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The Weight

[I picked up my bag, I went looking for a place to hide; When I saw Carmen and the Devil walking side by side...]

Last year, by Albert's standards, was a down year for the Cards' perennial MVP candidate. It's true that his numbers were better than just about everyone else's on the planet but they didn't quite meet to his standards. Consider the following:

  • Albert's OPS of .997 was the 2nd lowest of his career and his lowest since 2002
  • his .336 EQA was his lowest since 2002, 3rd lowest of his career
  • his VORP of 72.1 was the 2nd lowest of his career and his lowest since 2002
  • his isolated power of .241 was the lowest of his career
  • his RC/27 was the 2nd lowest of his career
  • his 27 GIDP was the highest of his career
  • his PA's were the 2nd lowest of his career
  • he hit the fewest homers, had the fewest RBI and runs scored of his career

We also know that, despite the fact that he did play in 158 games, he played much of the season injured. Additionally, many of us noticed and commented throughout the year that Albert just didn't seem the same at the plate. He seemed at times, contradictorily, overly patient and impatient. He had the most walks of his career yet seemed often to be pulling off the ball, trying to do too much or hit it too hard and hitting weak choppers or grounders to third. That stuff is simply anecdotal yet we cannot ignore the correlation between what we observed over the course of the year and the bulleted list above. There's no way that we were simply imagining his impatience or overstating its significance given the numbers above.

I must admit wondering whether we've seen the last of Albert as we've known him. Don't get me wrong - he's still one of the best hitters in the game but it's crossed my mind that we may not see him return to the level he exhibited from 2003-2006. Those 4 years in particular are almost unmatched in baseball history. It's still stunning to me that he has just 1 MVP trophy.

On the other hand, he is just 28 years old. He's still a little young to be past his prime and, even if he is, he's still a great hitter. And last year, one in which he was injured and got next to no help in the Cardinals lineup, there was still a pretty good case to be made that he was deserving of the NL MVP.

Every projection available has Albert improving on last year's performance in 2008. Hopefully, they're right. It may, of course, depend on his health but it's important to understand the context of last year's performance when projecting 08's.

Last year he got nearly no help in the Cards' lineup. Many of us believed him to be pressing --- trying to do too much. Perhaps some of that was caused by Carpenter's injury and the pressure of trying to repeat as World Champions but the fact that the rest of the lineup went to hell last year (Do not pass GO; Do not collect $200!) didn't help either. The table below reflects the performance of the 2 hitters immediately in front of him in the lineup and that of the 2 hitters immediately following him. The first OPS is that of that spot in the lineup and the next column is the rank in the NL. "Most PA's" is the Cardinal who got the most PA's in that spot in the lineup and his OPS IN THAT LINEUP SPOT. (Warning - be prepared to make a quick run to the bathroom!)

Lineup Pos OPS NL Rank Most PA's OPS
1 .669 15 Eckstein .745
2 .870 1 Duncan .804
4 .706 16 Edmonds .686
5 .674 16 Rolen .760

The 2 hole in the lineup was outstanding. Duncan got the most PA's there but Ankiel and even Taguchi were sensational out of the 2 hole. Aside from that, however, the numbers are downright odious! Those aren't misprints -- dead last in the NL out of BOTH the #4 spot and the #5 spot in the order and 2nd to last out of the leadoff spot. A .706 OPS out of your cleanup hitter and an Eckstein-like .674 out of the 5 spot?! No wonder Albert was pressing! If he doesn't get any more help that that, it's going to be another (relatively) rough year for Big Al.

Most of us aren't exactly expecting big things from the team this year. Nonetheless, it's a very important year in several regards. This team has to show some fundamental improvement from some of its players if the team is to compete in 2009, 2010 and beyond. Rasmus will be a rookie in '08, whether he begins the year w/ the team or not but he will be one of the main cogs in the lineup in years to come. Who'll be there along with Pujols and Rasmus?

