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Game 83 Open Thread: July 6, 2007

Lowry

Maroth

8-6, 3.46

5-2, 5.08

Maroth's 3rd start w/ the Cards - 1 good one and 1 bad one - he's due for another good one tonight. Against lefties, the Giants are 5th worst in the NL in OPS. Unfortunately, Lowry's also a lefty and the Cards are 2nd worst vs. lefties. Oh well, I like a pitcher's duel.

As for the other Giants, it would be disingenuous to have a game thread that didn't have some mention of Barry Bonds' coming to town, hoping soon to break Hank Aaron's record. As of Thursday, he needed just 5 homers to break the record and, though it's unlikely to happen this weekend, it's possible.

A lot of stuff on the p-d site re: Bonds, if you're interested. Clay Davenport of Baseball Prospectus has it at 1 in a million that he breaks the record tonight, 184 out of a million that he does it tomorrow, and 1410 that it happens on Sunday. See here: "I'm betting he sits one of the 3 out. No word on lineups yet but it wouldn't surprise me if he sits tonight w/ Maroth on the mound."

I'm tired of the Bonds is a cheating jerk stuff and I didn't want to get into another discussion of McGwire so I decided to devote this game thread to Hank Aaron. When he played his final game, I was just 6 years old so, clearly, I missed out on one of the (maybe, the?) greatest player(s) ever.

About Hammerin' Hank:

His career OPS+ was 155! He had 19 consecutive years with an OPS+ of 140! He hit 755 homers w/o ever hitting as many as 50 in a season. His peak was 47 in 1971. Certainly a tribute to his longevity! He was 30-30 (actually, 40-30) in 1963 before anyone ever knew what 30-30 was. According to baseball prospectus, compared to players throughout history translated to a 162 game season, his translated homers are 971! His career EQA is .326. From 1956-1968, his WARP3 was over 10 every year except 1, in 1966 when it was 9.9. It was 9.4 in 1955 and 9.9 again in 1969. He played, at various times and with varying success, 1B, 2B, 3B, LF, CF, and RF. He played in 2 World Series and the NLCS in 1969. Career postseason #'s -- .362 avg, 6 HR's in 69 AB's, OPS of 1.115! Talk about getting it done at crunch time!

Below are some links to some articles about Aaron and one to a great book about him. One of my favorite quotes is from Bud Selig who says, "I never saw a guy hit so many line drives all over the ballpark." Let's see, line drives everywhere, never hits 50 homers in a season, tremendous career - sound like anyone we know?

Below are links to 2 articles about Hank and the book link as well as a rather strange tribute by Delta Airlines.

Again, thanks a bunch to erik and azruavatar for all the help here.

Link to msnbc article

Link to article from Columbus Dispatch.

Hank on Delta Airlines

Hank Aaron and the Home Run that Changed America

Aaron's Baseball-reference page

Aaron's Baseball Prospectus page

BTW, I hope when Bonds comes to the plate tonight, Cardinal fans give some thought to Ryan Franklin and Troy Cate! To err is human. To forgive, divine.

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Although you wanted to keep it decent
We'd be remiss if we didn't consider this article from America's Finest Sports News Source.

by liam on Jul 6, 2007 5:16 PM EDT reply actions  

only 69 playoff ABs in 23 years!
I guess that shows how many poor teams he played with (especially late).  And only 1 MVP.

by redrey on Jul 6, 2007 5:29 PM EDT reply actions  

there's a great what-if
discussion at the hardball times about signing negro league players- the braves apparently were the first to negotiate with willy mays, but wouldn't pay him the $15k he asked for to sign.  Willy went to the giants, and 2 years later the braves signed Aaron.

Aaron and Mays could have played in the same outfield!

Anyway the consensus is that there would have been a lot more post-season play for the braves if that happened ;)

Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Remember,
there were no "playoffs" until 1969... the only "post-season" was The World Series! "Post-season" counting stats should always be looked at with that in mind. Guys like Derek Jeter have had a lot more opportunity to rack up "post-season" numbers because they play many more "post-season" games.

"Hammerin' Henry" just went out there and hit his 40 or so homers year after year after year after....

I don't give a rip about steroids; I don't want Barry Bonds to break Hank's record because I just don't LIKE Barry Bonds!!!

