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all time greatest cardinals to me.

This is to spark conversation that are based soley on life experiences and perception rather than stats...ultimately thats what got us into the game so it is fun to visit. I dont think there is a better time to reflect than just before the start of a new season. So here is how it works, my favorite cardinals, a super brief description of why I love them and their stats from their best season with the redbirds. Some of my picks are based on reality others are based on my perceptions at the age of 9. Others are based on my fascination with Bat S!@# Crazy people. I avoided digging in to old cards and line ups to try and be clever, these are all off the top of my head...if you cannot name your top 25 favorite cardinals off the top of your head, what kind of cardinal fan are you? I tried to make this look as much like a fantasy league roster as possible, so I only list OF vice LF, CF, RF...it makes it much easier. The stats are from baseballreference.com. Additional Disclaimer: this list obviously reflects my disinterest in baseball from 1995 to 1998 when  I was more interested in music and girls than baseball...luckily, I got over it. Also, this list could be completely different tomorrow. Submitted for your approval...  

Star-divide

HITTERS    Year  G   AB    R    H   2B 3B  HR  RBI  SB CS  BB  SO   BA   OBP   SLG    

1B -  Jack Clark 1987 131 419   93  120  23  1    35    106   1    2    136 139  .286  .459  .597

Jack Clark hit the first homerun that I recall witnessing in person. I was 6 years old. I was 12 rows behind home plate (my mom was old friends with a distant relative of Marge Schott and we were playing the Reds, it would be another 10 years before I would see a game closer than the nose bleeds) and Jack knocked the shit out of the ball. It could have just cleared the fence, but I heard him grunt and in my mind it went 750 feet. He also knocked Mike Scocia out cold and blew a small fortune on muscle cars and women...a man's man.

2B - Jose Oquendo 1989 163  556   59  162  28  7   1      48      3   5    79   59   .291   .375    .372  
Jose, as pointed out by his 92 Topps Studio card was born on the 4th of July and his favorite t.v. show is Night Court. In an alternate universe I would birth his children...our first born would have been named Harry, our second, Danfielding. He also has the record for best single season fielding percentage at 2nd Base in the history of baseball (1989).  Being known only as a great utility infielder is a disservice to his talent and career.

3B - Ken Boyer    1961 153  589   109 194  26  11 24   95    6     3    68    91   .329  .397  .533
Tough call as Boyer is essential a 1960s version of Rolen. Incredibly hard nosed. gifted fielder from the Midwest with a great bat whose career came up just short of the Hall of Fame. Bill James considers him one of the greatest players NOT in the Hall of Fame. Died too young to sway the Veterans Committee.  

SS - Ozzie Smith 1987 158  600   104  182  40  4   0   75      43    9   89   36  .303   .392    .383  

He was pretty good. His only drawback is that he never delivered a clutch homerun or anything too exciting. Very boring player.

OF - Stan Musial 1948 155  611   135   230  46 18  39 131     7  NA  79  34  .376    .450    .702

Stan was good at baseball.  

OF - Curt Flood 1965 156  617   90  191  30  3  11     83     9   3     51    50   .310   .366    .421

But for Curt Flood's challenge to MLB he would be in the Hall of Fame. He would have remained in St. Louis and had a long career. He was the best fielder of his generation and hitting well in the NL when pitchers were dominating. He was a casualty of the times but went down swinging. Not to be confused with Cardinal great Curt Ford...which I often did as a child and teenager.

OF -  Willie McGee 1985 152  612   114  216 26 18  10    82   56  16   34     86  .353    .384    .503

Willie was the most likeable person in the history of baseball. He had a great career that impacted me at a very young age. I remember pleading with him in game seven of the 1987 world series that if he delivered a game winning base hit I would never call him "E.T. McGee" again behind his back. E.T. McGee also was great to watch finishing his career with the Cards.

C - Tony Pena 1988 149  505   55  133  23  1  10      51    6   2     33    60    .263    .308  .372

Chalk this one up to 7 year old me. He was the catcher for the Cards, I was the catcher for the MBI Pinto league Cubs (I didn't get to pick the team I was on). He had a weird catching stance, I had to have a weird catching stance. He backed up 1st base, I backed up 1st base. It was a thing we had.    

