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Around SBN: Explaining Jeremy Lin's Early, Surprising Success

Shane! Shane! Come back!

I didn't see Wellemeyer pitch, because the game started and ended while I was otherwise occupied, but all of a sudden his ERA is within 4.75—well within the lower bound of acceptable performance for our erstwhile flamethrower. Now, after his two May starts, his heretofore way-too-good peripherals have started to look more worrisome as his enormous pile of hits allowed deflates—DIPS may be a great idea at the end of the season, but in the early going it's a little exhausting to follow.

We're still at the point where he might have a good or bad day in any one of the Three True Outcomes and leave the resulting stats so skewered that the Wellemeyer Narrative changes completely.

#

So, Shane Robinson—this is two years in a row that he's gotten off to a high-average start, and he's been rewarded, now, with his very own Baseball Reference page, which is a big deal. 

But I agree with Future Redbirds, except inasmuch that I think their comparison to Jarrett Hoffpauir is a little unfair to Hoff, who's walked 253 times and struck out just 197 in his minor league career. Robinson is useful now—he'll play centerfield, he'll give La Russa a pinch bat and glove to use until Ankiel gets back—but right now he's an uncertain fit as even a long-term fifth outfielder.

It takes a lot to hit like Shane Robinson does at AA and AAA in the major leagues—just look at Brian Barton's minor league numbers. If you hit like a fourth outfielder in the minor leagues, you probably can't hit like a fourth outfielder in the bigs. But I'm glad to see a new MLB player get his wings, of course, and there are exceptions to rules like that. So let's see if he can have that BABIP surge in the majors, too. 

#

There's more to talk about, but I'd like to get this up before noon. This one always gets me—Cardinals game at 6:00, even though the fact that Cincinnati is in Eastern Standard Time will never stick in my head.

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so we got cincin next, eh?

it’d be nice for another sweep… although a series win would probably be more realistic, it seems they are playing some decent ball

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 12:33 PM EDT reply actions  

Wait, what?

Cincy is in the Eastern Time Zone, so why wouldn’t the game be at 7 ET/6 CT?

by Hardcore Legend on May 8, 2009 12:34 PM EDT reply actions  

Because, in Ohio,

nothing is as it seems…..

/spooky music/

by arch support on May 8, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

you don't know the half of it

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on May 8, 2009 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm confused, too...

Cincinnati is in the Eastern Time Zone, the game starts at 7:10 Eastern/6:10 Central, and that’s exactly how it should be…right? Maybe Dan was just saying any 6:00 start throws him off, regardless of the location.

by LukeMP1186 on May 8, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

My reading comprehension skills...

are always better the second time around. I’m pretty sure he was saying the fact that Cincinnati is in the Eastern Time Zone to begin with is what’s hard to remember. I agree…

by LukeMP1186 on May 8, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Try Bloomington, Ind.

They are technically in the central time zone, but they don’t honor daylight savings time.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

that’s not true any more.

by greenback06 on May 8, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Virtually all of Arizona...

doesn’t honor DST either. So despite being in the Mountain Time Zone, they’re on par with Pacific Time during DST. During standard time, they’re in line with Mountain Time again…

by LukeMP1186 on May 8, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

i can vouch for that

it’s really kind of confusing here sometimes.

by Phizzle on May 8, 2009 6:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sounds like it would be LESS confusing

Never have to change your watch

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 9, 2009 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

franklin's beard.
Meanwhile, Franklin’s red, Lincoln-esque beard, something a hockey player would be wearing this time of the year, seems to get fuller and fuller.

“I’m just letting it go,” Franklin said. “I know my wife hates it. My kids don’t like it.”

So, how does Franklin win that battle? “They’re not here,” he said. “They’re back in Oklahoma.”

hummel

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 12:46 PM EDT reply actions  

wow

that’s awesome! he should start wearing a Lincoln hat too

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

It is a sight to behold in HD...

…wonderfully disgusting.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

that one scared the crap out of me

Don’t ask. I liked the Kids in the Hall version better, though.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYuOurhglz8

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on May 8, 2009 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

dang

I wish it was another day game, can’t watch it tonight

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 12:46 PM EDT reply actions  

Eastern Daylight Time

/being a dick

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 12:48 PM EDT reply actions  

haha

I knew it would happen, but I made a potential-confusion decision in favor of just using EST.

by DanUpBaby on May 8, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

i have to say the most disturbing part of the call-up of shane is this:

This guy has more neck than face.

That is all.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 12:50 PM EDT reply actions  

I've seen worse.

But yeah, he’s a tiny head.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

i cant tell if you are being dirty or not...

i can never tell with the females…

"Baseball is dull only to dull minds." - Red Barber
Yeah, I'm a loser...

by nomar34 on May 8, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wasn't this time,

but I’ll laugh if you take it there.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Since he has such a long neck

Maybe he should share some with Reyes

Stat Whore

by FlimtotheFlam on May 8, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

He kinda looks

like the Tony Shaloub character from Men in Black, when his head is only half grown back…

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on May 8, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeebs

You insensitive pricks! Do you have any idea how much that stings?

Don't argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. - anon.

by Solanus on May 8, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

The bit about Barton brings up an interesting point...

How come they did not just promote Crab Man?

He has the experience and offers everything Shane does except he can’t play CF. But we have Raz for CF and Ludwick can play in a pinch as well.

