Game 107 Open Thread -- July 27, 2008
by chuckb on Jul 27, 2008 12:45 PM EDT
in St. Louis Cardinals News
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12-2, 3.35 |
8-7, 3.05 |
Don’t get me wrong – he’s still a very good pitcher and certainly better than anyone we’ve got in our rotation right now. Maybe he’s feeling a little pressure from the big contract. Another explanation is that he did turn 29 and maybe he’ll continue to be a very good pitcher, but the days of him being an elite starter may be behind him. Who knows?
I’m hoping that last night’s victory and Pujols’ blast last night give the team a little momentum to turn this ship around. The pen has given up a 9th or 10th inning homerun in 5 of the last 6 games. With the trade deadline looming, I’m hoping that all the "Wainwright to closer" stuff is simply posturing to get the price tag for Fuentes, Sherrill, or Street down some.
C’mon Boys! It’d be nice to end this week w/ a series victory and Lohse is pitching as well as anybody!
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Strikouts are fascist
Santana has decided to adopt the Duncan democratic philosophy of pitching: throw more groundballs. His GB% is up from 38% last season (and 38.3% for his career) to 44% in 2008. Hopefully, some of these grounders snake through the Metropolitan infield for base knocks this afternoon on Long Island.
Coincidentally, Lohse’s GB% is up from 36.9% last season (and 41.6% for his career) to 48.3% under the democratic tutelage of David Duncan. His K/9 has fallen off as well to 4.69 from a career average of 5.57.
hey buddy
re: I’m hoping that all the “Wainwright to closer” stuff is simply posturing to get the price tag for Fuentes, Sherrill, or Street down some.
Actually, despite our conversation earlier on another thread, I totally agree with you on this. I’m only for Waino as the last resort for the bullpen. Fuentes is fun to watch, I’ll say that. Who is the best among the three you named, I don’t know…...but I’ll take any of the three.
Going out for a few hours. I hope I can catch the last few innings…....or do I? Let’s hope a little positive momentum has returned to the Cards.
This thread is lacking
Some lucky haiku action
Hopefully this helps
by notmorganfreeman on Jul 27, 2008 1:13 PM EDT reply actions
After a great ab from Ryan making Santana throw 6 pitches
we see 2 pitches and make 3 outs…
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
Yep, 8 pitches in the first inning.
Not good. They are apparently not going to make Santana work for it.
yea
need to be more patient. both pens are down, make him throw seems a good plan
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
Anyone else with Extra Innings having trouble finding the game?
I am, unfortunately, stuck at work and following on Gameday. But my fiance is at home and wondering why he cannot get the game. Anyone know what is going on?
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
by ChiTown CardFan on Jul 27, 2008 1:16 PM EDT reply actions
i couldnt find it either
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
by ihavebadknees on Jul 27, 2008 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions
coming through as game 11 for me
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
are you on direct tv?
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
by ihavebadknees on Jul 27, 2008 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
yes.
"It breaks your heart. It is designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring when everything else begins again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops and leaves you to face the fall alone." A. Bartlett Giamatti
by ChiTown CardFan on Jul 27, 2008 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
i have direct tv also
and cant find it
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
by ihavebadknees on Jul 27, 2008 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
the schedule doesnt have it listed
so i guess we are SOL
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
by ihavebadknees on Jul 27, 2008 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
The Mets broadcast is terrible.
They have no idea who is playing where, what the lineup looks like … it is like the whole broadcast crew came to the park 15 min. before game time.
+1
Some people may not like Dan an Al, but I think they are as good as any teams group and better than most.
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
i think anyone you listen to daily will sound stale after a while
but i still think al is inane and provides very little real insight, especially for an ex-player.
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
Well, I am not a fan of Dan and Al either, but they are better than this Mets group.
There are some really good ones around the league (Brenneman in Cincy, Scully in LA) that really make watching the game enjoyable.
This Met’s group wouldn’t be so bad if Hernandez was not the color guy that had to comment on everything. Their announcer is actually not horrible, but Hernandez is just an idiot and feels he needs to exhibit is lack of intelligence on nearly every pitch.
I don’t understand when the definition of “color guy” went from someone that knows more than me and explains the details of the game to a “colorful character.” I wish we would go back to the former, rather than the latter, definition.
HC
You said this:
And Santana has moved from the “Homer-Dome” to a very pitcher-friendly ballpark.
