Dodgers 3b Problem and Troy Glaus

by JMedwick on Mar 11, 2008 10:09 AM EDT Comment 37 comments

With the Dodgers facing a real holes at 3b (the oft injured Nomar in addition to LaRoche out with injuries), they could be in the market for someone like Glaus, who would be an upgrade over Nomar and add the power in the middle of the lineup that the Dodgers seek.

Should the Cardinals seek to flip Glaus to the Dodgers for prospects?

Seems like the no-brainier answer would be yes, particularly if Glaus gets off to a hot start and the Cards needed to pick up little or no salary.

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Glaus for LaRoche?

That would fill our need long term, their need short term and we could fill 3B with Ryan or Jimenez for the time being. Not sure but sounds interesting.

by StLHugo on Mar 11, 2008 10:22 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

rebuilding

that would be an outright admission of 'rebuilding mode' - which seems unlikely, as pointed out in the main post this morning. I don't see it happening, at least not until after the all-star break, and then only if we are WAAAYYY out of the playoff picture.

by cdb on Mar 11, 2008 10:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Who would you want?

I'd send them Glaus, but not straight up for LaRoche. LaRoche hasn't proven anything at the big league level and Glaus has, so Troy has to have more value especially considering he's not hurt right now.

Here's the deal I'd try and make:

Cards get:

LaRoche
Hu
Kershaw

Dodgers get:

Glaus
Reyes
Minor League Pitcher

Solves the SS and 3B options for the Cards for a few years as well as netting us a top pitching prospect. Solves the starting 3B job for the Dodgers as well as giving them a bat with some pop, which they don't currently have. I think you have to overvalue Glaus in this trade because LA doesn't have any 30 HR players on their roster.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on Mar 11, 2008 2:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't know that you could get that package

but I'll be damned if I can figure out why the Dodgers won't play Ethier or won't trade him either.

I'd be willing to be that if the Dodgers are THAT concerned about 3B, the Cardinals could pry Ethier out of their grasp for Glaus.

Still looking for 1985 Regular Season games on DVD/VHS

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 11, 2008 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kershaw

I can't see the Dodgers letting that guy go on the cheap, and I certainly think they could do better than Glaus, but I wouldn't mind having some convos with the Dodgers about Glaus.

Even with LaRoche hurt, I would trade him straight up for Glaus today. I think he could give you comparable numbers this season when he heals and probably better stats next year for a fraction of the cost. It would be a great rebuilding move that wouldn't even cripple us outside of the first couple of months waiting for LaRoche to heal. Ryan could play third in the time being, its a way to get him ABs.

The hot stove is burning...

by cardzfan24 on Mar 11, 2008 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't see

Anyone on the trade market at 3b who is Glaus' equal. Crede or Inge are about it and neither is very attractive.

by JMedwick on Mar 11, 2008 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Crede and Inge

I would much rather trade for LaRoche than for either Crede or Inge. Both good glove guys, both with terrible OBPs, both with power, both closer to getting more money in free agency.

Laroche would easily put up higher OBPs than those two today (you know, assuming his finger wasnt broken.) and he wouldn't cost as much.

The hot stove is burning...

by cardzfan24 on Mar 11, 2008 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think...

I think he was saying that if the Cards put Glaus up on the market he will be the most attractive option, better then Inge or Crede, for the Dodgers, therefore we would have some nice leverage in the negotiations.

by StLHugo on Mar 11, 2008 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ah ok

my bad

The hot stove is burning...

by cardzfan24 on Mar 11, 2008 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That is one good idea

Though I wonder whether LA would be willing to dump all that talent and still pick up some of Glaus' salary. I think one question that has to be answered is would the Cardinals rather:

A. Get a bit of talent and most of the Glaus money off the books.

B. More talent, but then the Cards must eat more salary.

Of the two, I would rather move the money off the books.

With that in mind:

Glaus and Reyes for

LaRoche and Hu

by JMedwick on Mar 11, 2008 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Do you think

the Dodgers want to trade Hu when he will probably step in for Furcal after this season? They probably value him more than wanting to trade him for Reyes.

The hot stove is burning...

by cardzfan24 on Mar 11, 2008 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

A fair point

To be honest, if the Cards simply swapped

Glaus for LaRoche and got LA to take on most of the dollars, I would be happy.

by JMedwick on Mar 11, 2008 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Blech...I'll say it again

Why do people so incredibly overvalue their own team's prospects and so wildly underrate other team's prospects.

Hu is a legit prospect. Kershaw throws 97 with a ridiculous curveball from the left side and is going to be the best pitching prospect in the minors once Chamberlain/Buchholz clear out.

Reyes for Hu would be a ridiculous steal in itself.

Glaus for LaRoche might be fair value.

Then they "throw in" Kershaw for a "minor league pitcher"?????

