Game 35 overflow II
by lboros on May 7, 2008 11:23 PM EDT
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Printbullpen's having a tough series ---- aside from villone and parisi, that is . . . . rockies lead it 4-3 and are still batting.
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Skippy, miles and pujols
if we’re going to get magic, let’s see it.
"You say the world has lost it's love. I say embrace what it's made of" - Dar Williams
+1
I wanna see some magic!
C'mon you Redbirds, lets prove em' wrong, again!
by yer dog first on May 7, 2008 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Alberto and Skippy are money
Albert Pujols will save the universe!
We have...
so much bullpen depth in the system. It really doesn’t make sense to continue to let old foges like Franklin, Springer, and, hate to say it, Izzy lose games for us. D.GOOCH
-- GOOCH
I really think that izzy just needs to abandon that damn cutter
he was effective in chicago when he did that
"You say the world has lost it's love. I say embrace what it's made of" - Dar Williams
on base
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
by ihavebadknees on May 7, 2008 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Skippy
nice. Get ‘im home, boys
"You say the world has lost it's love. I say embrace what it's made of" - Dar Williams
see, skippy is money!
now miles will shock me with a hit, and alberto hits a double to clear the bases…
well, our defensive replacement RF
was playing in frigging CF.
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
ugh
sometimes you just don’t get the breaks. Unlucky game for Albert
"You say the world has lost it's love. I say embrace what it's made of" - Dar Williams
its outright
guilty
C'mon you Redbirds, lets prove em' wrong, again!
by yer dog first on May 7, 2008 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions
well BOO! that
Izzy is back in the dog house I think
The bullpen has series issues
changes will need to be made.
by Hardcore Legend on May 7, 2008 11:34 PM EDT reply actions
Well
there is a series of problems as well. The series goes: Flores, Franklin, Izzy
by RabidBuffalo on May 7, 2008 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions
we like to have losses like this this year
we will come back tomorrow
i take your signatures and use them as away messages
Well,
that really stinks.
No Cutter is gonna be the new theme of this site when Izzy comes in. Blast that stinkin pitch!
C'mon you Redbirds, lets prove em' wrong, again!
fine fine, Barton and Miles also
but I meant just as an overall team performance, it was disgusting. But I guess most of the falls on the shoulders of Pujols and the bullpen. Ankiel got an rbi, but really screwed up by hitting into the DP with the bases jacked.
boo cubs, hooray beer
Hard to hit the ball
When the ump is calling balls that nearly hit you and bounce of the ground “strikes”
by cloistermaximus on May 7, 2008 11:35 PM EDT reply actions
I think we just saw a glimpse
of why we’re not considered a great team. Too many LOB bites us in the ass when we hand the ball to our blownsaver.
Rasmus or bust.
Sorry to be blunt
But I’m getting pretty fucking tired of this bullpen losing these games for us.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:36 PM EDT reply actions
i dunno
the hitting could be improved too
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions
can't win 'em all guys
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:36 PM EDT reply actions
when you win the last two games by one run in dramatic fashion
chances are, you’re not going to win the next one
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
it's funny
we say that, but I wonder if it’s true. I was watching the Scrubs vs the Reds today and the Cubs were down 9-0, and Bob Brenly or Len Kasper or whoever says “You know…we say we’d much rather lose games like this, than the ones where you lead until the end then blow it, but I don’t know if that’s true. This isn’t any fun at all”
I had to agree with them, losing like this sucks, but I think getting blown out is less fun.
boo cubs, hooray beer
we learned that lesson last year
glad to see the cubs learning it this year ;)
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
last season would have been
a lot more painful if we had lost all those games in the ninth due to a poor bullpen
but atleast we had good efforts
in blowouts, generally the whole team sucked. You can atleast take a few positives from tonights game: Wainwright continues to pitch like an ace, Ludwick is looking more and more like a legitimate cleanup hitter, etc..
boo cubs, hooray beer
2 out of three aint bad
and the cards have been doing it consecutively for a while.
one more tomorrow i think
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions
The love hate relationship here with Izzy is amusing, but
warranted. He clearly has the ability to be a shutdown closer once every blue moon, and we all love him when he does. That said, it’s time for a change. If this team is going to live up to the unexpected potential it has, we must have consistency in a closer.
yeah
he hasn’t been reliable enough to be a closer imo. not sure if anyone would be better though
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think anyone in the pen currently
is in a position to adequately replace Izzy. Maybe there’s a farm product I don’t know about, or Moz could make a trade.
by BamaCardinal on May 7, 2008 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think Perez is ready
personally. He still has command issues.
Motte only has one trick at the moment, and it’s a very hard fastball. That’s good enough to get AAA hitters out, but you need seconday stuff to get major leaguers out.
