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Going to the Well

Todd Wellemeyer – never really been a fan. Well, that’s not exactly true. He’s got pretty good stuff but he’s basically a two-pitch pitcher. Still, they’re two pretty good pitches – a good, hard fastball and a tight slider. I’ve just always seen him as a better fit for the bullpen – b/c of his lack of a solid third pitch and the fact that he has historically had such a problem w/ walks. His career BB/9 is 5.49 and last year w/ the Cards it was more than 4 per 9 IP.

I am, however, starting to wonder if he’s not becoming a different pitcher. He’s still got the two solid pitches but yesterday was his third solid starter out of 3 this year. I know, his stats don’t look that great in the boxscore b/c things did unravel in the 6th but he entered the inning having given up 1 hit and 2 BB’s. He ended up striking out 7 in 6 IP. We are still only talking about 3 starts but it’s a pretty good string he’s putting together nonetheless.

Toward the end of spring training, there was some discussion (you may have noticed it, not sure) about who would fill the final two spots in the rotation. Yesterday’s closer – Anthony Reyes – was left out of the rotation in favor of Brad Thompson (who has since been replaced by today’s starter) and Wellemeyer. At the time, Duncan said he was most impressed w/ Wellemeyer’s ability to "control pitch counts" – implying a reduction in walks. I excoriated him on a number of occasions about this seemingly ridiculous statement b/c, at the time, Wellemeyer had walked 9 batters in 12 IP. He finished the spring w/ 11 BB and 10 K in 20 IP – not exactly Cy Young numbers. Still, he’s begun the regular season now w/ 7 BB and 20 K in 18 IP – a distinct improvement.

It would be pretty surprising if Wellemeyer were able to maintain this sort of improvement throughout the entire season. He’ll be 30 in August – not the age one generally peaks – and has 155 career BB in 254 career IP over parts of 6 seasons. This guy was released by the Royals last year. Why the improvement? It’s all luck, isn’t it?

The short answer is – no, it’s not just luck. He does have really good stuff but that’s not new. What is new is his ability to throw strikes. His BB rate, as shown above, is becoming more and more respectable. Yesterday he threw 60 of his 93 pitches for strikes – 64.5 %. For the year, he’s thrown 175 of his 271 pitches for strikes – 64.5 %. This is a huge improvement for Wellemeyer. Last year as a Cardinal he threw 63 % of his pitches for strikes and overall, including his time w/ the Royals, he threw 62% of his pitches for strikes. His strike percentages from 2003-2006 were 59.2, 57.1, 59.5, and 58.7, respectively. I’m not sure why he’s become much more adept at throwing strikes but the improvement is undeniable, even for doubters like me, and it just might bode well for his ability to remain a solid member of our rotation.

Though he’s a two-pitch pitcher, his stuff is really good. His ability to miss bats may be the best in the rotation, Wainwright included. Last year, 14.1 % of Wellemeyer’s strikes and 8.8 % of the pitches he threw were swinging strikes. Wainwright’s percentages were 12.6 % and 7.8 %. In fact, no Cardinal starter other than Chris Carpenter in the last several years has had a higher percentage of swing-and-misses than Todd Wellemeyer. In fairness, Wellemeyer did have 21 relief appearances to 11 starts last year but he still had more IP as a starter than as a reliever. This guy has good stuff, misses bats, and, increasingly, is throwing strikes. That can’t be bad.

I’m not completely sold yet as we are just talking about 18 IP this year and the 6th inning implosion does cause us to wonder if he’s ever going to be able to put together more than 5 IP. Last year, only twice did he pitch as many as 6 IP and never got an out in the 7th as a starter. He did go 7 IP in his 2nd start this year but he gave up 2 big back-to-back jacks from Berkman and Lee in the 7th. Entering the 6th yesterday he had thrown 70 pitches – a pretty good number after 5 and then the wheels came off. He gave up homers to the pitcher and something called a Bowker, he walked Jose Castillo, gave up hits to Molina and Fred Lewis, and got a line-drive out from Randy Winn. His numbers so far this year after 76 pitches aren’t good – 5-12 w/ 2 BB’s and 3 HR’s. It’s a horrendously small sample size but fits what we’ve known about him – that, aside from his trouble throwing strikes in the past, he has trouble pitching past 5 innings. His career numbers are pretty good after 75 pitches but it’s hard to know what to make of that stat – any time he’s pitched over 75 pitches, he’s been pitching very well.

Let’s say that he has turned a corner w/ regard to his ability to throw strikes. The one issue w/ his being a starter, then, is his ability to pitch 6+ innings as 4-5 will carve the bullpen to pieces over a long season. Does he run into trouble b/c he runs out of gas or b/c hitters are seeing him for the 3rd time and they’re exposing his lack of a solid third pitch. It would seem to me (and I’m certainly no pitching expert) that the former is better than the latter. If it is a question of stamina, being out there and throwing pitches will help to build that stamina. If the problem is that hitters are getting a read on him after seeing him twice, that’s going to be a big problem if he can’t improve his changeup. Anyway, I’m starting to become a believer. Let’s hope he can keep it up.

