a few comments, questions, re Mulder

by the Tewk on Jul 1, 2008 12:38 PM EDT Comment 26 comments

(not that I am looking forward to, or trying to contribute to, a Mulder mania)

- I remarked after the 7th inning last night that if MM didn't throw an inning in this game, then why was he even put on the roster. Moot point

- If I had been in a coma for a year or so and woke up just in time to see him pitch last night, to my eyes it would not have been in the least remarkable. What I mean is the rhythm of his delivery seemed exactly the same as I remember it before. But hasn't there been some talk/reporting that during his re-hab he had changed his arm angle? If so, I could not discern it.

- Like most VEBers, I suspect, I was the most pleased about the fact that he threw strikes and didn't walk anybody {altho I think the ump gave him one, maybe two, calls... possibly the oft-seen wider strike zone in the last inning of a relative blow-out, or maybe even sympathy/respect for a veteran trying to come back} Even if so, Mulder was consistenly close to the plate.

- The two bloop hits also seemed 'familiar' to me. Hasn't Mulder always been a victim of that kind of thing? That's my memory of his previous work, anyway. I think because he has a lot of movement on his breaking stuff. Watching a flared, "lucky" hit off him also seemed like the old days, to me.

- lastly, the future question: what do we do with him now?: a) reserve him for a few more 'safe' one-inning stints; b) allocate him as the long-relief guy for the next week or so; c) pencil him in for a start; d) trade him back to Oakland {just kidding}

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Two things

1) I also could not discern any change in arm angle. However, despite being a pitcher myself, I’ve never been all that good at mechanical analysis of anyone except myself. So if someone who knows their stuff tells me his arm slot is lower, I believe them.

2) I think you take it slow on Mulder. A few more low-leverage situations. Then maybe some higher leverage situations. Then maybe you start to stretch him out in long relief (if the rotation is the ultimate goal). If all is still well, let him start against a mediocre team. Slow. Nice and easy.

by mojowo11 on Jul 1, 2008 12:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I like the move with Mulder.

They put him in a position where it was his to lose. I would have rather seen him take one inning to do a check than two innings that a recovering starting pitcher would normally do.

Prospects are good. Especially when they aren't rushed.

by CraveCase on Jul 1, 2008 12:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Here are two photos...

One from his days in Oakland and one from last night.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/photo;_ylt=AsyNIYGh91dfJ4b80lMrT8aFCLcF?slug=cd7b3da0a7a84bd981716fc46dee05ae.mets_cardinals_baseball_motg110&prov=ap

baseball301434/Mulder/Mulder29.jpg” target=”_blank”>http://members.tripod.com/baseball301434/Mulder/Mulder29.jpg

It looks like the recent one is slightly lower.

by Jumsy on Jul 1, 2008 1:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20080701/capt.cd7b3da0a7a84bd981716fc46dee05ae.mets_cardinals_baseball_motg110.jpg

by Jumsy on Jul 1, 2008 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good job by Mulder

I was impressed by the fact that after he gave up those two hits he wasn’t rattled , and continued to throw strikes. I liked the situation in which TLR placed Mulder in. The Birds had a six run lead and there was a lot of wiggle room.

by The Great Mississippi on Jul 1, 2008 2:10 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

start him out slow

i have a feeling the cards might do something similar to what the yanks did w/ joba. stretch his appearances out more and more until he is ready to make a start

by thenextgen on Jul 1, 2008 2:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I think the best move here

might be to use him to replace Flores for a while. We certainly are in dire need of an effective lefty out of the ‘pen and, until one of our starters falters or is injured, why not? Heck, I can envision the same role for Carp when he returns—not unlike what they did with Matty Mo a few years back.

by LuBrock20 on Jul 1, 2008 3:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

i think that the shoulder and hip positioning through his motion

are more significant than the arm angle. hips and shoulders are responsible for a larger portion of a pitchers velocity than anything.

by huts04 on Jul 1, 2008 3:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm basically on page

with Mulder, and a bit later Carpenter, working their way back to a starting role by spot relief for a while… with one multi-expressed reservation. Wouldn’t they almost have to enter at the beginning of an inning, and wouldn’t that limit their range (usefulness) as a member of the pen? Or, if used as ready-for-anything part of the bullpen, wouldn’t the possible excessive warming up for no reason (ie end up not being used) potentially be harmful to a career starter type?
It’s a thread the needle kind of thing. We want to protect the long-term health of valuable properties like Mulder and Carp, and do what is best for the final phases of their re-hab. BUT we also need to win games. Is asking a plumber to lay bricks all that wise an allocation of labor?
Granted we are not concerned (for THEM) if they have a bad relief outing, but what if it means we lose a few games we should have won?

by the Tewk on Jul 1, 2008 3:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd be surprised if Carp came into the 'pen as anything but the closer

so that addresses the ‘versatility’ end of things with him. As far as Mulder, you might have a point, but maybe they’re trying to ease him back into the rotation. Boggs does need to be sent down.