But it looks to me like the “Homer-Dome” and Shea have very comparable multi-year park factors, for what that’s worth.
Ventilation
That’s just because they rig it so the fans blow in while the visitors are at the bat and out while the Twinkies are up.
3-0 dp
a very nice present
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
by ihavebadknees on Jul 27, 2008 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions
18 pitches in the first
Hopefully we get some groundball outs early in the count from the Mets’ batsmen next inning.
he is batting 9th i believe
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, the Mets broadcast made a big deal out of the fact he was not playing
but then they showed him playing center. They also showed the pitcher batting 9th. Basically, do not believe anything from the Mets broadcasters today. They are just guessing.
Only 5 outs into it
But, Santana and CC have similar M.O.’s, to be sure. Hopefully, we can muster some offense toward the end of Santana’s outing.
That's the problem with guys like Santana and Sabathia
You want to preach for players to work the count, but those guys throw strikes, so if they try to work a count they just end up in 0-2 or 1-2 holes. The only way to beat guys like this is with talent trumping talent.
boo cubs, hooray beer
Class Catch 22
You’re damned if you swing, damned if you don’t.
Won’t it be nice to have a pair of aces that other clubs’ fans have the same sentiment about? (Crossing fingers, praying that Carp and Wainwright come back healthy and effective.)
man, I remember the two grandslams in one inning like it was yesterday
They say I look like yadier molina
I love Izturis' glove and all
but these automatic outs are driving me insane!
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Middling Middle Infielders
The problem is that we don’t get much from either second or short. You just can’t sacrifice “O” for “D” at two positions in the NL. It gives us three black holes in the lineup with the pitcher.
Lohse is gonna have to get through 7 today somehow
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
and it was so close
at least they got together to make the call
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Speed kills
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
I sure would
he can’t hit one out if they walk him. I am tired of Delgado too
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
I think they were trying to
Molina set up way outside there but Lohse left it too close
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Too close or too up?
Were they hoping for a harmless grounder to second, but left it up, allowing Delgado to lift it in the air for the sacrifice fly to CF?
Well the replay showed Molina in the outside batters box and reaching back to the plate
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Watching on Gameday at work
So, I defer to you. Poor execution by Lohse. Now, a 2-run hole versus Johan. That’s a tough one to dig out of…
I sure am happy that the umpire made the right call
on Pujols’ tag at first base.
On with the (good) youth movement!
that was a damn close play
wouldn’t you agree we have seen a lot worse umping than that lately?
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
"I'm picking up on your sarcasm"
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
Through three innings...
26 pitches for Santana, 64 for Lohse.
And another first pitch out.
by notmorganfreeman on Jul 27, 2008 2:04 PM EDT reply actions
Today we get to witness Johan Santana's first career
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 27, 2008 2:06 PM EDT reply actions
how could you not have that feeling?
we look very bad
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
There has never been one at Shea Stadium
so double the history!
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 27, 2008 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm pretty sure the Mets haven't ever had a no-hitter
In Shea or not
Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans
This is why Lohse is definitely not an Ace
he’s been a good #2 this year, but an ace is a pitcher you can count on to save your bullpen in a game like this. Lohse is not that pitcher
boo cubs, hooray beer
WTF?
Is it his fault Pujols and Ludwick made two awful defensive plays that extended the inning 3 extra batters?
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 27, 2008 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Ryan should have handled the throw from center
Don’t forget that one. It would have ended the inning with no runs scored.
No it's not, but he's been throwing a ton of pitches before that even happened
boo cubs, hooray beer
I hesitate to even call him a #2.
He is a 4 that is having a good year. A Suppan type pitcher in my mind.
De factor ace
He’s not someone you shell out $15M/year to as a pitcher, but he hasn’t pitched that badly today. He’s more a #3 in the NL and today he’s pitching like that.
I never thought he was an "ace" he is however our "ace" for the time being. (Until wednesday hopefully)
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
How about that inning?
Ace-like efficiency.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 27, 2008 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
That guy in the stands looked like Flores.
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
Maybe we should switch them and see how the fan does out of the pen
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
There is a bright side if the Cards can't win this one
I only had them winning one of these games in Azru’s poll anyway,
Rahter selfish of me , I know. You have to look on the bright side sometimes
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
The floodgates are open!!
Let’s have a 10 run inning
by BTown Birds fan on Jul 27, 2008 2:16 PM EDT reply actions
OT
but how in the world can MLBTraderumors be right? The Rays have 4 untouchable in the minor leagues? If you play in the same division as the Yanks and Sawx, don’t you have to be willing to move at least some of your premium prospects when you really have a chance?
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Some Rays prospects are so good, that listing them untouchable is correct
I mean, alot of those guys are about as close as you can get to bonafide aces and all stars.
boo cubs, hooray beer
they are great
but man, that is what you call willpower after this many years of losing ball
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Would like to see Glaus tag there.
Tatis was lolly-gagging out there and in no position to come up throwing. Since we are struggling, you like to see some aggressiveness.
Side Note
Does anyone have the scouting report on Perdomo? 24-year-old set-up guy? Is this a good return for Reyes, all factors considered?
all things considered - yes.
++ Fastball, a good work in progress slider
has the potential to be a good bullpen arm
boo cubs, hooray beer
But, you still have to question the wisdom of a trade of
a potential stater for a potential reliever.
A lot of teams have cash added
I recall even the Yankees receiving cash in a trade a couple of years ago
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
I know, but Cash?
Why not just throw on a scrap pile prospect that has the same value? It would make us all feel better about that trade. Because as it is, I personally don’t feel good about that trade at all.
I would take just about anyone over another year of having to watch Izturis bat
boo cubs, hooray beer
You would think with all the "stat guys" the Cards have in the front office
that Cesar won’t be back.
I was tempted to go along with that huge trade proposal going around yesterday
if only that it would have got us an upgrade at SS. That is impressed I am with his bat.
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Anyone with eyes
You don’t even need a calculator, one would think. Surely, just by watching the games, Mo can see that Cesar Izturis should not be penciled into a big league lineup.
That was the best he has hit the ball in a couple weeks.
and the outfielder had to come in and get it.
Izturis is so perfect in the #9 slot
It’s like Little League, where you just hoped that your #9 hitter would somehow walk to extend the inning.
Well, at least Santana had to throw a few more pitches that inning...
...no thanks to Iz2
by BTown Birds fan on Jul 27, 2008 2:21 PM EDT reply actions
No
I wanted to see him there this year, instead of Izturis. He’s cheaper. Plus, we could see what we have and upgrade as need be. Now, we are stuck with four MIFers on the roster, none of whom are particularly good with a bat in their hands.
I hear ya on that.......
But Iz2 is not really that expensive in baseball terms his contract has zero impact on the books really.
Yes
That was my point. See what we have in him early this season by installing him as the starting SS. I understand that Izturis was an insurance policy, and it worked with Ryan’s ST injury. But now, with the Miles/AK/Izturis/Ryan hydra on the roster, we just have a glut unskilled offensive players on the roster. Now we know, and moves should be made accordingly to offer us a better bench for the home stretch.
Does Lohse make it through 6?
Will TLR keep him in too long (i.e. into the 7th)?
Stay tuned for the answers to this and more on MLB Extra Innings!
Bullpen help
Right now, we need help in the ‘pen desperately. We should dump AK and install Miles, allowing for an additional bat on the bench. Plus, the market is not very good for SS’s.
For next year you are talking?
I am not sure a SS is in the works for this year.
For this year, I think the priority is a closer. Perhaps the closer is already on the team, but that needs to be the top priority.
For next year, I would agree with you (assuming we have some clarity at closer). The middle infield has to be at the top of the list.
amen, looks like not much in the pipeline for some years
still wonder if the dodgers might part with the roach or dewitt (perfect match eh) after getting blake
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
yeah, only way you beat those guys is with a little luck and...........
Mather, Izturis, Skip (vs. LHP), Ryan are not the names that generally beat Santana
+1
It will feel good to get to Atlanta if the Cubs and Brewers could both lose today, so we dont lose any ground heading into the series that we get Carp back
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions
By the time Mo gets off the pot
This race is going to be over. They needed a bat last month, a closer this month. It’s getting to be a little late in the day to make a meaningful impact. What a maddening club.
3 GB
We’re only three games out of the Wild Card and Division races. I don’t blame Mo for waiting to see what he would have from Carp and Wainwright before going trade crazy. The same goes for the ‘pen. TLR is just as accountable for managing the late innings. Why he continues to hand Franklin the ball in the ninth is beyond me. A closer this week, with Carp and Wainwright returning, puts us in a good position to make a run at the postseason, IMO.
even if carp and waino are back
this team still needs another bat – either in front of or behind pujols and a bullpen upgrade. those two things are independent of returns from injury.