Jaime Garcia is a starter, so he wouldn’t be much help in the pen.
boo cubs, hooray beer
yea
command is an issue…but i’d rather my closer walk one an inning and then strike out the side than give up base hit after base hit
chris perez, jason motte, jaime garcia
google ‘em.
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
I admittedly don't keep up with the farm system
like I should…
by BamaCardinal on May 7, 2008 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Never liked him professionally
Never will. 100% Izzy hate/concern from me. Whee! Personally, though, he seems nice enough.
Rasmus or bust.
As a person, I like him alot
as a baseball player, not so much.
But he really is a stand up guy and it pains me to be so harsh on him, but i’m sick of him blowing games.
boo cubs, hooray beer
Tony has to be thinking
about trying someone else in the closer role. I agree it is time for a change. Can’t afford to blow to many more games like this, especially since we have trouble with leaving tons of men on base and struggle to score more that 4-5 runs most games.
it all boils down to
one missed fly ball by albert. love the mang, and izzy didn’t pick him up, but ya gotta catch that ball.
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
or a series of lob at bats with nothing to show
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions
most of which were by Albert also
probably one the worst games of his amazing career
boo cubs, hooray beer
thanks to TLR not making him take a day off
or just giving him a day off, either way
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
we could be, like, totally celebrating how awesome Duncan is right now
oh, what fickle fans we are…
Still in first place by 2.5 games!!!
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
we're spoiled
heh
Ankiel is Jesus!
by Cards Fan in Chitown on May 7, 2008 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
i dont blame TLR for that
tomorrow was the ideal day to give Pujols the day off, not tonight
boo cubs, hooray beer
I'm surprised
this is the first mention of this in these gamethreads.
I left in the 8th after Flores got Helton to pop-up with a man on third and one out. Watched the Atkins AB when Pujols should have ended the inning on that foul pop. (He owned up to it in the post-game). Game should’ve been over there, Flores was nails and should’ve been the hero. Left when we changed pitchers to Izzy.
It’s a serious pisser that Isringhausen blew the save, but that inning should’ve been over without him having to pitch.
Also, I met up with a bunch of Red Sox fans to watch the top of the 9th. Pujols’ liner that Barmes leapt and caught was a rope. My table was greatly impressed with both the Pujols BIP and the Barmes snag.
Get ‘em tomorrow! Their starter has an ERA over 20!
We’ll just have to win the next two to get to the beastly .666 winning percentage.
Yep...bullpen needs a shake up
can’t trust Franklin or Izzy and Springer doesn’t even pitch, he just takes up a spot as best as i can tell.
Need another shutdown righty cause Franklin isnt that this year and who knows what the hell is up with Springer.
Besides his actual number of saves
does izzy have one stat/periphial/split or anything that could look as positive this season? I looked around and just could not find one bit of information that makes me think he can be effective this season.
nothing about Izzy has been a positive this season
after those first handful of games.
boo cubs, hooray beer
I’ll take Izzy without the cutter over anyone that we have in AAA at the moment, but even though he has some great success without it, he keeps going back to it and it’s bs
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Apparently Mike Shannon was right
he said that we’d lose the game if Albert didn’t come through with the bases loaded.
boo cubs, hooray beer
I agree with SleepyCA
I thought Pujols was a bigger goat this game than Izzy. Spilborghs’ single off Izzy was kind of a fluke—a chopper that squeaked between third and short. I mean, sure, the Iannetta triple was scorched, but frankly we shouldn’t have been in that position. Albert missing that pop fly was just odd, and he left 8 runners on base. Add in Ankiel losing track of the outs (and GIDP’ing with the bases juiced) and it all adds up to, I think, our ugliest loss of the season.
Brian Gunn
But there was some over managing
I mean, K-Mac should have stayed in there. He K’d the first guy, a bloop single and a triple. We’re up 3-1, surely he could have been given a chance. Why bring in Flores in that situation?
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Flores
is known to allow inherited runners to score, k-mac should have had a chance to redeem off a bad and well hit pitch.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
well, secondary goat vote goes to schu
he gave up two triples in one inning by being poorly positioned in RF. If he was told to play in CF by someone, fine, but he was way out of position on two balls that should not have made it to the wall.
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
uhhh....i doubt he was out of position by his own accord
the outfielders position themselves where the manager tells them to.
boo cubs, hooray beer
He also struggle reading both of those balls off the wall
although I doubt it mattered on being triples or not.
by Hardcore Legend on May 8, 2008 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions
someone explain the pujols dropped popfly
when did this happen?
Bottom of the 8th
Two outs, Flores just got Helton to pop out for out #2, then there was a foul pop near the first-base dugout. For some reason Albert drifted over and waited near the dugout railing, as if he was going to reach in and snare the pop. But it fell about two feet BEHIND him (he got twisted around and actually tried to barehand it at the last second).