"In this game, don't nobody know nuthin' about nuthin'." -- attributed to Lawrence Peter "Yogi" Berra

by The Ol Goaler on Jul 6, 2007 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thank you for the history lesson!
It's difficult to imagine a maximum 7-game post-season prior to 1969.

by redrey on Jul 6, 2007 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Amen Brother! Preach On!

As a child of the seventies, I remember 3 guarantees about Hank - he was going to hit the ball hard, he was going to play the game the way it should and he would be humble about it.

There's ALOT to like about that!

by Hinkster on Jul 6, 2007 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

very good point goaler
and i really think that is a lot of the reason bob gibson is so well thought of still, more than 30 years after retirement

the things he accomplished in those 9 world series starts, when he went 7-2, (with many arguing it could easily have been 8-1, if not for game 7, 1968) plus 92 k's in 81 innings, the people who saw him do that will always consider gibson the best big game pitcher they ever saw

Pujols is the greatest Cardinal in my lifetime.

by bigcardsfan5 on Jul 7, 2007 2:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

I love
how the delta airlines thing is clearly a way of them saying "Bonds doesn't deserve the record." Obviously, they don't come out and say it, but if you read those quotes, you know that's the point.
On with the youth movement!

by aet15 on Jul 6, 2007 5:36 PM EDT reply actions  

erik
the link to the CD article is broken...
Just remember -- if the world didn't suck, we would all fall off

by RosevilleRedbird on Jul 6, 2007 5:49 PM EDT reply actions  

20-14
i guess the twins missed a point after TD attempt or failed to complete a 2-pt conversion huh?

Jeez that is a ridiculous score.  That was the 1st game of a doubleheader too.  Both bullpens should be pretty taxed tomorrow.

"The right-hander is throwing up in the bullpen." -Mike Shannon

by DJ87 on Jul 6, 2007 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not to be a d!ck
but only Cali could make the team that scored 20 runs worry by giving up 4 over an inning pitched late.

by Harknights on Jul 6, 2007 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Garland's game score
-11
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jul 6, 2007 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

5 errors...
and only two unearned runs.  Way to minimize the damage!

by tinstl on Jul 6, 2007 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great topic
Henry Aaron  deserves to be remembered as a player who enriched the game.  I saw a lot of Aaron's career, and he's from my hometown, so he got a lot of play in the local press.

Aaron was everything his stats indicate - an extremely consistent hitter with power, dangerous in any situation. Also, as far as an outsider could tell, a good teammate.

As for "playoff ABs" - for most of his career the only playoffs were the Series, and the Braves were only rarely good enough, but 24 All Star games shows where he stood.

by madridbend on Jul 6, 2007 5:57 PM EDT reply actions  

I hadn't realized until I just took a look at his
baseball-reference page what a consistent hitter for average he was. He was over .300 for all but one year from 1955-1965, plus several times after that. Career .305 hitter with two batting titles, including .355 in 1955.

by BTown Birds fan on Jul 6, 2007 6:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

lineups from Y!
SF:
Roberts CF
Winn RF
Durham 2B
Bonds LF
Molina C
Aurilia 1B
Feliz 3B
Vizquel SS
Lowry P

STL:
Taguchi CF
Ludwick LF
Pujols 1B
Encarnacion RF
Rolen 3B
Molina C
Miles 2B
Ryan SS
Maroth P

Now the story of a wealthy family who lost everything, and the one son who had no choice but to keep them all together...it's Arrested Development.

by Bowen on Jul 6, 2007 6:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Why is
Mike Maroth covered in a fine layer of fuzz?
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Jul 6, 2007 7:20 PM EDT reply actions  

He was
too afraid to get involved in the bar brawl Noah Lowry was in.
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jul 6, 2007 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Forget the 2-seamer
Duncan needs to teach Reyes this pitch
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jul 6, 2007 7:31 PM EDT reply actions  

That's hilarious
My dad used to throw that pitch to me when I was a kid and I had completely forgotten about it.

by Big Red on Jul 6, 2007 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

hmm
maybe that's the gyroball!

by tomsteele on Jul 6, 2007 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

More about Jackie Robinson
But this article that Aaron wrote about Robinson is really touching.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 7:50 PM EDT reply actions  

did u read all of those val?
there were 7 in all, and they are all very eye-opening, i was born in 1972, have never lived around racism, and had never really thought about what those men went through, i cant imagine ever treating someone that way because of the color of their skin, maybe i am naive, but i just dont think i could treat any human that way
Pujols is the greatest Cardinal in my lifetime.

by bigcardsfan5 on Jul 7, 2007 2:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Amazing that...
Aaron's OPS+ of 155 is 23rd on the career rankings list.  Bonds is the highest active player at 183, Ruth the highest ever as the only person above 200.  Our own Albert Pujols ranks second among active players at 169...well ahead of the man of the day himself.

stlfan

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/OPSplus_career.shtml

by stlfan on Jul 6, 2007 7:51 PM EDT reply actions  

about the last part....
"BTW, I hope when Bonds comes to the plate tonight, Cardinal fans give some thought to Ryan Franklin and Troy Cate! To err is human. To forgive, divine."

