Projected Roster

by StLHugo on Mar 14, 2008 1:16 AM EDT

So with the newest addition I think now would be a good time to look at what the projected roster is shaping out to be.

C: Molina
1B: Pujols
2B: Kennedy
SS: Izturis
3B: Glaus
LF: Duncan
CF: Schumaker
RF: Ankiel

Bench: LaRue, Miles, Ryan/Mather, Barton, Ludwick

SP: Wainwright, Looper, Lohse, Reyes, Wellemeyer
RP: Izzy, Franklin, Springer, Flores, Villone, Thompson, Perez
DL: Carpenter, Mulder, Clement, Piniero, Johnson, Kinney, Encarnacion(just for good measure)

I think the real questions here are:
What happens when Piniero, Clement, Johnson and Kinney all come back mid April-May timeframe? Who gets bumped? Do TJ and Kinney get optioned for awhile? Will Villone get traded/DFAed? Will Flores? If all goes perfect for them we will have more decisions in June and July for Mulder and Carp. I think the 2008 Cards are best described by the word "uncertainty" since we have no clue what tomorrow will bring.

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do you mean

for opening day?

he's my opening day roster, with batting order

RF: Schumak
LF: Duncan
1B: Pujols
3B: Glaus
CF: Ankiel
C : Molina
2B: Kennedy
P : Wainer
SS: Izturis

Bench: Barton, Ludwick, Miles, Ryan, LaRue

Starters: Wainer-Looper-Lohse-Reyes-Welly

Bullpen: Izzy-Franklin-Springer-Thompson-Flores-Villone-Motte

notes: i think it'll be motte unless perez shows that he can control his pitches the next few times he goes out.

And if izturiz doesn't show his glove like he has all spring, i could see starting miles/ryan in his place and having mather be a reserve.

Cardwash - Cardinal, Washington fan (Washington???? Yeah, I know)

by cardwash on Mar 14, 2008 2:55 AM EDT reply actions

Jeff Francis

You will not see Schumacher (and possibly Duncan/ Kennedy) in the opening day lineup. We face a lefty to start the season. Think Ludwick, possibly Barton (unless Gonzalez somehow makes the team) and Miles.

"It takes pitching, hitting and defense. Any two can win. All three make you unbeatable". Joe Garagiola

by MRCARD on Mar 14, 2008 8:24 AM EDT up reply actions

You got it...

cardwash covered it for me with his "notes:" included.

The biggest question marks left over involves Gonzalez, Rasmus and maybe/possibly Marti. They may be the next Memphis outfield, depending on Mathers landing spot.

"We collect players that can hit and play 1st Base, but sorta play in the outfield most of the time." "Also, relievers that start!"

by cardschinmusic on Mar 14, 2008 7:05 AM EDT reply actions

The other question...

Since Lohse helps resolve one issue, the other is when to pull the plug on Kennedy and/or Izturis if they dont hit. For me thats the day of the second exhibition in Spgfld. La Russa and Mo have to be considering the situation, we still gotta score runs. That might change the starting line-up?

"We collect players that can hit and play 1st Base, but sorta play in the outfield most of the time." "Also, relievers that start!"

by cardschinmusic on Mar 14, 2008 7:45 AM EDT up reply actions

Marti's already back in minor league ST...

...although Marti is so awesome he can play three levels of pro ball before his breakfast of raw sausage and coffee grounds.

by Forsch31 on Mar 14, 2008 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions

Izturis/Miles

One or both have got to be released or traded for some old practice baseballs. Ryan should be the starting SS and Mather should be on the bench. Keep one of Miles or Iz2 to back up second and short.

I'm looking for the next Bobby Bonilla?

by showmejoe on Mar 15, 2008 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions

To your questions

What happens when Clement, Piniero, Johnson, Kinney come back in mid-May?

