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Game 102 Open Thread -- July 22, 2008

suppan

lohse

5-6, 4.71

12-2, 3.35

When the Cardinals signed Jeff Suppan after the 2003 season, he was just about to turn 29. When the Cards signed Kyle Lohse, he had turned 29 just a couple of months prior. It’s amazing how similar they were. Though Suppan had recently been Dfa’d by the Sox after a bad couple of months following the trade from Pitttsburgh, he had a fairly decent pedigree. He had thrown more than 200 innings in 5 straight seasons w/ ERA+s of 111, 103, 111, 93, and 106. He was never a standout – his career K/9 is 5.04 and he had given up an average of 29 homers per year in those 5 years before being signed by the Cards.

Still, he was a steady hand when the Cards needed one. He had worked more than 1000 innings in those 5 years and had made at least 31 starts in every one of those 5 seasons. There’s something to be said for a guy who can take the ball and pitch a decent, though probably not outstanding, game every 5 days – and Suppan filled that role admirably for 3 seasons. He didn’t rack up the innings as a Cardinal – partly due to being in the NL and having to be pinch-hit for at times, and partly b/c Tony LaRussa was his manager. Nevertheless, he made 31, 32, and 32 starts in his 3 seasons w/ the birds on the bat.

This offseason the Cards signed Kyle Lohse to, in some degree, play the same role that Jeff Suppan played while a Cardinal. Entering this season, Lohse had pitched more than 178 innings in 5 of the last 6 years. The only season he made fewer than 30 starts was in 2006 – ironically, the season Jeff Suppan helped the Cardinals to a World Championship. Now, Lohse wasn’t quite as effective in his pre-Cardinal days as Suppan was but he was, decidedly, league-average. After becoming a free agent, Lohse never received the multi-year offer he sought and, in fact, was a free agent until March. John Mozeliak signed him to team-friendly, 1 year, $4.25 million contract.

Lohse is now 12-2 w/ a 3.35 ERA. His FIP is 3.85. Though his K rate is pretty low, his GB % and BB/9 are as good as they’ve been in his career. There might be a little luck involved as he’s giving up just 1 HR for every 13.3 flyballs he gets but maybe that has as much to do w/ his pitching in a relative pitcher’s park rather than the homerun bandboxes he’s pitched in for the bulk of his career. Lohse has been absolutely outstanding and, while he was wanted by nobody this offseason, he seems to be making himself a lot of money w/ this year’s performance. Oh yeah – his #1 comp for pitchers through age 28 – Jeff Suppan. Here’s hoping that Lohse can have the postseason impact that Suppan had while he was here.

BTW, in what has to qualify for the bizarre acquisition so far this season, the Astros today traded for Randy Wolf. They couldn’t possibly get anybody better than Wolf b/c they’ve decimated their farm system w/ a series of bad drafts, free agent signings, failures to sign players they did draft, and trades for Miguel Tejada and Jose Valverde. They’re going to go for it this year despite their 46-53 record and 5th place in the NL Central standings. They’re 12 games behind the Cubs and 10 behind both the Cards and Brewers. In 2 years, the franchise that, until recently was the Cards’ equal in the division and the league, will likely be the worst in baseball.

I’ll get overflow threads programmed to go up at 8:15 and 9:30. There was a lot of traffic last night and I hope the same is true tonight. Hopefully it’ll be all cheers as the home team gives Suppan a rude return from the DL. The fans, I know, will treat him well.

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I do enjoy when HC talks about Lohse

for BleedCubbieBlue reasons.

Eventhough I’d prefer the Cubs to not make the playoffs, I would bask in the glory of Lohse winning NLCS Game 7 in a complete game shutout, just so Al would have to eat his hat.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 22, 2008 7:48 PM EDT   0 recs

what did Al write?

boo cubs, hooray beer

by Raconteur on Jul 22, 2008 7:50 PM EDT   0 recs

meant to reply to

boo cubs, hooray beer

by Raconteur on Jul 22, 2008 7:50 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

He wrote a column

mocking me when I wrote about what a good signing Lohse was. Something like, “this guy believes that Lohse is actually a good pitcher!!!” Hardy-har-har. Thanks, Hardcore, for bringing it up. Actually, it’s the 2nd or 3rd time I’ve referred back to my post. I’m gloating a little (though I didn’t think Lohse would be anywhere near this good.)

by houstoncardinal on Jul 22, 2008 8:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

He mocked HC's claim

at the time that Kyle Lohse was a good signing.