I might be stupid or I just missed something along the way....when did Cate get in trouble for steroids?

by Petkovsek on Jul 6, 2007 7:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Troy Cate
Mariners | Cate Suspended 15 Games for Steroids
Tue, 5 Apr 2005 10:36:27 -0700

ESPN.com reports Seattle Mariners P Troy Cate was suspended for 15 games for testing positive for steroids.

Alos, he's Mormon!

Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Jul 6, 2007 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pretty sure
he's been suspended twice!

by chuckb on Jul 6, 2007 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cheating Jerk Indeed

"I'm tired of the Bonds is a cheating jerk stuff"  

I'm tired of it too, Erik, but evidently Barry is not.  For goodness sakes, where's there's smoke there's fire and BB has been smoldering a long while.  There's a guy sitting in jail right now for those misdeeds.  I've never seen a public figure with such a total absence of humility.  

As the 'ol Goaler said, "I just don't like the guy!"

by Hinkster on Jul 6, 2007 7:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Looks like Bad Marquis...
has taken the hill against the Bucs...
Fire LaJocketty, Hire DePodesta!!!

by guayzimi on Jul 6, 2007 7:59 PM EDT reply actions  

too bad
the nats didn't bother to show up vs the brewers.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Awesome article...
about Mays and Aaron.

Thanks for the link!

stlfan

by stlfan on Jul 6, 2007 8:01 PM EDT reply actions  

man, i blacked out again!!!!!!
this is really pissing me off. i've gone from having every game, to maybe getting 2 a week. can anyone tell me what the deal is? is there a place where i can go to see what games are blacked out?

by ortic jones on Jul 6, 2007 8:06 PM EDT reply actions  

if duncan's in left
Roberts scores there.
.500 here we come...

by effin fisk on Jul 6, 2007 8:14 PM EDT reply actions  

if Juan see's the ball off the bat
he never reaches to begin with.

does he have some shades on? that ball really looked like it should have been caught. even Dan said so.

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

well guess what.......
Listening to the Memphis game A-rey -retires the side 7 pitches, THREE ground ball outs.  It took about 5 minutes.....

by jillsinmo on Jul 6, 2007 8:15 PM EDT reply actions  

Nevermind
it didn't go so well as the game progressed......

by jillsinmo on Jul 6, 2007 11:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

here comes 752
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 8:16 PM EDT reply actions  

i luv Pujols
that is all
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 8:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Maroth's not getting
the Glavine or Moyer strike zone early is he?

nice play scotty. way to get out of that inning only giving up 1 gents.

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 8:20 PM EDT reply actions  

Bonds grounded to pujols
albert stepped on the bag, and then threw home.  Molina and Rolen caught the runner in a rundown, and got the second out.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anyone else notice that
Brendan Ryan has the ugliest gameday photo in the world.
that's a fact.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 8:36 PM EDT reply actions  

dang
Jap is beating US 2-1 in the 6th right now.
blast.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 8:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Walking the leadoff man.........
Anyone know where to find out how many times Cardinal pitchers have started a defensive frame by walking the leadoff man? And where do they rank compared to other teams?

by fuegophil on Jul 6, 2007 8:40 PM EDT reply actions  

Twins scored 3 more in the top of the 1st
In the night part of the DH.  23 runs in 10 innings so far today.
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jul 6, 2007 8:43 PM EDT reply actions  

awesome
what is the record for runs in one day?

by tomsteele on Jul 6, 2007 8:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

The record for moat runs in a DH....
N.L.

43 Boston v. Cincinnati  Aug 21, 1894

A.L.