At that point I think Looper may have pitched himself out of the rotation, so Clement replaces him, and Piniero probably bumps the worst of Reyes/Wellemeyer at the back of rotation. Johnson will probably displace Villone or Flores and Kinney would probably bump Perez back down to the minors, as much as I'd hate to see that, Perez still has options so that has to be considered.

This rotation looks pretty decent to me:

Wainwright
Clement
Lohse
Reyes (assuming he doesn't suck the first month)
Piniero

There's some talent there as long as they are healthy. When Carp and Mulder come back some tough decisions will have to be made unless someone gets hurt (Clement) or pitches horribly (Reyes, Piniero)

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on Mar 14, 2008 9:47 AM EDT reply actions

Rosters

Rotation: Wainwright, Looper, Lohse, Reyes, Wellemeyer

Bullpen: Izzy, Franklin, Springer, Villone, Flores, Thompson

Outfield: Duncan, Shumaker, Ankiel

Infield: Gaus, Ryan/Izturis, Kennedy, Pujols, Molina

Bench: LaRue, Mather, Barton, Ludwick, Miles

Note: Izturis and Ryan platoon to start the season. Gonzalez goes to Memphis. Skippy, given his success in Spring Training in the lead-off spot, earns a starting job at the beginning of the season; I suspect he'll be shopped as part of a package when pitchers start coming off the DL.

by Forsch31 on Mar 14, 2008 12:02 PM EDT reply actions

Pen

I doubt TLR has only 6 bullpen arms but I would prefer not having to choose between Ryan and Mather.

by StLHugo on Mar 14, 2008 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions

About the Pen

With Pineiro, Clement, and Mulder all expected back within the first two months of the season and Lohse now on the roster, I suspect that LaRussa might live with a shorter-than-normal bullpen while some of his longer relievers fill in for the rotation. One or more of those guys would then simply move back to the pen. Obviously, that's best-case; I feel better about Clement than I do Mulder, and I'm not expecting anything from Pineiro until we know more.

In 2006, LaRussa used 4 relievers in 60 or more game apperances--Looper, Wainwright, Hancock, and Flores. Izzy had 59 before his injury, while Tyler Johnson had 56 games and Thompson had 43. After that, Josh Kinney had 21 games (starting in July) and Jorge Sosa had 19 (starting in August). I think that a 6-arm bullpen for the first month or so of the season is something that LaRussa could do.

by Forsch31 on Mar 14, 2008 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions

Ludwick...

was terrible against lefties last year, so the lineup (against Francis) for the opener should look like this:

Schumaker CF
Barton LF
Pujols 1B
Glaus 3B
Ankiel RF
Molina C
Ryan 2B

8)Wainer P
9) Izturis SS

Bench: Ludwick, Duncan, Kennedy, LaRue, Miles

Rotation: Wainer, Lohse, Pineiro, Loop (traded once Mulder proves he's healthy), Reyes (turned to the pen once Clement is ready)
- Carp works the pen once he returns in early September

Pen: Izzy, Frank, Flores, Springy, Villone, Brad, Wellemeyer

St. Louis Cardinals: 2009 World Series Champions

by spritown red on Mar 14, 2008 2:57 PM EDT reply actions

maybe its not so bad after all...

If this team ever recovers from all these injuries we actually look like a pretty deep team as far as depth is concerned. Assuming all players are healthy around July 31st this could be an incredibly entertaining trade deadline. Consider the players that could see action in '08:

Starters (13) -

Wainwright
Carpenter
Mulder
Pineiro
Clement
Lohse
Looper
Reyes
Wellemeyer
Thompson
Boggs
McLellan
Parisi

Relievers (16) -

Franklin
Springer
Isringhausen
Thompson
Johnson
Ra. Flores
Kinney
Villone
Looper
Wellemeyer
Ron Flores
Perez
Motte
Castellanos
Worrell
Dove

Outfielders (9)-

Ankiel
Duncan
Barton
Schumaker
Ludwick
Mather
Rasmus
Marti
Gonzalez

Infielders (8) -

Pujols
Glaus
Kennedy
Izturis
Ryan
Miles
Hoffpauir
Barden

Cathers (3)

Molina
LaRue
Anderson

Also keep in mind that next offseason will see ANOTHER $35.35 MILLION (less free agents + salary increases for players already under contracts)come off the books. Surely with all this cash and all these spare parts,not to mention all the emerging prospects in the system, Dewitt III/Mo can find a way to put together a real rotation, find a 2B/SS duo that can hit AND field, and return this team to the force it has been for the majority of the past 12 seasons under Lamping/Jocketty.

