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Around SBN: Chan Sung Jung Wins Thriller Over Dustin Poirier

the merry merry month of may

may is in the books; the cardinals went 12-15, which is (ahem) their best month since last august, when they were 13-15. a few select statistical lines for the month, starting with you know who:

AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB | AVG OBP SLG
pujols 97 14 33  6  0  3 13 14 | .340 .421 .495

this is pujols' second consecutive month of sub-.500 slugging; prior to this season he had only slugged below .500 for two months in his entire career, july 2001 (his rookie season) and may 2002. the latter month was also the only month in albert's career in which his isolated power was less than .200 --- until this month, when he recorded the lowest monthly ISO of his life. (i'm not counting june 2006, most of which he spent on the disabled list with a strained oblique.) it was still a good month for albert --- he hit the ball consistently hard, and if he keeps it up i think the power numbers will follow.

AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB | AVG OBP SLG
edmonds 75 12 20  1  1  4 13  6 | .266 .317 .467

edmonds slugged over .450 for just the 3d time in his last 10 months of baseball. his 2007 rate stats to date (.245 / .313 / .388) aren't much different from where they stood as of june 1 last season ( .241 / .345 / .379). he's a month further removed from surgery and has regained his ability to drive the ball to right field. two weeks ago he appeared finished as a ballplayer, but over the last half of may he slugged .707. last year, edmonds went .268 / .355 / .537 from june 1 forward; the way he has looked the last two weeks, it's suddenly reasonable to hope that he might produce at a similar level the rest of this year.

AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB | AVG OBP SLG
eckstein 71  7 24  2  0  1  5  3 | .338 .382 .408
may 06 111 17 38  5  0  0  8  8 | .342 .405 .387
may 05 116 19 38  4  2  2 11 12 | .328 .386 .448

as you can see, may has been a good month for eckstein every year since he joined the cardinals. it was his best month since his concussion on june 15 of last season and the ensuing oblique injury in august; now he's battling a sore back, so it's fair to wonder whether may 2007 will be the start of an upswing or just a blip in a continuing downspiral.

AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB | AVG OBP SLG
duncan 73 15 17  4  0  5 11  9 | .233 .325 .493

he actually had a very good month going through the pittsburgh sweep --- .919 ops, led the team in rbis --- but then went 0 for the washington series and has been laid up with a bad knee since then. that knee is a very serious concern --- he was sent to the hospital for tests, and the quotes from team personnel in this morning's post-dispatch are not encouraging. so just as they're getting edmonds back, they might lose duncan . . . . it figures.

IP H BB SO W-L ERA WHIP
looper 33.2 39 14 20 3-3 5.35 1.574
april 2007 33 23 10 18 3-1 1.91 1.000

ulp. . . . . . which of these two months do you think will prove to be the more aberrant, when all is said and done? the best we can hope for is that they're both aberrant, and looper's era stabilizes in the low to mid 4s. but lookie here, this may split will make you feel better:

IP H BB SO W-L ERA WHIP
suppan 30.2 35 14 15 2-3 4.99 1.598
april 2007 42.1 43  7 22 4-2 2.55 1.181

by the time supps' four years in milwaukee are up --- by the time this year is up --- which of those two months will appear to be the aberrant one? ok, back to the cards' own troubles:

IP H BB SO W-L ERA WHIP
wainwright 27 39  7 17 3-2 5.00 1.704
april 2007 29.1 39 16 21 1-2 6.14 1.875

look at the vast improvement in the walk rate --- very encouraging. adam's batting average on balls in play remains freakishly high at .379, despite pretty ordinary batted-ball splits --- average line drive rate (18 percent), high groundball rate (48 percent). he's been keeping the ball in the park all season, so as long as he continues to do that and keeps his walks low, wainwright is going to be fine. he posted 3 quality starts in his 5 may outings.

IP H BB SO W-L ERA WHIP
thompson 31.2 38  7 11 3-1 4.26 1.547

man, but the cardinal pitchers give up lots of baserunners. thompson got sorta lucky last night, retiring 12 of the last 13 men he faced despite a number of well-hit balls. i will say that he looked impressive in working himself out of a 3d-inning jam last night, pitching very intelligently against the top of the rockies' order; once he got a big lead he stripped down the repertoire and just started chucking it in there, which is when the rockies began to hit the ball harder. in other words, the kid pitched to the situation; brainy.

IP H BB SO W-L ERA WHIP
isringhausen 10.2  4  3  9 0-0 0.00 0.656

opposing hitters batted .114 against izzy in may, and are at .147 for the year; he hasn't yielded a home run all season. the rockies were absolutely defenseless against him wednesday night. his only blown save came in a game the cardinals went on to win, and occurred on a wind-blown bloop double. where is the love?

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Thanks lboros
Lots of love here for Izzy. I feel bad for doubting him last year if it truly was injuries keeping the man down.