Brian Gunn
and Colby Rasmus continues to stink it up in AAA
even though the rest of the team is raking against this Las Vegas pitcher. Anderson, Hoffpauir and Freese are all having great games and Mitchell Boggs is throwing a pretty good game versus one of the better AAA line ups.
boo cubs, hooray beer
Well
it could be said we stole the first game, they stole this one. let’s.. not split this series tomorrow.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:51 PM EDT reply actions
Agree...
We can still take 3 of 4 tomorrow….and that is a damn fine goal before heading into Brew land…
and
I don’t have any direct stats to show for it off hand, but from general impressions, teams that finish a road trip in fl don’t tend to do well.
and the brew have been stinking it up as of late, let’s not go in there on a 2 game losing streak.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Good point
We could’ve won all 3, but we really only played well enough to win 2 of 3, so the baseball gods are still just.
Brian Gunn
Yea
the only problem is that you can’t just ignore the obvious Izzy problem (i’m not saying you are, just saying in general). Something has to be done about this, but I don’t know if it will be. TLR has proven that he will keep trotting Izzy out there, regardless of the outcome
boo cubs, hooray beer
Well
I’m probably not along with the main group that thinks there’s an izzy problem per se. There’s an Izzy pitch problem. He needs to be enforced, by dunc, tlr, molina, larue et all.
That cutter is not something he needs to use, at all.
That’s the pitch that kills the man, remove the pitch and you still have a decent closer. In my opinion.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions
and he shouldn’t have even been in there. K-Mac should have gotten a chance after that triple to recover. I don’t think Flores was the right call at that moment.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 7, 2008 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I just dont think it is that simple
because if something is that obvious to us, then it is that obvious to people in the organization as well. Izzy was leaving the ball up with both his cutter and his fastball, which is a sign that his hip is acting up again. He needs to hit the DL
boo cubs, hooray beer
Possible.
But I think we have to accept that Izzy is just not the overpowering closer he has been in the past. I think the pitch he threw on the triple was not that bad of a pitch actually….and I REALLY question the move to bring him in, in the 8th by Tony.. ... but last night it was Franklin.. tonight Izzy….. but the 10 men left on base….the dropped foul by Albert…all of that is why they lost this game….and you have to just hand it to the Rocks and get ready for tomorrow.
well, I watched on espn rather than gameday as far as location and one pitch was up the entire outing, now while I can accept espn being off, it’s fair to say that his pitches weren’t up. No where near ‘06 Izzy standards.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 8, 2008 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
i watched on tv, and it looked to me like all the hits came off pitches that were up
boo cubs, hooray beer
Wagonmaker looked strong...
I almost prefer gut-thinking with our bullpen, wagonmeaker looked good keep him going.. pitch-counts overrated?
by Future Birds-on-Bat on May 7, 2008 11:55 PM EDT reply actions
yeah, he was dead
throwing 87 mph fastballs. Yikes.
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
Wagonmaker looked strong...
I almost prefer gut-thinking with our bullpen, wagonmeaker looked good keep him going.. pitch-counts overrated?
by Future Birds-on-Bat on May 7, 2008 11:55 PM EDT reply actions
Luddy gets the BAMF award, regardless of outcome
Waino is a close second, but he didn’t get a homerun, and I was disappointed.
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 8, 2008 12:04 AM EDT reply actions
hilarious WPA result tonight
Luddy was 2-4 with a HR, 2 RBI, and a run scored, (in a 3 run game!) and 2 great catches in the OF, while Schu was 1-1 with a single in the ninth inning giving up 2 triples, and luddy finished the game with a -.004 WPA while Schu led the team with .114.
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
have a link Sleepy?
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 8, 2008 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions
just the basic fangraphs page
http://www.fangraphs.com/livewins.aspx?gameid=280507127
And I awoke in California, far far from Spancilhill...
ah
duh, thanks
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 8, 2008 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions
know how many bullpen losses we have this year?
it’s a worrying trend, though I agree. Need to concentrate on tomorrow now, don’t want to head to Miller on a two game losing streak. Need to back up Lohse with a nice spray of hits
I use statistics much as a drunken man uses lamp-posts – as support rather than illumination. - Andrew Lang
by AdjustedExpectations on May 8, 2008 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I don't think you can blame Pujols....
Sure, it would have been great to catch that foul ball. But it’s not like it was an easy pop fly foul, it was about 3 feet from the stands, and it probably would have been in the stands in just about any other ballpark.
In situations like that, you need a reliever that can strike a guy out. The Cardinals don’t have that, really.
Start Ludwick vs righties (maybe this will work)
closer situation
what if we trade someone for Marmol? I mean… the Cubs aren’t very smart, right? he’s not even their closer now for some stupid reason.
I have a love/hate relationship with the Cardinals' middle relief corps.
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