Rule 5: You do talk about the Rule 5 draft
by DanUpBaby on Nov 19, 2009 6:00 AM EST
Email
PrintNothing exemplifies the Hot Stove season quite like worrying about the Rule 5 draft. Most of the players don't stick it out all year; most of the ones that do are eventually traded for Ronnie Belliard or Blaine Boyer; and most of the time it would be completely absurd to spend time thinking about this. Fangraphs won't return my calls, but according to my new WARP/seconds-in-your-limited-lifespan converter most of these guys peak around fifteen, twenty seconds. (Brian Barton, simply because his nickname was briefly "Enunciate It", broke the curve at forty-five.)
But it is November, and I already did a VEB Theater, and though it kills me to say it there is no baseball going on at Busch Stadium. So let us take solace in the dim light of this good news: the Cardinals will probably not lose a useful player to the Rule 5 draft this year. In approximate order of near-term usefulness:
ALLEN CRAIG
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: He doesn't really have a position; he's a minor league slugger who played in the PCL, so his numbers are vaguely suspicious; he strikes out too much and doesn't walk enough.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: He's looking more likely every day to spend significant time in left field in 2010, and there's a non-zero chance that he has a hot month while David Freese burns and Tony La Russa is suddenly convinced he can play third. He's never crushed a league, but he's also been extremely consistent level to level—in his three full seasons he's always hit .300, always hit 20 home runs, and always managed an OBP over .365. If the Cardinals find a left-handed outfielder they're comfortable with he is the ideal short side of a platoon.
JON JAY
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: He might be the platonic representative of the Cardinals' more conservative draft inclinations—he's almost guaranteed to be a likable fourth outfielder, but he's almost guaranteed not to be a likable third outfielder.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: He cowrote the Federalist Papers, and every dollar the Cardinals don't have to spend on a fourth outfielder who can play great defense and get on base a little is a dollar they can spend on the player who is consigning him to the bench. If pressed into service on a full-time basis he probably wouldn't hit much worse than Harold Ramis did last year, although the only thing we have to suggest his defense would be as good—I have the distinct impression that he was drafted as a defensive "tweener"—are a year and a half of minor league numbers.
ADAM OTTAVINO
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: His career minor league ERA is 4.15, and his career minor league BB/9 is even higher. In the high minors he's basically been Todd Wellemeyer.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: He's a first rounder, so we have to think about him, up to and including the moment in which he crushes our dreams. We were only allowed to stop thinking about Chance Caple last June. In addition to that, Ottavino's always been a Stuff Guy, and not a Results Guy; this is good for him, and bad for us. lboros's expert scouting report set me back about three years, as far as forgetting about him as a front-line guy goes.
In any case, he's too good a Rule 5 pick to not put him here. He's exactly the kind of starter who gets drafted, pitches fifty innings for a non-contender in the Brad Thompson role, and spends a third of the season on a rehab assignment for Rule 5 Syndrome. In fact, if he were playing for another team, we would be including him on a list of players for whom the Cardinals should dump Brad Thompson on the eve of the Rule 5 draft.
TYLER NORRICK
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: The Cardinals have Trever Miller and the Diner signed through 2010, so for once we don't need to worry about LOOGY free talent. He walked nearly seven batters per nine innings last year.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: He's probably better than Carmen Cali. Against lefties, his strikeouts-to-hits ratio was 2.5, which is awesome. His first name is Floyd, which is awesome, too.
DARYL JONES
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: He followed up 2008's breakout campaign with a breakdown campaign, treading water in AA Springfield. He's not a good 2010 option, even though we were hoping he would be.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: He's DJ Tools! He runs like a gazelle! He leaps like a gazelle! He no longer hits like a gazelle! He's the top hitting prospect on a team that doesn't have any, and he's got a skill-set that's become more popular in the outfield corners in recent years. He's not nearly as MLB-ready as Brian Barton was, but somebody might grab him anyway.
BRYAN ANDERSON
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: I don't think anybody's thought about him since last March.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: You remember Charles Cutler, who we all watched fly up the prospect lists this year with a great high-average low-power season in the low minors? Bryan Anderson is five months younger than Charles Cutler. Anderson was rushed through the system, but until going down with injuries this year he had displayed his one tool, hitting for average, at every spot. So far he's stuck at catcher.
He probably shouldn't be Molina's back-up this year, if the Cardinals have any long-term plans for him—because he's still only 23—but he's interesting enough at a position where offense is at such a premium that if keeping him on the roster were contingent to, ah, keeping him on the roster, some club would do it.
FRANCISCO SAMUEL
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM: Adam Ottavino's career walk rate, which is a concern, is a little more than half of Francisco Samuel's walk rate. I have nothing else to say about that.
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: It takes exactly two good weeks for our opinion to change about middle relievers, and the Cardinals traded every single righty relief prospect who was ahead of him on the depth chart before 2009.
MARK HAMILTON
WHY WE SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT HIM:
WHY WE WILL ANYWAY: After threatening to join Mike Ferris in the annals of great college sluggers who didn't do anything in the Cardinals system he was nearly as impressive as Allen Craig in an abbreviated season spent between AA and AAA. It seems like we've been thinking about Hamilton a lot longer, but they're the same age, and Hamilton's hitting prowess is less BA dependent. He might be the most underappreciated player in the Cardinals' system.
If something were to happen to—no. No. For the Cardinals Hamilton will never, ever, ever, ever play regularly, ever, don't even consider the possibility, but for another team in the Rule 5 draft he could be Chris Shelton.
951 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
FISTULA!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 7:28 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I never knew there was something called
the anal crypt… But I feel like I’m a better person for knowing that.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
I'm all about the philanthropy, man.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
Great ice breaker for chicks at a party. . . . I say, my good woman, did you hear the latest about. anal crypts. . .
We can all thank Monk for that sure fire line. . . .I’m less certain about the accompanying graphics. . .
An optimist is a man who upon discovering that a rose smells better than a cabbage concludes it will make better soup.
HL Mencken
Fistulae, fistula, fistulae, fistula-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Nov 19, 2009 12:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I have been singing this in my head all morning :-|
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:35 AM EST up reply actions
catchy tune
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Y'all Ain't Right....
:=8P
Big McLargehuge!
:=8O
by The MooCow on Nov 19, 2009 12:29 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
for once, I agree with the cow
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
I kinda hate you right now...
Correction…I absolutely hate you right now.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 19, 2009 12:47 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
you were holding out for the illustration with balls?
or….
vexed, you aren’t photoshopping something, are you?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
Not touchin' that.
Not a chance in hell.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 19, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
That's what she said.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 19, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
there was a worse one
but I thought it was arguably a bit too unpleasant. I think an illustration from a medical textbook is fairly tame for this version of the meme, really!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
your text only has female parts?
though I suppose for some members that’s arguably educational.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
your text only has female parts?
though I suppose for some members that’s arguably educational.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
SBN'd
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
The Monk strikes again!
+1 for originality on that one. It was about the last thing I thought I would see but I really should not have been suprised. Made just start laughing.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Nov 19, 2009 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
OK, this is out of line and has to stop now
That is all.
I'm guessing you are talking about the pictures and not Dan's article?
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
yes, of course
&!%$@% SBNation logon inefficiencies! I entered that as a reply to the ‘orrible meme, but it brought me back to the main comment page when I had to logon to post. I thought about posting that clarification as well, but decided it wasn’t necessary…
I thought you might be...
…reffering to the picture in the article that implies that Pujols is hung with a Lipizanner not just like a Lipizzanner. Could you imagine what the womem would think…
Sorry...
…hung with a unicorn. I missed the horn.
I'm guessing you are saying
&!%$@% SBNation logon inefficiencies!
and not
[censored]Fuck you azruavatar![/censored] SBN logon inefficiencies!
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
is there not a robot app for deciphering cartoon profanity?
they really should’ve included that in the factory settings.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:19 AM EST up reply actions
actually I appreciated your comment...
as obviously I should have posted that clarification directly. SBNation’s idiosyncrasies are definitely annoying though.
I'm guessing you are saying
actually I appreciated your comment…
and not
I like to have tea parties with my teddy bears and stuffed unicorns.
Just want to make sure we’re on the same page.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Nov 19, 2009 9:29 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I jsut spit coffee on my keyboard
that is all
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Nov 19, 2009 9:31 AM EST up reply actions
I like to have tea parties with my teddy bears and stuffed unicorns.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
I actually appreciated your comment.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
well this has now gotten much more amusing
My daughter sometimes has tea parties with her dolls and bears, but I’m rarely invited despite the fact that I really like tea. It would probably be more interesting to drink hard liquor with robots though — I wonder if she would be willing to play that instead?
sometimes it takes terrible, terrible things to bring out the best comments on VEB
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
A little burbon in the sippy cup
never hurt anyone.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
[I should have gone with whiskey since I can spell that correctly.]
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
i always bring a flask when i go the bar.
The best I ever did though was bring a broom to a Cardinals game for a sweep and filled it with booze.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 20, 2009 12:17 AM EST up reply actions
Bourbon, not burbon.
Just sayin’.
But yeah, kids these days grow up fast.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Baseball?
I came here to read about your personal losses, Dan, not about the rule 5 draft. Clean it up.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 19, 2009 8:58 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Well
All my life I’ve been vying for my mother’s approval. I always have searched for a woman to hold me and love me unconditionally and when I do find her, it always seems so empty in the end. Anyway, that’s kind of like our situation with Allen Craig. Not sure how, but it is.
"on gameday it says duke loves to face the four seamer and hates to face the four seamer" -VolsnCards5
"perhaps it's a computer joke about the duality of man." -tom s.
by Tudor's Electric Fan on Nov 19, 2009 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
Oh, that's like our situation with Allen Craig???
No, your MOM is like our situation with Allen Craig!!! Ha, BURN!
Oh, that’s….. kinda what you…… nevermind.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:36 AM EST up reply actions
Are you surprised at my tears, sir?
Strong men also cry. Strong men also cry.
"on gameday it says duke loves to face the four seamer and hates to face the four seamer" -VolsnCards5
"perhaps it's a computer joke about the duality of man." -tom s.
by Tudor's Electric Fan on Nov 19, 2009 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
the people I care about always leave me abusive comments.
I don’t know what it is about me, but I’ve never been able to do anything except recommend them to other people.
it's the ones we hold most dear that can do the most damage to us
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
Perhaps leaving Pete Kozma off of the 40 man roster
is a personal loss for Dan. How can you be so insensitive Fritz?
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Or is that a personnel loss?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
WORDPLAY!
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Somewhere
an angel SIUE professor just got their wings tenure.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
by azruavatar on Nov 19, 2009 10:53 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
You sir would have gotten a gold star
But since I don’t want to muck up my screen a rec will have to suffice.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
Ha. You said "Pete Kozma"!
That’s a draft selection that still baffles me. A 170 lb shortstop that struggles to hit his weight. Did they sign him because of exceptional defensive skills? Wish I knew more about the reasoning behind the selection. We passed up a lot of talent for him – namely the big Seton Hall kid, who reminds me a lot of another Seton Hall kid who had a few good years with the Cards.
Jay is overrated
His contributions to the Federalist Papers were only of minimal importance.
by dccardsfan on Nov 19, 2009 9:08 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
don't overlook
that he was the first Chief Justice of the United States Supreme Court. Maybe that got him on the 40 man roster.
Maybe Mark needs to change his name to Alexander.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
And get him rubbed out by
Aaron Burr Harang when he finally has his one-on-one duel? Nah.
by StanTheManFan on Nov 19, 2009 9:40 AM EST up reply actions
"rubbed out"?
That was the best phrase you could come up with?
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
no but it was the funniest...
Chicago Cubs: The first century was funny...this second one is just sad...
Al Hamilton
is probably the most important non-President in American history. More important even than Ryan Franklin, who was known to his friends as Ben.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Nov 19, 2009 10:08 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Him and Don Knotts, sure.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 19, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Hamilton is pretty awesome
Not only did he basically run George Washington’s presidency, but he nobly died in a duel with an enemy of the Republic. No, I will not tame my romantic ideal of his death with your “historic evidence” and other such nonsense.
Also, if the ten dollar bill portrait is accurate, he was clearly the best looking founding father, at least in his youth.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
But, can you make a mushroom out of his head, like Washington?
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Nov 19, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
Actually the Hamilton dollar bill art online is kind of disappointing.
I did find this awesome Flickr gallery though. And my current favorite dollar bill alteration:
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Nov 19, 2009 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Sweet.
That should be mandatory on the 20 from now on.
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Nov 19, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
lol til i cried.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
I actually have acquired a Chief Justice John Jay baseball card
My hope is that John Jay will make the St. Louis Cardinals and have a baseball card, so that I can display both in the same card plaque.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
is that from the wierd Topps series that has players and all sorts of other random "things?"
I remember reading about that on Pat Neshek’s website (an interesting place to visit if you’re into card collecting!).
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
You know what? I have no idea.
I got it and a few others at a garage sale. I don’t even know the company.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Yes, it's Topps
I found it on ebay.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I found some too. Very awesome, if random.
John C Calhoun definitely would have been one of those colorful 70’s pitchers, with his crazy hair.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
I love how it says "Jurist" on the card.
That’s an awesome touch.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I've always thought James Maddison had more upside
although I wonder if his flyball tendencies would hold him back in the Cardinals organisation.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:21 AM EST up reply actions
One d.
British people. Coming over here and misspelling our founding fathers’ names.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 19, 2009 9:48 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
awesomer.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:58 AM EST up reply actions
And, yet, Madison was British.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Weren't all the founding fathers?
or at least most of them?
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
I'll tell you what they were--
They were patriots.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Nov 19, 2009 10:35 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
You'll never take our freedom!
oh, wait…..
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Nov 19, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
British?
None of the major founding founders were born in Britain.
Washington (Virginia) ** Swung a mean stick
Jefferson (Virginia) ** First switch hitter in the Colonial league
Hamilton (Caribbean) ** First latin player to make it to the Colonial league, said to have terrorized the bases his first few seasons in the show
Adams (Massachusetts) ** Never made it past a minor league team in Quincy, MA; Abagail made him quit the sport upon marriage. No loss we are told.
John Jay (NYC) ** One of the original Yankees, he was a utility infielder who sometimes saw moppup duty on the mound. Although later a respected jurist, he was villified in his day for the Jay Treaty that failed to unify American baseball with British game of rounders. Some believe Jay’s failure was a direct cause of the war of 1812.
James Madison (Virginia) ** Could not play the game so his wealthy father bought him a team to help his son feel important in life.
The one revolutionary figure who jumps to minds as having been born in England is —
Thomas Paine (Norfolk, England) ** Known as the original heckler fan. Got under even Washington’s skin when he was at the plate. Best remember for his catch-phrase, “Give me baseball or give me death.”
by jjray on Nov 19, 2009 11:02 AM EST up reply actions 11 recs
This is great.
Technically they could be called British though since the colonies were British at the time. However they would tell you they were American.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 19, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
What I was getting at :)
They were born in what was techinically British soil at the time, until they turned it into American soil.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
little known fact
Jesus was an atheist in his teenage years. Kids that age just love to wind up their parents.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:30 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
"I won't listen to you, Father!
You don’t even exist!"
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
a few years later
he ended up following in dad’s footsteps in a misguided attempt to “prove himself” to his Father
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
Well he was...
but yes, they were (past tense) at one time british citizens.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
They were all British until July 4, 1776, correct?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
My biggest point is what they would call themselves.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 19, 2009 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
Prior to 1776?
I bet most would have referend to themselves by the states they lived in more than the empire they belonged to, so you are correct there.
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
That was one of their points.
Was that they didn’t feel a part of the mother country because Britain just left them alone. They were allowed to develop their own personality and then all of a sudden the King wants their money and they don’t have anything to say about it and they don’t even feel like a part of the country.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 19, 2009 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Agree with Hugo
Jefferson clearly believed Virginia was his “country”. He envisioned the United States as a confederation of sovereign countries. Even up to the civil war, major figures such as Gen. Robert E Lee also referred to Virginia as his country in written correspondence discussing his decision to resign from the United States military and take a post in the Confederate army.
are you saying that the War of Northern Agression
was faught over states’ rights?
we can’t be discussing politics, you know.
I think they just called themselves Gentlemen.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I thought Hamilton was born in Jamaica?
Either way, he was a terror on the basepaths. I think he was probably the most dynamic/exciting founding baseball father.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
I realize that is still the Caribbean, but it's not latin
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Jamaican me crazy
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
it was a joke
Hamilton was born on the island of Nevis in the British West Indies. He had fair skin and blondish / red hair. Both parents born in England.
Oh, I know it was a joke
I was just trying too hard to be funny… it kind of backfired. My bad!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
GINGER!
No wonder he was never president.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 19, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He wore a wig of shame.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
JFK looks pretty gingery in certain photos
Depends on the lighting though. Maybe he had ginger highlights.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Coming out of hiding to say
Patrick Henry (Virginia) was known for the phrase “Give me baseball or give me death.” Tom Paine was more known for his Common Sense approach to the game.
The rest of that was awesome, tho. =)
I’m pretty sure in big situations, they’d walk him [Pujols] to get to Babe Ruth.-- Matt Holliday
That's also the state motto of New Hampshire, isn't it?
Best state motto ever.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Slightly modified by a prominent native NHer to
Give me baseball or give me luggage
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 11:42 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
and I think it's actually
“Live free or die”, but whose counting
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
I always assumed it was inspired by it
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Little known fact:
General Stark stole that turn of a phrase from Chris Carpenter in 1808. Later, Chris Carpenter would have that very phrase branded on Ray King’s ass.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 19, 2009 11:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Jesus was jewish, but who's counting?
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
We wouldn't have had to read about him in history class
if it weren’t for the East Coast bias.
"on gameday it says duke loves to face the four seamer and hates to face the four seamer" -VolsnCards5
"perhaps it's a computer joke about the duality of man." -tom s.
by Tudor's Electric Fan on Nov 19, 2009 9:32 AM EST up reply actions
Marbury vs. Madison biotch
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
That is the great John Marshall.
Has anyone else noticed how pretty much all of the Founding Fathers should have their own Dos Equis commercial?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I don't always have a beer after defeating the most powerful empire on earth with a small army of farmers,
but when I do, it’s Dos Equis.
by Bring Back Tommy Herr! on Nov 19, 2009 10:24 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Imagine Ben Franklin's Dos Equis commercial...
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Somehow that reminds me of this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABFQ-T3uAVI
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 10:28 AM EST up reply actions
yea it was
screwed the pooch on that one
"Albert hits good pitches hard and bad pitches even harder. And when he gets in the batter's box, if you pray, then you start praying. And if you don't pray, you think about starting."--Brian Bannister
Marbury had a way better jumper...
and head tattoo. Not much of a baseball player though…
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
I Go With Madison...
….there was a cute late 80’s porn actress called Madison…
;=8)
Big McLargehuge!
:=8O
No Founding Father is as totally rad as George Washington
This documentary proves it.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Washington didn't almost electrocute himself
FOR SCIENCE. For me, that’s the kicker. Even if he got the stupid charge convention wrong.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
I heard motherfucker had like 40 goddamn dicks
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
He made love like and eagle falling out of the sky
Killed his sensei in a duel, and he never said why.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Between three and five. Hamilton, on the other hand, would have a bright future on this rubric . ..
at least until he faces a player named Burr. . .
An optimist is a man who upon discovering that a rose smells better than a cabbage concludes it will make better soup.
HL Mencken
A good chuckle in the morning always feels good
Makes the ultimate lull period in baseball entertaining. We aren’t even talking about bench players anymore, we’re talking about future bench players.
I’m so ready for FA to start…..and Boras/Holliday to wait until February to play everyone—-including the Ham Fighters—-against themselves and each other. Then Holliday’s acquisition of a midsized Caribbean Island Nation for his winter retreat from New York/Boston provokes AverageFan’s™ dey took errr jobbbbbs type response to a defense-oriented/free LFer. This leads to a thread that starts with “damage in the 2-hole” jokes but ends up in a 2500 post bitchfest explaining the risk in projecting 25M of value 7 years from now, the concept of team aggregate production and debunking protection to newbies…again, which then ends up in our nightly dating advice at 11 PM when someone finally makes a “protection” joke.
But it’s time for me to stop watching boxing on youtube, no matter how excited I am for Mayweather-Pacquiao, and get WACCed by 2PM.
Not afraid to nitpick
Pacquiao by UD.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:26 AM EST up reply actions
No chance
the size disadvantage is too significant. Mayweather 8 rounds to 4.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
I guess that's the conventional wisdom - Pacman has beaten (and made look very ordinary) much bigger guys in the past
I realise it’s a huge step up in both class and mass, and PBF will be impeccably prepared and Pacman might struggle to breach his defence (expect he’ll clinch quite a lot if Pacman gets inside, too) and reach, but I’m just not convinced PBF’s ever fought anyone CLOSE to being as fast as Pacquaio. Also, last couple of years I’ve learnt that whenever I think someone’s going to be too much for Pacman, he always seems to blow that idea out of the water.
I think it’ll go the distance but, either way, I actually wonder if it won’t be a slightly disappointing fight.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:34 AM EST up reply actions
This is true
Pacman has beaten (and made look very ordinary) much bigger guys in the past
But we’re talking about someone who is bigger and, arguably, just as fast as Pacquiao. Regardless, that’s a boxing match I buy the PPV for.
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
Yeah, definitely
I can see it not quite being a fight of the year contender, mind you, but it’s fascinating stuff.
I suppose I like the look of the recent comparison of the two vs Hatton and De La Hoya. Pacquaio spanked them both, whereas Hatton lasted much longer in with Floyd (at an uncomfortable weight, and with a poor gameplan) vs Floyd and DLH nearly beat him (SD). I agree Mayweather’s the favourite, I just have a sneaky feeling that Pacman might be even better than everyone thought….
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:56 AM EST up reply actions
The DLH/Hatton success/struggles
Are the same as Mayweather dismantling Marquez after a 21 month layoff while Pacquiao fought to a steal of a draw and then a war with Marquez. The difference was weight.
Mayweather fought DLH weighing 150 and DLH weighed in at 154—-DLH cut too far down to 147 for Pacquiao (look at the difference in DLH’s body from the Mayweather to Pacquiao fight!)…and Hatton it’s simple stylistic differences—-a defensive fighter getting a KO is still impressive.
Not afraid to nitpick
Well
You could say the same with regard to Pacquiao facing Mayweather’s speed seeing as how Floyd probably has the fastest hands, or at the very least reactions, at welterweight pretty much ever. I’m not too caught up in Mayweather’s size advantage, Pacquiao has more than enough power and now we can say chin, but I like Mayweather in the fight a lot given his unbelievable ability to counterpunch before the other guy even has a chance to recoil. Even if/when he cuts off the ring, Mayweather’s roll on the ropes is almost psychic how he’s able to avoid clean shots.
It’s a great matchup on so many levels and Pacquiao obviously has a great chance, but Mayweather has to be the favorite if it’s fought at 147. In any case, I’m sure I’ll get favorable odds for the people who follow the Mayweather struggled with De La Hoya/Hatton→Pacquiao killed them thinking.
Not afraid to nitpick
goddammit
I AM ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE!!!! Why don’t you leave me alone?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
(sniff...)
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
whatever
I’ll take Eckstein.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
While I mostly agree
I think Floyd’s counterpunching in this matchup is really going to be put to the test, because Pacquiao is much, much quicker than anyone he’s fought before, and his counterpunching is one of the things that put him a level above everyone else that he’s fought so far.
After watching Manny in his last two fights, I’m also really impressed with how well he can take a punch for a guy his size. I don’t see either of them getting knocked out, so I think it’s going to come down to how many punches Pacman can land without getting knocked around on the counters. Floyd is so good at avoiding direct punches that I think that will be his main advantage, but I think Manny is quicker than Floyd so it will be interesting to see how Mayweather handles this since he’s never really had to handle it before.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Plus the judges
PBF landed much cleaner shots than De La Hoya yet somehow one judge saw it 115-113 DLH simply on activity and not actual effectiveness.
Not afraid to nitpick
mayweather is prone to disappointing fights
because he just does what he has to do to win. maybe pacman can piss him off in the ring and we see some high octane, but floyd’s a pretty cool customer, ruthlessly so.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
After seeing what he did to Hatton
I wouldn’t bet against Pacquiao against Ali
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 10:35 AM EST up reply actions
After all the posturing and minds games
Holliday will end up signing a one year contract with the Chunichi Dragons. He’ll end up falling in love with a smart, beautiful and sassy (for a Japanese woman, anyway) young reporter, who is actually the manager’s daughter. Despite a rocky early relationship with his coach, whom he calls “Chief” (first sarcastically and later affectionately) they eventually bond as Chief helps Holliday regain his all-star form after struggling early in the year.
In the process they’ll end up teaching each other a lot about culture, baseball, life—and themselves.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Nov 19, 2009 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Additionally
Matt Holliday’s tenure with the Chunichi Dragons will be in 1941 and shall be played out against the backdrop of Pearl Harbour and the American entry into the war. It shall additionally serve as an allegorical mirror through which the mistrust and fear of the population of both sides can be seen.
There’ll be a mutual option for 1942, as well.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
and additionally
turmoil amidst the turmoil, holliday discovers tendrils of japanese roots that his family has hidden for generations.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
I hope you all realize this was just a play on the Tom Selleck movie "Mr. Baseball"
I’m not nearly clever enough to make this stuff up on my own.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
didn't know that
i was still working on the story. i had holliday, after discovering his japanese ancestry, suddenly developing a speech impediment that prevented him from properly pronouncing his own last name (the double L).
horrified at first, his performance suffered, but rebounded as he accepted his condition as only natural given the circumstances. the two (bat and impediment) so endeared him to the population that they formally petitioned to adopt him as their own.
of course matt was conflicted…to be continued.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Haha
This is probably a better story than Mr. Baseball already.
I wonder just how good someone of Holliday’s caliber could be playing in another country.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
to gain his loyalty
a yakuza leader commissions an enormous, godzilla-like statue of matt in downtown tokyo, built entirely of legos (the invention of which occupied the best japanese scientists, then munitions factories were converted for their production, a little-known fact in the downfall of japan)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
the plural of lego is lego
because lego is an adjective
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
it's a noun
in japan, and of course the “L” is pronounced differently
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
i thought it meant "play well"?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 23, 2009 9:13 AM EST up reply actions
In a world where Adam Wainwright can win a gold glove...
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 19, 2009 11:21 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Vitiligo.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:39 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
it swam in sosa's pool
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
A little off topic here
But just wanted to see what everyone thinks. For some reason I got to thinking this morning about the whole Holliday/Boras thing and came up with an idea. Being that I am a vengeful person and also happen to hate the way Scott Boras does business, this is how I would handle him if I was Mozeliak. I offer Holliday a good contract….say 6yrs/110M, and tell him he has 2 weeks to accept it. After that the the contract goes down to 6/95. This accomplishes two things: 1. It holds Boras’s feet to the fire. Imagine if a team offered you 110M, your agent says “Oh I can get you way more, don’t listen to them” and then no other team goes over 100M. Can you say FIRED!?! and 2. It makes it so we don’t have to drag our feet all offseason waiting to find out if we re-sign him and by that time possibly pass up on other options that would then be too late.
What do you think? I think Boras, being the same type of person I am, would tell the Cardinals to F-off. But oh how great that would be if he (publicly) “lost” his client money because of his stubborness.
When does the exclusive window for negotiating with your own FAs close?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I think you have two weeks
so I think it’s pretty much done.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 9:57 AM EST up reply actions
I think we're pretty well off topic already
Aside from that I think the Yankees or Sawx would jump at the chance to get Holliday for 6/100, that negotiating tactic could very well backfire on the Cardinals PR should someone get him for 6/110 or cheaper then. It’d be a “wait, so you had his value pegged at 6/110, then when you had the chance to get him for 6/110 you didn’t do it? DeWallet iz da cheapzzzz!!!” and it would actually be justified. Fake ultimatums that you can break typically don’t work very well because if the deal is right after the ultimatum passes, you look like an idiot any which way you go about it. You either break your ultimatum and look like a fool for making that in the first place, or you pass up a good deal.
Plus Boras could very easily spin it that the original 6/110 offer wasn’t even real to begin with…and if the Cardinals are willing to go 6/95, the big boys would be willing to go 7/110 for Holliday/SB to save face.
Not afraid to nitpick
agreed
I think the last point you made about how Boras can spin the Cardinals offer is why Mo/DeWitt actually haven’t provided one yet. I feel that they do not want their offer shopped to other teams as the “starting point” and would rather see what actual interest is out there first, before stepping in with their dollars. I’m assuming that they have one or two offers (different year/$ configurations) that they’re willing to go with, and will offer the appropriate one once the market has been defined, hopefully by other teams.
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Nov 19, 2009 10:46 AM EST up reply actions
As a fan I could support...
coming out to the media with one of the following two plans after walking out (publicly) of a meeting with Boras and Holliday.
A) If after talking to Holliday, the Cardinals ascertain that Holliday is more concerned about years than $ value per season (as long as it’s reasonable) this:
6 years, $108 million ($18M/yr) for 1 week.
5 years, $90 million ($18M/yr) for 1 week.
4 years, $72 million ($18M/yr) for 1 week.
3 years, $54 million ($18M/yr) for 1 week.
2 years, $36 million ($18M/yr) for 1 week.
1 year, $18 million for as long as it takes until he signs.
B) If after talking to Holliday, the Cardinals ascertain that Holliday is more concerned about $ value per season (as long as it’s reasonable) than years this:
4 years, $80 million ($20M/yr) for 1 week.
5 years, $85 million ($17M/yr) for 1 week.
6 years, $90 million ($15M/yr) for 1 week.
7 years, $95 million ($13.4M/yr) for as long as it takes until he signs.
I don't think that's in any way workable
for a whole gamut of reasons.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:38 AM EST up reply actions
what about if a gun and hostage were included?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
fire up the van
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
ditto
In the biz world (baseball included), setting a deadline for a deal is not a preferable tactic. It essentially closes the window of opportunity. A skilled negotiator tries to keep the dialogue going and tries to gain more leverage by any means possible as the discussions continue.
A thought on the Holliday contract
I’ve been watching this story develop. It’s looking grim. If I had to pick a team today, I would guess he goes to the Mets. However, I thought of an approach that might work well in both the Cards’ and Holliday’s favor. What about a short term high $ deal? Similar to the one Manny received last year. Say a lucrative two-year deal. Maybe a player/club option for 2011. Why? Holliday’s still young. I see no reason his numbers will decline dramatically over the next two seasons – especially in the Cards lineup. (Any sabre students who disagree, jump in now with the numbers, please.) This would allow the Cards to take a solid shot at the championship in the short-term, while allowing them financial flexibility in the long term. It would also give Holliday another shot at that mega-$, long-term contract in 2011 or 2012. Another selling point to Boras/Holliday is that we’re in a recession. The payoff for Holliday in 2011/2012 could very well be better a year or two from now. I know the NY team will always have big $, but perhaps they will offer even bigger $ a year or two from now. At that time, other teams may be able to afford to jump into the bidding war as well, which would benefit Boras’ client.
He’s probably going to sign a very lucrative long-term deal with NYM this off-season. But what do the rest of you think of this idea? Just a thought.
Boras does not believe the recession is real
he thinks everyone is profiting.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
I am waiting to see who will be
exposed on other teams rosters. I am still hoping that we can draft a backup catcher out of the rule V draft
no holliday (or rosy)
= jay/craig in left?
"No matter where you go, there you are" Buckeroo Bonzai Across the 8th Dimension
It's interesting, but,
I don’t think that we would see an all-rookie platoon. My bet would be Craig and a lefthanded FA.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Jay sucked a fat one in AAA last year
no way I want to see him starting for our major league team this year. I think he’s a quite marginal talent, tbh. Probably a 4th OF.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
You'd have probably said the same thing about So Taguchi,
after his minor-league career. And we all know how that turned out. (No, So Taguchi’s success in no way relates to what Jay will do in his baseball career. I just linking to stories about the 2006 postseason and the unlikely heroes it gave us.)
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I know he wouldn't fit the 'platoon w/ Craig' mold
but Marlon Byrd may be someone to look into. I’m as skeptical as anyone for someone coming off a very strong contract year (doubled his HR in only 24 more games than 08), but he has consistently provided good defense, seemingly would play a corner OF spot (which Cameron may not) and play it very well, and shouldn’t cost too much.
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Nov 19, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
I'd be open to a reasonably cheap Byrd
I am, however, very skeptical that he could move from Arlington to Busch and even sniff 20 HR. He’s kinda up-and down with regard to his OBP, as well (and actually had a worse year, in wOBA terms, in 2009 than he did in 2008, mainly because his OBP took a nosedive). He doesn’t walk much, so I think his effectiveness is prone to peaks and troughs as he’s very BA-driven.
Nice glove and I think he’ll be slightly above-average in a corner spot, but I’m not convinced he’s a huge upgrade over Craig. I could live with him in the 2-hole vs LHP, too.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
valid points (and concerns)
I just think he might be an agreeable alternative to Cameron (4 years younger, fairly comparable defense and offense, and could be cheaper on the yearly value, but may take more years to sign him).
Stupid Sexy Flanders!!!
by timmycardinals on Nov 19, 2009 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
I think Cameron's a better defender
but actually, just looking at them, you’re right – their offense is very similar. In fact, you could make an argument that Byrd may be better (although I think playing in Arlington last couple of years has helped him pad his stats). One’s more a contact hitter (Byrd), one’s more a TTO guy (Cameron).
Honestly, the more I think about it, the more I like the platoon option in LF (either DeJesus or Hinske with Craig) but you could very well be right that Byrd’s a better option than Cameron, if he can be had for only one year. My concern would be him blocking Craig long-term and becoming a bench bat, which might not be the best use of $5-8m (or however much it costs to land him) for the next few seasons.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
I like the Hinkse/Craig platoon
With the rest of the money spent on starting pitching and a reliever
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Should get us the very best FA option of either
although I don’t want Lackey (rather have Harden, personally). I could go Hinske, Harden, Smoltz, Wagner and maybe a backup IF this year. We should have the cash to do that, and no long term deals either!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
replace harden with sheets
and make that backup IF tatis and i’ll sign the papers.
the dejesus option is also good.
the cameron option has dropped to third for me, and the holliday option has staggered to fourth (i hold out hope for crawford, and only the holliday deal would effectively squelch that possibility)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Interestingly,
Byrd has shown a weak reverse platoon split each of the last two seasons, so maybe he would be a worst-case scenario of the big side of a platoon with Craig, although we’re kind of building a platoon bass-ackwards here.