Very impressive turnaround.

by paCardsFan on Jun 1, 2007 9:00 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree
Give me a big plate of crow because I need to get to eating.

http://whiteyball.wordpress.com

by whiteyball on Jun 1, 2007 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I still say...
If he gets through June with a sterling ERA, even if saves are minimal, LaRussa puts him on the All-Star team. It just seems like something LaRussa would do.
"I don't believe what I just saw!" ~ Jack Buck

by itsalemmon1019 on Jun 1, 2007 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

At this point who else would be the Cards' AS rep?
None of the traditional stars seem to be putting up All-Star type years.  Molina is out.  Duncan's numbers, while impressive, are nothing earth shattering.

by bailorg on Jun 1, 2007 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don't know where he's at in the voting, but...
There's no way he doesn't take Pujols...deserving or not, LaRussa can't leave him off...he's too loyal.

by joeyart on Jun 1, 2007 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

Pujols is ahead by >100,000
  1. Pujols, A.    Cardinals    399,706
  2. Fielder, P.    Brewers    291,911
  3. Lee, D.    Cubs    224,165
  4. Garciaparra, N.    Dodgers    222,107
  5. Delgado, C.    Mets    218,647
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jun 1, 2007 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ya
Pujols is gonna make it on what I call the Darryl Strawberry Rule. He's a name, and he's mang--even though he's having a crappy-by-his standards year so far. But Pujols and Izzy...could be it.
"I don't believe what I just saw!" ~ Jack Buck

by itsalemmon1019 on Jun 1, 2007 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice
Work and good to see JimmE and Albert coming around. How about Scottie?

  Larry, last winter there was as you called it 'agent speak', that Mulder would be ready in June. Is there any word on his re-hab? How about Carp is he still on track for August?

by nybirdfan on Jun 1, 2007 9:10 AM EDT reply actions  

Scott had mild improvement
in May from April.

However, since the Milwaukee series:
.289
1 HR
7 2B
12 RBI
15 BB
12 SO
.825 OPS

He needs to start hitting more over the wall, but he isn't the dead weight he used to be.

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

Love to see those walks
He might be getting his eyes back.

by sdrone on Jun 1, 2007 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

I believe...
... that he needs to rest more often.

GO CARDS!!!

by SuperSeve on Jun 1, 2007 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you saying....
There is reason for hope?

by Irishman on Jun 1, 2007 9:11 AM EDT reply actions  

I'm just going
by the "one series at a time" mantra. They look great for a couple days, then look like crap for a couple days. Let's see how they fare against the Stros this weekend. Oswalt tonite. Ug.

by rockin redbird on Jun 1, 2007 9:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

i'd like to see Rolen's numbers also...
for May compared to April. I know over the past 10 games, Rolen is batting like .500.
Miller sucks.

by Ankiels Missing Curveball on Jun 1, 2007 9:14 AM EDT reply actions  

Let go Cards!
starting with the Pirate sweep the Cards are 6-4 in the last 10 games. I was really expecting them to win the Nats series and be 7-3. Now lets look are the next ten games and even the month of June.

 the next 18 out of the next 21 games against sub .500 clubs. Oakland might or might not be. I think they can win every series. The Dodgers might be tough. It is nice that there are 6 games against KC.

 Now that the bats seam to be waking up it is time to get hot and go 15-6 over the next 21! That will make the Cards 37-35 as they hit Shea.

by nybirdfan on Fri Jun 01, 2007 at 08:58:58 AM EDT
[ Reply to This ]  

by nybirdfan on Jun 1, 2007 9:21 AM EDT reply actions  

Got nothing but love for Izzy
The man is a rock. His career looked to be over, yet he has come back and has looked better than ever. Let's just hope he continues to stay healthy. If the Cardinals fall out of the race, teams would be crazy not to take a shot at getting this guy.

by ryanisforever on Jun 1, 2007 9:38 AM EDT reply actions  

Yeah
he's not Joe Nathan or Mariano Rivera, but he sure as hell isn't Ricky Bottallico or Dave Veres.  

by Valatan on Jun 1, 2007 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

Still holds true...
I first posted this last thursday but just thought about it as we continue to see the Brewers skid through this tougher stretch of schedule.
"""Here's to the rest of the summer...
Ok, so it's only a 2 game winning streak, but it got me looking ahead a bit.  I think that the standings as of June 8 will be something to look at.  Right now, the brewers are 10 games over at home and 1 under on the road.  After Monday, they start a 10 game home stand that is followed up by 19 out of 28 on the road.  Their road trip consist of the Twins and Tigers, whereas ours, beginning on the 12th, consists of the Royals and A's.  I have been frustrated at times this yr but have not come close to folding it up.  I kept a lot more faith than most last year and was rewarded w/ the first WS Championship of my memory (born in '80).  I would love to be w/in 3-5 games when July 27th gets here and we then proceed to play the Brewers 8 times in a 21 game stretch.  Granted that they may not even be the team to beat at that point, but we're close enough to every one else that we, in escence, control our own destiny w/ the rest of the division."""
We were 9 games back at the time and here we sit today only 5 back in the L column.
Let's just enjoy the ride and see how it goes.
A happy weekend to all.

by toris34 on Jun 1, 2007 9:48 AM EDT reply actions  

What a bad division
Thank God the Cards are in it.

by birdjam on Jun 1, 2007 10:17 AM EDT reply actions  

Larry Bigbie is a Free Agent....
According to Rotoworld.

Larry Bigbie, who was hitting .349 for Triple-A Las Vegas, was dropped from the Las Vegas roster hours before a June 1 escape clause in his contract kicked in.

------

Given Dunc's injury, perhaps the Cardinals should try for him?

