bullpen question/tlr
does anyone know the final tally on blown saves this year? hate to think that we save half of however many and win the division while the cubs scrounge for the wild card.
also, anyone else optimistic that tony will leave before 2009? i admit he did well with keeping everyone fresh off the bench, but some of these kennedy in right/lopez at third/miles in left calls cost us games, and don't get me started about bullpen management...it would be my primary filed grievance against his return. i just seemed to disagree with him so many more times this year than in the past, and to think with some responsible bullpen maintenance this team could have won 100...just testing the waters of public opinion.
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LaRussa
LaRussa will definitely be back for 2009. I think 2009 is the main reason he signed a two-year deal. You have to remember how much pride Tony has and most importantly, how much he loves baseball. The Cardinals are hosting the All-Star Game in 2009. There is no way Tony is going to miss out on participating in that event. I also have a hunch ownership told him they were setting the table in 2008 for winning the championship in 2009. So we’re going to see some moves to form a team Tony likes and one that’s more competitive in 2009.
I think after 2009, though he will definitely leave. And eventually, Pujols may follow. It would not surprise me to see LaRussa and Pujols joining Walt Jocketty in Cincinnati in 2010.
by Matt Bug on
Sep 30, 2008 3:08 PM EDT
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Pujols is signed through 2011
There is absolutely no way in hell that the Cards are gonna trade Pujols inside the division after next season. That would be a sure fire way for the fanbase to desert the Cardinals.
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
by mattyfrommo on
Sep 30, 2008 6:03 PM EDT
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Why would Pujols go to Cincy?
The guy’s a competitor and wants every chance to win and that franchise has been stuck in the mud for years. Jocketty will help them move forward, but they are still years from being even close to competitive in this division. I seriously doubt Albert would be willingly go there, if for some absurd reason we decided to trade him.
As for LaRussa, I think he is done with the BOB after 2009. FO is going to try to give him the best chance to win a WS next year by finding his “impact bat” and shore up the pitching to send him off with his legacy solidifed (as if it wasn’t already…)
Ryan Howard: one of the most Statistically Outstanding players of all time
by RunninRedbird on
Sep 30, 2008 6:46 PM EDT
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I think TLR will stay
for next year and probably at least three more years after that. My totally unfounded theory is that he wants to pass John McGraw on the wins list and will need that long to do it. As long as he wants to manage and thinks he has a decent chance of succeeding here, he will stay. I just don’t see ownership firing him or letting him just walk away.
Just to be clear, I don’t like that scenario, but I think the only reason he came back after the 2006 WS victory was to go for his personal milestone. Like I said, totally unfounded, but that is my belief. Maybe they will sell him the team after that and he can manage until he’s 90 like Connie Mack.
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
by giveml on
Sep 30, 2008 11:17 PM EDT
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Sure sounds like he wants to stay
Russa said Monday that he has every intention of returning to manage the Cardinals in 2009, pending the wishes of ownership and the team’s front office. Considering he took a team widely predicted to finish below .500 to an 86-76 finish, those wishes would seem to be a foregone conclusion.
“I was at the owners’ last night,” he said on Monday. “There’s always a farewell thing for the staff. It was a social thing, it wasn’t an official thing, but nobody said they didn’t want me. And I’d like to be back. So I’m assuming.”
That doesn’t sound like a man with his foot out the door.
The greater question pertains to pitching coach Dave Duncan, who is not signed for 2009. Duncan has been La Russa’s pitching coach dating all the way back to the 1980s, when they were together on the staff with the Chicago White Sox.
“I think that he has put himself in a position where his value is unquestioned,” La Russa said. “I think the whole industry knows about it, and we have an edge, so I’m hoping that we play the edge and keep him. But you’ve got to recognize the value that he has. I don’t think anybody doesn’t recognize that value, including other clubs and our club. So we’ll see.”
He even sounds like he will stay if Duncan is gone.
by Evilfrog on
Sep 30, 2008 3:32 PM EDT
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doh!
Forgot my source. Matthew Leach.
by Evilfrog on
Sep 30, 2008 3:32 PM EDT
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while there's worse things than having Larussa back
it would probably be much more interesting to have a different manager imo
go rays
by Cards Fan in Chitown on
Oct 1, 2008 12:54 PM EDT
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31 Blown Saves By My Count
Here’s the Cards Sporting News statistics page. Ryan Franklin had 8, and Izzy had 7 to lead the way.
"The big possum walks late." - Harry Caray
by memphiscub on
Sep 30, 2008 3:35 PM EDT
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my 2 cents
I don’t think LaRussa was the problem for this team not winning 100 games. Izzy completly losing it, Villone not being able to get a lefty handed hitters out (i.e no reliable LH reliever) , McLellan wearing down from to many innings, Franklin not being able to close, Carp not making it back, Wainwright missing 2 months, and ultimately losing Ankiel and Mather in Sept all conspired to hurt this team in 2008.
winning 86 was an impressive year.
Take $18M worth of 2 starters off the Cubs including a cy young winner (i.e Carp, Moulder) for the whole season. Lose another $6.5M in a starting LF (Encarnacion) who may never play again. Be forced to eat $2.4M and cut your best utlilty man (Spezio) due to substance abuse problems. (note – that is $26.8M is dead money). Then have your $8M closer suddenly lose all abillity to get anyone out. Throw in a multitude of everyday baseball injuries and see if they win 100 (which they didn’t anyway).