Also, Byrd appeared to have a bad defensive year by the metrics, FWIW.
I like him better than Xavier Nady, but that’s not saying much. I think that I greatly prefer Mike Cameron.
I think that Byrd is arb-eligible, too, and I suspect that the Rangers would offer him arbitration. They did last year, at least. Surely he’s not a Type A, though.
by SouthsideCardsFan on Nov 19, 2009 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
Please enlighten me
Nobody seems even remotely excited to see what Allen Craig will do at the ML level. Is this just feigned stoicism? I mean, I understand the knock on his defense. I also understand that he strikes out alot. But the guy had an OPS of well over .900 last year and he “plays” a position where we are likely to have an immediate opening. His minor league numbers are better than Chris Duncan’s and, while I hesitate to utter his name around these parts, he certainly made a splash for a while in St. Louis (and I can’t image Craig’s defense is worse than Duncan’s).
Somebody explain this to me. Why am I not supposed to be excited about having Allen Craig on the horizon?
I would venture that it's mostly just restrained enthusiasm in the attempt to be more realistic.
Plenty of people here are interested to see what Craig can do, but I personally just try to tell myself that the Chris Duncans of the world are the exception, not the rule. Also, Craig has to actually make it to the ML club before can actually play there, and it’s still kind of hard to tell what the chances of that are. Though, I think either Dewitt or Mozeliak had some nice things to say about him, recently. So there’s that.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
he was the org's minor league player of the year last year
which, I presume, along with Mo’s recent statements, suggest he’s very much on their radar.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:19 AM EST up reply actions
That certainly seems true now
I think most opinions were formed while seeing Joe Thurston standing near third base on a regular basis and Craig not getting a shot at third in the minors.
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 11:21 AM EST up reply actions
Straight, no chaser, Sir. I think John Gall and Jim Journell were also players of the year. . . sigh
An optimist is a man who upon discovering that a rose smells better than a cabbage concludes it will make better soup.
HL Mencken
You're obviously not a regular reader
because I’d say there’s quite a lot of excitement (and anticipation) on this blog to see what Craig can do. So, GO CRAZY EVERYBODY, here comes Allen Craig!
Personally, like Dan, I’m happy for him to be a platoon piece/4th OF/corner IF/OF backup guy in his first year and maybe try to get him 300-odd PAs. Adjustment to MLB pitching can take a while, and he doesn’t have great plate disclipline, so (whilst he’ll hit for some power) he might struggle a little to get on base at first. It’d be nice to give him the best chance of succeeding by giving him as many PAs as possible against lefties.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
Ha, his statement made me laugh
not excited!? His MLE against lefties is like an .850 OPS. Just need to find a lefty on the other side of the puzzle.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
I did a frickin' photoshop!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
sometimes Ethan Allen commercials throw me off.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
Quite the opposite
I’m here every day. You may remember me for such posts as “We need you, Bobby Abreu.”
And I must say, the take on Allen Craig is predominantly low-key, with the exception of some stong proponents (particularly areound September call-up time). I was wondering what I was missing, so I’m glad people are now expressing some excitement.
I am at a complete loss as to what to do with this team offensively this year. I would really like to see us bring in the best non-type A back-of-the bullpen candidate and a solid starting pitcher. Beyond that, I’m not sure the free agent upgrades out there are worth it on a full-time basis (just decent platoon options). Therefore, I’m pretty damn excited to see what Craig and Freese can do on a less-than-full-time basis. It feels alot like 2008 when I was looking forward to regular Luddy/Skip/Spaceman time.
3165 comments since 2007 doesn't seem that low key, in my estimation
The majority is this year’s.
For perspective, the search “Brendan Ryan” — thus, the pre-Boog instances — yields 1610 comments.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
artificially deflated due to the number of Ryans on the team
Poor Boog.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
The last thing I'll say on the topic
I’m not saying he isn’t discussed. I’m simply saying that I perceive the general tone of the discussion to be, well, luke warm. If I am wrong about that, great. After all, I’m the one who’s excited to see him.
Your response and the Monk’s are indicative that I may have misread the temperature.
just sayin'... the group overall leans to the droll
with a lot of dry irony. excitement on VEB can sometimes be measured by how much one doesn’t say a name….
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
In fact, it's theoretically possible
that our desire for a certain player could even, in an extreme circumstance, become so emotionally unstable that we collectively suffer a delusion where we don’t even admit said player’s existence. I would think a player would have to be traded away in a deal that went tragically wrong for something like that to happen, though.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
unpossible!
a player like could never exist!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
Han Daren, dammit.
Just say it! Face your fears!
Clam Baren?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
no no that's Clam Russmoose
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
The Baron of Clams?
Sounds like a stinky fighter pilot.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 19, 2009 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
I'd even be up for saving some of the FA $ this year and spending them at a later date
if that’s an option that DeWitt would accept.
I think we can add a couple of platoon guys (or maybe even one plus a backup IF with a little pop like Tatis or someone) for <$10m, we can focus the rest of the cash on pitching. Realistically, the free-agent market is better on that side of the ball this year, AND we can upgrade easier there – any bullpen or starter we sign will likely be replacing a true replacement-level option (our 5th starter or, say, the Thompson/KMac end of the pen), whereas we have likely 1-2 WAR players internally to hold down 3B and LF, so signing a merely league average player to one of those spots really doesn’t gain us much.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions
how excited should we be about craig?
actually i was thinking about this yesterday and started compiling a list of recent defensively marginal OFs and their offensive AAA stats in Memphis.
in lieu of doing real analysis, i’ll let the masses try to guess who’s who?
player C is an aggregate of 2 AAA seasons. The rest are full seasons in Memphis prior to call up.
It's a trick question. They're all Stavinoha.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
That one chair got hit a lot.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
that's what... uh.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
I'm thinking E is probably Mather
is F Freese? I remember him OPSing .900+ in 08.
C’s 30 dingers has me perplexed. I really can’t remember anyone hitting that many for Memphis in recent years. Although, it IS split between two years. Maybe Colby, although I don’t think he’s defendively marginal. Hamilton? I suppose I’ll guess Colby – or could actually be Craig?
I’m thinking D could be Stavinoha – decent average but limited walks or power; maybe BABIP driven. That’s probably 2008 as well.
B has the highest walkrate and pretty good power with a low average. I can’t think of anyone like that in recent years.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
that chart needs a fanpost
SBN causes shrinkage
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
damn you SBN
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Hmmmmmm...
A: John Gall
B: Chris Duncan
C: Joe Mather
D: Nick Stavinoha
E: Allen Craig
F: David Freese
You missed Ankiel’s 31 homer season prior to his call up in 2007: .267/.314/.568/.883. If only we’d paid a little more attention to that OBP number we would have seen what was inevitably coming.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I can use fangraphs too ;-)....
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
I got em off the homer numbers without looking them up.
All except John Gall, who was a total blind guess.
I knew Ludwick wasn’t in there because he didn’t play a full season at Memphis prior to being called up.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Yah I'd realised that Luddy wouldn't be there
Gall I forgot, basically. I figured out C = Mather afterwards.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
Totally forgot John Gall.
Does he sell insurance now?
He was on the list of minor league free agents posted yesterday
the Astros let him go. I’d totally forgotten his existence until then, and now he’s reared his head twice in as many days!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
Before I examined the table, I was sure Ank would be on there,
but none of the OBPs looked low enough,
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
Exactly why I figured he wasn't on there too
and the fact that he had hit 31 homers before his call up.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
my point is:
Should we be any more excited over Craig than Mather or Freese?
I should have included the player’s ages too.
Yeah, the list doesn't really make me too Allen Craig-crazy
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Duncan and Mather were good until they got hurt, and we don't know what Freese'll do, yet
it’s also relevant to consider their relative ages. Craig is 25. Stav was 26 and driven by a lucky BABIP (with less power & patience), Gall was 27, I think.
Also, Craig’s numbers there ARE the best of anyone.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
I might say that Craig vs. Freese is a wash there, but good points.
Freese is older than Craig, right? Either way, it’d be nice of both of them had a higher walk rate… but if they did they probably would be much better prospects to begin with and we might not even be having this conversation.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Freese is a year older I believe
but he’s also been around longer and struggled to get out of the minors, Craig’s made pretty smooth progression and hit at every level. I still remain convinced Craig is probably the best non-Mather OF hitting prospect we’ve had in the last couple of years.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
that is my thought also
Craig has hit everywhere he has ever been in the minors
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
i'll have to check this
but, IIRC, freeze gave up baseball for a year or two (i think two) out of high school, then got the itch to play and found a college, so his age is a little deceiving in terms of knocking around the minors.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Interesting question
Why am I not supposed to be excited about having Allen Craig on the horizon?
I honestly don’t know, but I have a few ideas:
- The organization just doesn’t seem too excited about him either, which makes me think that the front office (or the scouting department) doesn’t believe that he can be an above average major league hitter. I don’t have any idea if that’s true, but if it’s not, why are they not boiling over with anticipation for him and giving him every shot to make the major league roster or get a call up the past two seasons?
- Nick Stavinoha has put up similar numbers as a right handed hitting outfielder with questionable defense in his minor league career, and if you’ve watched him at the major league level, he just looks completely outclassed. He’s your classic AAAA player: Too good for AAA, not good enough for the MLB. There are more of these guys at the corner infield and outfield positions than we’d care to admit, including highly touted prospects like Andy Marte, Brandon Wood, and Dallas McPherson, who just annihilate AAA pitching and look lost at the plate in the MLB. I think Craig looks the part more than Stav does, but I’m not a trained eye, so I refer back to #1: If he’s such a good hitter, why isn’t anyone in the organization excited to give him a chance. Why doesn’t anyone who looks at minor league hitters for a living, (like John Sickels, Baseball America, etc.) get excited when talking about Craig? The first favorable impression I’ve seen of Craig is Sean Smith’s PECOTA projections for next year that just came out last week. Considering how accurate they’ve been in recent years, that gives me a little more of that warm fuzzy feeling than I had before.
- I’ll be honest: To me, he’s on the Casey Blake career track if he’s any good (majors and minors. Nobody ever wanted to give him a chance, he kept hitting at AAA, took advantage of a bad corner outfield and third base situation in Cleveland, and he’s put together a nice career after age 28, when he nearly hung it up for good (I’m friends with Casey’s older brother Pete, and he really thought his career was going to end up like his brother Ben’s career, who played in AAA for Cleveland for years and never got his shot, then was named all conference playing linebacker at Division III Simpson College at age 30). I don’t think that Craig is as good as Blake at 3B, but I think he’s a better outfielder and they probably have similar talent on offense. I think he could stick around in the majors for quite a while if he can be a 20 HR hitter with a .340ish OBP, the question is whether he can do that.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
Casey has a brother?
his organization has now betrayed him too? Obi Wan was wise to hide him.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
He has three brothers actually
Ben, Joe, and his younger brother Pete. Joe is the only one that didn’t play pro baseball, but he holds a ton of passing records at Simpson College as a QB. Amazingly talented family top to bottom.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
oh, duh, I think I actually knew this
looking at the all-siblings teams in Baseball Almanac. cool.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
i'm not sure
that the org’s not high on craig, as opposed to the Free Allen Craig sentiment, which i once shared. but i’m now reconsidering their handling of this prospect.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Bill DeWitt Jr called Craig an Elite hitter
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 11:35 PM EST up reply actions
yes
i’m thinking more that they’re (and have been) handling him with kid gloves as opposed to they don’t think highly enough of him to give him a callup. Likewise, klobby could have made the team out of spring training in 08 based on performance, but they were thinking long-term interests, let him develop for best chance at success. so maybe they’ve taken it slow with craig because they really, really value him.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
or they are doing some game theory
and they are hoping they can trade him for zach greinke, if only they talk him up enough.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
not sure one quote constitutes
talking him up, but if they ramp it up in the coming weeks then i’ll assume greinke is headed our way (but mo secretly wants dejesus and is taking greinke just to net his prize)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Wow
He did it at work.
It’s dumb, but it’s kind of like that woman who got fired because a blogger started posting the emails and addresses of people who sent him death threats. Her husband had sent it from her work account, meaning she (and presumably the PD troll also) was screwing around on the company dime.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
are you kidding me?
Most people here post from work. This is such an over reaction it is mind blowing. He breaks his own terms and services. It sets such a bad precedent. I hope he gets fired from STLToday from all the blow back. He will find the full power of the streisand effect
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
I didn't say I agreed with it,
but this happens on a regular basis (for instance, the other example I gave).
Also, it said he resigned on the spot when he was confronted- that’s not enough to conclude he was fired.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
This kind of crap happens all the time.
http://www.mister-info.com/?cmd=displaystory&story_id=11063&format=html
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29796962/
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28424059/ns/technology_and_science-tech_and_gadgets/
“Facebook Fired” even has its own urban dictionary entry:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Facebook+fired
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
those are all much worst than what he did
not even the same category for me
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 12:20 PM EST up reply actions
If he resigned on the spot
I’m guessing there was some other browsing/posting going on that meritted the decision
/baseless_speculation
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
The best kind of specultation.
I heard he was a racist, too!
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
oh it gets better
He asked what the strangest thing anyone has ever eaten before. Of course people are going to put pussy in the comments. What a dumbass.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
What's so strange about that--wait, bad idea. Just, never mind.
This post does not exist.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
He's probably donezo, from the user agreement:
"We will not share individual user information with third parties unless the user has specifically approved the release of that information. In some cases, however, we may provide information to legal officials as described in "Compliance with Legal Process" below. "
I would not have gloated about this publicly.
Not afraid to nitpick
i hope he sues them
that’s pathetic.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
Ooooo you can almost feel him squirm in the comments
Someone called out the user agreement:
Second, I did not reveal any personal information. I didn’t have any to reveal and I wouldn’t have if I did. I informed the school about the comment. They already know their own IP address.
That can’t be a good feeling realizing you might have just cost yourself your job by bringing up your own dick move.
Not afraid to nitpick
So I just saw his home info being posted on the internet
Now people are starting to call the STLPD number to say he should get fired.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
Slightly OT: Cy Young?
I hate to say it, but they are probably right. I’m prematurely angry that Lincecum’s going to win, even though I understand he’s as deserving as Carp and Waino.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
He's more deserving.
Look at it like this: If Waino or Carp were on the Giants, and The Freak was on the Cardinals, who would you want to win? I’d be outraged if Tim didn’t win and he was on my team.
In reality, if Tim doesn’t win, I’ll just be annoyed for him and pleased that at least a Cardinals player won.
Now with extra feisty!
not what you meant, clearly
but if he was on the Cardinals, he’d be the runaway winner with 20+ victories
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
Which just furthers my point, really.
Wins are team-dependent to the degree that we’re even discussing this. Timmy should win.
Now with extra feisty!
Hmmm
Carpenter and Lincecum had almost identical run support (5.84 to 5.83, respectively), so I’m not sure its certain he’d be a 20 game winner with the Cardinals. He just would have had a few more chances because Carpenter was injured for part of the season.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
Waino lost more than a few "wins" due to bad relief, too
it wasn’t just the last one.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
I was mostly being facetious
but what if you gave him (or Carp for that matter) Wainwright’s 7.07? Projected wins wouldn’t be my metric of choice regardless, so it was a silly comment on my part to begin with.
Lincecum did the things that a pitcher has control over better than anyone in the NL by a long shot (FIP). You can say he had slightly worse results vs Carp based on ERA, but the disparity is mirrored in the 20 point difference in BABIP, a statistic over which a pitcher has very little control. If nothing else, the 4 extra games started push Lincecum over Carp on my ballot (I’m still waiting for that, by the way)
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 1:10 PM EST up reply actions
i think carp would've
walked away with it if it weren’t for waino mucking it up by pulling the most first place votes. they probably got the order right, but i was hoping 1 and 2 would be reversed. in the end swinging a bat and the resultant dl stint cost carp the cy.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
But...but...
The Cy Young Predictor has him in 3rd!
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 19, 2009 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think the Cy Predictor has ever been that far off.
Assuming Lincecum wins. Since 2002 I think the winner was always first or second on the list.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
Perhaps this means the voters are getting less moronic.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
vexed steeeeee-rikes again...
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:41 AM EST up reply actions
Every once in a while somethin' I put together turns green.
…it’s how I measure my real-life worth.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 20, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions
It's a vicious cycle to get into, isn't it
I used to have a normal life. I knew I had hit rock bottom with my green addiction when I found myself wearing all green clothes, drinking green beer that I had saved from last year’s St. Patrick’s day, popping greenies that I bought off a hooker I like to call “Green”.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
This isn't quite as good as the real thing
but if you ever need a cheap thrill, I’ve got your hookup. Here’s a taste:
by brackenthebox on Nov 20, 2009 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What do the World Series and a polar bear on birth control have in common?
THEY CAN’T HAVE CUBS!
Albert Pujols does not have “down” years. He has “~6 WAR” years.
by mattybobo on Nov 20, 2009 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 21387943298789321 recs
Lemme know
there’s plenty more where that came from
by brackenthebox on Nov 20, 2009 11:41 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
What the SBN is going on with the rec'd comment above this?
21,387,943,298,789,321 recs. Can’t reply to it, it refreshes the page. Strange.
