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Ankiel Community Projections

What stands out about our community projections for Rick Ankiel is that nothing really stands out. In many respects, we expect him to have a similar season to the one he had last year. The only real difference is that we, by and large, expect him to be healthier and get more playing time – thus increasing his counting stats. As a community, we don’t see a lot of improvement in his rate stats. To wit:

AB H HR RBI AVG OBP SLG
Ankiel 08 413 109 25 71 .264 .337 .506
Ankiel 08 w/ 467.75 AB 467.75 123.49 28.3 80.45 .264 .337 .506
VEB 09 467.75 128.39 28.95 86.73 .274 .339 .513

Last year’s homer rate was 1 homer per 16.53 AB. This year, we have him projected for 1 every 16.16 AB. The RBI rate goes up a little in our projections. Possibly that’s an indicator that we expect the Cards’ offense to be a little better in ’09. I know I do. We should see a lot of Rasmus in the OF + there’s depth w/ Skip, Mather, and possibly a healthy Duncan rather than Miles/Kennedy/Lopez. Greene’s replacing Izturis at short and, as Dan and I said each of the last 2 days, the offense shouldn’t take too big a step backwards w/ Glaus out of the lineup for the first month to 6 weeks.

Here’s a look at the ranges for our various stats:

AB H HR RBI AVG OBP SLG
High 595 177 44 112 .299 .391 .580
Low 312 80 14 48 .241 .302 .435

The members who seemed to be closest to our community projection were IL and STLFan or tom s. who nearly nailed 6 of the 7 categories.

Now let’s see how the VEB projections compare to Marcel, Chone, and ZIPS.

AB H HR RBI AVG OBP SLG
CHONE 446 113 25 66 .253 .319 .475
Marcel 402 107 21 62 .266 .334 .483
ZIPS 462 120 28 85 .260 .318 .496
VEB 09 467.75 128.39 28.95 86.73 .274 .339 .513

Sheesh! Look at that ZIPS projection! Did you people cheat? Once again, we’re the most optimistic projection but it doesn’t seem to be near as pronounced as the previous projections for Ludwick, Wainwright, and Greene. And before you go all Earl Weaver on the Marcel projections – particularly as it relates to his ABs – it’s not all that far-fetched if Ankiel hits lefties in ’09 the way he did in ’08. His slash stats vs. lefties (in 123 PAs) were .224/.268/.448. Not good. And if Joe Mather plays well, especially against lefties, and Rasmus solidifies CF, Ankiel’s playing time against southpaws could fall appreciably. Now, Mather didn’t exactly knock the cover off the ball last year against lefties (.219/.292/.391) in his 72 PAs but his career minor league OPS is 124 points higher vs. lefties than righties so it’s possible that he could become an integral part of the lineup against lefties. The playing time could come down to Ankiel vs. Rasmus.

The interesting thing will be to see what an .850 OPS guy w/ 28 homers who can play any of 3 OF positions is worth on the free agent market next offseason. If Rick meets ours (and ZIPS’) projections, he’s going to earn 4 years and $10M + per season – probably near $50 M for 4 seasons. That probably, as some of you pointed out in the thread yesterday, will put him out of our price range for 2010, particularly in light of our OF depth in the system. Hopefully, Jay and Jones will be working their way closer to the bigs and Mather takes a step up this year. Who knows what Craig and Wallace are likely to do as they garner some PT in the OF but, as we’ve pointed out myriad times, this is far and away the deepest part of our minor league system. There just doesn’t seem to be a need to pay Ankiel, who’ll turn 31 in 2010, big money when we can get basically the same production for near the minimum and use that $10 M to bolster the rotation or SS.

In other news, there really is no other news – the Cards’ fanbase is pissed at Mo and DeWitt. Film at 11. Oh well.

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Dealing Rick during the sesaon

I was previously a big advocate of moving Rick in the offseason to make room for Ras. Clearly Mo made him available to teams who inquired so I must assume nothing of great value has been offered for Rick. With his injury history (and depressed performance during the period that TLR played Rick in 2008 while he was clearly injured), I can see why his stock is down. If Rick is on a pace for 25 HRs at the All-Star break and playing a respectable CF, he’ll have substantial value in the trade market. We’ll never resign him after the season so it makes the most sense to move Rick before the trade line and get Ras into the lineup every day. I know TLR would throw a hissy fit as the team will probably still be lurking in the standings hoping to make a move in the 2nd half but JMo has to be strong and move Rick when his value in the market is at its highest.

by jjray on Jan 25, 2009 12:08 PM EST reply actions  

with you 100%

but we will lose this one. Mo won’t take the wrath of the fans (and/or Tony’s) if he peddles Ank, especially if the deal is less than stellar.
I’d love the OF to be Skip/Mather-Ras-Luddy; with Barton as the 5th sub. No Ank, no Dunc.

by the Tewk on Jan 25, 2009 7:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Confucius Says- Happy mooooooo year

First, a shout out to moocow. The lunar calendar just turned here in China- so we begin the year of the cow/ox.

