Oh, the Cardinals have a farm...
E-I-E-I-O
Today’s post is something I’ve wanted to do for a long time. It’s an idea I had last season and never really could figure out how to do it well, and it’s fairly time intensive so I put it on the back burner. With the trade deadline approaching, however, and the major and minor league teams at the All-Star break, it seemed an opportune moment to pull it out.
We’re now just more than a couple of weeks away from the trade deadline and the team’s going to be attempting to figure out its needs and which of its minor leaguers it would be willing to include in any deal. Part of this evaluation includes determining which of these minor leaguers will be able to help the big club and to what degree they’ll be able to help them.
At this point I wanted to figure out which Cardinal minor leaguers have had the most success over the first 3 ½ months of their seasons. This doesn’t mean, necessarily, that we’re only evaluating those prospects on most people’s top-10 lists at the beginning of the season b/c it is their performance during the season that changes future expectations. For example, nobody had pitcher Jess Todd on their top-10 list at the beginning of the season but if he’s able to continue pitching in the second half the way he pitched in the first, he’ll definitely be there next year.
The other thing is that you can’t compare a player at Memphis’ numbers to a player at Palm Beach b/c so many things are different – quality of competition, park factors and weather, etc. With that in mind, I wanted to compare all the Cardinal pitchers’ by ERA+ and all the Cardinal hitters by OPS+ to be able to establish which minor leaguers have had the best first halves.
By measuring ERA+ rather than ERA, and OPS+ rather than OPS, we can compare players across leagues. These statistics enable us to compare each player to the average performance in their respective leagues. 100 is exactly league-average. An ERA+ or OPS+ of 120, for example, places the pitcher’s ERA or the hitter’s OPS roughly 20 percent better than the average player. Therefore, we could say that a Memphis pitcher w/ an ERA+ of 120 has been better over the first half than a Quad Cities pitcher w/ an ERA+ of 110 b/c the Memphis pitcher was 20% better than the average pitcher in the PCL whereas the Quad Cities pitcher was only 10% better than the average pitcher in the Midwest League. This would be true despite the fact that the Memphis pitcher’s ERA would probably be considerably higher than the Quad Cities pitcher’s ERA.
This approach isn’t a perfect one, I’ll acknowledge. First of all, ERA+ --- while it is a pretty good measure of how well they’ve pitched --- isn’t a good predictor of future performance. BB/9, K/9, HR/9 and GB rate are all better predictors of the future so while this will tell us which pitchers, for the most part, have had the best first halves, it won’t necessarily tell us who will be better next year or 5 years from now. Secondly, my method for computing ERA+ and OPS+ doesn’t include minor league park factors as that would complicate the analysis more than it was already. ERA and OPS will be affected by the parks in which they play but w/o taking the park factors into account, our measures of ERA+ and OPS+ won’t be as accurate as they would be if they included park factors. Finally, there are problems w/ sample sizes (esp. w/ relievers’ innings) and w/ measuring relievers by ERA at all b/c their poor pitching often affects the previous pitcher’s ERA more than theirs. I know all this and understand it. It’s not meant to be a perfect analysis but it will tell you just how good Todd has been this season and that Clayton Mortensen, despite just less than 30 IP, has done an excellent job at Memphis.
Despite all of the lack of precision, we’re going to get a pretty good idea of which players have been the best over the first half of the season.
The top 10 Cardinal pitchers by ERA+:
| Pitcher | Team | ERA+ |
|---|---|---|
| Kelvin Jimenez | Memphis | 329 |
| Jess Todd | Springfield | 281 |
| Jess Todd | Palm Beach | 230 |
| Mark Worrell | Memphis | 223 |
| Jaime Garcia | Springfield | 213 |
| Nicholas Additon | Quad Cities | 159 |
| Fernando Salas | Springfield | 159 |
| Clayton Mortensen | Memphis | 156 |
| Chuckie Fick | Quad Cities | 153 |
| Matthew Scherer | Memphis | 152 |
Some other notables: Jaime Garcia at Memphis – 117, P.J. Walters – 102, and Ron Flores – 99. That’s right at league average for AAA. Former first-rounders Adam Ottavino and Mark McCormick at Springfield are at 68 and 72, respectively.