PITCHERS (by the way, this was hard. I guess I don't like pitchers that much)
SP - Gibson Year W   L   G   GS  CG SHO  GF SV   IP     H       R   ER   HR  BB   SO  HBP  WP  BFP  IBB  BK  ERA
1968 22   9  34   34    28   13      0     0  304.7 198   49   38     11   62    268   7        4    1161   6       0    1.12

He is the one with the wallet that says Bad Mother F@%*er on it.

SP -  Alexander 1927 21  10  37  30   22    2        4     3   268.0  261   94  75     11   38    48      1       1    1082   NA   0  2.52

Grover Cleveland Alexander  was 40 when he pitched for the Cards but he is one of my favorite baseball characters. He was like an early version of Roger Clemens if steroids were alcohol. He was a complex man who finished up playing with my favorite barn storming team, the House of David.

SP -  Andujar 1985 21  12  38  38  10      2         0     0  269.7  265  113  102  15  82  112       11      2    1127   12   0    3.40

This is more based on my readings of Whitey's books but he falls into my Bat S!@#$ Crazy category. In a decade of Bob Forsch and John Tudor, he made things interesting.

SP - DeLeon 1989 16  12  36  36   5       3         0     0  244.7  173   96   83  16   80    201        6      2      972     5     0    3.05

I just remember being thrilled that we had a pitcher with over 200 strike outs and 15 wins. Times were tough. He had a sweet little mustache (I think) on one of his Topps cards. I could be wrong.

SP - Kile 2000 20   9   34   34  5      1          0     0  232.3  215  109  101  33   58  192       13     8       960    1     1     3.91

 I liked him...at least better than Morris. I found out he had died in the same letter I found out Jack Buck and my dog had died...while I was in Officer Training. That was a crappy letter.  

RP - Kline 2001  3   3   89   0      0   0          26      9  75.0   53    16     15     3  29  54          4       1       303    7   0    1.80

Steve Kline was great. He gave me his autograph and let me touch his hat. He was a dirt bag. He coached High School wrestling in the off season...oh and he was pretty untouchable in 2001.

RP - Worrell 1986 9  10   74   0       0   0         60     36  103.7 86  29      24      9 41  73          1       1       430   16   0    2.08

Todd Worrell signed a baseball card for me in the large appliance section of Murdale True Value in Carbondale, Illinois.  

CL -  Izzy 2004 4   2    74   0       0   0          66    47   75.3   55  27     24      5  23 71          2        1       308   4    0   2.87  

Being an Izzy fan sometimes reminds me of me being a republican. Sometimes I am so proud but other times he does something so embarrassing and stupid that I want to strangle him and act like I never had anything to do with him.    

BENCH (honorable mentions)Year  G   AB    R    H   2B 3B  HR  RBI  SB CS  BB  SO   BA   OBP   SLG

Rex "Hurricane" Hudler 1991 101  207   21   47  10  2     1     15    12   8    10   29  .227    .260   .309  

I was young and the Cardinals were pretty weak. I was a slow white kid looking for a speedy white role model...Rex was fast (although his numbers don't show it, or did he think he was fast?)  so I liked him...and he had a life size poster night. He is a funny guy though and he tells some funny stories on sports radio when anyone gives him a chance.

Tim Jones 1988  31   52    2     14    0   0      0      3      4    1   4      10  .269    .321  .269

Tim Jones has the distinction of being the only Citadel graduate with a professional skate boarding contract to play for the Cardinals. I am not making that up. He now owns and operates a BBQ restaurant in     Little Rock, AK.        

Vince Coleman 1990 124  497   73   145  18  9     6   39      77   17  35   88  .292  .340  .400

I loved Vincent Van Go almost as much as he loved launching fireworks at children.

Mark Whitten 1993 152  562   81   142  13  4     25 99      15    8   58   110 .253  .323  .423  

He hit 4 homeruns in a game and you didn't .

Mike Laga 1988 41   100     5     13     0  0       1  4        0     0   2      21  .130  .147  .160  

Hit a foul ball out of Busch. Wore a pink shirt for his 87 Topps pic. Some say hack, I say ICON.

So Taguchi 2005 143  396  45  114   21  2       8  53     11  2   20      62   288    .322  .412  

Was one of the nicest ball players I have ever met in person. The Julio Franco of Japanese players.