"Everyone in here comes to the yard ready to play every day. I’ll take this group, any day until the day I die."
"This whole Cardinals thing.....I don’t know if you guys are a believer, but I’m a believer."
~ Ryan F. Ludwick
How did you do that?
Did I really make that comment? What’s going on, I’m so confused… I just need a little green to get me through this, just one time and then I’ll get on with my day…
Mmmm…. greeny…..
….
[Passes out on chair]
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
its a comment inside a comment by bracket
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Yeah, I still do not understand this at all.
Hence, he’s a witch.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
He's using HTML to make it look like
he made a comment, you made a comment, followed by another comment by him. The fact is, it’s all one comment. The “bottom” comment by bracken has the real time stamp and everything.
Now with extra feisty!
thanks spants, ruin the magic
I’m surprised SBN allows as much HTML in comments as the do. From what I can tell, pretty much anything not involving a div or a span is fair game.
by brackenthebox on Nov 20, 2009 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I figured it was HTML or something like that
but Fritz’s explanation didn’t really make any sense.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
"it's a comment inside a comment by bracken"
perhaps the typo threw you?
by brackenthebox on Nov 20, 2009 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
guess you met Timmy, huh
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Bye Bye Puppy Kicker
Royals have a deal with Brad Thompson
by creativereason on Nov 19, 2009 12:11 PM EST reply actions
Of course they do!
How did I not see this coming?
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
facepalm!
we should have thought of that!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
I was kinda hoping Brewers
Imagine going from Suppan and Looper to Thompson and Mulder.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
I wish him the best of luck.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 19, 2009 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
pitcher whose only quasi-weapon is a sinker + an infield of yuniesky betancourt and alberto callaspo = comedy gold
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
Brad Thompson had it all.
A bizarre photoshop meme, a…pitch, and he was part of the manliest man stew around, until he was DFA’d and signed by the Royals…
Now, Brad Thompson is on the dead last team in the central division where the pitchers don’t hit; does he have what it takes to carry this bunch of scrubs out of the cellar and up to the penthouse? Or will his failures lead to the greatest puppy massacre since the puppy shoah?
Brad Thompson is…
Dayton Moore’s Latest Acquisition
Coming in April, 2010
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Nov 19, 2009 3:11 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Rob schneider is...
…A CARROT
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 19, 2009 3:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
his failure to grow a stache was his undoing
he started in 06, but the regression to shaved in 07 set him back.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Hadn't he just lost a game pitched against the Royals when he made the puppy kicking comment?
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
....it's the circle of life!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
It's almost like going back to AAA!
We all come from the minors, and to them we shall return
(with apologies to pagans)
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
Hendry tries to outdo Mo...
2/$6.5 million for Franklin? Hah! 2/$7 million for Grabow (!)
MB for LF in 2010!
Mo:
“Touche, Hendry. First, Miles; now, overpaying for relievers. You have yet against one-upped me, but I shall have my day. Our Holliday contract will out-albatross your Soriano contract.”
Hendry: “Yeah, right! Mua ha ha ha ha!” (Goes back to petting his pet bill goat.)
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Radio in Chicago this morning called him
an 8th inning guy. This could end up being funny.
I'm laughing. for real.
hopefully no one walks in so I have to explain
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
this is like when they signed Marquis
and… all those other times.
those cubbies. always giving.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
wasn't he exec of the year too?
MLB awards are a funny thing
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 19, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
In fairness
no one else entered their name in the competition that year. At least that’s how I imagine those awards work.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
NL Les Sweetland Award Winner
Joe Posnanski does a bizarro Cy Young, named for one of the worst pitchers of the Deadball Era, Les Sweetland. A primer can be found at the beginning of his post on the awards. The NL winner is none other than Manny Parra. Here is a taste as to why:
Manny Parra, though, had the toughest year of the bunch. Parra was probably best known coming into this year as the guy who got into that shoving match with Prince Fielder in 2008. He pitched pretty well in 2008 — but struggled mightily in 2009 though he did become the first pitcher since 1938 to win more than 10 games with an ERA higher than 6.25. He went 11-11 with a 6.36 ERA.
Manny Parra’s line vs. the Cardinals:
5 GS / 27 IP / 2.33 ERA / 1.296 WHIP / 21 SO / 14 BB
The Cardinals’ line vs. Manny Parra:
114 PA / .212 BA / 1 HR / 6 2B / .307 OBP / .303 SLG / .610 OPS
So, against the rest of MLB, Parra was Les Sweetland; against the St. Louis Cardinals, he was Cy Young.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
a painfully awesome fanpost
would be for how many pitchers that’s true.
Wandy almost doesn’t belong because of the wicked curve, but there’s Wandy. Uh… what was that kid’s name, Richard?
Quick, someone name all the soft tossing lefties in the NL!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
Moehler
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
Moeller's like 38 or something
he’s hardly a kid.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
sorry, unclear
three somewhat unconnected thoughts … I couldn’t remember someone’s name in paragraph 2.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
doesn't merit a fanshot, but interesting nonetheless
new pitching hiring strategy?
Origin: [1275-1325]; Middle English < Anglo-Norman French < Old French < Late Latin; carpentarius artifex or wainwright, equivalent to Latin carpent(um) two wheeled carriage ( < Celt; cf. OIr carpad chariot) + arius – ARY
Carpenter name variants and backgrounds
* Wright – Woodwright in old England. Such as a “wood wright” (wood worker). See also “wain wright” (a wooden wagon maker) – See Wright and also: Wainwright (name).
* Carpentier – From the French Norman Carpentier (le Carpentier, le Charpentier) a worker of wood.
* Charpentier – Carpentier and Charpentier in French. A worker in wood. French Surnames > CARPENTIER ++, Forme norm.-picarde de Charpentier; var. du Sud-Ouest et roussillonnase Carpentier. Avecart. Le Carpentier.
* Zimmermann – Zimmerman in German. A worker in wood.
* Carpenterio – Carpenter in Spanish. A worker in wood from the English word Carpenter.
* Carpender – Carpender an English phoentic name variant of Carpenter. Also seen as Carpendar.
* De Carpenter or De Carpentier – “the carpenter” in Dutch, a worker of wood, from the French Carpentier.
* Timmerman – Carpenter in Dutch, a worker of wood, from the German Zimmerman.
Meanwhile:
Piñeiro
This English, French and Italian surname was a topographic name for someone who lived by a conspicuous pine tree or in a pine forest. The name was rendered in Medieval documents in the Latin form PINUS.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
So we get pitchers who are descended from wood experts
Since wood is their enemy, and in war one must know his enemy.
Odd that Carp’s and Waino’s names are so related… odd and totally awesome!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
so, who are we trading to the nats for Zimmermann (pitching edition)?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
splintering/sawing bats
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
it could be one or the other
But keep in mind — Brendan Ryan’s middle name is Wood. Thus, Boogñeiro.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
piniero
descended from a wood nymph and the keebler elf
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Nov 20, 2009 12:00 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Which Keebler elf?
There’s more than one, you know.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
well, i know there's seven dwarves
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Interesting. Where did you find this?
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
uh, wiki.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
I wikied. I must have a poor search strategy.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
What about Woodie Williams?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:42 AM EST up reply actions
What time is the CY announced?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
oooooohhhhh...... suspensful...
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
there's a show?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
wow
so that wasn’t a joke. This is actually happening.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
ARRRRRRRR!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
ARRRRRRRRRRRRR1001010011101001010010011101010100101!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 19, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions
A robot pirate? I don't know if the world is ready for that.
What’s next, ninja vikings?
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Wow, spants, you are amazing!
I was just about to post that I would like to see a ninja viking and, boom, there it is!
spants is bringin the jpgs!
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
If only he had a Wizard Robot Spartan sidekick.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
The whole world's gone mad, mad I tell you
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
I wish you weren't a liar.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
View it live on mlb.com too
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
Item of note:
A photo by none other than MomUp made it into a BaseballThinkFactory photo captioning contest.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
wtg momup!
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
yeah momup!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
3 Steroids related captions and counting....
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
aw.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
Love that old Mariners hat.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I just realized
That the two LL teams I played for that used ML uniforms were the Mets and the Yankees.
Ew.
I always played for a team named after a major league team
T-ball: Giants, A’s
Coach Pitch: Royals
Little League: Orioles, Cardinals (hooray!)
Junior Babe: Red Sox
Babe Ruth: Diamondbacks (hehehe our uniforms were purple)
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 5:36 PM EST up reply actions
Not I...
…Little League – Juniors: Geller Farms. (Orange jerseys with a pig silhouette)
…Little League – Seniors: MarkFore (Red jerseys with corporate logo)
…Softball – RAM-League: Juggernauts (Whatever I wanted. Named after the DeMarini bat)
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
i wish you were a liar.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
Now why did you have to go
and ruin it like that? A man needs to have some delusional fantasies to keep him going.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
you missed the point
/points at Linecium and wonder’s who that is
"Come test me every day if you want," says Pujols, "Everything I ever made in this game I would give back to the Cardinals if I got caught."
I hung up the Christmas wreath and took out the recycling while waiting.
Most productive I’ve been in a twenty minute span in a long time.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
are people watching this?
this guy is dressed like Captain Morgan and using words like “swashbuckling.” This is ridiculous.
"I knew they were up to shenanigans." --TLR
I've recently tried to switch from Blue Moon to
Captian and Diet….don’t get nearly as drunk frownie face
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
So Anthony Reyes and Brian Barton were both released
Sign them and Chris Duncan. I just filled 2 OF spots and a starting rotation spot
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 1:51 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
MIND BLOWN
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
sign barton and reyes but forget lil dunc
"A great catch is like watching girls go by the last one you see is always the prettiest."- Bob Gibson
A story at MLB.com says Lincecum won
even though the official annoucement hasn’t been made yet.
by BTown Birds fan on Nov 19, 2009 1:53 PM EST reply actions
Tim Lincecum’s been reported as this year’s winner, a fact also learned by an MLB.com reporter. No official announcement will be made until 2 ET.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
not really nexdef'd
just happened minutes ago
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 1:55 PM EST up reply actions
right, so the opposite of nexdef'd, hence the bizzaro.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
That wasn't very clear
Here’s what it says at the MLB main page: “Tim Lincecum’s been reported as this year’s winner, a fact also learned by an MLB.com reporter. No official announcement will be made until 2 ET”
by BTown Birds fan on Nov 19, 2009 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
> puts on defensive "ah, these awards are all stupid anyway" helmet <
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
please, there's still "who didn't vote for any of the three of them" skewering
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
These guys really fucking like Captain Morgans.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
how does captain morgan do it? does the peg leg throw off the balance?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
I think only drank Captain Morgan when I was underage
Captain and Coke was minor choice of drink
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
Captain Win-wright.
Clever.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
WWL is announcing it in seconds.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
I wanna see Timmy!
…and there he is striking out Albert. Damn you, WWL.
TEN POINTS separated the top three on the ballot.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
I bet Waino would of won
If he just would of had 20 games
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
and Ludwick.
damn you, WWL.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
F&&$*CK!!!!!!!!
Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth.
by RosevilleRedbird on Nov 19, 2009 2:01 PM EST reply actions
Best man won.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Best man, sure.
Better pitcher? Not this year.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
i disagree
you can look at stupid metrics but the bottom line is he had more WINS, fewer LOSSES, lower ERA, and lower WHIP than Linc………Carp should have won.
I dunno
if you give up the fewest baserunners and fewest runs per 9 innings, that makes you the best pitcher
so what if another player misses bats more…he gave up more runs and more baserunners.
Lincecum is up there trying to strike every batter out
And doing a good job at it. But Carpenter and Wainwright are not trying to strike everyone out. So of course he is going to strike out more people.
I hate how strike-outs and k/9 have become one of the main metrics for measuring how good a pitcher is.
+1
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
i agree with you, evilfrog
for the most part.
comparing maddux to johnson careers and declaring johnson the better pitcher because of strikeouts would be similar, imo, and analogous to comparing two .950 OPS guys and saying one is more valuable because he hit twice as many homers as the other.
i don’t have any problem with timmy winning, but i don’t think it was a no-brainer. if i had one game to win this past year i’d’ve chosen carp, and if i had a 5-year contract to hand out it’d go to timmy.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Yay stats we hate unless they help our argument!
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Wins, Losses, and the best pitcher.
So-called “wins” and “losses” really don’t have anything to do with who pitched better on a given day because the classifications are so team-dependent. I’ll quote Joe Posnanski:
Before I begin, I should probably explain quickly to those who have missed it that I cannot stand the pitcher’s victory as a prominent baseball statistic. I quote victories more often than I should because they are inescapable. But crediting the pitcher for a victory has always been somewhat absurd and also — as Crash Davis said in Bull Durham about strikeouts — fascist. Why would you give one guy a "victory?" A pitcher has only so much control over how many hits/runs he allows, and he has almost no control over how many hits/runs his team scores. If a third baseman hits three home runs and makes two great plays, shouldn’t HE get the victory?
As ridiculous as the pitching victories thing was in the 1970s and before, when pitchers threw complete games with regularity, it’s even more ridiculous now because they don’t. Starting pitchers generally go five, six or seven innings … why in the hell should they get a VICTORY for that?
And, yes, Carp’s rate stats are lower, but by how much? Lincecum’s 2.48 ERA is very low, and he did it over thirty-some more innings pitched than Carp. And Lincecum’s WHIP is .04 lower, which is an eyelash. While we’re on rate stats, Lincecum struck out 10.4 batters per nine innings. Carp struck out 6.7. A strikeout is an out 99% of the time. It’s the surest way to be an effective pitcher and Lincecum was surely dominant.
It’s a close contest, without question, and I was actually pulling for Wainwright to win, because he is my favorite Cardinal pitcher, even if he was the third-best pitcher in the NL this season. If I had a vote, I’d have voted Lincecum first because he was the most dominant starter in baseball this season, and he threw ~ 30 more innings than Carp. Is it a slam-dunk case? Not at all. But that doesn’t mean that Lincecum is undeserving of the 2009 Cy Young, in my opinion.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
posnanski picked lincecum
but said carp was just as deserving and it wouldn’t be an upset or crime if he won, and i think most consider posnanski pretty level-headed and insightful.
i’d campaign for lincecum for every award every year if he spoke only latin, at least in public
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
waino came in 3rd despite having most 1st place votes
go figure
Carpenter probably deserved it more than Waino, too
My vote would've gone Lincecum, Carp, Wainwright.
Surprised Waino had so many first-place votes. Upended Carp’s chances.
Now with extra feisty!
this seems emblematic of our season
stop at first, Boog.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Depends on what team she's batting for.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Nov 19, 2009 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
But she's pretty freaky, so you never know.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
You never know.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Nov 19, 2009 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
The BBWAA has it's own website?
Commences pulling out manual on how to send a DDOS attack*******
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
seriously?
what were the final tally’s
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
Interesting Wainwright had the most 1st and the most 3rd place votes, but very few 2nds
Maybe that’s the split between the voters who just want to see wins (1st place) and the ones who looked at the more sophisticated stats (3rd).
by BTown Birds fan on Nov 19, 2009 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
Are the voters getting smarter...
or is this just a fluke?
Neyer’s predictor was off by a lot for the first time in a while.
MB for LF in 2010!
Not sure if you're kidding...
That predictor is a reflection of how the voters have voted historically and it has been extremely accurate. That it missed this year in both leagues might indicate the voters have now changed their approach.
MB for LF in 2010!
Yeah I was kidding.
I mean maybe about 5% of the stuff I say on here to be taken at face value and not as a sarcastic statement.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
they just said that on WWL
Jayson Stark struggled not to call them idiots. lol.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Joe Posnanski thinks this year is a turning point.
And I hope he is correct.
Every so often in this crazy sports racket, you can’t help but feel like the conversation has changed ever so slightly … and changed for the better. Zack Greinke won the American League Cy Young Award on Tuesday. More than that, he breezed to the award. He was named first on 25 of 28 ballots. He was the runaway winner.
And he did it with only 16 victories.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
how is greinke a good example
fans who’ve never looked at a stat knew he was the best, and then there was his story – it’s pretty mainstream when WWL shows highlights of his every start and says, “…might not have most w’s, blah, blah, blah, but best pitcher in baseball” If somebody in the league had 25 wins, he simply would have won with a 5 FIP and 100 k’s or whatever, but without even the cachet of a 20 game winner it seems nonsense to talk about greinke winning “with only 16 victories”
same in the nl. how are voters getting smarter? it’s tim fucking lincecum – he wins this thing ten years ago too. it’s timmy the freak lincecum. if he had the same numbers and was a journeyman pitcher just having the year of his life, then carp takes the cy, this year as well as ten years ago.
there’s a lot of snobbery involved in thinking saber stats had anything to do with picking greinke or lincecum. the WWL touted them all year. after the fact you can use the numbers to support the selection of each, but i doubt those same numbers were what got them the votes – there’s nothing advanced about strikeouts, era, IP, etc.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
this post was fun to read in a drunken slur.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
AND I TELL YOU ANOTHER THING...
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:49 AM EST up reply actions
if you think writers' knowledge of advanced stats
had anything to do with greinke and lincecum winning, fine and dandy. i’d bet if you polled non-baseball fans as to the best pitcher in each league you’d probably get the same winners
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
I think it does speak to a devaluation of the win
I don’t think it says anything about the voters caring about the advanced stats
by brackenthebox on Nov 20, 2009 7:36 AM EST up reply actions
Who the fuck didn't vote Greinke first???