Some of those in the table are our best pitching prospects and others, so far, are not though they’ve done extremely well the first 3 ½ months. Despite Scherer’s excellent ERA, for example, his peripherals just don’t provide much indication that he’s a top-flight prospect. Then you look at how good Jess Todd has been, for example. ERA+’s of greater than 200 at 2 levels so far this year. He has gone from fringe prospect to legitimate prospect and, possibly, someone the Cards don’t want to even consider trading this July.
Let’s now take a look at the hitters:
| Batter | Team | OPS+ |
|---|---|---|
| Joe Mather | Memphis | 134 |
| Daryl Jones | Palm Beach | 126 |
| Bryan Anderson | Springfield | 125 |
| Paul Vazquez | Quad Cities | 123 |
| Tyler Henley | Palm Beach | 119 |
| Shane Robinson | Springfield | 118 |
| Jon Jay | Springfield | 116 |
| Nick Stavinoha | Memphis | 115 |
| Francisco Rivera | Quad Cities | 115 |
| Charles Kingrey | Quad Cities | 115 |
I left out Andrew Brown’s (Springfield) performance (127 OPS+) b/c he only had 59 PA’s.
Some other notables: Rasmus – 96 (though he’s been tremendous of late); Anderson at Memphis – 111; Kozma – 103; David Freese – 101; Allen Craig – 107; Tommy Pham – 113; Steven Hill – 111; former first rounder Tyler Greene – 91; Jose Martinez – 77. My personal 2nd favorite (after Rasmus) – Jarrett Hoffpauir is exactly at 100.
The Cards will have to figure out whether or not Freese or Craig might be able to take over at 3rd when Glaus’ contract expires after next season. This helps to give us a barometer on what type of prospect they are. Daryl Jones is clearly finally coming into his own, as (of course) is Mather. These players have emerged, like Todd, as legit prospects. Jones is finally turning tools into performance and this measurement tells us that Mather has been the Cards’ best minor-leaguer so far this season. Anderson is proving that he can hit at any level. Yadi’s hit well this year but his OPS+ is only 96. There just aren’t that many catchers who are more productive than the average major leaguer at the plate. These numbers should only increase Anderson’s potential trade value.
Jay has re-emerged as a prospect after a down year last year. Robinson is emerging also a legit prospect, possibly in the mold of Skip Schumaker, despite the fact that his BB/K numbers have fallen backwards somewhat this year. All he’s done so far this year is hit.
Despite the litany of imperfections I mentioned earlier, I think this is a useful exercise b/c it does help us see how well players like Shane Robinson, Bryan Anderson, and Jon Jay have hit this year. These are guys who are often criticized for their lack of power but, as Schumaker has shown, the ability to get on base frequently is a skill that has considerable value. They may never be stars, but when one can go from level to level and continue to get on base, and hit w/ some extra base power, the organization has to take notice.
As many here know, I’m a big proponent of keeping our good prospects, not trading them for league-average rentals or league-average players w/ large contracts. As the Cards’ farm system has gotten better the past few years, I’ve become an even bigger proponent of going w/ the young guys. Make no mistake, the Cards’ farm system has gotten considerably better. If I had gone on this journey 4-5 years ago, I’d have probably gotten quite depressed in really seeing the lackluster performance of the Cards’ minor leaguers in relation to their peers. Now, 30 of the 54 (56%) minor league hitters I evaluated had an OPS+ of 100 or greater. For the pitchers, 30 of the 57 (53%) had an ERA+ of 100 or higher. More than half of the Cards’ pitchers and hitters have been better than league average so far this season. That’s a tremendous improvement over just a few years, and it’s one that is going to bear fruit at the major league level very soon.
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Comments
Sadly
Some of the top-of-the-list guys – Jiminez and Mather come to mind, have been mediocre at best when called up. I agree a farm bird is often to be preferred to an about-to-be obselete rental. Open question – outside of Rasmus and Anderson -who would REALLY excite another club to the extent the other team would part with something useful?
An optimist is a man who upon discovering that a rose smells better than a cabbage concludes it will make better soup.
HL Mencken
by akaitori on Jul 14, 2008 7:31 AM EDT 0 recs
Waaaaaaaaaaay too small of a sample size to judge Mather
boo cubs, hooray beer
by Raconteur on
Jul 14, 2008 7:51 AM EDT
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Agreed
Add to that the fact that he’s been getting the Matt Murton treatment at the big league level (in and out of the lineup, never gets a chance to get a lot of AB’s in a row), and I think it’s very difficult to grade him fairly.