Anyway, I don’t think the VEB prediction to be wild and I was about to say something similar to what jjray just posted.

Before, I had been in favor of just holding on to The Rick, and that wouldn’t be all so bad, but the way things are stacking up (and hopefully he does produce at a good level this year) I do agree that he should be moved sometime this season.

MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

by Scarecrow7775 on Jan 25, 2009 12:12 PM EST reply actions  

Rick Ankiel = Kyle Lohse

The feeling I get is that the Cardinals will hold onto Rick all season long and then sign a 5 year extension with him in August worth more than they can probably afford. He’ll block other OF’ers from getting playing time and 2010 will be more of 2008.

by Hardcore Legend on Jan 25, 2009 12:54 PM EST reply actions  

If Jock was still holding Dewallet's checkbook

I might see them doing something that stupid. But I hope and pray JMo takes a longer view of what is in the team’s best interest. The only way to extend Pujols for the king’s ransom he will command is to have a bunch young cost controlled players spread out on the roster. Rick is just a luxury they cannot afford long-term when considering stockpiling payroll for the Mang. And Rick’s injury history gives me cause for concern with a long-term deal. He reminds me too much of JD Drew in this regard (same agent too). That’s on top of the fact that we have a cheap replacement for Rick waiting in the wings. Rick has done an awesome job bridging the gap between Edmonds and Rasmus but, in the end, that should be his Cardinal legacy.

by jjray on Jan 25, 2009 1:14 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Ras

I worry that Ras won’t meet everyone’s expectations. Where are we with a .238 AAA Ras in the big leagues? Skippie?

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jan 26, 2009 5:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Similar but different feeling

I can see a 3 yr deal now to buy out last arb year and his first two free agent years. Thinking is that Ank loves playing in STL, has limited cities where his psyche would survive scrutiny, and Boras just pulled a similar move with Madsen. If Ank doesn’t get an extension now, he’ll be gone at mid year based on Raz and lack of playing time.

I believe the next year’s free agents will face the same problem as this year’s. Top 5% will get the money and length of contract, the rest will be scrambling for a paycheck. Ank’s would be betting on a full healthy productive season against signing a guaranteed contract extension. imo, Jayson Werth’s deal $7 mm is closer than Gary Matthews Jr $10 mm deal.

by ubeddie on Jan 25, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Projections

Thanks C, but I wonder how you generate the numbers? A little too ethereal for me. The mountains vistas of Nepal predict spring training will happen, a closer will emerge, and there will be deals made that satisfy the angry in the nation. By the way, I couldn’t believe some of the posts in Mo’s SPD chat. Must have been Cubs fans. I can’t believe the angst about Glaus. Mo got him in one of the best deals in awhile. I can remember everyone moaning on this site at the time that Glaus had no D, etc etc. He outperformed Scott hugely. I am surprised about the people complaining that the Cards are not proactive enough about health issues, although I understand the frustration. El Hombre has been playing with this bad elbow for some years, why wouldn’t Troy try to let it heal naturally? It didn’t work, got worse, so surgery. I would do the same.

by kkkkathmandubirdsview on Jan 25, 2009 12:57 PM EST reply actions  

I'm with you

Some of those ‘questions’ in the Post were something else. I can’t believe they allowed them through. Hopefully he makes some moves around spring training like he said.

by CardFan@theLake on Jan 25, 2009 2:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Link?

por favor

Patiently awaiting the day Colby Rasmus does this: .275/.381/.551/.932, 29HR, in St. Louis...

by RunninRedbird on Jan 25, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions  

holy crap, i just had a WCBW flash back

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Jan 25, 2009 6:09 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

+1

The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.

by thegodfather on Jan 25, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Apparently...

…not all is well in Pinstripe Land.

Joe Torre wrote a book and some of the details are, well, interesting. Apparently Brian Cashman let Torre swing in the wind and Yankees players don’t like one of the game’s best players very much. Furthermore, I guess ARod had some kind of obsession with Captain Clutch. Who knows if any of this stuff is true. We’ll see I guess.