With no evidence to the contrary: Colby Rasmus is clutch.

by joker24 on Mar 11, 2008 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

No kidding...

No way the Dodgers would give up Kershaw alone for Glaus. It would take Colby Rasmus or Albert Pujols to get Kershaw. While I think Kershaw is somewhat overrated due to his lack of command...he still has the highest upside of any pitcher in any organization.

by indakind on Mar 11, 2008 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

don't forget

that David Price guy.

On with the (good) youth movement!

by aet15 on Mar 11, 2008 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

price is good...

...in fact he is very good, but his stuff is not nearly as dynamic as Kershaw's.

by indakind on Mar 11, 2008 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I beg to differ

I don't want to start a debate over this right now, mainly because I don't have the time, but I suggest doing some reading on the Rays' impressions of Price right now, along with his career stats. This guy is money, and everyone seems to be in awe of him right now -- and that's on a team with some pretty damn talented young pitchers.

"Not nearly as dynamic as Kershaw" isn't a fair assessment.

On with the (good) youth movement!

by aet15 on Mar 12, 2008 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Having seen Price in college and Kershaw in AA

Apparently he was 95-97 in his relief appearance with "wipeout" slider which would put him in Kershaw's stuff range, but as a starter he was more 90-93 dialing a 95 with the plus slider. Kershaw sits 93-95 dialing 8s and 9s with the huge plus-plus curve. It's not a knock on Price, Kershaw is pretty much ridiculous. "Not nearly" I'd take issue with, but Kershaw is lightning...

With no evidence to the contrary: Colby Rasmus is clutch.

by joker24 on Mar 12, 2008 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Man

I wish the Cardinals had a pitcher in their system like that! Sorry I should be clear a "STARTING" pitcher. I prefer starters to bullpen guys.

by ICbirdfan on Mar 12, 2008 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Porcello is gonna give him a run for his money

I love Porcello to an unnatural degree...he's a 4 pitch pitcher coming out of high school with incredible mechanics.

With no evidence to the contrary: Colby Rasmus is clutch.

by joker24 on Mar 11, 2008 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Right at the bottom of my original post sir

You HAVE to overvalue Glaus in this situation for two reasons:

The Dodgers needs his bat almost as much as we do
There's no reason to trade him unless you're getting more than fair value.

How is Glaus for LaRoche "fair value"? That statement makes no sense. Has Andy LaRoche ever hit 30 homers in a season? Glaus did that last year before he got hurt for Pete's sake. LaRoche came up at the end of last year and stunk up the frigging joint and he wasn't playing much better this ST before he got hurt.

Where am I overvaluing prospects? I don't have a "prospect" on that entire list besides a minor league pitcher. If anything, it's you that's overvaluing LA's prospects. Just because they're rated highly and played in the FutureStars game doesn't make them a noteworthy MLB regular.

That's the best deal I could conceivably come up with from our side without gutting the major league roster or trading Rasmus. You offer them a bona fide 40 HR guy for some of their prospects. You make that offer, the Dodgers counter if they're interested, if not, you drop the whole thing and forget about it.

"I just wish that the late Harry Caray were still around so I could hear him mispronounce 'Kosuke Fukudome' every fukun' night" -- Dennis Miller

by fourstick on Mar 11, 2008 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Glaus is good

but he hasn't had a 40 HR season since 2001 and 3 of his past 5 seasons have seen him miss siginificant time with injury.

LaRoche has never hit 30 bombs in the majors but he is very skilled with the bat. He has 1600 minor league ABs where he has put up a .294/.374/.524 line with 90 homeruns. The dude is legit, and we should be THRILLED if Glaus netted us Laroche because it would mean we turned Scott Rolen and his bum shoulders into multiple cost controlled years of a budding young stud.

His problem isn't lack of skill, it is lack of opportunity. He would get that here.

The hot stove is burning...

by cardzfan24 on Mar 11, 2008 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It was a combined statement #1

A. "Wildly underrating other team's prospects". To propose we would get Kershaw is outrageous for Glaus/Reyes/MilPitcher. Way beyond outrageous. You can't get Kershaw alone for that. Not even close. There'd be no point in even asking. Oh yeah, they're gonna throw in Hu who is a GGish SS too who slugged over .500 in AA/AAA. And LaRoche and speaking of:

#2. On a straight talent for talent vacuum, Glaus for LaRoche does favor the Dodgers. Except trades don't take place in a talent vacuum, LaRoche is pre-arb cheap and cost controlled for 6 years. Glaus is expensive for 2 years and old. You mention LaRoche's callup where he was brutal; You don't mention his AAA line of .309 .399 .589. I was being as generous by saying might be fair value, in reality I would trade Glaus for LaRoche in an instant based on the money/rebuilding team issue. Trades you'd do in an instant probably aren't fair, but that deal would at least be plausible. I wasn't criticizing that deal.