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:48 AM EST up reply actions
someone didn't vote Greinke first?!
A WITCH
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
3 witches then
And they’re all bad witches.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
did they say something like double double toil and trouble?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Oh wonderful
I was praying Waino or Carp would win just so I don’t have to hear the award referred to as “Cy Bong” ever again.
This is almost one of those "statistical ties"
Wainwright got the most 1st place votes, but Carp and Lincecum had way more 2nd place votes than him.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Hm. Does that count as a "nexdef'd"?
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
I want to know...
why they have this crazy idea of voting for anything other than 1st place. It seems to me you’re either the best pitcher that year or you’re not. Who really cares about being the 2nd or 3rd best pitcher?
/rant
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
Because
The Golden Gloves are voted on like that and see how ridiculous they turn out?
by Mulliganstew on Nov 19, 2009 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
Those second and third place finishes can get those pitchers extra cash.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I'm pretty sure if you're a good pitcher
the market will take care of you. You don’t need a 2nd or 3rd place finish to get your money.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
If Wainwright finishes in the top five the next two years
the Cards have to pick up his option.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I didn't take contract incentives into account...
Fail on my part.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
fail on his agents part for not having 2009 included in that.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
unless he has Tommy John surgery or something
I bet they were getting picked up regardless
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
I certainly hope so.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
still not a good answer
if there wasn’t a second or third in the first place then it couldn’t be used as a contract incentive – the horse goes before the cart.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
I thought it was $20m?
in that article that was posted yesterday. That seemed pretty steep to me, too… Better check cots.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:51 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I've always had a big problem with that too
The only reason to have a voting scheme like that is to make it possible to win with “points” instead of just getting the most “winner” votes. I can understand in some way why that would make sense… in years where one guy is universally considered one of the best, but there is wide disagreement on who is actually #1 I can see an argument for giving it to the guy everyone agrees on. And that guy would have to win with points, by being high up on everyone’s ballot. Still, I agree with you, it’s kind of unnecessary.
I don’t even know who I would vote for here, I really don’t have a problem with Lincecum winning it. Though Vasquez probably deserves more recognition than he got.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Josh Johnson too.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:51 AM EST up reply actions
and maybe that other guy, .
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:51 AM EST up reply actions
f'in sbn
I typed a bunch of space between , and . – I guess it “assumed” I didn’t mean that. Bah.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:52 AM EST up reply actions
Oh, I know who you're talking about
That guy, it’s on the tip of my tongue… don’t tell me… damn it, now it’s gone.
What were we talking about again?
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
we're like the best team with nothing to show for it
hopefully everyone doesn’t tighten up in ‘010, because that was a good start of somethin’.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Boog, Colby, Luddy, Piñeiro
I guess Albert will get his hardware. and I think Frankie’s was stats-driven.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
jebus
I forgot Skip.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
People seemed to think Waino should of won or been 3rd
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
1. Wainwright
2.
3. Wainwright
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
Profit?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Win-wright.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Just in case anyone wondering
1st: 5 points
2nd: 3 points
3rd: 1 point
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
That takes all the fun out of
setting up a system of equation or matrix and figuring it out if you didn’t know to start off with… Thanks for ruining all the math nerds fun…
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
Just did the math
If it was
1st: 3
2nd: 2
3rd: 1
The outcome would have been the same. I think I got 66, 62, 61
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
So I just did some research
This was the closest NL Cy Young race between the top 3 guys since 1987.
Steve Bedrosian PHI 57
Rick Sutcliffe CHC 55
Rick Reuschel TOT 54
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
But,
if they had put Carp in those two places, AND Goold had switched his 1st and 2nd place votes, we get a tie.
by ArkansasTravs on Nov 20, 2009 12:50 AM EST up reply actions
a tie would've been cool
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
That was probably the difference in him not winning
Oh my god… that is so ridiculous.
by Mulliganstew on Nov 19, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
would have been at most 4 points.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
needed 6 to tie...
SIX, WHY DOES IT ALWAYS COME BACK TO SIX. 6!!!!!!
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
What???
This is the most important example of 6 being a serious number… How could we possibly kill it off after proof like this?
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
It's a serious curse is what it is!
We must purge it with fire and then ne’er speak its name in these parts henceforth.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
it's a witch?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
how many runs scored in the playoffs....
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
One of them was Will Carroll
He voted for instead. Put Wainwright first, Lincecum second.
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
by Cardinals645 on Nov 19, 2009 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
Dammit.
He voted _ ___ as his third place vote. The ONLY writer to give him a vote.
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
by Cardinals645 on Nov 19, 2009 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
I can't believe one voter left their ballot blank
that was an oversight.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:53 AM EST up reply actions
contract bonus'
Carp – a cool $100k
Waino – a cool $100k as well
I wish I would get an extra $100k I wasn't expecting today
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
assuming you're on a grad student stipend
this is the equivalent of getting a couple hundred dollars for winning an award.
Go win a poster contest or some such, and it works out just about right.
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
i feel like
waino having the most 1st place votes and 3rd place votes is really weird.
i really can’t believe haren and vazquez even got a look
"like those hip musicians with their complicated shoes!" - George Costanza
Well, the advanced metrics really really liked Vazquez and Haren this year
But there’s no telling what the voters’ motivations were. Well, some of them write articles about it, but not all.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
in one case, the motivation is known
From Will Carroll’s article, linked above: “I felt that Dan Haren had been overlooked because of his team’s performance, but that his performance for them was definitely worthy of recognition.” That is some poor logic right there, voting for someone because you think their effort should be recognized instead of because they were actually the best. To be fair, he did say that he heavily second-guessed his own decision on this. Also, he downgraded Carp because of innings pitched. Quality vs. quantity is a tough call here.
is it really that unfathomable?
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Nov 20, 2009 2:21 AM EST up reply actions
It's inconceivable!
Really, the only bad part of bacon is that it makes you thirsty . . . for more bacon
Looking on the bright side:
Cardinals save $150,000 with a Lincecum win. Pay Carp $100k and Wainwright $100k for their top 3 finishes (either would’ve gotten $250k by winning, according to Cot’s).
MB for LF in 2010!
beat you......
well except for the whole logic part of this post.
Wow
we can afford about one and a half months of Rick Ankiel!!!!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 4:55 AM EST up reply actions
So how much is Lincecum going to get in his 1st year of Arbitration this year
Normally 1st year is like 40% of what he would get on the FA market. $30M a year on the free market is really not that crazy . $12M?
I'd guess 10
It’s a tough choice, because it’s a rare case. No track record when it comes to pre-arb pitchers winning Cy’s
I just want to see the Giants stance
on why they shouldn’t have to back up the Brinks truck…
He doesn’t look like a Cy Young Pitcher
He refuses to cut his hair
He burns tree
He made more than enough money from Dazed and Confused
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
i dunno
this is the team that gave Zito that contract. They are also the team that went with Lincecum even though he didn’t look like a Cy Young Pitcher.
They need to lock that kid up now.
Well, he needs to at least wait until the Febreeze kicks in
So it’ll actually be a little bit after he finishes.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
howard has the record
IIRC, and articles i’ve read seem to think timmy will get south of that – think howard got 10?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
if lincecum gets less than howard
that will be the most perfect proof ever that the arbitration system is irredeemably broken.
Which means the players will never let management change it. This will lead to interesting results ;)
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
How much did Howard get?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Did he win the MVP pre-arb? I forgot about that.
Stupid 2006… oh, wait, nevermind.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
So...
…Waino get’s the most 1st place votes.
…Carp gets the most 2nd place votes.
…Lincecum wins.
…Neato.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
It's like an old school Nascar points race...
Sorry couldn’t resist. I will now go hide my face for sullying this space with a Nascar comment.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
Old school NASCAR was the best.
…Cut the restrictors, let the crews develop better engine packages, remove the standardized bodies. I like JJ and all, but it’s all strategy now, no driver “muscle”
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
I used to watch all the time...
now if I happen to come across a race I’ll give it a glance, but won’t make any real effort to watch it.
"The Cards lead this game tied 1-1." -Mike Shannon
is there a logical argument
that carp and waino “split” the vote, handing it to timmy (not that he’s undeserving), based on waino getting the most first and carp the most second-place votes?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
we all kind of knew the vote would be split
I’m mostly sore at the two guys who left Carp off the ballot altogether.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
The two Cy Young winners together had a total of 31 wins
That’s got to be a record low number. Truly, the times they are a-changin’.
(“Come gather ‘round, stat-phobes throughout the land/And don’t criticize what you don’t understand”…)
by BTown Birds fan on Nov 19, 2009 2:38 PM EST reply actions
but in a world devoid of 20-game winners
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
somewhere, Denny Mclain is smiling
i hope so, at least.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
And they both were so excited for the other one...
This sucks… Oh well, MVP is ours though. No GOB may take that away… Not even the 04 GOBs
I want the Walrus back...
what about the 06 GOBs
when Pujols was better than Howard in every discernible statistical category except homeruns and girth?
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:01 AM EST up reply actions
you can spell grit from girth
and the leftover letter is h for howard. that’s how i explain it anyway.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
by cardball on Nov 20, 2009 5:04 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That makes about as much sense as the "homerz n rbi in Septmber iz valu!!!11" argument.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
my point exactly
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Turns out it was KLaw and Will Carrol who left off Carp
Unbelievable. Lincecum should’ve won, but leaving Carpenter off the ballot? preposterous
"...and pujols has given st louis the lead"
Proud Contributor to the Night of the Longest Train Wreck Ever 9/10-9/11/09
they need some express shipments of luggage.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
I never would've imagined the voter from BP would approach it this way:
I felt that Dan Haren had been overlooked because of his team’s performance, but that his performance for them was definitely worthy of recognition. I thought that the Cards had two quality contenders for the Cy Young, but that Chris Carpenter’s time away for injury tipped the scales over to Adam Wainwright between the two of them
It’s an individual award for the best pitcher. Simple. Straightforward. Don’t need to reinvent the thing.
MB for LF in 2010!
I agree.
It’s given to an individual player, not allocated by team. That makes no sense at all.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Vasquez and Haren were better than Waino and Carp this year
going by FIP-based WAR (6.6 and 6.1 wins respectively to ~5 in both Cards’ cases). Both threw a LOT more innings than Carp, too, which has to count for something (i.e. restricting the number thrown by your weaker bullpen arms & no.5/6 starters).
I see absolutely no problem whatsoever with voting for either of those guys, or Josh Johnson (5.5 WAR) in the top 3.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:05 AM EST up reply actions
Keith Law is the ass that put Vazquez 2nd.
Not that it mattered a whole lot in the grand scheme of things, but my writer-hate for Mr. Law has reached a new level.
"If I'm in a slump, I ask myself for advice" - Ichiro
Reasoning
Everyone who votes for these awards should be willing to give their reasoning for doing so. I’d like to see what his reasoning is.
I'd say it's probably based on advanced stats like WAR and FIP
Vazquez and Haren were just as good candidates as Carpenter and Wainwright by that kind of measure, I believe.
However, I can’t read the voters’ minds.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
So....
You’re saying it’s not silly to base your vote off of ERA (which was the only think Carp had an advantage of them in)?
Anyways, here is what happens. Voters pick in advance who they want to win, and then justify it after. I don’t mind going strictly by WAR, or WPA, or even pitcher wins – as long as you are consistent.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 19, 2009 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
Carp was the league leader in WPA
just sayin’. I wouldn’t have had him in my top 3, either.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:05 AM EST up reply actions
if you believe that
then i guess advanced stats…well, i guess the times aren’t a changing, based on the low point totals of those two compared to waino and carp.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Carp and Waino rated just as well in advanced stats
And far better in traditional stats. I would have voted for them 2nd and 3rd also.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 2:07 AM EST up reply actions
so how the hell
did vasquez and haren rate a vote over carp, all things considered? it’s tough to justify, which is what i thought mattybobo was doing, albeit halfheartedly.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
It was halfheartedly
I kind of see the argument there, but I don’t really feel it personally.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Both threw a lot more innings than Carp
both were more valuable by WAR (mainly because of this) and vasquez had a better FIP than Carp.
I think it’s pretty easy to justify, personally.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:08 AM EST up reply actions
Vazquez was better in FIP WAR
However, Carp was better in ERA WAR, tRA WAR and WPA – so it appears that he was better.
KLaw said he only looked at FIP WAR, and Vazquez was significantly better in that.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 21, 2009 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
V was better at being from atlanta?
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
He's so much smarter than everyone else!
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
The problem
is this is human subjectivity we are talking about. Everyone has a different method for determining who the best pitcher is. Unfortunately, there is no way to objectively pick anyone.
If Lincecum won and had a majority of the votes, it would be fine. But the fact that Waino had the most irritates me a bit.
2009 Draft picks excluded
Can’t quibble with that list, I’d have Jaime and Craig higher than Lynn, but that’s just an upside-evaluation
"...and pujols has given st louis the lead"
Proud Contributor to the Night of the Longest Train Wreck Ever 9/10-9/11/09
I was wondering when they would post that
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
Me, too.
I’ve been waiting for it since it was promoted in the Draft Review post.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Lance Lynn NUMBAR ONE!!!!!111
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
I was surpised by that
I’m no prospect expert, but it seems to me that the “insider” consensus would put Garcia above Lynn. Have I been misreading that?
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
what I want to know is... do we call him LL now?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
NFW. jeez. lynn #1? i don't know if that's an indictment of our farm or fangraphs or both.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
Well, they are excluding 2009 draftees, but yearh.
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
DJ Tools
It’s been quite a while since I looked at his 2009 cummulative stats, but, having done so in that post, I don’t feel as pessimistic about him as I had grown to feel between season’s end and today. He hit .279/.360/.378 and his power fell way, way off, but he did have knee trouble. It reminds me quite a bit of Rasmus’s 2008, injury-plagued season where Raz hit .251/.346/.396 over the course of 387 AAA PAs. Sure, Jones’s fall has been less than heartening, but I’m nonetheless very much looking forward to his 2010.
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Lynn over Garcia is absolutely preposterous, if that list is ordinal
They’re only one year apart and I think Garcia’s ceiling is higher, and his current level of talent is higher. I think Sanchez is way too high as well (I’d have him at the tail end of the top 10) but I realise I’m in the minority there.
Reifer’s too high as well. He’s a 23-year-old who put up a 3.50 FIP whilst relieving in single-A, and has major control issues that will only get worse (unless he improves his skillset) as he gets up to face hitters who can actually take a walk. I think he’s a long shot to be worth much in the majors, and relievers (except absolutely elite closers) aren’t worth much compared to SP or position players anyhow, so top 10 is crazy. I’d have had Robert Stock in this spot (although I note that no 2009 draft picks are allowed – in that case, maybe Henley?).
I dunno if Kozma should be in the top 10, either, he’s not really done anything yet to suggest he can hit a baseball at the professional level.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:15 AM EST up reply actions
kozma nor niko
have hit jackshit. seems it makes greene more valuable to us, for awhile anyways.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
JAIME GARCIA
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Whoa.. mass capitalization AND bold
danup is like the anit-lboros
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
love the avatar
esp. since I can ask, without even zooming in — which time was it with Theriot?
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
It was the second
when the lil bears were still mathematically in the race, but no longer ahead in the loss column
cubs v cards this year was exceptional
I honestly can’t imagine a scenario where I’ll be changing my avatar. It would have to be an act of GOB
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 19, 2009 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
I just changed mine
I’m waiting for Az to plastic bag me.
But it… demotes Yadi a little (I’ve been unhappy with him lately, though he’s still my favorite) and it adds Adam and Boog to the picture.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
What has Yadi done recently to make you unhappy with him?
Was it the autograph signing incident, or did something else happen?
Just curious.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
see: Al.
someone here noted how many runs he cost on the ’paths.
eh, I don’t expect him to be a saint, but there were several cringeworthy moments this year that had me rethinking my sig.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Sometimes I wonder how bad his knees are. I want to believe he just can't run those grounders out
But I admit it’s disappointing to think “grounder…damn, automatic double playDAMMITWHY ISN’T HE RUNNING?!?”
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
He was like 7 runs below average with his feet this year
That pretty much negates most of his defensive value
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
*sigh*
He even lost 20 pounds, what gives? You’d think that would help.
I still like the “He runs like he’s mad at the ground” quote.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
he stole nine bases!
he has stopped stretching out to block, it’s true. but his pick-offs have not let up. and he is doing it the hard way, by hopping up on his knees. he’s on his feet before the pitcher even gets both feet on the ground.
if anything, maybe he pulled strained something elsewhere.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
I figured he must be hurt somehow, but nobody was telling us.
his pick-offs have not let up. and he is doing it the hard way, by hopping up on his knees.
I know, and I think that’s awesome. But it also has me a little worried. How long ago did he have a torn meniscus repaired? Was that after the 2007 season?
That’s always in the back of my mind. That’s the only reason I’m concerned with his weight. I want him to stay healthy, or at least as healthy as a catcher can. I want an unbroken string of Gold Gloves that only ends when he decides to retire.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
I'm just not sure how
less weight plus more innings means he can’t run. there’s some step in the middle there we’re not getting.
i suspect back or backside.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
his cockix?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
i'd like to see him get a few more games off
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Maybe Greg Zaun is the answer, then?
he’s still a legitimate starting catcher, but if no-one else wants him, well, the Rays turned down a $3m option with a small buyout, which makes me think he could be had for, say, $2m or so, not much more than LaRue’s made the last couple of years.