36 Detroit v. St. Louis (Browns) Aug 14, 1937

by Ignatius J Reilly on Jul 6, 2007 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mike Maroth wants to know why the hell
Noah Lowry's strikezone is 23 feet wide and his is 11.
Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2007 8:45 PM EDT reply actions  

that's what happens
when you play for the cardinals this year.  he better get used to it cuz it's not getting better any time soon.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

...careful
Now dont be gettin all uncomplimentary of the umpiring or Harknights will come on and start wagging the finger at you....they NEVER have a team preference, have transcended subjectivity as human beings and are totally unbiased and color blind...:-)
"I don't need a damn number to tell me the guy's no good right now!" Old Casey.... Pitching, base running and defense!

by cardschinmusic on Jul 7, 2007 4:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

no clue
who hardknights is, but john mcClain's daughter would kick his arse.  go see the darn movie, the previews don't do it justice.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 7, 2007 6:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nice
Popout the pitch after a walk.
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jul 6, 2007 8:47 PM EDT reply actions  

and the pitcher swings
on a 2-0 pitch after lowry walks ryan on 4 pitches.  I love it when our guys exercise good fundamentals.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bi-Polar Betty with 6 earned runs in 4.2 innings..
..before retiring from the game. It's July, it's hot and here's the reverting to form we've all been anticipating.

by Ignatius J Reilly on Jul 6, 2007 8:49 PM EDT reply actions  

maybe i'm drunk, but
4.2 innings with 6 ER doesn't sound terrible to me at this point.  It kinda reminds me of one of those nights when i said "huh, kip/wellemeyer isn't TOO terrible..."

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeeeeeah
You're drunk.  4.2 IP and 6 ER is equivalent to a 11.57 ERA.  Thanks for playing though!  (And when Wellemeyer gets 10 runs of support, 6 runs through 4.2 doesn't look bad because we're WINNING!)
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jul 6, 2007 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok
i realize that it's a terrible inning.  it was just a typical "our rotation is awesome" joke.  Even with everything that has happened to our team, I'm glad we don't have marquis (I doubt he would have had the same start for us he did for the cubs)

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

wow
wouldn't you love to have Bonds on your team where he is afraid to break the record on the road so he purposefully doesn't hit home runs when he has a chance to, even if it would help your team?

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 8:58 PM EDT reply actions  

gameday sez...
ball 3 on bonds = strike 3. i think.

by tomsteele on Jul 6, 2007 9:00 PM EDT reply actions  

yea
it was a nice curveball, but i thought it was a little inside.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

i was amazed
to see a called strike 3 on durham- no way he's gonna call strike 3 on bonds.  F*ing coward.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is one of my big rants
but I really don't see why they don't have a machine call the balls and strikes.  There really seems to be almost no logic against that.  

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 9:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

i dunno
i vehemently disagree with ESPN's K-Zone most of the time on borderline pitches.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've just always heard, on any conversation about
umpiring, that consistency is more important than accuracy.  A machine is going to be more consistent than a person, and not prone to giving favorable strike zones to all-stars.  

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bengie vs. Yadi
I think there should be a rule that brothers playing for opposite teams are allowed to get into a scuffle without getting thrown out of the game as long as no one else is involved.
You know, because they're family.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:04 PM EDT reply actions  

dude
bengie could totally melvin yadi.  We really don't want to see that...
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

no way bro
Yadi can break steel with his eyes.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just don't understand
why Albert absolutely insists on swinging at pitches 3-4 inches outside!  He's getting the Bonds treatment but he's not taking advantage of it, by being patient and walking.  He needs to take the All-Star Break off and get fixed at the plate!

by chuckb on Jul 6, 2007 9:10 PM EDT reply actions  

i think
it's because he knows who is hitting behind him, so he feels that if something is going to happen, he needs to do it.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

that, and
always taking the first pitch.  Pitchers have got the scouting report now; the first pitch is going to be grooved.  Take advantage of it, darnit!

I was so encouraged by his last series; he swung at the first pitch a couple of times and got a hit every time I saw him do it.  This at bat he took the grroved strike and then swung at the ball and GIDP.

Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

not to knock Albert
but how many times in the past two seasons has he looked at 1 or 2 good pitches to hit, then took a swing at a really bad pitch and gotten himself out?

because he just did it again.

ugh.

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Double Plays
who would have thought that ground balls could create so many double plays?  we should have ALL our pitchers try to induce grounders...

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Why can't Mlb.tv show clips of old baseball games
or highlights around the league or something during the break?  Just have a headline news thing going?  Is it necessary to have either ads or breakout going?