With no evidence to the contrary: Colby Rasmus is clutch.

by joker24 on Mar 11, 2008 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

already passed?

i cant find a link, but i'm almost certain i read the dodgers passed on a potential glaus deal in the offseason. part of the problem is the money owed to glaus. the other part of it is that he still has to prove he is healthy. having offseason surgery doesnt prove you are healthy. the dodgers may re-evaluate their opinion on glaus come july, but right now i just dont think they are interested. they sure as heck wont be throwing in kershaw. if thats the case toronto would have sent him there instead of swapping him for rolen. think about that for a moment. the best deal toronto could swing was to get another team's damaged goods. what has changed since then? glaus needs to mash in the first half of the season if he's going to be traded for anything significant.

by dmb60614 on Mar 11, 2008 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly dmb

If the Dodgers wanted Glaus they could have easily outbid us on him.

by Calhoun on Mar 11, 2008 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

But...

that was before the injury to LaRoche plus the shocking realization that must be getting more and more frightening every day, that Nomar may be their starting 3B.

Things do change, and if nothing comes from this, I am fine with it. But if the Dodgers show any indication of wanting to get a 3B, we better be in on the convo.

The hot stove is burning...

by cardzfan24 on Mar 11, 2008 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

IF the Dodgers show any interest at all we need to pursue it.

by Calhoun on Mar 11, 2008 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

before when Glaus was availible, they thought they had depth at3B with Nomar and Laroche. Now, depending on the injury situation, they have a hole there.

Different circumstances.

Still looking for 1985 Regular Season games on DVD/VHS

by Hardcore Legend on Mar 11, 2008 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly +

If Glaus gets off to a hot start, I really think the Cards should look into moving him. A number of contenders, including both LA teams could use a power hitting 3rd baseman.

by JMedwick on Mar 11, 2008 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're not trading players...

You're trading contracts. LaRoche will make league minimum for the next 3.5 seasons, while Glaus makes big money. Even if they both made the same amount of money, PECOTA thinks LaRoche will be a better player than Glaus in 2009 and beyond, even if you discount his projection a bit due to the thumb injury he just suffered. As for this year, WE AREN'T WINNING ANYTHING THIS YEAR! If this deal is available (Glaus for LaRoche straight up), Mo should be jumping all over it. You've got an offensive core in '09 of Pujols, Rasmus, LaRoche, and a big-time free agent at 2B, SS, or a corner outfield spot that you can afford to sign with Glaus's money plus all the dead money that is coming off the books after this year.

by mikedallas23 on Mar 12, 2008 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Big-time free agent?

Dont get me wrong we need a big-time free agent in the middle infield but...they havent exactly been willing to spend a lot of money in the offseasons.

by Calhoun on Mar 12, 2008 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're kidding, right?

LaRoche and Kershaw are both high level prospects, with Kershaw being as close to can't miss as a pitcher can get. LaRoche, despite struggling in a whopping sample size of 150 ab's or so, is relatively close to can't-miss. The dude has done nothing but bomb the shit out of the ball in the minors. An older third baseman and a so-far failed pitcher, plus a random minor leaguer, would not be anywhere close to enough to pull those two guys out of there.

"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.

by redbirdnation8206 on Mar 12, 2008 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

My sister is a Twins fan.....she

told me the other day I would enjoy watching Glaus play third base. That is, "If I like watching a tree play third-a tree that moves every once in awhile with a stiff breeze." Her observations of him is that he only makes plays when they are hit directly to him, and that he doesn't move well to his left or his right.

Please, can someone tell me if her observations are correct? Is she just being mean telling me that? She has been out of sorts over the whole Johan trade.....

She isn't crazy, she's just not impressed.

by jillsinmo on Mar 11, 2008 6:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

that's exactly the impression

that I got from last week, almost word for word what I was thinking. I was hoping (praying?) he was just taking it easy early on...

play skip at second base.

by SleepyCA on Mar 11, 2008 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I really don't think the Dodgers

can do better than Glaus. I also think that he's much more valuable to a genuine contender than he is to ....uh...us. The Dodgers are in a position where they might overpay for Glaus so offering him for Laroche and another really good prospect sounds reasonable to me. I just don't think we'd do it since hope springs eternal and it is indeed spring. Our hopes won't be truly dashed till mid summer but there might be something attractive then too.

by easy on Mar 11, 2008 7:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Everyone can...

put Kershaw right out of your minds. The Dodgers weren't even comfortable parting with him in a deal for Miggy Cab.

by mynameistyler on Mar 11, 2008 9:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Glaus NTC?

anyone know if Glaus has a no-trade? I think he might have had to waive it to come to Stl, can't imagine him being thrilled to do it again. That said, he would be going to a contender.

by DenverCardsFan on Mar 12, 2008 12:18 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs