If the Schu fits...
by chuckb on Jul 6, 2008 1:00 AM EDT
in St. Louis Cardinals News
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Print[HC left for vacation the other day, and wrote this post before he left town and placed it into the publication queue. that's why there's no mention of yesterday's heroic comeback. --- lb]
Coming into this season, it was, for the first time, a virtual certainty (don’t you like those oxymoronic terms?) that Skip Schumaker would be on the active roster. Though he made the club out of the spring of ’07 as well, nobody saw him as a regular, everyday contributor. In fact, even this spring most didn’t see him playing as often as he has. Most of us saw Duncan, Ankiel, and Ludwick all getting more playing time in the OF than Schumaker and it wasn’t unreasonable to think that Colby Rasmus might also make the club, thus taking even more playing time from Schumaker. Some were even anticipating that Brian Barton would be the everyday CF or LF as Skip assumed the role previously played by So Taguchi.
I’ll admit, when I saw Schumaker’s name in the opening day lineup I saw this as Tony falling in love w/ one of his favorites, ala Miles or Taguchi. After all, Schumaker didn’t exactly have a terrific minor-league pedigree and hadn’t distinguished himself as a major-leaguer either. Sure, there were some signs. His ’07 was pretty good (.358 OBP, 111 OPS+) but he only had 188 PA’s in ’07. His walk rate was a paltry 4.3% and his BABIP was .368 so it was pretty easy to chalk up his ’07 numbers as being fluky.
Here we are, more than halfway through the season, approaching the All-Star break, and Skip Schumaker leads all the Cardinal outfielders in PA’s. Not only that, but it would be unfair and untrue to chalk it up to some sort of favoritism from Tony as Schumaker has demonstrated himself to be an above-average major-league OF. We’ve spoken at great length of the great, All-Star-worthy first half of Ryan Ludwick but little has been said of the great job Schumaker’s done so far. Perhaps it’s that many of us are expecting the other shoe to drop – for Skip’s star to become a white dwarf – so that Rasmus can take his rightful place in the Cardinal OF for years to come.
It’s clear that that time will come – and it will come soon – and nobody’s a bigger Rasmus fan than I am. However, it’s time that we acknowledge that it may not be Schumaker’s place that Rasmus assumes when his ticket is punched. Yes, Ludwick’s been great so far and Ankiel, IMO, has proven himself to be a genuine major-league OF but we can no longer dismiss Schumaker’s performance, and potential, simply b/c he doesn’t hit the homers those two hit.
Schumaker’s evolution as a major-league hitter seems to be genuine. He has, to date, 310 plate appearances so far this season. (numbers are a few days old as I’m now on vacation and had to pre-program this thread.) Skip’s current OPS is .803, making his OPS+ 113. His OBP is a robust .364 – not bad for a leadoff hitter.
His VORP is 16.1. That he’s 7th among NL LF’s masks the fact that the 6 hitters above him are all excellent hitters. They include the likes of Holliday, Dunn, Burrell, Braun, Lee, and Bay. His VORP is greater than All-Star starter Alfonso Soriano, among others. He would be 5th among NL CF’s (w/ Ankiel 4th) and 6th among NL RF’s – ahead of notables such as Jeremy Hermida, Andre Ethier, Justin Upton, Ken Griffey, Jr., and Hunter Pence.
He’s averaging 5.73 RC/27 outs – 19th among NL OF’s. He’s ahead of all the RF’s I just mentioned as well as Chris Young, Juan Pierre, and Jeff Francoeur. His WPA is 1.18 – tied for 11th among NL OF’s w/ Adam Dunn. Never once in Juan Encarnacion’s career was his OPS as high as Schumaker’s over a full season. Most of us considered Encarnacion to be about a league-average OF (though he was overpaid as a Cardinal). That Schumaker, who formerly appeared to be a left-handed version of So Taguchi, has become an above-average OF says something.
The question is not, however, how good has Schumaker been but rather, is his performance sustainable? On the one hand, Schumaker’s BABIP is once again rather high (.326), possibly lending credence to those who question whether Skip has truly turned a corner at the plate. Still, Skip has made a noticeable improvement offensively and nowhere is that more evident than with his increasing BB rate. In his time w/ the Cards last year, as I said earlier his BB rate was 4.3%. In his major-league career prior to this season, it was just over 7%. However, in the first half of this year, Skip has managed to increase his BB rate to 9.1%. Because of his BB rate, this year’s OBP is higher than last season’s despite the fact that his BABIP has fallen by more than 40 points.
The increasing BB rate is important for a leadoff hitter, but Skip has shown considerably more power this season than he ever has before. A full 40% of his hits have gone for extra bases so far this season. His ISO (slugging – BA) is .139 – the highest so far of his career. His EqA is .292 – higher than Derrek Lee’s, among others. The point is that Skip Schumaker is not simply a singles hitter. He has increased his line drive % to 21.2% and that, along w/ his relatively low K rate (12.5%) will help him maintain a relatively high batting average. However, it is the improvement in his BB rate that allows for the increased LD% and increased power. He’s clearly seeing the ball better, recognizing pitches better, and getting better pitches to hit by working pitchers into favorable counts. He’s swinging at fewer pitches outside the zone and making better contact.
All that said, Rasmus’ time is rapidly approaching. He’s been scalding the ball for more than a month now and he’ll be up before the season’s over. Where will he fit in? I’m not sure but I wouldn’t write Skip off just yet. Though he’s younger than both Ludwick and Ankiel, he probably has less trade value than the others simply b/c he has less power and there are probably more doubters about the sustainability of his 1st half performance. Needless to say, though, I’m starting to feel more comfortable w/ the idea of trading one of the others in order for Skip to play everyday.
I went looking for Skip’s comparables, b/c I had a hard time coming up w/ one myself. Prior to this season, his number 1 comp was the illustrious George Vukovich. I suspect that after this season, it will be somebody else. Who does he remind you of?
The first guy I thought of was Nate McLouth – though comps are usually of former players, not present-day but McLouth is another guy who has really made a dramatic improvement in his game. However, McLouth’s improvement has largely occurred b/c of his reduced K rate, not an increased BB rate. He’s been showing more and more power every year and then he’s really taken off over this season’s first half. Still, they’re built about the same and both play the OF so…
In any case, Schu’s been outstanding so far this season and his improved BB rate and high extra-base hit rate give every indication that he should be able to sustain it – for a few years at least. It will be very important for this team to get above-average production from an OF for the next few years, especially since Skip will be cost-controlled for the next 4. If you remember, many of the complaints about the Encarnacion signing revolved around his league-average production and his cost. Would it not have been so much better if the team had been able to get Juan’s production from someone earning a million dollars a year (or less) rather than $5 or so million per year? And Skip’s been better so far this year than Juan ever was.
