projections
i was showing my daughter for the first time the epic "a charlie brown christmas," and i was struck by a line that was delivered so poignantly, so humanly, so utterly childlike. the line is appropriate to both the holiday season and the baseball free agency season. the line called to mind matt holliday and everybody else gunning for the bigger dollars and the bigger years, often demanding sums that have nothing to do with their own needs or wants, but to demonstrate that they are more important than the next player in line (e.g., the rumor that linececum will demand a symbolic $23,000,001 in arbitration to show that he is more important than the best paid pitcher in baseball).
what matt is saying is: all i want is what i have coming to me; all i want is my fair share.*
and just as sally is right and yet so wrong at the same time, because looking out for her own self-interest (something that we all do and must do) clashes badly with the themes of the season, which is supposed to be about selflessness and giving, matt is both right and oh so wrong in baseball. right, in that the money may just go into the steinbrenners' pockets or the legendary dewallet should he agree to less than the ultimate penny he can squeeze out of his negotiating partner/opponent. wrong in that baseball, like christmas, is supposed to be above pettiness and above greed. baseball is about allegiances to a team, a team the player is supposed to sweat and bleed and struggle for; how do we reconcile that with the vision of a player pimping himself out to the highest bidder before the last out of the world series has settled in the glove?
baseball is supposed to be wholesome and american and all those things that wake adam dunn up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night. is it an accident that the two most iconic peanuts associations are christmas and baseball?
mind you, i am not saying that matt holliday is a bad person because he likes money. i look at free agency and baseball contracts and know that that is how it will be, inevitably. you can call it "wrong" if you like; i won't tell you that you're wrong in return. but one might as well tell a five-year old that she's "wrong" to wish for toys and candy at christmas. it is simply the way the world is, and the best one can say is that we can look at it and wish it were different, and we are fools to devote any more effort to it than wishing.
if i die and go to the afterlife and discover that any deity resembles ayn rand in any fashion, i will surely have to answer for the sin that is this post.
* i read on the internet and therefore it must be true that the actress portraying sally in the christmas special was so young she could not read or memorize her lines, and therefore her lines were often read orally to her, leading to the endearingly choppy delivery of that iconic line.
Something common to many anti-saberites is the objection to projections. if a player is projected to have an OPS of .750 and he has an OPS of .700, was the projection "wrong"? well, no. or maybe yes, depending on your expectation. but people who design, develop, and promote projections would say "no." a projection is not a prediction of what will actually occur. it's a statement of the most likely outcome. nobody makes - or nobody should make - actual predictions about what will occur on the diamond over the course of a season. too much is left to chance in any one season to claim knowledge of an outcome. were it possible to play the same season over and over again with the same player, you would likely see widely varying outcomes from one season to the next.
to give a better analogy, a projection looks at a bellcurve of the likely outcomes and picks the outcome at the peak of that curve. a player could do better than the projection, or worse, in any given season. the claim is that the individual projection is the most likely outcome. take a look at this 2009 projection for albert pujols from baseballprojection.com.
|
Percentile |
LW Runs |
vs. Repl |
Atbats |
AVG |
OBP |
SLG |
|
10th |
25 |
41 |
435 |
0.297 |
0.400 |
0.522 |
|
20th |
32 |
49 |
459 |
0.305 |
0.411 |
0.545 |
|
30th |
40 |
58 |
486 |
0.313 |
0.419 |
0.568 |
|
40th |
47 |
66 |
510 |
0.320 |
0.428 |
0.586 |
|
50th |
55 |
75 |
535 |
0.327 |
0.438 |
0.604 |
|
60th |
62 |
83 |
541 |
0.335 |
0.446 |
0.623 |
|
70th |
68 |
89 |
545 |
0.341 |
0.455 |
0.642 |
|
80th |
76 |
97 |
552 |
0.350 |
0.463 |
0.665 |
|
90th |
83 |
105 |
556 |
0.356 |
0.472 |
0.683 |
i like the way this depicts the bell curve -- there's a top and a bottom percentile. in an unlucky 2009, albert could have racked up a .922 OPS. in a lucky 2009, albert could have managed a 1.155 OPS.
a lot of teams would take unlucky albert.
but the most likely outcome is something within a relatively narrow range on either side of the 50th percentile1.042 projection. when a projection is cited, they're not saying albert will hit 1.042, but that 1.042 OPS should be more or less in the middle of the field of possibilities, will be at the tip of that bell curve. remember also that albert is well known as one of the most consistent players in baseball, so a less ridiculous hitter might show more than the .230 variation in OPS between 10th percentile and 90th percentile.
below is a table of projected 2009 results and actual 2009 results. i could try to do a statistical analysis of the accuracy of the projections, but those already exist. if you're statistically inclined, you'll probably already have seen the statistical discussions of projections. if not, you probably would rather check out the raw data than have math on a saturday morning.
|
PROJECTED 2009 |
ACTUAL 2009 |
|||||||||
|
Player |
PA |
AVG |
OBP |
SLG |
R150 |
|||||
|
Albert Pujols |
640 |
0.327 |
0.438 |
0.604 |
54 |
700 |
0.327 |
0.443 |
0.658 |
69.7 |
|
Brendan Ryan |
411 |
0.265 |
0.324 |
0.357 |
-20 |
429 |
0.292 |
0.34 |
0.4 |
-1.8 |
|
Brian Barden |
496 |
0.256 |
0.319 |
0.379 |
-18 |
114 |
0.233 |
0.286 |
0.379 |
-3.5 |
|
Chris Duncan |
456 |
0.254 |
0.349 |
0.45 |
3 |
304 |
0.227 |
0.329 |
0.358 |
-5.6 |
|
Colby Rasmus |
516 |
0.246 |
0.335 |
0.398 |
-9 |
520 |
0.251 |
0.307 |
0.407 |
-7.6 |
|
David Freese |
495 |
0.267 |
0.329 |
0.433 |
-8 |
34 |
0.323 |
0.353 |
0.484 |
0.8 |
|
Jarrett Hoffpauir |
464 |
0.269 |
0.349 |
0.37 |
-9 |
16 |
0.25 |
0.438 |
0.417 |
0.8 |
|
Jason LaRue |
344 |
0.201 |
0.294 |
0.329 |
-33 |
112 |
0.24 |
0.288 |
0.327 |
-4.6 |
|
Joe Thurston |
525 |
0.275 |
0.331 |
0.401 |
-10 |
307 |
0.225 |
0.316 |
0.33 |
-10.9 |
|
Khalil Greene |
510 |
0.251 |
0.304 |
0.43 |
-12 |
193 |
0.2 |
0.272 |
0.347 |
-9.1 |
|
Matt Pagnozzi |
262 |
0.205 |
0.26 |
0.283 |
-53 |
5 |
0 |
0.25 |
0 |
-0.6 |
|
Nick Stavinoha |
476 |
0.276 |
0.317 |
0.401 |
-14 |
91 |
0.23 |
0.242 |
0.379 |
-4.7 |
|
Rick Ankiel |
489 |
0.253 |
0.319 |
0.475 |
-1 |
404 |
0.231 |
0.285 |
0.387 |
-13.5 |
|
Ryan Ludwick |
506 |
0.267 |
0.344 |
0.499 |
10 |
542 |
0.265 |
0.329 |
0.447 |
3.3 |
|
Shane Robinson |
422 |
0.27 |
0.315 |
0.366 |
-20 |
26 |
0.24 |
0.231 |
0.28 |
-2.1 |
|
Skip Schumaker |
495 |
0.285 |
0.341 |
0.395 |
-8 |
586 |
0.303 |
0.364 |
0.393 |
3.6 |
|
Troy Glaus |
576 |
0.259 |
0.37 |
0.478 |
14 |
32 |
0.172 |
0.25 |
0.241 |
-2.7 |
|
Tyler Greene |
492 |
0.221 |
0.274 |
0.336 |
-39 |
116 |
0.222 |
0.27 |
0.324 |
-5.5 |
|
Yadier Molina |
436 |
0.272 |
0.333 |
0.39 |
-10 |
544 |
0.293 |
0.366 |
0.383 |
3.7 |
what's striking is that a lot of the actual numbers end up looking pretty good, relative to their projections. albert came in at his projection but for a 50 point bump in SLG (es aun mas ridiculoso!). colin rollinford underplayed his projection by 30 points of OBP, but otherwise did about what was projected. skippy picked up about 20 points of BA and OBP but otherwise matched the prediction perfectly. brendan ryan and yadi were better than predicted; chris duncan, rick ankiel, troy glaus, and khalil greene far worse. it's worth noting that the worst correspondences are between the projections and actual results of injured players. obviously, nobody projects rick ankiel to run into a wall. the correspondences for other uninjured players may be rough in some cases, but workable.
it's most interesting to me to look at the projections for the rookies. i would have expected them to be far less "accurate" than the MLers' projections since the MLers had more data in their datasets and extrapolating minor league data would seem more challenging. tyler greene's projection was eerily on point; brian barden's was not too far off; thurston's was too optimistic. but on the whole the projections were not obviously worse than those with substantial ML time. some like shane robinson or hoffpauir or matt pagnozzi just didn't get enough playing time to really draw any conclusion. the good results reassure me somewhat on projecting, say, david freese or allen craig in 2010. if freese actually puts up the ~.760 ops predicted for 2009 (here i assume the 2010 projection may be worse where it relies on an injury distorted 2009 season) in 2010 and plays +10 run defense, i'll be very pleased.
i present these numbers more for consideration and discussion than with any clear end in mind.
* * *
i am pleased to see mudflap will rejoin the team in 2010. the gotay signing is unexciting but harmless at worst.
i do want to take a moment to wish aaron miles well. coming off a tough - though in keeping with the theme of this post well-recompensed - year of injury, divorce, and ineffectiveness in a new and suddenly cold baseball town, aaron has landed on his feet, near his california home, with a rebuilding team in a low-stress environment. no one there will hate him for not being mark derosa. while aaron was a passable second baseman on his best days, he seemed like a legitimately nice guy. good luck, grit.
[edit - if people are still having trouble seeing the second half of the chart, here it is]
|
ACTUAL 2009 |
|||||||
|
AVG |
|||||||
|
160 |
700 |
186 |
0.327 |
0.443 |
0.658 |
69.7 |
|
|
129 |
429 |
114 |
0.292 |
0.34 |
0.4 |
-1.8 |
|
|
52 |
114 |
24 |
0.233 |
0.286 |
0.379 |
-3.5 |
|
|
87 |
304 |
59 |
0.227 |
0.329 |
0.358 |
-5.6 |
|
|
147 |
520 |
119 |
0.251 |
0.307 |
0.407 |
-7.6 |
|
|
17 |
34 |
10 |
0.323 |
0.353 |
0.484 |
0.8 |
|
|
8 |
16 |
3 |
0.25 |
0.438 |
0.417 |
0.8 |
|
|
51 |
112 |
25 |
0.24 |
0.288 |
0.327 |
-4.6 |
|
|
124 |
307 |
60 |
0.225 |
0.316 |
0.33 |
-10.9 |
|
|
77 |
193 |
34 |
0.2 |
0.272 |
0.347 |
-9.1 |
|
|
6 |
5 |
0 |
0 |
0.25 |
0 |
-0.6 |
|
|
39 |
91 |
20 |
0.23 |
0.242 |
0.379 |
-4.7 |
|
|
122 |
404 |
86 |
0.231 |
0.285 |
0.387 |
-13.5 |
|
|
139 |
542 |
129 |
0.265 |
0.329 |
0.447 |
3.3 |
|
|
11 |
26 |
6 |
0.24 |
0.231 |
0.28 |
-2.1 |
|
|
153 |
586 |
161 |
0.303 |
0.364 |
0.393 |
3.6 |
|
|
14 |
32 |
5 |
0.172 |
0.25 |
0.241 |
-2.7 |
|
|
48 |
116 |
24 |
0.222 |
0.27 |
0.324 |
-5.5 |
|
|
140 |
544 |
141 |
0.293 |
0.366 |
0.383 |
3.7 |
|
0 recs |
489 comments
Comments
FIRST favorite line of VEB of all-time
“if i die and go to the afterlife and discover that any deity resembles ayn rand in any fashion, i will surely have to answer for the sin that is this post.”
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 6:41 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Someday I'll read Atlas Shrugged
but I need to let The Fountainhead work it’s way out of my system first.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Dec 5, 2009 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They're both
incredibly interesting reads, whether you end up agreeing with her or not.
by CRay on Dec 5, 2009 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Agree
I think a lot of what she said is 100% right while a lot is 100% wrong and what I put in each column keeps changing. It will make you think…I’ll give her that.
Read Atlas Shrugged and Zen and the Art of Motorcyles Maintance back to back and your head might litterally explode.
by Harknights on Dec 5, 2009 12:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm not really sure how this happened
But I actually have both of these books on my bookshelf without having read either one.
by mojowo11 on Dec 5, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
signals...
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Could not disagree more.