Yeah, I understand that
trading for Burnett or Washburn or Wolf would have been premature at best. But look at HoustonCardinal’s analysis from this morning. It’s easy to see that the team’s batting average has been inflated by facing crappy starters. We missed Sheets on the first turn against Milwaukee. We missed Zambrano against Chicago. Oswalt is no longer an ace. Etc, etc.
The front office appears to have bought in to the hype a bit too much. Tony is right: the team needs a substantial bat. Unfortunately, the only place to park one is at second base or short. There’s a thin market for those guys, but the fact that we haven’t DFA’ed one of the middle infielders is pathetic. They need to understand sunk costs and get over them. Cut your losses before they destroy the team.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
maddening situation for sure
this wait for 09 business needs to be put in perspective. which additions are really going to matter and putting so much on one guy, e.g., rasmus, is a risky bet, as in no guarantees he’ll play 150 games. they are/were in contention this year and may or may not be in the same or better position next year. i’m not into blowing the entire future, but unless you have a perfect crystal ball, might want to maximize the chance you have. for me, boils down to just having some qualms about this “we know 09, 10, etc will be better because whatever fraction of young players turn out to be ML regulars” that seems to pervade the front office.
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
There is no guarantee any player will play 150 games
Many players face injuries, which is why multi-year contracts are so risky. Look at Carp. Right after we extend him, he misses 270 games. And he’s a pitcher. Holding onto Rasmus is a perfectly acceptable decision. I would even say that it is a very good decision. I’d rather have someone young and talented under our control (i.e. cheap) for years to come than to give him up Holliday or some other rental. It’s not a trade-Rasmus-or-win-this-year proposition. We have received very good OF production this season. We can make a playoff run by bolstering the ‘pen and cutting lose the above-mentioned sunk cost of AK while bolstering the bench.
Flores
Just like Friday. Here’s the ball, Randy, since the game is over. Throw 45 pitches and give up as many runs as you feel like.
hopefully Randy can go 3
and hopefully these are the last 3 he ever goes in a Cardinal uni
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Oh boy
That elusive thing called “momentum” has avoided us again
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
Which is disheartening when this IS your best pitcher
At least until Wednesday.
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
lol....
Call it…time of death….1:43 central time
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
at least Lohse is getting the bad start out of the way when we didnt have much of a chance anyway
every pitcher has one of these every now and then
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
true...
we just need to get out of new york also, I am looking forward to atlanta
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
Ugh
I was really hoping the wall wouldn’t be calling for my head today
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
3 run bomb for the Marlins
Jacobs
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
atleast we got that going for us
which is good, definatly good
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
pillow,
go with the pillow
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
Im just happy it's not a no hitter
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
Rain please
End my misery
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
Now that is what you call staring down a HR
uh….foul ball
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
haha
cant help but laugh a little
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
I've been watching for about 15 min
and Jay Randolph has already gotten 5 different people’s name wrong. He’s really difficult to listen too.
O and Randy Flores is a terrible pitcher.
maybe this is the day they decide
that Garcia will be the second LHRP?
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
maybe this is a good thing...
we could get flores sent back down
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
He can't be sent down
He’s on an ML contract. He has to be DFAed, then clear waivers. Really, though, he needs to be retired.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
He is a "veteran"???
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
it's cause of what he did a couple years ago
tony loves him
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
Please keep those kind of references
for another board. This is a family blog!!!
I have discovered in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. ~Bill Veeck
I am turning
this game off. This game, plus these announcers on KSDK, are making me ill. Jay Randolph needs to retire.
Rarely will I ever choose a nap over a baseball game. Today, the nap wins.
I have discovered in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. ~Bill Veeck
You know
it might help if this game gets rained out and we lose. At least it will preserve out bullpen.
On with the (good) youth movement!
I bet shannon is talking about 1981 when he went to dinner with some famous person
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
He was just talking about how Flores will be the sacrificial lamb today
in order to save the rest of the pen
by BTown Birds fan on Jul 27, 2008 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
could you blame him?
much more interesting than this inning. If I was listening on the radio and he wasn’t telling a story I would really be PO’d
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
hehe
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
Bea Arthur?
They would have made a cute couple.
