Sunday Notes
by DanUpBaby on Dec 20, 2009 6:00 AM EST
Email
PrintI'm still out of town, but the Cardinals wait for no man. Some faux bullet points:
Joe Thurston is gone; long live Joe Thurston. I don't think I was more wrong about any one player in 2009 than I was about Joe Thurston, who seemed perfectly positioned to earn too much credit and an undue share of fan appreciation as the speedy, slap-happy utility infielder who got off to a hot start. Glaus's absence and Freese and Barden's ugly starts meant he'd lost his chance at being Skip Schumaker's capable second base foil and had to play, instead--almost from the very beginning--as an overexposed, iron-handed third baseman.
But even that might have worked out for him if he hadn't been, and I don't think I'm exaggerating, here, the worst fast baserunner I've ever seen. How bad was he? In limited time, and despite his four regular season triples, he made one out more than Yadier Molina managed on the basepaths. By all accounts an intelligent, hard-working player, he has somehow been worth -12 bases in his brief Major League career, and even that seems like a conservative account of the trouble he had finding and staying on top of the bases.
Thurston's agent says he wanted to remain a Cardinal, but had to "strike when the iron was hot"; but I don't think it was ever a question. Now he's got a new chance to be a fanbase's favorite Scrappy Hustler, and I, for one, promise not to tell any Braves fans about his surprising limitations. I can only hope that a Braves coach takes him aside, just after position players report, and says: If you stand on those bases, they aren't allowed to tag you out.
As for real third basemen, Scott Rolen will be a Red through 2012. This is an interesting deal on both sides; the Reds open up a little payroll in the short term, reducing his 2010 tab from $11 million to $6, but get $6.5 million years for 2011 and 2012. Rolen will be 37 by the end of the deal, which is a little risky, but even with his power sapped and his shoulder in pieces he's been a valuable commodity.
Honestly, I'm not sure what's in it for him, unless he really likes Cincinnati; coming off his best offensive season since 2006, he already had an $11 million payday due him this year and could have been a free agent in what will presumably be a better market for players. His signing bonus--$5 million, deferred over the life of the contract without interest--means that he's basically signed a two year deal worth $11 million, starting in 2011.
Rolen recently made a surprise appearance near the top of Rob Neyer's list of top 100 players of the decade, fittingly right next to fellow MV3 alum Jim Edmonds. There's a Jack Morris-y aspect to the whole thing, because of course it helps that Rolen began his peak almost exactly at the dawn of the decade, but hopefully Rolen's long, intermittently superb coda won't detract from his brilliant run from 2000-2004, a Hall of Fame peak if there ever was one.
#
Finally, I think it's safe to say that the Cubs lost their trade of organizational headcases with Seattle, and lost it handily; dumping Bradley is one thing, and there is something to be said for trading a guy who the Cubs seem absolutely determined not to play for $6 million of salary relief, which can be used on--well, somebody. But Carlos Silva isn't just a bad pitcher; he's also the guy who whined in public about Ichiro!, the only baseball player whose last name has legally been Microsoft Word search+replaced into an exclamation point and the only bright spot on that last nightmarish Bill Bavasi team, filled to the brim with such luminaries as... Carlos Silva.
Lounging around on a sinking ship, whining at the people who are bailing out water--that is, you'll recall, more or less exactly what got Milton Bradley shipped out of Chicago. And Silva has battled weight problems throughout his career, so he might be even more of a hindrance to their metaphorical seaworthiness.
600 comments
|
1 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I won't mention anything, except to say I'm typing really fast
I really love that Cubs/Seattle trade
Rolen as a Red? ho hum
Just took a look at Neyer's 100
is it just me or is JD Drew at number 22 in-freaking-sane?
check out some (nearly all) of the dudes behind him
Neyer's point
is that if you look at actual performance, rather than what people think a guy did, you get a very different looking list than if you just read the headlines. By statistical measures, Drew was an excellent player for almost the whole decade. He just wasn’t as good as he was touted to be, or as the writers and fans demanded of him.
That said, I still wonder if the problem was that Neyer didn’t know how to spell “David Ortiz,” a name that doesn’t appear on this list at all.
by StanTheManFan on Dec 20, 2009 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
Ortiz...
is #53. I think Neyer skews heavily toward defense, underrated guys, and basically making a splash to generate debate. Not that there’s anything wrong with that…. Still, Polanco over Ortiz is madness on stilts.
MB for LF in 2010!
That was weird.
Not only did I not see him, I ran a text search on the page that didn’t find him either. A stealth player? Anyway, yes, he’s there, but I stand on the point: he shouldn’t be that far below Drew on the list, and probably not below him at all. Some other odd omissions: Luis Gonzalez (people forget what a beast he was for the first half of the decade), Jason Bay (maybe that’s the name Neyer couldn’t spell…), and — as weird as it feels to write this — Jason isringhausen.
by StanTheManFan on Dec 20, 2009 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
There seems to be...
a demerit for roids and DHing, or being immobile in the field. Again, no prob there…
As for Gonzo, he seems like a classic roid-era blip. Was he ever implicated?
MB for LF in 2010!
Being immobile in the field...
I remember one game where he as quite mobile in the field. That has to count for something right?
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
if you use firefox
a recent update caused words in hyperlinks not to be found while searching. IE, searching for a person’s user name in a VEB thread doesn’t work anymore either.
Not sure why they did that, if it was even intentional. Really reduces firefox’s usability, though.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Izzy
I think if you’re listing the top 100 players, it’s not unreasonable (given that their impact is generally kinda over-rated) to only have maybe 3 or 4 closers in there. I’m not convinced that Izzy is even in that conversation, to be honest.
Mariano Rivera is clearly one of the top 100 players of the 2000s, and I’d throw Joe Nathan’s name out there, maybe K-Rod too. Rivera aside, however, it’s hard to think of a closer who’s been dominant for more than 5 years during the decade. Izzy maybe only had 3-4 really excellent years, the rest ranging from decent to pretty bad.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 6:55 AM EST up reply actions
Based on that explanation
and taking a second look at Drew’s numbers, I still don’t see how he was the 22nd best player of the decade. A career 129 OPS+, basically occurring during the given time frame and granting that it is nothing to sneeze at… the 22nd best player of the 00’s?
by Scarecrow7775 on Dec 20, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
yeah
he was good defensively, as well, but he’s still ranked way too high. Especially given the fact that he played the entire decade and was still around 2000 PA’s below other guys who played the same set of years with similar or better numbers.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
OPS will underrate him
Because his OBP was always amazing. His career RC+ is 136, and he’s been an excellent defender as well.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
It's strange that they left #69 blank
Perhaps it was b/c of the sexual connotation.
Testicle-exploding shit storms, to date: T.E.S.S '08, T.E.S.S '09
Never too soon
TNWSS?
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2009 10:42 PM EST up reply actions
I ripped the Rolen thing...
on the last thread, so I should probably give it a rest… But here’s the deal: an extra $5 million for the payroll in 2010 does the Reds no good at all. Volquez is out for most or all of 2010. They have no chance of a playoff birth with or without that extra $5 million
They’re better off trading Harang and Arroyo at the deadline (if not now), then building around Volquez, Cueto, Alonso, and Votto. The Harang, Arroyo, and Rolen contracts were all set to expire after next year. Phillips and Cordero will still be around. The 2011 Reds could be really good, but if Jocketty keeps pulling these pathetic Isaiah Thomas-type, win-now moves they’re going to screw it all up.
MB for LF in 2010!
Rolen to the Reds is a good move for them, but...
paying him $6M a year will not go down well in Cincy once he gets hurt and is out for a while.
Best moment I've ever seen at a Cards game in person
Follow me on Twitter: @zoomzoomj88
Looking forward to Cardinals baseball in 2010!
It's not $6 million...
it’s $8 million. $6 million is his “salary” plus he gets a $5 million “signing bonus” paid out over the length of the contract. I don’t know why they bother with the confusing language, maybe to get the union to sign off on the deal.
They tore up a 1/11 and replaced it with a 3/24.
MB for LF in 2010!
I'd take Rolen for this deal
He’d be a nice fit for us especially if you have doubts about Mr Freeze. He’s cheap and a top 10 3B. Of course this is impossible given TLR issues, but personalities aside, I think this is a nice way to cheaply plug a hole.
Just win
For US is makes sense
For Cincinnati, who has a top prospect coming up at 3B, who are looking to trade one of their better starting pitchers, and who will be missing essentially the ace of their staff for all of 2010, it makes very little sense. They don’t look like they’re planning on competing next year if they’re trading Harang, yet they decrease what they owe Rolen after some of the good free agents have already signed this year by extending him to 3 more years? It’s non-sensical. Yes, he’ll be cheaper, but he’ll also be a lot older and blocking a top prospect, who has the chance to be cheaper and better for a much longer amount of time. They also lose out on the opportunity to let Rolen walk after this season and pick up draft pick compensation for him.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I'd agree with that
and I also think it is interesting that Rolen signed this deal. At the end of the day he seems to want to stay in one place if he can as evidenced by two team friendly deals that he has signed — can’t blame him for that really but undermines the concept that players are willing to give Cards the discount. Reality is that Rolen would have done it for anyone.
Just win
I don't necessarily agree with that
I think Rolen is looking at the market for Adrian Beltre and Pedro Feliz and thinking that he may not be able to get much better than that on the open market. Since his shoulder injury, he’s essentially the same player as Beltre (slightly above average bat, elite defensively), although he hits a bit better for average, while Beltre hits a few more homers and has generally been healthier
Feliz signed for below market, and I willing to bet that Beltre doesn’t get better than what Rolen just signed for, essentially 3Y$24M when he finally signs somewhere, and he’s 4 years younger than Rolen is.
As to the Cardinals and discounts, I don’t think that our great fanbase HURTS us any in negotiations. It’s really hard to determine whether it HELPS us a whole lot at bringing in players under market. I do think that we are able to get in on players that we normally aren’t able to get in on because of the strength of our brand, our club history, and our extremely positive fanbase. I also think that Dave Duncan and Tony LaRussa have a lot to do with us bringing in veteran players — most guys seem to really like playing for them for multiple different reasons.
I don’t think that Penny signs with us without the Cardinal brand of success and Dave Duncan being in St. Louis, and we certainly don’t have a chance at signing him after this season without those things.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Penny was apparently a Cards fan as a child
and has the whole Okie thing going on too, which I guess we have going for us.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 6:58 AM EST up reply actions
Being a Royals fan as a child
sure as hell wouldn’t persuade me to sign there.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Rolen is originally from Indiana, IIRC
so perhaps Cincinnati and St. Louis would be the two “hometown teams” he could sign with. That obviously leaves him with Dusty F. Baker and Walt Jocketty.
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Dec 21, 2009 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
well, it's possible that they don't believe in
Francisco at third base. Which is reasonable, since he has a career obp of .311 in the minors, with 442 K’s to go with 72 BB’s in ~4 years of play, and is likely to end up at first base (he looks a lot like wallace, except shorter).
This deal makes a lot more sense if they are planning on Soto being the man, since he’s a couple of years away.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Actually
I was referring to Todd Frazier, who isn’t going to cut it defensively at SS, but looks to have the bat to play 3B and have plus range there. Now they’ll probably try him out at SS and 2B instead of 3B, with Rolen being signed long term. Not sure if that makes a ton of sense though, since range, not arm, seems to be his problem at SS.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
gotcha
he’s apparently an outfielder now. guess they might move him back to the infield at some point, though.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Yah
I think they’ve moved him to LF, based on what I’ve just seen a couple of different places. Since they don’t seem to have anyone ready to take a corner outfield spot on the current MLB team, that makes a lot of sense. He’s really the only bat they have in the high minors that will be ready to make an impact on the major league club next year.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Well, this stakes the heart of those yearly rumors about Tony La Russa going to Cincinatti.