*Rasmus is to CF as Longoria is to 3B*

by Red Blazer on May 8, 2009 12:51 PM EDT reply actions  

because we traded him to atlanta for boyer.

i understand other teams take it mighty particular when we try to call up players from their minor leagues.

on the other hand, maybe we should try that with wieters. just call him up, see if anybody notices.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

I like that idea

Wieters probably wouldn’t mind. Let’s try to do it with Bumgarner and Price while we’re at it.

Patiently awaiting the day Colby Rasmus does this: .275/.381/.551/.932, 29HR, in St. Louis...and I'm wanting an Allen Craig call-up!

by RunninRedbird on May 8, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think it is an idea worth trying. ;)

But on the other hand, should we be surprised then if other teams try to write Albert Pujols in on their line-up cards?

by cardsgirl95 on May 8, 2009 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Would never happen.

He’d eliminate them.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

So is the winner...

the one who fills out their lineup card first? Is there a tiebreaker?

"Don't do anything till I get back!" - Jesus to the Cubs

by cardzfanbub on May 8, 2009 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Doh!

Well, I guess I forgot to flip the switch on the meat nugget in my skull this morning.

*Rasmus is to CF as Longoria is to 3B*

by Red Blazer on May 8, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

unfortunately

spaceman is with Atlanta now

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

No mention of Man-Ram

I know this is a Cardinals blog, but that PED cloud casts a shadow over all of baseball.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on May 8, 2009 12:54 PM EDT reply actions  

On the plus side

It reduces the possibility of LA having the best NL record. Is it too early to start thinking home field advantage???

by JWO on May 8, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Everytime another big name falls

I just duck my head and thank the Lord it wasn’t Pujols.

And honestly, I kinda yearn for the days of gaudy HR numbers.

by Hardcore Legend on May 8, 2009 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Me too

I am also thankful it isn’t Apu. But frankly, I thought the game was more interesting back in the 80s when a team could win without home runs.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on May 8, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Especially given

Albert’s pining for the Manny in the offseason.

Did anyone read Simmon’s column yesterday? Sad but true (the sentiment, not implying that the facts of his fictional story are true). It’s hard not to question a bunch of those Sox that won in 04 — Manny, Belhorn, Damon, Papi even Pedro.

by OCCardsFan on May 8, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I honestly hope he somehow gets caught

I hate it when athletes get caught for juicing, but the way he’s been such a douche about everyone who got caught, man it would just tickle me pink to see him get busted.

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think if there's one guy I feel confident who didn't juice

It’d be Schilling. Way, way moreso than Pujols, not that I think Pujols juiced.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on May 8, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

because he so adamantly calls out the people who do use it?

that could very easily just be a defense ploy to move suspicion off of him

by Cuttah on May 8, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've got to imagine, though

that he saw what happened to Palmiero after he was so adamant.

Frank Thomas is another guy in this group, incidentally—he’s been calling for testing since the mid-90s.

by DanUpBaby on May 8, 2009 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree on Thomas wholeheartedly

And would like to add that I can’t believe The Big Hurt is unemployed. He’s still going to get on-base at a .360ish clip, even if his power is dwindling. Surely, he was worth a low, incentive-latent deal.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gaudy

HR numbers? Like 11 in 28 games?

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

How many HR

is Albert on pace to hit?

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks,

but how did you arrive at this number?

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

162/28*11= 63 and change

although I believe he sat out one game thus far.

by redrey on May 8, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

if you do the plate appearance math...

albert has hit 11 hr’s in 126 pa’s for a rate of one homerun every 11.4 PA’s

and he is on pace to get 702.9 PA’s this year (28/29 games = 96% * 162 = 156 games * 4.5 pa’s per game [126 PA’s / 28 games].

so 702.9 / 11.4 = 61.7 home runs for the season is the projected total hr’s at season’s end. slightly more accurate than taking the hr / game rate.

by streamman on May 8, 2009 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

the whole steroid thing is just the media trying to get attention and dollars. I personally don’t care, since they overlooked it so long and now it’s “oh no, steroids bad!”. sick of hypocritical crap like this. sure manny shouldn’t have tried to get away with it, but something tells me this story isn’t over yet.

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't care about stories from the past...

like A-Rod’s deal, but I hate hearing about current players getting caught. I’m trying to be naive and believe that the drug policies are working.

"Don't do anything till I get back!" - Jesus to the Cubs

by cardzfanbub on May 8, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

i personally dont buy they hyperbole

if by now you don’t assume that a sizable portion of all players over the last 15 yrs have used/are using/will have used PEDs at this point, you really aren’t paying attention. superstars, scrubs and players in between. despite all the whining and hand wringing, more people (pre economic down times) were spending money on baseball than ever before. so basically no one really cares.

by FunkeeC on May 8, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am OUTRAGED

It wears a little thin. Bernie’s blog post was just silly. Olney’s suggested “zero tolerance” policy is absurd. The reaction to this is way overblown. None of them seem to care when it’s Ryan Franklin (and Bernie seems to have forgotten), but when it’s A-Rod or Manny, baseball’s sanctity has been violated and it seems disingenuous, almost as if it’s a game to see who can be more outraged—NOT surprised, mind you, because who would be after the events of the last few years—but OUTRAGEDLY OUTRAGED!

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

That's OUTRAGEOUS!

But in actuality, I agree with you. Plaschke wouldn’t have been putting on that circus act if it had been someone-not-named-Manny.

