Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Roy Nelson Willing to Pay for His Next Opponent's Drug Test

The Cards Experience

Each year ESPN the Magazine puts together their "Ultimate Standings" which attempt to compare all the major professional sports organizations in various categories. I’ve been asked for some feedback on fans’ present views of the club and wanted to turn it over to you b/c in many respects, you are closer to the pulse of the club than I am.

What I’m looking for, therefore, today is your input about the team and the organization. The categories that the magazine uses and that I’m looking for your input include:

  • Ownership
  • Coaching
  • Players
  • Fan Relations
  • Affordability
  • Stadium Experience
  • Bang for the Buck
  • Title Track
I’ll bet a few of you have a few things to say about ownership and I sense that there’s a mostly positive view of LaRussa, Duncan, Oquendo, and the rest of the staff. For players – I wonder what your impressions are. How much frustration is there by the fact that there seem to be fewer star players? Edgar Renteria is now Khalil Greene – a guy who had an OBP of .260 last year. Scott Rolen has become Troy Glaus and he’s hurt and so is David Freese and now it’s Joe Mather. Matt Morris and Darryl Kile have become Todd Wellemeyer and Kyle Lohse. Isringhausen is now Perez or Motte or…How much excitement is there about the fact that there should be so many young players (Mather, Rasmus, Perez, Motte, etc.) getting so much playing time? I sense both the frustration in the lack of "proven" names and the excitement at the emergence of these young players.

What about the state of the switch to KTRS from KMOX? I have to admit, I watch my Cards’ games on the Extra Innings package since I live in Houston. It makes me no difference whatsoever but I’m interested in your feelings. Is Bill DeWitt getting richer off of your frustration? What about the state of the Ballpark Village? The All-Star Game will be in town in just over 4 months – has anything been done? What is your reaction to the progress – or lack thereof?

What about ticket prices, as well as beer, souvenirs, dogs, whatever? How affordable do you find the fan experience? Is it different considering the state of the economy? In other words, has it become too expensive or simply a luxury you no longer choose to afford considering concerns about the economy as a whole? How does it compare to your experiences when you go to other stadiums?

What about Busch do you like the best? The least? How does it compare to old Busch? When someone comes in from out of town to watch the Cards play, what concession item do they absolutely have to try? What should they avoid? Where is the best place to sit and watch the game? (I know to avoid a day game or 6 pm game near 1st base – I got sunburned like the final days!) What else is there to say about the stadium? (not enough places to see the count, can’t see who’s up in the pen, whatever).

Bang for the Buck -- when you drop $40 per person (w/ parking, a drink, popcorn, whatever) to go to a game, do you feel you’re getting your money’s worth? Do you feel it’s worth it to pay that kind of coin to watch Joe Mather, Chris Perez, and Todd Wellemeyer instead of Rolen, Izzy, and Morris?

Title track – what are the team’s prospects for this season? How do you feel about their likelihood of winning? Is failing to win the division or make the playoffs compounded by the fact that the Cubs have a good team? Would it be easier to finish 2nd or 3rd to the Reds, Astros, or Brewers than the Cubs? Are the Cards on the path to a championship or will ownership’s (ahem!) frugality prevent that from happening?

Really anything you’ve got to say, anything maybe I’ve forgotten to mention, is worth including here. My impression is that the team is on the right path but won’t get there this year. I’m excited about the young guys and, to the extent that I’m frustrated at having guys like Todd Wellemeyer and Joel Pineiro play prominent roles, it’s b/c they’re relatively high priced vets w/ little upside and not b/c they’re not Kile or Morris (in his prime). I’d like to see more of Perez, Motte, Mather, and have come around on seeing what Skip can offer at 2nd (though I’m still skeptical. I just get nothing out of seeing Joe Thurston or Brendan Ryan. Skip at least offers hope.)

As for ownership, my personal viewpoint is that we’ve got to promote the young guys. We’re not going to succeed by relying on free agents so I’m not at all bitter by the fact that ownership didn’t dump a lot of coin on Brian Fuentes or give up everything they had for Jake Peavy or Matt Holliday (who would’ve required big $ next year and beyond). Of course, I don’t have to look at what should be the Ballpark Village either. That’s the stuff I need the most help with – the fan experience.

Thanks for the help this morning. Have a great Saturday and don’t forget to change your clocks tonight. I’ll be here an hour earlier tomorrow.

Comment 148 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Generally high marks

I have a higher opinion of ownership than many, I suspect. First, the organization is well run and professional. They hire the right people with the right experience to run their club from scouting to drafting, player development, public relations and field management. I also think they have spent their money and prospects wisely in trying to build a winning team, and to do so with a focus on sustained performance over many years. By being prudent and patient we often find value where others have not. And by not overextending the pocketbook, they retain flexibility to make moves when needed. I think they have a long term strategy in mind and are executing to that strategy pretty well.

I give the coaching high marks. The team plays hard every day and their fundamentals are strong. Not every player pans out, but clubhouse dissent is rare. Oquendo helps to get the most out of our infielders, and Duncan usually takes what he finds and makes it better. And Tony keeps everyone involved the entire season, so that even the bench guys are prepared to sub in, or take over for an injured player.

The players? Who doesn’t like our players? They are OUR team! Our ace pitchers are hardworking and humble, our superstar is intense and generous, and our role players are scrappy – and now with 30% more grit! We have pitchers playing OF, OF’ers playing 2B and 3B, and a former C may be a closer someday. They play to win as a team. No prima donnas in this group.

In short – Go Cards!

"I always thought he was very handsome. I liked his eyes" - My late Grandmother referring to Rogers Hornsby

by Hoosier Cards on Mar 7, 2009 10:46 AM EST reply actions  

One post in

and somebody already referred to our players as “scrappy”

by mojo7102 on Mar 7, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions  

i though just schu was scrappy

since he can’t be gritty

"No matter where you go, there you are" Buckeroo Bonzai Across the 8th Dimension

by sportsman on Mar 8, 2009 4:34 AM EST up reply actions  

Ball park villiage

Yuck. It’s such an eye sore. But it isn’t just the Cardinals’ ownerships fault it isn’t built. There are other businesses involved as well as the City of St. Louis itself. I love the new park

I feel I get my money’s worth when I go to a Cardinals game. I recommend the turkey legs when buying food..

And I’m also ok with the ownership playing the kids.

The fact of the matter is Cardinal fans are spoiled. They are so use to winning year after year that I think they get over critical when they do fall a game or two short of the playoffs.

by Evilfrog on Mar 7, 2009 10:47 AM EST reply actions  

oh yeah. KTRS vs KMOX

Both crap out right by my house due to a hill and some power lines. But KTRS shares the late games with 106.1 FM. And I pick that up pretty well here.

by Evilfrog on Mar 7, 2009 10:49 AM EST up reply actions  

High Marks as well

Let me preface this post by saying that I am probably not the responder chuckb is looking for but I wanted to add my 2 cents anyway.

I am an infrequent poster but a religious reader of this blog and an avid Cards fan. I live in Houston, and as you do, I find myself detached from much of the midwestern media and fan angst that seems to be rampant around the franchise. Having grown up just across the river in the 70’s, I can remember a time when the fan base and the Cardinals, for lack of a better term, were horrible. (Vern Wrapp anyone?). I lived through an era in Cardinal baseball when the players were marginal and the stadium was empty. You could pretty much walk up and buy a ticket to any home game in those years.