Now with extra feisty!
by spants on Dec 20, 2009 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
maybe, but they did make up last season. kind of
and Walt’s still the GM down there, so youneverknow. i’m not surprised this happened. since Cass is the owner & Walt is GM, two guys who were part owner & GM of the Cards when Scotty was traded & signed his original deal, they love him a lot. probably more than they should. i dont see this as a biz or baseball move, but a personal one by three friends who want to stay together. is it the right decision? maybe, but it’s also probably maybe too early to tell.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I've heard
they were having trouble making payroll this year—getting Rolen cheaper lets them keep Brandon Phillips, Their Guy.
Maybe helps keep Harang too?
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
why acquire him in the first place, then?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
because jocketty or some other reds decision-maker
thinks they can or must contend soon, and rolen is an above-average third baseman who they were eventually able to sign pretty cheaply through 2012.
Thurston
I knew that when the Cards signed Thurston, it was not going to be pretty. None of us had ever heard of the guy, and he hardly had any experience in the majors (after being with the Red Sox in the minors the year before). I figured he would be our backup 2B, and I didn’t figure he would be a surprisingly good player. I was right on every aspect of ‘he wasn’t a good player’.
I saw him play in Cincinnati on the July 4th weekend, and he made a terrible error right in front of my eyes. I could not believe that he was our starter, even though I knew he wouldn’t be for long after that (because the Cards had just gotten DeRo). I don’t know how the team made it with the Freese-Barden-Thurston tandem while Glaus was out.
In just about every way, I couldn’t imagine how Thursty was in the majors. He was a lot like Juan Encarnacion at the plate – didn’t get hits when it mattered and got hits when there was no one on base. His baserunning decisions were awful most of the time. And, he was not meant to be a third baseman (thank God for the DeRo trade). I, for one, am glad the guy is gone, and I hope the Cards don’t pull something like this again.
Best moment I've ever seen at a Cards game in person
Follow me on Twitter: @zoomzoomj88
Looking forward to Cardinals baseball in 2010!
I feel kinda sorry for the guy.
He was a back-up second baseman who got stuck starting at third base, and everyone hated him because of it. But yeah it was painful watching him.
(Insert Your Own Joke)
by AWolfAtTheDoor on Dec 20, 2009 9:18 AM EST up reply actions
It's hard to "feel sorry"
for a guy who made $400k a year and yet was less than mediocre (MUCH less…) among his peers. I respect the “hustling scrub” demographic, but to feel sorry for him? Nah.
by StanTheManFan on Dec 20, 2009 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
i don't think it's accurate
to say he was “MUCH less” than mediocre. he was right at replacement level. i think that’s a reasonable expectation for a guy making league min. people were too hard on thursty joe
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
whoah there
being played out of position has nothing to do with running into umpteen outs on the base paths, which is what stoked my dislike of him more than anything else
Anytime
you get a base running gaffe award named after you… probably not a good sign for your career. Which brings up the question, are we still giving out Thrustys for boneheaded base running next year or do we have to come up with something else?
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
time will tell
let the memes breathe, I say. you never know what everyone will type out in the heat of the moment.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
Good point
I look forward to seeing what you guys come up with.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
ditto
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Is there a direct link to your list of memes
that are in current or recent use on this site? I’m getting lost in the forest of meme claims.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2009 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
the glossary
contains at least part of them
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
the glossary is not updated from the last couple of months
the forest of memes may get weeded. (for instance almost all of Colby’s memes are suddenly fluid…. I wonder why…) I figure this is a “you had to be there” period, and other than the often-confusing comma meme — which may not even make the final cut anyway… no point unless something is actually happening.
(protip: do a search for “glossary”. i usually leave breadcrumbs behind for myself to compile.)
hardest ones that pertain to discussions:
centiquid / fat beaker = Brad Penny
Albertofstan = a wonderful place
nutshot and dingers … Holliday and McGwire related
link to glossary courtesy of the mods is on the front page.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
and yeah, that needed a few commas.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
(the danger is that once I put it in the glossary...
it becomes a meme, rather than it being a meme to begin with. and IMO it’s not fair for pitchers-and-catchers report members to find the hot stove holdouts have impregnated, deep-fried, mutated, and otherwise attached tentacles to the general parlance.)
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
I blame those stats guys
they have no heart and they don’t care about the true spirit of the game, or 2012
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Centiquid/ fat beaker
Wow, miss a couple of days and I missed out on the newest Card getting his nickname.
After looking at the “Separated at Birth” fanpost, I sort of wanted to start calling him Larry.
by ArkansasTravs on Dec 20, 2009 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
you missed a lot in the last couple of days
there are five posts with lots of new… material. or bacon.
“That was well worth the 45 minutes I just spent on it”
- andi_k
“Awwwwwwww”
- ClemsonGirl
“this is the weirdest thread i’ve ever seen here”
- erik
“I laughed. I cried.”
- Guy in the Truck
“I hate you”
-azruavatar
Start here at the prelude, then keep reading through the days until there’s a scary Star Wars guy and everything turns green.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Yea, I read the Star Wars thread
I even helped out on a couple of the late posts. I guess I need to go back another day or two to find centiquids first appearance. I still like ‘Larry’ Penny though. When he goes out to the mound for the start of each inning we could all post “OK, Larry, get-r-dun!”
by ArkansasTravs on Dec 21, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
can we get a ban here?
temporary only…AT needs to learn a lesson
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
come on, he's down in Arkansas, cut him some slack
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
OK, I promise to NEVER post that
if you’ll forgive my momentary lapse.
by ArkansasTravs on Dec 21, 2009 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
Let's NOT Include....
… Big Fat Sea Cow/Manatee = Carlos Silva. Personally, I like Big, Fat, Blubbery Sea Lion = Carlos Silva…
;=8)
Big McLargehuge!
:=8O
Thursty needs to continue to screw up for a couple more teams
If he can accomplish the same level of gaffe-itry for the Braves and one more team, Mario Mendoza may have to move over. He’got all the raw talent, just needs some PR.
Just win
I hope the Cards don’t pull something like this again.
what? low-risk signings? i hope they do. it’s not mo’s fault that freese hid an injury, mather’s wrists fell off, barden was mediocre and glaus got fat.
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
and how quickly we forget
27th April, 5 doubles, a triple, a stolen base.
Barden and Thurston had a combined line of .364 BA, 3 HR, 17 RBI, 16 R, 10 BB, 13 K. (Yeah i’m stealing from Bleacher Report)
Their April bought us padding for May, and set it all up for June.
Which was why it was such a pisser when Thurston’s “hiccups” turned out to be the norm.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 10:32 AM EST up reply actions
^ by 27th April
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
I do!
I wish I hadn’t gotten so f’in busy right after that. A couple of minutes here and there for VEB (okay, a lot of minutes) are one thing. That one needs an uninterrupted hours. f’in y2.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
this is factually incorrect
He was a lot like Juan Encarnacion at the plate – getting hits when it mattered and not getting hits when there was no one on base.
Fixed.
Both Thursty and Encarnacion were much better hitters with men on base. E had a .722 OPS with bases empty, .802 with men on, and .864 with RISP in 2006. T had a .588 OPS with bases empty, .708 with men on, and .768 with RISP.
Yeah, he was a bad baserunner, and yeah, he was bad defensively.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Try not to overreact.
I knew that when the Cards signed Thurston, it was not going to be pretty.
So, you foretold the future of a player you’d never seen play along with the injury outcomes for three other players (plus another AAAAer’s offensive suckiness) who were ahead of him on the depth chart? Thurston was overexposed, bottom line. He wasn’t meant to be the starting 3B, but that’s the position we were put into and we’re lucky we at least had Thurston to make sure it wasn’t Tyler or Khalil Greene at 3B full time.
Where’s the Ankiel or Chris Duncan hate? Both of them were as bad as Thurston, and we played them by choice rather than necessity.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
i hate them even more!
(not really. i don’t really hate any baseball player.)
(except you, Vance Law. those blintzes were lousy!)
I hate Tim Macarver
I will never forgive him for making the last out of he 68 series
by Macarver hater on Dec 21, 2009 3:12 AM EST up reply actions
is that the only reason you hate him?
I wasn’t around yet, but it seems pretty silly to hate him for making the last out in a world series when the team was down by three anyway, especially when there are much better reasons to hate him.
Of course if this is all sarcasm…carry on.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Not the only reason
but it being the 1st year of my love of the cards, it was the start.
by Macarver hater on Dec 21, 2009 10:05 PM EST up reply actions
Thurston
I knew that when the Cards signed Thurston, it was not going to be pretty. None of us had ever heard of the guy
Speak for yourself. Some people on this blog actually follow minor league baseball, you know. He’d had quite a few good years in AAA and was frequently mooted as a top FAT player after a strong 2008 in Pawtucket.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:00 AM EST up reply actions
and either way
it’s not that hard to look up a player’s stats and make an educated guess
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
A lot of us were actually looking forward to seeing him play.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
SBN'ed!
I was actually quite happy he made the team out of ST.
Didn’t he have a great year in the minors in ‘08? Sometimes you just have to take a chance on those guys. It is not really Thurston’s fault that Mo left him on the roster the whole damn season.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
i don't even know who you are anymore
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Yeah
and, tbh, if he was merely a 2B backup and made an occasional start (or played a couple of innings as a defensive replacement/PH at 3B) he’d have been fine.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 22, 2009 8:37 AM EST up reply actions
keepin him on the roster all season, along with Ankiel
and Craig not getting a shot, might be the only things MO has done that has left me disappointed
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
also
I, for one, am glad the guy is gone, and I hope the Cards don’t pull something like this again.
This is as dumb as a bag of rocks. You hope we never, ever sign a basically free player to be a 3rd-choice backup, whose previous career suggests he may be vaguely productive in that capacity? You’d rather we went out and spent $5m every year on a guy to be a backup 2B and 3rd choice at 3B?
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:04 AM EST up reply actions
Thurston signing with Atlanta
Makes me glad that the Braves AAA affiliate is no longer here in Richmond!
I had a dream last night...
That Strauss twitted we signed Holliday, check the PD site around midnight. Goold later confirmed. 6 Years for 100Mil. With a mutal option for a 7th 10 mil year. I got up this morning and was disappointed when their was no story on the PD site.
Only a few more weeks before pitchers and catchers report correct?
february, i would imagine
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions
McCovey Chronicles had a countdown to opening day thingy on their blog last offseason, but I don't see it now
VEB needs to have one of those, just for peace of mins
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
bcb has it
105 days
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
well fuck
I definitely am not gonna go over there to check it out.
Someone is going to have to keep track of this. I nominate you.
C’mon Dan, get us a thingy!
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
i was actually
posting over there a bit today out of boredom. i introduced them to fangraphs and told al (their danupbaby) in so many words that he’s a moron for thinking bradley plus for silva is a good trade
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
well
his argument was that since eric karros ended up being all right, silva probably would too. and the bradley’s .378 obp wasn’t very good since he had been above .400 before
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
i guess they just wanted bradley gone
they would have taken santa for him and claimed it was a good trade
We have Dan,
You may run like Hayes, but you hit like shit.
by flipthebird on Dec 20, 2009 10:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
They have Al,
Dan ’n Al!
You may run like Hayes, but you hit like shit.
by flipthebird on Dec 20, 2009 10:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
wow.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
so dan's the one to ask for a thingy?
who knew?
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Thats 105 BCB days, those.
VEB days are different. And by different, I mean not reactionary and dumb.
It's clear that Boras thinks
he’s representing Matty Ramirez. There’s still plenty of time in the offseason, but with each passing day the question of when Mo should set a deadline becomes more and more urgent. I really don’t want to end up in the position the dodgers were last year.
they'll need a bigger wig for Matt
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
I had a dream about college football shrines
like some sort of Japanese-style thing, except in school colors. which is weird, because I don’t even follow handegg.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
AAAHHHHHH
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 12:04 PM EST up reply actions
but was it made of bacon?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
mmmmm
Baconburger
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
i'm not telling you all my dream, it was f'ed up to the 9th degree
i’m still trying to put it all together. it was like a mash up of memento, pulp fiction & die hard
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
i don't think so
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
i'd be ok with that deal
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
My mental number is six weeks but I could be a little off
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
By that, I mean when pitchers and catchers report
It’s MLB’s Valentine’s Day present to me
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
bring your price down, Jason Bay...
or it’s to the Apple for you!