There are a couple of other things I’d like to discuss and the first relates to much of yesterday’s discussion re: the Cardinal OF’s. I’m linking the baron’s Saturday post but it spilled over into the game threads. As I’ve said a few times in the last couple of times, I’m surprised w/ the frustration that many have shown with Chris Duncan. Some of us have argued for more Barton and some of us argue for more Skip. Some don’t like Skip much and some want to see more Ludwick. It occurred to me that the problem right now is two-fold: 1 – all of our OF’s are playing pretty well right now and we can only play 3 of the 5; 2 – all of them are inherently flawed in some way that lends them to criticism.

For example, Duncan has started to put together a pretty good career w/ a .356 OBP and a SLG of .520. His career OPS+ is 124 – about what Carlos Lee’s is. We also know, however, that his defense is horrible. He’s basically a 1B/DH playing LF. We also know that he can be vulnerable to left-handed pitchers.

Skip can play all 3 defensive positions and has begun this year w/ a .368 OBP out of the leadoff spot before failing to reach base in 3 PA’s yesterday. However, he has little power and little base-stealing ability. Therefore, offensively he’s very limited.

Ludwick has power and can play all 3 positions but will be 30 in July and, as a righty, has been unable to hit lefties throughout his career. Barton is young and has speed and some pop but Tony seems to believe his defense, like Duncan’s, limits him to LF. He’s never really been seen by scouts as anything more than a 4th OF. Even Ankiel is flawed. He has tremendous power and the athleticism to play CF but has very few major league PA’s on which to judge him. As hot as he’s begun the year, his OBP is still just .333 and he’ll be 29 the day after Ludwick turns 30.

It’s reasonable to want one to play at the expense of another as they all have distinct strengths and weaknesses and as long as they’re all playing well, Tony’s got a nice problem to have. It seems to me that Ankiel and Duncan have to play more than the others, as they provide more to the offense than the others seem to be capable of. That’s not a knock on the others but those two simply have more power than the others and Duncan supplements his w/ a solid OBP. Still, Ludwick had a 178 OPS+ before yesterday’s game when he went 1 for 2 w/ a big homer. Until someone plays his way OUT of the lineup, it’s going to be difficult for Tony to decide and, it seems to me, difficult to criticize the decision.

I’d like to see more of Barton, also, but w/ the way the others are hitting, it’s reasonable to play Ludwick, Skip, or Duncan against a right-handed pitcher. It’s not necessarily a lack of faith in the young guy or a belief that he can’t hit righties. He’s trying to put together the best lineup he can and right now he’s got 5 choices for 3 positions. I guess he could sit Albert, put Duncan at 1B and start 3 others in the OF. That’d allow him to play 4 OF’s but I’d rather Albert be in the lineup.

I do have to say that after vociferously defending Duncan, I feel somewhat vindicated by his game yesterday – 3 for 5 w/ a BB, a 2B, and a HR. Even when he’s not hitting for power, he does know the strike zone and get on base via walks and we know the power will be there. It hasn’t disappeared and it won’t be that long before he’s able to make something happen w/ his bat. Maybe yesterday jump-started his season.

The last thing I’m going to discuss is in regards to Aaron Miles’ 10th inning bunt yesterday. It appeared as though it was going to be for naught when Izturis struck out, bringing Duncan to the plate w/ 2 outs after Ludwick was intentionally walked. Duncan was able to get the game-winning hit. After the K, I ranted "I hate sac bunts. I hate sac bunts. I hate sac bunts." After settling down w/ a couple of pops and a 10th inning victory, I would like to clarify one thing – "I hate sac bunts!!!!!!!!!!!" My rantings notwithstanding, Tony’s decision in the 10th was, apparently, the correct one.

According to Tom Tango’s The Book, bunting w/ runners on 1st and 2nd and nobody out reduces the run expectancy from 1.573 runs to 1.467 runs. In other words, teams who bunt in those situations cost themselves about 1/10th of a run by doing so. However, in the top of the 10th in a tie game, that bunt increases the team’s win expectancy from 69.8% to 71.3% -- not a huge increase, I’ll grant you, but it does increase the likelihood of winning. The numbers from fangraphs show the same thing -- that the Giants’ likelihood of winning went from 30.2% to 28.4% with the bunt (meaning that the Cards’ chances went from 69.8% to 71.6%). So, Tony’s move was the correct one. Sorry, Tony.