We had a similar situation in the late 80’s early 90’s. I had moved away by then, but from my distant view, the quality of players was marginal. Not sure about how tough the tickets were to come by at that point.

Then came LaRussa, Duncan, Jocketty, the sale of the Cardinals, SUCCESS and the “New Cardinal Fan”. A fan that doesn’t remember the tough times, the lean times, where ownership really didn’t care, the years of mediocrity without a franchise player. Spoiled is a good term for these people. I read some of the posts on other blogs and it blows my mind how attack minded they are against the ownership and Mozeilak (sp?)… The fact is Baseball is a business. You have to plan years ahead not for one. I would much rather be in the Cardinals situation, with a boatload of talent in the minors, a payroll that is not crippling, in the playoffs or in contention every year, and the potential to be competitive every year. I would rather root for that than be 1) the Pirates, who can never manage to compete, 2) the Marlins, who buy a couple championships then spend several years selling off their assets or 3) the Yankees/BoSox who break the bank.

I think the “non” roster moves, for the most part have been right on. Sure, I would have liked to have sign a big time free agent BUT that deal was just not out there without crippling our payroll for marginal return over the long haul. I guess my age and seeing the Cardinals through the years has me just a little more optimistic than the younger fan. I like the things that are going on and am excited about the season.

Ownership – B+
Coaching – A
Players – A (can’t go below an A with the greatest player I’ve ever seen on the field wearing the birds on the bat)
Fan Relations – Hard to rate from where I am
Affordability – is it any different in St. Louis than in Houston?
Stadium Experience – wish I knew, hopefully I can get to a game in the Lou this summer. However, Minute Maid stadium experience when the Cards are in town…. Excellent

Anyway, thanks for the opportunity to provide my occasional opinion. I love this blog. Great research. Reasonable debate. Good thought provoking questions on leadership and team direction but never mean spirited or an all out assault against the team or its management.

by Cards67 on Mar 7, 2009 11:43 AM EST reply actions   2 recs

I can't comment on too much

Never even been to St. Louis. But I will say this:

For the most part in my lifetime, the Cardinals have put a competitive team on the field year-in and year-out. This decade, we have been one of the top 2 or 3 most successful franchises. I also happen to be an Oakland Raiders fan. Comparing the experience of seeing a team that is almost always in the playoff hunt to a team that has been out of the playoff picture by week 6 for the past six years, I think alot of us take for granted how great it is to follow a team that is competitive. Even that disastrous year of 2007 saw us claw our way back to within a game of first place in September, and if it weren’t for an awful five-game series in Chicago in 2003 (as well as Brett Tomko and Tino Martinez…gross) we might have made the playoffs that year as well.

So as far as Title Track goes, I’m very pleased, A+. We don’t spend nearly as much as the Red Sox or Yankees, but we produce about as well as they do.

Also, I love our players. I don’t care if it’s Khalil Greene instead of Edgar Renteria. If he’s wearing the birds on the bat, he’s awesome in my mind. So that makes me a little biased in that category, but I’ll say A- because of Albert Pujols and Adam Wainwright.

Living in Georgia, I can’t really comment on the other categories, but I’m sure you’ll find plenty of St. Louisians to cover for me.

The artist formerly known as...
Mr Redbird @ Viva El Birdos
PowerOfDixieland @ Track Em Tigers, other SEC blogs

by jd is legend on Mar 7, 2009 12:03 PM EST reply actions  

Ballpark Village

Speaking of, last I saw, ballpark village was a big mudhole surrounded by nasty-looking fence. Does anyone know specifically what changes are being made or have already been made to gussy it up for the All-Star game?

by blehmann on Mar 7, 2009 12:39 PM EST reply actions  

sounds like

planting grass would be a good way to start.

by nybirdfan on Mar 7, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't go to the ballpark much

since I moved away from StL in ’03, but I still follow the team pretty religiously, as I have for longer than I care to admit.

While mildly disappointed in the level of the current payroll, I am mostly grateful to the current ownership as I still remember the days when the Brewery owned the team after Gussie’s demise. Now that was poor ownership. We are very fortunate to have a mostly top 10 payroll in a middle market, so I give more credit for the success of the franchise to the ownership than to TLR/Dunc.

We can all cite the few exceptions, but you basically have to have the payroll to compete. TLR has never been able to win without payroll at any of his stops and he won’t be able to overcome that in StL unless the front office is able to successfully generate enough home-grown talent to get it done.

Ownership: A-
LaRussa: C+
Duncan: B+

Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...

by giveml on Mar 7, 2009 12:53 PM EST reply actions  

TLR
TLR has never been able to win without payroll at any of his stops and he won’t be able to overcome that in StL unless the front office is able to successfully generate enough home-grown talent to get it done.

2004?
2005?
2006?

by STLRegalia on Mar 7, 2009 1:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

2004 – 11th on Opening Day (went up with Walker trade)
2005 – 11th on Opening Day
2006 – 11th on Opening Day

Does the front office do this on purpose? Come up with the 11th highest payroll and set the money that way? Sheesh.

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 7, 2009 1:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Whose numbers

are you using? I know the USA Today numbers aren’t necessarily gospel, but they show

2004 – 10th, 2nd in NL Central
2005 – 6th, 1st in NL Central
2006 – 11th, 3rd in NL Central

Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...

by giveml on Mar 7, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Guys relax

you’re both wrong.

vivaelbeñsheets

by vivaelpujols on Mar 7, 2009 3:11 PM EST up reply actions  

and the answer is?

Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...

by giveml on Mar 7, 2009 4:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes

The artist formerly known as...
Mr Redbird @ Viva El Birdos
PowerOfDixieland @ Track Em Tigers, other SEC blogs

by jd is legend on Mar 7, 2009 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

I'll comment on ballpark experience

I’m almost 20 years old, from SW MO. Growing up my father and I made it to about 3 games a year. The first time, however, that I went to New Busch I was with a group from school. It felt weird. Same Cardinals, same fans, same PA announcer, same “Meet Me in St. Louie, Louie. Meet me at the Fair!” playing over the speakers during bp. Yet, something wasn’t right. As that season wore on, I made it to a few more games—the stadium becoming more like home each time. Then came the postseason. Those memorable events of Yadi hooping and hollering as he circled the bases and knee buckling curveballs from the new rookie I will remember forever. Without that WS I believe that Busch Stadium would still have the feeling of playing in a strange park—one that is neither home nor away. Since then it has definitely been home.
My favorite place to sit is in the bleachers right behind the Cards bullpen. I always arrive early, waiting for the gates to open, to watch batting practice. (notice the quote in my sig) I love watching the players swing and interact with each other pre-game. The occasional autograph or foul ball happen as well. (Side Note: One of my favorite cardinals ever was Steve Kline. Not because of what he did during the game, but the fact that he always signed autographs before the game. He would always line up the rookie (and veteran) bullpen guys along the right field line and encourage them to sign. It meant a lot to me when I was a kid, and I miss seeing it happen now.)
The food that you absolutely must get is the kosher dog with grilled onions and kraut. A few years ago, as a graduation gift, my father took me on a trip—Seven Ballparks in Seven Days we called it. Kaufmann(KC), Wrigley, Jacobs Field(Clvnd), Great American(Cincy), Miller, US Cellular(ChiSox), and home for the Cardinals. The final game at Busch was the fourteen inning one in which Luddy hit a walkoff. So it was more like 7.5 games in 8 days. We got a hotdog at every stadium and we both concurred that the Kosher at Busch is the best, followed closely by the footlong sheboygan in KC.