Miller sucks.

by Ankiels Missing Curveball on Jun 1, 2007 10:30 AM EDT reply actions  

get him
I mentioned him before, but now he wouldn't cost us a player. Sign him! Make room for him by putting Duncan on the Dl. If they haven't done that already. When Duncan comes back send down Ludwick.

by nybirdfan on Jun 1, 2007 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

why?
Ludwick is better in every way; he's just had a rough start.  They need to DL either Enc or Duncan and give him 2 weeks of consistent playing time to show what he can do.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jun 1, 2007 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

thanks for that insightful response.
Bigbie's absolute ceiling is a 800 OPS, with 650-700 being much more likely.  Think Aaron Miles crossed with Juan Encarnacion- a few more walks and about half again as many k's as JEnc, with half the power or less, hitting into a ton of double plays.  Bigbie also bats left, and has a significant L-R split that won't help much against lefties.

Ludwick could be a 900 OPS guy but will probably end up in the mid-800's. He strikes out too much as well, but he hammers lefties and could potentially get things straightened out and be a factor in the lineup; early in his career he was thought to have 40 HR potential and while the injuries make that unlikely, he would have hit 30+ if he had stayed in memphis.

Both strike out way too much and don't walk enough.  Both play average defense.

I don't see any reason whatsoever for us to go for Larry Bigbie.  Maybe you can enlighten me?

Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jun 1, 2007 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bigbie would be an excellent pickup
I wonder why the Dodgers let Bigbie go?  His numbers in spring training were excellent and his numbers at AAA were just as impressive:

At AAA Las Vegas in 126 AB:

.349 BA (4th in the league)
.431 OBP
.532 SLG
.962 OPS

3 HR, 12 doubles, 1 triple
14 RBI
22 runs scored
24 strikeouts

In 56 AB in spring training:

.357 AVG
.400 OBP
.554 SLG
.954 OPS

2 HR, 3 doubles, 1 triple
14 RBI
only 9 strikeouts

Bigby is a former #1 draft pick, can play all three outfield positions well.  He has various physical impediments last year, but he's evidently healthy now and playing up to his potential.  

I'd be thrilled if the Cardinals would take a chance on this guy again, especially with Duncan ailing.  

by CardsWin on Jun 1, 2007 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bigbie chose to leave the Dodgers
Actually it was Bigbie's choice to leave the Dodgers:

"Bye-bye Bigbie: Veteran outfielder Larry Bigbie, who is hitting .349 at Las Vegas, has informed club officials that he will exercise the escape clause in his minor-league contract when it kicks in today, assistant general manager Kim Ng said.

"That will make Bigbie a free agent and officially end his ties with the Dodgers.

"Bigbie also tried to find a major-league job when his last "out" clause went into effect at the end of spring training."

http://www.dailynews.com/sports/ci_6034207

by CardsWin on Jun 1, 2007 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Too bad we already have him on the team
and his name is Ryan Ludwick.
In triple A he hit:
.340/.375/.642 = 1017 OPS w/ 8 homers and a 36 RBIs in 121 PA. I don't understand this bigbie love fest when we have better on the team already.

by Birds on the Matt on Jun 1, 2007 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Do it
Low risk, high potential reward.  We could have a 4-man outfield rotation, with one of those guys getting a day off every fourth day.  This is of course after (if) Duncan gets back.
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jun 1, 2007 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

A question on pitching intelligence
Sorry, I can't get Reyes off my mind yet. I'm reacting to this quote:

i will say that he looked impressive in working himself out of a 3d-inning jam last night, pitching very intelligently against the top of the rockies' order; once he got a big lead he stripped down the repertoire and just started chucking it in there, which is when the rockies began to hit the ball harder. in other words, the kid pitched to the situation; brainy.

So how much credit can we give pitchers for their pitch selection? The defense of Reyes seems to hinge on the perception that he never shook off Molina, that he was "pitching to the gameplan," and that therefore when he was getting rocked, it was the fault of the gameplan but not the pitcher.

Moreover, what is the difference between this assessment of Thompson as a brainy pitcher for pitching to the situation, and a comment like Bernie Miklasz's that Reyes is dumb as a rock when it comes to "pitching acumen?"

by taiko on Jun 1, 2007 11:03 AM EDT reply actions  

it's fair to say that reyes still has to improve
his ability to manage an inning and quash a threat. but maybe he could do it better if he were allowed to pitch his way --- ie, away from contact, relying on the 4-seam / change mix --- rather than pitching to contact and trying for groundballs. the stats i posted yesterday showed convincingly that hitters have not been hurting him on the high fastball --- if the catcher called for that pitch 60 percent of the time with men in RISP, maybe reyes would have a better record of pitching out of jams.

by lboros on Jun 1, 2007 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

just re-read your post, taiko
and i see i didn't really address it head-on. maybe the statement should be: the cardinals pitched intelligently in that 3d inning jam. or maybe the statement should be that the rockies batted stupidly --- kaz matsui chased a couple of pitches down around his ankles and struck out with men at 1st and 3d and nobody out. that's considered intelligent pitching if the hitter takes the bait; if not, it's referred to as "nibbling."

we can credit thompson for good execution of an intelligent game plan, and fault reyes for poor execution thereof --- but to return to my point, reyes is not equipped to execute a pitch-to-contact game plan. if you ask a player to do something he's not good at, and he fails at it ---- how do you apportion the responsibility? it's partly the player's fault, because he's paid to perform --- but it's also the coaching staff's fault, because they're paid to get the most out of the talent on their roster. by forcing reyes to pitch to contact, they're not getting the most out of his talent.

by lboros on Jun 1, 2007 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

There's still a fog for me
And this is because I've never played ball at any level outside of a beer league...