Albert's contract calls him to be with the team, at a bargain basement (for his production) price of $16 million through 2010. The club also holds a $16 million option on the 2011 season. However, Albert turned 28 about 6 weeks ago. By the time Albert enters free agency, he'll be approaching 32. One would expect that, though he'll still be an outstanding player at 32, he probably will have passed his prime.

If the Cardinals are going to be competing for division titles in 2009, 2010 and 2011, Albert's going to have to get some help from the lineup. If anyone is counting on Rasmus to do it all himself, they need to be seen by a team of psychiatrists. There's no bigger Colby Rasmus fan than me but he will only be able to hit once out of every 9 PA's. The team is going to need more.

This is so important b/c Albert will never re-sign with the Cardinals once his contract expires if the team has been unable to be competitive in the next few years. Therefore, his greatest trade value will likely be with a couple years left under the team's control - after the 2009 season. The Cards really have 2-3 years, at most, to build a solid team around Pujols. It's reasonable to question whether we'd want to re-sign Pujols in 2011 - when he's 32 and likely to get some sort of 7-8 year, $200 - 250 M contract but we'd like to have that option rather than have Albert demand a trade 2 years earlier b/c the team wins 75 games per year.

One thing to follow this year is the development of David Freese and Allen Craig in the minors. If one or both of them can develop into the kind of hitter who can be an average to slightly above-average 3B, that could provide a lot of help, both offensively and payroll-wise to the club. Getting some solid production out of a 3B earning the minimum will allow Mozeliak to build the lineup w/ another star or two through trade or free agency to help out Pujols and Rasmus.

Most importantly, however, this is a very big year for 3 of the Cardinals' outfielders. Chris Duncan has to prove that he can be effective for a full year. He's shown flashes of becoming a great offensive player. He walks a lot and has power to spare but has just over 650 AB's the last 2 years combined. Can he put together a solid offensive season with 550+ AB's? If he's going to develop into an everyday player, he needs to do it.

Rick Ankiel emerged with an explosion last year and no one was more captivated than I. Still, he's older than Pujols; he'll turn 29 in July and already has more than 4 years of service time in the big leagues. That's right - though he has just 172 career AB's as an OF, he'll be a free agent after the 2009 season. It may be unfair to expect him, considering his relative inexperience as a position player, to solidify his status as a major leaguer but that's the situation he's in. It's a big season for him to prove that he can do what he did last year more consistently. If he can put up 500+ PA's of solid baseball, we may have a commodity with which to work. But the team can't wait forever for him.

Finally, Ryan Ludwick turns 30 this July. He, too, has shown flashes of being a solid major league contributor. Like Ankiel, though, he's not getting any younger. Do we need him to become an All-Star? Certainly not, but if he can get 400+ PA's and give the team some power and solid defense from the right-hand batter's box, it will go a long way toward making the team competitive in the next 2-3 years.

It's important to understand that I'm not saying that these 3 will be the cornerstones of the offense beyond 2010. But, the team's performance over the next 3 years will be, to some degree, dependent on their performance over those 3 years. If they perform well, Albert will also and, more importantly, so will the team. In order for the team to be in the position of being able to consider whether or not to re-sign Pujols after 2011, they're going to have to perform well in the next couple of years. Adam Kennedy's not going to be a difference maker. Neither are Cesar Izturis or Skip Schumaker. Moreover, we don't even need ALL of the 3 players I mentioned to become solid everyday contributors. But if two of them can, it gives the team options for the 2009 and 2010 seasons and gives Pujols a reason to consider staying.

If he demands a trade before the 2010 season b/c the team has been horrible in 2008 and 2009, the team will have to seriously consider granting it in order to get maximum value in return. Right now, the Cards can't get from another team what Pujols is worth but that may not be true in 2 years and this may be an option the team has to consider if the next 2 years are as bad as they might be.

[Take a load off Fannie. Take a load for free. Take a load off Fannie, and (and) (and) you put the load right on me.]

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The Band
The easiest way to solve the Pujols FA problem is simple: Sign him to an extension after 2009.  Buyout his final 2 years of the current contract and add 4 or 5 more to the end of it.  Even at the initial $200m/7 years you proposed, it'd be actually be 5 years/$170m.