Patiently awaiting the day Colby Rasmus does this: .275/.381/.551/.932, 29HR, in St. Louis...and I'm wanting an Allen Craig call-up!

by RunninRedbird on May 8, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

lord im glad im not a dodgers fan

i live out in socal and i want to shoot plaschke already, and i dont read his garbage

by FunkeeC on May 8, 2009 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Plaschke is an abomination

There was a good post on NBC’s “Circling the Bases” that compared the LA opinionators’ individual responses. Not surprisingly, Plaschke comes off sounding like a reactionary lunatic who barely managed to scramble atop his high horse before casting down condemnation from it.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Abso-friggin-lutley
For years he and his colleagues demanded a drug testing system, and now that they have one and it’s working, he demands that it be ignored and guys be banned for life. Whatever, Bill. In any event, let’s remember to check back in with Plashchke in October when the Dodgers are sprinting towards a World Series victory. I have this feeling he won’t be nearly as wounded by Manny then.

Patiently awaiting the day Colby Rasmus does this: .275/.381/.551/.932, 29HR, in St. Louis...and I'm wanting an Allen Craig call-up!

by RunninRedbird on May 8, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

the most ridiculous part

is that manny was just taking a fertility drug

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I disagree

The most ridiculous thing is that because he tested positive once for a women’s fertility drug, that’s proof that he’s been cheating his entire career.

Where do these people get off? I want to see one of these jokers get caught driving drunk, so we can put “Colin Cowherd is an alcoholic who drives home drunk every night for the last 20 years” on the front page of the sports section.

And that doesn’t apply just to Plaschke, that applies to the mainstream media as a whole.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on May 8, 2009 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Regarding the mainstream media:

The thing that REALLY bothers me about this situation is that I have yet to see an article, opinion piece, or video segment even mention the fact that Manny could’ve been taking this to treat male factor infertility. But they are all sure to mention hCG’s role in steroid cycling. So much for being thorough and having journalistic integrity. All these pieces are one-sided.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've read several stories regarding the infertility issue,

and most of the physicians interviewed are really skeptical about this use for the drug any more. Most physicians today agree that Viagra and Cialis work better than this drug, and none of them are proven to do much for sperm count.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Viagra and Cialis

are for erectile dysfunction. I’d like to see links to these articles because I think you are generalizing in an extreme fashion.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

that's used at the end of the cycle

the part that bothers me is the difference in opinion in regards to the nfl and mlb

in baseball it is sacrilege, in football it is expected

by BirdsonFire on May 8, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Both bother me

We will declare a player’s entire career null and void for a positive test at age 36 and decry the black mark on the game while saying and writing nothing about NFL players. Both are ridiculous.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

You guys do realize that

this particular drug is used 95% of the time in men to help them jump start their own testosterone production after taking a cycle of steroids.

When you take steroids, your body gradually stops producing testosterone on its own. This drug is generally used to help people get their body to start producing testosterone again after cycling off the ’roids.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Where are

you getting that 95% figure from?

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I apologize for that number.

I read 2 articles this morning that indicated that this drug is used “most frequently” for that purpose. The 95% number was my own doing. I retract that.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes

It is used to restart natural testosterone production after utilizing steroids. I know that. And I believe that if Manny were using the ‘roids that precipitated his needing to take this particular drug for years and years, he’d have tested positive before now. I don’t know about the 95% of men who use it do steroids figure, but I know what it does.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

As I mentioned later, there are a LOT

of steroid and growth-hormone drugs out there that are completely undectable. Bonds’s “cream and clear” drugs were undetectable. The only way the MLB found out about them was through the BALCO raid.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right

But, weren’t they also using a different testosterone-inducing drug that is also undetectable? I thought that they were using a drug that has a similar effect, but is undetectable? I could be wrong. You are right. He could have been using undetectable steroids and then used a detectable drug to induce testosterone production by his body. Again, if this is his cycle, I have to think he would have been caught at this stage of it sooner than now.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Further,

why would everything be above-board through a physician? Is Manny so stupid that he wouldn’t try to hide/minimize the paper trail at this point?

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don't you think he would have been the least bit outraged

If this was all completely innocent, rather than just coming forward and accepting the punishment? Wasn’t Romero pretty vocal about how he got screwed? You didn’t really hear any of that from Manny. Just the excuse.

I’m skeptical.

by OCCardsFan on May 8, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

He

intended to appeal the suspension. He changed his mind at the last minute. Perhaps he didn’t want the world to know if he’s infertile. Perhaps his wife didn’t want the world to know.

Perhaps he’s Manny Ramirez and he wanted a vacation.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

IF he

didn’t think the fertility drug was a banned substance, then why try to hide it?

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

How

often do steroid users have to use a drug like hCG to produce testosterone again? If he’s a steroid user – and let’s assume for a second that he definitely is, and that he’s experienced at it – this would not be the first time he’d taken hCG. Five years of negative tests… He would’ve shown elevated testosterone before now. UNLESS he just started using.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

According to the AP story on HCG

It was just added to the banned list last year. So they haven’t been testing for it.

by OCCardsFan on May 8, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

He didn't

test positive for hCG. He had elevated testosterone levels.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

MLB used

a paper trail to prove this.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Okay well maybe he just started needing testosterone

I’m not ready to villify him, but I’m very skeptical of these fertility claims. I haven’t seen many doctor’s come forward to accept that it is likely that he was legitimately using HCG. Maybe there are, but I haven’t seen it.

by OCCardsFan on May 8, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

You probably haven't

seen it because it doesn’t make for interesting copy.