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on Mar 7, 2009 1:30 PM EST reply actions  

The only hot

dog I’ll eat is the Kosher dog at Busch.

by spants on Mar 7, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

It has become included in my definition of a baseball game

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on Mar 7, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Today's gameday

Anyone has the link to the today’s match gameday?

by Brianzaredbird on Mar 7, 2009 1:44 PM EST reply actions  

Pinero cruising

saying to himself: “Self, you are a certified bad ass and Puerto Rico is missing out on this year’s NL Cy Young winner.”

by STLRegalia on Mar 7, 2009 1:49 PM EST reply actions  

Can it really be true?

I just saw LaRue’s picture on the gameday feed and he looks clean shaven. I guess is tired of being referred to as “pornstache”.

Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...

by giveml on Mar 7, 2009 2:02 PM EST reply actions  

Great Game by Pinero

4.0 IP 1H 3K 0BB, We should try rooting for him instead of just ragging on him

Stat Whore

by FlimtotheFlam on Mar 7, 2009 2:06 PM EST reply actions  

Yep

"Stats are for losers," Muschamp said after last week's victory. "I like winning games."

by SoonerfanTU on Mar 7, 2009 2:20 PM EST up reply actions  

I always try to root for him

the thing is, he can never keep this kind of stuff up

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

and....BEN SHEETS!!! **

**not that BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment, just BEN SHEETS!!!
(BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment)

by mattyfrommo on Mar 7, 2009 3:01 PM EST up reply actions  

I rooted for the team to resign him after he came over to St. Louis

but then he was just terrible last year.

It’s not like we WANT him to suck. He does that plenty well on his own without our encouragement.

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 7, 2009 3:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

in 07 he really wasn’t much better than he was last year, he just got lucky. Management should have seen that he was a crappy pitcher, however a 2 year deal wasn’t THAT bad.

vivaelbeñsheets

by vivaelpujols on Mar 7, 2009 3:12 PM EST up reply actions  

The years aren't the problem

the money apparently is. Just imagine what we could have done with that $7 M!

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 7, 2009 3:14 PM EST up reply actions  

we already used it

for Puerto Rico’s best Starting Pitcher…duh…

by STLRegalia on Mar 7, 2009 3:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Turned it into dry powder?

The thought that I have is that the season is over. And that everybody in the game; a fan, a coach, a player, a manager, front office, scouts...surrender. They say, "that's enough," especially after a game like this. But then Christmas comes, New Years, contracts are signed, trades are made, free agents are signed; and then baseball, like the rose beneath the April snow will force it's way to the front again. And we'll have the fever once more.
-Jack

by Jack618 on Mar 7, 2009 5:55 PM EST up reply actions  

grass seeds for lake dewitt ballpark village

BEN MOTHERHUSHYOURMOUTH SHEETS

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Mar 7, 2009 10:22 PM EST up reply actions  

He's my pick

for best pleasant surprise this season. I’m thinking 14 wins.

There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Mar 7, 2009 5:43 PM EST up reply actions  

now that sounds like AL & Dan

after they have had a few

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

and....BEN SHEETS!!! **

**not that BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment, just BEN SHEETS!!!
(BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment)

by mattyfrommo on Mar 9, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

everyone should remember that the games don't count

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on Mar 7, 2009 2:08 PM EST reply actions  

Off-topic: For MLB.TV subscribers...

The USA/Canada game is available on the new media player (beta). It’s not HD yet as the plug in isn’t available to download yet, but the quality is still very good. The best thing is that the MLB.TV feed was actually slightly ahead of the ESPN feed on my TV, which is a welcome change from the 15 or 20 second delay. Go check it out…

by LukeMP1186 on Mar 7, 2009 2:27 PM EST reply actions  

On a Free Note

You can watch most of the WBC games at ESPN360.com for free. I am actually watchomg the Missouri vs Texas AM game on my computer

Stat Whore

by FlimtotheFlam on Mar 7, 2009 2:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Haha...

Not saying you should, I’m saying I would if it were me.

by LukeMP1186 on Mar 7, 2009 2:35 PM EST up reply actions  

http://xkcd.com/238/

The artist formerly known as...
Mr Redbird @ Viva El Birdos
PowerOfDixieland @ Track Em Tigers, other SEC blogs

by jd is legend on Mar 7, 2009 2:49 PM EST up reply actions  

its rough

moved in with inlaws temp…no cable 3 channels ahhhh

I can't believe i gave up a homerun to that punch and judy hitter-major league 2

by punchinjudy on Mar 7, 2009 2:35 PM EST up reply actions  

DVR

The only thing I might not give up instead of DVR is beer…and that would be a close call. The only things I watch live are sporting events, but it helps out there too. like if I have to leave for a few I can pause the TV and then eventually catch up by skipping commercials when I get back…I really don’t know what I would do without DVR

by STLRegalia on Mar 7, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Was the best thing I ever did

I don’t miss cable what so ever. I just don’t watch that much tv and the stuff I normally watch is on the antenna anyway. So much free content online now in days. I have a very nice Home Theater Computer System set up so it is no big deal. The only thing sucks is the lack of sports but there is work a rounds that. It does help though that I own over 1000 movies including the entire IMDB Top 250.

Stat Whore

by FlimtotheFlam on Mar 7, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions  

until watchman undoubtably makes it's way on the 250 w/in a week

I haven’t seen it and thus don’t have an opinion on it, but those kind of movies always instantly jump to top 250.

by TheBirds on Mar 7, 2009 2:46 PM EST up reply actions  

The Dark Knight was #1 on that list like a day after it released last summer

The artist formerly known as...
Mr Redbird @ Viva El Birdos
PowerOfDixieland @ Track Em Tigers, other SEC blogs

by jd is legend on Mar 7, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Dark Knight was good

But it’s no Departed. even though they are different types of movies

by STLRegalia on Mar 7, 2009 2:53 PM EST up reply actions  

If you like The Departed than I reccomend you watch

The movies it was based upon the “Internal Affairs” trilogy

Stat Whore

by FlimtotheFlam on Mar 7, 2009 3:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Heh, wow, I didn't notice that but now that I think about it they are pretty similar.

I like them both about the same, although if I had gotten to see heat in theaters maybe I’d like that more.

by TheBirds on Mar 7, 2009 3:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Ok...I just read that.

Is it just me or is that just completely generic? I feel like you could have done that with about half the action movies out there.

I hate to be this way, but that was pretty hackish IMO; almost like an intro to journalism student trying to think he’s deep.

The thought that I have is that the season is over. And that everybody in the game; a fan, a coach, a player, a manager, front office, scouts...surrender. They say, "that's enough," especially after a game like this. But then Christmas comes, New Years, contracts are signed, trades are made, free agents are signed; and then baseball, like the rose beneath the April snow will force it's way to the front again. And we'll have the fever once more.
-Jack

by Jack618 on Mar 7, 2009 7:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Wow.