I get that a pitching coach's game plan essentially gives the pitcher a "toolbox and a blueprint", where the tools are the favored pitches in his repertoire, and the blueprint is the plan for attacking certain batters, or approaching certain situations.

I also get that a pitcher who is given a set of crappy tools, and whose best tools are taken away from him, is at a disadvantage.

But what I don't know is how much credit a pitcher should get for making a "smart" pitch in a certain situation, for calling his own number and getting it right, versus making a "good" pitch - executing what the catcher calls for, or what the pitching coach calls for, and just hitting a spot. We can obviously assess a pitcher's "stuff" and ability to make "good" pitches, with perhaps Pedro Martinez at the very tip of that scale. However, I also want to believe that pitchers should be given credit for their intelligence, and that Grag Maddux stands at the very tip of that scale. I would have a very hard time accepting that Maddux's success was a product of just having a good catcher or a good pitching coach telling him what to throw and when. We all know that even in his prime he never had overpowering stuff.

by taiko on Jun 1, 2007 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Regarding Maddux...
while he's never had the 95+ MPH fastball or the "Bugs Bunny" curveball usually regarded as "great stuff," what he has had above and beyond darn near every other pitcher in MLB is the uncanny ability to throw any pitch at any time exactly where he wants to!!!

To my mind, Greg Maddux is the epitome of the "command and control" pitcher... he attacks batters by putting the ball where they can't hit it hard! When he has to, he can also go for the strikeout by putting the ball in whatever "holes" a batter has in his swing. (Almost every hitter has some "hole" in his swing... exceptions include guys named Musial, Williams, Gwynn, and Pujols; they're damned rare!)

Maddux knows what he can (and can't) do; he devises his own game plan based on that. Maddux doesn't need a Dave Duncan/Yadier Molina combo to be effective... but Maddux is a sure-fire Hall of Famer! Other pitchers can use that help, by concentrating on making whatever pitch is called for at the time. (Other pitchers seem to refuse that help, and are lesser pitchers for it.)

It's a beautiful day for a ballgame!

by The Ol Goaler on Jun 1, 2007 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Head scratcher to me
One of the things about LaRussa that is clear from "Three Nights In August" as well as other attempts to figure him out, is that he works hard to put people into situations where they are best positioned to succeed - and to keep them away from situations where they aren't well-equipped to succeed.  All the insightful data and observations provided here by you, lboros, and the VEB community paint a pretty clear picture of Reyes strengths and weaknesses.  I can't imagine that the Cardinals coaching staff doesn't have all that we've put together and more on Reyes - therein being able to clearly see strengths and weaknesses.

So why aren't we seeing Tony/Dave put Reyes in that "most likely to succeed" position?  Especially as a young guy with a lot of upside?  They are the pro's, but it just doesn't fit together.  I understand trying to develop him into more of a complete pitcher, but shouldn't one do that by building on strengths (as you have noted before).

When you look at the way Reyes has been treated in 2006-2007 I don't see how he is a Cardinal long-term (or even short-term for that matter).  I get this feeling that he'd love to be out of here and go somewhere else where they will just let him pitch.

by wildman on Jun 1, 2007 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

An interesting read
If you want a good read today check out a blog called The Soul of Baseball at http://thesoulofbaseball.blogspot.com/ (sorry no idea how to do links) The blog is written by Joe Posnanski of The Kansas City Star. He ranked his top most exciting players currently, as a part of his Bo Jackson post. Two birds made his top ten. We got a little love from Kansas City.
http://welcometojohnsonville.blogspot.com

by arthropodtodd on Jun 1, 2007 11:55 AM EDT reply actions  

Fun Stuff
He mentions Rickey Henderson when talking about Rollins.  I have always wondered if Ricky was basically the perfect left fielder.  Just a sick player...could he be one of the top 5 players of all-time.

by BigJawnMize on Jun 1, 2007 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I've read Posnaski
before, and enjoyed his stuff. Thanks for the heads up.

by cardsrul on Jun 1, 2007 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

all star game
just to let everyone know...I read yesterday in the paper that Albert was leading all voters and that both Rolen and Eck were in the top 5 in votes at there postion.  I know that is weird, ecspecially for eck at short but I guess it means we will have atleast 2 there, that being Albert and Izzy
2/3rd's of the earth is covered by water, the other third is coverd by Jim Edmonds

by cardsphan04 on Jun 1, 2007 12:11 PM EDT reply actions  

eckstein in the top 5 at short
a perfect example of why i think the players/managers/writers should pick the teams.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jun 1, 2007 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not so fast
A good 60% of the votes are counted in the last week of the voting...

The vote counts you see now don't count for that much.

by redbird2006in on Jun 1, 2007 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Last years first numbers
I can recall last spring when the first votes came out. 4 of the top 8 voting spots were covered by Cards. Things didn't end up that way at the break due to the Mets domination. Whatever numbers they are counting now aren't necessarily misleading, but they surely aren't set in stone.

by billyhoyel on Jun 1, 2007 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

ankiel
he hit another one last night of the walk-off variety. he's know hitting .278 with 12 homers and 40 RBIs. you have to think at least someone is seriously looking at him should duncan go on the DL.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jun 1, 2007 1:10 PM EDT reply actions  

Ankiel vs. Bigbie
True, Ankiel is doing well at Memphis.  However, I think that Bigbie would be the better choice RIGHT NOW.  (Assuming, of course, that he would agree to a reasonable offer.)