When Rick was called up last year, he was playing just about every game and was given AB’s to see if he could prove himself. I think that if Mather was in the same situation, he’d be a lot better off, but the club isn’t in the dire straights with OF play that it was a year ago either.
Regardless, it’s too early to judge whether he can be an effective hitter at this level, but he’s obviously raking at AAA, so he needs to be given every chance to succeed.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on
Jul 14, 2008 8:57 AM EDT
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Not sure I'd say Mather's been "in and out of the lineup"
Mostly just “out” lately
Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country
DFA Adam Kennedy and Randy Flores!
Track 'em Tigers - An SB Nation Blog for Auburn Tigers fans
by Mr Redbird on
Jul 14, 2008 1:31 PM EDT
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he's
Barton without the dreads and with a lackluster tan.
Well, his lineup appearances are quite similar
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on
Jul 14, 2008 1:43 PM EDT
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Except Tony actually uses Mather
as a defensive replacement. Go figure.
by Hardcore Legend on
Jul 14, 2008 2:23 PM EDT
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Maybe.....
But I don’t think it is too early to say he’ll need to retool his swing to contribute significantly at the ML level.
by SoonerfanTU on
Jul 14, 2008 10:09 AM EDT
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Based on what?
I’ve yet to see anything that suggests that he needs to re-tool his swing—he gets the bat to the ball effectively, adjusts well to off-speed pitches, and is able to foul off pitches until he gets the one that he wants. He proved the last point in the at-bat against the Nationals. He hasn’t seen much major league pitching, but he tore the cover off of it in AAA this season and probably just needs some adjustment time at the big league level, similar to Ryan Ludwick last season. Mather hasn’t seen nearly as many AB’s this year than Ludwick did last June. Once he gets regular AB’s we’ll have a lot better knowledge of whether he can hit at this level.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on
Jul 14, 2008 10:30 AM EDT
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further...
i could have sworn i read this year that he already has made a lot of progress with his swing, which was largely responsible for his power increasing and his emergence as a legit hitting prospect. 2007 was the first year he slugged over .500 ( or OBPed over .350). if i remember correctly, one of the minor league coaches convinced him his approach wasn’t taking advantage of his power potential and he was “swinging like a little guy” or something along those lines. then again, i think i read this in cardinals gameday magazine, which is not exactly the forefront of sports journalism, but they do have some cool exclusives sometimes.
so yeah… small sample size i guess. it’ll be fun to see joe masher keep developing.
by mattybobo on
Jul 14, 2008 10:53 AM EDT
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he has already started to adjust his swing
When he was sent down after his first call up he shorten his swing.
by Evilfrog on
Jul 14, 2008 12:23 PM EDT
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Based on the fact.....
That apparently the club told him to shorten it. And maybe he has started the process, but he still has a very long swing, with alot of holes in it. I’ve heard 2 different sets of announcers say that, and I’ve seen the swing with my own eyes.
Mather will never be an everyday starter on a playoff team. I’m pretty sure of that. I don’t know why so many fans want to turn run of the mill prospects into potential All-Stars.
by SoonerfanTU on
Jul 14, 2008 12:46 PM EDT
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I don't know why
so many are so quick to toss our prospects aside before seeing what they can really do. You might be right about Mather but I’d kind of like to find out for sure before tossing them in the trash heap.
by chuckb on
Jul 14, 2008 1:16 PM EDT
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agreed
everytime I hear about his swing being a detriment to what Mather can do, I want them to go tell Glaus.
Them: “Glaus, do ignore the 2375 total bases you’ve gathered over the length of your career. 8 away from 300 homeruns? Oh well. Your swing is long, therefore “turning you into an all-star” isn’t likely”
Glaus : “Um, Hoss? I’m a 4 time all-star”
Them : “Hush you, don’t kill my mojo”
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on
Jul 14, 2008 1:34 PM EDT
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Nobody said toss him in the trash heap.....