LINKY HERE

"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.

by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 25, 2009 2:17 PM EST reply actions  

i am

I miss Chris Carpenter

by Evilfrog on Jan 25, 2009 3:09 PM EST up reply actions  

What ever happened to p-dub?

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 3:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Wilson?

Im pretty sure he hurt his shoulder in the 06-07 offseason and was out for the whole 07 season. After that im not sure.

by Evilfrog on Jan 25, 2009 3:17 PM EST up reply actions  

ray lankford

in his hey-days in the 90s. when he came back in 04 he just wasn’t the same slugger i liked.

Cardwash - Cardinal, Washington fan (Washington???? Yeah, I know)

by cardwash on Jan 25, 2009 5:55 PM EST up reply actions  

ray lankford

He is the anti-Willie…….. The only Cardinal that was with the team for an extended period of time I have truly disliked. I will never forget the game where lankford picked up a double in the left field corner and TRYING to throw the ball home threw the ball into the stands. What a Bonehead!!!!!

by Retire51 on Jan 26, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions  

His stuff was more fun to watch than anyone else

The 2-seam/cutter combo was so cool how they’re the same pitch at 30 feet and then they end up 8 inches apart or whatever. Then there’s the roundhouse curve, and just for kicks a changeup here and there. So many weapons to deal with as a hitter and he’d throw anything in any count.

Not afraid to nitpick

by joker24 on Jan 25, 2009 3:37 PM EST up reply actions  

yea

truly an ace that guy was…to bad he can’t stay healthy

by VolsnCards5 on Jan 25, 2009 4:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Too bad we didn't trade him when we should have!

nc.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 4:37 PM EST up reply actions  

I missed the sarcasm

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jan 25, 2009 4:52 PM EST up reply actions  

at least

Carp gave us 3 good years instead of mulder’s 1. Although carp still has a chance to at least pitch decently for us the next few years.

Cardwash - Cardinal, Washington fan (Washington???? Yeah, I know)

by cardwash on Jan 25, 2009 5:57 PM EST up reply actions  

And a Cy Young

And a World Series (that he pitched in, well).

Still a bitter pill right now…here’s hoping Bill DeWitt’s best delusions come true!

Sign someone who can pitch, then let this team play.

by IL and StL Fan on Jan 25, 2009 6:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't get me wrong

I love Carp for what he gave us, but it seemed to me that we should have traded him after 2006 when it was apparant (so I thought) that it was time to rebuild.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 11:10 PM EST up reply actions  

trade him coming off of a WS title

when he was still a bad ass? I think the fanbase would have burned the new stadium down. Of course we could have traded him at the deadline in ’07.

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jan 26, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Anyone the news

re: Kris Benson? Apparently threw in front of 9 teams, (only 7 mentioned) and the Dodgers and Cardinals were the teams that “expressed the most interest in his services”. Ugh. Please. Sure, he’d be cheap, but he hasn’t pitched in the majors since ’06. Maybe sign him to a minor league deal and invite him to ST, but nothing more than that, I hope.

There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2009 4:05 PM EST reply actions  

Err...Anyone *seen* the news...

There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2009 4:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Does that mean

that we can pay him $2M to work out when Looper would cost $5-6M to pitch? When Ben Sheets would cost $9M to pitch? Hell, I’d pitch for free.

All of these “low hanging fruit” deals add up. We should stop spending money on several reclamation projects and spend it on one or two good players.

The Godfather himself has decided to grace us with his presence. This is his damn house. He sleeps 20 feet away.

by thegodfather on Jan 25, 2009 5:20 PM EST up reply actions  

I've been discovered

yes, I am indeed Bill Gibson, drummer for the News and when Huey left the band it was a very hard time for me. However, we hope to be producing a new album this year.

by Hardcore Legend on Jan 25, 2009 4:23 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Didn't you guys

just play the ARF fundraiser?

by spants on Jan 25, 2009 5:32 PM EST up reply actions  

and if you did

did you convince Tony to make Skip a second baseman?

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jan 25, 2009 8:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Minor league contract is Benson's best hope

Similar to Freddy Garcia’s contract If he pitches well in ST then maybe he gets a spot in the rotation with an incentive laden contract. Otherwise he replaces Matt Clement in Memphis for two months, then signs with Toronto in 2010

by ubeddie on Jan 25, 2009 5:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Torontos SB nation blog

should be titled “Third generation Angels”

(though only one was an angel)

www.GriffinandtheGargoyles.com or www.myspace.com/GriffinandtheGargoyles
Dont take me seriously :-D

NO Garland, NO Wolf, NO Looper!

by jealousblues on Jan 25, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions  

I was struck by some of Rick's splits when I check B-R for this project.

