Thought for the Day

by JShell73 on Aug 3, 2007 11:34 AM EDT

With the recent news of Johnny Damon wanting to play every day and his recent lack of playing time, does anyone else think he'd be a decent fit for the Redbirds? He's owed 13 mill a year for 08 and 09. I'm fairly sure he'd pass through waivers. Depending on the deal(and they're history) the Yanks would probably pick up some of his salary. The Cards have some of the bullpen help that the Yanks are seeking. He's played all three outfield positions. So playing left field when Edmonds plays center, and centerfield on days Edmonds' days off, could be a possibility. And we'd pick up speed which we seem to be lacking and it would give us a leadoff hitter.

I know it's probably just pipedreams since the Yanks probably wouldn't do it but just bored on a Friday and throwing stuff out there to discuss.

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A lovely thought

but the Yanks probably wouldn't go for it. But they could use bullpen help. Who knows?

by cardsgirl95 on Aug 3, 2007 12:11 PM EDT reply actions

i dont get to see the yankees play

much but why is he not playing for them.

HURRY BACK CARP AND MULDER

by LaRussa4President on Aug 3, 2007 12:24 PM EDT reply actions

Well

Let's run down the case here. The Yankees have been using Damon considerably in the DH spot this season, with that spot in jeopardy with Giambi returning from the Dl, they just might not have room for Damon. Cabrera by all accounts has done a very nice job in center for the Yankees since being called up, and of course comes at a much lower price. With the Yankees philosophy to hoard their prospects you have to wonder if they will continue with their philosophy and allow their young players to take time away from their veterans. If thats the case than perhaps the Yanks would part ways. The next question is does he fit the Cards organizational philosophy. As Lboros Pointed out earlier their is a limited amount of payroll flexibility for the coming year, and we already have a high priced, albeit some what ineffective Center fielder. TLR did state recently however that he had considered using Edmonds in right field next year in hopes of a Griffey like return to productivity. Which would leave JuanE the odd man out. If a salary dump for JuanE can match the salary taken on for Damon, then, perhaps its a distant possibility.

by Hammondsbird on Aug 3, 2007 12:34 PM EDT reply actions

Juan

plays a decent center. I'd actually like to sign/trade for a big bat in right (or see if Ankiel if a viable alternative) and platoon juan/edmonds in center next year.

Damon would only help this team in one aspect: speed. And his defensive liabilities and diminishing offensive skills probably wouldn't make it worth it. He's also a heavy candidate for an Edmonds like drop off in the not too distant future -- the guy put his body through a lot in the field making up for his lack of an arm.

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Aug 3, 2007 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions

Damon

Is currently 33 and would be 35 when his contract ends after the 09 season.

And he makes 13 mill a year, which when he signed it was pretty hefty, but with crappy pitchers getting 10 mill without anyone blinking an eye, I really don't think it's that bad any more. And we'll give 15 mill a year to a pitcher that's injury prone. And if the Yanks picked up part of that, that's just gravy on top.

Also, while I'm not one of those Juan haters. I accept him for what he is. I never had dreams of him hitting .300 with 40 homers year in and year out for 5-6 mill per. But I also wouldn't be crushed if he was dealt.

by JShell73 on Aug 3, 2007 1:41 PM EDT reply actions

The problem is

that we already have a pretty good LF (offensively) who really isn't a fit for any other OF position and is blocked by another pretty good hitter at 1b. I don't see where Damon would fit.

I think it's very possible the Yanks will trade Damon but, with them in the race, I doubt they'd do it until the offseason b/c I don't think they could get a very good return for him during the season. If we offer a couple of relievers for Damon and expect them to eat some salary, that just isn't going to happen.