Which was exactly my point somewhere above when I discussed the fact that the mainstream articles I’m reading are completely ignoring this legitimate form of treatment for men.

I’m not saying that this is what happened. I’m saying it could be what happened. There is a lot of ambiguity in this situation.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good points

I don’t really disagree. I’m just skeptical.

by OCCardsFan on May 8, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm skeptical of all of it.

Just offering an alternative viewpoint that’s not being discussed.

Ultimately, Manny is at best a complete dumbass.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

that's going on my gravestone.

“At Best, A Complete Dumbass.”

With your permission, of course.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Though

I doubt your complete dumbassery.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Both sides to this pseudo-debate are engaging in rampant speculation.

A la ESPN, we are making suppositions based on limited information. I think we’d save ourselves some time by taking a step back, accepting that we’ll likely never know, and move on. I am going to go jogging (or “yawging,” it might be a soft “j”) and to the Memphis Redbirds/Iowa Cubs game (provided it doesn’t get rained out). While there, I won’t think about Manny Ramirez’s PED use, whatever performance he was attempting to enhance. Have a good weekend, folks.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree

I mean I’m glad they are finally trying to clean up the game and I don’t buy Manny’s excuse at all, but I’m so sick of reading pieces that just tell us we’re all dumb for not throwing everyone under the bus. Spare the sanctimonious bullshit about how smart you are for being suspicious Mr. Journalist. (not meaning you of course, bgh)

Congrats to all the paid journalists who take the easy road and just throw everyone under the bus instead of looking at the matter on a case-by-case basis. (/sarcasm) I’m tired of all the writers who profit off of this issue over-sensationalizing it like they had nothing to do w/ the initial storm of steroid use.

NOT everyone is juicing. I’m tired of articles telling me to hate on everyone.

by kalmavet on May 8, 2009 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

The canonization of the players who set records annoys me, too.

Amphetamine use was rampant in the days of yore, with Willie Mays likely using and providing them, yet no one seems to care. Babe Ruth never faced an African-American or a Latino pitcher. (I would like to reiterate the fact that Branch Rickey was the person who invented minor league baseball, brought in the first African-American, and brought in the first Latino, yet we don’t have him on our left field wall of legends.) It’s an imperfect sport for an imperfect nation and the knee-jerk condemnations cast from keyboards across the nation is a little difficult to stomach. Lost in the shuffle is the fact that Manny has passed what I would estimate to be at least a dozen drug tests before this one. He’ll likely pass another half-dozen before retiring. I don’t what that proves and what it does not, but to me it sure seems like the “purists” have appointed themselves guardians of an idealistic game that simply does not exist, never has existed, and never will exis.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

according to Manny he's passed...

fifteen tests in the past five seasons.

"Don't do anything till I get back!" - Jesus to the Cubs

by cardzfanbub on May 8, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Without a doubt, it could

But, then, I have to ask, why and how does he end up taking something detectable and getting caught? I ask simply because I cannot fathom how such a cunning cheater could muck things up so badly.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

He didn't know it was on the banned substance list.

He said that himself.

Case in point:
Bonds would have NEVER been caught if it weren’t for the BALCO exposure. The drugs he was taking were undetectable.

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

agreed again

No one ever talks about the “legends” in that light. It’s how we romanticize them. The Babe Ruth point is especially telling.

Quite a few ppl would actually make the claim that Amphetamine use helped players over the course of 162 games than steroids ever did. And I think they’d be right!

Baseball’s imperfections are undeniable and, in a somewhat paradoxical sense, part of its charm. I just wish the national media as a whole was more honest about it. Perspective is lacking

by kalmavet on May 8, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

As a 35 year old "weekend" athelete/ weightlifter,

I’ll dispute that. The benefit of steriods are that you can recover more quickly, work out more and get stronger. Perhaps the short-term benefit of amphetimine could rival a steriod shot, but in the long terms speed, or any “uppers” have a negative impact on performance.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on May 8, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Untrue.

There was just a major article in the NYTimes regarding the positive effects of caffeine on athletic performance. Stimulants are stimulants.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

The other, ignored bit is: Steroids help you get bigger faster, but you still have to work out to get bigger. If you just do steroids, it won’t help much.

OTOH, amps are free; you just pop them in your mouth and suddenly you are able to focus and react faster.

TO me, this makes steroids LESS offensive than amps.

- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc

by SleepyCA on May 8, 2009 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

NFL writers approach

The NFL writers seem to get over the whole roid issue pretty quickly. Shawne Merriman is a great example.

Merriman finished third in the balloting for 2006 Associated Press Defensive Player of the Year, behind Jason Taylor and Champ Bailey, after having tested positive for using steroids which is against the league’s drug abuse policy.

Will Manny win the Comeback Player of the Year award for a great “second half”?

by ubeddie on May 8, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nike

I remember when Nike dumped Giambi after Giambi’s grand jury testimony was leaked to the press. However, after Merriman tested positive for steroids, he got his own commercial. Joe Morgan is, no doubt, OUTRAGED at the inconsistency.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

no it doesn't

I still like it, plus clouds would do that

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

PED Cloud

Honestly, I couldn’t care less about PEDs, and I didn’t want to write that “I don’t care” paragraph again. Manny Ramirez was no role model as is, unless you like shoving underlings around, so there isn’t a whole lot of “say it ain’t so, Joe” in this news for me anyway.

by DanUpBaby on May 8, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

I try not to care about things that haven’t been proven to work.

by Harknights on May 8, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really?