Some interesting FA's after 08 to consider -

Orlando Hudson
Rafael Furcal
C.C. Sabathia

How about an '09 line up of

Furcal
Rasmus
Pujols
Ankiel
Glaus
Hudson
Molina
Pitcher
Barton

Sabathia
Carpenter
Wainwright
Pinero
Garcia

"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Mar 14, 2008 4:27 PM EDT reply actions

+1

Its good to hear some positivity about this Cardinal team.
I agree I think we can really improve our team in the next few years.
And who wouldn't like Sabathia, Furcal and Hudson on our team! kinda doubtful it will happen though lol...

by Calhoun on Mar 14, 2008 5:21 PM EDT reply actions

sure...

but the money is certainly there

"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Mar 14, 2008 5:37 PM EDT reply actions

anyone else concerned about C Duncan?

Is he still hurt? Pressing? Victim of bad luck?

If he starts the year on a minor-league rehab assignment, does that mean Mather gets a promotion?

by gocards62 on Mar 14, 2008 8:57 PM EDT reply actions

If Duncan

Starts the season on the DL (and that is not a bad idea) I would think that Juan Gone gets his spot. Duncan can get an extended spring training and work on his back or what ever is ailing him. Then go to Memphis for a couple of weeks. Juan gets a chance to prove he can still play at the major league level. This way once Duncan is ready Juan can be traded. Same goes with Skip. His days with the Cards are numbered. He will be replaced by Colby. I think Schu should get every opportunity to play. This way he can build trade value. Once all the pitchers start coming back we will be in a position to make a move. I have thought for some time now that Reyes should start the season in Memphis as well. He could go 5-0 with an era around 2.5 or less and build his value. Looper, Reyes, schu, Juan, and/or Duncan among others should be available for trades. I would expect we could find so infield prospects.

I hope that Izzy2 is not on the 25 man roster at the start of the season, and Ryan is the starting SS. Miles is the MI back and Mather is the corner IF back up. The team going forward could be lights out. The '09 rotation could look like this.
Carp
Wainman
Mulder
Clement
Pineiro
Even if Mulder flames out we will have an plenty of arms and a damn good rotation.

Bill Blessing

by nybirdfan on Mar 15, 2008 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions

I really would like to be optimistic about Clement and Mulder

But the list is very short of pitchers who make it back to anywhere close to their former career performance after the type of injuries they had. If they don't want to keep Reyes in the rotation, they should not send him to AAA. They should just trade him. And they'll get something for him, as long as he keeps that nice K/BB ratio. As long as he's finding the plate, there's something to work with because really that's what spring training is for when your a pitcher. Control is there, command (in a perfect world) follows. Mr. Mozeliak just needs to contact the same teams that expressed interest at the winter meetings. I'll bet they're still interested, especially since pitchers have already started hitting the DL.

When I heard they signed Clement, I thought it seemed like a reasonable risk. But I assumed someone from the organization actually went and saw him pitch first. It seems like that didn't happen........

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Mar 15, 2008 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions

I agree with the roster

Boy I wish they would just get rid of Miles, or one of the other washed up middle infielders, and put both Ryan and Mather on the team, Mather playing the Spiezio role. There are gonna be some trade chips at the deadline if Mulder, Clement, and Carpenter get healthy.

by Youth Movement on Mar 15, 2008 1:41 PM EDT reply actions