That said, and I couldn’t watch the game as I was treated to Fox’s endless rain delay bullshit around this time, I assume in this situation that the Giants, expecting the bunt, were charging with their 1st and 3rd basemen while their SS went to cover 3B and their 2B went to cover 1B. This would have left the entire middle of the field undefended and made a double-play nearly impossible. If Miles had pulled the ‘ol butcher-boy play – faking the bunt and swinging away, as long as he kept it on the ground he would’ve stayed out of the DP and had a great chance of reaching base himself. This would have, of course, created a bases-loaded, no out situation for Izturis. That would’ve increased our likelihood of winning to 83.2%. Is it a gamble? Maybe but w/ the 1st and 3rd basemen charging, a bad bunt gets the lead runner and possibly a double play. The butcher-boy play may have been less of a gamble, with a higher payoff, than the bunt. Because the bunt worked, however, (by getting the runners over) Tony’s move was the right one and my rants should have been directed towards Izturis’ strikeout and not the sac bunt.

It’ll be another tough one today. Pineiro throws his first game of the season against Lincecum. I’d expect to see Barton, Ankiel and either Skip or Ludwick. Someone will probably curse LaRussa – "bleeping, bleeping Tony, aren’t you ever going to give Duncan a chance to hit lefties?!!!!!! He hit a homer and had the game-winning hit yesterday!!!!!!" They’ll be right, of course. I guess it’s too bad none of them can play 2B and SS.

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I don't really understand this...

You say " The one issue w/ his being a starter, then, is his ability to pitch 6+ innings as 4-5 will carve the bullpen to pieces over a long season. "

We have a couple guys (Thompson, Wellemeyer) that appear to be amazing stuff for 5 innings. First I find it hard to believe that 1-2 extra innings every 5th day really hurts the bullpen that much.

It seems to me that with the combination fo Well/Reyes/Thompson, that you easily have the relief pitching to handle every 5th start.

by redbird2006 on Apr 13, 2008 2:58 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Traditionally,

the 5th starter is a guy that you are hoping to get 5 innings from. If you are getting 6-7 innings from your other pitchers, with the occasional 8 from Wainwright, then there is no wear on the bullpen. The issue comes when you are asking 3-4 innings out of the bullpen every night. You have to have a strong 1-3 spots in the rotation to handle the average/below average 4-5 spots.

by etp_stl on Apr 13, 2008 10:17 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

It is true

that Thompson and welle can give you 4 or 5 innings, but you can't dedicate 2 or even 1 pitcher in the bullpen for use every 4 or 5 days. circumstances in the other games won't permit it...not for any period of time

by ridgesee on Apr 13, 2008 11:55 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wellemeyer is tied for the lead in Ks

Thats a great start. There is a long history of pitchers improving their control as they age. Good examples being Ryan and Koufax. Now Wellemeyer won't be anywhere near that good but its not impossible that he has taken a step forward in his control. If he has, we should leave him in the rotation.

If he can maintan close to this level of performance for 6ip on average then it would be worth carrying an extra reliver to pitch that one inning that we lose vs a normal starter.

Again I prefer 5-6 good innings to 6-7 ok ones.

If looper and Wellemeyer can give you 5-6 good innings and you pull them early we have reyes/thompson to cover 2-3 more innings in those games. The fact we have well above average long relief is something we can leverage by trading off innings from our starters in exchange for more effectiveness.

by DriverZn on Apr 13, 2008 5:35 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

If Shumaker

had held on to the ball that popped out of his glove, Wellemeyer would have allowed 1 earned run instead of 5. I know Shumaker came a long way to get to it but he was playing the hitter way over toward center. It was first ruled an error then i inning later changed to a hit.

The Cards as do most teams, play the right fielder far off the right field line toward center to protect against a ball from going for a tripple in the long jut in the wall in right center. It cost the Cards twice in the game. The one Shumaker dropped against Wellemeyer and the hit against Reyes in the 10th that Ludwick couldn't get to. Both balls would be normally caught. Also Izzy should have gotten out of it in the nineth. The ball hit to Pujols was not hit that hard. For some unknown reason Albert just ran over, made a feeble stab at it and watched it go by. Pujols makes that play 9 out of 10 times.

by ridgesee on Apr 13, 2008 12:20 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

probabilty

Pujols probably makes that play 99 out of 100 times.

by indakind on Apr 13, 2008 12:21 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

+1 ...

Tony really needs to warm up to the strategy of using a tandem of two starting pitchers whenever Wellemeyer and Looper pitch ... he's got Thompson and Reyes in the pen ... I think you should only ask Well and Loop to go 5 innings; 6 if they're on ... then bring in a fresh Thompson/Reyes to go 2 or 3 innings to finish the 'start' ... this worked beautifully on Aug. 8 against Houston, and I think it is a model to go with until the other starters get back and established... it limits Well/Loop to about 75/80 pitches per game (where they are most effective), and still gives them their chance for the Win and/or quality start ... When Mulder comes back in May, and Wellemeyer goes back to the pen, he becomes another long reliever that can spell Mulder after 5 ...