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Great post
Awesome read. Thanks for making the effort. The glut of outfielders is a good problem to have imo. I just wish we could parlay this into a kick ass middle infielder.
skip's actually not been lucky this year with BABIP
he’s hit 142 GB’s, 60 LD’s, 55 FB’s, and just 3 IFFB’s.
NL batters this year have averaged .228 on GB’s, .224 on FB’s, ~0 on IFFB’s, and .721 on LD’s. If skip had hit a league-average number of each, he’d have 32.4 GB hits, 11.6 FB hits, 43.3 LD hits, or 87.3 overall. He’s had just 82 hits on balls in play, so he’s not been “lucky”; he’s been UNLUCKY by at least 5 hits. Cutting down on the popups and increasing the LD percent have been big factors, I think, though both of those are probably due to being more patient at the plate (he’s increased his P/PA by almost half a pitch per PA this year)...
I’m still not convinced he’s an .800+ OPS player, though. 3 of his 6 HR have been “lucky home runs” according to hittracker, and 2 others were “just enough”; his power boost is likely at least partially an illusion. And he’s been shielded against lefties, though not as much as he should have been (Barton must have sat in tony’s seat on the bus or something) but I’ve very much enjoyed being wrong about his performance, so far (I said in ST that he’d finish the season around .750 at best).
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2008 1:36 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
It has slipped my mind earlier in the day
but Barton has a pretty narly hand wound that was wrapped during July 4ths game. I think that may be why he was sitting.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 1:55 AM EDT up reply actions
the way i recall it was a near-collision with ankiel in CF where he got tripped and rolled over it. he was shaking his hand a lot afterward, and the announcers pointed out that there was blood on his shirt. i thought that was a while ago. perhaps it’s another injury, or perhaps that existing one got infected. infections seem to be all the rage with our outfielders!
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
No, that's correct
The P-D has something on it. Barton evidently has a bone bruise (not a break), but it is too tender to handle the bat properly. It sounds like he’s going to go on the D.L. as soon as Monday.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 2:20 AM EDT up reply actions
interesting...
from bernie’s extra points article:
“Brian Barton doesn’t look good at the plate. He jammed his hand/wrist on the last road trip while trying to make a diving catch, and the rookie outfielder has been hurting. It’s difficult for him to handle the bat with sufficient strength and flexibility. The Cardinals probably will place Barton on the disabled list when they activate shortstop Cesar Izturis from the DL. (Possibly Sunday). This would be beneficial for Barton, who is batting only .203 with a .273 OBP since May 8. Barton’s playing time has decreased, and the Rule V draftee needs to play, needs the at-bats. It’s the only way Barton will draw out his potential. When the injury heals, Barton can go on a one-month rehab assignment and get plenty of ABs.”
i assume thompson will be sent down at some point and an outfielder will be called up. rasmus perhaps? or will it be a righty? if so, i hope its mather, though stavinoha would be okay too i guess.
I'll miss Brian
he’ll lose what little playing time he had and never get it back. Bernie once again makes a disingenuous statement. Barton was coming around. He got 3 starts in 5 games and did great. Then, he was sent back to the bench.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:32 AM EDT up reply actions
None of those 3
a week ago were redhot.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Neither was Barton.....
His little hot streak, if you want to call 2-3 games a hot streak, was a few weeks back, and against all lefties.
It was two weeks ago
and since he tried to win the games in Detroit and Boston single handily, he was sent back to the bench and didn’t get any playing time.
I’m not sure what you are driving at? If you don’t think he should have been getting playing time over Skippy, Duncan or a struggling Ludwick atleast once over the last 2 weeks after the offensive display he put on two weekends ago, then I can’t help you.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
And since Barton was sent to the bench
for Skippy, Skippy has started 9 games and is hitting .257 with a .668 OPS.
Now, if Barton was sent to the bench because of injury, that is one thing. Even with the bruised hand, he was able to hit a HR and a double in Detroit.
But don’t act like they couldn’t find 1 or 2 starts for Barton at the expense of one of the other OF’ers.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I could defently
See him starting over Ludwick durring that stretch. Unless he is hurt and they just wanted to rest him a few days. For some reason they seem to like resting people a few days before they send them to the DL. The DL must be a strenuous please to be if it requires rest before you go.
Duncan got those starts though.....
And that has turned out to be the right decision.
Not sure why everybody (not really directed at you evil) always thinks the guy NOT getting playing time would do so much better. Really makes good fans look unknowledgible at times.
I heard he hurt it
building a rocket ship for a moon trip. Betcha Barton will be included in a trade package. Its unlikely that with Duncan grabbing a life-preserver, that Barton will survive.
Did anyone else notice Ankiel taking a controlled swing and hitting a curve ball, up the middle (gulp). Incredible restraint and heroism.
Westcoastbirdwatcher
by westcoastbirdwatcher on Jul 6, 2008 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
I take back my bash on TLR yesterday then
i did not realize Barton was hurting then.
boo cubs, hooray beer
.212/.287/.221 against LHP is my one real concern with skip, but it’s only 119 PA.
is there a good source for historical minor league splits?
i don’t suppose we could ask for them to also start logging batted ball types in the minors…
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
www.minorleaguesplits.com
unfortunately something happened to the 2006-2007 data. but the ‘08 stuff is there, and the older stuff will be back at some point.
I would expect Skip to get better against lefties faster than, say, CD, since LH contact hitters generally fare better than LH power hitters against LHP (according to tango). We’ll see how it goes.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
My best guess
...regarding Skip’s future is that he’ll stay, along with Duncan (b/c of his dad) and Ankiel (b/c TLR gets all mushy over him, plus he’s a badass), and Barton and Ludwick will eventually leave. I’m figuring on this b/c TLR seems to have developed a “liking” of Schumaker, and therefore would fight like hell to block any kind of trade. That, plus the fact that Ludwick is probably a more valuable trading piece.
In my perfect world, Duncan would be swung for Tim Lincecum, straight up (well it’s my perfect world dammit! I’ll bend it to my will!). Barton would play out this season and then go to AAA to figure out what he can figure out. Ankiel and Ludwick would return as starters, with Schumaker returning as a bench guy/platoon guy. Mather would hammer the holy shit out of lefties and sort of fill in as needed, and Rasmus would kick the holy hell out of the NL next year and win the NL Rookie of the Year. That all isn’t happening, but it would be a nice fantasy world, right?