But why expect the kid to do something he’s never been suggested to have the tools to do?!?
by SoonerfanTU on
Jul 14, 2008 5:23 PM EDT
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Garcia
Jamie would be the first person to come to mind. A left hander that has shown he can dominate, at times, the higher levels of the minors is a pretty rare and special thing. even if his ceiling is as a #3 those things dont grow on trees.
Jess Todd would have to draw some intrest too with the way his has pitched in a hitters league, in double A anyways.
"Baseball is like church. Many attend, but few understand." -Wes Westrum
by nomar34 on
Jul 14, 2008 8:23 AM EDT
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I have always wondered...
every year somebody gives an award to the organization that has the best collective winning pct. among it’s minor league teams( I don’t ever remember the Cardinals winning this, though perhaps I am wrong)...does anybody have a sense of whether this is any barometer of developing major league ready prospects or is it just a bragging rights kind of thing?
by tbell61 on Jul 14, 2008 8:25 AM EDT 0 recs
I think Baseball America does that...
I remember looking at it last year, and the idea of using winning percentage is a mixed bag. At the AAA level, the teams that often win are teams with AAAA type guys, or veterans trying to catch on again with a team. Most interesting to me are the records at AA because it seems that the current thinking is to advance your top propsects for a year there and think have them jump to the major league roster the next season. Off the top of my head, Bruan and Longoria both did that.
The single A levels and below, winning means nothing really its about dvelopment of players and giving a good show for the fans so they come back.
In short, my opinion would be that award means little to nothing.
by Brock20 on
Jul 14, 2008 10:01 AM EDT
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I don't think
it has a lot to do with how good the farm system is overall, but a good barometer to look at, IMO, is whether the A and AA clubs are at or around the .500 mark. Even though they are developmental levels, I think it’s safe to say that good players, even while developing, win a lot more games than bad ones do. If you have a lot of good players in your system, generally your teams will win a few more games at each level than the competition.
The important thing is player development, however, and winning or losing records really don’t tell you how well your system is developing players—they mainly just give you an overall idea of how much talent there is in the system, imo.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on
Jul 14, 2008 10:34 AM EDT
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Wins/Losses
Today, Bernie opines about the Cards’ illogical record. As per usual, he cites the blown saves, injuries, etc. but also points to why the Cards are winning. His first-listed reason (even though the reasons are in “no particular” order:
Pitching coach Dave Duncan’s rotation has surprisingly held up for a 40-23 record and a 4.13 ERA. Year after year, Duncan squeezes terrific results from makeshift rotations.
Addendum: The starters’ ERA is 4.07.
Citing a starting rotation’s win/loss record is indicative of about nothing and ironic in this column, given the fact that Bernie complains about a streaky offense and a bullpen with 20 blown saves. The reason being is that there is no more arbitrary a barometer for measuring a starting rotation’s effectiveness than wins and losses. Whether or not a starter wins or loses is as much dependent on what the offense and bullpen do after the starter exits as to what the starter does (unless he throws a CG).
Lets just focus on ERA. The Cards’ 4.07 starting rotation ERA is good for 12th in the bigs. They have a record of 40-23. For comparison, the LA Dodgers have a starting rotation ERA of 4.02, but only have a 28-37 record. There are many reasons to praise the starting rotation-especially after each of the last two seasons-but citing their win/loss record in support of their effectiveness is something that ten-year olds do when trading baseball cards. Bernie should be pointing to other stats that are actually indicative of performance.
by bgh on Jul 14, 2008 10:40 AM EDT 0 recs
Look,
that’s a perfectly viable opinion, and I don’t want to come off as a jerk or anything, but do you have any idea who newspaper columnists are writing for? You can say they should try to pull the level of their audience up, but that’s not the way it works. Columnists write to the level of their audiences. And guess what? Bernie isn’t writing for people who know how to calculate VORP. To the casual fan, win/loss records matter. We can argue about whether or not they should all you like, but the fact is, they do.
Why don't you just make like a tree, and get out of here?
by the red baron on
Jul 14, 2008 10:45 AM EDT
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Basically I agree.
But I’d like to add that while casual fans put too much emphasis on W-L records, sabrticians (IMHO) don’t put enough emphasis on it.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on
Jul 14, 2008 10:57 AM EDT
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There's something to what you just said
but you’d be hard pressed to find many people around here that would give you the time of day about it.
by Tackle Box on
Jul 14, 2008 5:32 PM EDT
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How much emphasis does it merit?