We have 7-8 starters on this team; use them in tandem to protect the back of the pen ...

Culture of Winning: 10 World Championships, 17 Pennants, 6 Division Championships ...

by Cardinals4Ever on Apr 13, 2008 12:54 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   1 recs

Third time is no charm for Wellemeyer

I was at yesterday's game, one of the most memorable I've ever seen and as good as spectacular as it gets weather-wise and scenery-wise from the upper deck of AT&T Park looking out over the field with kayakers bobbing in McCovey Cove, to the right, ready to catch home run balls that splashed into the Bay and with the stunningly beautiful Bay beyond the bleachers, scattered with white sails and with an occasional big cargo ship passing under the Bay Bridge.

It was very gratifying to watch Wellemeyer look absolutely masterful in the first five innings, while Cain was literally unhittable (he seems destined to be a perennial Cy Young candidate eventually). Wellemeyer did not look suddenly tired during the sixth, not at all. It appeared instead that the hitters just adjusted, after they had seen him their first couple of AB's. I agree with you, houstoncardinal, that he needs to improve his changeup or find another third pitch.

Seeing yesterday's game was very much like seeing a doubleheader, with two strikingly different contests. The scoreless pitching duel the first five innings was extremely impressive on both sides. When Cain hit his HR in the sixth to put the Giants up 1-0, all of my foursome thought we might be witnessing a historic game.

But then game two of the doubleheader began. We all know what a slugfest that was. When four more runs came across for the Giants in the same inning, It was, of course, a bitter pill to swallow. All four of us felt that the Cards were doomed, and the sense of consolation we had at grudgingly admiring a fine Giants pitcher taking matters into his own hands and creating his own one-run lead was replaced by the dismal thought that Wellemeyer, despite the recent improvement in his control, was just not up to the job of starting. We had a sense of foreboding that Todd might cost the Cards a few more games before Mulder replaces him. That thought still persists even now, but in the top of the seventh inning yesterday, our dismal outlook for Wellemeyer was temporarily displaced by the exhilaration of seeing the Cards make a jolting comeback against the Giants bullpen. What a rush!

The game overall was a wild roller coaster, an extremely entertaining one in the end, that I'd ride again any day. Why not today? I am going to today's game, too, and I'm eager to see how Pineiro does. Once again, I expect the Cardinals hitters will have an extremely difficult challenge, this time against Lincecum. But unless he pitches a complete game, the Cardinals will again have a go eventually at the Giants bullpen, which is not only very weak, inherently, but also very tired today, after getting knocked around the last two games. With the clout provided by Ankiel, Duncan, Ludwick (and maybe Glaus) and with Pujols evidently saving his ammo on the bench until the late innings when the Giants bullpen takes over, I would not be at all surprised to see another "doubleheader" today. We can hope Pineiro keeps the Cards close until Lincecum leaves the game. If so, stay glued to your TV's in the late innings....

by CardsWin on Apr 13, 2008 5:59 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Um, Houston?

I'm a little confused. You say there will be cursing of Tony at the end, i.e. "when will you let Duncan hit against lefties, etc."

Lincecum is right handed. Am I misreading that bit of your post?

Que sera.

by the red baron on Apr 13, 2008 6:09 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Maybe

you were confusing him with the lefty Sanchez? He's also small and strikes out a ton of batters.

Que sera.

by the red baron on Apr 13, 2008 9:18 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wellemeyer

During yesterday's game, I made the statement that if Wellemeyer continues to pitch well, I'll apologise to him for all the negative things I've said about him the same way as I did Tony. I am a man of my word, so here goes.

Wellemeyer did pitch wonderfully yesterday, although I get the same feeling you do, Houston, that hitters are adjusting to him that third time through, because he really doesn't have any other way to attack them. I am, for the moment at least, withdrawing my objections to Mr. Wellemeyer being in the rotation, and I base it on two things.

One: he is pitching very, very well, and, to be honest, even if he does struggle the third time through a lineup, he's still giving the team five or even six very effective innings most times before it really starts to catch up to him.

And, more importantly, two: A while back, someone posted, (and I don't recall who, speak up and I'll thank you, but I'm much too lazy to go back and look it up) a history of Todd Wellemeyer's career usage in the minor leagues. Up until he broke into the bigs with the Cubs, Wellemeyer had been a starter almost exclusively. He made, I believe, something like 100 appearances in the minors, with 97 of them coming out of the rotation. His numbers in the minors as a starting pitcher were extremely good, albeit with the same control problems we've come to expect from him.