[Bill] Madden thinks that Bay’s reluctance to accept the Mets’ four-year, $64MM offer suggests the outfielder is wary of playing in Citi Field for a team that “even with him, looks to be no better than a third-place club.” Newsday’s Ken Davidoff agrees that Citi Field could be a factor, as the Mets pursue Bay and other free agents. Davidoff points out that, statistically, the park doesn’t seem all that bad for hitters, but it’s hard to shake that perception.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Maybe I'm way off base
But how can a park get that bad of a reputation in 1 year? Seems a bit excessive to me. Granted I don’t have millions of dollars and my career to worry about when thinking about this stuff.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
the Mets, on the other hand...
maybe he’s having Pirates flashbacks.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 20, 2009 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
Oh please...
they’ve shown that they’re willing to plunk down over $100M every single year, and sometimes significantly more than that, to win. Comparing them with the Pirates because half their team got hurt last year and their pitching went in the toilet is really unfair.
If the Cardinals had just had Waino and no Carp or Piniero, with Pujols, Ludwick, Schumaker, and Molina all missing time last season, do you think that we win the Central? Maybe, but only because everyone else imploded. Hell, that team might not even win 80 games.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
so you think the Mets will make it past the Braves and the Phillies
in Jason Bay’s lifetime?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Yes
They have the pieces to put it together.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
we're looking at it as objective observers
if Jason Bay only has, say, five more years of career left, and he’s still got hungry fingers, you think he’s gonna wait for the Mets’ dysfunctions to clear up?
you guys are saying you’d take that chance. but it’s not your career. we don’t know how these guys are gonna jump based on the logical projections, or for that matter, what they’ve heard from other players.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
They have a lot of upside
I just don’t see them being as bad as you make them sound
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
well, no, maybe they're not
but I don’t see their off-the-field issues going away any time soon. Jack Z is already with the M’s, yo. if the word around the league is that the Mets have systemic problems from top to bottom, it won’t matter what the pieces are.
like I said, it’s all about perception. maybe we do know better. but this guy is choosing not just his workplace, but where his career might close. he just passed up a golden opportunity to stick with the Sox.
I never said it was smart. I’m saying it’s understandable.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
defense
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
but just in theory
if we were to offer him a deal, you think he’d jump on it even if it was some $ less than the mets?
who knows
i wouldn’t be horribly against signing him for 4/60 if he’d take it.
i’d imagine that philly being stacked for the forseeable future and citifield play into his decision to some extent
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
i'd hurt MO if he signed him
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
can't hurt him more
than waiting on holliday til the last day to watch him sign somewhere else for more money and you have a hole in LF
guess the milk cartons have worked yet
please help us find him, it’s the holiday season!
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
The Braves are one
injury on offense (Jones, McCann) from being a pretty average team.
The Phillies look like a juggarnaut that will score a lot of runs, but then again, who do they really have behind Roy Halladay? Blanton is league average, Happ was pretty lucky in his debut last year and doesn’t profile to be much better than league average (he might actually be worse), Moyer gets his AARP card in a couple of years, and Hamels had a really bad year last year and has become kind of a question mark going into next season.
The Mets, with Bay, could trot out a lineup that looks like this:
Reyes SS
Wright 3B
Beltran CF
Bay LF
Delgado 1B
Francoeur/Murphy RF
FA 2B (Castillo, O-Dog)
Santos/Schneider
P
That’s not a horrible lineup. On the pitching side, they have a true ace in Santana, and a guy who could be a good #2 in Pelfrey….with nothing at all behind that. Their starting pitching is really where they need to improve, but if they added two league average pitchers that wouldn’t be much worse than what Philly will be trotting out there. Say they added Brett Myers and Ben Sheets on one year contracts — that has the potential to be better than the Phillie’s rotation.
Bottom line, they have some good players under contract and have been willing to have a top 5 payroll — you can do a lot with that if you spend money in the right places.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
If I was the Mets I would do a cheap platoon in LF
And reinvest the money into Starting Pitching. Especially a team like theirs. They need high upside guys even if they come with risk. Their is a lot of high risk and high reward starting pitchers out there. Imagine rolling the dice on Bedard AND Sheets. Than imagine they both return to form. Those are the kind of moves the Mets need to make imo.
I still would like the Cardinals to roll the dice on a High Upside starting pitcher myself.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
the mets will sign pienero
i guarantee it
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
ugh pineiro
not pienero
pienero? the midwest’s crazy violin playing emperor?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
pie.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
pinata
Best moment I've ever seen at a Cards game in person
Follow me on Twitter: @zoomzoomj88
Looking forward to Cardinals baseball in 2010!
That could be a good move for them
He’ll roll out there every 5th day for sure, and if he can keep throwing ground balls, they have a good defensive infield when healthy with Reyes and Wright. They would be smart to re-sign Castillo for cheap in that case and probably should have made a move for Nick Johnson at 1B before the Yankees signed him. Although Branyan would be a good move for them at 1B since they need another lefty power bat.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
To me Delgado is still the best available 1B
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
laroche is probably a better fit
younger, better defense, less reliant on the HR, etc.
But yeah, they definitely should have picked up Johnson. Damon would be an interesting option, too, if he could move to first.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
because david pretty boy wright only hit 5 dingers there last season
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Didn't he also play roughly 13 games there?
Or was he one of the few who didn’t get hurt last year?
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
um
he plays for the diamond backs
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
oh wait
reading comprehension fail
nah, i think wright was healthy all season. remember, he was contending for the batting title most of the season
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
If you say so
I follow NL Central teams. I get around to the other teams when the playoffs come around and I realize who I need to worry about.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
that is one ugly helmet
and honestly, i think it would be a tight fit on my big dome
Best moment I've ever seen at a Cards game in person
Follow me on Twitter: @zoomzoomj88
Looking forward to Cardinals baseball in 2010!
he looks like a child!
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
how come there's not an age controversy
does he have to come from Latin America before we find out he’s actually seven going on eight?
/smorgasbord of bad jokes.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
David?
Note: Above comment may contain gratuitous amounts of sarcasm.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Dec 20, 2009 10:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
blame david wright.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:10 AM EST up reply actions
why...
haven’t we been talking about a closer yet????
because Ryan Franklin sucks
Really, the only bad part of bacon is that it makes you thirsty . . . for more bacon
and so it begins
again
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
it never stopped if you ask me, which i'm sure you were going to
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
by gdm426 on Dec 20, 2009 4:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Franklin sucks
literally, not figuratively
Best moment I've ever seen at a Cards game in person
Follow me on Twitter: @zoomzoomj88
Looking forward to Cardinals baseball in 2010!
what does he suck?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
We have a closer (Franklin)
and two other candidates that could close games if they get things figured out (Boggs and Motte), while there are plenty of good candidates out there to bring in and take some closing duties if needed (Springer, Calero, trading for Soriano). We also have a minor leaguer that looked pretty good last year in AA (Sanchez) who could very well be helping in the big leagues by next June or earlier.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I, for one
am not as worried about the bullpen as I am about the hole in LF right now. As soon as Holliday makes up his mind, then Mo will have an idea of how much money, if any, there is left to spend on helping out the bullpen or adding another starter.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Honestly I am not worried about much
The NL Central over all got worst this off season so far. Brewers getting Wolf is the only upgrade I am seeing. The Cubs have gotten 2 to 3 games worst than last year. We actually had more dead weight to get rid than anything. Khalil, Thurston, Wellemeyer, and Ankiel were a negative drag on this team.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
I dunno
- The Cubs were banged up all last year. If they can keep everyone healthy they’ll be better than last year, unless their pitching implodes, and that’s a definite possibility.
- Milwaukee is one league average starter away from being a contender. They will most likely be better on offense than they were last year, because Hart should be better, Weeks will be back, and Escobar will likely be better than what they rolled out there at SS last season. Gomez is a huge downgrade from Cameron and McGeehee probably won’t repeat his 2009, but overall I think they’ll be as good or better.
- Cincy is on the upswing. Bruce and Votto will be better if healthy next year, and Rolen will make them a more consistent offensive club as well as providing good defense. Their rotation is the question, but both Harang and Cueto have shown that they can be really good for stretches, and Arroyo is pretty good if he can put it all together.
- The Pirates are a year or two away.
- The Astros
will suckneed to be shopping Berkman and Oswalt for as many prospects as they can get and starting over.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I agree about the Cubs.
they were much better on paper than they performed last year. regression works both ways.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
but they'll have exactly one position player under 30 next year
old teams getting injured a lot isn’t “bad luck”.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
If Derek Lee & Rameriez are healthy all season
they will be near the top of the division all season….if one or both are out for any period of time…they will be in trouble.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
Agreed
Soriano is just icing on the cake, despite what they’re paying him. With Lee and Ramirez playing well, they’ll be fine, since they have gotten good production out of Theriot and Fukudome both of the last two years. I’m not sure what they were trying it accomplish in the Chad Fox deal, because Fox was a really good player for them last year who can at least plausibly play 1B and 3B which would allow them to give Lee and Ramirez the occasional day off that they desperately need during the season.
Their pitching is what would concern me. They really don’t have a staff ace, and that’s a problem, when your two division opponents both have one, and in the Cardinals case, two ace types. Zambrano just isn’t an ace — I would pick Dempster to start a big game for me over Big Z just about any day of the week.
Their bullpen is also full of guys who pitched well last year and are due for some hard regression, suck completely, or are named Carlos Marmol. They really need Matt Capps, and will probably overpay to get him, despite his fly ball issues that make his peripherals look a lot like, oh, Kevin Gregg, who elicits a stream of swear words when his name is mentioned around any Cub fan.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
If they had actually dealt for Peavy....
I agree with the sentiment about their pitchers, honestly, they have 3 really good #2 guys (Z, Dempster, Lilly) even though Lilly is injured. Wells can improve from his good year, and they at least have Samardizaah(Butchered) and Marshall for the 5 spot. Not a bad situation, but yeah, Peavy would be great for them.
I am actually kind of surprised there is no sentiment for the Cubs to resign Derrek Lee. He was PHENOMENAL when he was healthy, and Cubs fans seem to wait for the day he hits FA.
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
I dunno
My guess is that they’re going to try Silva in the 5th rotation spot, if only because they’re paying him a shitload of money to be a middle reliever otherwise Golden Domer isn’t a fit there, they need to be grooming him as a closer, imo, and Marshall was fucking horrible as a starter last season. Not sure what they plan to do with Gorzellany either — turn him into a LOOGY?
I see Wells regressing HARD to the mean next year, just looking at his tRA for last year. He was lucky on homers and he only struck out around 5.5 per 9 innings. He’s going to end up being a 4th starter and having 4th starter numbers. Which is fine, but it’s going to make every Cub fan want to trade him by mid-June.
I still think they’re going to be pretty good. On paper, they’re probably a 85-88 win club, which is about what the Cardinals will be without Matt Holliday, and what makes signing him so damn important, imo.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Yeah
Wells can certainly go either way. I think that something to consider here is how shitty of a years Dempster and Big Z had with injuries and insanity episodes and whatnot. I can see Wells regressing if they really have to depend on him, but if Z and Dempster pitch to their potential, there is little pressure on Wells himself, and he can continue to develop.
However, you are correct. His HR rate was pretty disturbing, and i expect the Cubs in their god awfulness to put Gorz in the 5 spot.
Sorry to sound like an asshole here, but didn’t you say yesterday that a high K/9 is not required to be a good pitcher :D
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
How did Z and Dempster have shitty years?
by vivaelpujols on Dec 21, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
Injury wise I meant to say
Both mentally and physically. They weren’t worth what they were paid.