She’s an absolutely mediocre writer with an ego the size of that cake that Panda loves so much. The only thing to come indirectly from her that was worth anything was Bioshock.
by Mulliganstew on Dec 6, 2009 3:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
visual aid...

"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 4:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
mother of ass
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry it was sitting on a tee.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 7:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think that's a fair comment
She wrote her books, they received great praise from a subsection. I’ve never seen the crazy ego you speak of. You have to understand her background. She was raised in Mother Russia and dreamed of America, Hollywood, and capitalism. Did she go overboard in the virtuous businessman played by Hank Rearden and Daphne Taggart. Oh most assuredly, but when you’re raised under the extreme evils of collectivism run amok, it’s understandable, you’ll rebel against a more timid or moderate form of social collectivism (Not trying to call anyone socialist or compare them to muderous communism, just saying, Ayn Rand would be hyper-sensitive to those possibilities having grown up in a bad situation.)
I think that the biggest problem with Ayn Rand’s book is that it’s too much like the polar opposite of Karl Marx’s Communist Manifesto. Whereas Marx looked at the fat cats in business as evil and the political powers (in his ideal representing the will of the people are inately good), Ayn Rand looks at politicos who have to give handouts to the people to stay in power as inherently corrupt and the Big businessmen (as producers) are the truly good ones. This is obviously overly simplified in both cases.
The truth as is usual is in the middle somewhere, and on a case by case basis, it proves one or the other more true. It’s not really something you should base an entire ideology on it though because both know the evil human nature that affects the one side, but ignores how it affects their beliefs. Marx and Rand would be like Glen Beck and James Carville in a room together with no cameras. Both would yell, neither would listen.
Sorry if that’s too much politics. At least I didn’t advocate, except that if you want to understand the belief system of 2 very different groups of people, I recommend reading both books. I’ve done so and count myself better off for having done so. Need to get to the Fountainhead sometime. BTW, that supposed 60 page speech, is actually 200+ in Atlas Shrugged.
by RDCardsfan on Dec 7, 2009 6:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh, no, she had a tremendous ego
but that was one of her best qualities. If she didn’t have such a huge ego, she never would have accomplished all that she did; people that insult her don’t really understand the world she lived in, imo. but you make some good points. She was wrong about a lot of things, too, and the people who quote her as if it is scripture are as scary as the people who quote beck or carville or whoever.
Anyway, as far as this thread goes, the fact that some people think that saying someone else has a huge ego is an insult says more about them than it does Ayn Rand. She certainly wouldn’t have seen it as an insult; she ended her first book with that word, in all caps, carved into a stone- and that was well before she’d really had any real success. She was an iconoclast, especially for her time, she had some incredibly original ideas, that don’t seem so original now precisely BECAUSE she was so influential, and that for the most part have stood the test of time, and therefore she deserves at least a reasonable amount of respect.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Dec 8, 2009 1:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Right --
I think it’s incredibly ironic that someone would defend the Rand against having an ego. It’s fundamental to her worldview that individuals view themselves with an ego.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Dec 8, 2009 9:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
err
hope you’re ready for a few dozen 60-page monologues. rarely has a book’s reputation so far outstripped its literary quality or actual readership.
i think it probably has something to do with its intimidating size, which is reflected in its title. Maybe i’m just jaded by living in DC, where it’s apparently second only to the bible in reverence for a certain population.
by spencegrif on Dec 5, 2009 12:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm in the middle of the Dark Tower series right now
so it’ll be a while before I tackle Atlas Shrugged.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Dec 5, 2009 4:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The Dark Tower series is on my queue
From what I understand Lost draws a lot of inspiration from it so that’s enough for me.
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
by slu on Dec 5, 2009 5:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know if that's the case
but having read both, I can see the parallels. I’ve read the first 4 books previously but it was a while back so I’m starting over. The first book is like a 2 day read but they get progressively more intricate. Book 2 took about 5 days. I’m hoping it all has a satisfying conclusion.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Dec 6, 2009 1:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
was the last book ever written?
i red it long ago and there were still 1 or 2 books yet to come. did he ever finish?
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
by sportsman on Dec 6, 2009 10:45 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Tower-Book/dp/1416524525/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1260124514&sr=8-5
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Dec 6, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And
I’m still stuck without having started the 7th book.
My order of favorites goes as follows (favorite at top, # just signifies the order of the novels in the series):
- Wolves of Calla
- Wizard and Glass
- The Drawing of the Three
- Gunslinger
- Wastelands
- Song of Susannah
Like I said, haven’t read the 7th, but I felt the 6th was just a setup into the 7th, so it didn’t really have a lot going on that was interesting. it’s also the smallest since Gunslinger.
by RDCardsfan on Dec 7, 2009 6:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I read the first book of that
can’t wait to read book 2
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 5, 2009 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think it's ironic that lovers of Rand's books
have trouble remaining objective about her work. There is sometimes something cultish about the way she gets defended.
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 5, 2009 7:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i'm thinking of the wrong novel
anthem is the one i read
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 6, 2009 1:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Randites usually want to beat me up for saying this, but...
as for Atlas Shrugged being a piece of fictional prose, it is something less than satisfying. The story is intriguing in a sci-fi sort of way, the scope covers a lot of territory, and Rand more or less keeps the train on the tracks.
But, each major character has at least (AT LEAST) one pontification moment and each one is basically the same. The John Galt character’s big speech is so pointlessly long and really drags down what should have been a climatic moment in the narrative. Hemingway’s iceberg theory in shreds. I wonder if Hemingway ever read that book and if so, did he ever stop throwing up?
In the end, I get the impression that the book exists for the sake of Rand writing these speeches.
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 5, 2009 5:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"In the end, I get the impression that"
Well, yeah. That was completely the point.
She was a philosopher who tried to make her philosophy accessible by ensconcing it into a literary work. And she did a pretty good job of it, though Galt said everything he needed to say by about the 3rd page of the speech.
Anyway, it would be fascinating to know what Hemingway thought of Rand, but by the time Atlas was published, Hemingway’s mind was pretty much gone due to decades of alcohol abuse…
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Dec 5, 2009 5:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hemingway
is another that I just think everyone agrees is great because that is what is expected.
I find his stuff horrible.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 5, 2009 7:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not particularly fond of Hemingway either
but it’s nearly impossible to deny his influence, particularly when it comes to his writing style. Even Bukowski employed Hemingway’s form in his novels.
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 5, 2009 7:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am not an expert
but for me “good” writing in any definition you want to use starts with Joseph Conrad.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 5, 2009 9:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you don't mean chronologically, right?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 9:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not trying to posture myself as an expert in literature
particularly since I’m not even sure what that means, and I can’t claim to have a favorite, but among contemporaries of Hemingway and Rand I really like Thomas Wolfe. His premature death was a terrible loss for readers. His style, particularly his powers of description, are like slowly unrolling a beautiful Persian rug in the reading. Very heavy on atmosphere.
Hemingway at his best is more clearly seen in his short stories than his novels, imo. The Short Happy Life of Francis Macomber is really great.
When it comes to novellas, Heart of Darkness is as good as anything else that qualifies as such.
I think this is a baseball blog. Oh well- people go on tangents about girlfriends and such, so I guess literature is as good a side topic as any.
Yay books!
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 5, 2009 10:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i'll give salinger a shout-out
and vineland/the crying of lot 49 to pynchon for longer works
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 12:52 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The Crying of Lot 49 is excellent.
I’ve never met anyone else who wasn’t in my english class who’s even heard of Pynchon.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
by IHeartBoog on Dec 6, 2009 1:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i don't really know how to rate it
whether it be the greatest post WW2 novel…things like that, but it is certainly one of the greatest pieces of genius i have ever read, several times.
vineland is fun. not in that same class, but one likely only has one of those in them.
isn’t there a poster here with the screen name oedipa maas – thought i saw it a couple times?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 2:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just finished his new book "Inherent Vice"
It’s a really, really good read.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just started Crying
This sub-thread gives me hope.
by mojowo11 on Dec 6, 2009 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
books -
FUCK YEAH!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 6, 2009 5:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
TWILIGHT - FUCK YEAH
DAVINCI CODE – FUCK YEAH
DANIELLE STEELE FUCK YEAH
THIRD GRADE READING LEVEL
FUCK YEAH FUCK YEAH
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Dec 6, 2009 3:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you don't get prose like this from hemingway
"He turned then, with a mocking smile, and I stifled a gasp. His white shirt was sleeveless, and he wore it unbuttoned, so that the skin of his throat flowed uninterrupted over the marble contours of his chest, his perfect musculature no longer merely hinted at behind concealing clothes. He was too perfect, I realized with a piercing stab of despair. There was no way this godlike creature could be meant for me."
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
by slu on Dec 6, 2009 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No, but Hemingway does have a female lead speak this gem:
Catherine: “I’ll say just what you wish and I’ll do what you wish and then you will never want any other girls, will you?”
I absolutely adore A Farewell to Arms (particularly the army’s retreat), but only because I’ve developed an insanely elaborate fanwank to justify this female character. I expect were I to re-encounter the female leads in his other books (The Sun Also Rises, I’m looking at you), I’d have to come to terms with the fact that Hemingway didn’t write Catherine as he did because he was trying to illustrate the damage caused by war, but because he actually thought that this was how the ideal woman spoke.
And then I’d have to throw the books out a window.
by peach concrete on Dec 6, 2009 5:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hemingway makes me rethink book burning.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 6, 2009 5:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
either you all read too much or i read too little
i’m not sure of which. all i know is i don’t think i have heard of these books you all are talking about. i have heard of the authors though. i ain’t that stupid
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i'm having a good chuckle
imagining hemingway having written that…hmmm, he did live in key west?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know about Key West, but he had a great house in Havana.
by peach concrete on Dec 6, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he did live in key west
the question mark was more a raised eyebrow.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
imagine if such material were found secreted in an old treasure chest
after his death.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Garden of Eden was found in shopping bags.
That book is good. Lots of gender-bending, something Hemingway isn’t exactly known for.
Now with extra feisty!
by spants on Dec 6, 2009 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not quite the quality of what slu posted, though
i imagine that was twilight stuff, or of that ilk
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 10:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Upon first glance, I thought that said
boobs – FUCK YEAH!
That’s a meme I can get on board with
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 7:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
must,,,, resist,,,,, posting,,,,, gif,,,,
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 7, 2009 8:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd like to put in a vote for Charles Dickens
in the pantheon of writers that everyone says they love, but who, in actuality, completely and utterly suck.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Dec 7, 2009 1:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Dickens was more of a zeitgeist/social commentator than a great writer, I think
I’m not sure he’s generally regarded as a “great” for the actual quality of his writing. FWIW, I agree with you, although a Christmas Carol remains one of my favourite stories ever (despite the fact I totally disagree with the political sentiment – I suppose the fact that it’s practically a polemic, and I disagree with its moral, yet still love it, must say something about its quality as a piece of literature).
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 7, 2009 7:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except that
his themes from “A Christmas Carol”, “Great Expectations”, “Oliver Twist”, and “David Copperfield” have been used in countless plays, movies, and other fiction.
Dickens’ strength was his social commentary and writing in the proper era for his style. Still, the themes in those four books have been revisited many, many times — and as is said about Shakespeare: Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he was probably better serialized
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 7, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
David Copperfield I liked because of its autobiographical nature.
Same with Of Human Bondage.
Today we would just say “Life sucks.” But these books describe it.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 7, 2009 5:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually
I believe her first gig as a writer was in screen plays in the silent film days. She was in tight with one of the early giants, but I can’t recall if it was DeMille or Griffith.
I don’t find Rand to be an especially bad writer, although I don’t understand what all the fuss is about. If one wants to read philosophy then Atlas Shrugged might be the better choice (or perhaps just read “straight” philosophy). But I think The Fountainhead is actually a much better novel. There is far less flab in that one.
One problem both novels have in spades is a tendency to get corny in the dramatization of the protagonists’ struggles against the world. More than a few eye-rolling moments in each book.
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 5, 2009 7:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The Fountainhead
is clearly her best work, imo. I never understood the whole point behind writing Atlas Shrugged after The Fountainhead, to be honest. She really said everything she needed or wanted to say in the first book — there was no need to write a second one.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 5, 2009 7:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I have to disagree for only one reason
Not a huge practitioner of Objectivism, but I just kept going back to one thing. I don’t know of any other novel that’s written so well in someone’s second language. The rants gone off on by Galt, Taggart, etc. are grindingly redundant (so I agree in full there) but I kept thinking to myself, “Damn I can’t write very well in my own language, and she can do it in her second language.” But all the other critiques are valid. I would assume, though, that your tone may cause more anger than your substance. If your critique of anything, seems unduly harsh (again reading internet posts is hard in terms of context) then you’ll piss people off anyway. As an admirer of the writing from an achievement standpoint (like being in awe of someone who climbed Everest, and then attempted to do it hiking from the other side for lack of a better analogy) I was impressed, but the ideology doesn’t seem fully fleshed out and seems to just be atheism mixed with libertarianism, and can be summed up in one sentence. The Universe loves producers.
by RDCardsfan on Dec 7, 2009 6:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Jospeh Conrad.