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 2, 2008 1:47 AM EST reply actions  

how huge
would troy glaus' .839 OPS last year look in that 4 spot?  Or even Chris Duncan's numbers, prior to aggravating the hernia.

I'll still disappointed we didn't sign mench, but the more I think about it, the more excited I get about the idea of a duncan/gonzalez platoon in LF.  Giving Gonzo ~300 PA's (since he'll PH almost every day and start every 3rd or 4th day), that could be a lot of offense out of that position.  

by SleepyCA on Mar 2, 2008 3:08 AM EST reply actions  

The Duncan, Gonzalez
platoon is also intriguing to me. Gonzo looks in great shape and I do believe he can still hit. Hopefully he can still play adequate defense.

by ridgesee on Mar 2, 2008 8:33 AM EST reply actions  

Great post.
While I think we've all become more optimistic about the pitching in the pipeline, the position players don't seem to be there. If Glaus can give the Cards 3-4 good years (I realize they'll have to re-sign him) they still need help in the middle of the infield. How would a Polanco-type player look at 2B, batting #2?

by vinniefromjersey on Mar 2, 2008 8:45 AM EST reply actions  

OK
Now I think you guys are doing this to me on purpose.

[I pulled in to Nazareth, was feeling 'bout half past dead  
I just need some place where I can lay my head  
"Hey mister, can you tell me where a man might find a bed?"  
He just grinned and shook my hand, "No" was all he said]

Well if I have to have a song stuck in my head it could be worse, it could have been Gordon Lightfoot again.

If everyone would help me out I seem to have misplaced an 82 around here somewhere, If anyone finds it please let me know.

Thank you lboros

by That's a Winner on Mar 2, 2008 9:06 AM EST reply actions  

Wait a minute Chester
If he doesn't get Stage Fright I think Ankiel is the best bet to take the load off Albert.  King Harvest will surely come if we can keep the pitchers out of Cripple Creek  Look out Houston....uhh....I'll stop now.

by easy on Mar 2, 2008 9:09 AM EST reply actions  

If he demands a trade
because the team was down (if it actually is) in 2008 and 2009, he's not as smart as he is rumored to be, because those are "sunk costs" of being a Cardinal, to borrow a term from the management side of salary discussions.  The real question is: when 2010 rolls around, what do future Cardinals teams look like then?  And I'm not convinced that any of the names in this discussion are relevant to that question except Rasmus and maybe Craig.

In my opinion, the key to a satisfying answer to that one is to have a real monster of a draft this year and next.  Top-echelon guys drafted this year should arrive in the majors in about 2011, just in time for AP to notice that suddenly the team is going to get very good again.  Top-echelon guys drafted in 2009 will be burning their way through AA or AAA in 2011 and should also be obvious on the Cardinals (and Pujols) radar screen.  It therefore follows that this is the time to make sure the team drafts absolutely the best players available for all possible draft slots in 2008 and 2009, and if that means going to war with the commish about paying over slot, then go to war with the commish.  Albert Pujols is more important to the future of this team than Czar Bud.

In a way it's handy that this problem is happening now, rather than a couple of years ago.  Moving up a couple of notches in the draft should increase the odds of finding someone who's really transformational.  Last year, the only guy out there who fit that category and was still available when Luhnow got to make his first choice was Rick Porcello, and while I would have preferred to see them take him rather than Kozma (and then start the salary war with Bud if need be), there's always a real risk associated with taking high-school pitchers.  This year the chances of finding someone like that should be much better.  So go for it.  This is not the time to be a compliant little franchise and do what a self-interested, short-sighted commissioner wants.

That's only half the battle -- doing something to develop more guys into major leaguers once they are drafted must also be done -- but it's the imperative first step.  Luhnow is going to have to earn his pay the next year or two.