Bonds set the single-season home run record of 73 at the age of 36. His previous career high was 49

by Glowsticks on May 8, 2009 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

absolutely

manny’s actions to get out of Boston are just as bad if not worse than him using PED’s. What does it say about the game that a player can quit on his team, shove team employees, and be a general jerk and end up getting exactly what he wants for his efforts?

by kalmavet on May 8, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Only observation I have of Manny

is that I’m surprised that nobody’s pointed out the obvious reason that Manny was caught taking a women’s fertility drug for personal reasons:

he wants to be called ‘Loretta’.

Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.

by liam on May 8, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

stay safe, Cardinal nation

That t-storm cell crashing through the heart of Cards country is also spewing tornadoes. Greetings from basements everywhere.

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on May 8, 2009 1:01 PM EDT reply actions  

Heh

I had to duck and cover around 8:30 this morning. Good thing was, it cancelled my classes for today!

Patiently awaiting the day Colby Rasmus does this: .275/.381/.551/.932, 29HR, in St. Louis...and I'm wanting an Allen Craig call-up!

by RunninRedbird on May 8, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I love this weather,

especially when the Cards are on the road.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I already spend all my time in my makers* basement so no big deal.

*Robots don’t have mothers.

Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation

by azruavatar on May 8, 2009 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Then you obviously aren't one of those sophisticated

models from A.I. are you?

Patiently awaiting the day Colby Rasmus does this: .275/.381/.551/.932, 29HR, in St. Louis...and I'm wanting an Allen Craig call-up!

by RunninRedbird on May 8, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mothers

of invention.

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Do you remember us discussing getting an Expos t-shirt?

I did it. I rule.

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

YES!

Classic underachiever.

by spants on May 8, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sooo,

no need to buy a Mother’s Day card then. Is there a holiday for Makers?

by cardsgirl95 on May 8, 2009 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I forgot what this thread was about

and for a sec I thought there was a holiday for Makers Mark

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

All of them, right?

Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.

by liam on May 8, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Days ending in "y"

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

if only,,,,

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on May 8, 2009 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I understand

that jinxes surround us like the Force. That we are all guilty of committing them—I myself called Colby’s first homer a dozen times before he finally hit it. As God wrote: “For man is born unto trouble, as the sparks fly upward.” We are human, and cannot help but jinx this and jinx that, against our better judgment.

But it makes me happy to see that Cubs fans are not infallible in this respect.

by santiagofish on May 8, 2009 2:18 PM EDT reply actions  

FSM "blackout" games

Blackout may not be the right term, but does anyone have the list of 2009 Cards games that are carried generally through the FSM market, including St. Louis, but are not shown in some places? I think it is about 20 games, and I have a bad feeling tonight is one of them.

This season the local station that has picked up the Sunday afternoon games for years has dropped them, too. Man, I miss those.

by Youneverknow on May 8, 2009 2:27 PM EDT reply actions  

This should be it

Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.

by liam on May 8, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

If you're talking about his anti-anxiety meds

They’re physician-prescribed and MLB approved.

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

kid tested & mother approved.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

See...

I think that Ritalin and “focus-enhancing” drugs like that are just as performance enhancing as steroids are, yet they’re unregulated.

If I was a player in the big leagues I’d probably pop an Adderrall about an hour before game time. No nasty side effects and I get to have unfettered concentration for 4-6 hours during the game.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on May 8, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

this whole situation is ludicrous

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

If a player has anxiety, and a doctor prescribes xanax for it, it's kosher

Just as if a player has low testosterone, and a doctor prescribes testosterone supplements for it, that’s kosher too. When these players take the drugs without a documented medical need for them, that’s when the trouble starts.

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 9, 2009 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

looks like you'll have to copy paste this

also mentions Motte pitching 10 scoreless innings in a row

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Motte

I’m loving what he’s been bringing since [the game that shortened my lifespan]

by mikey_mac on May 8, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

From the same column

I notice that the Dodgers are using the the double-leadoff lineup with Juan Pierre batting 9th.

Wonder if they’ll stick with it.

Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.

by liam on May 8, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are they really using the double-leadoff?

Or is Juan Pierre just a worse hitter than their pitcher most nights?

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Click Click

Guys like Bradley are exactly why we can't have a pumpkin patch anymore.

by liam on May 8, 2009 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hmmm
You’ve heard enough about Manny Ramirez(notes) for one day; it’s a Manny-free zone as we sail through a collection of enhancement-free Thursday night bullets

And then they start talking about Franklin…

by Evilfrog on May 8, 2009 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

No doubt

He should have had a bullet point about JC Romero following that one I guess…

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on May 8, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

radar

link

hecanthithecanthithecanthithecanthit

by Alxfritz on May 8, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have no statistical basis for this...

But I would be willing to guess that no team in baseball that’s not based in the Northeast has suffered through more rain delays and postponements in the last 3 years. Not so much the postponements (despite 2 already this year), but I swear it felt like there was at least one rain delay a week in 2007 and 2008…

by LukeMP1186 on May 8, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Aren't you from the South?

Florida? Atlanta? You know about those pop-up thunderstorms every afternoon right?

When I was at Auburn, I took classes in the summer a couple of times. Literally every day (well, maybe 90% of the days), I’d wake up at the crack of noon, and there wouldn’t be a cloud in the sky. Hot, muggy, beautiful day. Right around 4 or 5, you’d see some ominous clouds in the distance. By 5 or 6, it would be a downpour thunderstorm. By sunset, it’s gone. I don’t know how it worked, but you could almost set your clock to it.