I just read that, and my post comes across way worse than I meant it to. Sorry.

The thought that I have is that the season is over. And that everybody in the game; a fan, a coach, a player, a manager, front office, scouts...surrender. They say, "that's enough," especially after a game like this. But then Christmas comes, New Years, contracts are signed, trades are made, free agents are signed; and then baseball, like the rose beneath the April snow will force it's way to the front again. And we'll have the fever once more.
-Jack

by Jack618 on Mar 7, 2009 7:10 PM EST up reply actions  

lol, i concur with your original sentiment though

and i think you need a longer signature block.

"i have a feeling the answers are bigger than the questions" -Dr Heyward Floyd

by SleepyCA on Mar 7, 2009 8:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Love the Departed

Effing awesome movie

The artist formerly known as...
Mr Redbird @ Viva El Birdos
PowerOfDixieland @ Track Em Tigers, other SEC blogs

by jd is legend on Mar 7, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Awesome movie, don't get me wrong, but

Ending…meh. Could have been a lot better, IMO.

The thought that I have is that the season is over. And that everybody in the game; a fan, a coach, a player, a manager, front office, scouts...surrender. They say, "that's enough," especially after a game like this. But then Christmas comes, New Years, contracts are signed, trades are made, free agents are signed; and then baseball, like the rose beneath the April snow will force it's way to the front again. And we'll have the fever once more.
-Jack

by Jack618 on Mar 7, 2009 5:59 PM EST up reply actions  

At the showing I went to

a very athletic looking black man stood up while all the craziness was going on and just kept saying “Beautiful man. Just Beautiful. Beautiful man.”

I wasn’t going to be the one to tell him to sit down.

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 7, 2009 6:01 PM EST up reply actions  

haha!

See, I think that would have made it better for me.

The thought that I have is that the season is over. And that everybody in the game; a fan, a coach, a player, a manager, front office, scouts...surrender. They say, "that's enough," especially after a game like this. But then Christmas comes, New Years, contracts are signed, trades are made, free agents are signed; and then baseball, like the rose beneath the April snow will force it's way to the front again. And we'll have the fever once more.
-Jack

by Jack618 on Mar 7, 2009 7:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Joey Votto as a man

as a person that watched a ton of Reds games last year, he’s going to be dangerous for years to come.

If it weren’t for Dusty, I’d pick the Reds to win the division.

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 7, 2009 2:53 PM EST reply actions  

The reds always look like they are going to be good

until about a month or two into the season.

Team Canada has a solid lineup, I dunno if any of the best hitters turned down the invite, but then again, I don’t really keep track of all the Canadians in the MLB.

by TheBirds on Mar 7, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Yes but usually their pitching

is terrible. It’s usually based on all the bats they have in the lineup. This year, if Harang is healthy they have a great rotation.

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 7, 2009 2:56 PM EST up reply actions  

geez

who is starting short stop?

tulo?

Dont take me seriously :-D
www.GriffinandtheGargoyles.com www.myspace.com/GriffinandtheGargoyles

NO Garland, NO Wolf, NO Looper!

by jealousblues on Mar 7, 2009 3:27 PM EST up reply actions  

just checked that

blargh

i just like Rollins better

Dont take me seriously :-D
www.GriffinandtheGargoyles.com www.myspace.com/GriffinandtheGargoyles

NO Garland, NO Wolf, NO Looper!

by jealousblues on Mar 7, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions  

very sanguine this year

not that I predict we will be in the playoffs, but this is one of the easiest cardinal team’s for ME to root for. I actually like the no super-star team (well, we have Pu, but he is a special case kind of super-star).
I sorta wish Miles and Looper were with us, but I am ecstatic that I went four for four on my negatives (Itz, Izzy, Lopez, Kennedy). I love the emerging talent; easy team to root for.
And if by chance Carp is healthy all year…oh my!

by the Tewk on Mar 7, 2009 3:38 PM EST reply actions  

Cardinal Experience

Ok, so I’m a native St. Louisan and live in the city (am I the only one on here?) and probably get to in the neighborhood of 10-15 games a year. Had to pass on my Pujols pack this year due to financial constraints, so probably a few less now. I’ll get my major beef out of the way first, and it’s one I’ve heard a lot- the new Busch just isn’t what it could have been. They either went cheap, rushed, or just dropped the ball on a lot of the simple things, like the sight lines. My seats the first year were in the second level from the top, right field line, and you can’t see the corner. Last year, we were down the third base line near the left field corner- ok seats, but they’re angled towards right field. You have to sit sideways if you want to watch the game. There are a lot of natural bottlenecks and dead ends as you try to make your way around the stadium, and I wish it were more open to the field- I feel like I’m walking through a parking garage or a mall half the time. And I’ll call this a minor complaint because it probably just isn’t very realistic, but I really wish they could have located the stadium somewhere closer to the river with a more prominent view of the arch, possibly closer to the Dome and casino. They could have collaborated with the Rams and Pinacle in developing the area and they might not have the whole ballpark village fiasco on their hands. That said, I like the all inclusive picnic areas, and the open area on top of the stadium with concessions. The food is good and the prices are fair-ish (I’d rather not pay $8 for a beer, but that seems pretty standard these days). The fresh squeezed lemonade on a hot day is almost enough to get me to pass on the $8 beer (almost). And this also is not really a Cardinal-specific complaint, but I could do without the crapitization of the games- I don’t need a had dance/trivia contest/pep rally or to be pelted with t-shirts between every single inning. Play some music, and if your kid can’t sit still, teach him (or her) how to keep score.

No complaints with LaDunc, any minor issues with Larussa’s dig-me attitude are offset by the magic they have worked with the pitching staff and winning a World Series speaks for itself (right Cubs fans, oh…sorry, guess you wouldn’t know). The radio switch made no difference to me, if I’m not at the game I’m watching on TV. As far as the organization, I’d say ownership hasn’t shown me anything yet. They should have a respectable payroll with the fan support they have, and I think they’ve made a lot of empty promises and done just enough to get by, and milked a lot of the goodwill created by a team that overacheived and won a Series. I’m not yet screaming that we should storm the castle and run King Dewitt and Prince Mo out of town, but I’ve got my pitchfork and torch ready, just in case they think about letting Albert leave. I’m all for the young guys getting their shots, but I think that can happen organically and shouldn’t mean that they can’t make reasonable deals and free agent signings. If they could have gotten a Matt Holliday without giving up Rasmus, and it meant another year or half-year in AAA for Rasmus, I’d have been fine with that. But I do understand that as the game stands today, the Cardinals business model has to be closer to the A’s than the Yankees. I’m excited about the season and think that if everything breaks right, they can compete, but I’ve gotta say it feels like they’re playing for a wild card and the season hasn’t started. I wish baseball could see past the dough they’re raking in and improve the game long-term by instating some sort of salary cap (and also a minimum amount you must spend- Hello, Kansas City?). Again, not really a commentary on the Cardinals, but on the game in general. Mostly I just can’t wait for the season, so I can stop bitching about the front office, sit in the sun with a frosty cold franklin, and start bitching about Joel Pinero.