Incidentally, I do endorse Hardcore's solution to the Pujols situation as well.  But that's only half the battle.  In keeping with the musical theme of the day, let me also propose a different set of lyrics to have floating around in our heads:

You who are on the road
Must have a code
That you can live by
And so become yourself
Because the past
Is just a goodbye...

by StanTheManFan on Mar 2, 2008 9:39 AM EST reply actions  

I agree that this draft
is of monumental importance to the team's future.  It is supposedly deep, we're in a good slot and we even have an extra early choice.  The last two drafts may get us a bunch of league average guys but this is the time to roll the dice on blue chip talent and "teach the children well."
I'm not sure though that we should be so concerned about making decisions based on Albert's situation.  As much as I love watching him I think it's always a bad thing to have an attitude that the team goes as it's best player goes.  Albert may indeed level off over the next few years and noticeably lose productivity after that to the point of not being the hub of the offense. That will be okay if we've drafted the best talent and developed them well.   Player procurement decisions shouldn't be made assuming that Albert will be a similar player in five years to the one he is today.  Having said that though, I do think that, like Ozzie, Albert's greatest assets are his intelligence and work ethic.   I suspect we may see him fall off one year because of injury or age, make some adjustments or re invent himself and come back as a slightly different but more productive player the next.  It'll be fun to watch.

by easy on Mar 2, 2008 10:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Next year
Next year, we will most likely have a top 5 pick.

by RedbirdRay on Mar 2, 2008 10:40 AM EST up reply actions  

On Albert and "protection"
Overall, I think I agree with your two main points -- that the lineup was bad in 07, and that we may have seen the last of Albert's seasons of lapping the competition.  Not sure I agree with how you got there though.

The lineup in 2007 was essentially Albert, a couple guys who performed close to league-average for their positions, and then a bunch of essentially replacement level hitters.  Teams with one superstar, a couple maybe-average hitters, and then all the rest unproductive, do not score many runs.  So clearly we need to improve our hitting in several places, or else we will not score many runs in 08 (and going forward) either.

BUT that said, you're probably aware that there is not much statistical evidence for a given hitter performing differently based on the name or performance of the hitters around him.  In fact, while there is no evidence that OTHER hitters make Albert better or worse, there is SOME evidence that Albert's presence presents some challenges for the hitters immediately around him (a small "reverse protection" effect).  

Pitchers appear to approach the monster hitter the same regardless of lineup, and the monster appears to perform the same regardless of what is around him.  BUT there is some evidence (via pitch selection, quality, and location) that pitchers bear down to get the guy before and after the monster comes up, perhaps in attempt to limit the damage the big guy can do.

Rather than the other hitters explaining any change in Albert's OPS and ISO, I would suspect that it is more likely related to two other factors -- first, his health (which you mentioned).  This may explain the change in behaviors you note -- as opposed to "pressing" or "lineup protection," perhaps he felt like he had to try harder to overcompensate for pain or weakness or loss of ROM, or had to be more selective because he couldn't handle all the same pitches the same ways as usual.

Second, his career trajectory.  I've noted elsewhere that historically great players -- players who are major league regulars and offensive forces starting immediately and at an unusually young age -- do not tend to follow the same developmental curve as other major leaguers.  Oftentimes they never exceed (and often never even match) the production they are able to put up in their first four to six seasons.  Naturally there are exceptions, but if you look at players like Mays, Mantle, Dimaggio, and more recently ARod and Griffey Jr, many have their career-best season OPS+'s within their first four to six years, and many are able to put up a three-year block of production someplace between age 20 and age 26 that they can never match the rest of their career;  their "peak years" are usually no better than (and are often a slight degrade from) the years that presumptively were "before he even reached his peak."

That's NOT to suggest we're about to see a decline, or an age-related drop-off --- just that for guys like Albert who, at age 20-22, already own the league -- there typically is no such thing as ENTERING their "peak years" -- they tend to already be in them when they first arrive.  The drop-off in 07 was not completely unexpected, regardless of the lineup he was in.

by skmsw on Mar 2, 2008 9:48 AM EST reply actions  

ESPN
is finally giving the Cards some ST coverage.

Outside the Lines this morning did a feature story on the TRL/Mckay PED link. Should be replayed on ESPN 2 or ESPN news later today.