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
Putting Gorzellanny in the 5th spot would not be god awful
as he’s probably the 4th or 5th best pitcher that they have.
He is a lot better than Silva.
It would be stupid to make Silva their 5th SP (just because he’s being paid a buttload of money) and relegate Gorz and Marshall to LOOGY/mop-up duty.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 22, 2009 8:39 AM EST up reply actions
Wells can improve from his good year
FWIW I’m not convinced about that. I think he might be a case of a so-so guy from the minors who just hit his major league ceiling very early. Otherwise, I agree they should be OK in the rotation, certainly slightly above average with Lilly, Dumpster and Z.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:26 AM EST up reply actions
well, they got ~8 WAR out of those two last year
Tough to improve much more than a couple of wins on that.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Yeah, I agree about the Brewers
if, as has been reported, they have a few mill left to drop on another innings-eating starter, I think they could be much better this year.
Gallardo looks set to improve again, and obviously Wolf is a big upgrade over Looper. Suppan still sucks, but I can’t see how Manny Parra (who has some talent and was above average in 08) and Dave Bush (who’s been league average for a few years yet fell off a cliff in 09 with injuries and ineffectiveness) can’t possibly be as bad as they were last year. With just a slight rebound from their back-of-rotation guys, they can easily go from having a rotation that put up about 2 wins last year to one that’ll put up 8 or 9. That’ll take some luck, of course, but it’s not totally out of the question.
Obviously replacing Cameron with Gomez is a big downgrade, and I don’t see Escobar providing as much as a healthy Hardy at SS, and McGehee looks unlikely to repeat his breakout year, so their position players will be a bit worse, but I could see their rotation being a LOT better this year.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:24 AM EST up reply actions
Yes
but Hart had a down year and will improve, and Weeks will be an upgrade over what they were starting at second base last year. I think they’ll be just as good, if not better, offensively next season.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
"worst" is still not a comparitive adjective...
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:06 PM EST up reply actions
"comparitive" is still not a word.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:27 AM EST up reply actions
so i'm forgetting a vowel
sue me, i’m on break. blame chrome for not catching it.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 21, 2009 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
point being
if you’re going to be a nit-picky douche and call out peoples’ spelling, expect to be called for it yourself ;-)
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
i know i know i know
but it’s not spelling thing either. he’s misusing the word “worst” when he should be using the word “worse.” that’s not a spelling mistake, as he’s done it numerous times before.
/being a douche
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 21, 2009 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
i think he just sucks at typing
i’m sure he knows the difference between “worse” and “worst.” pretty basic english
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
he was dropped on his head as a child
a lot
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
yeah, it could be a repetitive typing error
I consistently type weird as “wierd”, to the point where I just do it automatically now. I also usually type “Holliday” as “HOlliday” and have to correct it; for some reason, it’s just a word for which I leave caps shift on for a millisecond too long. I don’t do it with any other. Here’s to 6 years of mis-spelling it!
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
+1 for HOlliday
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 21, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed.
The marginal gain in LF and SP is still much bigger than the gain of a guy who might be able to pitch a dozen important games for us next season.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
soriano
already got traded to the rays, no?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
Yes
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I was kinda referring to
the past tense there, I just didn’t make it very obvious
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
i'm just choosing to believe
that motte is on a field somewhere learning a splitter/slider/change hybrid that will revolutionize the “he needs to learn a second pitch” conundrum
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
i for one am praying he learns to throw a knuckleball
He would be unstoppable
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions
better learn to catch it, Yadi! it's comin'. we just know it.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Going from a 98mph fastball to a 60mph knuckler?
That’s so freaking nuts it just might work.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2009 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
Wakefield's fastball is like 58
and that struck a guy out once.
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
That's so slow it'd throw you right out of your shoes.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 20, 2009 7:48 PM EST up reply actions
well for one thing
I got the impression there were a lot of closers looking for not a lot of spots. if we wait, their prices may go down? just hazarding a guess.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
The only decent 'closer' left is Jose Valverde
But he will cost a draft pick. I have heard zero news about him so far. I bet he gets a 2 year/$15M contract or so
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
yeah only news i've heard from him is "overpriced"
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
capps is decent
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
I'd like Capps
but looks like the Cubs are all over him. FWIW, I think Heath Bell is really excellent, but I’m guessing the Padres want the moon on a stick for him and I think he’s only got one cheap year left, so he’s probably not worth going after (realistically, he’s probably a slight -ve regression candidate too).
Calero is VERY clearly the best, cheap candidate IMO, and I wouldn’t be aversed to looking at a cheap year of MacDougall or Springer as a ROOGY-type.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:30 AM EST up reply actions
i think we should push the capps thing, just so the cubs give him a 2y/$12m contract.
My daddy told me, lookin' back, The best friend you'll have is a railroad track So when I was 13 said, I'm rollin' my own, And I'm leavin' Missouri and I'm never comin' home . . . Now I woke me up with a cardinal bird, And when I wanna talk, He hangs on every word. . . And I'm lost at the bottom of the world. - Tom Waits
i like that idea too, but i still want him
and no to any padres closers Monk. have we learned nothing from the all star games?
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I wouldn't want Bell
because they will want serious prospect(s) back in return. He’s a LOT better than any of our relievers, though, and has been consistently awesome for a few years. I would be concerned about his very low HR rate (and how low his HR/FB rate has been in Petco), so I’d expect him to not be quite as good for us, but that’s still going from “one of the top 7 or 8 relievers in baseball” to being merely “very good”. He strikes guys out, doesn’t walk many, and gets a ton of groundballs. What’s not to like?
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 22, 2009 8:43 AM EST up reply actions
i don't trust him away from dog park, i just don't
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Valverde for the league minimum...
he’s barely worth the 25th pick. I’d be all over Capps, Smoltz, Chan Ho… Beyond that it’s just a grab bag of special projects for Dunc.
MB for LF in 2010!
kiko calero
we should do a redux with him
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
I've been saying that I want them to sign Valverde for a couple of months now
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
dave has been saying all off season he wants a vet closer
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
i could have sworn he said last week he'd rather have someone else close
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
From good reporter
"I think that finding that guy that Tony (La Russa) and I both have confidence in that you could use to sepll Franklin whenever there’s a time to do it — whenever he’s being pushed beyond what we think is reasonable limits — to add that guy would be really important to our ballclub, probably equally important to getting an experienced fifth starter,"
* is an Asshat
i hope you're right
but i never read that. ’twould also surprise me greatly
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
listen to this
this interview is what i was talking about. i could have sworn he said he’d rather have someone else closing.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
i will when i get home from work
i promise!
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
when asked if franky was set as the closer, quote
“i don’t think so. what i would really like to have is somebody that we have a lot of confidence in, that can work with franky, and um be able to finish a game off, uh whenever he’s pitched 3 days in a row. and here we got a win sitting there & we push him to pitch another day you know? somebody to help franky out a little bit would be a big plus for us.”
i guess all i heard was him saying no about franky being the closer, not the rest where he danced around & said someone to “help” him close.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
at least
they don’t appear to be willing to izzy the situation
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
read between the lines
I think he’s basically saying “Franklin’s the closer if we don’t get anyone else, so I’m not going to throw him under a bus or say he can’t do it, but I really, really want other options”.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:31 AM EST up reply actions
oh man, this really cracked me up:
If you stand on those bases, they aren’t allowed to tag you out.
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 2:44 PM EST reply actions
If I ever coach Little League...
I’m going to have to use that sometime…
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
watchu guys think lowell?
if boston will eat at least $10MM of his salary (they were going to eat 9 for texas), leaving $2MM to be paid, he’d be good for a bench bat and freese insurance once he recovers from thumb surgery
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
I don't like it
I’d rather wait until the spring and see how his thumb surgery goes. I think, ultimately, Boston just holds onto him.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I don't know.
They seemed to want to deal him already like john said. It depends on Gonzo, and if they happen to grab him(Highly unlikely imo). Ofcourse, they could be very happy with Kotchman himself and just ship Lowell out anway.
My halloween costume: the Indiana secondary iPhone- no matter how much you want to love it, you know the coverage area sucks.
-ChronicHoosier
well
if the surgery goes well and he bounces back, his price rises a lot
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
i was coming to post the same thing
Seems like a low risk move
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 6:09 PM EST up reply actions
yeah
worst case, we’re out $2MM
only thing is, the sox were gonna eat $9MM to get a prospect back (max something. i’m sure i could quickly find out if i just tabbed back over to mlbtr, but whatev) so getting them to eat $10MM for nothing (or essentially nothing: walters?) in return would be tricky
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
heh
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
Max Ramirez
and, although he had a pretty bad 2009, he is in fact a genuine prospect (a catcher who has hit solidly in the minors and who can apparently handle the position defensively). At the very worst, he profiles as a backup guy with starter upside.
I think he’s probably a better prospect than Bryan Anderson, so realistically we’d be out more than just the $2m for Lowell. I guess the fact that the Rangers pulled out due to the injury issue might mean we could get Lowell for less, but I’d have thought Anderson would be the absolute minimum (and they might be keen on someone like Sanchez – just say no).
All in all, I’d be open to it – Lowell profiles as an above-average bat even if he can’t field any more, and if we can’t get Holliday we’re seriously short on those.
The thing to do is probably wait & see if the Adrian Gonzalez deal goes down now or later (it could be, in fact, that they’re waiting to see what happens to Lowell anyhow). If they pick up Gonzo, Lowell has no position whatsoever and so they’d probably basically dump him for nothing.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:35 AM EST up reply actions
The problem
is that if he can’t field anymore there’s no place to play him. I’d rather have Freese’s bat and above average glove than Lowell’s bat and below average glove.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
that's true
however, for $2m, an above-average right-handed bat off the bench probably isn’t a complete waste of money. Even if he only takes, say, 150-odd PAs that would otherwise have gone to, I dunno, Tyler Greene, he’s worth something, and I suppose you’d be gambling on the “upside” that he might rebound a little after injury and still be reasonably productive & able to play the field.
Mind you, his CHONE projection isn’t especially rosey (he’s only barely above average with the bat, and in the field, with slightly reduced playing time) so he’s probably not THAT useful as a PH, but for $2m he’d be a decent gamble, I think (especially if we’re looking at employing someone like Crede, whose value is similar overall but almost entirely glove-based, and who might cost a couple of million more). I’m kinda “meh” about it overall tbh.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
I think we could have Crede for around $2M or less
without giving up a prospect. He’s not Mike Lowell, but he might be Mike Lowell After Thumb Surgery.
Then again, Crede isn’t that much better than Freese is probably, so that would kind of be a redundant signing.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Yeah, that's the way I feel, kinda
I also think Freese’s bat will probably be better (and CHONE seems to agree), as Crede’s has basically fallen off a cliff. Right now, in the event of a Holliday non-signing, I think we’ll need all the runs we can muster (even though a run saved may be just as valuable). If Crede and Freese are more or less interchangeable, value-wise, I’d rather have the cheaper, better-bat guy and spend the cash elsewhere. Still, either signing (Lowell or Crede) wouldn’t be a disaster IMO.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 1:17 PM EST up reply actions
man
that neyer top 100 is such trash. what a waste of a skim-through
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
Agreed
It’s definitely a piece designed to create debate and rile up bloggers, which, of course, is exactly what it’s doing, lol.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
sbn'd
that is really, really sad. she was married with kids.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
in another unrelated story (I'm all over these unrelated stories today)
drugs are bad for your heart!
I'm guessing it was a heart defect.
I bet those other things played a role, though.