What does a mama bear on the pill have in common with the World Series? No cubs. ~Harry Caray

by Tupelo on Mar 7, 2009 3:46 PM EST reply actions  

he is still faking it

it will come down to Dunn needing a hit in the last AB for Team USA to win the whole damn thing. Dunn will then just walk away from the plate with the biggest smile ever and yell “FOOLED YA!”

Bank on it.

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

and....BEN SHEETS!!! **

**not that BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment, just BEN SHEETS!!!
(BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment)

by mattyfrommo on Mar 8, 2009 12:04 AM EST up reply actions  

I wonder how much the Reds

ever demanded of Dunn that he try to improve his defense or ‘show some leadership.’ Seems to me there was some ‘enabling’ going on; they put up with his excessive strikeouts and seeming diffidence because they wanted those 40 dingers a year.
Altho I see a lot of Reds’ games on TV, it is hard for me to be objective, because I usually root against them. Thus from MY point of view I was always happy to see Dunn in the line-up.
Were he a Cardinal these last few years, I’m sure I would be on his case.

by the Tewk on Mar 7, 2009 4:07 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree

We complain about Duncan but he is a Gold Glover compared to Dunn. If Duncan is our biggest defensive liability than we are doing pretty good because by most metrics he is just a few runs below average.

Stat Whore

by FlimtotheFlam on Mar 7, 2009 4:13 PM EST up reply actions  

40 hrs

I’ll take my beer-league left fielder on the Cardinals if he hits 40 hrs/ year & a shit-ton of BB’s. I would also put up with Rosie O’Donnell if she hit 40 hrs/year.

by STLRegalia on Mar 7, 2009 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

True

most of Duncan’s defensive deficiencies are what I would call “style points”.

Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...

by giveml on Mar 7, 2009 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Rick Sutcliffe...

is making my ears bleed. God he’s horrible…

by LukeMP1186 on Mar 7, 2009 5:01 PM EST reply actions  

I thought Adam Dunn hated baseball and his country?

I thought there was video of him throwing apple pie on the field while stuffing his face with crepes.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Mar 7, 2009 5:08 PM EST reply actions  

hummel's first sentence

Commish’s Hot Stove
I realize it’s just a blog zone, but that first sentence is terrible..

by Glowsticks on Mar 7, 2009 5:44 PM EST reply actions  

That reminds me...

of the Seinfeld episode where Elaine dates the writer, and they break up over the usage of explanation points (Elaine was all for them, the writer not so much). Hummel must have sympathized for Elaine, but secretly wished it was commas that she was so fond of.

by LukeMP1186 on Mar 7, 2009 6:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Hummel obviously needs ST too

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

and....BEN SHEETS!!! **

**not that BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment, just BEN SHEETS!!!
(BEN SHEETS might be involved in this comment)

by mattyfrommo on Mar 8, 2009 12:05 AM EST up reply actions  

KTRS vs KMOX

I left St Louis in 1963, but have always followed the Cards. I have lived in 8 states, and the great thing about KMOX was that at night , if I was on the road, I could listen to a scratchy Cardinal ballgame. I miss that!! Thank goodness we now have VEB and the internet in general.

by Remember Kenny B on Mar 7, 2009 5:50 PM EST reply actions  

many many nights, sitting in my car

I live close to Louisville (approx 270 mi from StL) and my experience is similar to yours. In fact many nights I would go sit in my car because the radio in the vehicle was better for reception on the AM band than any radio in the house.
And ‘scratchy’ is the perfect word. As a boy tho I couldn’t wait for the sun to go down… and the games in Frisco and LA were especially good because I got to hear the whole thing, pre-game and all. Jack Buck was very special.
p.s. 1 : I got Ken Boyer’s autograph and had a small chat with him the year he became the Cards’ manager — still a great memory for me.
p.s. 2 : I wonder if you also got hooked on John McCormick (“the man who walks and talks at midnight”), the same as I did?

by the Tewk on Mar 7, 2009 8:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Where I stand with the Cards

Being a life-long fan puts things into perspective. Nothing can be worse than where we were back in the early 90’s.

Ownership 7/10 – They’ve brought us a championship and roughly a decade of above average payroll, some big-name trades/players, good coaching, new stadium and an All-Star game. Can’t find too much fault in the above.

Coaching 8/10 – Let’s be honest here. La Russa drives us ALL crazy at times. La Russa hasn’t been perfect in the past (steroids). La Russa is a baseball guy and winner. Red, Gibson, the secret weapon, McKay, Duncan and others have played a big role in Cardinal baseball this last decade. Right or wrong, they’ve done the job to keep this team competitive year-in, year-out.

Players 7/10 – We’ve got a potent offense, and potentially a good pitching staff and bullpen. A lot of what-ifs the last few years, but we’ve been blessed with seeing the MV3 years and some great pitching over the last decade. Watching some serious player development has been enjoyable.

Fan Relations 5/10 – They do some good things, but this is the area that is lacking in my book. They could emulate the Blues front office more in this area to improve. Selling off pieces of history (like bathroom stalls) is a bit over-the-top.

Affordability 6/10 – Saint Louis is pretty affordable across the board, but the owners push the envelope here while cutting payroll and building a new stadium elsewhere.

Stadium Experience 8/10 – The “newer” Busch Stadium is beautiful and makes for a good experience. All the fans mostly wear red, and are in the game for the most part. The stadium offers diversions from the game for those interested.

Bang for the Buck 8/10 – Player development will answer this question in the coming years, but the Cardinal fans have been getting some of the best “bang for your buck” in the MLB for years.

Title Track 7/10 – Cardinals are above average in this category as well. The Cardinals have had a chance to make the playoffs almost every year for the past decade. As a MLB fan, that is about the most you can ask for from your team. The new emphasis on player development should help keep the Cardinals contenders for the near future (one would hope that the team that created the minors could put together a solid player-development system).

by StoJo on Mar 7, 2009 6:28 PM EST reply actions  

As a followup to yesterday's post...

Some hot dogs apparently do come in packs of 10. Oscar Meyer. Every other brand is eight though, and I can’t stand Oscar Meyer (I get Ballpark or Hunter), so I never noticed.

Felipe Lopez - next year's Joel Pineiro (on another team, thank you Mo!)

by DiscoJer on Mar 7, 2009 6:49 PM EST reply actions  

gotta try nathans

better than either

"No matter where you go, there you are" Buckeroo Bonzai Across the 8th Dimension

by sportsman on Mar 8, 2009 4:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Thankful to be a fan

    * Ownership
Economics: average. Cost conscious but willing to take occasional chances.
Others: DeWitt. I think he is pretty good. I like the fact that Bill is not too controversial. I prefer that the focus remain on the team instead of the ownership, e.g. Steinbrenner.

    * Coaching
Great group.

    * Players
In general, we stay away from head cases. I cringe when others on VEB start clamoring for players like Milton Bradley and Guillen. IMHO, the Rolen situation only started later after frustrating rehab with the shoulder. (Oh, how I wish Hee Sop Choi never played 1st base).

    * Fan Relations
I have no problems with the lack of transparency sometimes. I think the GM has to be a bit sneaky in order to get a good deal. Information is critical in negotiations. That’s why when AK public asks for a trade, it lowers his chances. Maybe that’s not such a good example since AK is not good.