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 2:03 AM EDT reply actions
That plan will not and can not work
you can’t have Ankiel, Duncan, Skippy and Rasmus as your 4 top OF’ers. That’s 4 lefties.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:05 AM EDT up reply actions
I meant the first plan
not the second one. I dig the second imaginary one!
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:09 AM EDT up reply actions
I think it's the definition of pipe dream
But hey, it’s a pretty good one!
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 2:12 AM EDT up reply actions
you know
mather had so few PA’s at the major league level that if you remove his first two games, he had an OPS over .800.
Just felt like throwing that out there. IMO he certainly didn’t “fail” and deserves a very long look this september (I’m certainly not saying anyone in this thread is accusing him of failing, but there seems to be a mentality of “he got his shot…” when Mather is mentioned as an ‘09 option). He really didn’t.
Regardless, we absolutely HAVE to trade someone, since none of {duncan, schu, luddy, mather} can be sent to AAA next year.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
I agree
Heck, take out the final 5 games or so that he was here and look at his numbers. He hadn’t ‘earned’ a demotion and he should have probably been given first crack at the 1B job when Albert was hurt.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:19 AM EDT up reply actions
take out the last 5 games...
And just look at the first 8? Mather was worse than Duncan when he was up here. It was only for 13 games. It’s fair to say that another three weeks he may have started to improve. Duncan has been much better these last few weeks.
and let's not forget,
That when Mather went down to AAA his only apperence was a PH for the first week because he was hurt.
He got hurt on his return to Memphis
there is nothing to suggest he would have gotten hurt while up here.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
most have been one bumpy of a bus ride
He didn’t play his last few games up here. And he didn’t play his first week in Memphis. I’m not buying the Cardinals saying he got hurt in transition.
He didn't get hurt in transition
he got hurt during one of the games.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions
The hell he was worse than Duncan
He was a better defender and perhaps you forget how truly inept Chris was prior to his demotion, while he was in Memphis and when he was called up.
Only until recently has Chris returned to a competent level, which we are all happy about. But don’t try to portray it as the correct personnel move to call Chris up.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
+1!
Absolutely no baseball reason why Duncan was recalled. OK, so he got a few hits after struggling for two weeks at the MLB level. He could have gotten the same benefit by getting regular hacks in the PCL.
Glad he seems to be doing better, but he still has a long way to go before he deserves regular playing time on this roster. He should never get a start at Ludwick’s expense as Lud hits both RHPs and LHPs better, not to mention his defensive superiority. Even when Duncan was rolling he was never as good as Ludwick has been the past 365 days: .931 OPS and 91 RBIs in only 105 games started.
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
why dunc was called up
The deal between Mo and TLR was that Duncan would go to Memphis for two weeks only. He was coming back regardless. The day Pujols was injured, Mo said in an interview that Duncan was coming back soon. This was on the pre-game show, before the injury happened.
Since Duncan spent less than 20 days in the minors, it didn’t cost an option on his contract, which makes him more attractive as a trade chip.
Whether or not Mather was playing better was irrelevant, because Duncan’s demotion was temporary from the get-go.
Well
We’re dealing w/ TLR here. I’d imagine he’d get all emotional about holding onto Ankiel and Schumaker, and therefore MO will cave and won’t trade either until at least 2010. Duncan isn’t going anywhere but Memphis as long as his dad is in the dugout. I figure MO will have to ditch Ludwick, b/c shit someone’s got to go.
Clearly it’s not a good plan (due to the reasons you’ve laid out), and I never said it was, and I’m a hair perturbed that you seem to think that I thought it would. I’m just speculating right now, and if you notice MY scenario doesn’t look like that. It’s all a matter of what TLR is willing to give in on and where Mozeliak is going to put his foot down. Eventually, someone is going to have to win that game of chicken, and I bet that TLR will be that winner until 2010, when his contract has run out.
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 2:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Hey, a lot of us would get
emotional over Ankiel being traded. The guy probably has Birds on the Bat Underoos.
As shown above, either Duncan or Schumaker needs to be traded after the season. Rasmus is coming and he’s lefthanded. They can’t be sent down without passing waivers, so that’s that. Dropping Ludwick doesn’t really help if you want to platoon with RIck and Colby-which TLR would definitely do to keep them from being too exposed to lefties-so why would we trade him, absent a great fit for second or short?
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 2:29 AM EDT up reply actions
ludwick platoon
doesn’t really work with his reverse splits.
2008 season (avg/obp/slg)
vs. RHP .320/.395/.605
vs. LHP .240/.321/.510
granted, that’s actually the best line against lefties of the five outfielders…
barton vs LHP .239/.368/.366
ankiel vs LHP .233/.275/.430
schumaker vs LHP .167/.241/.181
duncan vs LHP .133/.161/.300
we really need to see if mather or stavinoha can help against lefties. if not, then perhaps we need to find an outfielder who can in the offseason.
Hope Schu sustains thru the trade deadline...at least.
Barton and Mather are the “victims” (term used loosely) of the OF glut, nonwithstanding TLRs involvement. Rasmus being the third, tho he obviously does’nt compete for ABs in the majors, it more or less cost him some skin at the end of spring training….. but hes been where he needs to be. Throw in Marti too.
I think Barton has everything needed in a leadoff hitter if Schu were packaged to a contender needing a solid #4 OF and I believe both he and Mather can hit leftys, making them a better match up with Ank and Ludwick…..if they ever get a chance. Ludwick very well could be the guy traded instead of Schu.
Maybe the injury rehab WILL give Barton a shot at some successive ABs and a chance to prove?
This outfield formula is full of Catch-22s. Duncan is still as much enigma to me, can he sustain whats he done in the last 10 games?
Schumacher has earned his situation, no doubt….but I still think more pop in the lineup is a need as much as leading off. .
So “Mini-Me” (or is it “Mini Puh”) is about to be reactivated….I hope we dont see a prolonged hitting lag from Izturis from being sidelined about now.
by cardschinmusic on Jul 6, 2008 5:54 AM EDT up reply actions
The most likely scenario,
which none of us seems to want to acknowledge, is that it is Rasmus who is traded at the deadline for a pitcher and/or middle infielder. He’s the one with the most value. I’m not advocating it, but it may the way things play out.
by vinniefromjersey on Jul 6, 2008 8:23 AM EDT up reply actions
i don’t think barton has proven OBP, the thing i consider far and away the most important attribute for a leadoff hitter. and if it’s an everyday one, i would want their OBP to be solid against both RHP and LHP.