Did not learn English until his 20’s.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 7, 2009 7:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
it's a poor man's 1984
not terrible, but not terribly original
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 6, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
assuming you are talking about anthem
which was published 8 years before 1984…
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Dec 6, 2009 6:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
interesting
said the guy who doesn’t dismiss rand – she seems alot smarter than me.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 6:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
in the sense
she’d whup me in every argument and leave me wishing i’d never opened my mouth.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 6:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
interesting factoid
even if it isn’t a 1984 rip off, it’s still a poor man’s 1984
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 6, 2009 10:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wonder if it served as inspiration...
as in, “this is interesting, but i could do it much better.”
i’ve read fountainhead and shrugged and quite a bit of shorter stuff but unfamiliar with anthem, so really have no idea. however, that would give anthem some cachet historically, i’d think, if it indeed had any such influence.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 10:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I sort of doubt Orwell read it
but I might be wrong.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 7, 2009 7:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd LIke...
…to smack Ayn Rand in the head with a grease-drippin’ pound of bacon.
:=8/
Big McLargehuge!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Dec 5, 2009 6:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ayn Rand is one of the most overrated author's in history
Her “philosophy” could be teared to shreds by any philosophy student worth their salt
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 5, 2009 7:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hate both
Ayn Rand and philosophy students!
by Mister Eff on Dec 5, 2009 7:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
it would be funny to watch them argue though
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 5, 2009 7:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How do you get a philosophy major off your doorstep?
Pay them for the damn pizza.
I’ll be here all week. Try the chicken. I’m a MooCow friendly comedian.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 7:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
baddum ching!
I had to work at starbucks once when I was just outta college, my manager had a masters in philosophy, I guess that’s what it takes to deal caffeine to the masses.
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 5, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Like the Bud Light
Real American Heroes commerical for Mr. Coffee Shop Pourer. What do you do with a master’s in art history? You pour coffee for a living.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 8:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know a guy with a PhD in philosophy
who earns his day’s pay as a long haul 18 wheel semi driver. Anyway, that’s better than Starbucks.
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 5, 2009 8:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Must give him a lot of time
to come up with the answers to life’s questions.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 8:49 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I know a guy with a degree in philosophy.
That is the regional salesman for Coke. Not sure if he has a Master’s or not, he went to school long to have one.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 9:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
huge grammar fail
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 9:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A little harsh
But probably true. The same could be said for Karl Marx, but they still teach him in philosophy even though his ideas are outdated and antiquated. Neither Marx or Rand hold a candle to Ludwig Wittgenstein, or so I hear…
by RDCardsfan on Dec 7, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In your first celestial sign, you can scratch the sign of Dewallet in the clouds . . .
An optimist is a man who upon discovering that a rose smells better than a cabbage concludes it will make better soup.
HL Mencken
by akaitori on Dec 6, 2009 7:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
got it tom
last out of world series did not settle into matt holliday’s glove
or previous ones either
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
by sportsman on Dec 5, 2009 8:57 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
that was Varitek's glove
Let’s see how Mr. Holliday’s series played out.
Game one, grounded out twice, K’d.
Ramirez singled to left [Youkilis scored]
Varitek singled to left [Ramirez to second]
Taveras flied to left
Ortiz singled to left
Youkilis doubled to left [Ellsbury scored]
Ramirez singled to left [Ortiz scored]
Lowell doubled to left [Ramirez to third]
Ortiz flied to left
Game two, singled – adv. to second on an error (did he nutmeg?), singled and LOB, singled and LOB, singled and picked off.
Pedroia flied to left
Ramirez singled to left [Ortiz to second]
Lowell doubled to left [Ortiz scored, Ramirez to third]
Varitek flied to left
Game three, reached on fielder’s choice, grounded out twice, 3-run homer, flied out.
Ramirez flied to left
Ellsbury doubled to left
Varitek singled to left
[Ramirez out at home (left to catcher), Lowell to third (on throw to home)]
Matsuzaka singled to left (that brought Lowell home)
Ramirez flied to left
Game four, grounded out, K’d, flied out, grounded out.
Ellsbury doubled to left
Matsui doubled to left
Ramirez lined to left
Lowell doubled to left
Lowell flied to left
(Atkins was 3B, Tulo was SS.)
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 9:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I only see until OBP
of the second section in the chart above.
by stlfan on Dec 5, 2009 9:51 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
probably your screen size
Nothing to do with VEB.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 5, 2009 2:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But I can shrink the size of the text
and that doesn’t change what is on there…it just adds more grey border. It’s definitely a problem with VEB.
by stlfan on Dec 5, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
my 17 inch WIDESCREEN can’t see the entire table…
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Even on the "wide" setting?
My 19 has it all on the wide setting.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 2:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, even with the wide setting...
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 2:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i lie
“wide” setting gives me the entire table. i’m a dumbass….
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 2:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
can you show me a screen print?
I’m just curious what it looks like.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
my 30 inch screen sees all
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 2:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
56in computer screen? whoa that is pretty big.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
everything's bigger on the internet
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought that was texas
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 2:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Texas stole it from the internet.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 2:46 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This part of this subthread was great.
Well done.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 2:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just imagine how much bigger things are on the internet in Texas
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 8:02 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He has to comment from across the room to keep from going blind.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh the idealism of how other people should spend/make money...
That’s why people with money usually only associate with other people with money.
I know people genuinely think they’d do some altruistic bullshit with their big payday but how many times in the history of professional sports has this happen outside of “home town discounts” and taking a low payday to play for a contender (both have self serving motivations)?
Not.Never. Why? Is it because “born” athletes are “born” greedy? No. You just don’t know how you’ll handle something like that until you’re in the position to do it…and I’ll bet $20 and my left nut the same people saying X person “makes too much” would do exactly the same thing but justify it someway to get over their cognitive dissonance.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Dec 5, 2009 9:55 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
that second part of the bet
makes the $20 fairly insignificant.
by _pistol_ on Dec 5, 2009 10:31 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
nuts are 6
around here
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 10:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
tim wakefield.
if his $4m endlessly renewable contract wasn’t a “i love baseball and i love playing for my team and i’m not concerned about milking the hell out of my team each year” contract, i don’t know what is.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 5, 2009 5:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and in the end he ends up getting bit in the ass
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Dec 5, 2009 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just what the Beatles said would happen.
by Mister Eff on Dec 5, 2009 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
then when you play it backwards
that’s when it really gets interesting
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and yet people still rip on the Beatles
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Dec 5, 2009 6:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Those are the type of people that think that their favorite musician/singer/entertainer
invented music in the first place.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 6:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But we all know led zeppelin invented music.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 5, 2009 10:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But I thought Muddy Waters invented electricity?
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 11:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That came out more smartassed than I meant it.
I love Muddy. I like Zep, but I don’t think that they are the be all and end all.
The Beatles changed music forever, like Chuck Berry did, only they didn’t take underage girls across state lines. Are they the greatest? I don’t know, there are too many shades to music to say one is greater than another. But to try to discredit what they did is ludicrous.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 12:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I still find the Beatles insanely over-rated
but there ya go.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 6, 2009 5:33 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Maybe they are over-rated and I have fallen for the hype-machine rhetoric,
but pop culture music was never the same after them. That is all I am saying. I suppose that can be said of just about any band that had any amount of influence.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 11:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh they were definitely hugely influential
probably the most ever, by some distance. I just don’t think they were terriblye good. In much the same way, Charley Patton and Lemon Jefferson were maybe the two most popular and influential figures in blues music in the 20s, but I think both (at least judging by their recorded output) weren’t very good compared to some of their contemporaries.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 7, 2009 7:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They were never caught taking underaged girls across state lines, you mean.
Now with extra feisty!
by spants on Dec 6, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
True. But until there is proof they did, there is only hearsay. And we all know how reliable that is.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 12:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I have given up hope on music.
If Brittany Spears can sell 10 million albums of pure crap then all is lost.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 6, 2009 12:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It just proves
how stupid people are when left to their own devices. Luckily these people elect the leaders of this country. I’m going to go put my head in boiling water now.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 3:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the oven on the fritz?
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Boiling water can look like and accident
gotta be able to fool the life insurance company.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 7:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I gave up on pop culture music years ago.
Once the ten year olds took over I said eff it. How the hell Taylor Swift gets by is beyond me. You hear her songs on the radio and she sounds like she might can sing, then you hear sing live on some awards show and she is flatter than a pancake. Makes me want to cry.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 6:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Never discount
the ability of a pretty face to cover up for lack of talent.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 7:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think she's pretty at all
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 8:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I may lose my man card here
but I like Taylor Swift’s music. Not because she can sing, because she can’t.
But she’s one hell of a songwriter for someone so young and precocious.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Dec 7, 2009 1:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
hand it over
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 7, 2009 1:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
also
i don’t know anything about taylor swift, but i would shocked if dhe wrote her own music. how many of these disney kid singers are writing their own music? my guess is 0.
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 7, 2009 1:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
she isnt a disney kid
and she does write her own music. if she didnt she wouldnt be winning all of these awards….and for what its worth i agree with Southside, she cant sing that well but also i dont think her sound is as processed as other young pop stars
Chicago Cubs: The first century was funny...this second one is just sad...
by nomar34 on Dec 7, 2009 7:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
She writes all of her songs.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 10:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They add a word to the lyrics.
So they can get a writing credit and royalties.
I doubt Swift can read.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 7, 2009 5:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
because all pretty blondes are dumb?
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Dec 7, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes. And redheads are GREAT in bed.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 7, 2009 5:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
damn right
and i do know a hot blonde who is very, very smart & very intelligent. she still has horrible taste in men though.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 7, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
meaning she won't date you?
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 7, 2009 7:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
that goes without say
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 7, 2009 7:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know a lot of guys who secretly like Taylor Swift.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 10:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I feel sorry for them then.
Not to go all country music here. After years of listening to women that actually can sing live. I mean Martina, Trisha, Allison, Reba, and a few others, and then to hear her live and have her be lauded for vocal mediocrity, it makes me sad. I don’t really care if she writes her own songs, she can’t sing anywhere even close to the same level. If she wins a songwriting award is one thing to call her a vocalist is purely a popularity contest.
And since that is all that matters anymore, I shouldn’t be suprised.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 7, 2009 11:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Most of them don't consider her a country singer fwiw.
I don’t know if they consider her a good singer. They like her music. That’s where I am. She isn’t a good singer but she writes good songs and is a lot more real than any of the Miley Cyrus’s of the world.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 11:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i have some very questionable country girls
& one or two pop girls in my CD collection. but everyone of them where hot single women in 20’s. even in my younger days i stayed away from the under 20yrs old. there is just something wrong about it in my unholy opinion
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 7, 2009 4:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There hasn't been country music in years.
It’s just different degrees of pop.
I want Gangster Rap to make a comeback.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 7, 2009 5:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
all my CD's are from the early-mid 90's
i too want gansta rap back. i hate that shit that’s put out today
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 7, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you have to turn in your VEB card
for bringing up the term “man card”.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Dec 7, 2009 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
can i get an amen?
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 7, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you mean
across stately lions for imortql porpoises?
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
by sportsman on Dec 6, 2009 1:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Something like that.
Maybe……..what?
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 11:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He was just the first
To ruminate on Descartes set to melody. and it somehow all comes back to philosophy.
by RDCardsfan on Dec 7, 2009 6:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Matt Holliday is wro-wro-wro-wro-wroooooon
by Hardcore Legend on Dec 5, 2009 10:24 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Mr Ro-ro-ro-mantic?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 6, 2009 5:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm relieved
that we’re cutting back on Holliday spending. I really didn’t mind the trade as I’m not that high on the prospects we gave up but, even beyond the obvious financial considerations, the idea of signing Holliday has given me a bad feeling for a few reasons:
1. He’s a Larussa obsession. Tony seems to manage better when he’s denied his obsessions and this one’s contract will be around long after he’s gone. Six years at big bucks not only makes it hard to sign Pujols it makes it hard to sign anybody else for a long , long time.
2. We have other needs. Signing a closer, a number four starter and a left handed hitting outfielder to platoon with Craig in left would make us far stronger this year than we were going into last year plus leave us with some “dry powder” to go after next mid season’s needs.
3. We need to rebuild the farm system. Let’s get those picks.
4. The rationale of getting Holliday to “protect” didn’t work. Albert had his most dismal stretch I can remember after Holliday arrived. Maybe it was the elbow but it sure didn’t seem to limit him before the trade.
5. We would be paying Holliday for six years expecting he’d be as good as he was for the couple of months after the trade. He won’t be. I admit he was great for us but I don’t think he’s anywhere near that good a player.