    * Affordability
I would say average. It’s unavoidable that food is expensive when there are captive customers. Food and walking around the stadium in between innings is just part of baseball. That’s what makes it such a great experience for me that’s different from other sports.

    * Stadium Experience
I thought the Old Bush (Bush II) was good. Can’t complain. If you want an example of a really crappy stadium, see the old Veterans Stadium in Philly. Sucktidude par none. I grew up watching the Dodgers in Chaves Ravene, and I really like that stadium even though it feels very dated. I like Bush equally as well.

    * Bang for the Buck
I would say pretty average.

    * Title Track
Hope springs eternal in the Spring. MO signed Reyes after the other cast offs didn’t pan out. I can’t complain. At least they evaluated and reacted. I was pissed out about the lack of LOOGY acquisition last year. Forgive and forget.

My experiences of stadiums involve mainly four teams: Cards, Dodgers, Angels, and Phillies. I would rank Cards and Dodgers at the top. Disney wrecked Big A for me by Imagineering the stadium. And I hated the old Phillies stadium.

 I would have to say that the O’Mailleys and the Autrys were classier. I don’t mean this to denegrate DeWitt, but it’s just he is different, perhaps, more business oriented. But it is a different era.

born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red

by totalloser on Mar 7, 2009 7:36 PM EST reply actions  

Cardinal Experience

Stadium = A+++…nothing…NOTHING beats being at Busch III in August/September.
With that said the quality of the team does matter…I went twice when the cards were “out of it” last year and I paid almost zero attention to the game and all my attention on the girl I was with (usually vice-versa)…still a great baseball environment but watching cardinal games that don’t matter is rough.

Best place to sit are +$100 places (scoreboard patio or ground level behind the bases, I prefer behind home)

DeWitt = suck it.
Mo = Walt Lite (yeah I’m bringing that back)
09 = another throw away season. Mo blew the “play for 09” horn way too much…09 is already here and it’s fucking ugly.

Ballpark village = indifferent. Ugly crater? Yeah…But the stadium is just awesome, downtown st louis is ugly everywhere outside of the stadium so it’s business as usual.

Bang for your buck = yuck. Spending about a 1/3 of my income in 2000 -2006 to only get rewarded with AAAA players and broken vets in 07-09 so dewitt gets a fat pocket leaves a sour taste in my mouth and sitting in “only going when it’s free” territory.

Affordability = no. For somebody that wants to go as much as possible, just not gonna happen unless you like nosebleeds, don’t eat/drink, and take the metrolink.

overall – there’s nothing in this world that is better than a game in september at home when the cards are on top…nothing. It’s still a really good experience ONCE a season if the cards have no prayer….

"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"

by rocKStark5 on Mar 7, 2009 9:33 PM EST reply actions  

thoughts, ruminations

    * Ownership – I think the ownership is fine, level headed folk. they seem to really know how to balance acquiring talent with great upside from sometimes the most least likely of places with signing the right veterans at a good price (hopefully making it easier to re-sign the mang)
    * Coaching – Larussa got a bit too eccentric last year, hopefully back to norm this year
    * Players – 2009 will probably be my favorite Cardinal team ever. the players we have now are really awesome, fun to watch personalities with a lot of ability and effort
    * Fan Relations – as with any major league team, fan relations could improve. maybe if they somehow reached out into other markets
    * Affordability – since I don’t live in St. Louis, I’m not sure how to answer this. seems like their merch costs as much as anyone elses, so maybe if the jerseys were cheaper I’d be more happy. tickets seemed reasonable last time I was there. beer and food prices could be lowered!
    * Stadium Experience – I loved Bush II, haven’t been to the new ballpark yet. would like to visit the STL this summer and go to a game
    * Bang for the Buck – one of the best teams in MLB in this dept.
    * Title Track – I really expect the team to contend again this year. will be better than last season after two relative off seasons for the cards. Excited to watch this team develop and make a run at the playoffs again.

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Mar 7, 2009 9:49 PM EST reply actions  

The New Busch is Pretty Pricey

I noticed this trend before they left the old Busch. When I was growing up, Busch Stadium was one of the very few places in St. Louis where white people and black people seemed equally represented and commingled in the common love of the team and the game.
I live in Los Angeles now, but I try to fly home and take my Dad to a game every summer. I started this tradition the last year of the old Busch so we could get one last game in there together. What surprised me was how much more expensive Busch Stadium is than Dodger Stadium. Seeing as the cost of living is so high out here, it really seems like the LA ownership understands that baseball is a game for the people. The second thing I noticed on that trip to the old Busch was that there were nothing but white faces all around us. And we weren’t even in that great of seats. We were in loge at best. This trend seems to have continued in the new Busch, although my perspective is limited as I make it to one game a year at most in St. Louis.
But it looks good on tv.

My general feeling about ownership, having NO understanding of what it’s like from their perspective, is that after 2006, they decided that should hold us over for a number of years, knowing that Cardinal fans are gonna keep showing up. I really felt this way in 2007, but last year was pretty fun to watch. I really don’t know if you can give anyone in ownership credit for that, though. I guess maybe Albert is the ultimate barometer for how much slack we should give ownership. When he starts grumbling, you know something’s up. If we ever lose Albert……oh, I don’t wanna think about it.

by hugman on Mar 7, 2009 9:54 PM EST reply actions  

WHAT?

Dodger stadium is MUCH more expensive than busch, unless you sit in the club seats in stl or the top row of reserve seats in LA. It’s really not even close, the order of 2-3x more expensive in LA:

IE, dugout Club in LA: 500-650
“cardinals club” in STL: $250

Field box MVP in LA (crampy seats that typical humans don’t fit in, and the top 15 or so rows have an overhang from the terrace, so if the ball is hit in the air you lose it): $120
Infield box in STL: $89

loge box MVP in LA (same size seats as below, bad sight lines, some sight lines blocked by huge stone pillars): 70-75
infield terrace box in STL (equivalent location, better sight lines, closer to the action):30-32

etc. The only thing that is cheaper in LA are the bleacher seats and the uber-nosebleeds that go on and on forever (LA has two layers of nosebleeds, and the uppers are BRUTALLY bad).

Add a minimum of $20 for parking and because it’s in the middle of nowhere in an awful neighborhood you have no other parking options than what the club sells you, unless you want to take the awful LA public transit. And after youo park you have to walk half a mile. Getting into the park in LA is an awful experience; it literally takes an hour (from the time you exit the freeway) to get parked and walk to the field. People who live in STL have no idea how good they’ve got it when it comes to “getting to the park”.

Beer and dogs etc are about the same, better beer available in LA, and you can get blue margaritas, but IMHO the overall experience in STL is much, much better than LA.

