5:34 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

i think were fine... no more tinkering with this team

duncan is gone (no disrespect, he just hasn’t got it together after surgery)
ankiel is showing signs of life
pujols is pujols
molina is consistant
ryan play great defense
shumakers ops is creeping up on .800
rasmus is a talented rookie
ludwick is himself again
we got derosa

the bullpen has been very good most of the year

and the starting pitching has been even better (please resign pinero oh please resign him)…. although i wouldnt mind boggs starting over wellemyer sometimes..

by cardsforever on Jul 23, 2009 11:20 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Do you really want to pin the 09 playoff hopes

on Ank’s bum shoulder? I really don’t need to run out the stats since that injury yet another time.

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 24, 2009 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

if we get holliday

i really hope if we trade wallace that we are gonna be able to re-sign holliday….anyone know?

by Jombari on Jul 24, 2009 12:18 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Unlikely.

Decrease runs scored?
Maybe.

Decrease winning? Never seen that proven.
-SFTU

by hazel on Jul 24, 2009 1:02 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No, we can't re-sign holliday

without a commitment to raise payroll significantly. It probably also means DeRosa won’t be back.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 24, 2009 5:43 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

no mark teahen

as fourstick said, he is the poor man’s derosa. we either go big and get someone who would make a difference in this lineup or nothing. holliday has been hitting well after an adjustment period to one of the tougher parks for hitters. is he gonna rake like he did at colorado, no. but he’s gonna be the best protection for pujols we can get. and you can’t tell me he’s not gonna be able to bang at h-town’s bandbox, cincy’s homer-friendly park, pittsburgh, a day the wind’s blowin out at wrigley, or the crew’s dome…please. and he’s a plus defender.

lineup

1. skippy
2. ras (could be inter-changeable at 6)
3. pujols
4. holliday
5. stud-wick
6.de-ro (could be inter-changeable at 2)
7. molina
8. pitcher
9. ryan (leads off against lefty’s sometimes

bench: larue, ankiel, lugo, glaus (when healthy to play), thurston, greene????

that lineup is effin solid. i look at it say, “wow, if pujols has an off nite we could still win.” our pitching is fine with carp and waino fronting the rotation. we won’t use the fifth starter in the playoffs. the only other thing i think we could use is maybe another guy for the pen…but that would prolly be wishful thinking. if the organization is not sold on the fact that wallace, the walrus, jesus with a bat, or whatever you wanna call him call him can’t play third at the major league level then best of luck to ya kid. this could go along way towards showing pujols we’re here to play with the big boys. i have a feeling holliday would like it here. he re-signs for 5 years 54-62 million and we had a sick outfield + pujols n molina…..everything else is replaceable. (just talking about everyday players)

"A slick way to out-figure a person is to get him figuring you figure he's figuring you're figuring he'll figure you aren't really figuring what you want him to figure you figure." ~ Whitey Herzog

by birdsonabat on Jul 24, 2009 2:25 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I really wish we knew

if Wallace would stick at 3B. That would make our complaining so much more directed. And do you really think Holliday will take 4-5M under market just because he likes it? Best case scenario imo is 5 years 70 mill.

by AWolfAtTheDoor on Jul 24, 2009 2:38 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i could live with 70 mill

as long as the extra 10 mill or so doesn’t effect pujols cash. i believe we’re selling out a few more games with that lineup as well. cards fans come in droves when everyone thinks we can win.

"A slick way to out-figure a person is to get him figuring you figure he's figuring you're figuring he'll figure you aren't really figuring what you want him to figure you figure." ~ Whitey Herzog

by birdsonabat on Jul 24, 2009 2:46 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

[Holliday] re-signs for 5 years 54-62 million

lmao

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 24, 2009 5:38 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

sorry that probably came over slightly dick-ish

what I mean was, yeah, there’s no way in hell Holliday signs a contract for less than $11m/yr. Think $15m/yr and upwards.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 24, 2009 5:44 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

...please excuse the grammatical errors...its late...i'm buzzed...shit happens

"A slick way to out-figure a person is to get him figuring you figure he's figuring you're figuring he'll figure you aren't really figuring what you want him to figure you figure." ~ Whitey Herzog

by birdsonabat on Jul 24, 2009 2:28 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I quite like Teahan

but he’s a little bit redundant if we have DeRosa (who is a better hitter and a slightly better defender). The whole point of DeRo is that he’s versatile (good OF, so-so 3B, kinda crappy but acceptable-with-his-bat 2B) so it means that we can fill in the extra gaps by signing either a 3B or an OF, and just plug DeRo in where he’s needed. If we have TWO players who can play all three positions, I think we’re not getting the full advantage of their versatility (plus, Teahan is a bad 3B so he’s likely an abysmal 2B), so we’re “paying for the versatility” which is kind of redundant.

DeRosa won’t cost much more (contract-wise) to extend, and won’t cost a player to trade. I also think Teahan is liked in KC and by Moore (and he has a good contract, as you said) so I think it’ll take more than (say) Boggs + a C-level prospect to do this. I reckon they need one of our AAA (or a higher ceiling guy at A/AA, say Lynn), probably someone to play 3B or OF (maybe Craig?) plus at least one more meaningful piece (maybe a reliever) to get it done.

I think, as we have DeRosa and could probably extend him for less than $10m next year, we’re better of just getting a rental at 3B or OF. We don’t need another utility knife.

Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008

by Felonius_Monk on Jul 24, 2009 5:49 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

i’m thinking of him as less of another utility type player and more of an everyday left fielder for a team running out replacement level players every night we have a good core to our offense in rasmus pujols and ludwick fill in the rest with leauge averagish players coupled with our above average pitching and we are a playoff team i don’t think we need another impact bat just someone to take at bats away from ankiel

by callmesir on Jul 24, 2009 9:18 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

The site managers should retire this page

Because it is now officially OBE and DOA.

by JWO on Jul 24, 2009 4:40 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

it's a member of the order of the british empire?

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on Jul 24, 2009 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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