I’m more than willing to discuss this. That’s part of the reason I brought it up.
by bgh on
Jul 14, 2008 6:45 PM EDT
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I am not sure how to quantify it
But my basic points are
1) The offensive output of a team (in a game) and the team’s pitching are not completely independent. Undoubtedly pitcher’s react to the overall game situation.
2) In general pitchers are more than hitters able to “up” their game.
3) Like everyone else, to extent we have to judge what they do against the resources they have.
The St. Louis Cardinals- 11 time World Champions!
by Zubin on
Jul 15, 2008 1:22 AM EDT
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I would also add in support of W/L
that it seems a good measure of a starting pitcher’s effectiveness with the team for which they play. A pitcher that is winning a lot of games isn’t necessarily a good pitcher, but it seems to me that in order to win games they must pitch effectively for the defense behind them, the offensive production that they regularly get in support, and how the bullpen supports their starts. Additionally, their home ballpark, and/or divisional ballparks may play to their strengths.
To me, a guy like Lohse is very valuable to the Cards, because of his W/L record. I know that 11 wins doesn’t mean he is better than all pitchers with fewer wins, but at the end of the day whip and k/bb ratio doesn’t get you to the playoffs or win the WS. If your team can win games consistently with pitchers of lesser talent, why pay top dollar for “aces?”
by MotherTruckinSteve on
Jul 15, 2008 2:07 AM EDT
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W/L is why...
...we got Jim Edmonds for Kent Bottenfield.
Why feed the ignorance? There are tons of other reasons to praise Duncan that fit right into the shorthand, CW on why he is a good pitching coach. They are throwing strikes, walking fewer players, and working longer into games. Or, you could go player-by-player. Looper has dropped his ERA from 4.94 to 4.25 in his second year as a starter under Duncan (who saw his potential as a starter to begin with). Kyle Lohse, a career 4.70 ERA pitcher, has been reborn under Duncan, lowering his ERA to 3.39. Welleymeyer, too.
I’m not saying that Bernie needs to write a column about the W/L stat should be thrown out the window (although it would be hilarious). I just don’t see why ignorance was be fed. You can make the argument in support of the rotation’s work without bringing up W/L record.
by bgh on
Jul 14, 2008 10:59 AM EDT
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The problem with Bernie's statement
is that he doesn’t explain why the starting rotation has been so good. They’re walking fewer people, they’re getting a lot of ground balls, and the Cardinal infield has been turning a lot of those ground balls into outs, something they didn’t do a year ago. Win/Loss records are ok to state in a column like this, but without qualifying them by stating observational, not statistical, information that anyone can see when watching a game, it makes it sound like W/L record is good statistic to use when comparing pitching staffs when it truly is not.
In other words, use it to bring fans in, and then explain why that record is so exceptional and give fans watching games something to look for that can be reasons for that success.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on
Jul 14, 2008 11:33 AM EDT
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Offense & Bullpen
I agree wholeheartedly, but did a poor job of developing my point. If you are going to praise Dunc, then show how his philsophy of throwing strikes and pitching to contact is working for the rotation using the stats you list above: strike %, groundball outs, and defense. For context, you could compare them to the last 1.5 seasons’ horrid rotations.
Another problem is that Bernie cites inconsistent hitting and bullpen woes as reasons why the team’s record defies logic and then goes on to use the starters’ W/L record as a reason why we are winning. As I stated, perhaps convalutedly up above, a rotation’s W/L is very dependent on factors outside of their control, namely offense and the bullpen. Perhaps he could have stated that the record would be even better, but the bullpen has lost 20 games, blowing would-be “wins” for the starting pitcher. (If one insists on using W/L records.)
by bgh on
Jul 14, 2008 3:33 PM EDT
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Careful...
Adam Kennedy, who at the time was a prized prospect, was also included in that deal.
If you are going to replace W/L in the average’s fans mind you need a stat that is easy to explain and that they can grasp. One thing I’ve noticed over the past year, at least out here in Boston, is that OBP is now prevalent on all Red Sox broadcasts and is even on the jumbo tron at Fenway.
Why? Because the ownership and management of the Red Sox pushed it as their prime objective and it easy to explain to the average fan as to how to calculate and why it is important. They can get it and get it quickly.