Needless to say they have them as the poster boys PED enablers. I can't say I didn't see this comming. They even rehashed the Gonzalez border stop. Between the NBA, March Madness, NFL free agents and ST I guess all their crack journalists couldn't find any NEW storys worth covering.

"Do what you want to the women and children but leave me alone"-George Carlin

by That's a Winner on Mar 2, 2008 10:04 AM EST reply actions  

It's to early for me
TLR/Mckay
"Do what you want to the women and children but leave me alone"-George Carlin

by That's a Winner on Mar 2, 2008 10:44 AM EST up reply actions  

albert pujols
uncle albert started abandoning his plate discipline sept of 06, and has been an issue for my monitoring since. this is also when his lineup protection also started declining. cause/effect. in his eyes, it was/is a necessity.

what is truly amazing, is the level of production albert has achieved without lineup protection. he is not in decline. the quality of pitches he has seen, since sept 06, is in decline.

there is NOT a more disciplined inside-out swing in baseball!  not jeter, polonco....notta! alberts natural power and fundamentally sound approach will last AT LEAST 10 more years. the great ones, (hammerin' hank), make it look simple in their late 30's. uncle albert will too.

baseball is not the top priority in alberts life, as he has said. this man has admirable values. if there is one player in todays game who defies chasing the $ as your next FA hired gun, its albert. if he doesn't finish his career as a cardinal, i believe that will be someone elses choice, not alberts. and i would be very dissapointed.

by hard9fan on Mar 2, 2008 10:40 AM EST reply actions  

agreed
i hope the ownership understands the value of a player like albert not only to the team, but the fan base.  recent history made ozzie smith one of the highest paid players in all the league, signed rolen, edmonds and mcgwire to huge deals (at their respective times).  

the biggest blemish is letting steve carlton go for wanting 65K instead of 60K (or something like that).  it's been 40 years, and we haven't forgotten that.  i hope the organization doesn't either.

"There's a good possibility we may not be as bad as people think we're going to be."-- La Russa

by birdsonthebat on Mar 2, 2008 11:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Gameday links
Either this or this.  I'm not sure who's the home team when we play the Marlins.

by Phyrkrakr on Mar 2, 2008 11:34 AM EST reply actions  

I throw up a little bit in my mouth...
...anytime "trade" and "Albert Pujols" appear in the same sentence.  D.GOOCH
Cardinals, Cardinals, Cardinals!

by GOOCH24 on Mar 2, 2008 11:43 AM EST reply actions  

Albert's Age
This may have already been talked about here but is Albert truly 28 years old? I don't know where it was but I saw a picture of him a few days ago that would have the local carney guessing around 35.

I hope he is as young as everyone says but if he isn't could this have some weight come end of contract time?

by Wizard24 on Mar 2, 2008 12:29 PM EST reply actions  

If you saw
a picture of Greg Oden without knowing who he is, would you expect him to be just 19-20 years old? People age at different rates. My sister-in-law is in her mid-40s, but has had white hair since she was in college and has looked a lot older than she was. A high-school friend of mine has been bald since he was 19, but looked 29 or so(we're both 55 now).
Could Albert be older than he says? Yeah, it's possible, but remember that just because you look "old" doesn't mean you are.
"The moment we want to believe something, we suddenly see all the arguments for it, and become blind to the arguments against it."

by cardsrul on Mar 2, 2008 5:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Catch a cannonball....
Now, take me on down the line.
My bag is sinkin' low,
And I do believe it's time.

Call me nieve, but I believe Albert is only 28. I would hate to guess wrong on that one and let him get away assuming a pending decline. With my luck he would end up somewhere else in the NL Central and would continue to dominate for the next 10 years. There would be a lot of us throwing up in our mouths at that point.

"Even on a great year you have to watch your team loose about 60 times."

by tangledbrett on Mar 2, 2008 12:41 PM EST reply actions  

Speaking of throwing up in mouths...
Did anyone see this quip regarding Sir Sidney pitching for our scouts?  

I am so sick of this garbage!!!  Youth movement, my ass.

by RedbirdRay on Mar 2, 2008 12:49 PM EST reply actions  

Well, he needs him here to push Reyes out
of a rotation spot.........

Seriously, is that some sort of a joke?  Sidney Ponson?  Do we possibly need him for anything?  I hope this is not true.  If Mr. Mozeliak goes there again I will lose all respect for him.  

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Mar 2, 2008 7:39 PM EST up reply actions  

doubtfull
I find it highly unlikely that Ponson will be on the Cardinals.  I am sure he is throwing for a lot of teams to see if someone will pick him up not or at the end of ST, since you know a few pitchers will go down in the spring.

I really don't see it as major news at all.  I guess he may end up on the team if a couple guys get hurt and the cards need a cheap stop gap.  They may have reasons not to use some of the young guys at the MLB level quite yet.

I can't believe people are worried about it.

Reyes should not be worried, he has been awful and has gotten tons of chances at being a starting pitcher.  Brad Thompson has been fucked with WAY MORE than Reyes, but Oh well.  

I just hope the pitching is good this year, and I could care less who pitches as long as they are good.

by ICbirdfan on Mar 2, 2008 10:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Blake Hawksworth is pretty awful
I'd have to say he joins my list of players who should not play in St. Louis this year:

Aaron Miles
David Freese
Blake Hawksworth

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 2, 2008 1:59 PM EST reply actions  

Pujols off season workout
A while back M & F published his off season weight lifting routine.  It was two pages long and looked like a Mr. Olympian routine, many sets going to failure with heavy reps and around 1/3 of them dedicated to arms (hello elbow?).  

I read a "review" of his workout routine and it does make a lot of sense that Albert would be plagued with injuries lately and probably will continue to do so.  

http://www.intersportswire.com/content/view/57/33/

"How depressing is it being you? Would you equate it to being a lifelong Cubs fan?"

by rocKStark5 on Mar 2, 2008 2:02 PM EST reply actions  

I'm glad someone else
is thinking that.  It's been a while, but the first thing I thought when I read that M&F article was "he's crazy- but i assume his trainer knows more than me..."

by SleepyCA on Mar 2, 2008 3:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Odd how time change
up until about twenty five years ago, it was frowned upon by team management for a player to be "messing around" with heavy weights. No heavy lifting at all. Also a lot of clubs restricted hitters from playing golf during season ( pitchers OK). Now you do have a lot of hamstrings, obliques. Ten years ago, I had never heard of an oblique, and still don't know if i can spell it.

by ridgesee on Mar 2, 2008 4:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Here Comess ...
New 'Automatic Out' ... Izturis.  Another candidate, Hardcore Legend, for someone who shouldn't even make the team.
Culture of Winning: 10 World Championships, 17 Pennants, 6 Division Championships ...

by Cardinals4Ever on Mar 2, 2008 2:28 PM EST reply actions  

Walks ...
Has anyone ever heard of a calculated percentage of how often leadoff walks end up scoring?  Just wondering ... seems like something that would be out there.
Culture of Winning: 10 World Championships, 17 Pennants, 6 Division Championships ...

by Cardinals4Ever on Mar 2, 2008 2:46 PM EST reply actions  

I've seen it somewhere online
but am not sure where.  I know it is published in Tango's "the book", but I don't have that with me right now.  it should be the same % as for leadoff hits.  

You can look up the run expectancy value for "man on first, no outs", which is the total number of runs expected to be scored in the inning, not the number of times the leadoff guy scores.

by SleepyCA on Mar 2, 2008 3:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Walks ...
Thanks SleepyCA for the response ... I checked out 'The Book' at your suggestion and found the below table, which I thought I'd post for others information ... I thought it was interesting.

Go Cards!!!

Sabremetrics 101: Run Expectancy Matrix, 1999-2002
Actual Runs Scored, following each base/out state to end of inning
By Tangotiger

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The following table presents the average number of runs that scored, from that base/out state, to the end of that inning. All data is from 1999-2002.

Note: All partial innings are excluded. All home innings in the 9th or later are excluded.

(In the next release, I will present the number of times that exactly 0,1,2,3, 4, 5+ runs scored, from each base/out state.)

RE 99-02  0      1      2  
Empty     0.555  0.297  0.117  
1st       0.953  0.573  0.251  
2nd       1.189  0.725  0.344  
3rd       1.482  0.983  0.387  
1st_2nd   1.573  0.971  0.466  
1st_3rd   1.904  1.243  0.538  
2nd_3rd   2.052  1.467  0.634  
Loaded    2.417  1.65  0.815  

Bottom line:  Lead-off walks end up scoring approximately 40% of the time, same as lead-off singles ...

Culture of Winning: 10 World Championships, 17 Pennants, 6 Division Championships ...

by Cardinals4Ever on Mar 3, 2008 11:02 AM EST up reply actions  

Nice at bat by Albert
10 pitch walk
Jimmy steps in to lead off the bottom half of the inning... with nobody on base... It could happen... just not tonight.

by Hollywood15 on Mar 2, 2008 2:51 PM EST reply actions  

White Knight of Izturis
Are you going to champion him all year or just until he's DFA'd?  lol

by RedbirdRay on Mar 2, 2008 4:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Not time to bury Cesar, nor to praise him - yet.
Lighten up.  My remark was playful.

I'm not "championing" Izturis per se.  I'm just advocating that we judge players by their performance on the field, rather than jumping to conclusions based on skewed data.  

Perhaps you'd prefer to critique the authors of these earlier remarks for replaying the tired, widespread, incessant mantra, "I come to bury Cesar, not to praise him."

EARLIER POSTS:

Here Comess ...

New 'Automatic Out' ... Izturis.  Another candidate, Hardcore Legend, for someone who shouldn't even make the team.

Culture of Winning: 10 World Championships, 17 Pennants, 6 Division Championships ...
by Cardinals4Ever on Sun Mar 02, 2008 at 11:28:15 AM PDT

    [new] They only signed Isturis

    to Take VEB pressure off Miles

    by ridgesee on Sun Mar 02, 2008 at 01:45:44 PM PDT
 

by CardsWin on Mar 2, 2008 6:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Skewed data?
Basically his entire career except 2004? It's the pro-Izzy 2 people who are skewing dating (He was good in part of 2005!, etc)

by DiscoJer on Mar 2, 2008 8:04 PM EST up reply actions  

lighten up?
me?  you must not have noticed the "lol" after my post.   methinks you need to take your own advice.

thanks for the tirade, though.  if i pissed you off, i could really care less.

by RedbirdRay on Mar 2, 2008 8:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Life is too important to be taken seriously,
said Oscar Wilde.  He must have been prescient about blogs like this.  So I'm sure you won't take it personally that I'm not the least bit offended by the fact that you "could really care less".  lol  

No, I'm not pissed, and I'm certainly not your adversary, though you seem to think I am. I'm just a fellow fan. I come here purely for fun, as I imagine you do, observing and sometimes engaging in dialog with a bunch of fellow Cardinal fans I've never met in person.  So what is there to get bent out of shape about?

I look forward to seeing more comments from you and others as we marvel at some insights offered here and scratch our heads the analysis of others.  The differences in our views is a big part of what makes it fun to follow our favorite "Reality Game", aka "Spring Training".  ("Who WILL be voted off the 'Island'?  Gonzalez? Barton? Schu?  etc.  Stay tuned.")

: )

by CardsWin on Mar 2, 2008 9:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Pujol's weight
Does anyone else wonder if Pujols is just too heavy?

He looks so big to me the last year or so.  He's got the usual baseball hips and thighs.   I wonder if losing a few pounds would help his feet as well.

by sdrone on Mar 2, 2008 6:50 PM EST reply actions  

That's an interesting comment
I haven't been able to catch any games yet, so I can't say. But last season everyone was saying he looks smaller, then muttering stuff about PEDs. Then earlier in this thread there was a discussion about his workout routine and how buff the man is.

Albert: The walking optical illusion.

Baseball, I missed you.

by effin fisk on Mar 2, 2008 7:21 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm not talking about this year
I'm talking about the last couple of years.