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 9:16 PM EDT reply actions  

because
people need to KNOW that they are watching mlb.tv.  it's advertising.  If they didn't do it, how would people using mlb.tv know about mlb.tv?

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Or pop it up in foul territory
whatever works for you.

Wouldn't it be nice to see Scotty's power outage end here?

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lowry so far
27 strikes, 27 balls.  let's be patient boys.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:20 PM EDT reply actions  

and those 27 strikes
are including the 15 or so balls that we've swung at and either fouled off or popped up.  grrr.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

oh, and
the 4 or 5 "gift strikes" that the home plate umpire has handed out...
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

this offense is making me sick
my head hurts.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

When he was asked for his opinion on the Aaron
record being broken, Al's response:

"records should be broken, but you have leaked grand jury testimony, that as far as you know is truthful, but it was illegally obtained, and the lawyer who leaked it accepted the maximum jail term"

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 9:23 PM EDT reply actions  

He attended
the Joe Morgan school of never answering a direct question

by FunkeeC on Jul 6, 2007 9:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

He should be a politician with that comment.
As I don't know anybody whose head, feet and hands started growing in their late 30's I don't need leaked grand jury testimony.

Aaron = Class

bonds = ASS

by Ignatius J Reilly on Jul 6, 2007 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bonds Schmonds
They should just induct McGwire, Sosa, and Bonds all in the same class of the Hall of Fame.  If one gets in, they all should (Especially since McGwire is "guilty" for not answering questions, whereas Bonds is ambigious even though there is a leaked testimony of him blabbing...)

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cubs
Bases loaded, 0 outs for Ramirez.  Still down 7-2, and it's the 8th, but still...

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:31 PM EDT reply actions  

2 straight sac flies,
Buccos lead safe at 7-4

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Classy or not
I like that we Boo Bonds.
hell, i'm booing him from my couch.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:35 PM EDT reply actions  

he should be batting next inning
that 2-2 pitch to durham was a strike.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

here comes 752
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:35 PM EDT reply actions  

ugh
Bonds is too good of a hitter to be fooled too many times in one at-bat

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

shhhhh
it's working
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

of course,
if umpires refuse to strike him out looking...

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Off topic former 2B update
Belliard 4-4 with a HR in a losing effort against Milwaukee

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:39 PM EDT reply actions  

i miss Gansta Luv
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Big Perm's
.298 avg. would be welcome in the 7 slot....

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok
are people booing Bonds for the walk? or our pitcher for the walk? (or the ump?)

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:40 PM EDT reply actions  

ballgame!
Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot, So?

by chuckb on Jul 6, 2007 9:41 PM EDT reply actions  

blacked out in Peoria....
was it a catchable ball? Shannon and Horton seem upset that he dropped it...

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

VERY
he jumped, but he didn't have to. hit the heal of his glove and he dropped it.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

definitely
he was drifting, got to it about halfway through the warning track and, inexplicably jumped, again, and had it bounce off his glove.  It's an error all the way -- definitely should have been caught.

by chuckb on Jul 6, 2007 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

so So has been watching
some Duncan outfield tape?

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

No
He's been watching too much So Taguchi tape.
Pujols currently < Career godliness.

by joker24 on Jul 6, 2007 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

be thankful
you're blacked out!  I paid $180 for the Extra Innings package to watch that shit!

by chuckb on Jul 6, 2007 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

dude you paid $180?
we only paid $160, and we didn't swich over to DTV, we kept Dish, and just added DTV for the EI package.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

"Blacked out in Peoria...."
If I were to write a book on my late teenage years, this would be the title.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2007 1:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

i luv our defensive specialist in center
hurry back Jimmy.

hurry back.

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:41 PM EDT reply actions  

Sigh
Think its time to hit the movies

by FunkeeC on Jul 6, 2007 9:42 PM EDT reply actions  

forget the movies
time to hit the scotch. sigh.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

ugh
that catch lacked honor.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:42 PM EDT reply actions  

to entice
Tomo Ohka to sign with the Cards?

/kidding

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

indeed
Time to try Chris Duncan in Center Field.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

hey
at least he would have gone crashing into the wall creating a huge dent.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

geez
I'm glad Duncan is on the bench.  He would be doing much worse than everyone else tonight against a lefty.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:46 PM EDT reply actions  

working the count
of course the Cards have worked Lowry for 60 pitches so far, so maybe we can chase the lefty in the 11th....