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
Leadoff OBP
who would you rather have against a LHP: Schumaker and his .241 OBP or Barton and his .368 OBP?
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
How many Cardinals are selected for the ASG?
We know none got elected (New York Media leaked the list) but how many position players get a crack?
I would wager that Pujols is selected as the DH (if Clint doesn’t take Holliday as his DH), and either Ludwick or Ankiel will be selected as an OF’er. Lohse will go as a pitcher.
I would hope
...that that was the case. Clearly Berkman deserved the starting gig, but Pujols deserves to be there too as DH. However, Hurdle taking his guy wouldn’t shock me either. Did Fukudome end up making the squad? I was at the game on Friday and all the f’ing Cubs folks around me seemed to think Fukudome was ssssssuuuuucccchhhh a baller, w/out realizing that he’s only been a bit better than Schumaker, who they decided to rag incessantly. Anyway, I will now put away my soapbox, take some heavy chill pills, and go back to my little corner to calm down.
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes
the NL All-Star Starters:
Lance Berkman at first
Philly’s Chase Utley at second
Atlanta’s Chipper Jones at third
Florida’s Hanley Ramirez at short
Cub Alfonso Soriano starts in left
Cub Kosuke Fukudome in CF
Cincinnati’s Ken Griffey, Jr. in right
Cubs Geovany Soto is the starting catcher.
Soriano is injured, so he will be replaced. Hopefully he is replaced by Holliday and then Pujols is the DH. If not, it’ll probably be Braun in LF and Holliday at DH.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions
AL Starters
3B – ARod
SS – Jeter
2B – Destroya
1B – Youkilis
LF – Ramirez
CF – Hamilton
RF – Ichiro
DH – David Ortiz
C – Mauer
Ortiz is going to be replaced by Milton Bradley due to injury.
Players from the AL that DIDN’T deserve that start? Manny, Jeter, Ortiz, Destroya. Should have been Young at SS, Kinsler 2B, Dye, Drew or Quentin in the OF and who the heck cares at DH.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Most of the country
doesn’t know who Young, Kinsler & even Quentin are thanks to the round the clock coverage the media gives to the big two East Coast spenders. The likes of ESPN are killing the interest in baseball for “casual baseball fans” not within 200 miles of NY or Boston.
There was an article a few weeks ago
that National baseball broadcasts were WAAAAY down but regional coverage (ie local teams) was WAAAAY up. You’d think Fox would take notice.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:52 AM EDT up reply actions
exactly
I listen to some of the Louisville sports talk shows…and they hardly talk any baseball. A caller asks why a few days ago and their responce was..What is there to talk about..we can only talk about the Yankees & Red Sox..so much. The caller then says “Why would people in Louisville care about those teams” The talk show guys said they are the only teams in baseball that people talk about.
MLB needs to do something soon and start making the media cover some of the other teams…because the interest in baseball is going down fast in the rest of the country because the media only focuses on two teams and ESPN & FOX shows these two teams EVERY week. The casual fans are tuning out because of this.
Kinsler is a stud
& went to the great University of Missouri!!!
Baseball-Cardinals
Football-Rams
College Sports-MU Tigers!
Who are these...
...Kinslers and Quentins of which you speak? They are clearly made up persons, as neither plays for a real baseball team (i.e. the Yanks, Sox, Mets, Tigers, Cubs, those St. Louis Hummingbirds [or Ravens? I don’t really know], or Barry Bonds’s team). And isn’t Milton Bradley a game company? Why is a game company likely to be in the ASG?
Seriously though, those guys have been having remarkable seasons in complete obscurity. Kinsler has really played well, Young is a great hitter, and Bradley has been apeshit good this year. Quentin has come from being a discarded prospect to a legit force on a surpising team. In the NL, Pat Burrell is finally starting to truly shine, Ryan Braun is a developing masher of prodigious mashiness (despite a very low OBP), Hanley Ramirez may hit 35-40 bombs this season…But all that matters is that the Tigers have struggled, the Sox are the-fucking-shit, and the Yankees have been perplexingly bad (and not b/c their rotation is dog crap and their lineup is made up of guys whose ears hurt from the Big Bang, but rather b/c of god-knows-what mystique-deficit or some shit). The Rays are only now a story, the neck and neck race between the 1a rivalry (Cubs/Cards) is barely mentioned, and so much more is discarded by these dudes in Bristol, CT who believe baseball revolves around about 6 teams. It’s disgusting to me, but really not surprising or even a huge deal. I know my team is doing pretty well, and that’s that…
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 3:14 AM EDT up reply actions
MLB can let them get away with it for now
because attendance is still doing pretty good around the country as a whole…but the constant Yankees/Red Sox lovefest that the boys in Bristol and the ladies at Fox shove down the country’s throat is starting to really hurt the popularity of the game around the country as a whole. If something isn’t done in the next 5 years…I think Bud or whoever is the comish will see what a mistake it is to let the media focus on just two teams because the casual fans not on the East Coast are starting to exit stage left.
You would think they'd take notice of that Texas team......
There’s great stories there too-Hamilton’s is well known, but what about Milton Bradley? The things that make him explode are the same things that make him an elite player-and Kinsler, man, do folks even know his name? They could start by featuring Texas in one of their games of the week…...or Pittsburgh. They’re interesting too-pitching has fallen apart, but everyone else on the field has come alive….I really don’t care to see anymore Red Sox/Yankees games from here on out.
I get WGN on my cable so I get to see some of the teams when they play Chicago teams but ESPN/Fox/TBS is missing out on some good teams with plenty to see. Baseball fans are the losers, and I ‘d say baseball is too.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
well, at least the infield is probably right
though I take mcCann or martin over Soto in Soto’s rookie year.
The OF is terrible.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
Agreed
Soto is having a good year, but McCann has been a bit better IMO. That one is excusable though.
The starting OF of Soriano (.879 OPS), Griffey (.751), and Fukudome (.818) is inexcusable. The Cubs fans who stacked that to get Soriano and Fukudome in are friggin morons, considering they have a good shot at the WS and should WANT to vote in guys like Burrell (.999), Holliday (.984, though inflated by Coors), or shoot even Nady or Ludwick (.936 each) b/c it will make the team better. But no, I guess it’s better to get your decent, not great, guys onto the field so the can tip their caps and so you can go to a local bar and chant FU-KU-DO-ME! over and over like a moron.
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 3:01 AM EDT up reply actions
Moreso, the game is being played at Yankee Stadium.