Seeing as how I like thunderstorms, though, I loved it.

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes, i miss those living out here in cali

nothing like falling to sleep to a thunderstorm

by FunkeeC on May 8, 2009 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'll trade you

my thunderstorms for your 75-80 degree weather year round and beaches

by Cuttah on May 8, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think I've asked before

But where do you live?

I’m in Santa Monica and can’t ever find anyplace to watch a damn Cardinals game in public.

defy, cards, defy. hey logic --- you suck.

by effin fisk on May 8, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I love Santa Monica

I have a few friends who live there. If the economy didn’t suck and I could afford to look for a job down there, I would.

by Cuttah on May 8, 2009 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wrong santa

Santa Barbara is burning, so I’m safe (For now).

No word on Santa Glaus.

defy, cards, defy. hey logic --- you suck.

by effin fisk on May 8, 2009 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

im in orange county

huntington beach to be exact. if we can find some places to watch some cards games live im down, sadly i generally catch them on mlb.tv as it is

by FunkeeC on May 8, 2009 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've grown up in Memphis...

and I’ve been at UT (which is in East Tennessee for any of you who weren’t aware) the last 4 years. I know what you’re talking about, even though I probably don’t experience it as often, you being further South and closer to the Gulf and all…

by LukeMP1186 on May 8, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah

I’d imagine it’s not as common in the mountains of E. Tenn.

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 9, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

The storm heading Cincy's way looks like a hurricane

I've got one foot on the platform, the other foot on the train
I'm going back to New Orleans, to wear that ball and chain

by jd is legend on May 8, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

She is an ugly mother!

As having lost a home in a tornado….. you all take care out there!

by OKCARDSFAN_411 on May 8, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

ESPN RADIO help help let me out of your box

i have always been suspicous of certai guys, cause they walk the line so closely its hard to believe whats true whats not…Like clemens wants us to believe his best friend, wife, and trainer all used but he didnt…my thing is then fire your trainer, help your wife and best friend instead of still employing the guy etc…but what i heard on ESPN yesterday was a bit much

I think the game with a certain risk it would tak eshould start exalting AP Id even meet with him if i was selig do a big campaign around him his charity etc..but is he ever gets busted your screwed. He hasnt had a cloud other than the stoopid Mitchell false report that basically just picked big names. Ok now to what they said since a large part of the guys caught or Lations(their words) and he’s dominican and plays for a manager that has had former users in his clubhouse before(ie Canseco allegedly Big mac) then he has to be using right? The interview was with some guy from the Globe to which he said yeah there is probably a guilt by association there.

that whole piece of reporting just made me sick. Well hes similar in race, and his manager knows guys who did then yup user.

I can't believe i gave up a homerun to that punch and judy hitter-major league 2

by punchinjudy on May 8, 2009 3:05 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

It's not "reporting."

It’s witch hunting. It’s paranoia. It’s gutter journalism not even worthy of a tabloid.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

On a lighter note

Oakland is starting a pitcher with perhaps the greatest name imaginable for a hurler: Josh Outman.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 3:38 PM EDT reply actions  

his brother Fake

could get off a jump shot in traffic like no basketball player I’ve ever seen, before or since.

by DanUpBaby on May 8, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Damn

I’m glad he doesn’t play for the Cards — I would then have to sift through an entire FanPost of suggested first names for his cousins, nephews, nieces, and grandchildren. :-D

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on May 8, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm going to the game tomorrow night in Cincy

Last year when I went to a game at Great America Albert hit 2 HRs…looking forward to the sequel. We have beat up on Herrang in the past so I am hoping for a big scoring game!

We’ve got a long way to go and a short time to get there.

by KYCards on May 8, 2009 4:05 PM EDT reply actions  

Hopefully your presence proves lucky again for Pujols and the Cards

Enjoy. I’ve always wanted to go to BOA, but haven’t felt like driving across three states…

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's an odd stadium

the seats are actually slanted towards homeplate so at times, you are looking at the back of the person sitting next to you.

The OF area seems completely disconnected from the rest of the stadium and you’ve got to walk about 20 miles to actually get to the stadium from the parking.

by Hardcore Legend on May 8, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's what I really like about Busch

I can get a hotel within one to five blocks, park, and just walk back and forth all weekend. Many stadiums don’t have it so walkable. Plus, you can go to the Imo’s just on the other side of the interstate, get a medium pizza and large 32-oz. drinks to feed four people for a little under $20, which is a great way to avoid the over-priced stadium fare.

How are the ticket prices at BOA?

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ticket prices are not bad at all.

And I have been able to move around the stadium and sit wherever pretty easily. They never sell out and there are plenty of good seats available. It’s actually kind of sad, Cincy used to be a great baseball town. When the Cards play there I would bet the stadium is made up of about 35-40% Cardinal fans. Which isn’t a big deal because the Cincy fans are not rude and they don’t really care that you root for the Cardinals. So what Reds fans are left are pretty cool people.

We’ve got a long way to go and a short time to get there.

by KYCards on May 8, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

My goal this summer

Either PNC or Department of the Treasury Field. With airfares so low, I think I can manage it. PNC is looking like the most likely destination. Maybe I’ll at BOA to my 2010 list…

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah it's a weird park

I actually miss Riverfront. Yeah it was a cookie cutter but it felt like a Major League Park. BOA feels like a minor league park to be honest. One good thing is it’s easy to get tickets. But HL your right the parking there is crap. You will get good exercise going to a Reds game. Especially if you walk across the bridge that goes from KY to Ohio. I did that once and it was a much longer walk than I thought.