If Kyle Lohse pitched for the Cubs, he would be the third best pitcher on the staff by a wide margin.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 22, 2008 8:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I did not know Lohse was drafted byt he Cubs

that makes this story a little bit sweeter

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 22, 2008 8:53 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

fsn

fsn is showing highlights of every cards blown saves

"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by Bahamaredbird on Jul 22, 2008 7:51 PM EDT   0 recs

There is?

I just talked to someone at the game on the phone and they said it wasn’t raining.

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 22, 2008 7:55 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

he was being sarcastic

due to the incredibly large amount of blown saves we have, it would take a few hours to show them all

boo cubs, hooray beer

by Raconteur on Jul 22, 2008 7:56 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Yep :)

Sorry for the confusion Hardcore

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 7:58 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

THAT WAS JUST PAINFUL

so much so I didn’t even bother to get off the all caps. It was worthy!

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 22, 2008 8:04 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

23 blown saves could take a while

"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by Bahamaredbird on Jul 22, 2008 7:55 PM EDT   0 recs

we have only converted 23 of 58 saves

I wonder where that ranks among league averages

"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by Bahamaredbird on Jul 22, 2008 7:58 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

correction 25 converted 23 blown

"The two most important things in life: good friends and a strong bullpen." - Bob Gibson

by Bahamaredbird on Jul 22, 2008 7:59 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

that was U G L Y

and very hard to watch

please, whoever is in charge of baseball, GOB’s or whoever, please make it stop

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Jul 22, 2008 7:58 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Record?

What is our record in games where the ‘pen has blown a save?

by bgh on Jul 22, 2008 8:02 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

We've won 9 and lost 18 I think

Proud sponsor of the Official 2008 StL Cardinal theme song: "Beautiful Day" by U2

by gocards62 on Jul 22, 2008 8:03 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

does that math work?

"Them Cubbies can kiss my ass" -Dizzy Dean

by Molina4MVP on Jul 22, 2008 8:04 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Posted earlier this week

that Cards had multiple BS in several games

Proud sponsor of the Official 2008 StL Cardinal theme song: "Beautiful Day" by U2

by gocards62 on Jul 22, 2008 8:04 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

yea.

won 9 and lost 18=27 games. isn’t that too many?

"Them Cubbies can kiss my ass" -Dizzy Dean

by Molina4MVP on Jul 22, 2008 8:06 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

overall we are 9-12

in ‘saves’ blown before the ninth we are 6-5

in saves blown in the 9th or later we are 3-7

by vances law on Jul 22, 2008 8:05 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Thanks!

Proud sponsor of the Official 2008 StL Cardinal theme song: "Beautiful Day" by U2

by gocards62 on Jul 22, 2008 8:06 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Trivia from the Braves game

Luis Gonzalez is one of 3 active players with at least 250 HRs and 500 2Bs. Name the other two. No cheating!

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:02 PM EDT   0 recs

ARod and Chipper?

Proud sponsor of the Official 2008 StL Cardinal theme song: "Beautiful Day" by U2

by gocards62 on Jul 22, 2008 8:03 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Griffey and Manny?

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 22, 2008 8:05 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Nobody's right so far...

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:06 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I know the answers...

now that I looked them up. I never would’ve gotten it. 500 doubles is tough!

by guayzimi on Jul 22, 2008 8:09 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah that's the thing

Both the Braves announcers and myself were thinking HR hitters like Griff, but you need to focus more on the 500 doubles, because there’s only a few

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:10 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Pudge?

boo cubs, hooray beer

by Raconteur on Jul 22, 2008 8:12 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Possibly

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:13 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Gotta be

Piazza is inactive, right? Or, is he in Japan? I can’t remember.

by bgh on Jul 22, 2008 8:13 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

He doesn't have 500 doubles

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:14 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

kent, pudge, gonzo

btw, both pitchers in that game are throwing no no’s

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Jul 22, 2008 8:14 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Posada

Proud sponsor of the Official 2008 StL Cardinal theme song: "Beautiful Day" by U2

by gocards62 on Jul 22, 2008 8:13 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Vlad and Giambi?