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

come on, now
We're all frustrated, but we can try to knock the pitcher out of the game WITHOUT actually trying to knock him out with the bat.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:49 PM EDT reply actions  

I know
our options are pretty limited in CF.  Any word on Spiezio?  Maybe it's time to try Juan in CF?

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

yea
i never minded when Juan was in Center Field.  He seemed to be pretty decent at it.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bonds is the only Giant
hitting over .280.  Cards need to win this series.  When he sits out it should be like a softball forfeit.

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:51 PM EDT reply actions  

Arod ties Lou Gehrig,,,,
...and "The Crimedog" with HR #493 tonight.

by Ignatius J Reilly on Jul 6, 2007 9:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Thome
hit number #485 tonight too. Really puts A-Rods awesomeness in perspective as he is only what? 32?

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

But A-Rod also
goes out in the field and almost never misses games, even though he doesn't really show up for the playoffs....

by jillsinmo on Jul 6, 2007 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thome
has played in the field for over 80% of his games.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2007 1:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

gooch
the next time someone tells me taguchi plays "great defense" or "is an underrated fielder" i am going to kill them

by bigmcq16 on Jul 6, 2007 9:55 PM EDT reply actions  

no
show them tape of him, hand them a sword, and hara-karii should commence

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

sure SO OLD you make that sliding catch
now that the game is over.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 9:58 PM EDT reply actions  

it wouldn't be so bad
except that it's the second ball in a week he's dropped at the wall.  For some reason that really, really makes me angry, notwithstanding the good season with the bat that he is having.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

wow
i cursed ludwick twice on that play.  he really showed me.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:01 PM EDT reply actions  

nice hustly LUD
but now they'll just walk Albert.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:02 PM EDT reply actions  

ohh
if he had been out at second in front of pujols. . .

by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2007 10:02 PM EDT reply actions  

any one know a good eye doctor
in the STL area? Albert's been missing a lot of pitches, and it looks like he can't pick up the ball very well. and it's not just tonight.

of couse now that i say this, watch him end his homerless streak.

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:04 PM EDT reply actions  

jesus christ
how many K's does he have this year?

by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2007 10:05 PM EDT reply actions  

surprisingly
that is just #37 in 301 ab's, putting him on track for about 7 over his career average for the season (67k's/600 ab's).
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

THAT WASN'T EVEN CLOSE!!!!
geez what's up with Albert tonight?
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:05 PM EDT reply actions  

Hooray!
i like juan.  sure, sometimes he looks "lazy", and sometimes he "grounds into a lot of double plays", but he is still pretty decent.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

He floats after the ball
it's kinda cute, except when it skips past him...

by jillsinmo on Jul 6, 2007 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

man
i want to see a cardinal just sit the bat on his shoulder the entire at bat.  i don't think he can throw 3 strikes out of 7 pitches.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:09 PM EDT reply actions  

Juan's double should have tied the score
nice double Juan.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:10 PM EDT reply actions  

credit where credit is due
Not a fan, but Juan has been the total offense for the last 14 innings.

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

quick cable question
on the radio broadcast Shannon has referred to a standing room only crowd at Busch...why then have they blacked out the game in Central Illinois?

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 10:10 PM EDT reply actions  

i think it's because
they wanted to save you guys from seeing SO play center.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

ha
well, mission accomplished.

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok
we gave Franklin an extension already, let's get started on Percival.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:17 PM EDT reply actions  

no seriously, here come 752
Percy will challenge him and loose most likely.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:17 PM EDT reply actions  

Good night Barry
tomorrow is another day.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Did anyone hear what Chipper Jones said....
...upon learning John Smoltz had been placed on the 15 day DL?

by Ignatius J Reilly on Jul 6, 2007 10:17 PM EDT reply actions  

when will they learn?
Thou Shalt NOT Steal On YADDA!
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:21 PM EDT reply actions  

freddy lewis
is a dead ringer for barry bonds circa 1992.  Wonder if he'll hit 800 HR?
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Buehrle
from ESPN's MLB Rumor Central:
Jul 6 - According to ESPN.com's Jayson Stark, the White Sox are reportedly marketing Buehrle aggressively, but teams are balking at the price -- three players with two being prime-time prospects.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:22 PM EDT reply actions  

blowin' up
Considering their pitching staff has given up 31 runs today so far (and the 2nd game of the double header is in the 3rd inning), they probably could use some pitching prospects.

by yorktro on Jul 6, 2007 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Here is the rest of what they say
Stark is also hearing that Boston might be getting back in on Buehrle and trying to expand the deal to include Julio Lugo.