And Fukudome has a .610ish OPS away from Wrigley.
by notmorganfreeman on Jul 6, 2008 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
That fucking outfield
is a total disgrace…I think the AL fans came out in drones to put out a shitty OF for the NL.
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
sabatoge from within....
It’s like there are hundreds of thousands of Ron Santos running around Chicago…
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
thats right ...these are the same Cubs fans that threw away Alberts 300th HR ball..
the same ones that were excited to get jason marquis, the same ones who think Fukudome is Hideki Matsui and Ichiro Suzuki rolled into one, and the same ones who always think every year is the year they are gonna finally make it
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Didnt
Didnt number 300 hit the pole and land back in the stadium
by FlimtotheFlam on Jul 6, 2008 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
It hit the pole...
...but then things got wierd. Reed Johnson, possibly not realizing the significance of that particular home run, tossed the ball into the stands. An usher got this “Holy shit” kind of run going, and the fan heaved the ball into the space of left field. Who the fan’s allegiance was to I couldn’t tell, b/c I was at the game and literally clear across the stadium. At least the ball made it back.
"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.
by redbirdnation8206 on Jul 6, 2008 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Fukudome in center?
how do you go from a right fielder to center fielder in the All Star Game? it doesn’t seem like he has the range to play there. thanks, Cubs fans…
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions
they actually both have
114 OPS+ right now. Wow.
if Fukudome wasn’t a first-year japanese player, the fact that he is probably starting the ASG would be a total disgrace.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
They don't solely vote a player in
but they are certainly a deciding factor when it comes to pushing a player over the top. If Taguchi had the support of Cardinals fans as a starter, the Japanese internet vote would have certainly helped.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 2:33 AM EDT up reply actions
it's not so much fukudome that angers me
it’s that fuku and soriano are both voted on there. where’s your center fielder? one mistake I can deal with, but two glaring omissions of great outfielders like Burrell, Holliday, Ludwick, Ank, etc. is inexcusable. just shows the ignorance involved there.
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
sorry
I meant 3 glaring omissions, if you count Griffey
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions
They should go back to the old voting system
Only paying customers at the ballpark can vote. Basement-dwelling internet weasels stuffing electronic ballot boxes are gauche.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 2:32 AM EDT up reply actions
+1000000
agreed 100%
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
i see your point, but wouldn’t that exaggerate the already-discussed issue of physically cast ballots favoring the teams which have more home games during the all-star voting period? my understanding was that the cubs benefitted from that – evident the wash.
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
Not ot mention that it was always fun to go and vote at the AS game
But we shoudl also remember that there were some truly horrific AS selections even before the internet.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
yeah
Either way it’s going to be little more than a popularity contest, which would be fine by me if it didn’t decide home-field advantage for the WS.
Curse You, Bud Selig!!!!
Given that the unbalanced schedule makes the regular season “unfair” for somebody every year, couldn’t home-field in the WS revert back to back-and-forth?
"In this game, don't nobody know nuthin' about nuthin'." -- attributed to Lawrence Peter "Yogi" Berra
by The Ol Goaler on Jul 6, 2008 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I bet 2 if we're lucky
the two most common words used in conjunction with the Cards is “smoke and mirrors”
Pujols will be on the team
maybe Lohse
doubt they pick any of our outfielders although Ankiel or Ludwick would be legit in my opinion
Lohse is just about a shoe-in
and I think we’ll see 2 out of 3 of Mang, Ank, and Luddy. hell, Molina should make it too
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe it is the mad scientist in me
but I get all goose pimply thinking about the haul we would get if we put Lohse on the market.
Can't we get a nice haul if we keep him?
Won’t he be a Type “A” free agent?
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions
a Type A free agent is a mediocre haul
Yea, it’s nice to get another 1st or a supplemental round pick. But with the season Lohse is having, you have a legitimate chance of getting a young major league ready player or 2-3 really good prospects for him.
boo cubs, hooray beer
you also have a legitimate shot at throwing your season away
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
well yeah,
future future future!! I’d give up a contending season for the possibility of contending down the road ;-)
"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"
lol...yea sounds great
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
For the record
Colby Rasmus was compensation for Renteria departing via FA. Not that you can find that type of prospect that late very often but it’s not exactly impossible.
Regardless, I severely doubt you could really get a true top 20-30 prospect for a half season of Lohse….......and the value of half-season of Lohse + two 1st rounders is way more than a ML ready though mediocre player.
"Regression to the mean is so much more fun to watch when it’s a Cub who is regressing." SleepyCA
Depends on whether or not the team plans on contending in 2009
Especially considering that a look at the 1998 draft (to leave plenty of time to make the majors) shows you that a 13/43 first rounders failed to make the majors at all. Another five or so failed to sign, and then you have players like Corey Patterson who were total disappointments. If you then factor the amount of time it takes a minor leaguer to work through the system, versus having a proven prospect/young player NOW, It depens largely on what way the front office wants to go.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
I agree
I still wish we could trade him for a big hual or just one hual of a bad ass 2b * Cough …. Cano….
by FlimtotheFlam on Jul 6, 2008 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Schumaker deserved this
After Ludwick, he’s the position player who has contributed the most to the team playing above expectations, imo. Furthermore, I believe he’s been more consistent then Ludwick or Ankiel, which speaks to his MLB-readiness, but then consistency isn’t as important when you have power.
I love him in the leadoff spot, simply because he gets on base and has enough power to drive home runs too (something I believe is often lacking in this position.) Some teams seem loaded with great sluggers, but don’t seem to put enough men on base to capitalize off them. Others are loaded with great OBP players who lack the power to drive runs in. Having players that can do both is underrated, imo, and particularly so in the leadoff spot.
Schumaker
I used to rag on him the first month of the season because he had a skill of making outs into singles and singles into outs. He just always seemed to be out of position. I don’t think I’ve seen one of these Shcumaker speicals for the last 6 weeks.
"nobody saw him as a regular, everyday contributor"
I beg to differ : )
Great article… applications are still being accepted.. no experience necessary.
THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!
Can Schumaker play second?
This is a half-joking comment only. We have had a hole at second base seemingly forever. As far as I know, we have no real prospects to fill that hole (assuming Ryan continues in his current role). Martinez seems to be our best 2nd base prospect, but I doubt the kid can hit major league pitching for a .300 average – as Skip is showing he can do.
Second base does not seem a difficult position to learn. Skip would have a good arm for second and would have good range. It would take him a while to learn the ins and outs of the position, but that is why we have the secret weapon.