He’s a switch-hitter and has been above average by wOBA two of the last four years (including last year). Excellent BB rate for a catcher and he gets on base at a tasty .344 clip, again, really good for a backstop. He’s considered competent defensively and has been an everyday player at various points in the last few years.
Because he’s a much better hitter than LaRue (esp. against RHP) he also gives us another option as a PH. If we’re going cheap on LF (DeJesus, FA platoon, DeRo, Swisher or something) I guess an extra million or so on our backup catcher might be a good investment, both for us and for Yadi.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:25 AM EST up reply actions
yeah
i’m generally of the mind to just bring larue back, but sitting yadi a little more would necessitate an upgrade. i say it begrudgingly because i like larue and our backup was so little used it didn’t really matter before who it was.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
with the amount of time Tony gives backup catchers
do you think there is any chance in hell Zaun would sign here? I would love to have Zaun, but I think he actually wants real playing time.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Nov 20, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
I think Yadi will be one of those catchers who seriously falls off a cliff in his 30s
I’d not be too keen on signing him to another big long-term deal after this one ends, even though watching him catch is poetry in motion. He’s a big, big guy and the way he plays behind the plate must be so hard on the body. He also doesn’t have a lot of “margin for error” in his hitting, IMO, with his limited power and kinda meh walkrate – it won’t take much of a drop-off of his contact skills for him to become a really limited hitter.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:19 AM EST up reply actions
not clicking that
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 19, 2009 3:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I thought that meant the people of Wal Mart back boobs.
Like for breast cancer or something. Totally not what I expected.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
Punctuation screwed you over.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
Affirmative. Over & out.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:26 AM EST up reply actions
i really want to photoshop
some nipples on it
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 3:59 PM EST up reply actions
i feel torn
while i believe you CG, this forbidden fruit taunts me. Now how i know how the baron feels.
I can't even begin to describe how wrong that is.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Nov 19, 2009 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
at least I was decent enough to post a link and not just put up a picture
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 5:24 PM EST up reply actions
I will give you points for decency.
I was just meaning that fact that somebody actually dresses like that. Not that I want to infringe on anyone’s right to look how they want to.
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Nov 19, 2009 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
wtf
I cannot repeal the words of the golden eel
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Nov 20, 2009 2:26 AM EST up reply actions
at least from behind
you got boobs to play with
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 4:59 PM EST up reply actions
Kinda gives new meaning to a reach-around huh?
You're the fail to my win?
"There is not a better feeling in the whole world than knowing that you are the best team in both leagues."- Bob Forsch on winning the 1982 World Series.
by MaytheForschbewithyou on Nov 19, 2009 5:03 PM EST up reply actions
in related news, kyle mcclellan has sought refuge in the witness protection program.
word is an angry man with a georgia accent came by his house twenty minutes ago, lit his car on fire, and shouted “ten lousy points! ten points!”
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Nov 19, 2009 4:59 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
Yes.
Because on Real World/Road Rules some girl thought her breast implant had exploded. And I was shocked (although in retrospect, I don’t know why, it makes perfect sense that that could happen) to hear about this and mentioned it.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
it really did feel like begining of the end
sucked all the life out of the team for the playoffs.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 5:21 PM EST up reply actions
That game had me in a bad mood all night
I just said to my ladyfriend, “Well, that guy may have just cost the starter the Cy Young. He might get killed.”
OT: Tech Supprt! Help Please!
Ok, so I am having problems again with my laptop. When I turn it on, it starts to boot up then goes to a black screen and sticks on that screen. After about 15-20 seconds it shuts down and restarts itself. I’ve been having problems with it locking up if I let it go to standby. I got help from spants and prophetjohn (i think) about 2 months ago that temporarily helped that situation. Apparently today when I put it in my backpack to bring it to class it didn’t get shut down completely and overheated. It has had ample time to cool off now, but I’m afraid the damage has already been done. Any suggestions on what to try??
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
can you get into the setup menu (usually f2 or f1)?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
you could try to take the battery out and let it reset it self over night
You could always just shake your laptop when it doesn’t work. I shit you not I have to do with my laptop from time to time. I literally took it apart trying to figure out what was wrong with it. Couldn’t figure it out. So I shook it to death and now it works.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 5:44 PM EST up reply actions
No one has these anymore
but the Dell 600m series had a problem in which pushing the power button would crack a circuit board underneath it over time. The dell recommended solution to force it to turn on (prior to getting it serviced, obviously) was to shake it vigorously or hit the bottom.
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 6:14 PM EST up reply actions
my buddy reccomended it to me
I am a pretty technically inclined person. But it wouldn’t even boot up. Just power on and the fan would stay on. I tried taking it apart and looking for problems. But couldn’t find any problems. So I thought what the hell why not. By god shaking it worked. It still does it occasionally and I literally throw my laptop around till it works again.
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
Mechanical Agitation
Is the technical term.
I was reading about how countless species are being pushed toward extinction by man's destruction of forests. Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us. - Calvin, Scientific Progress Goes "Boink", Watterson
My Aaron Heilman story
Setting: Busch III, 2009, and the Chicago Cubs are getting loose in left field while the Cardinals take BP.
I walk down to the wall and yell, “Hey, Aaron Heilman! Thanks for 2006!”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
tom
sorry, i’m on the school’s crappy network that doesn’t really work well with SBN and won’t let me reply. I can get to the setup menu if I’m quick when it starts up. What do you suggest from there? Oh, and if you think this is going to get too cumbersome with me unable to reply, just let me know and I will find another route for help.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
sounds like a software issue then -- if your computer can stay functional in the setup screen it's not a hardware issue
like a power or a motherboard issue.
if you don’t have irreplaceable stuff on your hard drive, i’d suggest a clean sweep and a reinstall (just not with vista). otherwise, you might see what you can do to get your data off your hard drive; use a boot disk, and see if your laptop will run and let you recover any essential data that way, or tinker with your settings.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
fack
test status: #10009- replace hard disk
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
Test status: #13717- use reply button
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 19, 2009 5:43 PM EST up reply actions
ok, given that
shaking it is probably about the worst thing you could do
by brackenthebox on Nov 19, 2009 6:15 PM EST up reply actions
yeah sounds like the hard drive is toast
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 19, 2009 7:05 PM EST up reply actions
happened to me last month
and my motherboard fails last week. My computer must like to travel.
Really, the only bad part of bacon is that it makes you thirsty . . . for more bacon
good thing is
Warranty is up. Gotta shell out for a new hard drive. Any suggestions?? Make it something nice. Have I mentioned its my birthday?
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
hp pavilion
dv9500
anything more detailed you need to know? The hard drive that crashed was 160 GB and the rep that I talked to said that I could order either a 200 or 250 GB for $100. I dont remember the exact because I wasn’t really listening once he started telling me the damage.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
Can you get a solid state drive?
I don’t know how new your laptop is, but those things are apparently really quick and not taxing to the machines.
Now with extra feisty!
what is this?
I’m not very techno savvy at all. I’ve had the laptop for about 2 years now.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
seems I may be in over my head
wish flim was still around
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
The easiest way to explain solid state drives is that they are like the flash memory you put in digital cameras
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 20, 2009 12:18 AM EST up reply actions
did you see my reply
to your question about model and all that. Do you have any suggestions based on that info? Is there something more that you would need to know?
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
JD status
officially getting kicked tomorrow for National Kick a Ginger Day. I can’t reply for some reason. It just sends me to the top of the page when I click it. Sorry to inconvenience you.
BTW spants, if you are reading this, I guess you can consider myself [redacted].
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
hmm. joe strauss, wednesdays at 11AM CST?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
ah, my own fault
should’ve been more careful about putting it in my backpack.
"Baseball is like Church, many attend, few understand" - Wes Westrum
News: Dispatch helps discover which writers did not vote for Carp/Wainwright
The link I clicked on described the article as “Keith Law tries to explain his Ballot.” Obviously he failed, because Gordon doesn’t get it.
He essentially includes every quote from Law’s article in which he uses crazy voodoo like FIP and WAR and VORP to decide that Vasquez should be 2nd and Wainwright 3rd.
Also, as I noted above, Will Carroll put Wainwright first, but left Carp off the ballot to include He-who-shall-not-be-named.
Best Part: In his rush to mock the votes of Law and Carroll, Gordon puts in his sub-headline that Carroll’s vote was Lincecum, Wainwright, Voldemort. Yet, in the article, he directly quotes Carroll as saying, “"My final ballot for the NL Cy Young went Adam Wainwright, Tim Lincecum, and Tom Marvolo Riddle.”
Obv. his journalistic diligence can only be topped by his outrage at someone leaving a Cardinal off the CY ballot by using using Sabermetrics (?!?!?!).
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
Additional highlight
Law also dismissed the victory totals of the pitchers, noting that it "tells us nothing useful about how well the pitcher performed."
Here is what Tipsheet find [sic] useful: Wins and losses. But maybe we’re just old-fashioned that way.
He dismissed victory totals?! GASP Yes Gordo, you ARE old-fashioned that way.
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
by Cardinals645 on Nov 19, 2009 5:58 PM EST up reply actions
I will trade Jeff Gordon noted 18 game winner Kent Bottenfield
for an in his prime “clubhouse cancer” Jim Edmonds.
I love people who are old-fashioned about “wins.”
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I really don't get it.
I guess I don’t care what he thinks, but sometimes I really just forget the ridiculous spite of statistics, and it is staggering.
Plus the whole article is full of errors. From the incorrect ranking of Carroll’s votes, to this gem: "
He explained his thoughts on ESPN.com. He are snippets of that:
Yep, Keith Law ‘are’ snippets of his own article. Nicely done.
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
by Cardinals645 on Nov 19, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions
Like I said the other day,
Jeff Gordon makes Strauss look like a genius.
"Everyone in here comes to the yard ready to play every day. I’ll take this group, any day until the day I die."
"This whole Cardinals thing.....I don’t know if you guys are a believer, but I’m a believer."
~ Ryan F. Ludwick
Before I even got into Sabremetrics
I realised wins were totally useless when Jason Marquis got 16 of them in 2006 and then was (justifiably) left off the post-season roster…
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:31 AM EST up reply actions
People who still embrace...
…W/L seem to love to snidely toss out comments like this. It’s really almost pathetic at this point.
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Nov 19, 2009 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
The comments are worse.
I mean REALLY bad. Not just incredibly stereotypical, “Go back to your mom’s basement!” bad:
It’s a shame he even gets a vote for these awards, go back to playing dungeons & dragons Keith!
but also pure and utter hatred bad:
Espn has a knack for having eggheads like Law and idiot Gammons, who can barely open his twisted little mouth without muttering something about his apparent gay feelings for the Red Sox. I hope to run into Law someday, somewhere, like when his hair is on fire and I refuse to pee on it. He is gaining notoriety, and I am sure he is relishing it. Hopefully something can be done about it. I hope he dies. Apparently he was denied voting rights according to the Wiki for "not attending enough games" a couple of years ago and then there is the Vernon Wells deal where he made up quotes. He is just a wannabe pansy, and he probably gets picked last in any pickup game after the blind guy and the wheelchair guy. In other words, Carp got screwed by an idiot, and I hope we give him the business if he ever shows up here.
-Scotty Cam
Emphasis added. It would honestly be funny, except that someone out there really thinks this and is getting that upset about just TWO guys not putting a pitcher in the top three.
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
by Cardinals645 on Nov 19, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
Wait...
He is just a wannabe pansy
… is that an insult?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
THAT GUY COULDN'T EVEN BE A PANSY IF HE TRIED
HE’D STILL HAVE SOME COJONES, AND WOULD BE TOO MUCH OF A MAN TO BE A PANSY
WHAT
i guess the fact that he wants to be a pansy
is an insult (not that it’s a fact, but you know what i mean)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
So he can't even live up to his life goal of being a pansy.
Therefore he is too macho to be a pansy but this somehow makes him worse than a pansy. This is a strange cycle of manliness this person believes in.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
People who write that drivel need to stop and think about what they're saying
They’re advocating bodily harm to another person because they didn’t vote the “right” way on an award in a game. I mean, that’s all baseball is… a game with a lot of money floating around in it. Sure, you’re perfectly within your rights to get heated about the results and inform all those around you about how heated you are. The second you use language that incites you’ve crossed a line, internet or not.
Obviously this site is an exception, not the rule, but nevertheless the seemingly permanent state of internet commenting is just kind of pathetic.
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Nov 20, 2009 12:41 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yup.. This is my fanbase.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I don't know how I missed these quotes earlier.
It is terrifying to think these people exist. Why you would think it is acceptable to say ever, anywhere, that you hope someone dies because they didn’t vote for someone you wanted them to vote for in a baseball award forum is beyond me. And frankly frightening. I don’t care how anonymous people think the internet is and how much they would say I would never actually say that, they thought it didn’t they? They pressed post. They actually took the time to type it out which takes longer and in my opinion more thought than just speaking.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 20, 2009 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
Also
someone from the PD could, you know, look up their IP address, find out where they work, and try to get them fired.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:32 AM EST up reply actions
Gordo covers baseball for a living. For. A. Living.
And he thinks that “wins” and “losses” are a useful “metric” for gauging a pitcher’s individual performance. Think about that, for a moment. Is there another field where this is even possible? (Beside being an analyst for ESPN or FOX.)
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
I would like to see him make the case
for getting Marquis back, since his team has never not made the playoffs. I think Gordon could do it.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
That's true.
I don’t have cable and generally only watch “The News Hour” and “Washington Week” on PBS, shows where the experts are actually experts, for the most part. I had forgotten about primetime cable “news.”
"I'm gonna throw the nastiest curveball I have ever thrown...if he hits it, I'll tip my cap, but if not we're going to the Series."
--Adam Wainwright on the final pitch of the 2006 NLCS
Ha, that was my immediate thought too.
Offseason Rumors : Me :: Unicorn Blood : Voldemort
by Cardinals645 on Nov 20, 2009 3:32 AM EST up reply actions
one thing i will say is that Law's comment about Linececum winning both WAR and FIP titles is double counting
assuming he uses Fangraphs WAR which is based on FIP, right? i’d rather he said linececum had a higher strikeout rate or a better tRA.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
True, but it's a start right?
"Everyone in here comes to the yard ready to play every day. I’ll take this group, any day until the day I die."
"This whole Cardinals thing.....I don’t know if you guys are a believer, but I’m a believer."
~ Ryan F. Ludwick
not quite
because WAR takes into account IP, which I think is a very important factor in why Carp shouldn’t have won this year.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:33 AM EST up reply actions
Has anyone done a SABR breakdown of Gibby's 68 season?
Like how he went from being a good-to-great pitcher to having the greatest season in pitching history then back to being good-to-great again in his age 32 season?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
His walk rate from that year is the only thing that REALLY stands out to me.
Oh, why didn’t they have pitchf/x back then? We had nearly put a man on the fucking moon!
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
No, we had not
they just want you to think that. Since we couldn’t put a man on the moon, not having pitchf/x is easier to take now, right?
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
think about how much better we coulod fake it, today, though (pTWSS)
there would be martians on the moon with waving little american flags, welcoming neil and gang…
Unfortunately, their park factors would totally fuck with our most advanced player valuation metrics.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
by SleepyCA on Nov 20, 2009 2:52 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If Pujols ever leaves St. Louis
I hope that it is only to be the DH for the Luna Prospectors when he is in his 40s. I could probably drool over the numbers he puts up playing for that team.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Nov 20, 2009 11:01 AM EST up reply actions
"That ball was an absolute Earth shot!"
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
by mattybobo on Nov 20, 2009 11:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
remember
they lowered the mound after that 68 season.
didn’t he lose 9 games or something. i remember looking it up once and IIRC he mostly lost head-to-head battles with jenkins and marichal like 1-0 and 2-1…i could be dreaming though.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
if you really care
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
thanks
i’ll delve into it more tomorrow, but first perusal shows three losses to giants and two to cubs, but i’ll have to check out the opposing pitchers. not quite the scores i dreamed for those games, though.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
to follow up
gibby started 8/34 games against SF and CHI (4 and 4)
sf: L perry, W 3-0 marichal, L bolin, L 1-0 perry
chi: L jenkins, W 1-0 jenkins, L (ND both gibson and jenkins), W niekro
(noted shutouts with scores)
funny: if i ever knew his full name is Pack Robert Gibson, i’d forgotten.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Alright so a question.
i believe i heard (but i could be wrong; i often have been and often will be) that BAA and its relatives are not very reliable because BA itself is not a good measure of hitting production. Correct? Would a stat like wOBAA be very valuable as a pitching stat?
Really, the only bad part of bacon is that it makes you thirsty . . . for more bacon
Danny Mac doing the Tenn St.- Eastern Illinois football game on ESPNU
I seriously don’t think the man takes a day off
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
who else hates Keith Law?!?
I DO! Besides being a horrible reporter and also often writing false rumors, the guy is just pain stupid. His excuse for leaving Carpenter off the ballot… he pitched 30 fewer innings than Lincecum. Rediculous. And he said that St. Louis had a GREAT defense this year and that Carpenter’s numbers benefited from that GREAT defense. I wouldn’t call the D great this year… just over average at best. He’s willing to overlook Carps pitching stats due to GREAT defense, but unwilling to look past Carp’s 30 less innings and actually look at his pitching stats.