I don’t see anything on the pitching side that rivals OBP in that regard. Quality starts are bs, and the average fan would agree to that. If they were to lower the number of runs allowed to two, I think that might be a good measurement but again I’m just brainstorming here.
I do think the growth of fantasy baseball has pushed WHIP into more people’s minds, which I think is a good thing. Again, I don’t think its a perfect measurement of effective pitching but it is a start. I would couple of it with K/BB to which going back to the forties baseball people ahead of the curve (no pun intended) were looking at as a metric.
Branch Rickey consider that his number one metric in looking at pitchers and hell if it is good enough for Branch, then it is good enough for me.
by Brock20 on Jul 14, 2008 11:21 AM EDT 0 recs
To be fair, it was talked about all post season last year by the networks holding the games. Though I guess it helps when Manny and David are OBP’in like crazy
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on
Jul 14, 2008 1:37 PM EDT
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Yes, AK was included and proved to be the Angels' best part of that deal
I don’t mean to diminish his inclusion, but he was still a bit far off at that point and Bottenfield was highly touted after his 18-win season (even if there was nothing much else to get jazzed about). I believe that Bottenfield’s inflated value made the deal palatable and that Walt leveraged him at his absolute highest value for Jimmy Baseball. I count my blessings that he did so even if Jimmy is now disregarding his Cardinal history while wearing royal blue pinstripes.
(As an aside, I forked over more than I’ve ever paid for tickets to get seats behind the Padres dugout when Jimmy was a Padre, so I could sit behind the dugout and show my appreciation for him. Was that ever a miscalculation…Nonetheless, I’m very excited for this weekend’s series.)
Rickey used K/BB or W/L? I’m a bit unclear.
by bgh on
Jul 14, 2008 3:38 PM EDT
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What did Edmonds do to tick u off?
Baseball's only fun if you're playing it, watching it, or thinking about it.
by Eckstreem on
Jul 14, 2008 3:58 PM EDT
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I'm not ticked off
I just found he and TLR’s little tiff a bit saddening because I found it to be below each man.
It’s Padres management that ticked me off when they DFA’d him, causing me to miss his return to Busch (or should I type “InBev?”).
I’m not really angry with anyone, to be honest, just lamenting the twist of fate that prevented me from missing Edmonds in St. Louis one last time (even if he’s not wearing the birds-on-bat).
by bgh on
Jul 14, 2008 5:04 PM EDT
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This great game has some wonderful surprises at the all star break......
Our own Cardinals are performing in ways that were not expected when the season began-we discuss that all the time. There are some things you might have missed, though…..
Ian Kinsler is becoming a household name.
Chad Billingsley is the best young pitcher no one has heard about.
Okay, great for you Josh Hamilton—but what about Milton Bradley and his season?
Tim Lincecum is the most fun to watch…...and he sure has electric stuff.
Kudos to Justin Verlander for turning around what looked like a really bad season.
Quick. Who’s the Oakland pitching coach? He has gotten magnificent performances from pitchers hardly anyone has heard of.
The Minnesota Twins are in contention. Huh?
The White Sox traded smartly-yes they did, and stuck with some young arms, and Brian Anderson-they are in first place. Carlos Quentin is going to be an MVP candidate-maybe even this year.
The Yankees all look old at the same time. The young starters weren’t ready for prime time-but how about Mike Mussina’s year? He’s a neat guy. I’m gald he could turn it around.
I admit I love Manny being Manny-but keep your hands to yourself-no pushing teammates and travelling secretaries allowed.
Next time you feel bad about injured players, go look at what has happened to the Nationals. They’ve lost 2 outfield starters, 2 infield starters, a closer, and various other role players to the DL. They didn’t have a very good team, but there’s a reason they have been soooooo bad.
The Seattle team-ugh. They sure made a lot of mistakes putting that mess together.
Baseball ought to be ashamed about the condition of the National League West. How did all of those teams get so bad?
Prediction: Home Run Derby Winner=Grady Sizemore
AL beats NL in 10 innings 5-4
That’s all folks…..I probably should have started a diary…..sorry, Houston Cardinal, but I just don’t want to clutter it up…Peace out.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on Jul 14, 2008 11:24 AM EDT 0 recs
Nice
I’m surprised Kenny Williams isn’t more highly regarded. I thought the Danks/Masset for McCarthy trade was brilliant last year and it’s looking like it this go around.