This would give you a way to keep Skip in the lineup on an everyday basis. Skip could lead off, followed by Rasmus, Pujols, Ank, Glaus, Ludwick, Molina, Pitcher & Ryan. It would also allow you to keep Barton and Duncan in the Taguchi role unless Mather or Jay or someone else forces their way onto the lineup.
I know it sounds crazy, but it would solve a lot of problems for the next few years and potentially give us a solution at 2nd that we have been looking for for decades. It won’t be as easy of a transition as moving to first, but I think it could be possible. It is worth a try if nothing else and if it doesn’t work then you go to your backup plan and trade someone.
Skip doesn't need to hit for power...
if we get a 2B or SS with some pop
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
???
So you’d rather have a LF or RF that doesn’t hit for that much power? 2B is a place where you usually stick players without power? Without looking it up, I’d bet that Skip has above average power at 2B, actually.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
no...
you have to realize that it doesn’t matter if you have a power hitting 2B and a weak hitting OF or a power hitting OF and a weak 2B…as long as there are enough power bats in the lineup you’ll be fine…right now were about one power hitter short and it doesn’t matter if we fill that need at 2B or the OF
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions
But Skip's replacement at LF is likely to have more power than him
while Skip would be replacing someone at 2B with less power than him. Finding someone with more power at 2B or SS is very difficult—unless we’re trading for Brian Roberts, who is it going to be?
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
It does matter
Because it would be less of an upgrade in OF. You would not gain as much with a power bat in OF. But a better bat I would argue in SS more than any other position would give us the most to gain.
by FlimtotheFlam on Jul 6, 2008 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
But you have to find the player!
where the hell are you going to find a defensively adequate 2B or SS with pop in excess of Schumaker’s? You’ve now limited the team to a set of exactly one player that is actually available: Brian Roberts. Perhaps you could go get Michael Young, but reports are that he is barely a SS in the field. Meanwhile, you could concievably fill Skip’s hole with any number of power hitting OF, up to and including Holliday.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
All I'm really saying is, Uggla and Utley aside,
a power hitting 2B-man has historically been the rarest commodity in all of baseball, even moreso than reliable starting pitching.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
people keep saying this
You can never have “enough” offense to be “fine”. A weak 2b and a strong OF or a weak OF and a strong 2B may both lead teams to score 750 runs, but they key isn’t to score 750 runs, it is to score “as many runs as possible”. Skip over Kennedy at second would be around 25-30 runs, or a net 3 wins offensively.
The question is, would he cost us that much defensively? It’s impossible to know if we don’t try. If not, then they need to make the switch. he’s got a middle infielder’s body. Why can’t he catch ground balls?
They need to do the same thing with Shane Robinson at AAA. He’s a dead ringer for brian Roberts, physically, and will probably be at best somewhere between shane victorino and 4th or 5th outfielder type as an MLB OF. But he’d potentially be an all-star at second. And it’s NOT too late with him, as it may be with Schumaker.
If they are going to throw Mark Mulder to the mound to pitch against the Phillies to “see what they have with him”, they should be willing to risk a couple of ground balls not being caught in AAA to see if some of these other guys can do it. Hell, if i am Shane Robinson, I’m demanding a shot at it.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
I think you are all
I think you are all greatly under estimating the ability to play 2b at a major league level
by FlimtotheFlam on Jul 6, 2008 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Project for off-season
If they play CDunc in the OF, Grits at SS and 3B, Ank in CF, Looper and Welly as starters why wouldn’t they try Schu at 2B? I don’t think anyone is suggesting it’ll be cakewalk, but Schu has had SS experience. If anything, the Cards have proved to be quite creative in how they use their players. And the players have been willing to accept all sorts roles.
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
Beane wouldn't do it because Beane values defense
players don’t transition from outfield to middle infield on an everyday basis despite what people in these parts seem to think.
Beane doesn't do it because he has Mark Ellis at second base.
The Mark Ellis (5’11”, 180) who looks an awful lot like skip schumaker (5’10, 175), except that Ellis hits RH. Ellis was a third baseman in college his freshman and sophomore years, then moved to SS. If he hadn’t moved over in his junior year, would he have ever been considered as a second baseman? Top prospects don’t play 2B in college, anyway. Would Skip even have been drafted if he was a 2B in college?
What makes shane robinson or skip schumaker significantly different from ryan freel, bill hall, chone figgins, etc? They are all skinny, small, athletic guys with plus arms and speed. if Brian Roberts had come up as a CF- a position no less demanding than SS or 2B- we’d be saying “how can you show that Roberts could move to second”? It’s arbitrary and all about where the guy played in high school or college. Who cares about where a guy played in high school/college? Those coaches are usually awful. in the high minors/MLB you have the best coaches in the world, who can work with a guy and teach him the little things that go with playing a position. if they’ve tried it and decided “OK, skip can’t get it done”, that’s one thing. but just to say “no, that isn’t done/doable” without trying is ridiculous.
FWIW, the Dodgers are trying Laroche at second. I think we’re going to be seeing a lot of this kind of thing in the future; we might as well try, right? i mean, seriosuly, THERE IS NO RISK in asking your AA or AAA CF to take some ground balls. Not doing it is just insane imho. And it’s not like we’re asking to see Chris Duncan or Joe Mather make the switch. We’re talking about the guys who are 5’10” 180, or 5’8” 160 in Robinson’s case.
160 lb outfielders don’t transition from the minors to the majors on an everyday basis, either.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
And it isn't like Robinson
would be blocking anyone of any consequence. In fact, if the OF logjams at both STL and MEM don’t get cleared up, then Robinson himself will be blocked anyway.
I would think Skip would be motivated to give it a try, especially if he wants to stay in St. Louis. We just need to find a way to make TLR think it was his idea…
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
we had a discussion about this a month or so ago
but the general consensus was that he hasn’t played infield in a looooong time, and it would take him too long to make the transition.
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Great read HC
Its about time someone took some time to give credit to Skip. He’s been awesome this year, and while he may not be the long term solution, he’s a big reason for this teams success.
Also, now that we’ve given some credit to Mozeliak, I also think its time we start giving some credit to Tony LaRussa and Dave Duncan. I cringe at a lot of the moves Tony makes during and before the game with the lineup, but I can’t think of any other manager that would have this roster in the position that were in. He absolutely gets the most from his team than any other manager.
And Dave Duncan?...Who else could turn Wainwright, Lohse, Wellemeyer, Looper, and Piniero into one of the more productive rotations in the league? I’ll forever be thankful for he and Tony not subjecting us to another year of Anthony Reyes. Do the math….if we would have had Lohse and Wellemeyer doing what they’ve done this year instead of Wells and Reyes getting rocked 2 out of every 5 games last year would have been a lot different.