6. He blew the catch. Okay it’s one play but it gave me an eerie feeling that this isn’t going to work out. Short take, let’s forget about this guy and move on with building the long terrm future of the team.
by easy on Dec 5, 2009 11:01 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I agree but
the Cards can afford Holliday and Pujols (though I agree with most of what you said easy). The consequences of signing Holliday for, say, 6 years (in my view) is eventually letting go of Ludwick, probably Schumaker, and (perhaps) Carpenter. The budget is not too bad the next few years, but in year 3 or 4 (when Pujols’ new salary kicks in, Rasmus and Ryan will be arb eligible, the Cards will have to think of a new contract for Waino, etc.), things will get very tight. So, I then see problems keeping some of the players I mentioned (especially Carp, as his contract will be up). To me, signing Holliday is a long-term bet on most of the following: Freese working out, Garcia, Lynn and Miller coming along as hoped, and (perhaps) Descalso and Jones or Henley working out. But all this could happen, Holliday could prove to be a fine player, and the Cards could have many years of success. An interesting gamble in my view.
by CRay on Dec 5, 2009 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
just plain too much money
but more so too many years
holliday doesn’t look like he will age well, ie, a dh by 34
i agree we need to find the next 12m santa, plus 6 elsewhere makes us better (lh of or late inning relief help)
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
by sportsman on Dec 5, 2009 3:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would allocate the money like this
3/27M for Beltre
3/18 for soriano
1/4.5 for Garret Anderson
that’s about 19 million added to payroll with some cash for mid-season pickups.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
garret anderson?
4.5?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no I didn't say that
I meant 1.5 M ,stupid keyboard. ha ha ha ha
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
whew
your citizenship was just about to be reviewed.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They were gonna give you another chance.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you can't touch me I'm the Batman
mu ha ha
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
careful
a “review” consists of yadi2 digging up every stupid thing you ever posted, and if you have never posted anything stupid…there’s always editing
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
for you? not really.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 4:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would have more comments if I blurt nonsense
but no, I take time to form my comments.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 4:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
your nonsense
does seem to be well-thought.
and be careful how you address the Commissar of Records. a simple “sir” will suffice, though “comrade” is preferable.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure i'm ready to be der kommissar
they say the faster you live, the faster you will die.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 4:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
is Albertofstan a clever way of recruiting Adam Dunn?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 4:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you're not the batman
you don’t have the new f’in CTS-V Batmobile like i do

pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 5:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
it's too late gdm
you know what you can be robin or better yet Iron man.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
f that, the commish is dirty
she’s siding with you only because you’re younger & her mybook bff or whatever it is you kids are calling it these days
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
listen old man I'm the f'n Batman
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You clearly are not the Batman with that attitude.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
everyone is entitled to a review
this is albertofstan
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm interested in making a flag for albertofstan
any suggestions?
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
first thought
red
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes
I think throwing in the numbers 5 and 6 would be a good idea
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i've always been fond
of birds on flags
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lboros' avatar
with a 5around the eye and 6 in each corner.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Or a 6 around the eye and 5 in each corner.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
ok I have the first edit done

changes?
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 4:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you are on a better track than my idea was.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
None right now.
I would say maybe including all the HOFers but that might take away from Albertofstan.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 6:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
besides making it one big-assed flag
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 6:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
800*500 is an acceptable resolution
I’ll do a clean-up of the image, and give you a smaller version option when done.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 6:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That huge eye
is freakin my shit out.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 8:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It is a lil disturbing, ain't it?
But that should keep our enemies from messing with us.Who would want to go up against that?
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 8:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
like stringing skulls
along the road leading to the castle.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 8:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The skulls of pitchers
whose heads snapped off due to the whiplash of watching El Hombre’s bestowing of gifts to the people in the farflung reaches of Albertofstan?
I don't often comment, but when I do, I only comment on VivaElBirdos.
by TBender on Dec 6, 2009 12:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not skulls. elbows.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 6, 2009 12:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The all seeing eye of the Cardinals.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes that one.
reply fail
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 4:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Take off the ring
Sauron will see you.
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
by totalloser on Dec 5, 2009 11:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
also, Albert wants his ring back
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 6, 2009 12:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Counterpoint
1. TLR is obsessed with good players; he seems to manage better when he has better players and Holliday is the best player we could sign.
2. We have no need bigger than a great hitter to play LF.
3. We need to rebuild the big club; nobody does that better than Holliday.
4. Who cares about the protection rationale.
5. We’d paying Holliday expecting that he’d be as good as he’s been in his career, which is pretty damn good.
6. He lost it in the lights; big f’ing deal.
by Willie McGee's Twin on Dec 6, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Counterpoint #2
1. TLR is obsessed with good players; he seems to manage better when he has better players and Holliday is the best player we could sign.
TLR might be here 1 or 2 more years. Holliday will be here 6 or 7. I don’t think what TLR wants should be particularly high on our list of priorities when we’re dishing out $100m+ contracts.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 7, 2009 7:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Cubs want Mike Cameron
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 11:15 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
If the Cubs sign Cameron
Do the Cubs have to start untucking their jerseys after they win too?
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 5, 2009 12:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you're assuming they can find the hems
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 12:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
or win
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Dec 5, 2009 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
a broken clock's right twice a day
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If they only win twice
that will be the greatest season of baseball evar.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i think we had this discussion
we’d rather have another flag for the Cards
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 2:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
second greatest?
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Greatest being they win twice
and we win a flag? So maybe third greatest, second greatest= any year we win a flag.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I should've called Kanye
I fail
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 3:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nah. you just gave me a better line of perspective.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well by september it doesn't matter.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
by rocKStark5 on Dec 5, 2009 12:27 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
some good thoughts here, but you're dead wrong on one point
it is simply the way the world is, and the best one can say is that we can look at it and wish it were different, and we are fools to devote any more effort to it than wishing.
Simply not true. You have the power to change your own outlook and attitude which in turn will lead to a change in behavior. I’m not an inspirational speaker or some crap but i have personally made a conscious effort to do this over the last couple years (after being a selfish asshole for the first 30 years) and am seeing results. Not just in myself but in others close to me. It spreads. And if you set the example you’re kids will follow, possibly setting the stage for even more positive influencing of others.
as for how baseball is supposed to be american, i believe that wholeheartedly. it’s a mirror of america for sure. and the image reflecting back is selfishness and greed.
good on players like pujols for setting an example to others on how to dial that greed back a bit and use your power to truly help others.
good post overall, Tom. not trying to pick on the new guy i assure you. just an issue that hits close to home.
by iaintsentimental on Dec 5, 2009 11:35 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
How selfish of you to want to change the world
to make everyone nicer like you are.
by Hardcore Legend on Dec 5, 2009 12:06 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
great post
truly something i can wrap my mind around after spending this semester in a stats class. if i had the time and motivation to go deeper into these stats i would, but i simply don’t have much of either (mainly time).
the thing that stuck out to me in the chart (which got cut off btw, but the most important stats are still up there), is the awesome unexpected performance by brendan ryan. he had a projected OPS of .589 but in reality had an OPS of .632. those 40 or so points difference were probably worth one win alone.
oh, and albert pujols is ridiculous. .922 OPS in a bad year? god.
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 12:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
der--added up the wrong two colums
projected OPS: .681
actual: .740
the point is the same.
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
booooooooooooooog.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 12:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
.922 would be epically bad by Pujolsian standards, .133 off of his career average..
His “worst” year he plate appeared .955
by Mister Eff on Dec 5, 2009 12:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i still think one of these years he's going to hit more jacks than strikeouts
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 12:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He was one away from being even in '06.
Wasn’t the MVP, though.
by Mister Eff on Dec 5, 2009 12:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
duh
to be the mvp you must strike out AT LEAST three times as much as you hit a home run.
jd is legend for Cardinals' closer 2010!!
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 5, 2009 12:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure if this makes me a phillistine or not,
but I really enjoy egg nog with brandy or rum. Any of you alcoholic DIY-ers ever make the stuff yourself?
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Dec 5, 2009 12:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
yeah
I used Alton Brown’s recipe and it wasn’t really worth it, in my opinion. Still fun to make, though.
by Mister Eff on Dec 5, 2009 1:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
did same thing
Also, don’t think it was worth it.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 5, 2009 1:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OT: hearkening back to our RPG discussions a few days ago
found an ode to Secret of Mana. Part of a series on the staff writers’ most beloved gaming memories. Worth a look.
"on gameday it says duke loves to face the four seamer and hates to face the four seamer" -VolsnCards5
"perhaps it's a computer joke about the duality of man." -tom s.
by Tudor's Electric Fan on Dec 5, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Did any of you guys play Secret of Evermore?
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Dec 5, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am playing Dragon Age: Origins right now
It is pretty fun so far. But it is hard to level up. I like RPG’s were I can go off and grind off some new levels.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 5, 2009 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
I like to always have the proverbial carrot at the end of the stick whilst RPG-ing. With Dragon Age, do you find that you lose interest as a result?
I’m insanely curious about the game. It’s near the top of my wish list and I need a good RPG to carry my stat-lust through the doldrums of another baseball offseason.
"on gameday it says duke loves to face the four seamer and hates to face the four seamer" -VolsnCards5
"perhaps it's a computer joke about the duality of man." -tom s.
by Tudor's Electric Fan on Dec 5, 2009 4:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, Secret of Evermore.
The poor cousin of Secret of Mana. Decent gameplay, and an intriguing story, but the execution just wasn’t there. A rare miss for Square during that time period, as well.
Then again, SoE’s greatest sin didn’t actually have anything to do with the game itself. It had the unbelievably bad fortune to be released at the exact same time as Chrono Trigger, and there was a huge ad campaign touting the two games as Square’s new wave of great RPGs. Unfortunately for SoE, Chrono Trigger was one of the two or three greatest RPGs ever created, and Secret of Evermore was a decent but not great impression of the Seiken Dentestu series.
Here comes the funcooker!
by the red baron on Dec 6, 2009 7:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Also, I think Secret of Evermore was actually made by Square USA, so it really was kind of an imitation.
I borrowed it from a friend once and just couldn’t get into it past a couple of hours’ play. But I actually liked Secret of Mana enough to download it on my Wii. And that still sounds kind of dirty, I don’t think I’ll ever get over that…
Chrono Trigger, on the other hand, oh man. That’s a “desert island” game if I’ve ever seen one.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Dec 7, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We had an RPG discussion?
Where the hell was I? Sometimes I hate my new job.
by Evilfrog on Dec 5, 2009 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It shouldn't be too hard to strike up new RPG discussions around here
It’s like Beetlejuice. Just say “RPG” enough times and I promise you a fruitful RPG discussion will ensue.
For example, it was excruciatingly hard to reply to you with Flim’s Dragon Age comment right above you just waiting to evolve into a full-scale RPG dorkfest. In fact, I can’t take this anymore…must…reply…to…
"on gameday it says duke loves to face the four seamer and hates to face the four seamer" -VolsnCards5
"perhaps it's a computer joke about the duality of man." -tom s.
by Tudor's Electric Fan on Dec 5, 2009 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Since RPG means something totally different to me
the idea of an RPG dorkfest amuses me.
by Mister Eff on Dec 5, 2009 4:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
speaking of dorky rpg's
when i was a kid, back in the late 80’s “potato gun” craze, I decided to one-up my buddies’ hair spray cannons by building an over-the-shoulder launcher to fire custom-built model rockets tipped with water balloons out of a 4" piece of PVC pipe. With a D motor, I could hit my dad’s barn from almost half a mile away. That thing was so much fun.
Only caught myself on fire one time…
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Dec 5, 2009 5:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
tater guns are always fun.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 7:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't remember potato guns being a big deal in the late 80's.
Which, oddly enough, was when I graduated HS and should’ve been in my most destructive phase. I remember them getting a resurgence in the late 90’s. Which I thought was funny cuz everybody acted like it was new and my older brothers had taught me to make those in the 70’s. They didn’t use potatoes, they shot tennis balls at each other. You really shouldn’t teach a 7 year old to do that and then leave them unsupervised…..you really shouldn’t.
The 80’s were when paintball guns first got popular. We had no helmets or padding, didn’t know we needed it. All you got was the gun some paintballs and co2 cartridges and a flimsy pair of goggles and off into the woods we went. Those old paintballs would freeze, that got really interesting.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 9:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Someone else occasionally reads Jeremy Parish?
I’m not the hugest nerd on VEB???
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Dec 7, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
maybe if you had a career year
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 7, 2009 2:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
that's one of the things i look forward to every winter
i never make my own egg nog, but even store-bought stuff really helps put me in the holiday spirit.
that, and hot apple cider cooking on the stove, with a couple of cinnamon sticks and a bit of spiced rum…
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Dec 5, 2009 1:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Even though it's too late now to get figgins
imagine if we signed him and resigned Derosa, that would’ve solved our LF and 3B problem at the same time while giving Albert someone who can score 110 runs that he can drive in.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 1:33 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
but but but
RBIs are stupid stats that make the baby Jesus cry.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes, but they can sure help albert garner MVP numbers.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And that is the third best thing that can happen.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hmmm
1.Win world series
2.?