I should also add, since I didn't when this subject was first addressed, that I'm not sure why adding speed should be a priority. I realize faster players are better than slower players, ceteris paribus. But why should we seek out speed if it means sacrificing on-base ability or power? Why add fast players who have trouble getting on base or hitting the ball in the gap or over the fence? I know this doesn't directly address Damon, as he does have those abilities, but I'm not willing to concede that we have to add speed to our offense, unless it is in conjunction w/ the ability to get on base frequently or hit with power.

by chuckb on Aug 3, 2007 3:58 PM EDT reply actions

Speed

The idea of adding speed, as you say, doesn't make any sense if you're sacrificing other tools just to have it. However, the thing is, speedy players are extremely effective when used in the proper context. You ask why you should sacrifice power for speed, but the idea isn't to replace one with the other, it's to acquire the correct tool for the correct situation.

You obviously want any speedy player to get on base; his speed is useless if he can't get in a position to exploit it. But for a player who hits in front of your run producers, speed sort of replaces power. It creates the possibility of extra bases, but with the added benefit of pressure and distraction on the defense and pitchers.

I agree with you that speed shouldn't be the focus to the exclusion of all other skills, but to devalue completely is, I think, a bad idea.

To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 6, 2007 7:57 AM EDT up reply actions

I guess

I consider Damon's speed more of an upgrade for defense and I'd consider him the leadoff for next year since I don't see Eck coming back. For a team that just a few years ago used to pride itself on great defense, we have a horrible defense any more. Duncan, Ludwick, Taguchi, Kennedy are pretty much just bodies out there any more. I love Duncan as much as anybody and his defense has improved, but he really should be a fulltime 1B somewhere or DH in the AL. I know he's inexpensive but unless they're spending that money on quality pitching(which they aren't) what good is having players like that?

by JShell73 on Aug 3, 2007 8:12 PM EDT reply actions

Duncan?

I know he's inexpensive but unless they're spending that money on quality pitching(which they aren't) what good is having players like that?

What good is having players like...Chris Duncan? His .314 EqA in his second full year is pretty damned good. His OPS+ is 142. And as shaky as defensive statistics are, his FRAA is +1. He'll never be any better than average out there, but that's why he's in left field.

It's hard to fault management for not spending money on quality pitching, given that there wasn't really any last offseason to begin with.

by jdub176 on Aug 4, 2007 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions

No duncan because our pitching is bad

is like cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Duncan and Pujols are the core of the Cardinals offense.

Future Redbirds

by azruavatar on Aug 4, 2007 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions

Lineup

I like this lineup for next year...

CF Damon
RF Edmonds
1B Pujols
LF Duncan
3B Rolen
C Molina
SS Ryan
2B Miles/Kennedy

I know it is longshot that we would be able to unload JuanE and get Damon, But if we could get damon for day, Percival, Dennis Dove (young power arm that we could give up), and maybe another throw in like flores or Cate I wouldn't be that unhappy with what we give up.

Our pen wouldnt be hit that badly if we get Kinney back, Johnson and Cate/flores, franklin, thompson and izzy all come back next year. Add Chris Perez to that and I dont think our bullpen falters at all.

We give up a decent prospect in Dove and two guys that will help the Yanks now. I would do it.

Cards fan banished to NH

by t7rick on Aug 5, 2007 6:15 PM EDT reply actions

Damon

I'm going to have to pass on Damon. Not because I don't think he's a bad player; he does some things very well that probably could help this club out. However, the payroll situation the Cards find themselves in, to me at least, dictates that they can't really afford to take on another eight figure contract. I realize your proposal includes the Yanks picking some of his salary up, but I think that if you were going to have them pick up any meaningful amount, you would have to give up pretty decent value in return. You want to trade scrubs, you might still get them to bite, but you're going to have to foot the whole bill.

Also, just from a general perspective, I would prefer this team to avoid picking up any more pricey veterans who are at that point in their careers that they are probably due for a significant downturn. One or two of those guys, when you're close to being a big time contender, is fine. Where the Cardinals are right now, though, I think they need to focus on getting younger and playing for the future. I'm not sure that Damon would offer what they need right now.

To hell with your spoiled baby! I need those shoes!

by the red baron on Aug 6, 2007 7:32 AM EDT reply actions