Now with extra feisty!
could be
but most people don’t realize just how deadly anorexia is. I remember being completely shocked when I saw its mortality rate – 5-10% over 10 years, maybe as high as 20% over 20 years. I mean, damn….that’s way higher than many forms of cancer, and death usually occurs because of some sort of heart complication
she got way to skiny
i’ll never understand why hollywood forces women to be so skiny. that’s not normal & it’s not at all attractive. men want curves damnit, not skeletons.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Men want curves...
fashion designers don’t…
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
but they don't rep the real world
just because snobs in paris, nyc, miami & la like the crack whore look, doesn’t mean the rest of the world does. women should band together & revolt against them. the world would be a much better place if they did.
come on ladies! if you don’t want to do it for yourselves, then do it for good old gdm.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Don't worry I agree with you.
This just goes to show the herd mentality of humans…
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
Sure, she could gain 10 pounds and look smoking hot in person.
OR
She could stay nearly crack-whore skinny and keep her career.
There’s a lot of pressure.
Now with extra feisty!
well she's dead now, i wonder what she thinks of her decision now?
i’m telling you, if you women start to revolt, they will listen. they’ll have to because all their profits will be gone.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
If you ladies
just grouped together and decided to do things, as opposed to being in some stupid competition with every other woman on the planet. You wouldn’t have to worry about things like losing a career in an effort to be a healthy person.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
I'm not justifying her decision.
Just showing a little empathy.
And as far your comment, sounds like ignorance to me.
Now with extra feisty!
How the hell do all the "ladies"
group together and decide to “do things” as opposed to being in competition with each other? Explain that to me.
Now with extra feisty!
i don't know
but it needs to start with hilary clinton and nancy pelosi.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:39 PM EST up reply actions
did i say anything about their politics?
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:43 PM EST up reply actions
democrats
that even democrats dislike. bound to turn nasty
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
oh come on
what i mentioned them just because of their inspiring womanly leadership?
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:50 PM EST up reply actions
Relax. I didn't flag you or anything.
Is it so wrong that I threw in a “No politics” reminder?
Now with extra feisty!
************************sarcasm
you weren’t in the wrong on any of it.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions
i'm being tough today
getting the correct amount of sleep makes me a smart ass i guess.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:56 PM EST up reply actions
It was just a general statement.
I don’t have a plan of action. My main point of it was women do a lot of things for other women and I think the oddly thin thing is one of those. Kind of like guys who spend way too much time at the gym for the huge muscle look. From the ladies I talk to there’s a certain level that’s acceptable then after that it’s just weird. At that point guys are trying to impress other dudes with how big they can get. It becomes a stupid competition that really has no winners.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
There aren't a lot of women in charge in Hollywood.
These actresses are being told to look a certain way by the men that are in power. And because there are so few interesting female characters in films (which are greenlighted by the men in power), of course there is competition among the actresses.
As far as what you’re talking about, that’s a different phenomenon. And I wish wish wish women got together and “did things.” Perhaps many societal imbalances would be corrected.
Now with extra feisty!
I wish women got together and did things
I’d even help!
by Evilfrog on Dec 20, 2009 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
sitting in the corner & watching them
doesn’t count as helping
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
It has winners in Hollywood and fashion in terms of who gets jobs.
Except for exceptions like Kate Winslet. It is a problem but it has a lot less to do with women and a lot more to do with the men in charge (not all men, mind you).
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
Even Kate Winslet lost weight recently
and all the magazine articles talked about how much better she looked. That’s the way the industry works.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
She's naked in many films,
and I don’t recall ever being able to count her ribs. That’s pretty good for Hollywood.
Now with extra feisty!
That's true.
I mean she lost weight in the last year and a half or so—whenever it was that she went blonde.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
she is probably the first actress to come to mind
when i try to think of a hollywood actress who seems both bright and beautiful.
natalie portman is supposed to be smart. cate blanchett has seemed bright to me, but that could just be the accent. i’m sure there are others.
My daddy told me, lookin' back, The best friend you'll have is a railroad track So when I was 13 said, I'm rollin' my own, And I'm leavin' Missouri and I'm never comin' home . . . Now I woke me up with a cardinal bird, And when I wanna talk, He hangs on every word. . . And I'm lost at the bottom of the world. - Tom Waits
portman is dumber than a box of rocks
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
listen to her talk, 6ly i can't stand her
she’s a good actress, but wow is she dumb
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I am glad I don't read those magazines anymore.
She has always been one of the most beautiful actresses in Hollywood.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
They're an addiction for me,
I love fashion magazines. Except Vogue is seriously pissing me off with its price increases. I’m not paying $28 a year for them to talk down to me. But the photography is so, sooo excellent, and every interesting (to me) fashion trend or item of clothing is in that magazine first.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
OT: Oh! Surprise dinner date at Sycamore!
Catch y’all later tonight
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
I like Teen Vogue as long a I don't read the articles.
I’m probably old enough to switch over to Vogue by now but I know a model who frequently poses in Teen Vogue so I like reading that one.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
I am not ashamed to say I also enjoy reading Teen Vogue
I had a charter subscription for their first three years but I let it run out. I used to be a buyer for a vintage and used clothing store, and it was very useful for knowing what the kids were into.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
i think it involves a kitchen
no i’m just kidding i’m sorry
but this reminds me of that dinosaur. “if a tree in the forest falls and kills a woman….what the fuck is the forest doing in the kitchen?”
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
phew
that was a close one
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
Ummmm
Your secret meetings where you all laugh at the grand conspiracy to drive us insane with illogical relationship thinking and erratic driving?
Duh.
Not afraid to nitpick
When do you guys hold your
Let’s Keep the Patriarchy Strong meetings, and which cliches are you covering next time?
Now with extra feisty!
Mondays and Wednesdays
I lobbied for “borderline crazy-house interest in the mundane daily happenings of celebrities” but got stuck with driving.
Not afraid to nitpick
Well I thought maybe because it has kind of soap opera like qualities.
I don’t know I don’t really watch that show anymore.
I still don’t know what house-interest means.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
crazy-house=insane asylum
As in:
An F-list celebrity was a cheerleader in 2006 ZOMG!!!!!
Not afraid to nitpick
Oh.
I don’t really care. They really are very boring people.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
And that show is highly amusing.
That girl in particular. It’s like a train wreck.
To be clear I don’t regularly watch this show but when it’s on I laugh.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
I feel intelligence being sucked from my brain when that show is on
It gets replaced with hair gel.
Not afraid to nitpick
...Chase Utley?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Just blowin a kiss to all dem haterz
The most douchey thing about them though is that they all have arms that are way too big for their body. Like guys, you aren’t badass for having roided out arms, that just means you have no flexibility.
Not afraid to nitpick
That's true; there is a LOT of pressure. One of the articles touted on the cover of January's Vogue
is about a size 4 model (Lara Stone) getting called “fat” in the industry and having trouble getting jobs because she doesn’t look like she’s dying of starvation—she just looks like she doesn’t enjoy eating.
The infuriating coverline?
When Size 4 Is Too Big: A “Curvy” Model’s Struggle To Fit In
I added the quotes; I don’t believe size 4 is curvy.
But sample size is zero. If you can’t wear size zero, you are out of a job. Plain and simple, nobody wants to hire you if you can’t wear the sample size.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
especially when you consider that, if she's a model, she's probably also 5'10" or better
a size 4 woman who is 5’2" is a reasonable size. a size 4 woman who is 5’10" is very slender.
My daddy told me, lookin' back, The best friend you'll have is a railroad track So when I was 13 said, I'm rollin' my own, And I'm leavin' Missouri and I'm never comin' home . . . Now I woke me up with a cardinal bird, And when I wanna talk, He hangs on every word. . . And I'm lost at the bottom of the world. - Tom Waits
still at the speculation stage
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
i'm shocked, i always liked her
her mom found her in the shower, how awful. right before xmas too, so very sad. she’s my age, i can’t even imagine taking a shower & the next second you’re in the afterlife. HFS®.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
They say it comes in 3's yes?
First Oral Roberts
Then Chris Henry
Now Brittany Murphy
Note: Above comment may contain gratuitous amounts of sarcasm.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Dec 20, 2009 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
she's the 4th actually, Jennifer Jones died the other day
i don’t remember her name, but she won an oscar for her role in The Song of Bernadette
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
If ya wanna get down to brass tacks... 5th
Roy E Disney…Walt Disney’s nephew….died on the 16th
Note: Above comment may contain gratuitous amounts of sarcasm.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
Also,
Marcos Arturo Beltrå -Leyva on the 16th.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
at least he got #1 right.
it wouldn’t have surprised me at all to see Derek Jeter™ or A-Rod up there.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
Why?
He basically just used WAR, with adjustments for playoff performance and other things – I don’t see the problem with that.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
Very interesting...
tramp stamp. 6ly why the hell would someone do that?
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
Hardee's has Bacon Cheddar Fries? that's it, i'm a fatty for life
and yes that tramp stamp is an odd choice, although i love her dedication.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
i give up, God wants me to be a fatty
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
when i'm dead in three years, just leave me here in the basement
i’ll be to big to get out of the door, but at least i’ll be filled with cheesy bacon goodness. i’d rather be filed with love, but that’s life
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I don't know why she would do that
but I think I love her.
I will have to find her, or a reasonable facsimile thereof.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
WTF SBN?
it’s stopped live updating for me, WTF?
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Someone forgot to pay the bill?
Wait I don’t think that works.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
firefox says it's still getting date from api.facebook.com whatever the f that is
i guess that’s why i have to keep refreshing the page to see the new comments
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
did you end up at the rams game today?
if you did, it wasn’t the worst thing in the world, was it?
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
No never got the call
Apparently the other person ended up going.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
awwww, so you missed the half full party.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:09 PM EST up reply actions
Party and Rams
are two words that should probably not be put together.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
sigh
i miss good football in STL.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
No one has mentioned #77
on Neyer’s list. This is the guy we want to pay $16 mil a year to? #77 on the list of top 100 players of the decade? I bet we could get this guy for less. At least he’s in the top five.
/jk
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2009 5:13 PM EST reply actions
matt holliday wasn't that good until 2005 or so.
/too lazy to look up actual year
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Yup
and we could trade Wainwright for Roger Clemens too, right?
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Why would we have to trade?
He’s a FA, is he not???? Just tell him that there would be two other ‘roided guys who deny the ’roids (Bonds and McGwire) on the team in some capacity, and the 3 of them could hang together….man’roid stew, anyone?
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2009 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
My point was
that I would bet a 29 year old Matt Holliday will be better than a 46 year old Barry Bonds, and that a 28 year old Adam Wainwright will be better than a 48 year old Roger Clemens.
I was being sarcastic in response to your sarcasm….
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
you would rather have a 46-year-old barry bonds who hasn't played in two years than matt holliday.
all right.
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:37 PM EST up reply actions
Roids or No Roids?
With Roids I’d have to think about it……….lol
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
i think you've lost it.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 11:39 PM EST up reply actions
He's forgotten
that the NL doesn’t have a DH.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
i guess
can anyone imagine bonds in left field?
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 11:48 PM EST up reply actions
only if he can have a segway
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
would that count as steroids?
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
only if they can prove it
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
He's tanned, rested and ready
I’m sure.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 3:36 AM EST up reply actions
little would surprise me
i was waiting for you bust out something like the local maxima of marginal tARKS positive correlation with age that increases exponentially after age 43 or something
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
he's a lot cheaper that's for damn sure
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I wouldn't even kid about trading Waino, esp. for Clemens
My equally sarcastic point was that we wouldn’t need to trade for Rocket…just show him a little bit of jack, and the chance to “redeem” his career with a few outings, along with Mac and Barroid….ya never know.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 3:40 AM EST up reply actions
why is there a trojan add at the top of the page?
don’t they know us basement dwellers don’t have the sex?
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
suit yourself, dad ;)
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 5:18 PM EST up reply actions
this is not a choice i'm willing making
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
They probably do a lot of business...
with the mind set of I’m going to need some of those when I get laid… which should be happening any day now. Better stock up.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
I made some good money as a 5th grader
selling condoms to other 5th graders, for like a buck apiece.