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:02 AM EDT reply actions
Also,
has anyone noticed that despite injuries to Isringhausen, Pujols, Wainwright, Izturis, Flores, Springer, Molina, Piniero, and Wellemeyer, we still haven’t lost any ground?
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
yep
it displays our depth and overall composure. it would be easy to throw in the towel after even half of those injuries. amazing.
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
(sounds of crickets...tumbleweed rolls by)
....well…I think they’ve done a damn fine job since being here and I think that ‘06 world series pennant on my wall looks a hell of a lot better than that bare spot that used to be there.
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Good article
Schu’s doing a pretty good imitation of a genuine lead off hitter and I suspect he will be able to approximate this for a few years. The organization’s recent emphasis on taking walks has helped him more than anyone else. Don’t know a perfect comp either. Maybe a very light Len Dykstra or a rich man’s Jimmy Dwyer. I’d hang onto Schu if I was Mo and jettison Dunc over the winter.
Also the injury to Barton could be a big break for him and the team. I didn’t realize he could do a month long rehab stint. He needs the playing time and by the time he’s done with that it will be close to the September roster expansion. In the mean time we should be able to get an idea whether Mather or Stavinoha can help out against left handers.
if by "over the winter" you mean "RIGHT NOW" than I'm with ya
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak
by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Jul 6, 2008 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Skip's biggest problem.....
Is that he sucks vs lefties. If not for that, I’d say pencil him into the leadoff spot for a few years. It might not be a big deal if our team makeup was different, but we seem to have alot of OF’s that would be best served in a platoon role. 1 you can get away with, but not 2-3.
Hmmm.
Ryan – 5
Ankiel -9
Pujols – 3
Rasmus – 8
Glaus – 6
Molinda – 2
Someone not named Kennedy – 4
Wainwright/Carp/Wellemeyer/Pineiro/Boogs? -1
Skippy -7
Not to bad. But with 3 Left hander out fielders. Kinda hard to get the lefty/righty switch that TLR likes.
I'd
hit Rasmus 2nd, and Ankiel 4th.
We’re going to have to get rid of a lefty OF at some point. You just can’t have that many, I don’t think.
Maybe we should see what we can get for Ankiel, and bring Rasmus up. I don’t know. Would love to get Holliday, as I just feel like he’d “fit” in the lineup.
Mather is on his way back to STL/Izturis off DL
Barton likely headed to the DL b/c of his hand injury, not sure what the other move will be.
boo cubs, hooray beer
Why?
To collect splinters? They’d have been better just calling up another pitcher. It’s not like Mather will get playing time, we’re already carrying 4 OF’ers.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
We are facing a ton of lefties before the ASB
so we need a right handed outfield bat to platoon with Schoomaker
boo cubs, hooray beer
This is what I found
- Joe Mather is up, starting, leading off.
- Cesar Izturis is activated, starting at short.
- Mitchell Boggs has been optioned.
- Brian Barton (hand) placed on the DL.
Waaaaa?
Boggs has been optioned? Does that mean Mulder starts next week?
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I really hope it isn't Thompson
I’d rather they promote someone from Memphis before they do let Thompson start again.
We may not have to worry though, if Wellemeyer blows chunks today he’ll be going to the DL and then Boggs can be immediately recalled! Gag.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
So I guess Boggs has one bad start
and they have seen enough? I would have liked to seen how Boggs would rebound from that Mets pounding he got. I though he did pretty good (except for that Mets game) for a guy just starting in the bigs.
Me too
This was going to eventally happen to Boggs, Maybe it’s a shame that he has to go back down on such a bad note, but it was pretty inevitable that he got sent back down to clean up his game. I can’t blame them for protecting their investment there.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
I gotta say
I was really impressed with the kids fastball, the most impressed I’ve been with a Cardinal starters fastball since Carpenter. If he can develop a good secondary pitch, he’ll have a long future with the club.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
I like his attitude also. He seems to handle himself well in interviews after games.
I hope Boggs is looking at it as being sent down after a great 3-1 trip in the majors instead of a tough last outing.
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
some of his starts had good results, but there are a lot of factors that contribute to a win. looking at his individual performance, 3/5 of his GS resulted in him issuing more walks than strikeouts. his total line for the year in the majors is 28.2 IP, 17BB, 2HBP, 12SO, 4HR. that translates to a (poor) FIP of 5.96. that being said, he’s got a nice groundball percentage and appears to have some real future upside. perhaps the major leagues just isn’t the place for him to continue his deserved development.
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
Someone also said that Haerther
was taken off the 40 man roster, so someone else could be coming up or we signed someone else or we traded for CC Sabathia.
Whoops, how’d that get in there?
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I just hope Tony & Dave
don’t get stupid and count on Mulder to start or bring back Mike “Maroth” Parisi to pitch sure fire losses.
I think I'd rather have Mulder start
than have him pitch in the 8th inning. If he blows, more time to come back.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2008 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
If they know Wainwright won't be back for another month or so
and if Welly has a bad game today…I think we should be shopping for another starter soon…at least for the stretch run.
Surley we could trade Reyes
and a low level prospect for a “decent” 3rd or 4th starter from a team out of contention.
I suspect Wainwright is back a little sooner than that
But agree that if Wellemeyer is DLed then another pitcher will be required. Wouldn’t be total madness to give Garcia a try before opening DeWallet.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
lineup i’d like to see today:
schumaker 7
ankiel 8
pujols 3
ludwick 9
glaus 5
molina 2
miles 4
wellemeyer 1
ryan 6
lineup we will see today:
schumaker 9
ankiel 8
pujols 5
glaus 5
duncan 7
molina 2
kennedy 4
wellemeyer 1
izturis 6
by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2008 12:17 PM EDT reply actions
No way
TLR throws out 3 left handed OF’s against a lefty today.
Ludwick will start, probably for Duncan.
I’d imagine our lineup will look alot like yesterdays, save maybe Larue getting the start.
Favoritism
Favoritism seem to be used in a negative fashion in VEB when referring to LaDunc. But what is TLR favoritism? Many have complained about "unfair" competition, even though TLR claims that playing time goes to the best players. To me, TLR does not only look at "what have you done for me lately". I think he looks at a player’s long-term track record. I think he differentiates proven major league experience versus minor league numbers or potential. Unless a player is tested by fire, it’s hard to be sure that a player will not wilt under pressure. Like someone else said on VEB about Boggs, a player learns by having their ass handed to then. (As a tangent, I think Boggs will bounce back nicely.)