I have discovered in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. ~Bill Veeck
I gotta say, that was the most exciting double in baseball
But no matter how ugly this game gets, it’s still just one loss. Not that comforting, but still….
by BTown Birds fan on Jul 27, 2008 2:51 PM EDT reply actions
I think it funny,
the fact that Mike hampton led to david wright being with the mets
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
the most exciting
or so i’m told after the eleventh replay of a yankees-red sox game
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Beat me to it!
I was just going to say that.
Nope, he is not.
But, I would take him anyday. He loves the game, plays hard, has fun … kind of player that makes your team better.
until he pouts
because delgado couldn’t pick a terrible throw and reyes gets an error and throws his glove to the ground
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
How is he overrated?
How many SS bring what he brings to a team?
There is a few, but not many in the NL.
well
rollins, hanley, furcal when helthy
and for giggles…julio lugo…
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Nah, I don't think I would agree with Tejada.
He brings a whole different skill set. I know his defense has improved this year, but he is little more than a slugger. A slugger at short is great, but I would take Reyes over Tejada.
well, right
they have individual skill, but in total, he bring about the same amount to the team.
On with the (good) youth movement!
another thing about Reyes
he tends to go on pretty huge cold streaks,
On with the (good) youth movement!
yeah
my fantasy hurts because of him
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions
What kind of fantasy do you have?
Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans
Right, I will give you those 3 (not lugo)
Hanley is the best of that group, but all of those have similar characteristics as Reyes does. Speed, good arm, a little power (more in Hanley’s case), personality … Reyes is in that group. He may be at the bottom of that group, but he is still a very valuable commodity.
no,
but him and wright look marvelous in those ads for abercrombie and fitch
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
why not?
you are up 7-0 with Santana on the hill. This is the time to be going all out
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
did you see him almost get out on that play at home
when it was 0 to 0 and they threw to 2b? His being an idiot isn’t a one time thing.
On with the (good) youth movement!
no I did not see that one
but man everyone makes boneheaded plays
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
that wasn't bonehead.
it was lazy, and his head was completely out of the game. Great players with some smarts never do things like that.
Since you didn’t see it, his run wouldn’t have counted at home if we got the guy out at second because he was practically walking into home plate. And the point is that the “boneheaded plays” happen once a week for him. Believe me, I live in New York and watch way too much Mets baseball for my own good.
On with the (good) youth movement!
I will not argue with you then
I can be convinced easily. Especially when it is a Met
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
Question:
why won’t this team DFA players??? Guys like Flores, Izturis & Kennedy should have been gone months ago. Is there a reason why the Cards refuse to DFA guys?? Every other team in baseball are not scared to DFA a guy who is stinking up the joint…big contract or not!
mets dfa's brandon knight
i bet he could help us, he looked good after the first inning
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
Completely agree
It’s inexplicable. If someone thinks it’s the “Cardinal Way” to keep junk on the roster just because they have a two-year contract, then they’re fools. My first memories of the team were in the early- mid-Seventies. Those teams were awful for a reason.
The corollary to that is don’t sign mediocre players to multi-year deals because they are a good “value.” That’s why we have/had Kennedy, Looper, Encarnacion, Piniero, Eckstein.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Kennedy
really isn’t that bad. It’s just trendy to say he should be DFA’d.
On with the (good) youth movement!
are you serious?
I think a lot of us are spoiled by a winning tradition. Check out some other MLB rosters when you get the chance. Not to mention, I’m sure if we DFA’d him, he’d be picked up in an instant. I’m not saying he’s that good at all, but we can’t just go around releasing all of these guys signed to million+ deals. That does add up, you know?
On with the (good) youth movement!
He is not really that good either
and there are probably players in our minor league system that could do what he does for us much more cheaply.
might as well dfa iz2 too
he hits worse then ak
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
There's a difference there
between Kennedy and Izturis. Shortstop is more demanding position, and a harder one to fill with a quality hitter. I would be okay with him if second were more adequately stocked. I would also be okay with Miles/Ryan at second if the SS could both field and hit.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
don’t disagree, but as has been said many times, they have sunk costs. they need to get a grip on quality and how they are going to prioritize their spending in the winter if they don’t know which position players in the system will help them; ST really isn’t the best way to judge that.
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
all the cool kids do it
we’re all dfa’ing kennedy.
succumb to the peer pressure
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, then I was ahead of the trend
Because I’ve been saying it since he was signed.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
He had a good first month of the season
and had a decent three week run up until about 2 weeks ago. Other than that , has he done anything while a Cardinal, or am I just remembering wrong?