I’m probably responsible for a rash of high school pregnancies when those things finally got used 6 years later.
But by then
you were selling oregano to nerds who didn’t know better… Gotta stay one step ahead.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
is anyone else having problems with SBN using firefox today?
the page won’t finish loading & it still won’t live update the comments. i’m just wondering if it’s me or should i send off an email that’s all
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
fine here
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
i switched to the laptop & it seems fine
weird
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
clear yo cache, dawg
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
will do
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
bring your luggage before you click, HFS ®
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
y'know, as long as people don't figure out
that Boog counts as ¼ of a pitcher, I’m cool with all that.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
why wouldn't you pitch for contact
with APu, Boog, Colby and Schu behind you
“what separates a good pitcher from a great pitcher” my ass…
yeah, clearly 'e missed where Carp consciously changed his approach
maybe it was the terror
Unless it’s a certain situation late when you can lose the game or change the game I’m going to come after you. I’m not wasting pitches. I’m trying to get strike one, strike two, strike three as fast as I can, or get you to put the ball in play and let my guys work behind me. When you do that it puts (the defense) on the offensive. You’ve got to make a decision what you’re going to do. That’s when it gets fun.
→ compiled
I mean, come on.
According to Gameday, a few of his pinpoint strikes were being called balls and just to make the Ump’s tightzone happy, he moved them in about 1/8 quarter inch [sic] each pitch thereafter. That poor bastard on the other side appeared to receive the same treatment; so long as it’s uniform can’t complain too much. Those 3 weeks(?) on the DL are fading away from a statistical perspective and as PapaDunc mentioned while in Cleveland, of all his Cy Young hurlers, he’d take Carp as the Complete Deal. Me too.→ http://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2009/8/23/999354/dominant#20101597
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
What separates a good pitcher like Carpenter (6.8 career K/9 ratio) from a great one like Tim Lincecum (10.2) is his ability to strike out opposing hitters (or lack thereof). For whatever reason, Carpenter is a contact pitcher—he lets batters hit the ball and hopes they don’t score.
Could basically the same not be said of Roy Halladay, 2nd best pitcher in all of baseball??
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:41 AM EST up reply actions
there should be a comma in there somewhere
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Dec 20, 2009 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
his muscles are reportedly being ex-SWAT trained for second base
we’ll ask the robot for a verdict come ST
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:40 AM EST up reply actions
nah, just a general warning before clicking the link
got to pack before a trip… one might want to luggage something
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Besides Chris Carpenter.
Who happens to be an expert on all things Chris Carpenter.
by Mister Eff on Dec 20, 2009 6:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Chris Eff Carpenter
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
that's probably missing a comma.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Chris, How Dare You F'ing Question Me, I'll F'ing, Luggage Your Ass Biatch, Carptenter
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I was expecting a 2.32
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 8:57 PM EST up reply actions
I thought it would be about
That this recent DWI by Freese is actually his second DWI.
by FlimtotheFlam on Dec 20, 2009 6:50 PM EST up reply actions
Carp needs to get his ERA under Freese's BAC.
by Mister Eff on Dec 20, 2009 6:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
bets on how long it take
for “freese not hitting over his bac jokes”
i say may
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
move the end quotation back a word
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
This will get the locals riled up...
What separates a good pitcher like Carpenter (6.8 career K/9 ratio) from a great one like Tim Lincecum (10.2) is his ability to strike out opposing hitters (or lack thereof). For whatever reason, Carpenter is a contact pitcher
MB for LF in 2010!
He would be better if he struck more guys out.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
he'd be better than he is now
if he struck more guys out. he’s still a great pitcher which is all gayzimi was saying
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
I saw what u did there
leaving out the “u”.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2009 8:43 PM EST up reply actions
heh
jus playin’ guay!
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
or if he walked fewer people, or if he gave up less home runs.
Even if you accept the FIP assumptions, that sentence is a ridiculous oversimplification.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Correct
However, Carp’s biggest “problem” is a below average strikeout rate – that’s the biggest thing to improve upon.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 9:06 PM EST up reply actions
Could he substantially improve his K rate whilst maintaining a GB rate well above 50% though?
if he’s trading GBs for Ks he need to be winning that trade. One more K/9 in exchange for 5-10% of his GB rate probably isn’t a winning proposition.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:44 AM EST up reply actions
flying = auto Gold Glove?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:40 AM EST up reply actions
So was Greg Maddux
He seemed to do ok.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 20, 2009 8:49 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
for whatever reason, hahaha.
well, hopefully somewhere Carp is slowly growing enraged.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Duncan'd
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 8:58 PM EST up reply actions
How is that crap?
That article is spot on…
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 7:42 PM EST up reply actions
it's crap only because he makes it seem you can not be a great pitcher unless you are a high strikeout guy
which is a bunch of bullshit, and I even like high strikeout guys.
But anyone looking for him and Wainwright to repeat as baseball’s best top-of-the-rotation tandem will be disappointed.
That line is also flawed. He might think it won’t happen again, and there is a good chance it probably wont, but a simple changing of “will be disappointed” to “probably will be disappointed” would make a hell of a difference. I love all this statistical analysis, but you have to admit that sometimes some people get a bit arrogant in their opinions.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
...
What he said was true about Carp (and the same thing holds true for Wainwright – as does all pitches coming off of really, really good years). There is small chance that Waino/Carp are actually as good or better than they were last year, in terms of true talent level.
He definitely should have said probably, you’re right.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
It's not completely crap
But’s it’s awfully arrogant to state that you can’t be successful striking out just under 7 hitters per 9 innings when some very good pitchers have done just that for their entire careers.
Greg Maddux Career K/9: 6.04 — he had only two seasons over 7 his entire career.
Chris Carpenter Career K/9: 6.84 — he’s had three seasons above 7 in his career.
Andy Pettitte Career K/9: 6.61 — 4 seasons above 7 K/9, one above 8.
Carpenter’s 2009 was a very Maddux-eque season. Walk rate below 2.00, strikeout rate a bit under 7.00. Maddux’s career BABIP was around .290, which is around 10 points below league average for the whole of his career. Carpenter’s is right at league average for his career, and that includes some bad seasons up front. In his Cardinal career, his BABIP is about .285. It’s not lucky if you repeat it for multiple seasons. It’s statistically relevant in that you induce a lot of poor contact, which leads to outs. It’s also a skill to have a low BB/9 (below 2.0 or better), and Carp has allowed very few free passes since joining the Cardinals, having 4 of 5 seasons below that 2.0 mark. Looking at K/BB, Carpenter stacks up pretty well, trailing Lincecum 3.84 to 3.79.
So Carpenter may not be as good as he was last year, but if you regress him to .285 and not .301, that’s a whole lot better than the author gives him credit for, and also probably more likely.
Then there’s this gem:
In addition to being lucky about balls landing where fielders could catch them, Carpenter was quite fortunate with the types of balls that were hit as well. Throughout his career, opposing batters have earned a 1.789 OPS against Carpenter when they hit line drives off of him.
Well golly fucking gee, Lewis, can you show me a pitcher who can induce guys to hit line drives right at people? Notice he doesn’t give any data about what “league average” OPS on line drives is, which I’m sure is ridiculously high, since BABIP on line drives is probably around .450 or better. This statement alone shows that he’s kinda full of crap. Inducing ground balls and poor contact, if repeated over a large range of PA’s as Carpenter has, is a repeatable skill. It’s called “knowing how to pitch”. He’s completely ignoring this fact here, and you’re better than that VEP.
Carp’s injury history is sordid, which is not something any of us here takes lightly. But he’s a very good pitcher when healthy. He’s not Tim Lincecum, who’s the best pitcher in baseball, but he’s still more than likely to be a #1 starter when healthy.
If the author is so concerned about K rate, they why is he busting Wainwright’s balls? He struck out over 8 hitters per 9 last year, which would put him in the top 15 in the NL in K-rate and K/BB. Smells like a Cubs fan with sour grapes to me….
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 20, 2009 9:18 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
FWIW
Wainwright’s BABIP last year was .309, which is above league average. So does Mr. Pollis regress him to league average, which would indicate that Adam will be better in 2010 by Lewis’ own polished analysis? You can’t have it both ways, Lewis.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I hope your being sarcastic Fourstick
Players regress when they have good years, simply due to sampling errors.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 9:43 PM EST up reply actions
Of course I am....
but I also thinks it makes a pretty good point that BABIP and K rate don’t tell the whole story, as Lewis seems to be implying in his piece.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
BABIP on Line Drives
finally found some info on BABIP for Line Drives. League average is .710. Seven fucking ten.
I couldn’t find league average OPS on line drives, but if hitters hit .710 on line drives, and line drive probably account for a good percentage of doubles, that league average OPS is going to be over 1.500, making the 1.789 look pretty good, if not below average.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
how do you not know about baseball reference ;)
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 9:41 PM EST up reply actions
Damn
I was trying to use the little play finder tool thingy and I couldn’t get it to spit out the data I was looking for so I gave up. Didn’t even think to look at the league totals section.
That said, Carp is a little below league average on line drives, a point the Lewis should have pointed out in his article. Of course, if he pointed out that league average OPS on line drives is 1.706, why bring it up at all? That’s a pretty damning example of cherry picking stats that reflect your point, but don’t tell the whole story.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
baseballreference needs some help with layout
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 10:09 PM EST up reply actions
No...
I’m just an idiot for not thinking to look there. I’ve been to that page before, just a total brain fart on my part.
I think their site is much more intuitive than FanGraphs, where I can’t link to a player’s splits from the player page, but I can look at their monthly splits by drilling down from the team page. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I find it a little hard to navigate myself
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
Aren't you in web-design or something?
perhaps you could help….lol
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
my web design skills were taught in '98
and I never really liked it that much. I’m more of a photoshop guy/fine artist
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, i hate it
because it’s so hard to find data. and usually when you do find it, you have be a subscriber to see it
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:29 PM EST up reply actions
...
But’s it’s awfully arrogant to state that you can’t be successful striking out just under 7 hitters per 9 innings when some very good pitchers have done just that for their entire careers.
Did he (I) say that? His article said that A) Carpenter would regress from last year’s 2.24 ERA, and B) Carpenter isn’t as good as Lincecum, mainly because he doesn’t strike out as many guys. Both of those things are 100% true.
Carpenter’s is right at league average for his career, and that includes some bad seasons up front. In his Cardinal career, his BABIP is about .285…So Carpenter may not be as good as he was last year, but if you regress him to .285 and not .301, that’s a whole lot better than the author gives him credit for, and also probably more likely.
Fourstick, and I can’t find a link so you’ll have to just trust me on this one, BABIP takes about a half a career to tell you anything meaningful about a pitchers’ skill. It has so, so, so, so, sooooo much noise in it, that even if Carp had put up a ~.285 BABIP for his last 3 full seasons, that really doesn’t mean much – you would still have to regress heavily to the mean. You also have to remember that Carp has played on some pretty good defensive teams with the Cardinals.
So Carp’s true BABIP skill going forward is probably something like .295 – it’s almost assuredly not .285.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 9:38 PM EST up reply actions
OK
In his four full seasons as a Blue Jay: BABIP ~.310
In his four full seasons as a Cardinal: BABIP ~.285
I think that’s pretty good evidence that he’s doing something differently. I mean 4 full seasons in a row that are much better than league average seems like pretty good evidence, but again, I’m not sure how it correlates. On the other hand, how does the pitchers returning all the way to league average from .030 points better than league average correlate, because that’s what he’s saying.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Sorry...info was taken from FanGraphs
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
You're not listening to me Fourstick
I was saying that the 4 seasons don’t mean what you think they do. Carpenter has allowed a .285 BABIP in his last 4 full years – that means that his true BABIP skill going forward is probably .295 or maybe a little higher.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:04 PM EST up reply actions
why does that have to be true?
sorry to jump in here, and maybe I’m being naive, but couldn’t the answer simply be – as fourstick alludes to – that Carpenter became a different and better pitcher with the Cardinals? I mean, that much is pretty obvious. applying Duncan’s pitch to contact philosophy, with generally great defense behind him, couldn’t it be true that he will now be a pitcher whose BABIP is closer to .285 than .310? I’m sure I’m missing something, but it doesn’t make sense to me that it has to be somewhere in the middle going forward, if he’s changed his pitching technique since becoming a Cardinal.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
Ah, I see the disconnect
that Carpenter became a different and better pitcher with the Cardinals?