Ron Gant 1996 122  419  74  103  14  2       30 82     13  4  73       98  .246  .359  .504

This one time I was at my buddy Jon K's house in 1996 and Ron Gant was up to the plate and the announcer said "the pitcher is throwing his 100th pitch of the night" and I looked at Jon and said Ron is going to hit this one out. And he did.

Reggie Sanders 2004 135  446   64  116  27  3      22  67     21 5 33      118  .260  .315  .482

Reggie was awesome. We wouldn't have had the opportunity to be swept by the Red Sox but for Reggie's performance in the post season of 04. As you can tell, unlike TLR, I like black ball players.

George Hendrick 1980 150  572   73  173  33  2      25 109   6   1 32         67  .302  .342  .498

On July 4th 1980, the day I first graced this planet, George hit a walk off homer in extra innings to win the game, I believe the final was 1 to 0. Ahhh, small ball.  

Honorable other mentions...Joe McEwing, Stubby Clapp, Bo Hart, Scotty, Jimmy, Sweet Lou, Mabry, Julian Tavarez (the other Bat S!@# Crazy candidate) Enos (even though he is a racist, him and my grandpa are the only racists I allow myself to love in spite of their ignorance),  Eck, Larry Walker and Will Clark.

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That is definately a personalized list...
If I were to come up with something like this just from the players that played since I've been watching baseball (1988), it would look a little something like this:

1B - Albert Pujols
2B - Jose Oquendo
SS - Ozzie Smith
3B - Scott Rolen
 C - Mike Matheny
LF - Vince Coleman
CF - Jim Edmonds
RF - Tom Brunansky

Bench - Joe McEwing
        Rex Hudler
        John Mabry
        Tom Lampkin
        Willie McGee
        Craig Paquette
        Placido Polanco

SP - John Tudor
     Matt Morris
     Bob Tewksbury
     Darryl Kile
     Chris Carpenter

LHP - Ken Dayley
      Steve Kline
RHP - Julian Tavarez
      Mike Perez
      Mike Timlin
      Ryan Franklin

CL - Lee Smith

Honorable Mentions (by position):
Gregg Jefferies, Fernando Vina, Edgar Renteria, Fernando Tatis, Yadier Molina, Ron Gant, Ray Lankford, Felix Jose, Joe Magrane, Tony Fossas, Al Reyes, and Tom Henke

"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Feb 27, 2008 2:51 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

oops..
that's 27 players, oh well.
"Ding-dong the wicked witch is dead!" - Wayne Hagin after the cardinals snapped a losing streak

by The Ghost of Todd Burns on Feb 27, 2008 3:53 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Ok
I'm not doing anything right now, so I'll bit.  Only guys I've seen play, and who I liked.

C Yadi
In my family we always pick a player before the season and this year he's my guy.
1b Albert the Great
Game 4 blast off Lidge is one of my favorite moments in sports.
2b Fernado Vina
Only because since I've started watching the cards he's the only guy who's been around that long
SS The Wizard
First cardinal I can really remeber cheering for
3b Scotty Ro
My favorite cardinal for the time that he was here.
OF Larry Walker
Got to meet him once when he was with the Rockies and liked him alot.
OF Hollywood
Need I say more
OF Ray Lankford
Didn't really like Ray that much, but it just won't feel right if I didn't have him starting.

Pitchers
DK
Matty Mo
Carp
Sup
Bud Smith

Relief Pitchers
Kline
Tavares (sp)
King
Izzy
Wainwright
Tyler Johnson

Bench
Big Mac
Will Clark
Reggie Sanders
Mike Matheny
Aaron Miles (just for you all at VEB)

Not a fan of Troy Glaus

by gibbyfan on Feb 27, 2008 12:11 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

All time team and their years.
Lineup
C Ted Simmons 1977
1B Mark McGwire 1998
2B Rogers Hornsby 1924
SS Ozzie Smith 1987
3B Scott Rolen 2004
LF Albert Pujols 2003
CF Jim Edmonds 2004
RF Stan Musial 1948

Bench
Mike Matheny 2003
Red Schoendienst 1953
Ken Boyer 1960
Edgar Renteria 2003
Enos Slaughter 1942
Lou Brock 1967
Joe Medwick 1937