I always knew he struggled in late innings, but the gulf is enormous. He hits like Pujols in innings 1-3 and like Brendan Ryan in innings 7-9.

Check the splits (BA/OBP/SLG/OPS)
Inning 1-3 — .343 /.425 /.664/1.089
Inning 4-6 — .293 /.362 /.571 /.934
Inning 7-9 — .165 /.229 /.308 /.537

Now some of the late inning difficulties may be facing lefty-specialists. But even his LH splits aren’t as bad as his late inning splits ( v. LH: .224 /.268 /.448 /.717).

Is this random noise? We’re talking at least 140 PA’s in each third of the game for this season. His 2007 splits don’t reveal such an extreme trend, which makes me think maybe we won’t see the same split return. But the fact that we’re talking about a reasonable (not huge) sample size and such a striking gulf between early and late innings makes me worry.

by tom s. on Jan 25, 2009 7:49 PM EST reply actions  

that's funny

it makes me hopeful. He was obviously a different player in the late innings, and that’s easy to fix with either a “defensive replacement” or a pinch hitter.

Assuming he doesn’t fix it himself with yoga, post-hypnotic suggestion, or a tequila shot in the dugout after the 6th, 7th, and 8th innings. or something.

still cannot accept that Rachael was Chani.

by SleepyCA on Jan 25, 2009 8:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Mather seems like a good fit as a late-game replacement, partially to get him PA's, partially

because he would mess with attempts to use lefty specialists in late innings, partially because his skill set matches w/ rick’s.

I hope the seventh-inning strech shot of tequila isn’t what’s causing the late inning struggles.

by tom s. on Jan 25, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, but one of those inning 7-9 at-bats came in

this game. Sure, it’s a sample size of one, but that one really kicked ass!!

by BTown Birds fan on Jan 25, 2009 9:26 PM EST up reply actions  

fyi

hummel says mo has final say on questions for his chats. double bad mo!

"No matter where you go, there you are" Buckeroo Bonzai Across the 8th Dimension

by sportsman on Jan 25, 2009 9:25 PM EST reply actions  

Take it for what it's worth, but Bernie says

Mo doesn’t choose the questions – “I have no idea who does the screening. I do not know the specifics of the process. But he does not choose the questions.”

I’d be inclined to believe Hummel over Bernie, and if it’s true I agree that’s a bad one on Mo. He could still take critical questions to keep the whole process a little more legitimate and interesting; he just doesn’t need to take the questions from spoiled twelve-year-olds.

by BTown Birds fan on Jan 25, 2009 9:33 PM EST up reply actions  

'46 World Series is on The MLB Channel

n/c

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 11:03 PM EST reply actions  

Go Stan Musial!

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 11:04 PM EST up reply actions  

Wow, Stan was fast in his younger days.

n/c.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 11:12 PM EST up reply actions  

I think everyone was

back then.

hecanthithecanthithecanthithecanthit

by Alxfritz on Jan 25, 2009 11:36 PM EST up reply actions  

'44 Series is now on!

.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 11:30 PM EST reply actions  

When was the 11th Championship?

Unless you’re talkin’ about the “stolen” series of ’85?

There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2009 11:40 PM EST up reply actions  

1886

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 25, 2009 11:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Ah, yes.

Pre-1900 years. Forgot about those Von der Ahe teams.

There was Gibson in the Reds' dugout, visibly manhandling about three Reds and tossing them bodily out of the dugout and onto the field...He was the toughest athlete mentally I ever saw, and the greatest competitor. JACK BUCK

by ISawGodInGibby'sRightArm on Jan 25, 2009 11:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Watching Game 2 of 2006 WS now

It retrospec it seems obvious KR was pine-taring his fingers.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 26, 2009 12:05 AM EST reply actions  

you know

at the time, I HATED him for that. Now I look back on it, basking in the glow of the championship, and I am not so mad.

Sadly, I don’t get the MLB channel, so I can’t watch it.

still cannot accept that Rachael was Chani.

by SleepyCA on Jan 26, 2009 12:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Give TLR credit

He didn’t want to make a big deal of it and distract his team. Most of Cardinal Nation, myself included, were not so magnamamous.

The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!

by Zubin on Jan 26, 2009 12:52 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah don't ask Jillsinmo about that one

"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.

by redbirdnation8206 on Jan 26, 2009 8:41 AM EST up reply actions  

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