* sarcasm might be involved in this comment
He's terrible
though he’s actually made himself into a pretty good defensive 2b. Offensively, few are worse.
You just can't give up the offense
from the middle infield entirely—especially with the pitcher batting eighth. It just destroys a third of the innings. It’s like we only get up to bat 2/3 as many the times as the opposition.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm just saying
that if half of the people on here had their way, most of our roster would be gone by now via DFA.
On with the (good) youth movement!
agreed......if you DFA guys who suck you lose B. Ryan, Izturis, and Kennedy.
Mile will play SS and 2B at the same time.
check out some archives.
you’ll see many a name on there.
Kennedy, Iz2, Izzy, Flores, Villone, Barton . . . haha, honestly, the list is absurd.
On with the (good) youth movement!
Hooray for my signature!
Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans
I bet Ludwick hits a meaningless bomb here
gonna need more franklins to get through this one.
by hoofhearted-pujols on Jul 27, 2008 2:55 PM EDT reply actions
now
that was a slap in the face
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
False Jay! False
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
boy
the look on flores face when he left the mound. i agree he is not performing, but you know dfa is running through his mind and his baseball life as well. sad, he once helped us a lot (i.e., before his 2 year deal was signed)
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
paging.....
BBTN webgems and sportscenter top 10
The wind in here just shifted 360 degrees!!!
-Mike Shannon
wow
gonna need more franklins to get through this one.
by hoofhearted-pujols on Jul 27, 2008 2:56 PM EDT reply actions
should have been out
what a play
gonna need more franklins to get through this one.
by hoofhearted-pujols on Jul 27, 2008 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
It was a hell of a play.
He is still a good player. Never was he was billed to be, but still a good player.
Albert!!
"A good friend of mine used to say, "This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains." Think about that for a while."- Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh
At least we didn't get shut out
It seems that the boys are picking up Santana’s pitches better this inning. Alas, too little, too late…
well I honestly think Johan just lost concentration against Lud and Bert... Why not challenge them.
He refocused against Glaus
Mather's new 'shortened' swing
produces too many pop-ups.
Stop tinkering with the hitters, McRae.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 27, 2008 3:04 PM EDT reply actions
on top of that
it ain’t very short. maybe he should go back to his fernando tatis swing
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
no, I just don't think he has gotten enough AB's which is why I say leave him in Memphis..
It’s not easy to get spotty AB’s Barton did a really good job getting spotty AB’s
Some guys just need to play everyday.....
That is what actually impressed me very much about Barton was that he was very good considering his spotty chances to play.
Guess
Boggs will be throwing his bullpen right now. Just will count on the stat line?
I have discovered in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. ~Bill Veeck
Speaking of bullpens
anyone heard anything about Carp’s?
ESPN Management (CT): Umm…...what does this have to do with the Red Sox and Yankees?
SportsNation Jerry Crasnick: Management, Let’s take a break with the sarcasm, OK?
by Smokin Turkeys on Jul 27, 2008 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Arm fell off
Palletta is re-attaching it tomorrow. His start will be pushed back a week.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Ankiel has an abdominal injury?
Heaven help us if the organization is again underselling the severity of an injury...
Rick Ankiel was held out of the Cardinals’ starting lineup on Sunday due to what the club is calling an abdominal strain, an injury which he evidently sustained during Saturday night’s game at Shea Stadium.
I bet he hurt himself trying to catch the game tying home run from tatis
They say I look like yadier molina
it's all an elaborate plan
to lull the mets offense to sleep…then when they’ve used their entire bench, we pounce
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 3:12 PM EDT reply actions
i hate all this
merengue that they pipe into shea.
they turn it up to 11 and it gets on my nerves
by barry whiteteeth on Jul 27, 2008 3:14 PM EDT reply actions
Wow, braun has another home run
he may win the mvp award this year
They say I look like yadier molina
He still looks
like Dobby the house elf.
I have discovered in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. ~Bill Veeck
I was about to type "No way"
then I looked at his #’s, and wow, he really picked it up after starting off the year relatively slow. He may be in the argument with Albert and A-Rod for best hitter in the game in a couple years.
boo cubs, hooray beer
Why is Santana still in the game?
Hey – let’s run the $100m investment 9 innings in a blowout?
Wow.