According to the Chicago Sun-Times, the White Sox and Buehrle agreed on terms of a contract extension last week (four years, $56 million), yet the deal died because the White Sox would not grant him a full no-trade clause.

The White Sox gave Paul Konerko, Jon Garland and Jose Contreras full no-trade protection for the first year of their current contracts, with Konerko also getting limited trade protection after the first year. Buehrle has the same first-year trade protection, but general manager Ken Williams acknowledged there would be an 18-month window in the middle of the deal without trade protection. "I called [Buehrle] to let him know this is not an effort on our part to get some sign-and-trade deal," Williams said. "We're not going into this with that mindset. You always want to have flexibility in constructing a roster, but we wouldn't have gone into this with that mindset.

"I wanted to explain to him, just in case there was any question about our motivation."

But it's believed that if the White Sox and Buehrle don't come to an agreement soon, the White Sox will look to trade the 28-year-old left-hander before the July 31 deadline, with the Mets looking like the most interested suitor, the Sun-Times reports.

"I obviously have to go down the road of exploring all of our options and all our alternatives," Williams said.

The Cardinals, Braves and the Dodgers are also reportedly interested in Buehrle, who is set to become a free agent after the season.

A source told the St. Louis Post-Dispatch that talks with the Cardinals about Buehrle have been "ongoing." Anthony Reyes has been among the names mentioned in a possible deal.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

and
sorry if it's not new to you.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Let's Go BIRDS!
one run an inning here on out and we tie it up.  we can do it.

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:25 PM EDT reply actions  

7th inning features
Ryan -- OPS .724
Kennedy -- OPS .535
Taguchi -- OPS .726

The run expectancy matrix for this inning is about 0.000042 runs.

by Keep your hands off on Jul 6, 2007 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

so they boo Bonds, but not AK?
Ok, i get that. but seriously, AK is killing us. what a wasted at bat.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:27 PM EDT reply actions  

AK
At this point Tino Martinez looks like a awesome signing several years ago compaired to Kennedy. At least we got a little production from Tino.

Are they going to cut their losses with him soon and get rid of him or are we just stuck with him because of his multi million dollar contract?

by KYCards on Jul 6, 2007 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

2nd one i believe
damn big bucks. glad our money went there.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2007 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

2nd worst hitter in MLB
according to VORP.  He's 12.3 runs BELOW replacement level at the plate.  Only Dioner Navarro is worse.  

by chuckb on Jul 6, 2007 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

maybe we could get someone to spike his gatorade
the way the tigers did Neifi... arrange a little test, and it's cya next spring training buddy.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

finally found some one slower than YADDA
big brother Bengie. dude was out by 10 feet.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:34 PM EDT reply actions  

That's what I'm sayin!
IF those two fight, yadi will use his speed to beat his brother...

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

some of the most
useless ABs of the season tonight.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2007 10:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Albert
Man I wish Albert would just not go to the All-Star game and stay in St. Louis to rest his legs and study tons of tapes of his At-bats from 2002-2006.  He needs a rest.

by KYCards on Jul 6, 2007 10:43 PM EDT reply actions  

wow
troy cate can teach SO a thing or two...

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:47 PM EDT reply actions  

Well this was a pathetic display
the only people taht came to play today were the guys on the bump.

Juan gets the clutch hit, too bad Horton and Shannon have been ripping him all night for half-assing it after 2 fly balls in the first inning, which gave them 1 run.

Cardinals 1 - San Fransisco 0 - Juan/So -3.

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2007 10:58 PM EDT reply actions  

first Speezer sighting in two weeks
how's the finger Imperial?
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:58 PM EDT reply actions  

from Al
"Duncan on deck, the problem is that Just ties it."
WHAT is wrong with tying the game, Al?!?1?

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 10:59 PM EDT reply actions  

just so long as we're within slam range!!
or something.  I hate the pitcher change suspense.

Let's go dunc.