My reasons?  While Rick has better power numbers (I guess, certainly more homers), Bigbie's avg and OBP are quite a bit higher, he (Bigbie) has major league experience, and (probably the biggest reason) once we call up Ankiel, we can't send him back down.  It's still better, IMO, for the long run to leave him in Memphis where he can get 3-5 AB's per night instead of being the 4th or 5th OF in StL.  Come August/September, given that he keeps performing at his current level, my preference would probably switch.

by ArkansasTravs on Jun 1, 2007 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow, this Bigbie
bandwagon just won't go away, will it?  Bigbie has ML experience at sucking.

by MdRedbirdFreak on Jun 1, 2007 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

as opposed to
ludwick, j-rod, ankiel, stavinoha, rasmus. We don't need anymore outfielders like bigbie. Ludwick's numbers in AAA were just as good as bigbie's. We don't have the roster space to waste on that kind of ballplayer.

by Birds on the Matt on Jun 1, 2007 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed. And I watched Bigbie
play every day for 2 years-plus in Baltimore.  Ain't one thing special about him (though he does LOOK like a ballplayer).  He is destined for a great AAA career.

by MdRedbirdFreak on Jun 1, 2007 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sucking?
2003 BAL

g    ab   r h hr rbi  bb  so  sb cs obp   slg  ave
83 287 43 87 9 31  29  60   7 1  .365  .456 .303

2004 bal

g    ab  r  h  hr  rbi bb  so sb cs  obp  slg  ave
139 478 76 134 15  68  45 113 8  3 .341 .427 .280

 (sorry no matter what I do I can't get them to line up)

2005 he was hurt and last year was wiped out beacuse of injuries.  

 I dare say those 2004 numbers are very Edmonds like numbers. As a matter of fact lets see who in our current outfield has better numbers? JaunE? Taguchi? Speez? Ludwick? Wilson? Tell me who would you rather have? That you could add to team for a song?

 I say sign the man, and Dl Duncan. Hell he plays all outfield spots. Once Duncan is cleared to play Ludwick gets optioned.

 I was excited about Ludwick I was hoping he would provide a spark. Well, Larry was right. He can't hit ML pitching. Bigbie at least has, and his defense will be a plus.

by nybirdfan on Jun 1, 2007 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ankiel is not coming up...
...until he is ready to be on the big league roster permanently.  I think he has to pass through waivers to be sent down again.  Some team will claim him at this point.

by BigJawnMize on Jun 1, 2007 1:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Also....
Ankiel is not currently on the 40-man roster, so they would have to purchase his contract from Memphis, and release someone from the 40-man before being able to call him up.

by Irishman on Jun 1, 2007 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Our or field Roy Oswalt on the mound tonight..
Just going by memory but it always seems we are a 'swing at the first pitch' team against him.   Often getting 2 outs in the first 2 pitches of the inning.

Is my memory bad or is this who we are?

Any chance we try to take some pitches tonight?

by redbird2006in on Jun 1, 2007 1:53 PM EDT reply actions  

I was under the impression
that was our strategy against every pitcher ;)

by outraged on Jun 1, 2007 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Elijah Dukes
I found this over at mlbtraderumors.com

Seems the D-Rays would like to trade Elijah Dukes for a solid reliever.  A few teams might bow out because of Dukes' past, but in my experience most don't care.  I could see a match with the Padres, as they will need a center fielder if Mike Cameron leaves.

He's been a problem child, but I can't believe all they would want is a solid reliever for him.

by Carps on Jun 1, 2007 2:36 PM EDT reply actions  

For the talent he's got
yeah, they should ask for a lot more.  Unfortunately for the D-Rays, he's completely demolished his trade value.  

They guy's lucky he isn't in prison and might find himself there in the near future.

Plus, the composition of a human being who storms into an elementary school and threatens his own wife's life is more than enough reason to stay away.

by Big Red on Jun 1, 2007 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I realize
that Dukes is a big d-bag, but I'd acquire him given half a chance. Brett Myers is still in baseball, let's give this kid a chance to get himself sorted out before we brand him the next soulless Carl Panzram.

And let's sort him out while he's hitting for the Cardinals. Heh.

by DanUpBaby on Jun 1, 2007 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

There's gotta be...
something wrong with Zambrano...

4 2/3 innings, 11 hits, 2 walks, 0 Ks, 5 runs allowed... and the Braves have stranded 6 and had a guy thrown out at home.

by guayzimi on Jun 1, 2007 3:56 PM EDT reply actions  

Well
the Cubs suck.

They were treated to a chorus of Boos from the Wrigley faithful after a big inning by the Braves that pushed their lead to 7-1.  That's with Zambrano on the hill btw

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 3:57 PM EDT reply actions  

HOLY SHIT
ZAMBRANO AND BARRETT JUST GOT IN A BRAWL IN THE DUGOUT!