Carlos Quentin was a guy I was really happy the Cardinals were going after a coupla years ago. Williams was smart to pry him away.
by liam on
Jul 14, 2008 11:34 AM EDT
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I think Kenny is a good GM
but the comments he makes in public make him seem to be more lucky than good.
Well who the hell can see forever?
by Alxfritz on
Jul 14, 2008 11:36 AM EDT
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I will credit him with having a good eye, a very good eye,
on what players will work best in his home park.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 11:49 AM EDT
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He's made some good moves...
But he’s made some bad ones as well, like trading for Orlando Cabrera and his huge contract.
The McCarthy for Danks/Masset was one of his finer moments for sure, although McCarthy has showns signs of being a pretty decent pitcher when healthy. Arizona just needs to be slapped with a fine for giving up on a talented OF prospect like Quentin when they were already short on good bats to begin with. There were probaby a lot of GM’s looking to trade for Quentin, because he was on the block all winter long—I think Williams just got lucky on that one.
Ozzie deserves as much or more credit for this club’s success—occasional press tirades aside, he’s shown that he can be a good situational manager and can properly motivate veterans.
"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller
by fourstick on
Jul 14, 2008 11:41 AM EDT
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Quentin
I think Zona gave up on him due to injury and they had good young OF depth…. It’s not like Quentin could have gotten consistent AB’s in Zona.
Besides the Dbacks and Sox have traded in the past so they have a relationship. The sox sent Chris Young to the Dback for Vazquez.
by ICbirdfan on
Jul 14, 2008 11:53 AM EDT
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Orlando Cabrera is a free agent after this season.
So is Jon Garland. I see it as a bad contract swap for a bad contract swap. I doubt Garland re-signs with the Angels. I also doubt that Cabrera re-ups with the Sox.
Not even mentioned is Alexi Rameriz—now that was a coup by old Kenny, no?
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 11:54 AM EDT
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Please. You are combining Sox/Expert, right?
I follow them because they come on TV free with my cable package. They really are a fun team to watch….oh, and my husband grew up a Chisox fan.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 12:10 PM EDT
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No,
actually, I was comparing the fairer sex with expert.
by ridgesee on
Jul 14, 2008 12:12 PM EDT
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Okay, I guess?......
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 12:31 PM EDT
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oooo
I wish we could get Kinsler on our team somehow! he’s on one of my fantasy teams, and he’s been raking. I watched some of the Cubs game where Lincecum was shutting them down, now that was a lot of fun to watch for sure! not only does he have electric stuff, he looks like he’s having a blast throwing it. I’m sort of surprised the Twins are in contention, but more surprised that the White Sox have been in first place for most of the year. and M. Bradley’s performance has been a huge surprise.
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on
Jul 14, 2008 1:21 PM EDT
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And that's why they play the games........
I am even surprised that Bradley has been healthy enough to start the season…...he has missed time here and there, but thus far avoided the DL. He’s an all star to boot…..good for him. He’s one of those intense folks-the things that make him so good also make him so bad. I think he’s really been embraced in Texas, and it’s probably helped him stay CLOSE to emotionally balanced, that and the fact other players are in the spot light there too.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 1:27 PM EDT
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and no one would have guessed
that Ludwick would be an all-star… the Cards are one of the biggest surprises. and I’m proud of Ankiel, there’s just so much perseverance going on with that guy
strikeouts from left-center
by Cards Fan in Chitown on
Jul 14, 2008 2:20 PM EDT
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Watched the
Future Stars game yesterday and I can’t tell you how good it feels to have a few of the young Birds there.
Todd walked the first guy he faced on four pitches but got the next two out. The second was a strike’m out throw’m out double play. He gets some good sink on that fastball. He has instantly became my favorite prospect since I found out he’s from Kilgore TX and went to Kilgore CC. The only reason I’ve even heard of this tiny town in East Texas is because my younger brother was a cheerleader there for a year.
Salas worked his three batters in order but I wasn’t very impressed, looks like a smoke and mirrors type of pitcher. If he has the command to do that great but his stuff looks average at best.