When he got to the major leagues, the Cubs had no real opening in the rotation for him, and stuck him in the pen as a power arm. They fell in love with the stuff he showed in short stints, and declared him their closer of the future. It wasn't until the Cards picked him up last year that he finally got a chance to start again, fulfilling the role he had been working toward his entire career, essentially.

I admit, I didn't know all that. I wasn't familiar with Wellemeyer's path to the bigs; I only became aware of him whenever we started seeing him pitching in relief for the Cubs.

What I mean by all of that is this: when Wellemeyer came to the bigs, it was as a still developing starting pitcher with ridiculous stuff that put him on the fast track through the minors. He was placed into a role he wasn't comfortable with, and it may, just may, have impeded him from developing that last facet of his game, i.e. the harnessing of his repertoire, as well as adding that changeup. He continued to find relief work, because teams saw him in that role and knew what they were getting; all the while, he continued to stall a bit in his development. When he came to St. Louis, he was moved back into the starting rotation, and maybe, again, just maybe, he's starting to finally put it all together. We know that many power pitchers take off a little later in their 20s, when they finally learn some lessons about how to tame and control the stuff they have; perhaps Wellemeyer, with regular side work and a schedule, neither of which you have in a big league bullpen, is finally developing into the pitcher he could have been all along.

I'm not completely sold on Wellemeyer just yet; like most others, I want to see if he really can keep his walk rate under control for the better part of a season before I start anointing him as any sort of saviour, but I do find it interesting that the way he was handled when he came to the bigs may very well have stunted his growth a bit.

And for the record, he doesn't have any kind of consistency with it yet, but every once in a while, he can break off a wicked changeup. If he could learn to throw it the same way every time, National League hitters may want to start carrying talismans of some sort with them to the plate.

Que sera.

by the red baron on Apr 13, 2008 6:28 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Run Support

Hopefully we can start giving him some run support so he can have safer opportunities to use it. I, for one would love to see him use it more. That being said, I'd much rather see him do it with a 4 run lead in case he leaves it up and over. A situation our bats aren't giving him this year thus far.

by AdjustedExpectations on Apr 13, 2008 8:01 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Isn't it ironic.

All of the discussion at the beginning of the year was that he only survived last year as a starter because of the incredible run support he was afforded. He was simply lucky last year to Reyes' unlucky run support.

I'm not calling anyone out, because I wasn't convinced he could turn around his control, either. Both Houston and Baron make good points about the hitters making adjustments to him. He threw many more pitches last year to get through 5, but that was still about his topping out point. I haven't done the research, but I believe his pitch counts were high due number of pitches per batter, not number of batters faced. That would seem to indicate that he can fool guys twice through the lineup, but that third time seems to be too much. It also seems to be this year that it is the third time through the heart of the order that is getting him. That would seem to back up this point, as those are the hitters most capable of making the adjustment.

It will be interesting to see if he can develop a way to get through the third time before the other starters start coming back. If he can't, he should be an excellent long reliever; and a pretty decent insurance policy against further injury or trades.

by etp_stl on Apr 13, 2008 10:31 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

He's a completely different pitcher this year, though

There's just no comparison to his command of the strike zone this year from his spottiness lat year. Especially with that slider.

"You say the world has lost it's love. I say embrace what it's made of" - Dar Williams

by Valatan on Apr 13, 2008 1:56 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

You are probably right...

however it may all be for naught. What happens when Mulder comes back. Doesn't matter if you think Mulder will come back and be productive, he will at least be given the chance. In my mind that means either Welly or Loop (possibly Pineiro) are back off to the bullpen. I believe it will be Welly (although I hope I'm wrong, I just don't like Looper in the Starting rotation, however if he keep producing results, I can't fault the Cards for the decision)

by AirForceCardsFan on Apr 13, 2008 10:06 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wellemeyer

at this point looks almost the same as Schilling did at the same point in his ML career. Only dfference, Schilling got his chance at a little earlier age. True he is basicly a 2 pitch pitcher, but why develop a 3rd until you can master controlling the 1st 2. Especially if the first 2 are a good live fastball ans slider. Thats all Schilling had and he developed a good off speed curve to lend asset to his 2 bread and butter pitches, the fastball and slider. Hopefully Wellemyer can do the same.

by ridgesee on Apr 13, 2008 12:40 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I'm not sure I'm completely sold on Wellemeyer.....

Sometimes he looks so dominant; other times he almost looks like he doesn't know what he's doing.

I love the K's.....the homerun rate is horrendous. He's yielded 5 in 18 innings. Is he a three true outcomes pitcher?

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Apr 13, 2008 7:14 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Not sold on whatsisname either...yet.

Your first line also describes Reyes to a "T", only with Reyes it was one line drive aftter another with the bases packed with runners, until moving to the pen as we know. Maybe Wellemeyer and Reyes will both put that behind them to the extent that it wont require repetitive discussions after every outing they have. Would'nt that be grand!