"i have a feeling the answers are bigger than the questions" -Dr Heyward Floyd

by SleepyCA on Mar 8, 2009 5:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Don't forget that most of the Dodger fans

would leave around the top of the 8th inning to beat the traffic….. and some leave earlier than that.

by OKCARDSFAN_411 on Mar 8, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

my .02

ownership: the owners are, well i don’t know what they are. are they cheap? or are they smart? they seam to waste a ton of money, IE Marky Mark, Pinata, Carp(that contract is awful), Hollywoods extension. then they go cheap on a position like 2nd base where now the fans hopes fall on Skippy, a converted center fielder. it’s sometimes madness. i guess i’m saying the owners are madding.

coaching: what i can i say about Tony & Dave that hasn’t already been said? they too are madding.

players: love em. even Mini Me & Pinata. well not all of them. i’ll never love Betty.

fan relation: madding. they need to stop the spin. if i wanted to hear spin, i’d follow politics. i want the truth. don’t sugar coat it, don’t beat around the bush, just tell me the freaking truth.

affordability: never been to Busch III, but i can’t be the only one who thinks $9 bucks is way over priced for a Bud Light

stadium experience: can’t comment, never been. but my family says it’s nice, a lot nicer than Busch II. but many i know also say it’s like an over sized minor league park. and not in a good way.

bang for the buck: if your talking about wins, they are one of the best in all of sports.

title track: i think they are going to shock the world this season. i really do. i see 110 wins & another WS ring in their future.

BEN MOTHERHUSHYOURMOUTH SHEETS

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Mar 7, 2009 10:40 PM EST reply actions  

Cardinal Experience

Ownership: B+. Hasn’t been great lately because the Cards haven’t been dealing with issues as well as they should be.

Coaching: B+. If the Cards can be more consistent this season, I will be much happier.

Players: A. It’s great seeing good-mannered players in STL. We don’t need guys that can be clubhouse cancers. Thank God Manny and Bonds aren’t here.

Fan Relations: C+. Hasn’t been very good recently. The Kennedy saga and the fact that we haven’t gotten much in recent offseasons is starting to tick me off.

Affordability: C. I haven’t gone to many Cards games in STL, and I don’t live in the area, but tix aren’t as cheap as I was hoping. Tickets also sell fast, so it’s hard being a Michigander and trying to get July 4th tickets some years.

Stadium Exp: A. I’ve only been to Busch once (summer 06), but I liked it a lot. The party rooms are great, and even the standing room view isn’t bad.

Bang for the Buck: B. Not as good as it could be, considering recent Cardinals teams have not had the talent fans have hoped for, but it’s still been pretty good.

Title Track: B. At times, like this offseason, it’s been hard to tell what’s been going on in the front office. Granted that the Cards have had opportunities to go or win the World Series (and getting the title in 06), it would be nice for the front office to address all the issues that the Cards have, not just some.

It’s really strange not seeing a lot of talent on the Cards these days, especially since we have one of the highest payrolls in baseball. I still remember the teams of 04 and 05, and how stacked we were. It’s too bad we’re not seeing Rolen or Edmonds hit 30+ home runs, or Eckstein making a great play. I miss a lot of the guys from the old teams, but hey, if we can be successful, I’d be happy.

Welcome to Baseball Heaven.

by zoomzoomj88 on Mar 7, 2009 11:17 PM EST reply actions  

cardinal experience

ownership: a. i think the fact that they are trying the luhnow way will pay off in the end, going younger is going to be better in the end, and i think they will be more careful about contracts to older guys

coaching: a-. larussa has some quirks, but he gets more out of less than most managers; duncan is a genius at times, but he has his rough moments as well; oquendo can take a below average fielder, and make him at least average if not better; plus you have gibby, red, hal, aldrete, and mckay; sadly we will no longer have george kissell

players: a+. when you have the best player in the game, it makes it easier

Pujols is the greatest Cardinal in my lifetime.

by bigcardsfan5 on Mar 8, 2009 1:02 AM EST reply actions  

just a few opinions

from bdw to mo to tlr, communication seems lacking with fans, media, players, and even each other. i know you can’t put your five year development plan on the internet, but go back and look at mo’s answers on his chats. none are informative in a baseball sense and he also picks argumentative questions for reasons that puzzle me. all in all, i say
C at best. communication is a D and a few good trades get a B and some missed trades and signings also get a C-/D. mo needs some schooling in this area. bdw says nothing, so he can’t even get a C for class participation.

lastly, i want to say that the cards seem to be run as a military operation with lots of, secrets, spin, and confidential reports. they just need to realize we are not living in the 50’s anymore. this is the information age and most who follow the club and exchange ideas with others as at veb, expect legitimate information to come from the club. for me, saying one thing and doing another doesn’t cut it in any line of business where you are totally dependent on consumers spending their discretionary money on your product instead of movies, plays, and, depending on your seat, a new car! basically, they seem to have lost sight of the fact that many of their fans have played the american game, some extensively and are not naive about the game of the business of the game. just don’t treat us like we were unaware of what happens on the field and in the game re rules, stats, and the daily feeds on mlb tv and extra innings.

"No matter where you go, there you are" Buckeroo Bonzai Across the 8th Dimension

by sportsman on Mar 8, 2009 5:18 AM EST reply actions  

thoughts

    * Ownership
i think the Dewitt’s have been great for the team and the city. I love the new stadium, and have always been surprised that STL can field a payroll equal to or greater than the payroll that much larger cities like HOU, KC, CIN, ATL, etc. I’ve been a bit frustrated the last few years, but a lot of that is due to the awful luck we’ve had with injuries and long term contracts. And Ballpark village, which was a great concept executed 2 years too late.

    * Coaching
TLR is overrated, but only because most MLB managers are terrible. He’s much better than most. I’d have broken his nose a couple of times in 2006 if I was the GM, but he still won the WS (somehow). I love Jose and Duncan the Elder, though I don’t know much about how Jose would be as a manager. I think Pettini is a very underrated coach as well.

    * Players
Eh, gotta love ‘em, right? Or at least their laundry. If they ever did something like the “Milwaukee shirt untucking” nonsense last year, I’d change my mind, but I just don’t see it happening here. Albert is a Hero, Luddy is who I thought he was, Wellemeyer continues to surprise me, AW has felt like a guy one pitch away from TJ since 2006, but as long as he’s throwing that curve, I’m going to drool, joe mather has a 40 HR season in him, and I’ll kick your ass if you talk smack about Yadi, Lil’dunc, or Rick ******* Ankiel. And Rasmus might be better than any of the other outfielders, if he gets his head screwed on straight.

    * Fan Relations
The front office PR is absolutely incompetent, and has been for years. I don’t think it’s due to malice; I think they just don’t realize that they are f’ing it up. OTOH, I think we get a lot more information than a lot of other teams. I think the communication from our front office is much better than most teams. We also have a couple of complete idiots writing for our newspaper, and their useless opinions influence a lot of people. This has a viral effect.

    * Affordability
I’ve been to games in 5 MLB parks since 2006. Compared to LA, SF, and SD, it’s amazing how cheap it is to go to baseball games in STL. AZ is about the same. You can get awesome seats second-hand the week before a game in STl for what you’d pay the team for seats in those other cities. Beer is too expensive, since they don’t sell anything worth drinking, but when you consider parking, tickets, etc, STL is great.

    * Stadium Experience
I’m disappointed that they don’t open the park earlier to see BP and warmups. You can catch the tail end, but it would be nice to get in early and see the whole thing, for both teams. The stadium itself is very nice, parking is convenient and close and cheap, the seats are reasonably sized, with nice cup holders, sight lines, etc. The ushers can be jerks. They really need to increase the beer selection.