I heard a couple of "smaller" comments after the steroid talk started, but I didn't know what to think of that.  He looked bigger to me.

by sdrone on Mar 2, 2008 7:24 PM EST up reply actions  

3 Nights in August
Talks a lot about Pujols' early career. Apparently the Cardinals had some concerns about Phat Albert being too heavy. In fact, they set him up with a nutritionist and a strength coach to help him tone up and slim down a bit. I think the steroid paranoia has come to the point that people assume all great hitters are on PEDs. That could be why you are hearing the Pujols comments. I personally don't think his body has changed much at all over the last several years.
"Even on a great year you have to watch your team loose about 60 times."

by tangledbrett on Mar 2, 2008 8:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Forget PED's
My thoughts have nothing to do with them.

It's probably just me.   I just look at Pujols and think "hmm, he could lose a few pounds."

by sdrone on Mar 2, 2008 11:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Pujols for MVP
I'm still pissed that Pujols got shafted on the MVP's in 2003 and 2004.  I hate Bonds.  Anyways, I still think Pujols is in the prime of his career.  His slugging dipped to .568 last season with only 32 homers and 103 RBI's, but I attribute that to the nagging injuries and no protection.  I'm praying that Rasmus can grow up quick and that Glaus can have a few good years behind Pujols.  

by MKCards512 on Mar 2, 2008 8:43 PM EST reply actions  

What's up with Brian Barton?
Can someone who's getting a chance to watch these games enlighten me? His stlcardinals.com stats say he's 0-for-Spring Training, but I know he had a couple of hits against SLU. How does his swing look? How is he in the field so far? Anything?
Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country

by Mr Redbird on Mar 2, 2008 9:16 PM EST reply actions  

Barton
The game against SLU didn't count towards grapefruit League stats

by The Butcher on Mar 2, 2008 10:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I know that
My original question still wasn't answered.
Cardinal fan in the heart of Braves country

by Mr Redbird on Mar 3, 2008 12:27 AM EST up reply actions  

the band, quality tunes
I truly hope SOMEBODY will hit behind Al this year, the lack of protection was painful to watch at times last year.

On a unrelated topic, glad to see marquis back to his old whinning ways, per mlb trade rumors. He doesn't want to pitch out of the pen.

"Textbooks are Soviet propaganda" - Rev. Jerry Falwell

by elirock83 on Mar 2, 2008 10:40 PM EST reply actions  

Yeah, that was in the Trib today
Piniella is NOT happy about it.  heh.

Rumors were they tried to trade him all winter and couldn't.

by sdrone on Mar 2, 2008 11:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Cardinals will be all right
c'mon guys, the cards are consistently in the race. Last year they almost made the playoffs and they had just about every possible thing go wrong. It's not too horribly unrealistic to expect 40HR seasons from  3 players (unless Pujols' elbow gives out), and nice rbi's from a few others. I think the main thing barring the offense would be to see izturis and kennedy start more often than brendan ryan and miles. Miles has a few similarities to Eckstein, he's your sparkplug guy. Ryan would be a good leadoff hitter in case Schumacher doesn't pan out and I think is an underrated hitter. The outfield has plenty of depth, although more than a few of these guys need to step it up out there and at the plate. the pitching will keep them in it until Clement, Mulder, and Carpenter warm up, and even if one of them gets hot the starting rotation really doesn't look too bad at all. the bullpen should be pretty solid barring too many injuries or starting ineffectiveness. The lynchpin should be if Wainwright emerges as ace of the team yet, or even close to that. I'd like to see them bring Rasmus up later as sort of a boost to a slow early season start, followed by one or two starters whenever they get ready, should be a nice kick in the arse. That way with Rasmus coming up after a month or two, they can further evaluate regular everyday outfield starters and hand over center field to the prodigy. and let's hope Glaus stays healthy and effective, heh. anyone think Brian Barton will play much of the season in the big leagues? I think he may be a nice surprise. gotta get karma back from that herren trade, hahahah!
Ankiel is Jesus

by chicago cards fan on Mar 8, 2008 12:37 AM EST reply actions  

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