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 3:57 PM EDT reply actions  

and we think
the cardinals have it bad...sheesh
Call up Ankiel!!

by jeff abs on Jun 1, 2007 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dumbrano just attacked Barrett
in the dugout.  He has sucked today, 7 runs no strikeouts and he tries to kick Barrett's ass after Barrett tells him to 'look at the scoreboard'.
Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 4:01 PM EDT reply actions  

sooo
who won the fight?
"Left-hander, right-hander, soft thrower, power guy, fastballs away, fastballs in-- [Albert Pujols] doesn't have any holes." - Tino Martinez

by _pistol_ on Jun 1, 2007 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

No one really got 'jacked'
the pitching coach grabbed Zambrano's arms as he was throwing haymakers with both arms.  Barrett was just kindof in defensive mode, like "what the hell are you doing?"

Both have been removed from the game.

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Somewhere...
Dusty Baker is smirking.
"Left-hander, right-hander, soft thrower, power guy, fastballs away, fastballs in-- [Albert Pujols] doesn't have any holes." - Tino Martinez

by _pistol_ on Jun 1, 2007 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Probability Game
Whats the probability that Zambrano is still a Cub by the end of the year?

My guess is only 15% that he is a Cub. I think he will be traded at the trade deadline. Possibilities - to the Mets for something like a Pelfrey/Milledge combo (although the Cubs have absolutely no need for Milledge, Jaque Jones could be packaged too) or to the Indians or Tigers (however I doubt Leyand would want to put up with Zambrano) or maybe even to the Angels. I could see the White Soxs making a run and that would make it even more interesting

by stl3bagger on Jun 1, 2007 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

perhaps...
Cleveland. They have a few outfield prospects to give up.
"Left-hander, right-hander, soft thrower, power guy, fastballs away, fastballs in-- [Albert Pujols] doesn't have any holes." - Tino Martinez

by _pistol_ on Jun 1, 2007 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think the Cubs have more than enough
outfielders.  Soriano, Pie, Jones, Murton, etc.  
Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, yes and no
i think if they had alternatives, they'd trade jones and dfa murton. they'd absolutely welcome a soriano-pie-milledge of next year.

however, i'm not sure two months of zambrano buys milledge. especially if he keeps throwing more haymakers than no-run innings.

I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fight continued in the clubhouse
Derrek Lee had to go get Pinella and Rothchild.

Zambrano has apparently left the stadium in his car in a hurry.  

It is his birthday, too.  Happy Birthday, Carlos!

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Barret was on the bench, I believe
so he was probably destroying crap.

DAMMIT I hate when I miss this stuff.  I'm 10m from home - I should start working from home on Fridays.     Friday afternoongames always seem good for some Cubs self-destruction.

by sdrone on Jun 1, 2007 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow...
if the Stros and Cubs weren't even crappier than us, this season really would be unbearable.

Keep in mind, those two teams are in "win now" mode.

by guayzimi on Jun 1, 2007 4:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Bite your tongue
we have to beat the crap out of the Astros this weekend.
Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Stupid Scott Boras quote of the day
"The Cardinals not signing Jeff Weaver is how you don't win divisions, and my prediction is the St. Louis Cardinals won't win their division this year."

http://www.ocweekly.com/features/features/the-boras-factor/27177/?page=1 (Top of second page. Hat tip to www.mlbtraderumors.com)

Somehow, I don't see Jeff Weaver's 14.32 ERA as the missing ingredient on this team.

by DCGreg on Jun 1, 2007 4:09 PM EDT reply actions  

I caught that too
Ya think the guy is bitter? He completely screwed Weaver in the offseason while he was so worried about Zito. So, I guess he just blames the Cardinals. I wonder if this changes any draft choices or free agent acquisitions.

by Carps on Jun 1, 2007 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

i wish
someone would completely screw me and leave me $8M richer.
Don't Panic!!!

by SleepyCA on Jun 1, 2007 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

lets see what he says...
after this season when Jeff's 1 yr. deal in Seattle is up....that two yr. deal from the Cards is going to be looking MIGHTY good right about then I'm guessing.

by Timbo02 on Jun 1, 2007 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

My favorite is this one

Weaver eventually signed with the Seattle Mariners for $8.3 million. "You have to respect that teams have a right to make their own decisions," Boras says, before turning around and passing judgment on Cardinals general manager Walt Jocketty. "Here's a GM who never played the game saying, `We're going to go with our young guys,' and I go, `You can't.'"

"GM who never played the game" sounds like a real dig at Jocko.  That phrase seems out of place there.  As if he wanted to say: "Here's (this jagoff) saying, 'We're going to win with our young guys.'"

Juicy stuff.

youneverknow

by meat on Jun 1, 2007 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

check that
quote's on top of third page

by DCGreg on Jun 1, 2007 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

agreed
it's delightful.
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

oh yeah....
they are blowing up over there at BCB....lots of talk of trading Barrett ...hey?....catcher?...kills the Cards on a regular basis...if we got him we'd win about 4-5 more games a year minimum!  LOL....

by Timbo02 on Jun 1, 2007 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

hours of entertainment
probably heading home early so I can watch PTI ...
Call up Ankiel!!

by jeff abs on Jun 1, 2007 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

On Elijah Dukes....
Don't think I want him here, but he grew up in South Florida under horrific conditions.  He needs anger management training, and a place to play  far, far, away from Florida. Getting away from people in his past might help him straighten things out before he falls off the cliff.

by jillsinmo on Jun 1, 2007 4:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Yeah...
that place is known as prison.