I have discovered in twenty years of moving around a ball park, that the knowledge of the game is usually in inverse proportion to the price of the seats. ~Bill Veeck
14 innings
few pitches
game tomorrow?
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
makes me wonder if tlr will go back to the future
9=izzy, 8-frank, 7=mac w/ springer as fireman
at this point i’m not so sure it’s not the best ifra
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
make that idea
If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs, perhaps you haven't grasped the situation!
Looks like Soriano is getting hot
which is bad news…he can carry that team for a week if he finds his HR stroke.
Seriously, what crap
not only did they get Harden, who has been filthy, but they got Chad Gaudin who has been a great bullpen arm. Not fair, how come Beane couldn’t ream them like he did us.
boo cubs, hooray beer
If this week was supposed to be a
bellwether week for whether the Cardinals were contender or pretenders and whether they should be buyers or sellers, they failed miserably.
In fact, if this weekend series with the Mets was supposed to decide it, they failed epically. They got skull pounded in 2 games and in the middle game they coughed up 3 run leads twice.
Too bad Lohse decided to have the worst game of the season right before the deadline. Way to crap all over your high trade value.
by Hardcore Legend on Jul 27, 2008 5:27 PM EDT reply actions
i doubt they could've
gotten anything better than Type A picks. now we just need him to bounce back and retain type A status
Kyle ruined his trade value
because he doesn’t want to leave St. Louis. J/K!
Lohse wasn't going to be traded anyway
Mo said as much in the P-D article today.
I do think they should be making trades to fix next year’s team now, as this year looks less and less likely to be fruitful. If that’s the goal, Sherrill is the man because he’s under team control for another 2-3 years. Fuentes is not—for the opposite reason. They need to look hard at what to do about the middle infield now, and not find themselves in December looking at the same half-dozen names for shortstop that everyone else is.
The elusive additional big bat, I’m afraid, doesn’t have a chance of coming here this year. Maybe Mo should map out a plan to trade some pieces for a slugging secondbaseman over the winter. Look at three or four teams that can use our prospects or some help in the outfield, then work the phones.
But he’s walking a fine line. As Strauss put it the other day, Duncan keeps turning Hamburger Helper into steak. Eventually he gets tired of working with retreads. Duncan goes and the economic model for the club changes. Tony also goes, IMO. The turmoil of one or both leaving would pretty much doom the team’s chances for next year. And that’s why Mo needs to try to placate Tony. But how does he do that working with what he has and the dual goals of winning and building up the farm? He’s got a tough job to do this week.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm getting really excited about the trade deadline..
Unfortunately, I was hoping Lohse and Wells would be traded before the inevitable, but like Izzy, the Cardinals waited waaay too late with them.
What about Schu? We really don’t need him.. especially next year. He could net us a decent reliever.
Yeah I could see Schumaker
as the odd man out when Rasmus arrives. You can get more playing time for Barton as well. I think it depends on the other moving parts, though. If we can somehow trade for Brian Roberts, then we have a leadoff man. If not, I don’t know if he goes in the next five days. I don’t think you want to rely upon Mather or Barton out there too much at this point.
by Red in Chicago on Jul 27, 2008 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Wells?
My fellow Americans. As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball, but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward, upward not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom.
wellemeyer
not america’s most winningest pitcher, kip.
i don’t think the orioles need schu as they have a stacked of already
This is what frustrates me about the Cardinals...
They don’t make trades to make the team better now, but they don’t make trades to make the team better in the future by selling while your players have their most value.
Look at Reyes – he should have been moved years ago. He’s had 2 years of his life wasted, and all the Cardinals got was a fringe relief prospect.
yep...
That’s why I have become such an admirer of Beane of Oakland…there was never a better time to move Haren then last winter, and they got a boatload of prospects for him…same to some extent with Harden.
Thing is it means making the hard call to your fanbase that you are tossing in the towel…Oakland is a much different market than St. LOuis. Don’t know how well the Nation would accept a rebuilding year or two…they never really came right out and said this would be one, then they caught lightning in a bottle and surprised everyone.
TLR is a proud guy, who doesn’t accept giving up…that’s why he left Oakland 12 years ago and that’s why he is pushing to get help this year…sometimes, it’s hard to argue against that…as he says, you still have to play the season that’s in front of you now.
Tatis=Cardinal Killer
Playing out of his head at 33, after being out of baseball awhile and spending all of last year in the minors.
Then Cy Santana shows up. Yikes! Rough series….
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
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