We’ve got a long way to go and a short time to get there.

by KYCards on May 8, 2009 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

I visited it in 2007

and I have to say it is the worst of the 8 ballparks I’ve been to. To me, it just didn’t have much baseball atmosphere at all. One of my favorite things about going to the ballpark is the smells, but It didn’t smell like a normal ballpark (hot dogs, peanuts, beer, grass, etc.). Instead the smell of river was very pungent and my put it as “smelling like a dirty diaper.” That might be a bit harsh, but If I was choosing to go there or any other NL Central park I would go with the latter.

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

i will not be there this season, have fun.

your luck is far better than mine.

but i enjoyed the park, HL’s right about the seats. that’s the only thing i remember bugging me about it.

you know, besides the loss & Jamie’s elbow blowing up.

It kind of sounds like he’s [Duncan] just running around like a puppy out there – full speed ahead in random directions. – BTown Birds Fan

by gdm426 on May 8, 2009 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not sure if anyone else caught this...

but the Cubs traded Gathright for Ryan Freel today

"Greene over to Schumaker, on to first! Double Play!!"

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on May 8, 2009 5:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Farney's a Cub?

Say it ain’t so!

defy, cards, defy. hey logic --- you suck.

by effin fisk on May 8, 2009 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I saw where it was in the works

This is very odd to me. Don’t the O’s already have the Cubs’ last five-tool OF castoff in Felix Pie? Isn’t Gathright and Pie very, very redundant? I don’t get this from a Baltimore perspective, unless they are going to option Pie down to AAA or something.

From a Chicago point of view, I guess the get another RHB in the OF? Freel, Johnson, Fukudome, Hoffpauir, Soriano…I thought Johnson was handling the RHB platoon role just fine.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Freel...

was making some noise about not wanting to be in baltimore

"Greene over to Schumaker, on to first! Double Play!!"

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on May 8, 2009 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

maybe ..

they see freel as more of an IF?

"Greene over to Schumaker, on to first! Double Play!!"

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on May 8, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

The *new* DeRosa....

Utility player? Interesting.

"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."

--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS

by bgh on May 8, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Then where does Grit fit into the Cubs rotation?

Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.

by Eckstreem on May 8, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

rotation??

I thought he was a bullpen guy.

"Don't do anything till I get back!" - Jesus to the Cubs

by cardzfanbub on May 8, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

very interesting.. considering...

They traded DeRosa in a salary dump…but signed Gathright and Miles for more than what DeRosa was due…and added Freel’s 3+ mill

"Greene over to Schumaker, on to first! Double Play!!"

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on May 8, 2009 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

fantastic

for us

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on May 8, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, if somebody has an explanation for this, i'd like to hear it.

having two teams trade 5th outfielders seems like the biggest non-move ever. Freel hasn’t had an OPS over .700 since 06. Gathright is not much better.

the difference is that freel used to be good, while gathright is younger. if you think freel will return to form, then i guess it makes sense. if you think gathright will improve, i guess it makes sense.

neither of them seem more interesting than, say, brian barton.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

i agree...

especially if the Cubs wind up taking on more salary…if the money is even on both sides then, yea its a total non-move…but if the cubs are gonna take on freel’s salary…..wtf??

"Greene over to Schumaker, on to first! Double Play!!"

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on May 8, 2009 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

just saw on BCB that the orioles will pay SOME of the salary -- which doesn't tell us much.

i guess the idea is that he will be derosa, part deux. but freel’’s barely put any time in the infield since 2005; back when he was, you know, good.

i would not be particularly savvy about putting freel in at 2b or 3b. they’d be better off trying to coax miles into hitting .300 again. i smell enormous disappointment coming round the bend.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

There's been talk in the Balto

papers about Freel being unhappy with his role, even going so far as to approach the GM about it (Trembley can’t be happy about that).

And Felix Pie is disappointing everyone here and if he doesn’t pick it up soon he’ll likely be gone.

by MdRedbirdFreak on May 8, 2009 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hard to say.

I doubt they will be able to start at 6 if they do play.

by cardfan124 on May 8, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

this makes a conundrum for me

I was thinking about going to sedgwicks to watch the game after work, but I don’t really want to go there if they aren’t playing. hmmm

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

is sedgwicks

21 and over?

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, by next baseball season

I’ll be 21 anyways so, that should be a good time

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

let's see if this catches the image width

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on May 8, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I bet they will

The big blob (to use the technical meteorological term) of rain on the radar map is already mostly past SW Ohio and moving pretty quickly, and it’s still an hour before scheduled first pitch.

by BTown Birds fan on May 8, 2009 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

it looked like it was mostly just windy, very little rain last I checked

4B - beer baseball bands blog
rocknroll ain't noise pollution

by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 8, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

that system

started off in western KS late last night, made it here (KC) by daybreak, and is now blowing thru OH. It is definitely hauling ass….I’d expect baseball tonight, although they may only be getting ready to take the tarp off at the announced game time.

by nota bene on May 8, 2009 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

this has gone unremarked so far, but ryan's DL stint has been extended.

leach says so.