That’s entirely possible – and probably very likely. What I am trying to say, is you can’t really make that determination strictly off of his BABIP. BABIP is a stat with a lot of noise in it – meaning it can be effected pretty heavily by things that are out of a pitchers control. Studies have shown that BABIP takes a long, long time to “stabilize”, like 6-7 years. By stabilize, I mean the point at which it tells you more about the pitchers skill than noise.
What I am trying to say is that the fact that Carpenter has put up a .285 BABIP over the past 4 years, isn’t really that meaningful. It’s possible that he really is a .285 BABIP pitcher, but you can’t tell from simply looking at his BABIP.
Got it?
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, I get it - thanks.
but assuming what you are saying is true, its not really correct to say his “true” BABIP going forward is closer to .295. the truth is, we don’t know what his BABIP going forward is or will be. the huge discrepancy between his toronto years and his STL years suggests that it hasn’t “stabilized” yet.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
Right
But if you are going to use the Stl. BABIP as a reason to say his BABIP will be lower, than you also have to regress heavily to the mean.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I don't believe that Carpenter isn't better at BABIP than average
Right now, doing a pure stats projection, Carps at around a .295 BABIP. If he puts up a .275 the next 3 years, it should drop to about .285.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
the thing I don't like about articles like this one
Which pretty much states that from a pure stats projection he’ll regress. Is that it really doesn’t take an account the pitcher. Yes if you have a 100 stat lines like Carpenter’s put money on most of them heading back towards league average.
But I don’t believe you can state that Carpenter will regress to league average just because of luck. If someone were to tell me they watched every pitch Carpenter throw this year. They noted the situation. They noted the pitch selection. They noted the pitch execution, (hitting his location, pitch break, etc), they noted how well the batter appeared to pick up on the ball, how comfortable the batter looked, and finally they noted the result of the pitch and the At Bat. And then that person were to tell me that they believe Carpenter’s BABip was nothing but luck I would have to believe them.
Now then, I did not watch every pitch Carpenter threw this year. But I would venture to guess I seen about 60% of them while listening Mike Shannon babble about 30% of them. And I seen a pitcher who was a head in the count. Pitching quickly to keep the batters of balanced. Had betters guess at the pitch. Had batters swing at pitches out of the zone and causing all kind of pitching mischief which I believe bigger reason for the low BABip than luck.
He also was about to K 42% of batters once he had them at 2 strikes. League average (including relievers) is 38%. This tells me that Carpenter can and will strike out batters when the opportunity percents itself. I also hat it when people take points away from pitchers because they don’t approach every PA with the mindset of getting the strikeout.
Which pretty much states that from a pure stats projection he’ll regress. Is that it really doesn’t take an account the pitcher.
Aside from being preposterous, this argument also doesn’t take into account Carp’s long and varied injury history. Chris Carpenter is very likely to regress, simply because of his BABIP luck, but he’s also likely to regress because there’s a one in three chance he has a big injury.
And then that person were to tell me that they believe Carpenter’s BABip was nothing but luck I would have to believe them.
Greg Maddux, the best clean pitcher in history, a guy who was so good that batters said he was reading their minds, had a career BABIP of .289 over 5000 innings. If he were pitching in his prime mid-nineties form today, we would STILL regress his BABIP toward the mean to create an accurate projection of his future performance. BABIP is simply not tied closely enough to a pitcher’s skill for us to assume that a pitcher can repeat a performance that is so far above average.
As fourstick says below,
had he regressed it to a probability plot, giving a low, median, and high range for his predictive BABIP that would have been more correct and still illustrated his point,
By regressing, you don’t simply assume a pitcher will go from a .267 BABIP (Maddux in his prime) all the way back up to .300, but you do assume it will rise, because luck dictates that it most likely will thanks to the lack of control that a pitcher has over balls in play.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Dec 21, 2009 5:48 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No
I heard you, you’re not hearing me apparently.
You can’t say that .295 or higher is absolutely true. Just like I can’t say that .285 is absolutely true. The evidence does seem to point to the fact that he’s been much better with balls in play since coming to the Cardinals though, and you can’t just ignore that and throw it out.
This is why I don’t like arguments like this when they attempt to be absolute or make a “certain” prediction about the future, which is why I felt like tearing this analysis a new one on what I believe to be pessimistic assumptions on the part of the author.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
No YOU'RE not hearing me ;)
Look above in my reply to IHeartBoog – I hope that clears things up.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with that
I think you are under the impression that I’m arguing with you. I’m not, my beef is with the author for doing a shitty job of proving his point and cherry picking stats to illustrate a conclusion that he’s already arrived at. These are the type of people who give WAR and other sabermetric stats a really bad name.
It’s possible that he really is a .285 BABIP pitcher, but you can’t tell from simply looking at his BABIP.
Right, you also can’t say that he’s NOT a .275 BABIP pitcher by just looking at BABIP, or that he’s a .300 BABIP pitcher by just looking at BABIP, like the author assumes.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Well that's the mean assumption
And it’s more correct to regress to that.
So yes, he should have said it’s more likely that he will have a .300 BABIP next year than a .275 BABIP.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:49 PM EST up reply actions
Right
had he regressed it to a probability plot, giving a low, median, and high range for his predictive BABIP that would have been more correct and still illustrated his point, although not as consistently as he would have liked probably.
Like I said, I think this is lazy analysis and was done to come up with a statistical reasoning that illustrates a preconceived position.
“Chris Carpenter had a better than average BABIP last season, therefore he will be a worse pitcher next season, and here’s now much worse”
That’s illogical reasoning and lazy analysis. I think we can both agree on that.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
So we're clear
I’m not saying Carpenter isn’t a likely candidate for regression, just that the author in this case is cherry-picking stats that I can refute in a post half as long, simply by pointing out that other pitchers have been successful doing the same things he’s saying aren’t repeatable over the course of their entire careers.
It’s likely that he will regress, probably 75-80% chance of that. But that doesn’t make it a sure thing.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
The article was arrogant, and contatined a lot of "FanGraphs" misconceptions, as I like to call them
He’s still correct in his thesis.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:05 PM EST up reply actions
If he'd right a similar article about
how Carp has an amazing ability of forcing groundballs to the left side of the infield with runners on second, I think we’d all be supportive of the author saying “that being said, he is bound to regress from being the best pitcher in baeball” since, well, he will since that is what people do. We regress.
But he sweeps away the accomplishments Carp has made by saying he’s lucky since he doesn’t strike out as many guys as one of the best strikeout pitchers in the league.
Carp’s not lucky, he’s a pitcher. He induces ground balls when he needs to. He gets double plays when he’s up 5-1 to the Pirates in the sixth inning of a random June game and he strikes out a guy with the bases loaded in the seventh during a 2-1 game in August.
On his best days, he does what he wants, he dictates the tempo of the game, and he gets motherfuckers out. On his worst days, he just gets motherfuckers out. Kind of like Lincecum.
I don’t need an article telling me Chris Carpenter won’t be good in the future. In fact, I don’t really need anymore internet journalism telling me how everything sucks. It’s been done before, better.
I’d rather just enjoy shit and go on my way.
by Mister Eff on Dec 20, 2009 10:18 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
And, yes, it should say write.
boner.
by Mister Eff on Dec 20, 2009 10:18 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
rec'd
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I agree with everything said here.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
fourstick, i wish i had half the talent you do in expressing your opinion in a concise, well written manner
rec’d.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
+1
Even if he does piss some people off. I’m less opinionated than some people, but probably not less than most, and most of the time, I think 4pieceofwood should be one of the mods here. Then there are days when I want to beat his head in. Today is not one of those days.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 3:49 AM EST up reply actions
lol
Well golly fucking gee, Lewis,
amazing that players get good results when they strike the ball well, huh?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
Yes
as noted later in the thread, the BABIP for line drives in 2009 was .710, and the OPS on line drives was 1.706. So including that piece of analysis made him look like a guy grasping for straws.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
yeah, i read
just felt like it was worth another mention
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:38 PM EST up reply actions
yah
I’m also pretty sure the .060-odd difference in OPS from the league average is nowhere near statistically significant. That’s like a couple of extra singles over the course of the whole season.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:51 AM EST up reply actions
Something tells me
that Chris Carpenter would have no problem hitting someone named “Lewis” with a large, hard-sided suitcase.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
by fourstick on Dec 20, 2009 8:48 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
or striking him out
and there’s pretty much no chance this guy would get a hit off of him, no matter how “lucky” he is.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
he's not that lucky
Carp takes care of business in broad daylight in front of thousands of people
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
i get the feeling carp could strike out more batters if he wanted to
but he would give up more hits in the process…its a tradeoff he has made in order to be a dominant pitcher
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
...
i get the feeling carp could strike out more batters if he wanted to
but he would give up more hits in the process
That’s not true. Strikeouts are directly correlated to hits allowed – meaning the more strike outs you get, the less hits you allow. That’s why they are considered so important.
Now, his walk rate would probably suffer if he struck out more batters, but not his hits.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
Probably true
I would also think that he’s probably not going to go as deep into games, as most strikeout pitchers rack up some pretty serious pitch counts from time to time, due to a higher walk rate.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I'm pretty sure that's been debunked actually
Guys who strike out more allow fewer hits, so they will face fewer batters thus lowering their pitch counts. David Gassko had a nice article about this for THT, but I can’t find it now.
At any rate, using Pitch f/x from 2007-2009, I find a slightly negative slope for a linear regression of krate on pitches – meaning the more guys you strike out, the fewer pitches you’ll throw. The correlation was of course 0.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:46 PM EST up reply actions
Actually, when I run the regression on aggregate totals by pitcher from 2007-2009
The slope is slightly positive, meaning more k’s = more pitches. The r2 is still .03.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
Would this be due
to more hitters working counts as OBP becomes more important? Or just more high pitch, high K pitchers in the league?
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I'm not really sure what you mean
The difference between the first regression I ran and the last one, was that for the first one I grouped by pitcher and game, while on the last one I just grouped by pitcher.
By the way, running another regression on aggregate totals from 07-09, with pitchers having at least 2000 pitches during that span, the slope and correlation are literally zero.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think
that I’ve ever found out how much I don’ t know about one topic in such a short time as I have today with all this stuff. I need to find some books or something so I’m a bumbling idiot on these topics.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
That's true for "strikeout pitchers"
who have overwhelming stuff that they can blow by hitters. I think that if Greg Maddux or Chris Carpenter tried to become “strikeout” pitchers that is negatively going to effect their pitch counts, because they will get more of the plate at times and they’ll end up with more balls fouled off and more walks because they don’t have the dominant strikeout pitcher stuff that causes hitters to swing and miss a lot.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Carp definitely has dominant stuff
Are you kidding me? 95 MPH two seamer with an 86 MPH slider – with a shit load of sweeping movement – and a filthy curveball? If he wanted to be a strike out pitcher, boy could he be a strike out pitcher.
At any rate, foul ball rate has almost a perfectly linear relation with velocity, meaning the harder you throw the more foul balls you’ll give up.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
Then why doesn't he?