Sorry, I’ve been busy and away from the computer all day and just found out the Lincecum won (guess I should have expected it), so I had to vent. I’m sure you’ve all spent some time today discussing the matter.
I feel better now… a little
I don't hate him.
Not one bit. At least his reasons were based on things other than the pitcher being a “gamer” or “tough as nails” or whatever cliche you choose. Those qualities are great, but they don’t measure the quality of pitching. Lincecum is most deserving of this award.
Now with extra feisty!
I'd like him if he would work on his smugness.
The guy isn’t an idiot but it obviously makes his penis rally when he shows off how smrt he is.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
no, I'd say it just makes money for him
Can’t take any of those attitudes seriously — he knows that snark pays his bills.
that's the thing, he doesn't
he had a great first half, then a not so great second half. he won this because he won last year & because someone’s a little bitch & because someone’s just trying too hard to be seen as “smrt”
in my totally & completely biased opinion, he should have been third. i would have voted Carp, Wagonmaker, Stoner
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
the guy is just pain stupid.
Yep! Total moran!
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:35 AM EST up reply actions
shouldn't have been a votar
is all he’s saying.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
re: Allen Craig
How does one have an OBP nearly seventy points higher than his BA and still get labelled as someone who “doesn’t walk enough”? Was he hit by 50 pitches?
70 pts isn't that huge a gap. he had a walk rate of 7.5%. that's not awful, but it's not that impressive.
guys hugely reliant on their BA or SLG are more likely to not see that skillset transfer to the ML.
I agree that if he has a .800 OPS in the majors, I won’t care too much about his walk rate. the concern is that some people who suck at taking walks in AAA will not succeed in the bigs.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
Yeah
also, walkrates are one of the things that generally take a nosedive from AAA to MLB, and his isn’t that high to begin with.
Rasmus in AAA: 13%
Rasmus in MLB: 7%
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:38 AM EST up reply actions
he was a big cheese
in the minors and pitchers were likely more careful. i’d think his walk rate will go up with a little adjustment to mlb pitching (in other words, once he starts hitting more dingers and scorching gappers, as well as identifying that low breaking ball)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
His walk rate was around 7.5%
which is pretty average. A true TTO (three true outcomes) player will walk at a 10-12% rate in the minors which would relate to around a 8-10% walk rate in the major leagues.
It’s not that he doesn’t take walks, like Rick Ankiel, it’s that really good plate discipline in the minors usually leads to really good plate discipline in the majors, which is generally thought to be a good indicator in success at the major league level. You can count on one hand the number of hitters who have little to no plate discipline and are successful in the majors for any length of time (Pablo Sandoval and Vlad Guerrero would be the two I could think of).
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
I wouldn't call him a "successful"
major league hitter either. If he wasn’t a good to great defensive backstop who has some power he wouldn’t be in the big leagues. No way does he put those numbers up in a corner outfield or infield position and keep his job.
Please consider any Hot Stove talk in the above comment is spoken under the assumption that the Cardinals are not signing Matt Holliday.
is walk rate the only measure
of plate discipline? because craig has looked very disciplined to me in that he doesn’t offer at pitches he can’t do much with, even when they are strikes, which often puts him in the hole and being down 1-2 in the count could be responsible for suppressing his walk rate. any thoughts? (when i say he has looked…to me, SSS of probably 20 2009 AB’s)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Jury Duty is OVER!!!!!!!!!!
Woooooooooo, So does anyone want a copy of moneyball? This is the third time I’ve read it, and I can’t see myself reading it again.
Go Broncos!!
by from First to Third on Nov 19, 2009 8:07 PM EST reply actions
Am I the only person in the world that enjoys jury duty?
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
My husband just got a summons.
I wish it was me instead. But, knowing the limited pool of jurors in St. Louis, my time will come soon enough.
Now with extra feisty!
It's two days of reading, people watching, and telling lawyers you think pot should be legal!
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I have been called for jury duty twice
both times all of the cases pending got settled. I didn’t even get to make it to the courthouse. I am still disappointed.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Im glad its over because it was 10-2 for 2 days, and finally it happened
I actually enjoyed it, it was a life changing experience. I’m glad my encounters with the law have never been bad enough to require much court, only a nice little 7:00pm date with the judge to get a little fine. It really made me think watching all these cases being put to trial, to know that there are some really messed up people out there with a lot of time on there hands doing some evil shit. I though my life was complicated when I had only 3 hours from the time I got off work to get some Call Of Duty in before I went to class. My problems are pretty gay compared to some of these people with some serious issues. I’m just going to enjoy my Cardinals baseball a little more next year, Holliday or not. Things were put into prespective for me, or I have had one too many Khalils since I’ve got off
Go Broncos!!
by from First to Third on Nov 19, 2009 8:56 PM EST up reply actions
Of Jury Duty
had to hit it before I got a TWSS
Go Broncos!!
by from First to Third on Nov 19, 2009 8:58 PM EST up reply actions
I'm so happy
As a law student I’ll never have to jury duty ever.
by Mulliganstew on Nov 20, 2009 7:42 AM EST up reply actions
Hmm...
@JoeStrauss Just got off phone with Carp’. Yeah, he’s surprised. Details from him and Waino’ in expansive tome in Friday P-D. #stlcards
Now with extra feisty!
I want the unedited, non-Straussian version.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
hope they stay classy.
Nothing worse than a sore loser, especially since Lincecum has a very good argument.
OTOH, luggage is fun.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
The quotes from all three given in the article sound very sportsmanlike
But I absolutely LOVE this quote from Carp:
Carpenter(’s) ’05 experience led him to conclude that he had fallen short this time when he received no notification by noon.
“When I texted Adam and he said he didn’t get a call either, it caught me off guard,” Carpenter said. “I was surprised. Then I went and got a haircut.”
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
I am always amused to hear about players texting each other.
I don’t know why. It makes perfect sense. It just amuses me.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 20, 2009 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
getting a haircut is code for......
whoever finishes this sentence best wins 1 million internet dollars with an extra bonus 500 VEB tokens
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
luggaging McClellan?
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
by andi_k on Nov 20, 2009 12:35 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
im still holding out....
MAKE ME LAUGH PEOPLE
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
it was...
the unkindest cut of all.
YEEEEAAAAAAAHHHH…..
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
having his hair cut.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
smartass.
That’s the second “smartass” I’ve given you on this thread, isn’t it?
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
You have to say it with a very serious face and tone.
Or, just picture how Tracy Morgan would say it.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I heard those baby seals just love to go clubbing.
I want to go clubbing with some baby seals.
I’m Brian Fellow!
That’s the Tracy Morgan I’m thinking of.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
Tracy, talking about his son while his son sits in the corner:
“But I’ve got this little D-Bag over here.”
Son: “I know what that means!”
Tracy: “And yet you won’t tell me!”
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 20, 2009 12:53 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Brian Fellows, Safari Planet
Rocket
I’m taking a rocket
I’m packing my suitcase, so look out Mooooon
Yeah, a rocket
Into outer space
Goodbye human race, I’ll be there soooon
Blast off
For fun and adventure, yes I said adventure
Collectin’ stones
Yeah, it’s my way
On the old space highway, that’s why they all say
There goes Astronaut Jones
Hey!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
get a hair cut = scalp motherfuckers
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 20, 2009 1:09 AM EST up reply actions
somebody got scissored
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Gary Nolan
random inducing there.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
oh yeah... Tyler Norrick is of Festus.
I’m shocked DanUp missed that in the ‘awesome’ line.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Your sarcasm is spilling on the carpet sir
Go Broncos!!
by from First to Third on Nov 19, 2009 9:06 PM EST up reply actions
only hometown pitchers are allowed to blow important games
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:18 PM EST up reply actions
does that make him the onan of sarcasm?
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Nov 19, 2009 11:41 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
oh waino
poor guy. you’re the cy young in my heart. that tim lincecum needs to learn to share (even if he was hands down the best pitcher in the games last year)
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
ahahahaha
why the shit is pujols riding a unicorn?!
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
btw
he looks tubby in that picture
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
by prophetjohn on Nov 19, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
He always looks a little tubby by August
At least since 2005, anyway, iirc. 2004 is the last time I remember him still looking trim in the fall.
That being said, he can look however he wants as long as he keeps being REDICULOUS. That Home Run Chicken is delicious.
Seriously, I actually made some Pollo Guisado last week, following DeeDee’s recipe I modified from pujolskitchen.com. It was soooooo good. I just wanted to keep a little baseball in my life in whatever small way I could.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
and thank you for a wonderful suggestion
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Nov 19, 2009 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
Do it! You won't be sorry.
The Dominican beans are an essential part of the deliciousness, so make sure you serve the chicken with the beans and rice.
It’s also surprisingly inexpensive.
Add much, much more cumin than she indicates. I don’t think good chefs ever reveal their real recipes—they make you figure out your own spice proportions.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
No problem! I would be interested to hear your opinion of it after you've tried it.
I think she “Americanized” the recipe for popular consumption. I’m assuming it’s much more spicy and complex served at home. I would consider this a starting point.
Pujols KitchenDon’t use the one on the Food Network website because it’s missing (even more) major parts of the recipe.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
Dee Dee's just trying to throw off the other hitters' wives
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 19, 2009 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
Smart strategy.
She did say that when his friends from opposing teams come to visit, she will only make that dish for them if they won’t be starting the next day.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
i would think most pitchers would want
a little extra toot on their fastballs
by FlimtotheFlam on Nov 20, 2009 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
Just looking at that recipe
it sounds like a metric shit-ton of ground coriander (erm, cilantro in the states, I think) would work very well alongside the cumin.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:43 AM EST up reply actions
coriander comes in the spice racks here
about all i know about cuisine
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
except i sometimes eat
at a restaurant called cilantro’s (but mostly drink their margaritas)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
In the states,
coriander is the seed and cilantro is the plant part (leaves and stems)
There’s a ton of cilantro in the sofrito (or is it sazon) recipe needed to make the chicken
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
It sounds delicious--like you could modify it as a base for curry or something
add ginger and garlic
That makes me hungry.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
there's almost nothing that doesn't taste better
With more onion, cumin, garlic, and nutmeg.
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
by tom s. on Nov 19, 2009 11:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Even better if you toast and grind your own cumin seeds
I have a dedicated spice grinder for cumin.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
andi is hardcore!
the truth can't hurt you, it's just like the dark/ it scares you witless, but in time you see things clear and stark -- macmanus
andi cooks a lot!
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
He *has* gotten a little bit of a belly since we've been together, poor guy.
Husband No.1 did not appreciate my cooking. I shouldn’t elaborate because it’s unseemly to speak ill of an ex-husband.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
silly andi, women can't be unseemly
they can be gossiping nelly’s or chatty kathy’s. but they can’t be unseemly. they’re are just too darn purty & sweet.
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
Hmmm, I dunno
If you had seen me on my two year post-divorce “I’m FRREEEEE” bender, you would have seen some pretty unseemly behavior.
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
Okay, fine--I'm a paragon of virtue
Feel better?
"She gone! Airplane time! Airplane Time!! AIRPLANE TIME." Boog
"I think those scorers must be from Mars or Venus. Or maybe they're just from that book." --Mike Shannon, 7/09/2009
if you'd ever rode a unicorn
you’d know that one’s weight “settles” (black unicorns, however, have a mysterious slimming effect)
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
If something were to happen to—no. No.
pretty sure craig is ahead of him on the 1b depth chart
or so i would imagine
Of course, hope means being cut down on some street corner, as you run like mad, by a random bullet.
much easier now
to figure out who should be on the 40-man roster since the backlog of right-handed pitchers and walruses has been cleared out. I wonder who we would have left off—and possibly lost—if we still had guys like todd, perez, gregerson, and wallace.
also, call me naive, but if allen craig can catch a soft line drive in the ninth inning with two outs in game three of a division series, well, let’s give him a chance :)
"When all's been said and done, I can say that all has been said and done."
-Steve "Lips" Kudlow, of Anvil
wow, i have really repressed the memory of that series...
i think the only treatment is to watch the 2006 playoff videos again, stat!
"When all's been said and done, I can say that all has been said and done."
-Steve "Lips" Kudlow, of Anvil
by redbird brain on Nov 19, 2009 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
Questions
As I hear the downgrades of Carpenter as a Cy Young candidate, I wonder if the writers who downgraded him had voted for Jim Tracy for manager of the year. I also wonder if they voted for Manny Ramirez last year for his less than half season with the Dodgers. And the ones who voted for Lincecum for his poor September when his team needed him most, but voted for Ryan Howard almost solely for his September performances in 2006 and 2008.
Keith Law is anti-Cardinals…not sure why, but he is entitled to his opinions. I don’t mind opinions when they are consistent. However, show the stat lines for the 3 pitchers and don’t have names attached and Lincecum probably doesn’t win the award. If Carp or Waino’s stats belonged to a big media market pitcher, they win, hands down.
All 3 of these guys are good. This is the Cy Young award and the man the award is named after is known mostly for wins and pitching an insane number of innings. Wainwright led in both of those categories.
Every statistic tells lies. WAR, FIP, VORP…everybody can argue until they are blue in the face about which stats should be given how much weight. However, if you want to make a case for any one of these 3, you can find numbers to back it up. The people who downgrade wins as not important have probably never played the game. The new stats like the ones listed above are useful for a lot of analysis, but tend to overvalue strikeouts. It is the pitchers’ job to win, not build a stat database. Good pitchers sacrifice strikeouts to keep their ptich counts down. (and sometimes to appease their coaches) And good pitchers use their defense, especially if they have a good one. So, taking defense out of the equation is useful in free agent evaluations, but IMO should not be over emphasized in Cy Young balloting. Are wins the most important…no, but 4 wins is a huge spread and 15 is the lowest total in Cy Young history.
How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!
I have played the game
And I played it a lot. My college degree was partially paid for because I played the game. And wins still don’t mean anything. They are dependent on things outside of the pitchers control, period. End of story.
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Nov 20, 2009 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
As a pitcher, I valued wins
because it meant I won. I was, theoretically, better than the other guy in allowing runs to score while I was pitching.
But, yeah, they don’t say much about one’s performance, really, and are really rather useless in the big scheme of things.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
You feel nice when you get one, I suppose
But a pitcher’s job is to pitch well. Pitching well, at its simplest form, is simply executing the next pitch, and then doing so over and over. If you throw a good pitch more often than not, your numbers will take care of themselves.
True, Lincecum is more likely to walk someone than Carp or Wainwright, but it’s not like he was a walk machine either. However, the high K rate indicates that his pitches are of consistently high quality, so much so that someone cannot even get enough bat on the ball to make weak contact (as they often do with Carp and Waino [who of course had a lot of K’s this year]).
Anywho, like you said, they don’t mean much. They’re a nice cherry on top of a good performance at best.
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Nov 20, 2009 12:46 AM EST up reply actions
I don't know
I felt as shitty if I lost 2-1 as when I lost 7-6. In micro-terms, my only job was to win that game, I didn’t care how I did it. In macro-terms, my job was to pitch well, a lot.
But I was honestly never happy unless I won, threw a shut out and didn’t walk anyone.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Do you think that major league pitchers "pitch to the score"?
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 12:56 AM EST up reply actions
yes.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
Guys like marquis especially.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I think a lot of guys
turn it off when the get a lead and just put it on cruise control, giving up three or four meaningless runs be damned, as long as they make it 5 or 6 innings (Jeff Weaver, Jason Marquis, Kip Wells) to get a W or a QS.
Others go out knowing that their job is to throw six innings and give up four runs or less (Jeff Suppan, Braden Looper, pre-sinker Joel).
I’d honestly guess 40% of big league pitchers coast at some point in time.
Yet some go out looking to get mother fuckers out (Chris Carpenter, Adam Wainwright, Old Matty Mo and DK), fucking always. They are normally the biggest pricks and the guys who won’t talk to anyone the day they pitch. Fuck. (for emphasis.)
Physically, I don’t think there is much difference between Kip Wells and Chris Carpenter. But mentally, they are 180 degrees apart.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
by Alxfritz on Nov 20, 2009 1:10 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Stuff wise, Carpenter overshadows Wells by so much it's ridiculous
Ditto with control, I don’t even know how you can argue against that.
Anyway, what I’m trying to get at is if two pitchers give up 2 runs in 7 innings, but one pitcher gets 4 runs of support while the other gets 1, would you credit the two pitchers differently.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 1:14 AM EST up reply actions
Wells on his best days has Carps medium day (not his best, nor his worst) stuff
he just can’t repeat it like Carp can. To me, that’s mental.
Anyhoo… No. But if the run differential was greater, probably.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
We'll respectfully disagree on both points then
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 1:21 AM EST up reply actions
[I bow and tip my cap]
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I think I am misreading your question, in hindsight.
if pitcher A goes 7 IP w/ 2 ER
while B goes 7 IP w/ 2 ER
Then I think the both did a great, and the same, job. I would not credit them differently.
Now, if someone gets a six run lead and casually gives up three runs because they’re not focusing their hardest, but who gives a shit they still won, that is pitching to a lead to me. And I think it happens a lot.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
I think pitchers with a big lead often throw more stuff right down the chute
and “challenge” the hitters more than guys with a 1-run lead. I have no real evidence to back that up, but that’s how I feel it quite often goes down. Pitchers are generally more careful with a smaller lead.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:53 AM EST up reply actions
pitching a 1-0 CG shutout
certainly says more (positive) about a pitcher’s performance than winning 12-5 with 6IP, so i don’t believe all wins are created equal, but some are definitely 90% on the pitcher.
pitching duels are often a matter of who blinks first, and the advanced stats might rate the 2 pitchers as overall equals for a certain 1-0 game, but how do you measure that blink?
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Really
Wins don’t mean anything? I bet your coaches loved that attitude. You play the game to win, you don’t play it to have the highest K-Rate per 9 innings. Bottom line is winning. Pitchers and hitters trying to get wins may do things differently during the course of a game to give their teams a better chance win, but it may be detrimental to their statistics.
Are wins dependent on things outside their control…in some ways. Are any other statistics outside that players control…in some ways. No pitcher faces the exact same teams on the exact same days. Bullpens blow games, teams fail to hit, defenses break down, ballparks have different dimensions, weather changes, luck happens, coaches use different strategies, health issues arise. The game is not played in a vacuum, but bottom line, it is the goal of every major league player to win. The other statistics have value, but to completely ignore wins is ridiculous.
If wins don’t mean anything, why don’t we just have the saber bowl and be done with it?
How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!
Let's break down the ways in which wins are out of a players control
1) His team has to score more runs than he allows (so that’s at least 50%).
2) His defense has to play reasonably well, especially if he’s a contact pitcher
3) His manager has to keep him in long enough to qualify for a win
4) His bullpen has to save the game, even if all of those other 3 things happen
Why the fuck would we evaluate pitchers like that?
When looking at the end of season awards, the answer should be pretty simple I think. How good was the pitchers isolated performance. People have different ways of interpreting that (for example, some believe timing should be taken into account, others feel differently), but we can all reasonably agree that it’s necessary to separate pitcher and team performance. FIP does a decent job of that. tRA does an even better job. PZR adjusted ERA is the best, but it’s hard to find good PZR numbers these days. Wins are absolutely one of the worst ways to evaluate a pitcher.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 10:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Team wins are definitely important
That’s why whenever I vote for any individual award (Cy Young, MVP, gold glove, silver slugger, etc), I make sure to only vote for players whose teams won the most games when they played. Strangely, I only ended up voting for Yankees players this year.
by brackenthebox on Nov 20, 2009 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
wins don't mean anything
you’ve managed to confuse the pitching statistic “win” (which is worthless) with an actual victory
you’re in good company though, most baseball writers/fans think the same thing
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 20, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
when will people learn these are two seperate things?
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
the same time I can seperate one matt on VEB from the other
seriously, there’s like 8 of you
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 20, 2009 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
a matt is always near
right…
behind you!
Albert Pujols does not have "down" years. He has "~6 WAR" years.
OH SHI
"There's a lot of things we say that don't make sense to our viewers. Okay, primarily me." ~Al Hrabosky~
by YesWeOquendo on Nov 20, 2009 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
that is some beautiful ass water.
"In 2035, 25 young men will be able to call themselves world champions. Some of those guys haven’t even been born yet. And some of them are Asian." -Mike Shannon
we expect pics of your vacation next week
i’d also like a shell necklace
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
I'm not sure where all my fellow Yadis went
there ought to be more Molinas
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 20, 2009 10:45 PM EST up reply actions
Of course TEAM wins mean a lot
Pitcher wins? Ah, there’s the rub…
VivaElBirdos: Celebrating glorious mustaches since 2009
by redbirdnation8206 on Nov 20, 2009 5:38 PM EST up reply actions
Good Gob I hate the
probably have never played the game
argument. GAH!
Fuck, I get so sick and tired of hearing that. I would bet that the vast majority of people that love advanced stats have played the game. I wish people would start coming up with better stuff than that crap.
Lighten up, Francis - Sergeant Hulka
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on Nov 20, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
...
However, show the stat lines for the 3 pitchers and don’t have names attached and Lincecum probably doesn’t win the award. If Carp or Waino’s stats belonged to a big media market pitcher, they win, hands down.
San Francisco has roughly the same payroll and level of national coverage as St. Louis. If you are arguing that the only reason Lincecum won the award was because of the market that he played in… well that’s just wrong.
Every statistic tells lies. WAR, FIP, VORP…everybody can argue until they are blue in the face about which stats should be given how much weight.
No statistic lies – each just tells you a different thing. For example, FIP shows how the pitcher would have pitched if performance on batted balls and timing were taken out of the equation. WAR (which doesn’t have to use FIP), shows roughly how many wins a player would contributed to an average team above a replacement level player. It can be calculated using ERA, FIP or tRA – or any R/9 estimator out there. Pitcher wins tell you how many times a pitcher pitched at least 5 innings, and had his team score more runs than the opponent. Each of those stats measure different things – however, the last one is by far the most arbitrary, the least descriptive of the pitchers actual performance, and the most team dependent one of the three. That makes it practically worthless when evaluating performance.
The people who downgrade wins as not important have probably never played the game.
That is an unbelievably asinine thing to say. I have played the game, and I bet that 80% of the other posters here advocating for wins have also.
The new stats like the ones listed above are useful for a lot of analysis, but tend to overvalue strikeouts.
No, they don’t. FIP, which I assume you are referring to, values the strikeout by exactly how much it is worth. You could argue that the amount of ground balls is also relevant – then you could use tRA.
Good pitchers sacrifice strikeouts to keep their ptich counts down.
LIncecum was third in the NL in innings pitched (about 8 below Waino).
Meaningless
Are wins the most important…no, but 4 wins is a huge spread and 15 is the lowest total in Cy Young history.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 12:56 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
one interesting thing about SF
they were much better than STL, defensively, by UZR, by close to 70 runs. Yet lincecum still managed to underperform his FIP. While carp and AW both outperformed theirs.
Food for thought.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
you can't quantify motherfuckerness
but it exists.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
but if you don't use motherfuckerness to win
your motherfuckin’ stat will be less motherfuckin’ impressive
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
actually, over the last three full seasons that each pitched
L has underperformed his FIP twice, tying it once; AW has overperformed 3 times; Carp has overperformed twice, and (interestingly) underperformed the year he won the cy young.
The giants have been better than the cardinals by UZR 4 of the last 5 years, though last year was the only one in which the difference was so significant as to make me go “wow”. A UZR diff of ~10% of the runs scored by a team seems huge.
Of course you can’t rule out the fact that having L, Zito and Cain pitch for the giants helped their UZR. All 3 have been “lucky” in their careers, by BABIP, compared to an assumed mean of .300.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
that is a wow for last year
because boog vs. renteria is my first instinct. i know winn is good, but…just wow.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
I am very much of the opinion that Waino out-performing his FIP consistently is relevant
I don’t know if it’s statistically significant, per se, but it seems to me he gets himself out of a LOT of jams. Obviously his high GB rate will be under-valued by FIP, but I also feel he pitches very well with men on base, which is a definite and definable skill (whether you call it “timing” or simply a mechanical ability to pitch well from the stretch, or to reduce the number of potential flyball-generating pitches you throw or whatever) that is not represented in FIP.
Obviously, statistical foibles mean that there will potentially be one out of every few hundred pitchers (say, Waino) who out-performs his FIP over a LARGE sample size, and likewise one out of every few hundred guys (say, Javier Vasquez) who will under-perform over a similar sample, perhaps due entirely to luck (i.e. being on the far extremes of good and bad luck over a large sample), but I tend to feel that there may be a significant level of skill involved in that, and I think it probably has to do with the ability to pitch with men on base.
Felonius Monk - bitching to contact since 2008
by Felonius_Monk on Nov 20, 2009 5:59 AM EST up reply actions
it's called
bearing down, or not buckling under pressure, or nerves of steel, or willpower, or motherfuckerness, or not blinking, but some guys have it, and some get the yips
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
it's called replaying the 2006 World Series in his head
which we will no longer find amusing should his control go away, but still.
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
Most good pitchers will overperform their FIP's
And bad pitchers will underperform. Here’s why:
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/why-you-cant-subtract-fip-from-era/
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 9:13 AM EST up reply actions
so why do lincecum (and vazquez) consistently underperform theirs?
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
for lincecum, it's been two and a half years
That’s not a big enough sample to say “consistently”. For vasquez, he’s always pitched a lot worse with runners on base for some reason, even this year.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
he can't see them around his hair
"It was like two ankles." AVENGE BOOG
"But listen, and understand: more Molinas are out there. They can't be bargained with. They can't be reasoned with. They don't feel pity, or remorse, or fear." - THT
by Yadi2Second on Nov 20, 2009 10:45 PM EST up reply actions
Interesting
The first comment about the stat lines was not really directed at Lincecum. (In fact, the SF area writers didn’t put him first.) However, tell me if a Dodger, Mets, or Phillies pitcher had Wainwright or Carpenter’s stat lines that he wouldn’t be holding the trophy.
To your second point, taking out timing and performance on batted balls ignores strategy and a pitcher’s ability to pitch to the situation. Not all batted balls are created equal and not all pitchers can bear down and make timing work for them. Also, Lincecum was bad in the second half of the season when the pressure was greater. (For example, he was 5-5 in the second half and Carp was 10-1) Lincecum was also far better at home than the road…due alot to his pitcher friendly ballpark.
Again, we will have to agree to disagree, wins are not meaningless. Ask any player or manager if wins are meaningless. Ask fans in cities that don’t make the playoffs if they would rather their pitchers have 4 more wins or 50 more strikeouts on the year.
I guess what I am saying is: Give me the same team on the field and I’ll take Wainwright and you take Vasquez, and I will win the game 80% of the time, and you can have the freakin’ saber title.
(I would give the Lincecum-Carp-Wainwright matchups 50-50-50 splits for the most part.)
How about handin' me another helpin' of those mashed taters...thank you very much!
All stats have flaws
FIP undoubtedly takes out too much. tRA takes out less, but still ignores timing. ERA takes out too little, and wins are so shrouded in things that are out of a pitchers control that it’s hilarious to me that anyone would actually use them to judge a pitchers performance.
by vivaelpujols on Nov 20, 2009 10:57 AM EST up reply actions
Wins mean a lot because baseball people say they mean a lot, which makes fans think they mean a lot.
Fascinating.
Now with extra feisty!
Keith Law
The guy is not a big fan of the Cardinals…which is evident by some of his blogs today. That’s fine…Big deal.
But what I don’t get is how in the hell did he get to vote of the National League Cy Young??? This from a guy who was dogging the National League on his blog when he went to a Cardinals – Brewers game back in September.
If the guy doesn’t like the National League how did he get in the position to vote for that league’s best pitcher??
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
by KYCards on Nov 20, 2009 2:16 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
You know what I hate.
Having tests two class periods before a break and then having class the day after the test when it’s a Friday and I really need to pull an all-nighter tonight and don’t want to go to class tomorrow but I will anyway even if I’m up until 5. Stupid teachers.
Also why must teachers put everything right at the same time. I can’t even be accused of procrastinating we just got these huge assignments. School is going to kill me.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
God I'm old
I haven’t been in college since 1998. Seems like a decade ago….uh I guess it has been.
Boy a frosty cold Budweiser would be great about now"…long pause…then an "aahhh". --Mike Shannon
Well I'm free after this semester... If only the job market in Fort Wayne didn't sick.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
ever been to a hockey game in ft. wayne?
met the owner at a baseball tourney in cooperstown this summer. he used to be the gm of the baseball team there. had a bunch of great stories about some of the players that went through there – we drank alot of beer together in a week. never realized ft. wayne is a pretty good-sized place.
"Some days I feel like the hypotenuse in a love triangle; others as if my lucky number is pi."
Komet Hockey is some of the best. A staple in the area.
…I live here, so naturally, I’ve been to a game or 40.
Also, baseball-related, our new ballpark is gorgeous. Set in the southwest corner of downtown, we get a nice “skyline” view.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 20, 2009 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
Why does it have to be Fort Wayne?
And, in a related story, this week marked the 5,000th performance of the Broadway musical "Cats." It also marked the 5,000th time a guy turned to his wife and said, "What the hell is this?"
by jd is legend on Nov 20, 2009 10:14 AM EST up reply actions
That may be better if it was the only class I had.
Then I could stay up until then and then sleep until I have to work the desk at 5.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
I also hate that now Pandora is going through this phase where it thinks I like trombone solos.
I have told it thumbs down on about ten songs that feature “great trombone solos.” I didn’t that many of those existed. y life would be so much better with some baseball (relevant).
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
I don't mind them.
I just don’t know why Pandora thinks this is a quality I look for in my music when I have thumbed up (that sounds dirty this late at night) things like NSYNC, Britney Spears, Owl City, and various rap songs. I guess I like musical songs but that doesn’t automatically mean trombone solos. Whatever. Soon I’ll only be listening to Christmas Pandora so it will be fine.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
It's nostalgic.
I’m not too picky about music. If it makes me happy for some reason, I’ll listen.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
i know every word to "dirty pop"
don’t judge
I'm like a polygon, I'm edgy.
"OHHHHH!!!!!!! IT TASTES. SO. GOOD!!!!!!!!!!"
-BOOOOOOOOG
Sick and tired of hearin' all these people talk about...
(me too. Not ashamed)
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
It's all good...
…so far Winamp has shuffled forth Disturbed, Thin Lizzy, Blue Man Group, Jay-Z, War, Seal, and Kris Kross…in that order.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
The other day
it went from Hellogoodbye, to Glee, to gansta rap. It made me incredibly happy.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
HS tuba player myself
One band that is a blast to listen to is The Dirty Dozen Brass Band. Second Line Sound, New Orleans-based group. They use a tuba in place of a bass guitar. BTW, I fucking hate John Philip Souza.
I was reading about how countless species are being pushed toward extinction by man's destruction of forests. Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us. - Calvin, Scientific Progress Goes "Boink", Watterson
And finally
Twilight. I hate Twilight. That is all.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 20, 2009 2:37 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
careful
i hear vampires keep track of young girls who don’t go see twilight at least 4 times and target them. Don’t be a statistic, dude.
6ly, it’s way out of hand at this point. My gf (children’s librarian at small suburban-LA library) has ordered 20 extra copies of the new (and fantastically stupid) twilight book just to try to keep as many of y’all safe as possible. That’s 3x as many as the typical harry potter release. This is a problem.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
....
pretzels pretzels pretzels pretzels
by gdm426 on Nov 20, 2009 10:21 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
AHAHAHAHA
Rec’d.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 20, 2009 10:28 PM EST up reply actions
I played the trombone for six years
but my terrible secret was that I could not, for the life of me, improvise. Solos in regular band? Count me in. Solos in jazz band? Yikes.
fang's going to yell at me.
He played trombone too. So did one of my best friends. My other best friend and I decided that even she wouldn’t want to hear 10 songs centered around trombone solos.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
Improv takes time...I finally started gettin' a hold of it in 8th grade jazz band
But that’s when my jazz “career” ended.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
by vexedtechie on Nov 20, 2009 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
My brain exploded tonight...
…got a ride to my friends house from someone else goin over there… Turns out when I was gone, my car was hit ’n run…in a subdivision…with my right wheels ON the curb. So now I have a SWEET dent in the left rear and scuffed up headlights on my freshly polished nice black coupe.
Livid.
BOYCOTT HASS AVOCADOS
i know what youre goin through
I went into a CVS for 6 (6!) minutes to buy some beer, i come out, and my car’s left front fender is smashed in. apparently some broad (most likely without insurance) backed into me and drove off. of course CVS’s cameras don’t work so well at night. thats what i get for going to college in a ghetto. awesome.
Matthew, Mark, Lugo, and John.
Best story of the night.
So I’m walking to the bathroom for the third time tonight and I pass two guys playing football on the first floor (quiet floor) of the library. Awesome. Just awesome. The some guy blatantly checks me out as I walk up the stairs. Good confidence when you get checked out at 3 am in pajama pants. Thanks boy in yellow t-shirt.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
I don't even know who he is.
I’ll never see him again.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
you have to walk past the library to pee?
that sounds awful.
FWIW, pajama pants are usually pretty hot, if nothing else than for the implications. OTOH at 3 am on a weekday morning in college, i’d have been checking out the frigging statues in the quad.
it's Clydesdales vs Goats. Actually sums up Cards vs. Cubs quite nicely. -all4tookie
Thanks. Thanks a lot.
I passed two guys playing football on the first floor. Not the library. I was in the library. Don’t confuse me at this hour.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
He said he'd check out statues at 3 in the morning.
Implying I didn’t have to be anything special. I was quite please boy in the yellow shirt was checking me out.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
by ClemsonGirl on Nov 20, 2009 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
Comments like this make me wonder
how pent up people on this board are.
/thinks SleepyCA has a girlfriend
/is using this specific comment to make a general observation
Future Redbirds - tracking Cardinal prospects for Cardinal Nation
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- Josh Hamilton on public relapse: ‘It was just wrong. That’s all it comes down to.’
- Photo: The Marlins’ ridiculous-looking home run sculpture is almost complete
- Yankees GM Brian Cashman lures alleged stalker into police dragnet
- Report: Josh Hamilton had a relapse with alcohol
- Happy Birthday Boy! Wes Ferrell, the best-hitting pitcher of all-time, would be 104
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