    * Bang for the Buck
Pretty darned good, for a team that won the world series two years ago. Maybe too good.

    * Title Track
78-95 wins, with a mean around 90. I think we’ll really surprise (again) and if carp is healthy, there will be a battle for the central in September, and we’ll win the wild card easily.

"i have a feeling the answers are bigger than the questions" -Dr Heyward Floyd

by SleepyCA on Mar 8, 2009 5:43 AM EST reply actions  

Experience

I agree with a great deal of what Sleepy said, except that my experience with the ushers has been great. I was looking for toasted ravioli, which is only sold in about two of the thousands of concession stands. Two different ushers went out of their way to make sure that I found the right stand and then asked me about it later in the game. How did they remember that I was the lady looking for toasted ravioli (?), but they did. The ushers will take your picture with your friends after the game when you know that they wish you would just leave already. Sometimes they shoo you out when you try to hang around too long, but that is just part of their job.

Any time I have needed to call or e-mail about any matter (tickets, publications, etc.), the person on the receiving end of my communication has always been very helpful and very friendly. And returned my call or responded to my e-mail the same day.

A little about parking issues: I love the fact that you can park across the street if you choose. Or park a little further away where it is cheaper and walk a few blocks. It is also easy to get into the city and get out when you leave. The only other major league stadium that I have experience with is Comerica in Detroit. It is a nightmare to get in and out of the city of Detroit!

The fact that you have the option of bringing in food and drink (except alcohol) from outside helps to make a day at the ballpark more affordable if you choose to go that route.

I loved Busch II, but I love Busch III as well. I’ve always had a good view wherever I sat, no bad sight lines. Except in the Casino Queen Party Porch where you can’t see the scoreboard and I always keep a scorecard, so that was annoying. But it rained that day and you stay nice and dry under the roof of the Party Porch, so it turned out to be a plus after all.

I like the direction the club is going. Trying to draft well and going with younger (ie, cheaper) players is the way to build a winning club if you don’t have the Yankees’ pocketbook, which we don’t. So it didn’t bother me that we didn’t get lots of high-priced free agents this offseason. And I feel that we will be competitive this year, especially if Carp remains healthy.

By the way, I think that toasted ravioli is the food you have to get at the ballpark because it is so uniquely St. Louis.

by cardsgirl95 on Mar 8, 2009 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Beer selection

Check out the bar at the Casino Queen* Party Porch. Much better selection than the concession stands.

*I’m not a huge fan of how everything is sponsored at the new stadium, and really hate that giant Hardee’s sign. But I guess that’s how you make money.

hecanthithecanthithecanthithecanthit

by Alxfritz on Mar 8, 2009 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

You know what I hate more than that sign?

The large quantities of smoke that pour out from behind it and choke out entire sections.

by spants on Mar 8, 2009 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Someone offered me free seats

near the sign and I turned them down because of the smoke. Granted, I was seeing like 10 games that season.

by spants on Mar 8, 2009 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

bp

If you walk in when the gates open you generally get to see every cards player take his hacks. Then the visiting team gets about an hour. I’ve been to 7 big league parks’ BPs and Busch’s is the longest.

"All baseball fans can be divided into two groups: those who come to batting practice and the others. Only those in the first category have much chance of amounting to anything."--Thomas Boswell

by albrtfn on Mar 8, 2009 9:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Specifically on ownership...

I am a bit relieved to find only a few “ownership = cheap” comments in this thread. Unlike CT, most of the posters here get it when it comes to evaluating ownership. I pin the more recent dumb contracts (Carp extension, absurd Mulder deal, Pinata deal) on Jocketty losing his mojo over his final seasons here (Pinata was Moz’s signing, but it had all the marks of a Jocketty panic-induced bargain attempt that backfired). These two deals tarnish an otherwise sterling resume for WJ.

Recent attacks on ownership regarding the new stadium, prices, payroll/FA are pretty unfounded IMO. The new stadium was financed roughly 90% with private money, and resulting debt service eats up a pretty big chunk of cash flow right now. My best guess based on public data is that it accounts for $20-$25M in cash each year that must come out of operating profits. The relative burden should lessen as revenues grow and some of the shorter-term debt is paid off—hopefully in time to give Albert a big fat extension.

by Hungry Jack on Mar 8, 2009 12:21 PM EDT reply actions  

from an old Cards fan in CA

I’ve been a Cards fan since Musial, but I’ve never lived in St. Louis, so I’ll keep my assessment mostly to the game itself, not the stadium and local relations.

Ownership

Can’t complain. For the last three years, we’re 11th highest out of thirty teams in payroll. An argument could be made that the organization should have a higher winning percentage over those three years, given the average payroll… I assume DeWitt et al are saving money to sign Albert, so no big name FAs… Fine by me… I like how Mo is going about things in general. Cliché alert: Sometimes the best moves are the ones you don’t make. I think we would have been unhappy with Fuentes. I think we COULD be happy with the rest of the relief staff, esp if Motte and Perez turn out ok… And ownership (and we) can’t predict injuries with much accuracy. The Glaus injury is tough, esp since we may have cement gloves at 3rd and 2nd now, but we’ll probably score reasonably well anyway…Finally, I think we’re likely to trade Rick or one of the other surplus outfielders later in the season, if not just before the first game…

Coaching Players

I know there are folks who like to complain about LaRussa, but the guy wins and he has guts enough to do things w the line-up that others would never do, i.e. bat the pitcher 8th. There are times I’ve always felt he favors vets too much, and there are times I wish he’d play the sabremetric percentages a little more than he does, but he’s very good. And, w apologies to Leo Mazzone, he keeps the best pitching coach of the last twenty-five years on OUR team. Don’t know what happened w Marquis, but most of the time our pitchers improve under Duncan’s tutelage. Overall, this is a good area.

Fan Relations

Don’t know, really. All I ever hear across the country is that the best, most knowledgeable fans are in St. Louis. If VEB is any indication, the fan base is seriously good. Is there a more exciting game site in the country than Fenway? Doubt it. Is there a more beautiful game site in the country than AT&T park? I doubt it. Still. I would love to get to the new park someday. But my annual rotating conference is never held in St. Louis… Just don’t get there… But I know the fan base is terrific because when I see the Cards against the Giants, Dodgers, and occasionally the Mets, there’s lots of red in those alien stands.

Title Track

We’re just about always in contention. How many fans would like to be able to say that? 2006 was too much to hope for…and it worked out anyway. As for this season, we’re probably in no better than wild card contention. But here are five "ifs":

(1) If Carp can go, say, 25 good outings and
(2) If Wainwright can go maybe 30 and
(3) if the infield dee holds to the league average, and
(4) if one pitcher is hurt in Chicago, and
(5) all those kids in Cincy play like kids, well…

…maybe we’re looking at a run for the NL Central title… After that, as recent history suggests, anything is possible.

by SLOKev6 on Mar 8, 2009 6:51 PM EDT reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

The Internet's #1 St. Louis Cardinals blog.
Yahoo_full_count

Managers

Jack_benny__1__small DanUpBaby

Editors

Bendermad_small azruavatar

Trigun_001_small the red baron

Images_small tom s.

Authors

1989_bgh_cropped_small bgh

Valverde_medium_small vivaelpujols