will necessitate even more action to remove our outfield glut, will whine and cry about his contract, and will be terrible enough in the field that I can see him posting the exact same WAR as ludwick, just for about twenty to sixty times the salary.

I’d take Sheets over Manny any day of the week. I don’t know how you figure Andy SONNANSTINE’s value to be nearly equivalent to a healthy Sheets though. Sheets’ 2008 ERA/FIP: 3.09/3.38, Sonnanstine’s 2008 ERA/FIP: 4.38/3.91.

Manny Ramirez was a 6.5 value win player last year. 1.2 in 2007. 3.9 in 2006. I don’t see how he could possibly be worth 6 next year. That said, we don’t have enough money for him anyway. We have plenty of ML caliber outfielders. Ankiel, Ludwick, Rasmus, Schumaker, Barton, Duncan, Mather. We don’t need to try to outbid the Dodgers and end up paying $20 million for another, who will turn 37 in May.

… don’t forget that Luddy is still under team control and fairly cheap (i.e. below market) for 3 years. so you’re losing a whole season if you trade him and sign Manny. yes, i know you get Sonnastine for several years.

i have no idea what kind of deal Sheets is gonna get at this point, but i’d be willing to bet that the AAV is close to $10mn less than Manny.

Yes, yes he was. He was a 3-3.5 WAR pitcher last season.

The Cards have plenty of outfielders and can get enough production out of their 7 headed monster out there.

However, the rotation is a house of cards (no pun intended). Besides Wainwright, there are 4 question marks. Can Wellemeyer have another fine year after being a poor relief pitcher his whole career? Can Lohse conquer his peripherals and have another good year? Can Pinata pitch at all? Can Carpenter stay healthy? If they bring Sheets aboard, sure, he adds another question mark…but he’s also really f’ing good, certainly better than Lohse, Wellemeyer, and Pinata. It’s certainly a risk, but it injects new talent into a rotation that could just as easily flop as flourish.

If we sign Manny, its not even a sure thing that the Cards could trade for a major league ready starter. Then we would be stuck with umpteen outfielders. On a personal note, I hate Manny. If we’re gonna sign him, why not just sign Bonds? He’s still playing apparently.

For future reference, his name is spelled Andy Sonnanstine

That’s all I’m gonna say

Mediocre outfielder with an aging but formidable bat? – Well we could use the bat, but the last thing we need another outfielder especially for the money he wants and the baggage he posesses or…

A number 2 – 3 SP who has a bit of a history on the DL and will send draft picks to a div rival.

I say take SHEETS

Sheets, no Manny here!

I live up near Boston and this guy is money. Big game player. Smokes the ball and puts fans in seats. Puts the fear of God into the opposing pitcher. I’d love Manny (and Sheets). He clearly can have an attitude and I think he overplayed his hand with Boston, but there was a lot of angst for years between him and front office. Don’t think he will get anywhere near the deal he wants, but if you can get him for $60-65 million for three years with a fourth year option in the middle of Albert’s prime I’d do that. Yankees, Red Sox, Angels, Nationals appear out of hunt. So only team with deep pockets are the Dodgers who want 2/45 with an option.

I agree you need a get out of jail card on a long term deal and that he might start deteriorating sooner than we think, but he is awesome when he is on and next to Albert may be the only one in baseball who can pick up a team and carry it on his back for weeks at a time.

I’d put up with his defense for that kind of output. Signing him means you are done except for scrap heap and rehab projects but I’d like Ankiel, Ludwick, Pujols, Ramirez, Glaus in the middle of our lineup.

Only if he has incentives similar to the Randy Johnson contract. I can live with promising 5-6 million, but require him to pitch 160+ innings before you give him another cent.

Ben is still (comparatively) young. Maybe he comes to the Cardinals, similar to Lohse’s situation last year, proves his health, and then cashes in the following season?

If we get deeper into the offseason and no one has picked him up. He might not like it, but he is perceived as a health risk. He’s probably worth $15M if he pitched a full season. But he doesn’t do that very often, does he?

if the yankees sign manny? that just wouldn’t be fair