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

california penal
worked for rick "wild thing" vaughn
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

And, before you start yelling at me,
I am not giving him a pass on the alleged threat he made to his wife.  I'm just not ready to pass judgement until I know more.....remember Duke anyone?

by jillsinmo on Jun 1, 2007 4:40 PM EDT reply actions  

this is NOT duke
  1. his wife showed reporters the photo of the gun he sent her.
  2. school officials called the cops when he showed up at her school and threatened her. not like there were no witnesses to what he did.
  3. his response to the allegations has not been, i didn't do it or i'm innocent, which is what the duke guys did from day 1. his response has been, i'm just going to play baseball.
i understand the guy is a good player. but no thank you.
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

His actual response to reporters
that asked him about it was a short response followed by "that's all I'm gonna say.  I have a video game to go finish."

Nice.

by Big Red on Jun 1, 2007 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Apparently
Cubs fans are ready to give up Zambrano, Barrett, Jones, Murton, Eyre...

Let's see... Give them Encarnacion for Jones.  Trade  for Barrett then ship him off to the AL.  Give them Kip Wells for Zambrano.  They can keep Big Red and Eyre.

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 4:41 PM EDT reply actions  

oh yeah, tlr and duncan
would LOVE zambrano.
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

"We like the groundballs,
but we really don't understand why you're throwing so hard."

by DanUpBaby on Jun 1, 2007 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice job on the CG shutout
but those 10 strikeouts were completely unnecessary.  GROUNDBALLS DAMNIT!

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

hahahahahahaha
Bob Brenly: "Carlos with no strikeouts today.... boy you really have to go back a ways to when Zambrano didn't punch a guy out.... (long pause).... at the plate."

Len Casper: "thank you for that"

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 4:49 PM EDT reply actions  

zing!
That is Major League-esque.

by DanUpBaby on Jun 1, 2007 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

brilliant
Call up Ankiel!!

by jeff abs on Jun 1, 2007 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

wow
i wasn't listening. that's amazing.
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

wow
that escalated quickly

by azruavatar on Jun 1, 2007 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

I stabbed a guy
with a trident
Call up Ankiel!!

by jeff abs on Jun 1, 2007 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

z,
where did you get a hand grenade?
I believe in the Sports Guy rule. Any "complaining" in this post is actually happy, cheerful "constructive criticism."

by nycbirdo on Jun 1, 2007 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is why I LOVE the Cubs!!!
I can't get enough of this team!!!  I live in Chicago and dispise Cub fans.  

Just when you think they've gotten as bad as they can, they go out and do this.

Classic.

by Big Red on Jun 1, 2007 4:56 PM EDT reply actions  

And now some moron
jumps onto the field as Ramirez hits a homerun.

by Big Red on Jun 1, 2007 4:57 PM EDT reply actions  

chaos at Wrigley
this is why I miss Julian Tavarez... kinda.
Acquire some runs!

by madding on Jun 1, 2007 5:01 PM EDT reply actions  

Astros game tomorrow
completely off-topic, but this is a breakdown showing what markets get which games tomorrow on FOX.  unless you're near Missouri, Texas or in Topeka, KS (sorry, Wichita, KS) you're out of luck.

I'm in Portland, OR, so I never got my hopes up, of course.

Acquire some runs!

by madding on Jun 1, 2007 5:06 PM EDT reply actions  

freakin' ridiculous
i live in STL, so it doesn't affect me but i know you out-of-towners get pissed over this. can FOX honestly think 85% of the country is either a yankees or a red sox fan? bleh.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jun 1, 2007 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think they make that judgement ...
though it may be the case that the casual or non-fan would be more likely to watch yankees/sox.
Call up Ankiel!!

by jeff abs on Jun 1, 2007 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

a non-fan
wouldn't just decide to flip on a game. he'd watch the belmont stakes or something other of the sorts.

by stlcardinalsfang on Jun 1, 2007 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice
Chicago getting the Yankees/Sox.

I thought I had ESPN for Yankee games?

by Big Red on Jun 1, 2007 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

YES
Got it in Alabama!
"Tyler's gonna bust a nut on some babies tonight!" - Tyler Johnson (as told by Alex Fritz)

by Mr Redbird on Jun 1, 2007 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

dang, I turned the flubs game off too early
that should teach me. I hate that I missed their melt down. how much longer do you think sweet lou will stick around? I'm betting he's out of there before the end of the month. the way he looks in the dugout is priceless. he really expected to win. it's sad.

no, it's freakin hilarious.

in other news, any one else think it's time us Cards fans lowered are expectations for the Cards this season? I really want to believe they will make the playoffs, but I just don't see it. not with the starting rotation they keep rolling out day after day. the last two games were nice wins, but tonight they go up against Roy, who always shuts them down. the game probably won't last two hours tonight because he'll mow right threw the line up like he always does, and fat elvis could hit a cheap homer run to the boxes in left for the only run of the game. it does not matter that Roy has been ruffed up, at least by his standards, in his last few starts. he owns the Cards. they are the reason why his owner bought him some huge caterpillar bulldozer.

I don't know. maybe I'm too much of a pesimist, but I don't have any faith at all that the Cards will win tonight.

The 2007 St.Louis Cardinals. Not Your Father's 04-05 Cardinals. And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jun 1, 2007 5:21 PM EDT reply actions  

Cubs postgame live coming up next
for those in chicagoland CSN area.  Should be a treat.  

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 5:27 PM EDT reply actions  

Per Lou
The fight spilled over into the clubhouse.  He sent both guys home.. they will be back tomorrow and punished.  