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 22, 2008 8:09 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

DLee and Ortiz

Proud sponsor of the Official 2008 StL Cardinal theme song: "Beautiful Day" by U2

by gocards62 on Jul 22, 2008 8:08 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Barry Lamar?

"Them Cubbies can kiss my ass" -Dizzy Dean

by Molina4MVP on Jul 22, 2008 8:08 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

or is he not active?

"Them Cubbies can kiss my ass" -Dizzy Dean

by Molina4MVP on Jul 22, 2008 8:09 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

Interesting note on Suppan...

He’s replaced approximately 10% of his pitches that used to be fastballs with sliders (per fangraphs)

by AndyB83 on Jul 22, 2008 8:04 PM EDT   0 recs

Totally rediculous trade...

If Oswalt gets healthy again they should move him, Berkman, and Valverde. That’ll net them some pieces. Then trade Wandy and Pence next year.

Anyway, that team was blatantly run into the ground.

by guayzimi on Jul 22, 2008 8:05 PM EDT   0 recs

they are planning on moving the team to Portland

You don’t want to see Drayton in a cardboard bikini …um Drayton cardboarded in bikini tear-offs

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 22, 2008 8:07 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

agreed

at this point, they might as well firesale

boo cubs, hooray beer

by Raconteur on Jul 22, 2008 8:09 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd have taken Wolf for Reyes

Seems to me A. Reyes would have as much or not more value than what the Padres got from Houston for Wolf. Cards need a left-handed arm, period. Wolf isn’t great, but he’s decent. Plus, he’s a vet which would make TLR happy. At worst he could have filled a role as a bullpen guy/spot starter, although I’m sure Wolf may well have considered that a demotion and may think he’s better than that (which I’m not so sure). Nonetheless, I feel it would have been a good pickup on the cheap for St. Louis for a playoff run. I’m kinda disappointed GM Mo wasn’t able to make such a deal. Relying on Carpenter and Wainwright as that “second half booster” has to be somewhat of a letdown within the clubhouse.

by RedbirdattheBeach on Jul 22, 2008 8:59 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

or even Jon Rauch

Considering the state of our bullpen. For the caliber of player it took to get Wolf and Rauch, doesn’t it make you wonder if Mo is even trying? Seems like we have this level of player/prospect to have been able to add one or both of these pitchers who in my estimation would have been helpful additions to the pitching staff.

by RedbirdattheBeach on Jul 22, 2008 9:57 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

win expectancy finder for 1 run games in 9th

I found it interesting that the win expectancy in the classic closer setting—9th inning, no one on, no out, up by one is only 86.6% for the home team and a mere 81.2% for the visitors.

for 2 run leads and above the numbers are 95%+

by vances law on Jul 22, 2008 8:12 PM EDT   0 recs

Interesting

I’d imagine that needing two or more hits is the reason.

by bgh on Jul 22, 2008 8:15 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

lets go kyle

i take your signatures and use them as away messages

by ihavebadknees on Jul 22, 2008 8:14 PM EDT   0 recs

geesh Kyle

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Jul 22, 2008 8:16 PM EDT   0 recs

that's more like it Kyle

nice K

hopefully you are correct

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson AND THAT'S A WINNER!

by gdm426 on Jul 22, 2008 8:18 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

stupid weeks

no more homers

i take your signatures and use them as away messages

by ihavebadknees on Jul 22, 2008 8:16 PM EDT   0 recs

Whoa

Loooooong out to start the game. The Gameday dot is over the wall

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:16 PM EDT   0 recs

First 1-2-3 inning of the series

Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans

by Mr Redbird on Jul 22, 2008 8:19 PM EDT   0 recs

No Dunc

I think I’ll enjoy this game more tonight.

by ccthemovieman on Jul 22, 2008 8:20 PM EDT   0 recs

Basket catch

Willie Mays style.

by bgh on Jul 22, 2008 8:22 PM EDT to parent up   0 recs

I hate it when people talk about their Fantasy teams

but I just have to brag about the Furcal and Posada for Cole Hamels trade I pulled off 3 weeks into the season.

THE SKIP IS LEGIT!!

Seriously... what were Rich Harden's parents thinking?!?!?!

by stltrav09 on Jul 22, 2008 8:20 PM EDT   0 recs

luddy

BOOYAH

i take your signatures and use them as away messages

by ihavebadknees on Jul 22, 2008 8:21 PM EDT   0 recs