No, TLR was not the problem in 2008 no matter how much you disagree with his moves or dislike him.
by Knighttime on
Sep 30, 2008 4:43 PM EDT
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Yep
Injuries, lack of depth to make up for injuries, and just being short a player or two in general.
by SoonerfanTU on
Sep 30, 2008 5:08 PM EDT
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Not to take away from your overall point
but your Villone comment baffles me. TLR clearly misused Villone. Lefties had a .630 OPS against him, righties .869. Lefties had 84 AB’s against him vs. 99 righty AB’s. Villone had no problems with lefties. Villone is a loogy, yet TLR refused to use him as one.
by outraged on
Sep 30, 2008 5:13 PM EDT
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good point
Thank you. I didn’t take the time to look up Villone’s spilts – i just knew he wasn’t as good as we needed him to be.
by Knighttime on
Sep 30, 2008 5:34 PM EDT
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Interesting
that you don’t think TLR had any control or blame over the first four items on your list. I think many would blame him for all the bullpen issues you listed. Combine that with playing obviously injured and ineffective players (Duncan and Ankiel) for extended periods of time, then I think you can point a finger his way. Despite losing Carp (I can’t believe anybody seriously counted on Mulder) we still only missed the playoffs by four games.
I also think getting 15 wins out of an emergency replacement starter in Lohse and having an obscure OF finish fourth in the NL in OPS are two key factors in the success of the team that he really shouldn’t get any credit for.
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
by giveml on
Sep 30, 2008 11:27 PM EDT
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good points
all around, really happy with the conversation that was generated. i will concede we did suffer a lot of injuries (as seems to be the norm now), but i just hate to think about those 31 blown games, knowing that it would have taken winning only 12 of them to win the division and homefield throughout the playoffs from the friggin’ cubs, and have a virtual cakewalk to the world series, (let’s go dodgers—i think this will be a MUCH more competitive team than north shore chicago is anticipating).
oh well, i guess we all knew 2009 was the year we were waiting for. hope dewitt finds the money and mo works the phones like we need him to reclaim the division title next year, at the very least.
MY 2009 wish list:
-re-sign lopez for short, let izturis walk
-spend the money on uggla at second for a power bat (maybe oquendo can fix his glove?)
-sign brian fuentes for the left side of the pen
-find the money to re-up on wellemeyer AND looper (both deserved deals before lohse got the big money IMO); let pineiro walk
-prayed we would save money for aj burnett, but it appears that went to lohse. maybe we still go after a big fish for the rotation?
considering kinney’s back (fingers crossed), motte, perez, kyle-mac, and springer will hopefully be available next year from the right side, and either villone/flores,jaime garcia, tyler johnson, and ideally fuentes from the left side, i think the bullpen sounds more solid than i anticipated. motte/perez closing? or would it go to fuentes if we picked him up?
input/editing/insertion of your ideas and wish lists welcome!
by gsjefferies93 on
Oct 1, 2008 3:35 AM EDT
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is uggla a free agent?
go rays
by Cards Fan in Chitown on
Oct 1, 2008 1:05 PM EDT
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Are you really
saying that Lopez should play SS and Uggla should play 2B? If that is the case then we better rework the pitching staff toward fly ball pitchers because a boatload of gound balls would get through that infield. My only real issue with the Lohse signing is I think it probably precludes a signicant upgrade at SS. Unless someone else comes in and throws ridiculous money at Lopez, he will probably be our 2B next year. Hopefully, it will be only a one-year deal with a club option. I hope we have learned our lesson on giving recycled 2Bs multi-year deals.
Also, I don’t ever want to see Randy Flores in a Cardinal uniform again. Garcia will miss pretty much all of 2009 and I think it would be a little bit of a surprise if TJohnson comes back. It 2would be a great thing to have a quality lefty in the ’pen, but a bigger payroll team will probably land Fuentes.
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
by giveml on
Oct 1, 2008 9:46 AM EDT
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that we be the most ugglay MIF in the bigs
go rays
by Cards Fan in Chitown on
Oct 1, 2008 1:05 PM EDT
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I think there's room to criticize Tony
this season, but this was not going to be a 100 win team…period. We weren’t that good. I don’t even agree with the notion that we “underachieved.” The pen could’ve pitched better and the offense from the MI was, by and large, horrific. Playing Kennedy and the other infielders in corner OF spots was absurd but they didn’t cost us 14 wins, not by a long shot.
by chuckb on
Oct 2, 2008 12:49 AM EDT
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Especially since.....
Most of the crazy lineups didn’t appear until the last few weeks of the year, which included times where Molina was out, Glaus was out, Mather was out, Ankiel was out, Barton was injured or just returning, and numerous other things.
Gotta think will all the returning MI’s, that we might have been showcasing AK and Miles, and maybe to a lesser extent Ryan, while trying to figure out what to do with Lopez.
by SoonerfanTU on
Oct 2, 2008 1:30 PM EDT
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i would agree
that the displacement of a lot of the MI’s came in september. i don’t think these quirky decisions cost us too many games, i know that lopez at third cost us two for sure with errors or other miscues. and as we know, games add up guys. i’m not claiming that this was a 100 win team, and i will admit that we overachieved with some unknowns. BUT. those 31 blown saves and arguing that this COULD HAVE BEEN a 100 win team easily are still ideas that i’m standing by. it’s simple math that had half of those saves been converted we win 100+, the division, and quite possibly make a run through a terribly weak NL playoff bracket. but we’re all tired of the could have/should have i know, so i’ll let it go. it’ll be a long, cold winter, but a little warmer if the cubs get swept by LA. :D
by gsjefferies93 on
Oct 2, 2008 1:48 PM EDT
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