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

HEY DUNK
BREATHE dude. just RELAX & BREATHE.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 10:59 PM EDT reply actions  

kryptonite
it's a lefty, which means duncan can't possibly succeed.

how could he do worse than some of the other hitters? we don't sit pujols or rolen against righties, do we? i support la russa in general, but it's no good having your tied-for-the-leading hr hitter be a platoon player.

by willievinceterry on Jul 6, 2007 11:02 PM EDT reply actions  

see?
he can't possibly get a hit off a lefty.

by willievinceterry on Jul 6, 2007 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

dang.
ok, you heard it here second...

by Molina4MVP on Jul 6, 2007 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think they meant
an out by so. he's had a rough night at the office. man, that three-run error hurts.

by willievinceterry on Jul 6, 2007 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

OK SO,
make us forget that error.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 11:05 PM EDT reply actions  

good contact at least.
would have liked him to take a pitch at least against the new pitcher. but i guess if you see a pitch to rip, you see a pitch to rip.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2007 11:06 PM EDT reply actions  

SOOOO not clutch
yeah, i went there. this loss is on you SO.

and the ump not giving Maroth the same strike zone he gave Noah.

I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 11:07 PM EDT reply actions  

yall realize that edmonds doesn't make that catch
he plays so shallow that jimmy proabaly doesn't even get to that ball. so people saying "where's jimmy" should realize he doesn't make that catch and its three ER against maroth.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jul 6, 2007 11:08 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm going to disagree
not because Edmonds is fleeter of foot, but rather because of what So did.  He made a bad read on the ball off the bat and never really got under it.  If he had broken back on the ball intially when he should have, he would have been standing under the ball waiting for it to come down.  Instead, he didn't get a good jump and then didn't know where the wall was.  He jumped for the ball when he didn't need to and dropped it.

I still think Edmonds makes that catch.

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2007 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

you seriously think Jimmy wouldn't have
ran back and caught that ball? dude a healthy Jimmy would have had that with no problems. SO got spooked and jumped for no reason. this loss is on him.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 11:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jimmy
from three-four years ago would have. He's been pretty hobbled when he's been out there this year.
Boooo-urns.

by Alxfritz on Jul 7, 2007 1:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would have to agree
So didn't run into the wall he drifted into it. That's basic outfield stuff there.
  1. Find the wall.
  2. Find the ball.
Now Jimmy might have been playing at the Co-Ed line and would have had to run into the wall and would be out for the next 3 weeks...but he would have caught it.

by Harknights on Jul 6, 2007 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can't feel too horrible about that loss
they fought back in the 9th, and really, the difference was one boneheaded play.  That's way less depressing than watching the team punt the game.  

by Valatan on Jul 6, 2007 11:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah, I'm not too upset about
losing that one.  It's a little frustrating to look at it and see that the Giants really didn't have any 'earned' runs and the Cardinals lost but there were positives, especially Duncan getting a hit against a lefty.  Maybe Tony will pull his head out of his backside and let Dunc play against LHP.

Also, turns out Rolen's lineout was a bigger play than I thought it'd be.  That ball is a foot to the left or to the right and the run scores.

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jul 6, 2007 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

DUNK should START, not just play EVERY DAY
no exceptions. unless he needs a day off. he's the Cards second best hitter, and their second best power hitter. he SHOULD START EVERY DAY.
I'm going to go try to find a puppy and kick it. - Brad Thompson And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jul 6, 2007 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well
The deconstruction of Reyes looks complete. 4 2/3 IP and 6 ER with 3 HR. I bet teams can't wait to trade for him now.

On a possitive note. That Hoffpauir (sic) guy is all but yelling "Yeah I couldn't help but notice that you can use a good 2B. Well here I am!" Something to watch at AAA.

by Harknights on Jul 6, 2007 11:19 PM EDT reply actions  

consider it a revenge game
one of those HR's was a 3R shot by John Gall... meanwhile the redbirds are 2-1 when he starts, and that's what matters, right?

Meanwhile Joe Mather (playing in CF!) hit his 5th home run in 15 games at AAA (and almost has his batting average to .200 again).

Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jul 6, 2007 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I hated to see that.....
because he started the first inning 7 pitches, 3 ground ball outs.  Announcer described pitches as curve, slider, fastball and change up.  His control was definitely off, and he's actually had a pretty low walk rate even when he was here, so that is surprising.  The homeruns, well that's something he's always needed to work on. He hasn't started for awhile now, so I'm sure that doesn't help with being sharp on location.  I have every confidence that he'll figure it out and be just fine.  He'll probably be out of a Cardinal uniform before it happens, though.....

by jillsinmo on Jul 7, 2007 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

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