They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...

by Valatan on Jul 1, 2008 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

As much as...

...Boggs may need to be sent down, I think after watching him vs. the Royals Saturday, he needs to be given one more start in the majors OR be sent down for the rest of the year. Let him either have earned another start, or tell him, good enough for this year (unless the injury bug hits this hard again.) Take what you have learned up here and tear it up in Memphis and around the PCL.

by stlfan on Jul 1, 2008 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What would be the pros and cons

of relief versus starting, looking at it solely from a conditioning standpoint. Can Mulder (or Carpenter, for that matter) move in and out of short-relief, long-relief and spot-starting without screwing up their starter conditioning? Can relief pitchers who are really starters on furlough throw side sessions and the like to be able to hop back into starting on, say, a week’s notice?

I genuinely would like to know. Because if Mulder is to be a starter, or can be, then maybe his relief duties should be decidedly short-term.

by Red in Chicago on Jul 1, 2008 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It seems like it's way easier to go from starter to reliever than the other way around

but then again, I’ve only seen this used as an excuse.

They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...

by Valatan on Jul 1, 2008 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

remember 2000

In 2000, the Cards has Alan Benes and Matt Morris in the pen when both were rehabbing injuries, right? Maybe we’ll see Mulder setting up Carp’s saves by the end of the year.

by raisin1 on Jul 1, 2008 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Closer?

I’d say the chances of that are darn near zero.

You don’t take two guys that have been closing all year (Izzy and Franklin), and completely take them out of the closer’s role.

Nor do you throw a guy coming off of arm surgery into that role, with other capable arms.

by SoonerfanTU on Jul 1, 2008 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Franklin's been kind of shaky as of late

and I havent’ seen Izzy declared ‘fixed’ yet. And the Carp situation seems somewhat analogous to the situation the Braves had when John Smoltz was coming off of surgery in 2000 or so.

They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...

by Valatan on Jul 1, 2008 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

that is exactly what the Braves did though with Smoltz

and it worked out pretty damn good

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 2, 2008 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

you cant throw a guy into the closers role

until you see what he has to offer
you didnt do it with matt morris
you shouldnt do it here
he might have the tenacity
but you need to know what you have in a closer
and he wont be a known commodity for serveral outings

Come on 2009!

by benstl on Jul 4, 2008 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

mixed on Carpenter

I think what Valatan meant, Sooner, was IF Carp throws in some relief it would be as a closer … for the few times he did throw out of the pen. I don’t think he meant Carp would BECOME our ‘everyday’ closer or anything like that.
However I may be in the middle on this… in that I think Carpenter has the temperament (and certainly the tools) to BE a closer. a’la John Smoltz, or a reverse Wainer.
Say, for instance, if the medico’s etc determine that Carp will NOT be ready to assume a starter role any time this year, because of arm strength or whatever, but that he COULD pitch short stints without any negative impact on his long-term re-hab… why not use him as a closer.
He eats nails for breakfast and that is one of the most important attributes of a closer; not all of them are the raw heat kind.
And I admit that some of my dreaming, here, is because I don’t think much of Izzy.

by the Tewk on Jul 1, 2008 5:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

He definitely wouldn't come off the DL as a closer

I don’t look at him like a Percival type pitcher. He’s a much better stamina pitcher. Long relief, would be much better for him, and for the rest of the tired, tired bullpen.

Prospects are good. Especially when they aren't rushed.

by CraveCase on Jul 1, 2008 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed.....

Plus, with when he is now expected back, if he starts in the pen, I bet he stays there all season.

by SoonerfanTU on Jul 1, 2008 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

why wouldn't he?

if he had his stuff back, and was effective? If he is your nest option in the pen why wouldn’t he be at least given opportunities in the closer role?

* sarcasm might be involved in this comment

by mattyfrommo on Jul 2, 2008 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

especially since

closer = strictly 9th inning pitcher = warmup situation solved.

They say that it's never too late, but you don't get any younger...

by Valatan on Jul 3, 2008 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Muder's Mechanics

I just took a look at Mark Mulder’s mechanics…

- Mark Mulder: Pitching Mechanics Morph

The bottom line is that he looks better to me than he has in 2 or 3 years. His PAS elbow isn’t so low and his arm doesn’t seem to be dragging as much.

Of course, taking 2 years off will fix a lot of problems.

by thepainguy on Jul 2, 2008 10:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs