Bill James on Craig Biggio

by kindred on Feb 26, 2008 7:48 PM EST

A nice little article in Slate, about how Biggio was one of James' favorite players for years before the sheen wore off. Money quote:

"I'll still say today, if there was a draft and you could look ahead and say, "OK, that guy's going to be Ken Griffey, that guy's going to be Frank Thomas, that guy's going to be Juan Gonzalez, that guy's going to be Tom Glavine, that guy's going to be Craig Biggio," just give me Biggio and I'll take my chances. Maybe that's not what the numbers say is the right answer, but Biggio was the guy who would do whatever needed to be done. Makes it a lot easier to build a team.

And then the story went on a little too long. You ever go to a movie, it' s pretty good for about an hour and a half but then the story is over but it's like the director can't find the ending so it goes on for another half-hour looking for some way to tie things together? That's kind of Biggio's career; it was over, and then it went on for quite awhile."

It's a nice bit of perspective on Biggio, from the obvious perspective of a non-partisan baseball fan. I've never especially liked Biggio, probably because he killed the Cards too many times through sheer peskiness, but I've grown to appreciate him a bit more after reading it.

My favorite Biggio moment is still having him get thrown out at second trying to stretch his 3,000th hit from a single to a double, but he really was a good player for a long time.

http://www.slate.com/id/2184797/nav/tap3/

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1997

His '97 season was probably one of the best seasons ever by a baseball player. 146 runs? ZERO double plays grounded into? .415 OBP. 34 HBP. Holy $#!?. For a 5'9" player from Seton Hall, he turned out pretty fair.

by sdangler on Feb 26, 2008 8:56 PM EST 0 recs

What was he supposed to do

when he realized he had a shot at 3000 hits? Retire so James wouldn't be disappointed in him? I love Bill James, but if he can't understand why Biggio ended his career they way he did ...

by MdRedbirdFreak on Feb 26, 2008 9:11 PM EST 0 recs

half hour too long?

I guess.

PErsonally, I believe the only time you really can look at a player and say they've played too long is when they're being paid like a top-tier player for too long.

I expect Soriano's contract will be one of those by the time he's 39 and still making 15M or so a year. Some of the other players with huge contracts won't be that good when they're 38, 39, 40, 41, whatever.

Craig Biggio was never a guy I considered overpaid (within the context of baseball anyway). His last four years, he received a total of 15.1M.

Now, having said that, his last two years were pretty bad. For a guy with a .363 career OBP, he had the last two years as: .306 and .285.

Craig Biggio is one of those guys that you don't comprehend how great he is by watching any single game he played in. He never hit 500 foot home runs, he never knocked in 100 runs, in fact, he never really SEEMED like a super-speedy guy, but he did lead the league in stolen bases one year.

When you look back at his career though, the way he was able to contribute, exactly as previously stated, simply by giving the team what it needed. Sometimes that meant him hitting in RBI situations, sometimes that meant batting lead-off or 2nd. Sometimes that meant catching, sometimes center field, sometimes 2nd base. His role changed all the time. What stayed the same? The man was a hit-machine, got on base very consistently, and was able and willing to do whatever his team needed. I whole-heartedly agree with James that Biggio was a great player.

There is also no taint of steroids on him whatsoever.

He's a definite HoFer in my book and I think he'll be judged by most as being one of the most dominant players of the 1990s and more important to those Astros teams than Bagwell.

by mtalken on Feb 26, 2008 9:31 PM EST 0 recs

As a long time fan of both

Craig Biggio and Bill James I'd say that this is where the stats revolution and the old time observational appreciation of the game meet. Some of Biggio's ability, his obp for instance is easily appreciated by James and his statistical analysis. Others, his defensive competence at three positions, his stolen bases, his "intagibles" are not. I also would be glad to start my team with Biggio and I am astonished to hear that Bill would do what's "not what the numbers say is the right answer."I'm also pleased because I would also take him over those guys and a bunch of other guys who test out statistically as better players than him. I am jealous of the Astros fans who have been able to appreciate this guy for twenty years. He has helped his team win ball games in more ways, for a longer time than any player I can think of.

by easy on Feb 26, 2008 9:38 PM EST 0 recs

Players playing too long...

Personally I don't think you can play too long. If a major league baseball team feels you add value to the organization and offers you a contracts and you WANT to play, there is no reason to say no. No your career, not how it will look when you end on a Willie Mays note, not nothing.

Major league baseball is experienced by a select amount of people for a very select amount of time. One should be so blessed to get the opportunity, and one would be an idiot to turn it down for a legacy.

You leave baseball 20 years before the retirement age, and when they won't let you play anymore you can remember it fondly, but I can't imagine the feeling of a texas league single loses its spark.

Family? Fine. Injuries? Fine. Numbers? I don't think so.

by bretsyboo on Feb 26, 2008 10:04 PM EST 0 recs