3.Albert wins MVP
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Like this:
1.Win WS and Albert wins MVP
2.Win WS
3.Albert wins MVP
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe it would be this
1.WIn WS, Albert wins MVP, A.D.A.M./Carp win Cy in a tie, GGs for everyone!!!
2.WIN WS…..
3.Albert wins mvp
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hmmm..
1. I catch the Walkoff Grandslam to win the World Series.
2. Cardinals win the World Series.
3. Albert gets MVP.
by Evilfrog on Dec 5, 2009 3:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but would you share the ball?
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Or.
1. I catch the Walkoff Grandslam to win the WS in a 4 game sweep
There that looks better.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and the first three games the cards out score opponents by 40-0
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just pee'd a little.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 3:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and let's same this team is the redsox
boy would ESPN be scratching their heads over that series.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
now it makes sense
" and let’s same say this team is the redsox "
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 4:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great Post!
What the chart tells me is that
1. Our pitching carried us into the playoffs.
2. We’re better off through subtraction, getting rid of dead salary and letting the arby players go.
A request: Can you put up figures for DeRosa, Lugo, and Holliday?
by gocards62 on Dec 5, 2009 1:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
As I was reading the first part of the post
I couldn’t help but think the “The Secret” and “The Disease of More” Simmons talks about in his basketball book. Namely sacrificing (in this case money) for the good of others on the team in order to let others get theirs and put together a more talented group of players.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 5, 2009 1:37 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
the basketball book
parts of this were great, other parts were trying to convince me that robert horry was deserving of enshrinement in the hall of fame.
I’m not sure what I was expecting—I guess I hoped that, in aping bill james’s book format, a little analytical intelligence would rub off. I’ll take five all-stars who don’t know the secret over robert horry, and I will take that every time.
by DanUpBaby on Dec 5, 2009 3:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
unfamiliar with the book
but 5 iverson’s might be a bit much – i’d throw one horry into the mix
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the thing is
there are so many Horrys, and so few Iversons.
that one Horry turned into a fetish object for a bunch of championship teams instead of fading out after his championship run like James Posey does not make him a hall of famer, but good luck telling Bill Simmons that.
by DanUpBaby on Dec 5, 2009 4:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The 2004 Olympic team.
The 2002 World Championships team.
You can’t put any 5 all-stars together in basketball. It’s not like baseball. You need players who will do the “little things”, like bump cutters, dive after loose balls, take fouls, and work on the offensive glass to win games. Either you find All Star talents who don’t mind doing those things (like Dennis Rodman, David Robinson) or you find another player who thrives on doing that type of work and doesn’t mind taking a backseat in other areas of the game, specifically not having plays run for them on offense (Robert Horry, Ben Wallace, Bruce Bowen).
I don’t think Horry is a HOF player, any more than I think that Steve Kerr or Dennis Rodman is a HOF player. But nearly every title team in the last 30 years has had a player similar to one of those guys on it. That is not a coincidence.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 5, 2009 8:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, they all have one
because there are so many of them
by DanUpBaby on Dec 5, 2009 10:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i would not lump rodman in
with the battier/horry guys. probably a HOF’er if off-court didn’t matter, and it doesn’t to me.
he was kind of a great offensive player without scoring, and his defense and rebounding on both ends were extraordinary.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 1:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't lump
Pistons era Rodman in with those guys (he was an offensive threat back then), but Spurs/Bulls era Rodman was DEFINITELY one of those guys.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
nah
on the bulls he could’ve scored a few more, but really no reason. he was a great facilitator of that offense with his excellent passing and picks, and even drawing attention cutting.
like the celts are discussed today, with their big three, rodman was part of a big three in chicago, and in a third member comparison, better with the bulls than allen is with celts. i don’t really call that a “role player”, just a player with a certain role to play – two totally different things, imo. for example, ben gordon’s role is to come off the bench and score a la vinnie johnson, but i don’t consider him a “role player”, a term that to me has a different connotation.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 6:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess the bench "role player" with that team
at least latterly, was Kukoc, no?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 7, 2009 7:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Kukoc = Odom on the current Lakers
Talented player who can get his own shot and score against other teams’ bench players, yet will be on the floor to finish games even though he doesn’t start.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
All of them have either a
HOF post player or HOF 2 guard as well, are they ubiquitous?
What you’re stating is that those guys aren’t valuable, when they ARE valuable, regardless of how many of them there are — and there’s a lot fewer guys who can do what Horry did (guard 3 different positions well, rebound, hit threes, solid pick and roll player, unselfish) than, say, what Ray Allen does, yet people seem to think that Ray Allen is a HOF player — yet he’s won one title and played in one Finals.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ray Allen
Also hasn’t played with the G.O.A.T., the best 1-2 combo in a long time or the best power forward ever.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ray Allen isn't a superstar
So maybe he should have taken role player money to play for one of those teams.
You kinda made my point for me.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That doesn't make Horry better than Ray Allen though
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No, it makes him smarter AND better, just not more talented.
It’s about winning championships, and Ray Allen was never a franchise player on a good team, so he should have swallowed his pride and been a very good role player on a better team. As I’ve said, it’s hard to find talented guys who are willing to do that.
Ray Allen could have been a great role player for the Spurs had he wanted to be. But he didn’t want to be.
Is Reggie Miller is HOF player? He was essentially a role player on those Indiana teams, who never had a true superstar. The difference is that he played like a role player instead of like Ray Allen, and his teams had a lot of success.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Uhhh
Ray Allen has a ring and Reggie Miller doesn’t. Not sure where that came from.
No way Robert Horry could have been 20-10 if he was selfish. His per 36 minutes rates spell that out as well as just his talent. He didn’t have the option to go try and be a franchise guy because he wasn’t that type of offensive player. He’s no better than James Posey except with the sense to go play with the best 5 players of his generation. Props to him for being a good guy, but being smart enough to be on already great teams does not make a great player.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 2:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Per 36 minutes is bullshit
and you know it. He could have been a 20-10 guy in Memphis instead of a role player in L.A., he chose to play on the better team and damn his stats.
Do I think Horry should be in the HOF? No, I don’t. But to say that guys like Robert Horry are a “dime a dozen” is complete bullshit, because they aren’t.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 4:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He's not dime a dozen at all
He was a good player. Not 20-10 good—-no way no how, taking only good looks at a 45% clip means he couldn’t fill up the net and he never ever approached the rebounding rate it would take to get 10/game (and it’s not like you can be a selfish rebounder, he just wasn’t that great at it)…….let alone both of those. Per 36 isn’t bullshit when it tells you a guy doesn’t get that many rebounds. He wasn’t anywhere near as talented or athletic as say Chris Bosh or Amare Stoudamire and that’s what it takes to get 20-10.
But yes he was good—-Posey got 25M for doing almost the same thing for a reason—-but he was only in those championship positions because of Hakeem, ShaKobe, and Duncan so the “count the ringzzzz” argument for him being this indispensible sidekick is just dumb.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 5:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and to say horry is better than ray allen
is ludicrous.
one of my former coaches (and former nba head coach) sings the praises of horry, for what he was, but i am positive would laugh at this notion. i shall ask, though.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ray Allen
should be a spot up shooter on a playoff team, not the face of a franchise. He’s Ben Gordon with a little better defense. A smaller J.R. Smith without the tattoos. None of his teams in Seattle were any good when he was the “star”. He’s only won in places where he’s been paired with two other really good players: Milwaukee and Boston.
There are more players in the league like Ray Allen than there are like Robert Horry. Allen may have more overall talent, but Horry is going to improve my chances to win more than Allen does as a simple addition to my team, because he’ll do things that other guys simply won’t do.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
personally
i think you’re nuts.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 8:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Amare Stoudamire is a horrible rebounder
Cannot get his own shot, and wouldn’t be near the player statistically that he is if he didn’t play in Phoenix’s system with Nash running things. He’s a complementary player if there ever was one — especially considering that he’s absolutely terrible on defense. He’s a one trick pony — he can hit an open 15 footer and dunk on people. That’s it.
Bosh might be the most underrated player in the game right now, and I would submit that he’s better than Horry. But if I’ve got the choice between Amare and Horry — I’ll take Horry every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
Just watch this summer — Amare won’t get any interest on the FA market until all the other “marquee” types are signed, and he’ll end up taking way less than Bosh will. He’d be better off signing a deal with the Suns right now.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
now i know it
wouldn’t want you as my player personnel guy if you think horry is better than amare. i am no amare fan and think his game limited, but…
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 8:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
reggie miller
was absolutely a superstar. he was the greatest two guard playing during jordan’s hiatus, and before that was of course second, sort of like drexler previously. and two-guard is the glamor position.
miller got plenty of press. and he’s gotten to finals, which is all one can say of malone, stockton, iverson – three of the greatest at their “roles”. miller is just as highly regarded.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So
We give great credence to role players who score a lot of points — but no credence to role players who do everything else but score? Sorry, that’s bullshit.
The best 2 guard in the league during Jordan’s hiatus? Probably, but we’re talking about an era where Mitch Richmond, Dan Marjele, Cedric Ceballos and Dana Barros were making the All-Star game as 2 guards. Not exactly the 4 horseman of the HOF 2 guards there.
Here, tell me the difference between these four players:
Per 36 Min (Career):
Player 1: 19.1 PPG, 3.2 RPG, 3.1 APG
Player 2: 19.4 PPG, 3.6 RPG, 3.7 APG.
Player 3: 20.1 PPG, 4.3 RPG, 3.6 APG
Player 4: 20.0 PPG, 4.5 RPG, 3.98 APG
Which guy is the HOF player? I submit that none of them really merit consideration.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
reggie miller was not a role player
unless you consider larry bird a role player because he could do everything, or jordan. i’m not comparing miller to either, or to magic, but what is your definition of role player? i have never heard miller described as such. you make him out to be ben gordon.
i’ve played with a guy named walton. i am curious about your take on him – what do your numbers say?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 8:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
because he could do everything
I’m no expert, but I always thought miller was pretty limited, actually. He didn’t drive that well, didn’t play stellar defense, wasn’t a force on the boards – he was a very, very good jump shooter who played very hard and fit in well with an offense that was basically run for him.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 8, 2009 9:42 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
miller didn't drive
all the way to the hoop, like young jordan, if that’s what you mean, but he could definitely operate off the dribble to create his own shot, which he would pull up on, much like a latter jordan. however, when it needed to go to the hole, it went, and then of course he was a great free-throw shooter.
an acknowledged clutch performer (mark jackson places him behind only jordan), this moniker extended to his defense as well – big play after big play (or rebound).
he wasn’t a force on the boards, but was a guard and the pacers had the davis “brothers” and smits to rebound and wanted miller out ahead of the pack.
the offense was run for him (as it was for jordan or any other top scorer) and defenses tried to stop him, especially in 4th quarters, yet he had so many hugely memorable, might say legendary, 4th quarter playoff performances, especially in madison square garden and in matchups with jordan’s bulls (one game in particular when he hit the winner over jordan very reminiscent of jordan v. ehlo or byron russell).
the only players to play for one team longer were stockton and malone – miller WAS the pacers yet didn’t have another HOF alongside him, like that pair or jordan-pippen. yet they went to the finals (lost to shaq-kobe) and were other times eliminated in epic conference finals by bulls and pistons, both of whom went on to win the crown.
reggie miller was a franchise player. thus, the pacers tailored their gameplan around him, and miller tailored his game to the plan.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 8, 2009 2:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I will never forget Miller's
8 points in 9 seconds vs. Knicks.
That is all I really have to say about RM.
* is an Asshat
by RiverRat on Dec 8, 2009 7:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Also
Go look at Horry’s PER ratings - they are pretty damn good. As is his Adjusted +/ and Roland Rating. These stats are much more flawed than anything we use for baseball, due to the nature of having 10 different players who effect how each other move and play on each and every play vs. one pitcher, one batter, and 8 defensive players. But for basketball they are the best we have, and Horry stacks up quite well overall.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 5, 2009 8:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
horry's career PER is 13.4
I might be wrong—I was crushed when Hollinger stopped writing the forecast, but I didn’t enjoy his work as much on Insider, so my subscription has lapsed—but isn’t 15, a mark he never quite hit, supposed to be “average”? That’s great for a role player, but it doesn’t make him an irreplaceable role player.
Obviously the five-iversons comment was hyperbolic. But Simmons completely fails to understand the scarcity of a great player as compared to a fine role player; the only things separating Robert Horry from every other great role player who’s ever had a good year for a championship team are that he played forever at his nearly average level and he wasn’t subsequently signed by some also-ran team whose understanding of winning basketball runs as shallow and association-based as the Sports Guy’s.
by DanUpBaby on Dec 5, 2009 10:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he was a great role player
who later in his career was a good role player. at one point to replace him with another “role player” likely would have involved a downgrade, but there are alot of role players, so he was replaceable. of course, even stars are replaceable with other stars, other than the few.
he’s not a HOF’er any more than michael cooper or cornbread maxwell are. intangibles, glue guys, grit – these things apply in basketball exponentially more than in baseball due to the nature of the game, but they will still never deserve springfield.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 1:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Average PER for a role player is about 5, so he's quite a bit better than that.
And most role players have a slight positive plus/minus (2 or so). Horry’s was around 5-7 for his career, meaning good things are happening when he’s on the floor.
I think you are underrating how unique a role player Horry actually was, which is what Simmons’ is getting at in the book. The closest guy in the league right now to Horry is Shane Battier, who can’t guard 4’s and 5’s, isn’t as good a 3 point shooter, an isn’t a good pick and roll player because he can’t hit jumpers on the pick-and-pop. If you combine Battier, David West, and Rasheed Wallace, you probably have something close to what Horry provided.
The other thing you’re underrating is the fact that Horry probably could have been a 20-10 guy at any time in the league, which would have earned him a lot more money during his playing days, but instead decided to be a role/bench player on good teams. That’s completely selfless, and you just don’t see it very often in this day and age in the NBA.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
horry was derosa
great if you look at him as an utilityman, averagish as a starter.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I assume you think of
Joe Dumars, Dikembe Mutumbo, and Reggie Miller the same way then, because that’s what they were.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
didn't albert sort of do this?
he’s only being 12M annually and will be deferred the rest(without interest I add) from 2020-2029.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 3:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There's really no reason to do this in baseball though
There’s no limit to the amount of salary any team can carry. Even the luxury tax is really, really fucking tough to hit without grossly overpaying a few players.
Tom Brady took less from New England, and what’s he gotten out of it? They keep trading All-Pro players away and getting middle round draft picks in return — which is a classic salary reduction strategy. They didn’t keep Asante Samuel or Randall Gay and look how bad their secondary got torched last Monday night by the Saints.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 5, 2009 8:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They also didn't keep Deion Branch, Ty Law, Lawyer Milloy, Willie McGinest etc
Not keeping those guys let them acquire the likes of Moss/Welker etc and they’ve been good for the entire decade as a result. And it’s not all Tom Brady at all, Cassell went 12-4 in his first year starting. The Patriots FA/expensive vet policy is made for success not for cost cutting. When Richard Seymour (and his 4 2009 sacks) signs with some other team next year, they’ll be picking #14ish in the draft. That’s not cheap, it’s smart.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 5, 2009 8:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It's a 2011 pick
And didn’t Cassell go 10-6 and miss the playoffs?
(Insert Your Own Joke)
by AWolfAtTheDoor on Dec 6, 2009 5:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
11-5 my fault....the only 11 win team in history to miss the playoffs
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 5:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah that did suck.
I just remembered the had a way better record than San Diego. And I don’t see why they traded Seymour unless they didn’t think a Super Bowl was possible this year.
(Insert Your Own Joke)
by AWolfAtTheDoor on Dec 6, 2009 5:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
5 years of the 10-15 pick > 1 year of Seymour
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 5:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No, they won't
they’ll probably trade that pick for 2 second rounders and a third rounder or some shit.
There was no reason NOT to keep Samuel or Gay though. They had replacements for all those other guys — they didn’t have replacements for Samuel and Gay and that’s been obvious. Lucky for them they play in a shitty division where every other team has a ton of flaws. It’s pretty clear that their defense can’t stop any good offense this season, and the road to the Super Bowl goes through Indy.
You know who else has been good this whole decade? The Steelers, and they don’t make stupid personnel changes like this all the time. In fact, they’ve been good for going on four decades now (under three different head coaches), without cutting and trading away veterans who then go elsewhere to play productively to the end of their careers.
Brady must mean something to them, or they would have traded his ass away too, years ago, prior to him getting expensive — that’s what they did to Cassell, right?
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Like Plaxico Burress?
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
without cutting and trading away veterans who then go elsewhere to play productively to the end of their careers.
Plaxico Burress was a veteran who played productively to the (abrupt) end of his career.
But it’s a salary cap league, you have to let guys walk. The Patriots have easily had the best FA decisions of any team in this decade. We can only say in retrospect they had replacements for all the veterans they’ve let walk, maybe they thought they had replacements for Samuel/Gay that didn’t pan out. It finally burned them yes, but they wouldn’t have been remotely as successful had they not had the balls to let guys walk. And they’re still going to make the playoffs, it’s not like they’re some dogshit team. New Orleans sliced and diced them…………New Orleans has sliced and diced everyone.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 2:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Since when did Plax Burress play in New England?
I don’t know what he has at all to do with this conversation.
They’ve been much more shrewd than they’ve had to be, and they’ve overpaid their fair share of players, which has led to this cost-cutting. I think sometimes everyone thinks that Belichick is sooooooo fucking smart, when I think he outthinks himself pretty often.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 4:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Plaxico Burress played on the Pittsburgh Steelers
He was successful with the Pittsburgh Steelers, then the Pittsburgh Steelers let Plaxico Burress go elsewhere where he proceeded to play productively to the end of his career.
[Steelers have] been good for going on four decades now…without cutting and trading away veterans who then go elsewhere to play productively to the end of their careers.
I can’t put that any other way. It means every team has dumped veterans because it’s a salary cap league. And the Pats have a pretty good track record of knowing when to cut bait until Asante Samuel. No one is perfect.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They didn't cut him or trade him
he left via free agency and signed a huge contract with the Giants. No way that the Steelers were going to match that deal. Now, if the same happened for Ben Roethlesberger, Troy Polomalu, or Hines Ward? They’d probably match. They kept bringing Jerome Bettis back for years, while pairing him with Willie Parker when he couldn’t be effective as an every down back. They didn’t cut him and cost him a few million dollars — they let him retire gracefully while phasing him out of their plans.
Burress has also been a serial malcontent pretty much his whole career. The Patriots cut Willie McGinest and Lawyer Malloy who were two players that were great team guys their whole careers. They didn’t leave for a big contract and then shoot themselves in the leg carrying an unlicensed firearm. This is a noticeable difference in how the team’s operate.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
WTF?
Anyone else get a Jack in the Box ad when they clicked to view the comments?
It wasn’t a pop-up, it was part of the site.
f’in SBN.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
by IHeartBoog on Dec 5, 2009 2:52 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Same.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 2:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Though in fairness
If adblock were to fail to block an ad, I wouldn’t mind it being a JitB ad.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 5, 2009 3:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well sure, you have access to 99 taco's for 2 cents
a lot of us aren’t so lucky
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 5:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wow, that's a bargain
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 6, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You haven't seen the 2 tacos...
I don't often comment, but when I do, I only comment on VivaElBirdos.
by TBender on Dec 6, 2009 8:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no
it’s 99 tacos
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 6, 2009 10:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OT: Lindenwood is here in Helena playing
the semifinal in the NAIA handegg league. 35-35 in the fourth great game.
* is an Asshat
by RiverRat on Dec 5, 2009 4:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
this is off topic as well, I guess
has anyone noticed the similarities in Matt Holiday’s and Hanley Ramirez’s offense over the past three seasons(RBIs and SB aside)?
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 5:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I hadn't,
bu toyu are correct. Damn near identical.
* is an Asshat
by RiverRat on Dec 5, 2009 5:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
holliday would be a superstar
if he could play SS
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 8:29 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This made me chuckle.
* is an Asshat
by RiverRat on Dec 5, 2009 10:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
been awhile
at least since i spotted one of your classics. seems you’ve been writing other words lately. (now watch – yadi2 wil point out that your percentage of TWSS posts has remained at 90 and then someone will project that it is sustainable)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 1:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I was told there would be no math!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 6, 2009 8:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
off topic . . .
you mean some people didn’t vote for me?
smithers, release the hounds!
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 5, 2009 5:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
great stuff tom
i like how you explained projections because i was under the impression they were what people thought was going to happen, not an average or a peak average of what the formulas say could happen. now i know, and knowing is half the battle.
also wanted to hit on the first part. as i see it, here’s the problem. baseball used to be all about the team & doing whatever is necessary to help that team win it all. but when the money started to infect it, it changed forever. it will never be about the name on the front of the jersey, it will now, always & forever, be about the name on the back of the jersey. no matter what a player says, he’s looking to get paid in the Escalade. even our beloved Albert. and that’s all fine & good, the money’s there & they should go get every dime, penny & quarter billion they can. they are the best of the best & in today’s world that’s what you get when you are the best. you get paid & paid & paid some more till your great grand kids grand kids will never have to do an honest days work in their life time.
i don’t know how much good it does us to look back & morn what once was. is it really healthy or wise to hope & wish & pray things could, hopefully, possibly, maybe if we really try hard enough believe that both Lego & Albert will take penny’s on the dollar to keep wearing our BOB’s? it’s just not wise because all that is going happen is we fans get are going to get our hearts broken. and i don’t know about anyone else, but my poor heart can’t take anymore heartache. it’s been shattered into a million pieces & just like humpty dumpty, all the kids horses & all the kings men will never be able to put it back together again. i think it’s best for everyone if we realize people do in fact suck. you can’t trust anyone. they will turn on you & stab you in the back without giving it a second though. especially our professional athletic heroes. they don’t have any loyalty because there is no more loyalty to go around. it’s been replaced by the almighty dollar.
so yes, tis the season of giving & self sacrifice. but only if you get yours first.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 6:04 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
I'm not reading all that
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 5, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Me neither.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
f'in gdm
nor I
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 5, 2009 6:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i'm saving it
to have with eggnog and a warm fire on christmas day
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 8:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i've created a monster
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
damnit, i'm going to have to be a lot more careful in the future now
you all need to stop looking up to me & worshiping me so much
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 8:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
gdm
president-for-life of albertofstan
i’d nominate you, but then your life would become a living hell…oh, wait.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 9:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so you're saying it will be a vast improvement?
therefore, i accept your nomination
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 10:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
anyone secant?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 1:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i read it, man. don't listen to the haters.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Dec 5, 2009 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
gdm, you are a literary monstar.
They should carry you around on a litter, borne by great hulking men, with beautiful women fanning you and catering to your every need. Your feet should never again be sullied by common dirt.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 6:40 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
rec you very much
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 10:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
HFS
I think that’s the first time I’ve had anything rec’d.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
FWIW
the good old days of baseball weren’t so fucking good for most of the players. You never got a chance to negotiate your pay, you were simply at the mercy of what the owner wanted to pay you and you had to hope he was a nice guy and fair. Otherwise you were fucked.
Teams like the Yankees stockpiled talent in the minors so that other teams couldn’t get their hands on it, and many guys who would have played on other teams in the league never made the big leagues because they were stuck playing behind HOF players on the Yanks. If you took a contract to go play for a league in Mexico, you got blackballed and couldn’t come back into Major League Baseball. The owners controlled everything, and they made HUGE profits by having to share little if any of it with the on field talent.
It has nothing to do with the front or the back of the jersey — it has everything to do with players getting screwed over for a long, long time. The MLBPA is the strongest sports union out there, no other union comes close in terms of solidarity — they should get theirs, because we go to games to see Albert Pujols and Matt Holliday, we don’t go to games to see Bill DeWitt make a speech.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 5, 2009 8:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well I do.
That Bill DeWitt is such a rhetorical mastermind. It’s beautiful to see.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 8:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i totally agree
but we fans used to have this innocence about the game & it’s players. we never paid attention nor did we ever used to hear about what went on behind the scenes.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 8:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nowadays
I still don’t think that the MLBPA does enough to defend players. Players like JC Romero, etc.
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
by Taskmaster on Dec 6, 2009 6:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Cheer up, gdm
- don’t fret about mourning what once was. It wasn’t.
It’s only mythologies that provide an actual occasion when Paradise was Lost. And Malt does more than Milton can to justify God’s ways to man.
ceterum censeo, delendo est Joe Strauss
by alberich on Dec 5, 2009 8:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tom
I will reiterate what gdm said in thanks for doing this post it helped me understand a few things as well. I will always applaud any reference to Peanuts.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 6:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
do you think that
when sites such as sportingnews say OBS instead of OPS this just confuses people? I actually kind of think that OBS makes more sense, or maybe OB+S
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 5, 2009 7:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Florida goes down in flames.
Tebow cries.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Dec 5, 2009 8:43 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
roll tide
roll.
tebow cried on the sideline after the endzone pick. after the game i don’t care. all i care is texas loses because bama will kill them.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 8:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You want Texas to lose so they don't get killed by Alabama?
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if texas loses, cincinnatti or tcu will play alabama
there’s no way texes plays them, or florida plays alabama again
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just didn't understand what he was saying.
I don’t really care who plays Alabama.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 8:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i want texas to lose
because i want tcu (hoping cincy doesn’t leapfrog them) – the only team with a defense that can keep it a game
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 9:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay.
I like TCU so I would be okay with that.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 9:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
just trying to keep you happy
or cheer you up.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 5, 2009 9:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
she's going to be inconsolable now
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 11:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Worst game ever.
I hate, hate, hate GA Tech. Almost as much the stupid Gamecocks.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 11:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i thought you all had won it there for a minute
that sucks, although not as bad as how the nebraska texas game ended
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 11:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I have some relatives that are gonna have hangovers tomorrow
from that Texas win.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 5, 2009 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't care about nebraska and texas.
The point is stupid GT cheated earlier this year and didn’t get caught. CJ works his tail off and proves he should win the Heisman but he won’t because our stupid defense decides playing was optional today.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 5, 2009 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i know you don't, i just meant for all of CFB that was a worse ending
the clock ran out & the refs gave tex 1 second to kick the winning field goal & they did. thus ensuring for at least one more year the BCS will still ruin the sport.
obviously your tigers losing late is worse for you. that cj kid had a heck of game & almost won it all by himself. it’s a small consolation, but at least you all can be proud of that
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 12:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you watched the replay
the ball landed out of bounds with one second left. Blame instant replay.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 12:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i don't know man
i really think the game was over, but to protect the BCS the refs gave them that second. they didn’t have to, but they did to try & save face.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 1:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought it was over myself until I saw the replay.
I watched it a couple of three times and the ball touched with time on the clock. Nebraska lost that game because of the kicker kicking the ball out of bounds and that horse-collar penalty. If neither of those things happen the game is over.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 1:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well I don't think Texas allows the clock to run off if
they weren’t in position for the field goal. They didn’t really show a sense of urgency after the Shipley catch, and they had a TO. I think Texas might have been able to do it.
(Insert Your Own Joke)
by AWolfAtTheDoor on Dec 6, 2009 5:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They might could have pulled it off.
But I really don’t think so with the way Nebraska was playing D in the second half. The biggie was letting them start out at the 40.And Colt got way too nonchalant on that last play and it almost got away from them.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 10:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They would have gotten away with it too
if it weren’t for those meddling refs.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
or if the railing
the pass first hit out of bounds was maybe a few feet further back. mccoy got extremely lucky with that ball hitting that railing and stopping that clock.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I love a good conspiracy theory...
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 9:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
I heard about that. But I didn’t see it so I don’t really have any opinion.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 3:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
that cj is pretty good
but clemson could have pitched a shutout and he still wasn’t in the heisman discussion.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 1:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He was too.
He was in it until last week. You watch the commercials, he’s in the commercials. He’s second in the fan voting and they get a small vote in it this year. He does everything, not just run, not just catch. Everything. I saw something a stat a couple of weeks ago saying he was nearing Reggie Bush’s record. He’s better than good. He deserves the Heisman and I realize I’m biased but he does. I also think a lot of those other guys deserve it too. I think he deserves to be in the discussion at the very least. He is amazing. He’s been playing hurt all season. I don’t know if you’ve seen him play but I’ve seen him every week for two years and he never ceases to amaze me. Saying he doesn’t deserve to be in the discussion is, I don’t know what it is, and I’m not going to say what I’m thinking because I’m tired and angry and it may not be very nice. Let’s just say I can’t think you have watched him much if you don’t think he deserves to be in the discussion. He almost single-handedly won that game tonight. I didn’t see Mark Ingram singlehandedly win game for Alabama this year. But CJ has done that multiple times this year.
And maybe you didn’t mean to imply he didn’t deserve to be in the discussion but he was in the discussion for a few weeks there. I saw it myself. He’s still in the commercial. I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s one of the 5 at the ceremony. I wouldn’t be surprised if he isn’t either. I would be floored if he won. He doesn’t have a chance to win. But he should be in the discussion.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 4:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
sorry, clemsongirl
i wasn’t referring to any discussion i am having with myself or others, and i did not say he didn’t deserve to be in the discussion – i wasn’t opining at all but stating what i believed to be a fact.
i was talking generally about the names i’ve heard during telecasts of various games. i don’t doubt that he may get some votes down ballot – not sure if the voting is more mvp- or cy-like. but i do not see him in ny with ingram, mccoy, clausen, the stanford rb, cincy qb, the tebow, or suh of nebraska, and they only invite the top 3-5 vote-getters.
i guess i’m just talking about a narrower discussion, and it’s one i really have no interest in. also, i haven’t seen the commercial you mentioned.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 4:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They never mention him in broadcasts except Clemson ones.
But they were having a show a week or so ago talking about all of the candidates and at the time he was in the top 5. If they had one last week and this week, he’s still in it, almost guaranteed. But as it is he gets forgotten because they do vote like they do for the cy and mvp. I know they only invite up to the top 5. But he should be in the top 5 and his team gave him no chance to be there because of how they do vote. He is definitely one of the most underrated players in the game. It’s frustrating to see him get no recognition on a national scale but I guess he really doesn’t care so it’s okay.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 5:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I live in Kansas City
and heard about Spiller a LOT early in the season…not so much later until the past 2 weeks.
by stlfan on Dec 6, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Spiller > Ingram
Yet Ingram will win because of Alabama’s defense saving his ass when he fumbled away a game earlier this year. Spiller has no such luck.
Oh well, I"m sure CJ will be ok with it when he’s a top 5 pick in the draft next year.
He’s the next Chris Johnson, imo.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He'll be fine.
I’m secretly hoping the Rams get him. They need a quarterback though but I don’t think there are any really good ones this year. That is according to my dad and uncles so I don’t really know.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Won't be the Rams
If they’re smart, they’ll take Claussen or Locker, who I think are the two best QB’s in the draft, and I hate Notre Dame, so that tells you how much I think of Claussen.
Jimmy Claussen could be next year’s Matt Ryan, imo.
I have a feeling that Spiller ends up in Tampa, which would be a good spot for him. Pair him up with Josh Freeman, who is going to be a good QB, and they’ll have the makings of a very good offensive unit there.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I knew it was a long shot for him to go there.
I just wanted him to so I didn’t have to add another football team to follow.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sigh, Notre Dame is going to be mediocre next year
Unless we grab a decent coach.
Still praying to god Tate stays, least I realize that Clausen is as good as gone.
I still think Bradford is better than Locker, but I wonder how far he will fall due to injury.
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
by Taskmaster on Dec 6, 2009 6:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
bradford would have been number one
overall (or suh, depending on who gets the pick) but i have no idea how far he will fall – depends on the shoulder.
notre dame isn’t the only college program on tv anymore and it’s cold and recruits are tending to stay closer to home, so i don’t think it will ever be the destination it once was, for players or coaches. they should try to be a top20 program annually, and join the big 10 or east and try to win that.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think Bradford is that good actually
I think that the talent that was around him last year made him look a lot better than he was, and none of those great Oklahoma QB’s (Heupel, White, etc.) have been worth a shit at the next level. Also, spread QB’s really struggle when they get to the league because they can’t read defenses post-snap (Chase Daniel, every Texas Tech QB ever, Colt Brennan, etc.).
I like Locker because he’s tall, has a cannon, and ran pretty much a pro style offense in Washington this year with Sarkisian, who coached at USC when they had Palmer, Leinart, Sanchez, and Cassel. He’s a lot like Ben Roethlesberger actually. Claussen can just flat out play.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not a big claussen guy myself
but it’s a weak draft for qb’s, especially with the bradford situation, so i don’t know where clauseen will go. i think brady quinn made first round, though he was better in college than claussen i think.
locker and snead and bradford (depending on shoulder) probably all go before claussen, and i think the mac qb, leforve or whatever, will get a good look.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 9:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
locker and snead
probably go before any claussen. forget where colt brennan went in draft, but claussen is pretty comparable player.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How are Colt Brennan and Jimmy Claussen related at all?
That makes no fucking sense. One guy ran a spread look against shitty competition, the other ran a pro style offense for a pro coach against some of the best competition in division one and his offense scored a lot of points — it’s just that his team’s defense couldn’t stop anyone.
Claussen is heads and shoulders better than Colt Brennan and if he goes later than the top 15 picks will be a steal for the team that gets him.
Snead hasn’t looked very good at all this year. I think he’s a very good talent, but his regression from last year to this year is a bit scary.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 7, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
don't care about their systems
so much as their size, talent, arm strength, etc. my background is in talent and, like krausse, i think talent is talent – if you can identify it in one sport, you can identify it in another, as he did with basketball and baseball.
i won’t say i have never been wrong, and know alot of people like claussen. also, i ridiculed the sf qb selection of alex smith but one day he could prove me wrong, so there’s always that angle too.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 9:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and it seems ingram
is the next emmit smith, so i guess it’s a matter of which you prefer. i’d rather watch chris johnson run than emmitt, but emmitt (ingram) likely gets picked ahead of johnson (spiller) most every time in an NFL draft.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you only run for 20 yards on Auburn's defense this season
You don’t even deserve first team all-conference
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 8:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
injury
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 9:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Coverup
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 9:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How did Tech cheat?
Don’t know if this is when Illinois was in their tail spin and I had written off all things football and I missed it.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 9:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Second that question...
Run Vince run! There's a tarp chasing you! Run! It's right behind you!
by TBender on Dec 6, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They had a fake field goal and it was against the rules how they did it.
I don’t understand the rules of football but it is a clear cut rule in the rule book that the refs should know and decided not to call.
I can ask my dad to explain it. He gets it better than I do. But he is in St. Louis and I am here.
That was in the first game we played this year.
Last night they did not cheat, our defense just sucked.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
denkinger blowing a call
doesn’t equal the royals cheating.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The Royals didn't break a rule though.
Tech did. If they had got caught they still would have cheated, they just would have been punished. Sorry if I came off as saying the refs stupidity is equivalent to tech cheating. Tech broke a straightforward. They didn’t get caught. I would still say they cheated had they gotten caught but it would have been with a chuckle most likely
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 7:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
what happened?
sounds like you are saying they intentionally pulled something and the refs missed it, which is kind of like getting away with a balk in baseball. unless tech deflated a football or something…i’m not getting this cheating thing. doing something that should be penalized, whether caught or not, isn’t cheating.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 8:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I call breaking a straightforward rule on purpose cheating.
Clearly we have a different definition of cheating. Either that or I am not using the word I’m looking for. I told you that I don’t really know how to explain it. My dad can. He says it’s a stupid rule but it’s laid out perfectly clear in the rule book and so there is no excuse to miss the call or do it.
As for the balk thing I call getting away with something like holding or something like that like a balk.
They did something weird with how they lined up for the fake field goal or something.
GA Tech got extremely lucky that first game and it really bothers me. That is not saying getting lucky is cheating. They did one sketchy thing that I think could be called cheating and at the end of the game they got some lucky calls. That isn’t their fault at all but it still bothers me.
I will say nothing else about this unless you say something else that makes me really upset because I have already almost said a few things I don’t want to. I don’t really know if I want to say this. I am very tired and stressed and upset so I may be oversensitive right now.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 8:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting...
I remember that play. Apparently everyone missed it at the time it happened because the NCAA caught it later:
http://web1.ncaa.org/web_files/rules/football/2009/10-092009PlaySituationsNo.2.pdf
Situation 2 on page 2 of the pdf.
Didn’t realize this was illegal myself. I thought it was up to the defense to pay attention to the number of offensive players. But then, colleges don’t recruit football players for their ability to count.
It was the officials’ fault for not catching the infraction, not Tech’s for committing it. That play was just like watching Pettitte’s move to first. It’s illegal, but it wasn’t called as such.
I don't often comment, but when I do, I only comment on VivaElBirdos.
by TBender on Dec 6, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't watching it.
My dad was and he called it cheating. I trust my dad. Sorry if that’s a crime. I guess I just don’t understand what is called cheating anymore.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 8:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Look
I’m sorry for this whole conversation. I still think doing something illegal deliberately is cheating. Maybe people are saying they didn’t do it deliberately. I also think we may be talking about a different play because my dad was saying something about giving it directly to the kicker nothing about how many people were on the field. Maybe I’m just a stupid girl who doesn’t understand with football which is actually true. So maybe I shouldn’t have gotten into an argument about something my dad said. I just feel a little bit attacked right now and that may be because I’m not in a place right now where I can handle all of this.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 9:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well clemsongirl
hope you cheer up. you obviously have alot more invested in this than i. to me cheating is a very serious charge in sports, there’s a certain honor code, and so i was just trying to get clear what exactly they did.
keep in mind, teams line up in what are called “illegal formations” all the time, and it isn’t deliberate but rather a matter of a player or players screwing/mixing up plays. and sometimes a ref doesn’t catch it because the rules can be very cumbersome, almost arcane.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If it was only an illegal formation and my dad was wrong then that's fine.