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 5:33 PM EDT reply actions  

When asked if anyone got hurt
Lou said: "well.... they're both big guys... lets hope neither are hurt"

hmmm

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 5:35 PM EDT reply actions  

Lou:
"Barrett's lip is cut up pretty good"

by stltrav09 on Jun 1, 2007 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I made this YouTube of it
pretty much covers everything that happened on the field:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_O64BqGsVwM

Interested in pre-1990 Cardinals games on tape

by Hardcore Legend on Jun 1, 2007 5:44 PM EDT reply actions  

it would appear...
that the fight MUST have continued down into the locker room if Barretts lip is actually cut up...it doesn't appear that Z got any full shots to the face in the dugout does it?

by Timbo02 on Jun 1, 2007 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah
Apparantly (according to Lou), Z was sent to take a shower and then was to go home.  Barrett was still in the game at that point.  

At some point, Barrett went back to the clubhouse and all hell broke lose.  

Btw, if you watch the video, you can see that after Barrett says something and then points (looks like he points to the scoreboard) he walks towards Z and starts to raise his hands.  

Z then kinda jabs him with a left and cocks the right just as the batting coach and Rothschild get between 'em.

IMO, Barrett's lucky he wasn't knocked out.

by Big Red on Jun 1, 2007 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

CLASSIC!!
oh man...I just LOVE seeing the Flubs starting to implode!!! As my high school Spanish teacher, Mr. Francis used to say..." Heads are 'gonna Role!!"...

by Timbo02 on Jun 1, 2007 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nah...
In fact, for a supposedly "loco" moose, Zambrano slaps like a little girl. Maybe the clubhouse fight was meaner. Nice work, Cubbies!

by rockin redbird on Jun 1, 2007 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

saw lou's press conferance
i really thought he would lose it. but he was pretty calm till the very end. i didn't hear what question he was asked, but he got a little upset, then yelled something like they need the players to run, and catch the damn ball, or they would get some in there that would. then he got up and left.

all in all, he looked and sounded depressed. your typical flub manager attitude i guess.

The 2007 St.Louis Cardinals. Not Your Father's 04-05 Cardinals. And That's A Winner!

by gdm426 on Jun 1, 2007 5:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Oh, dear....
I'm glad it's the Cubs and not us.  This kind of thing might wake the team up, though.  I know we have beat this to death on this board, but I'm still disturbed by the whole Anthony Reyes thing.  I keep seeing quotes from others, not Anthony himself, and not management, that he refuses to pitch the way they want him to.  It seems to me he tried, and didn't do all that well, but the implication is that he didn't do well because he really didn't try.  There were no words on this BEFORE he was sent down, and since he has never commented himself everything is just heresay. This stuff has been in different forums on StL.com.  I also read he was supposed to pitch Wednesday, but he hasn't until tonight.  Was he demoted and denied a start as a punishment? Is this the right way to handle someone that has a legitimate difference of opinion-and when you consider how he can pitch, with how he did pitch since they asked for the changes, I understand why he wouldn't want to do it a new way.  Last thing I wonder is if it's not so much as he CAN'T do instead of WON'T do it.  I'm hoping for a perfect game tonight for him, just because if we are not going to use him, if management really thinks there's more upside to Todd Wellemeyer, deal him already yesterday.

by jillsinmo on Jun 1, 2007 6:33 PM EDT reply actions  

well....
I see the same sorta speculation on Reyes everywhere I go, most "armchair GMs" want to look at numbers/stats only, others want to look at some unexplained diagreement between Duncan and Reyes and others want to say its damage control for Reyes.

The kid was 0-8 and was in a funk needing a break from the discouraging results of some good as well as some less than good efforts. I also think that had the Cards scored a bunch of runs and got him a couple of wins along the way, things would/might be different. Hence, no need for discussion here, at all. So maybe he WAS a victim of numbers...the teams dreadful at bats?

In terms of numbers, the most important number in the eyes of management, the (0-8)W/L was indeed not good, ...and secondly....rampant conjecture about a disagreement was drawn from a statement by Ducan about "throwing a certain OUT-PITCH to get ground balls" the day after or the day he was sent down, which in my mind meant NOTHING!!...more LaDuncan fodder and propaganda for the media. I personally dont think Duncan knew WHAT to say! The kid was going down and he gave an excuse based on some discussion he'd probably had with Reyes at some point in the past (maybe he thought it was better than saying "the kid was bad and he cant pitch out of the pen, we had to send him down"???)

I believe it was probably damage control, get the guy a break, some wins and confidence...I dont think punishment was involved, he fit into the rotation at Memphis wherever he fit it, period.

I also dont think he's a bonified major league pitcher yet, not when he folds up with runners on base and starts walking batters. I think he has a ways to go to get consistent command of his pitches from game to game, or even inning ti inning.. (and so does Wellemeyer, for that fact!) He has very little trade value at the moment, maybe thats ANOTHER aspect of the damage control side of it?

Carlos Zambrawlo strikes again, what a picture show he is...whines and complains, then he gets more money (6 + million increase), then promises a Cy Young award AND a WS to Chicago..now he blames his performance on Barrett (the Cardinal killer)! Maybe if you go after the other guy on the team with a rep for punching back, you look more justified?

"I don't need a damn number to tell me the guy's no good right now!" Old Casey.... Pitching, base running and defense!

by cardschinmusic on Jun 2, 2007 6:32 AM EDT reply actions  

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