Anderson walked on four pitches and was stranded at first but he did look good catching. I was impressed that he went out to the mound to settle down the Rockies prospect when he started losing it, he seemed to handle the pitchers well. Just wish he had gotten more then one at bat so I could see what his swing looks like.
"Do what you want to the women and children but leave me alone"- George Carlin
by That's a Winner on Jul 14, 2008 12:04 PM EDT 0 recs
Nice....thanks for that. I didn't get to watch.
I’m one of about 5 folks that DOESN’T want Anderson traded. At least not yet…..
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 12:07 PM EDT
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Im 6
Well. Im really okay with trading everyone. But we better be getting something really good for Anderson.
by Evilfrog on
Jul 14, 2008 12:32 PM EDT
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Jill
I don’t want him traded…yet and maybe not at all. However, I have been impressed w/ the improvment Yadi’s made at the plate and am resigned to the fact that the current admin loves Yadi on an almost cult-like level. At this point, I’d rather see Anderson go than Todd or Garcia but, if I had my way, I’d keep them all for the time being.
by chuckb on
Jul 14, 2008 12:37 PM EDT
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I think what we do know about him, is that he can hit.
We know he’s very young for his level, we know he has made improvements defesively, and how he handles a pitcher. (you can watch MILB tv archived games for free if you want to watch-he’s very agile, makes stupid mistakes with passed balls, but doesn’t look clueless either) I mean, he could be the next Maurer or Martin type, no? Yadi’s made real strides as a hitter, but I just worry if he goes down. I’d rather have Anderson waiting in the wings than go with LaRue or Mark Johnson for any prolonged length of time..not to mention, are we sure what his worth is yet? I hope they keep him, at least for this season.
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 12:49 PM EDT
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I don't want to trade him either
I’ve told people, if we are going to trade a catcher, why not trade Molina, who has demonstrable value and would likely bring more in return, and take a chance on Anderson? I don’t mean this year. I don’t think Anderson is ready. But I wonder why Anderson’s name comes up so often as trade bait (I’m talking to you, Dan McLaughlin). At least consider the other option, if we feel we can’t carry two good catchers.
by Youneverknow on
Jul 14, 2008 12:52 PM EDT
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They would NEVER consider trading Molina.........
Mr. LaRussa would have a stroke…...
The Indians kept Kelly Shoppach around. Turns out they needed him…....
She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.
by jillsinmo on
Jul 14, 2008 12:56 PM EDT
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You sure don't think much of TLR or Duncan.....
Why should Tony want Molina to be traded? He’s still relatively young, is pretty much a perfect defensive catcher, has learned what TLR and Duncan want, and NOW he’s even hitting the ball well.
We’d be fools to move him.
by SoonerfanTU on
Jul 14, 2008 12:59 PM EDT
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What could we get for Molina?
We’ve gotten so used to trading prospects for established major leaguers under Jocketty that it’s almost as if we have forgotten that you can also trade good players for good players, giving both teams a chance to fill a need.
The Keith Hernandez for Neil Allen deal turned out to be a great trade for the Mets, but part of the reason Herzog was willing to make it was to create room for Andy Van Slyke on the team. Why else have the minor leagues? he asked. I’m looking at this situation similarly—your top prospects give you flexibility with your established players.
As I wrote above, I don’t think Anderson is ready, and that is just based on what other people around here are saying. I would not put Yadi on the block this season. Maybe not even next year. But if Anderson really is a major league catcher (something the club has to evaluate), maybe his bat makes up for him not being one of the top catchers in the league. I agree with you that Yadi is at the top. But do we need the top defensive catcher to win? Or merely a good one?
All this is predicated on the thought that trading Yadi brings more in return than trading Anderson now or even next year.
by Youneverknow on
Jul 14, 2008 2:14 PM EDT
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Anderson
Even if he doesnt turn out to be an actual GG type catcher with his defense. If he can hit like Martin, and field comparably, he’ll win the GG anyway. (tongue in cheek, firmly)
I’d rather not see Anderson or Yadi traded, at least not yet. We know what we have with Yadier, and are beginning to see what Anderson is capable of. Lets not rush either of them out the door in favor of the other until we KNOW what weve got total package wise.
C'mon you Redbirds, lets prove em' wrong, again!
by yer dog first on
Jul 14, 2008 2:22 PM EDT
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