Starters
Bob Gibson 1968
Dizzy Dean 1934
Mort Cooper 1942
Chris Carpenter 2005
John Tudor 1985

Relievers
Bruce Sutter 1984
Jason Isringhausen 2005
Lee Smith 1991
Steve Kline 2001
Silver King 1888

This was mostly based on my knowledge of Cardinal players and some quick research on baseballreference.com. I mostly chose players based on their individual season performance, though some players made it in for other reasons. This team is built like an all-star team, only 10 pitchers, though those guys could probably slug it for an entire season. Silver King is in the pen as the ultimate rubber armed long reliever/spot starter, though he probably ought to be in the rotation. I just couldn't bear to see Carp go. As for the lineup, it lacks a leadoff man, but I don't know who to take out for Brock. Pujols? McGwire? Edmonds? Well, it's not like that lineup would really NEED a leadoff man; they'd still score a million runs. And Brock would be the ultimate pinch runner.

I'm open to suggestions.

"Jumpy, jumpy, jumpy, fall!" - Bob the King

by bobtheking on Feb 27, 2008 4:56 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

simple
1964's infield were all all-star starters; all i add is stan.

by sportsman on Feb 27, 2008 9:25 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

not exactly what I had in mind.
Its easy to pick the "best"...i was looking more for "favorites". If I was doing a list of most hated it would include Manny Aybar, Todd Zeile and Enconarcion (sp?)to start...and J.D. Drew.

by birdsonbat on Feb 27, 2008 9:42 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Favorites
Here are my favorite players since I started following baseball (1996. Yeah, yeah.)

C Tom Pagnozzi: When I was nine or so my mom always used to buy me a pack of cards when we went to games, even though I was more into basketball then. I got a lot of Pags. He also wins because, of all the no-hit catchers the Cardinals have had since I started being a fan, I knew the least about baseball when he played. Heh.

1B Mark McGwire/Albert Pujols: It's a favorite list, so no chance I only pick one. Watching McGwire hit 70 in Busch is one of my all-time baseball moments and will be forever. I remember not being able to pronounce Albert's name in 2001. I learned it quick.

2B Delino DeShields: I remember him always getting harrassed in his two years here, but I liked him (once again, because I had gotten a DeShields card as a first grader out of a pack of old cards awarded for my good classroom behavior.) And how nice would it be to have a second baseman who could throw up a 110 OPS+? Or a 70 OPS+?

3B Scott Rolen: By the time I get old and prone to exaggeration it is going to sound, to my grandchildren, like Scott Rolen, when throwing the ball, was putting his first baseman in mortal danger. I've never seen someone more defensively dominant--he could, can do things that seem completely absurd until you see it happen yourself.

SS Ozzie Smith: Who doesn't love Ozzie?

LF Ray Lankford: I got into god knows how many arguments as a thirteen or fourteen year old rooting for Ray Lankford in Busch Stadium. My all-time favorite player. Maybe if The Russ had put him on the Series roster instead of Marlon F. Anderson or F. Roger Cedeno it wouldn't have been such a debacle.

CF Jim Edmonds: My second favorite center fielder ever to be traded by the Cardinals to the Padres. If there was any justice in the world the Cardinals would have won the series in 2004 and his back-to-back NLCS saves would have gone down in history.

RF J.D. Drew: Dreeeeeeeew. Remember his 2001? Look at that first half.

SP Rick Ankiel: Gotta fit him in somewhere.

RP T.J. Mathews: Back when we first started going to Busch I picked my favorite player the easy way: completely at random. Presumably he had a good day.

by DanUpBaby on Feb 27, 2008 11:32 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Who doesn't love Ozzie?
There's a guy who wears sunglasses at night that I'd like to introduce you to...

by Valatan on Feb 28, 2008 12:40 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

TLR
You beat me to it. Brilliant.

by birdsonbat on Feb 28, 2008 3:11 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

This is fun.
C - Tony Pena - he made catching look cool.  I also loved watching him and Oquendo warm up before games.  Pena stood on home plate while Oquendo was at the right field pole... all on a line.
1b - Pujols - I remember my dad telling my brother and I that we have to check out this new guy who's raking in spring training.  After 10 minutes my brother says, "are you kidding me, our next star is going to be named Poo Holes?"  But hey, he's panned out ok.
2b - Tommy Herr - 100 rbi's for a pre-steriod era second basemen?  Of course, he was hitting behind Coleman and McGee... but still.
SS - The Wizard - does anyone remember when he was on Johny Bench's The Baseball Bunch?  My brother and I ran out right after the show and started throwing a tennis ball against a brick wall.
3b - Rolen - so whatever happend to Hee Sop Choi?
OF - Jimmy - every outfielder will now be compared to Jimmy.
OF - McGee - I named my fish after him
OF - Ankiel - Here's to hope!

SP - Gibby - feared by all
SP - Andujar - he was crazy! I remember he killed the toilet in the KC club house after game 7... and was never heard from again.
SP - Jose Jimenez - well for two games anyway.  I was at the game where he no-hit the D-backs.  My wife was angry cause I wanted to rush back to the hotel so we could see the highlights on sportscenter.  His next outing was also against the D-backs but in Stl.  I think he one-hit them that game.
SP - Carpenter
SP - Ankiel - hey, it's my list... Man, he was the next ___!

bench:

  • Oquendo - when he signed with the Cardinals I couldn't believe that we had the two best defensive shortstops in baseball.
  • Super Joe - I think he could have been our Biggio if he could have played 2b every day.
  • Tito Landrum - I always thought he should be starting, though I don't know over whom.
  • Will the Thrill - Still wish he'd have played the next year for us.
  • Ceasar Cedeno - as great a trade-deadline as Will the Thrill
  • Glen Brummer - what other back-up catcher steals home?
  • Big Mac - I wasn't going to add him to the team... but just so he could have a final at bat without being pulled for a pinch hitter who everyone knew was going to bunt... for goodness sake!
bullpen:
  • Ray King - funniest shape ball player ever
  • the Mad Hungarian - tried to knock down the girl ball player that attended the old-timers fantasy camp.  Gotta love it.
  • Steve Kline - kind of gross, but you knew the lead was safe.
  • Eck - sure, he was our closer, but since it's my list and he started for awhile, I'll throw him in as a long-reliever.
closer:
- Bruce Sutter - he could have been any of my uncles... but there he was throwing that nasty pitch.

by Birdos in Mexico on Feb 28, 2008 4:03 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Favorite Team
C-Oquendo
1B-Oquendo
2B-Oquendo
3B-Oquendo
SS-Oquendo
OF-Oquendo
OF-Oquendo
OF-Oquendo

Bench
Oquendo
Oquendo
Oquendo
Oquendo
Oquendo

Pitcher
Oquendo

by Jumsy on Feb 28, 2008 6:36 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

For real now
C-Matheny
1B-Pujols
2B-Vina (loved the unconventional double play running the runner from first back and then throwing)
3B-Pendleton
SS-Ozzie
OF-McGee
OF-Brian Jordan
OF-Edmonds

Bench
Vince Coleman
Mark Whiten
Placido Polanco
Oquendo
Yadi
Brendan Ryan

SP
Wainwright
Matt Morris
Bob Tewksbury
John Tudor
Kile

RP
Kline
Lee Smith
Sutter
Izzy
Todd Worrell
Dan Quisenberry

by Jumsy on Feb 28, 2008 6:42 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Old Post...
...But this is one my favorite exercises, so I'll jump in anyway!

MGR: Billy Southworth (Newest Cardinal HOFer!)
C:  Simmons
1b: Pujols
2b: Hornsby
3b: Rolen
SS: Ozzie
LF: Musial
CF: Edmonds
RF: Slaughter

Bench: Lankford, Cepeda, McCarver (i think i just threw up in my mouth), Red, Boyer, McGee (my first favorite  Cardinal, so he's on!)

Rotation: Gibby, Carp, Dizzy and Daffy, Kile (sentimental pick, he's always on my team)

Pen: Smith, Sutter, Izzy, Todd Worrell, Tudor (non technically a bullpenner, but this is my team dammit!), Kline (just to give Southworth the finger)

"Your Holiness, I'm Joseph Medwick. I, too, used to be a Cardinal."-Joe Medwick, to Pope Pius XII.

by redbirdnation8206 on Mar 2, 2008 9:19 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

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