If they both do well, the team does well, my main and greatest concern. Go C-Dunc!

"Anthony, you have everybody all stirred up again, I want you to cut that out....right now!" Anthony Reye's Mom

by cardschinmusic on Apr 13, 2008 8:58 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

That's the beauty of Thompson

Going into the 'pen along side Reyes.

I mean, last year we were in a position where we're scraping for pitchers last year, and this year? We don't *have* to have effective innings every time out just to have a chance. That's not to say we don't want effective innings, but we have Reyes and Thompson who can both do short or long reliefs. And with the way we're going, that's a damn solid looking 2-3 innings.

As far as Wellemeyer goes. What does his speed and movement look like in the later innings? His later inning collapses could be various things. Molina could still be having issues on his pitch selection. Wellemeyer could be physically, or even mentally out of condition to go into 90 pitches as of now. It's reasonable considering he's been bullpen since being in the majors. Or Tony could be having issues sensing when to take him out. He looked excellent up till that last inning. Tony gave him a chance to escape trouble yesterday, now Wellemeyer can't go against him if he chooses next time to pull at first sense of trouble.

Hopefully (fingers crossed) we can start putting more runs on the board so that we can risk him getting into trouble more and more until his confidence, control, conditioning gets where it needs to be. It's got to be exhausting to be pitching a shut out/1-2 run game, and having to be damn near perfect.

So far the proof is in the pudding.
April 2nd he never had a lead larger than 1, left the game 2-1
The 8th against Houston we didn't score till the 9th. He carried a shut out all the way into the 7th with zero run support.
Same thing yesterday into the 6th

We can't expect Wellemeyer to dominate entire games without run support. He's never going to be a pitcher that thrives in that type of pressure, and frankly 8 runs in 18 innings over 3 games in situations like that is fine with me. Even three games in I wouldn't have thought a 4 era was possible.

The only thing scary about him is that we've faced some of the weaker bats in the league thus far. How he does against the Brewers will give me a better sense of what he can do, since it appears he'll get one, if not two games against them this month, and a possible Reds game to boot.

by AdjustedExpectations on Apr 13, 2008 7:29 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

LaRue was catching Wellemeyer yesterday. don't know much about the guy... seems like a pretty average backup. any thoughts?

Ankiel is Jesus!

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Apr 13, 2008 2:42 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I wont yell if Duncan is sitting today

I'll be yelling if Ludwick is sitting! The guy is hitting the ball great and plays far superior defense then Duncan. Ludwick really had the BIG hit yesterday not Duncan....if Izzy does his job everyone is talking about the clutch 2-R game winning bomb he hit in the 9th.

Ludwick's hit great for a year and 2 weeks for us and plays a solid OF...what else does he need to do to become a starter full time???

by gossard56 on Apr 13, 2008 8:17 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

Guessing we'll see Dunc and Ludwick

Over at the Post they indicated that it might be a different lineup. I'm guessing Pujols is out with Dunc and first. Might be time for Barton to get his first start????

by birdo rojo on Apr 13, 2008 9:49 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wouldn't be Barton's first

by a long shot. He's already started several games. Uncle Rico is the one who hasn't had a start yet. He could conceivably fill for El Hombre at first, although Dunc is more likely.

by StanTheManFan on Apr 13, 2008 10:33 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Thanks for the clarification

Yeah was meaning against a righty - his 3 starts to date are against Zito, the immortal Matt Chico and Odalis Perez - all lefties

by birdo rojo on Apr 13, 2008 10:59 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Stupid Isringhausen

All he had to do was force a 2 out ground ball to a gold glove first basema and we would have won that one in regulation.

Formerly Big Red (victim of the SBNation upgrade)

by Tackle Box on Apr 13, 2008 10:03 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Izzy gives me heartattacks

I have never been a big fan of Izzy because no save is ever easy with Izzy. I prefer a 1-2-3 ninth over drama every single outing. I know his WHIP is not that horrible except for his 1.457 in the hip problem season of 2006. But the dominant closers in the league have WHIPs ~.70-0.80 (Putz 0.7, Papelbon 0.771, Saito 0.715), and some good closers have similar WHIPs to Izzy (e.g. K-rod, Rivera, Street) but they are AL. As others have pointed out, the number of saves is not a great stat, and in that department Izzy has done quite well in his 6 years, going on 7, in STL.

I don't want to sound ungrateful for what Izzy has done for us for six years, but I am hoping that Izzy could be traded this season if he is willing. Chances are that it won't be done because TLR loves Izzy and hopefully we'll be in contention and it will be no time to mess with closers.

born Dodger blue, now dyed Cardinals red

by totalloser on Apr 13, 2008 10:33 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Izzy is more dominant than 95% of the closers in MLB

and if we trade him, things will only get worse, because we certainly won't be landing one of that last 5%. Chris Perez is good, but he has awful control right now and still tends to give up hits. I have to completely disagree with you here.

...just a bit outside....

by Ankiels Missing Curveball on Apr 13, 2008 11:34 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

But he's been so solid for so long

yes, he's not Joe Nathan or Mariano Rivera, but he's been better than anyone not in that absolute top tier of closers. And he's had an absurd longevity at it. He's the longest tenured player on the team, after all.

"You say the world has lost it's love. I say embrace what it's made of" - Dar Williams

by Valatan on Apr 13, 2008 2:01 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Good post, Houston.

I too had trouble believing in Wellemeyer, and hope his new found control continues. Since you needed CIA clearance to see yesterday's game, what happened in the inning he gave up the runs? At first I read Schumaker dropped a two out flyball and the 3 run homer followed, but in two boxscores this morning the Cards have no errors and all the runs were earned. Was the official scoring changed?
As far as the outfield is concerned I'm still hoping the regulars at the end of the season and going into next year are Barton, Rasmus, and Ankiel, left to right. Schumaker and Ludwick as reserves and Duncan traded for middle infield help. Duncan's offense is a major plus, but you can't hide him on the field.

by vinniefromjersey on Apr 13, 2008 8:27 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

The official scoring was changed

Schu had a tough play to make and didn't quite make it (catch on the run, ball popped out of his glove). It was scored an error at the time, changed later.

Back on topic, I would be nervous about reading too much into Welle's success so far. Remember that he has been succeeding against baaaad offensive teams, by and large. Even your fifth starter is supposed to succeed against those guys. More challenging tests are coming soon enough.

by StanTheManFan on Apr 13, 2008 10:32 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Oh, stop. EVERYTHING has been accomplished with us facing bad offensive teams.

And we have only faced a few really good pitchers too. Wandy in Houston had his breakout just last year, and we couldn't hit him. Matt Cain has been good since he came out of the womb, and we could barely get a hit off of him. And Kip Wells......you just KNEW he would throw a gem against us. Jeff Francis is not good this year so far, not good at all.

But I'll take it. You are supposed to win these kind of games, and I give the Cards credit because some of these games were a real battle. I'll just happily let the season unfold.

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Apr 13, 2008 10:42 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Here's the thing with bad teams in major league baseball

They typically win about 35% -40% of their games so it's impossible to think that since a team is in last place or is really bad, your team should just mow 'em down.

Formerly Big Red (victim of the SBNation upgrade)

by Tackle Box on Apr 13, 2008 11:04 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

That's true. And losing records can be misleading too.

The Nationals have been beat thouroghly while the Pirates have fought and fought hard through their loses. I guess what it says is that winning and losing is not as easy as it looks....or something.

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Apr 13, 2008 11:07 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Wins against bad teams count

just as much in the standings as wins against good teams, for sure. However, drawing conclusions based on those wins is a risky business. I'm not ready to join the chorus of praise for Welle until he turns in a comparable performance against a better team. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate the Ws.

by StanTheManFan on Apr 13, 2008 12:06 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Thats right

Jillsinmo, you keep everybody in line...they don't pay me no attention.

by ridgesee on Apr 13, 2008 12:48 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Ha...that only works if I keep ME in line......

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Apr 13, 2008 1:25 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

So true...

You're obviously the only person you listen to...so that is 100% TRUE! The impact you have on this blog is amazing....Mr this and Mr that! All without concealing your contempt, it has to be theraputic for you.

"Anthony, you have everybody all stirred up again, I want you to cut that out....right now!" Anthony Reye's Mom

by cardschinmusic on Apr 14, 2008 6:10 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Contempt? Oh, dear. I'm really trying to be funny or ironic, maybe sometimes sarcastic.

Don't mean to come across that way.

I do listen to my husband, my school principal, and my brother, my children.

There are certain things I believe, certain things I don't. Yes, I'm not easily swayed. But I read what you all write.......I guess you could call that listening, couldn't you?

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Apr 14, 2008 6:25 AM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I know you have good heart!

Its apparent in most all you say, had to jab you some with your "self control " comment.....AND, you have had a major impact on "you know who" overall stature at VEB....and if he can keep it going we may win a bunch of games as a reward and he can build on that, earning respect from his peers will win over the rest.

by cardschinmusic on Apr 14, 2008 2:54 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I just watched the highlights from wellemeyer's performance yesterday and is stuff looked great, lots of movement, control, mixing it up around the batter's box. I think this guy just might stay in the top 5.

Ankiel is Jesus!

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Apr 13, 2008 2:58 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

Oh, some observations from this week

Cardinals have a lot of fight in them, a lot of fight

What is wrong with Sabathia, Willis,Oswalt, Lilly? They look like they forgot how to pitch.....

The Florida Marlins can hit--is it possible they have fleeced the Tigers?

Arizona's youngsters on the job training last year has paid big dividends this year.

The Minnesota pitching staff doesn't even miss Johan. (At least not yet.)

The Oakland A's are rolling along. Mr. Beane still knows things the rest of us don't.

The White Sox are a fun team to watch. Mr. Guillen might be crazy, but I think Kenny Williams also knows some things other GM's don't. Acquiring Nick Swisher was genius.

Mr. durability, Jimmy Rollins, injured? Yikes!

Baltimore? Kansas City? Who thought they'd get off to a good start......

I'm still predicting the Reds as the dark horse to be on top of the division. Aaron Harang=Cy Young and Dan Haren in the top 3 for consideration.....He'll have a monster year with the Diamondbacks.....sigh.

I do love how everything is possible in April........

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Apr 13, 2008 9:03 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

2 things

Willis has been bad for awhile now.

Lilly had his career year last year.

by indakind on Apr 13, 2008 12:16 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

The Florida Marlins can hit--is it possible they have fleeced the Tigers?

It just tickles my ass when owners and GMs get their balls handed to them after going after high priced free agents and trading good prospects for billionaire major league stars. After all if you sign a 26 year old man who has never had to work a day in his life (and I don't consider playing a game working) to a 180 million contract. With security like that, what incentitives will he have... unless he's exceptional, nothing...but the powers of baseball never learn.

by ridgesee on Apr 13, 2008 1:16 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

I thought getting rid of Haren was one of the worst moves in recent years. and that was when it was happening, had no idea he'd be this good

Ankiel is Jesus!

by Cards Fan in Chitown on Apr 13, 2008 3:00 PM EDT to parent up reply reply   0 recs

houstoncardinal

I said it last year, Welle has the best stuff on the team quite possibly.

I agree with Reyes and Thompson you have guys who can pitch long relief very well anytime Welle starts. I think Reyes is better in the pen with his new role and Welle is better starting in his new role. Why not combine Welle and Reyes and let them both thrive. It's like Reyes gets better when he does not have to worry about pitching deep into games and he can just throw the ball hard and strike guys out. Welle seems better starting and once again I believe he has better stuff than Wainer when it comes to simply missing bats, but he obviously is not nearly as good of a PITCHER.

He Tony seems to be a master of rogerwholestaff so let him do his work.

Great rundown of the OF situation I could not agree more. We are in a good spot because just due to history some guys will probably cool down and regress. I like having the extra guys and Dunc can spell Albert off and on as well.

by ICbirdfan on Apr 13, 2008 9:29 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

You have to have faith

that TLR knows what he is doing. Right now we have 5 outfielders playing well with only 3 spots each game. Soon we will have 7 starting pitchers and only 5 slots. What is TLR going to do? 6 man starting pitching staff? Matching up starters with teams like he does outfielders against opposing pitchers. Who Knows? I'm sure he doesn't know yet, but I'm sure it will be entertaining.

And you can also be sure that the VEB community will be ranting and wishing eternal damnation on Duncan and LaRusa no matter what he decides.

Me, I think this is fun, and I intend to enjoy the ride this summer no matter how it turns out.

by O'Fallon Park on Apr 13, 2008 9:52 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

i'm going to go one step further here, houston,

and say that when we compliment Wellemeyer, we HAVE to compliment Dave and Tony. Some of being a good manager is picking the right tactical move at the right circumstance (see the sac bunt discussion above). What Tony and Dave do better than ANYBODY, as far as I'm concerned is a) spot raw or unheralded talent and b) develop it.

Todd Wellemeyer is a shining example of this. Released by the Royals - the ROYALS! - after being a mop-up reliever, Tony and Dave spotted a real talent that needed some polish, worked with him, and over the course of a season made him into a real pitcher with good control.

The other examples are pretty famous -- Carpenter (whose issues were injuries, not ineffectiveness), Wainwright. Jeff Weaver needs no discussion. Suppan went from a passable #5 guy to more of a #3 guy (not just b/c of necessity, but b/c he got better). Of course, not every dumpster dive works out (Mike Maroth?). And the jury is still out on the only real possible counterexample - Reyes - of someone who some would argue was overtinkered with. If Reyes gets traded to another team and starts 25 games and ends with an ERA under 4.00, I will have to eat my words a bit.

Obviously, Wellemeyer came with some natural skill and did the work himself, but we shouldn't overlook the coaches' role here.

by tom s. on Apr 13, 2008 10:10 AM EDT reply reply   0 recs

listing to the giants radio broadcast as I drove

They made the comment that wellemeyer was a different pitcher when he in a stretch.
He seems to have more control they thought when he was winding up.
Interesting, I thought because it explains his rate of failure as a reliever and his success as a starter.

by leftcoastfan on Apr 13, 2008 10:12 AM EDT reply reply