For now, i’m just as happy to get a feel for tyler greene in front of big league pitching. but it sounds like a reasonably serious strain, not just a day-to-day twinge. hopefully, it doesn’t have any long-lasting effects on ryan’s play. i’d rather he takes his time and comes back 100%.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 6:11 PM EDT reply actions  

you can't stop the rabbit

“It’s crazy to send him out there to play under control because it won’t happen”

"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT

by Yadi2Second on May 8, 2009 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

and A's traded for kennedy.

money and PTBNL.

rotoworld says quippily (and how I would love to be a copy editor for them — good baseball snark)

How far Kennedy has fallen — looks like he’ll be organizational depth in Oakland, reporting to Triple-A Sacramento. Still, if anyone can find a use for Kennedy, it is the A’s and their collection of misfit toys.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 6:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Lineups

Schumaker, 2B
Rasmus, CF
Pujols, 1B
Ludwick, RF
Duncan, LF
Molina, C
K. Greene, SS
Pineiro, P

Taveras, CF
J. Hairston, 2B
Bruce, RF
Ra. Hernandez, !B
Nix, LF
Rosales, 3B
Hannigan, C
Janish, SS
Cueto, P

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 6:49 PM EDT reply actions  

perfect! don't change it! i'm not going to complain at all!

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

On further review, your memory was dead on and mine was dead wrong.

We did beat up on Cueto twice last year: a 7-2 win on April 29 where he gave up 6 ER in 1.2 innings, and a 10-0 win on June 11 where he gave up 6 ER (with 8 BB!) in 5 innings. We were 1-1 against Volquez, but he pitched us a whole lot better.

Hopefully we’ll still have Cueto’s number this year.

by BTown Birds fan on May 8, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

we were a couple of great defensive plays

away from doing that, tonight.

- "I went at it and didn’t slow down, so it kind of bounced off me." -Lil' Dunc

by SleepyCA on May 9, 2009 2:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

it’s always nice to see Tony use a straightforward, self-explanatory lineup like that.

by nota bene on May 8, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

except we might need a 3b.

who is apparently thurston. i’ll complain about that.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

oops,

I forgot thurston is playing 3B and batting 9th, but I too would like to only bat 8 guys—more ABs for Albert

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

ugh I suck

thurston is batting 8th

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not as awesome

then

hecanthithecanthithecanthithecanthit

by Alxfritz on May 8, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Awesome lineup

hecanthithecanthithecanthithecanthit

by Alxfritz on May 8, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

also, skywatchers -- strauss says tarp is off the field and game time = 6:20 now.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know

I love this lineup.

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Manny is so important that he's the subject of the photo and related video in the Cards/Reds preview

at Yahoo Sports. And upon further exploration, he’s the subject of the photo and related video in every single game preview there. Just imagine what it would be like if he were still playing for the Red Sox….

by BTown Birds fan on May 8, 2009 6:58 PM EDT reply actions  

what a joke….that has nothing to do with the article at all.

by nota bene on May 8, 2009 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

River's up!

hecanthithecanthithecanthithecanthit

by Alxfritz on May 8, 2009 7:02 PM EDT reply actions  

Re-posted TV question

So I posted this on last night’s game thread and got a couple responses but since the game ended several hours before I don’t think many ppl saw it. With a looming rain delay this seems like a good time to mention it.

Is there anyone here who lives in the Memphis, TN region who has Comcast cable?

I have to switch from Dish Net (had sports package = FSMW) to Comcast cable and I’m trying to figure out if i’ll still be able to watch the cardinals games. There are two foxsports channels but I don’t know if I’ll get the foxsports MW feed from them since they don’t specifically say FSMW. Anybody know if I need the sports pack or something? One is channel 25 and the other is FoxsportsSouth or something. When I called the cable company they gave me a very vague answer and couldn’t look at a programming guide.

So does anyone from around know whether the games are on frequently on those channels? and thanks to those who tried to help w/ this before.

by kalmavet on May 8, 2009 7:07 PM EDT reply actions  

goooddddddddd

of course #$%^!* arod hits a 3-runner in his first pa back. of course he does. i hate the yankees so. fucking much.

at least it was in baltimore instead of in front of those godawful fans.

by nycbirdo on May 8, 2009 7:13 PM EDT reply actions  

how in the heck was he not on someone's dl??

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 7:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

drafted him

in the 3rd and 2nd round respectively in the two leagues I’m in. Gotta say, my teams are looking pretty strong having Hanley and A-Rod in one league and Miguel Cabrera and A-Rod in the other.

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on May 8, 2009 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

it was in baltimore off a baltimore starter.

nuff said.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

umm. game thread?

first pitch just went out?

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 7:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Gamethread???

anyone, anyone? Bueler…

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 7:23 PM EDT reply actions  

that's what I would guess

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

nice AB so far for Rasmus

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 7:27 PM EDT reply actions  

/ducks

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

eh

10 pitches in the first

k sucks, but nice early ab

by BirdsonFire on May 8, 2009 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

even with the K

i still liked that AB PA

My brain has shut down completely so my butt is doing all the thinking.

by jacksonian on May 8, 2009 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

i feel my hairs splitting

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on May 8, 2009 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

excellent thread title

and an excellent PA for Rasmus. . . even though he chased ball four

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on May 8, 2009 7:28 PM EDT reply actions  

what was that

a 13 pitch inning and rasmus saw 10 of them?

"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum

by scoot on May 8, 2009 7:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Game post up.

Here.

the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus

by tom s. on May 8, 2009 7:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Albert and Skip

both smoked the ball. Cueto isn’t fooling them. Even Rasmus had some good rips before striking out

by Cuttah on May 8, 2009 7:31 PM EDT reply actions  

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