I would guess because he’s been more effective “pitching to contact” in St. Louis than he was just trying to ring guys up in Toronto.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
That's might be true
It could also have to do with the whole Dave Duncan thing.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
he said it's easier on his body to pitch like he has been
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I think that he could strike out a lot more guys if he changed his approach, so he wouldn't have to hurt his body in any way
But that may not necessarily make him a better pitcher if it causes him to walk many more guys. There’s definitely a balancing point. Personally, I think Carp could should aim to strike out a little more guys next year.
by vivaelpujols on Dec 20, 2009 11:11 PM EST up reply actions
How about it has something to do
with all the injuries he’s had….he’s likely had to adjust how he pitches so as to prevent further injury.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 20, 2009 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
because injury
right? doesn’t it take more wear and tear to push up the pitch count, throw harder,
I’d rather have Carp on longer and smarter than filthier and shorter.
and I just realized everyone said the same thing, but I’ll press post anyway.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:43 AM EST up reply actions
the reason he's not a K pitcher is because it's fascist
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
by gdm426 on Dec 20, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Finally a point I can understand...
Keep up the good work gdm.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
maybe
we should sign dunn to be our new closer. a fascist K thrower could be what we’re looking for!
oh.
i forgot.
he would reject our extended olive branches made of (apple) pie, because, well, he hates america. why does getting a good closer have to be so difficult?!?
R.P.O.F.Y.M.
by BVHeck on Dec 20, 2009 11:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Why are we talking about a closer?
I thought jd had that problem figured out already.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
how do you explain rich harden?
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
fair enough
maybe i meant he wouldnt get as many weak grounders…since more pitches would be in the strike zone
or maybe i am looking at all this incorrectly
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Dec 20, 2009 10:28 PM EST up reply actions
How about:
Chris Carpenter is a historically good pitcher and we should all appreciate watching him pitch, BABIP be damned?
i don't like watching him pitch
nearly as much as watching him bat
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Dec 20, 2009 10:34 PM EST up reply actions
Ode to Chris Carpenter
There once was a pitcher named Chris
Who sometimes got hitters to miss
But more often, I’d say
They put balls in play
And Boog threw them out with much bliss.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
by IHeartBoog on Dec 20, 2009 10:41 PM EST up reply actions 15 recs
recarific
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
my first recs!!
thanks guys! this is a glorious day. also, the limerick is a vastly underrated form of art.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
creeeeeeeeeeepy.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 10:52 PM EST up reply actions
That's what she said?
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
I won't stand for this
That one was solid and you know it.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
ooooooo
jonathan swift is rolling in his grave
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Dec 21, 2009 12:20 AM EST up reply actions
I know a guy from Nantucket that would agree with this.
the limerick is a vastly underrated form of art.
* is an Asshat
by RiverRat on Dec 20, 2009 10:54 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
miranda kerr's lighter than air VS holiday commercial blows that away
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
i could listen to her read the phone book
6ly. oh here’s what i’m talking about
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
of course not, you're happily married
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
I could watch her read the phone book.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
the female Australian accent is music to my ears
it’s just so perfect. i really could listen to any woman from down there read just about anything all day long. if i ever move out of this country, i’m moving down there.
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
So you can become an epic moocher?
At least that’s what I hear about Australians.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
some might say i already am
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
ireland & france ftw
on that front, sirrah.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:54 AM EST up reply actions
irish is gold too, french has it's moments
but they don’t hold a candle to the aussie’s in my book
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
This is weird
Never heard of her before today, but found this earlier, where she’s ranked #4
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 3:57 AM EST up reply actions
BTW: Sorry about that testosterone post
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 4:45 AM EST up reply actions
ok, good.
it was green from my end and I was afraid I was over here celebrating for no reason…
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
This needs to be in the glossary
I’m calling it.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
that is, like, the ultimate honor.
note to self: write moar limericks.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
sorry
not unless people are constantly quoting it. the glossary is about locating memes, not dingers.
I can, however, add it to the Chris Carpenter fanshot.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
this entire blog is.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:44 AM EST up reply actions
I may need to write a limerick for all the players.
of course, “Chris” is easiest to rhyme with and I wrote that one in like 14 seconds… “Boog” will be more challenging.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
if you finish that
before I finish the poem
you win some bacon. or something.
((eta on that damn poem just may be spring training, haha.))
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:59 AM EST up reply actions
Easy to get around
A young man named Boog played at short,
His Hoover-like glove made a sport
Of soft hits and squealers
And would-base stealers,
Making Chris a much happier sort.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 4:12 AM EST up reply actions 9 recs
That's supposed to read
*And would-be base stealers
/edit fail
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 4:47 AM EST up reply actions
my brain gestalted it in; I didn't even notice it was missing
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
that's even better than the carp one.
RELEASE THE CENTIQUID!!!!
by Felonius_Monk on Dec 21, 2009 7:54 AM EST up reply actions
sweeet
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:44 AM EST up reply actions
He would generate less "good/solid contact"
but his walk rate would probably go up. That’s why Javy Vazquez and Zach Greinke were so impressive in 2009. They both had K-rates in the high 9’s with BB rates of 2.00 or less. That’s pretty hard to do.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
re: your signature
you still believe we won’t re-sign holliday?
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
by VolsnCards5 on Dec 20, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
No
I just got tired of typing:
You know, in case we can’t sign Holliday
at the beginning or end of every Hot Stove post regarding moves the Cards should make.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
he'd also pitch fewer innings
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 20, 2009 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
Ummm
If you completely ignore the fact that he’d have to change his pitch locations and the way he pitches people to get more strikeouts which would, in turn, probably lead to him giving up more line drives and hits into the outfield.
by Mulliganstew on Dec 21, 2009 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
you mean you DON'T want nfl network?
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
guess they assume that since i follow one team
that i want to follow every team, in an entirely different sport.
thaaaat would be a NO!
R.P.O.F.Y.M.
haha
i hate the debate. i just wish someone would breakdown (either NFL network, the cable companies, or the league) and just give it to everyone or eliminate it. seriously. it’s absolute crap that i can’t watch nationally televised football.
follow me on twitter @nickg105
by stlcardinalsfang on Dec 20, 2009 11:04 PM EST up reply actions
wow, I didn't know Terry Gilliam was coming out with a new movie
this looks awesome http://www.apple.com/trailers/sony/theimaginariumofdoctorparnassus
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 10:35 PM EST reply actions
Yah
That’s the one he had to reshoot with other actors because of the death of Heath Ledger, who was the star in it originally. Heath is still in it some, but they did a bunch of rewrites so that other people could play his character throughout the rest of the movie.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
it reminds me a little of adventures of baron munchausen
so I will be going to see it. wish it was released nationwide on xmas though, I think most of my family would go
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
Actually
I think it is based on that………but don’t hold me to that.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I'm just glad that Verne Troyer has work
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Dec 20, 2009 10:41 PM EST up reply actions
I saw this a bit early at the StL Film Fest
I enjoyed it. Not as good as Brazil. Way better than The Bros Grimm.
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Dec 21, 2009 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
man
i could use a straussian twitter tease about now
but alas. i’ll go to bed
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Dec 21, 2009 12:10 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
OT (sort of):
Assume most of you have already seen this Goold article?
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 12:13 AM EST reply actions
I'll go on record as saying
that if I had a the chance to push a button that would detonate a stick of TNT in Bor-ass’ derriere, I wouldn’t hesitate. He is a leech, and pondscum, and other lowly things.
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 12:16 AM EST up reply actions
actually he's made of bees.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:47 AM EST up reply actions
Is it just me
or does anyone else want to punch things with every Boras quote they read? His quotes come across as exceedingly jackassish to me. It does not make for a happy me.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
Cutting his valve stems comes to mind.....alot.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 12:20 AM EST up reply actions
Pulling out
the stem cores is a lot more fun. Takes people a lot longer to realize what’s going on.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
If you pull out the core, it goes flat in a hurry.
if you take a really sharp blade and barely poke it into the valve, it will slow leak constantly and drive them nuts.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 12:29 AM EST up reply actions
Besides, you can buy replacement cores.
To replace the valve means you have to take the tire off and requires more work.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 12:30 AM EST up reply actions
I know all the tricks
but it’s more fun to steal cores cause it’s annoying but easy to fix if you know anything. I like mischief, not vandalism.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
I figured you did.
And usually I share your view of mischief vs vandalism, but with Boras I could easily relax my views and morals.Not saying that I would actually do it, but a boy can dream
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 2:36 AM EST up reply actions
Eh he seems like the type of jackass
who would press charges… hence mischief…
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
You think I'm dumb enough to let him see who it was?
I’ve seen CSI damn it! I know what’s going on!
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 8:59 AM EST up reply actions
FWIW if you gave me a flat tire that way
I’d definitely press charges. That’s the kind of stupid thing that gets people killed.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Someone has anger issues.
"When I knocked a guy down, there was no second part to the story." - Bob Gibson
for now
I have faith in Mo’s balls of steel.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Dec 21, 2009 12:49 AM EST up reply actions
6ly, that's a great article. it means Boras is desperate & pissed off
DeWitt & Co haven’t blinked & Boras is f’ed. he over played his hand & now he’s desperate & now no one is going to play his game. go ahead, wait till march, see if anyone wants Lego. by then all the teams will have spent their cash & you’ll have to come crawling back to the STL. but you know what Scott? they won’t let you in. he’ll have to go to canada for a year & then he’ll fire your ass.
merry fucking xmas Scotty!
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
by gdm426 on Dec 21, 2009 2:26 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
i love you too
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
The Dodgers had him over a barrel
with his pants down……..and then caved and paid Manny Ramirez anyway. It was an incredibly stupid thing to do, imo.
Nobody else wanted Manny Ramirez last year. Nobody. The Dodgers probably didn’t NEED him as badly as they thought either. Would Manny have sat out the whole year had they not given in? I seriously doubt it — the guy loves playing the game too much.
I seriously doubt that Matt Holliday will let it get to this point. $80-$90M is a good chunk of change and he’ll take it in January if that’s what is out there.
“That’s why you can take time,” Boras said Sunday. “Things always get more defined in time.”
Yup, the market will define itself….as a bunch of teams that aren’t willing to give your client an 8 year contract Scott. Then he’ll fire your stupid ass like A-Rod did and sign the deal himself. The Cardinals have apparently offered an AAV similar to what Soriano and Lee got in better markets, so your only choice is to compare him to Teixeira who plays a different position entirely, is a switch hitter, and has better power production than Holliday.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
AAV
This is a new acronym to me, tho I’ve seen it for 5 days or so here. Assessed annual value?
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 11:17 AM EST up reply actions
tks
There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK
by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Dec 21, 2009 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
OT: My second favorite day of the year is tomorrow.
The shortest day of the year is barely beaten out by Christmas. Why, do you ask? Mostly because Christmas is Christmas. Oh. Sorry. You were asking why it’s my second favorite day. That’s simple…cuz everyday for the next six months gets a little longer. Warm weather is just around the corner, my friends.
Okay, so it’s a big friggin corner and it’s a long way off, but as someone pointed out, we are getting down to single digit weeks until pitchers and catcher report. So tie a knot in your rope and hang on Cupcakes.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 12:18 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
also, tomorrow is my last day of work for the next two weeks
which is Good.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
so you're saying it's all down hill from here?
Every morning I wake up & smoke a dart. Then I eat five strips of bacon, & for lunch I eat a bacon sandwich. And for a midday snack? Bacon! A whole damn plate! And I usually drink my dinner. And I'm still here! Sometimes I wonder if God forgot about me.
Depends on your veiw of "downhill".
There is still some very tricky weather ahead, but on the otherside of that is ST and then April. So I guess downhill would be the word, with some serious moguls in between.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 2:31 AM EST up reply actions
view*
/learn to spell dumbass
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Dec 21, 2009 2:32 AM EST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- New York Yankees fragrance strikes nostrils this month
- Braves ditch insensitive patch on new throwbacks
- Tim Lincecum slims down with swim routine, loses appetite for McDonald’s
- Create-a-Caption: Kevin Youkilis shows up to the Super Bowl, gets ComicCon instead
- Baltimore flips Jeremy Guthrie to Colorado for Jason Hammel and Matt Lindstrom
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