I have been pretty disappointed with CDunc bashers lately. I just feel that we are at least a bit ungrateful for what CDunc has done in the past. He was one of the positives in ’07 or at least before he got hurt. He has a major league track record, albeit not a very long one. In terms of playing time/development process for OF, I think he has to be viewed differently than Mather or Barton. Don’t get me wrong, I do like Mather and Barton very much. I agree with HC’s post on Schu. I think TLR takes into account Schu’s whole body of work, and probably included Schu’s experience batting lead-of for team USA.
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
Isn't Schu
Isn’t Schu just like Colby but worst in every way? Colby has better tools across the board from Avg to Power to Glove. So I just don’t see enough room on the roster for the both of them.
Maybe that's it
He probably hits for too high of an average, and with too little power, but maybe you can think of him as an extremely poor man’s Grady Sizemore.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
Closer Brad Lidge signed a $37.5 million, three-year contract extension
Injury prone…....rarely used….........but no money to sign Lohse. That is you free market system. That is also a monstrous indication of collusion.
Westcoastbirdwatcher
by westcoastbirdwatcher on Jul 6, 2008 12:51 PM EDT reply actions
lidge has the best FIP and ERA of all pitchers in 2008 baseball with more than 30 innings pitched.
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
he is great
he is fragile, my point has to do a tiny bit about the market. The Phillies are desperate for pitching, as will be a number of other teams. Lidge’s agent is not Scott Boris….......
If you see Welly avoiding the slider and breaking stuff today…...you can write him of for a couple of months…...of longer.
Westcoastbirdwatcher
by westcoastbirdwatcher on Jul 6, 2008 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Collusion, or Boras
mis-reading the market for Lohse? Kyle’s pitched much better for the Cardinals this season than he did for the Reds and Phils.
Is it possible that Lohse (based on previous performance) simply wasn’t worth what Boras was asking?
Jeff Weaver shoulda fired Scotty about three mis-steps ago….
"In this game, don't nobody know nuthin' about nuthin'." -- attributed to Lawrence Peter "Yogi" Berra
by The Ol Goaler on Jul 6, 2008 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Agent Compensation
Do all agents work on a commission basis, or do some do flat fee? For comissions, one could argue that there might be a slight conflict of interest if maximizing current contract does not maximize a player’s major league career. I know people love to hate Boras, but the players are the ones who choose their agents. I am assuming that the player doesn’t have to agree with their agent if the deal is not rigth for them?
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
yeah
it’s just what is negotiated between the player and the agent. It can be anything; there are really no rules regarding agents in MLB.
There’s a great book by Crasnick on the subject called “license to deal”. It’s ostensibly a “moneyball” type fawn piece about Matt Sosnick, but takes plenty of shots at him as well and really really rags on Boras.
"If thats bad luck, lets DFA our luck away." -DriverZN
Who to trade?
Why only look at trades from the supply side? Often, tt seems like we talk about trades in terms of who we would rather not keep instead of how a player would fit in another organization I would like to think that Mo would consider all offers and react accordingly. We all have our favorites, but I hope that if a good deal comes around that he would be willling to deal Ank, CDunc, Luddy, Lohse, etc… despite any (maybe imaginary?) LaDunc objections.
born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red
OT: Jay Bruce may be the coolest young prospect to come up
in a long time. His attitude is so good, he doesn’t have a huge ego, isn’t above doing interviews and the interview of Griffey during the July 4th rain delay was hilarious. It’s nice to see a kid with that much talent have such a good attitude about it.
Franklin question
obviously yesterday’s outing was poor
but my question is, since they brought Franklin in in the 8th in a tie game (not a closer spot)
who’s the closer du jour? Perez?
There maybe a chance that Izzy's back in the role, perhaps?
A quick look at his June and July would seem to indicate that he’s fixed. And looking at him throw, it certainly looks like his cutter’s no longer a gopherball.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
it’s plausible that he used his “closer” in the highest-leverage game situation, which happened to be the 8th
FIP > ERA, OBP > AVG
I would like to think that is true
but it would certainly be quite a departure for TLR to do that. I wonder if Franklin had any clue he might be used that way before the bullpen phone rang?
Those Pilgrims ain't lookin' so proud now...
Mulder will be starting wednesday
according to Goold.
Will the Phillies put up 10 runs on him in 2 innings?
boo cubs, hooray beer
Oh, god
In Philadelphia? Nice way to ease him back in the rotation. I hope he’s set to try and get those grounders.
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
Better that Mo and Tony know now
whether he can contribute versus knowing in four weeks. I think they’re trying to figure out if they want to go after another starter.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
that could be ugly
we’ll have thompson on hand for mop-up duties, right?
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on Jul 6, 2008 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
He brought his
bucket and latex gloves with him from Memphis.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 6, 2008 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions
This is absolutely ridiculous
Why does he get handed a spot in the rotation? Has he been demonstrably better than Boggs? I don’t think so—he’s struggled to get out minor leaguers while Boggs has that to his credit, at least.
The one upside of starting him against Philly is that they have several key offensive players that are lefties.
But I still think this is a total farce.
I wonder if they are " dangling"
Mulder to the pitching hungry Philly’s…....What happens to Boggs? Poor sod.
Westcoastbirdwatcher
by westcoastbirdwatcher on Jul 6, 2008 2:12 PM EDT reply actions
He goes back down to memphis to develop a changeup
in a context where he can throw it without risking his life and the entire outcome of games that affect the standings
They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...
2B aint the Problem
SS is our bigger problem than 2B.
Our 2B are putting up a /.314/.360/.376 line which is good for 7th in the NL and 14th in ML
While our SS are putting up a line of .243/.299/.298 which is 27th in ML and 15th in the NL
So we are getting league avg production from 2B while near bottom of the league production from the SS position
Good post on Skip
He’s had a fine year, with some clutch hits, and often goes under the radar. Glad to see you give Schu his due. Nice job!
The trouble with Skip
Is that he hits horribly for a corner outfielder. Yes, he’s hit better than expected. But if you compare him to other corner outfielders, he’s pretty much worse than anyone except Juan Pierre
See
He would be 8th in OPS among LF if he qualified
Yes, he’s high on the list in VORP, but VORP is a counting stat. He’s been the lead off hitter much of the time, so it’s going to be inflated (he doesn’t qualifty at LF not being of overall playing time, but because he’s played at other outfield spots).
His defense is also terrible. But because he’s short and scrappy, everyone loves it.
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