And they aren’t cheaters but he was saying something else. Like I said I didn’t see that play. I only saw the second half of that game. Doesn’t change the fact that they got extremely lucky that game and that their fans have shown very little class in my experiences. Obviously not all of their fans are like this but I have been turned off by many of them. And that is really why I don’t like them.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 10:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And like I said somewhere
maybe cheater wasn’t the right word. I did say that right after they won so emotions may have been involved. I don’t know what word it is.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 11:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
their coach is very highly regarded
if there was a cheating allegation against him i think it would be big news, followed by his immediate dismissal by the university if the charge had any merit. having heard nothing like that, i’m a little flummoxed here.
anyway, i wish clemson had won the acc title game and got the bcs bowl bid and the millions that go with it just to make you happy, as i have no college team i really root for, especially anymore – bear bryant came to my hometown to recruit a guy i know who won the outland there and replaced HOF’er hannah in new england and he and i worked out in the summers together so i have sorta liked bama since, by default.
for my buddy bob – roll tide!
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 11:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know their coach is highly regarded.
I’m only repeating what my dad said. I never said anyone in the news was saying anything. Just my dad. Sorry this got out of hand. I clearly have no idea what I’m talking about so I’ll shut up now.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 6, 2009 11:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You assume most of us on here
do know what we’re talking about… big leap of faith. At least if I’m on the other end of the conversation. And I didn’t realize it was Orange Bowl or bust (where bust is Gaylord Hotels Music City Bowl) for you guys last nite… Yikes is all I can say for that.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah but I get to go now.
Last year we played a bigger bowl and weren’t even in the championship. Apparently the Music City Bowl is the highest the ACCCG loser can go, which is terrible in my opinion.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 12:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
According to CBS
here the Music City Bowl is awarded to the 5th, 6th, or 7th place finisher. I guess whatever division they are in was the weak one this year… very weak by the looks of it.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It's the ACC.
In football. It’s always weak.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 12:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This may be true
but whichever division Atlantic or Coastal looks really weak if the winner is at most the 5th best team in a weak conference. I could figure out where they are but am way to lazy to look up actual standings. Also Nashville in December has to be beautiful… enjoy that one. Granted at least you have a bowl game to head off to.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:37 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
GT's division is better than ours.
I think we have Duke and UNC. And Maryland. I’m not 100% sure but I think. They’re all terrible.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 12:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The ACC
has the world’s most ricockulous division break down. Seems to be little rhyme or reason to it. Would North – South have been so damn hard? Or anything that follows some time of logic other than what appears to be names drawn out of a hat.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But it's more fair that way.
Randomness… duh.
I don’t know.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 12:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
some dude named Jefferson Segundo, a pitcher
was just suspended for taking Stanozolol, a PED. he played in the Dominican Summer League. the fish & dbacks also had players suspended. only the dbacks guys played in America.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 5, 2009 8:53 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
tom
your boy fiorentino merited an article on fangraphs – sure you’re aware, but if anyone wants to check it out
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 1:41 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Does Texas still have a claim over TCU for the National Title game?
Looking for objective observers here.
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Dec 6, 2009 4:59 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
they don't need a claim
they essentially have an automatic bid. all the stars aligned for them this year, when they are not even that good. i really would like to see tcu, and think they would beat texas head-to-head, but i think cincy is likely to leapfrog them – not that it matters. clemson losing hurt tcu a bit in the computers, as that was one of their big wins, and then they don’t have a conference championship game like cincy did today.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 5:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Cincy didn't have a championship game
it was a de facto championship game… What I wouldn’t give to have the old Bowl Alliance back.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 9:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
how was it de facto?
if pitt wins they go to bcs bowl instead of cincy. that was millions of dollars at stake there.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 7:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Because you can't have a championship game in name
unless you have 12 teams in the conference. The Big East only has 8 teams. It just so happened Pitt and Cincy playing was to go to the BCS… hence de facto
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so it was a regular season game?
that clears that up – i thought it was a conference champ game. big east has like 16 in basketball, but i know that includes nd who is indy in football and seton hall who doesn’t have a football team that i know of – is louisville not big east in football? it’s very confusing – in comparison, the bcs is crystal clear.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 1:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The BCS football teams are
Louisville, Pitt, West Virginia, Rutgers, Yukon, Cincy, USF, and Syracuse. There should be some rule against having double the number of teams for basketball than you do for football. It’s completely ricockulous.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 1:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
By BCS
I meant BIg East… sorry still a bit punch drunk at the balls of the BCS to put TCU and Boise State in the same game to keep them from embarassing any of the big boys. Honestly… Bowl Alliance… let’s start a letter writing campaign.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 1:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
pissed off too
remember, the last team to beat bama is utah, in whichever bcs bowl game last year. and utah is in same conference as tcu – admittedly, utah was likely more pumped than bama, which had lost the florida game…well, you know. the rationale of the bowl director was tcu-boise matchup because boise is 1000 miles closer to this game whereas cincy is 1000 miles closer to the site of their game – wtf? is everyone traveling by horse?
the whole bowl biz is pretty nefarious. i was going to post for clemsongirl above, but think you joined that conversation, so:
i did some checking, and the reason clemson got a shitty bowl is because the ACC sold them out. the gator bowl is supposed to take the runner-up of ACC championship game, but that game used to be played in jacksonville, which is where the gator bowl is. so the gator committee made a deal with ACC that they needn’t take the loser because they’d then be hosting them consecutively, and less interest second time round – fair enough. problem is, the gator bowl used that agreement even though the fucking acc championship game is no longer played in jacksonville!!
so, the gator bowl wanted 6-6 FSU, which clemson and miami (who also got shafted in this deal) had both beaten, because it would sell the most tickets, being bowden’s last game and pitted against west virginia, where he formerly was coach. one problem: ACC bylaws do not allow a team that finishes two games behind another conference member to go in lieu of that other (shafted) member – in this case both miami and clemson finished at least 2 games ahead, and there were several more 7-5 ACC teams, though i didn’t look at conference standings to see if any finished 2 up on fsu. anyway, the gator informed the acc that their agreement (dated, since the champ game is no longer in jacksonville) overrode any conference bylaws and the acc said simply, “OK.”
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 7, 2009 3:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Bowl games aren't about being fair
They’re about making money. They normally do a very good job of it. And I like the idea of people lining up to go to Jacksonville. From what I’ve heard North Florida and Jacksonville are if not hell on Earth, very close. So they may have a great point about no one wanting to go there consecutively. Granted it’s moot now, but probably found in solid reason at the time.
The whole situation sounds quite similar to the K-State fiasco in the 90s when they lost the at the end of the season and ended up in the Sun Bowl after dominating all year. Only scaled down to a 7-5 team. Oh well like I said I’m an Illinois “football” fan so bowl season really isn’t too stressful for me as far as matchups, ticket procurement, and travel arrangements.
Now for the BCS rant part of this comment :
The thing I love about the BCS is it’s presented that it’s all about making great games when it’s about making the top conferences a bunch of money and it does a really good job at that. When in my opinion it took a lot of fun out of bowl season. At least with the Bowl Alliance you could always debate with your buddies about if Team X wins by 25 and Team Y wins close you have the chance to get past them in the polls and and may be able to back your way in to a National Championship. Even though it would probably never happen, but it made for some fun conversations. Now there’s one game that has any real meaning and a bunch of games that don’t mean squat to anyone since people rarely remember the awesome showing by Penn State to jump from 8th to 4th in the final polls.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 7, 2009 3:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Only because they started ahead of TCU in the polls
Run Vince run! There's a tarp chasing you! Run! It's right behind you!
by TBender on Dec 6, 2009 11:39 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Rec
The problem with college football today…it’s too media-dominated
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 8:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think they do
Even though the Big XII isn’t what it was a year ago. Last year’s Texas team was much better than this year’s Texas team, that’s for sure. That’s me being objective….
Personally, I think TCU is the only team that has a chance of beating Alabama. They can score points, are balanced on offense, have a great coaching staff (and Mack Brown was serially outcoached by Pelini last night), and their defense makes plays. They have as much talent as anyone else out there, and Boise State proved a couple of years ago that these non-BCS school belong in these games because they have the talent to win them and they won’t just get rolled. I was hoping that Texas would lose and that TCU would get in the title game and win. You’d have every BCS conference president SCREAMING BLOODY MURDER if that happened, and we might actually get the fucking playoff we deserve.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 6, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
NO MOAR HANDEGG.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 6, 2009 11:11 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
After seeing this youtube video I feel so much better about the Holiday trade
by CodyG on Dec 6, 2009 11:28 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Meh
None of those pushed him.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 6, 2009 12:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
His arm still looks like crap.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Dec 6, 2009 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
True.
That’s kinda what I meant. Shoulda said so. If any of those had pushed him at all it may have shown that he isn’t much more than a heavy bat. Not that that wouldn’t be useful.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 7, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
Maybe he should switch to second base. heh.
by Mulliganstew on Dec 6, 2009 3:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Errr
That was supposed to be a reply about Wallace.
by Mulliganstew on Dec 6, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but his range would suck
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 6, 2009 3:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Regarding Holliday and greed
I don’t begrudge him anything. We should have went into this with eyes wide open. If he was going to be open to any type of home town discount, I’m pretty sure he’d still be in Colorado. Just to look at it from the opposite perspective, it’s presumptuous on our end if we think 75 or so days in STL means he should turn away millions of dollars.
I can kinda get behind the concept of finding your happiness where you are, but I just think it applies to just about anyone better than it does with Holliday.
by Merry CRasmus on Dec 6, 2009 3:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
bu bu bu but
we applauded him like crazy in the 30 or so home games, and in the post season even after he dropped the ball we cheered him.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 6, 2009 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
to be fair though ,the post season cheers were more sarcastic.
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 6, 2009 3:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i still hope he signs with rockies
as part of a previously-agreed master plan – now that would be a team player.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not sure it is fair to say greed
matty, scott b, dewallet, etc are all competitors. holliday and other top of the line -players can have their cake (high salary) and eat it to (play on a winning team). the guys who are greedy to a fault are guys like jeff weaver and maybe even figgins this year.
I may be in a rut, but at least I know where I'm going
by sportsman on Dec 6, 2009 9:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
where's viva's post today?
there better be a new post, or the cat gets it

pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 6:16 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Sweet jesus
Gdm, are you standing behind that baby?
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
by Taskmaster on Dec 6, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i am that baby
i was 11months old
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 7:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lies
That Graco seat is too recent to be yours.
Now with extra feisty!
by spants on Dec 6, 2009 10:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OK, it was JD
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 11:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I was too bald at that age for that to be me
I also had straight hair up until I hit puberty
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Dec 7, 2009 8:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
i’m starting to get the shakes
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 6, 2009 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
who let the punk
in the cubs diaper into the bacon bin?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 10:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the fuck i did
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 11:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if the Batman says you did, you did
mu ha ha ha
I am the Batman
by CodyG on Dec 6, 2009 11:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ann Margret is moving up my list.
Linda Cohn is #1 but she has competition now.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 6, 2009 6:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
hmmm...no main post today?
ok, silly youtube video time. This video had my abs aching from laughter. I don’t even know why, but it just killed me:
LINK
by mattyp on Dec 6, 2009 7:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
That was fantastic
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
by ducttape16 on Dec 6, 2009 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
DAD GUMMIT!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Dec 7, 2009 11:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
WHOA NELLY!
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Dec 7, 2009 11:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hate the NBA.
Stupid cheating refs and league.
by Tom_Lawless_Bat_Flip on Dec 6, 2009 7:33 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
many frustrations
plowing through this thread. But I will limit myself to shouting out the first one:
who the hell is “mudflap”?
p.s. I really hope Pinata (I think most people know THAT nickname) accepts arby. I have not seen yet where he has said no.
p.s.s. Somebody please ask John Smoltz if he will sign and be a co-closer, set-up guy; if he says no I can put to bed what I think is an excellent idea.
p.s.s.s. If AnKiel needs cab fare out of town, I will be glad to chip in.
by the Tewk on Dec 6, 2009 10:39 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
larue
nickname given to him by one of the pitchers, Springer I think. There’s an article about it over on the P-D website.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Dec 6, 2009 10:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
thanks, scoot
for responding, and for informing me without making me feel like I was an idiot.
by the Tewk on Dec 6, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I have problems with some nicknames too
I think Mudflap is pretty easy though if you think about it. Where do you find mudflaps? Semis. Who on the Cards looks like they drive a big rig in the off season?
Larue. :)
by Mulliganstew on Dec 6, 2009 11:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i don't know if he has a semi, but he does drive big pickups
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Dec 6, 2009 11:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i thought maybe he collected them or something
with all the dirty little trucker sayings – i think of mudflaps generally as removabe tattoos.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Dec 6, 2009 11:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no problem
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
by scoot on Dec 6, 2009 11:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
[hopes against hope there won't be a need to update the glossary]
damn nicknames.
the players do come up with the cheesiest nicknames. the majority of them don’t catch on in VEB.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 7, 2009 12:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I can't NOT root, root, roooot for a smoltz signing
Even though I think there may be better options (unless he signs really cheap and really incentive-laden). I just love the guy too much.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 7, 2009 7:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

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