hancock family lawsuit
as discussed in the game thread, josh hancock's family has sued mike shannon's, the manager at shannon's, the towing company, the tow truck driver, and the driver of the car the tow truck had stopped to help.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/stlouiscitycounty/story/B30B1CD42616DCDC862572E5005F04FC?OpenDocument
i'm not entirely clear on the facts, but it would seem like the family's claim against the tow truck and the driver of the car are pretty baseless - the lights were flashing; cars do break down on the road sometimes, even absent negligence; how was the broken-down car supposed to get off the road without a tow truck? etc.
negligence on the part of the car's driver could exist if something out of the ordinary happened - like, he knew the oil hadn't been changed for 20,000 miles, or a mechanic had told him a week before that the car was likely to break down or something. but it would have to be a situation like that, where the driver was careless.
for the tow truck driver (and the company, who would be liable to the extent the driver was), it's about how much warning was provided. flashing lights seems pretty reasonable, but if the industry standard is to do extra things - flares, road cones, whatever - and this particular driver didn't, that could lead to negligence, i guess.
in either case, car or truck driver, even if there were negligence, a judge/jury would have to find that that negligence was a proximate cause of josh's accident, rather than (or in addition to) the fact that josh was drunk, may have been on the phone, speeding, whatever else was going on.
the claims against shannon's and the manager, as discussed in the thread as well, are based on "dram shop" liability - the concept that a business that sells alcohol to someone who is visibly intoxicated is responsible for injuries later caused by that person.
the missouri dram shop statute is available here:
http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/C500-599/5370000053.HTM
as houstoncardinal mentioned in the thread, the missouri version of the law (dram shop laws vary a bit by state) only calls for liability in three situations:
1. the person served was under 21;
2. the person suing is a third party, not the drinker;
3. potentially, if the person was involuntarily intoxicated.
that third one is just a guess (i haven't looked at the whole area of MO law) based on the statute's specific bar to liability based on a person's own voluntary intoxication. what it means is, the fact pattern "hancock visibly drunk + shannon's keeps serving him + hancock dies" isn't enough to create liability. but the statute says nothing about involuntary. that's probably why the hancock family is claiming that "The intoxication of Joshua Morgan Hancock on said occasion was involuntary."
involuntary intoxication basically happens in one of two situations: either the guy was slipped something (ex: ghb), or the guy was forced to drink (ex: hazing). if either of those things happened to josh that night, it certainly hasn't been reported previously.
at this point, i'm honestly not sure what to even hope for here.
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42 comments
Comments
I'm hoping Hancock's family loses the suit
A very low-class move by the Hancock family. They must be getting bad advice, but then again there are a lot of predatory lawyers out there...
Your son made a tragically stupid decision, and many people are paying for it now. It sucks. It is what it is. Circle up the family wagons and try to heal and recover. This is nobody's fault but Josh's.
by MKDCardinal on May 24, 2007 5:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I hope they come to their senses...
I also hope the lawyer is disgraced.
by taiko on May 25, 2007 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep...
by rockin redbird on May 24, 2007 6:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree
by 1985kid on May 24, 2007 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i know it's not really a laughing matter
by erik on May 24, 2007 6:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i'm hoping for
http://youtube.com/watch?v=yU-tZy3NIS4
by nycbirdo on May 24, 2007 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
it appears
by gibbons on May 24, 2007 7:13 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
With regard to the legal point...
So Shannons could have been liable for the consequences of Hancock's voluntary intoxication if such consequences included harm to others. But since he injured himself, they can only be liable for his injuries if he was involuntarily intoxicated.
by OCCardsFan on May 24, 2007 7:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
that's correct
by nycbirdo on May 24, 2007 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This upsets me
by Alxfritz on May 24, 2007 8:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
me too...
by kindred on May 24, 2007 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hadn't heard that "three blocks" bit
What a waste of time and resources - legal, financial, emotional.... I have no anger for Hancock, and a lot of sympathy for him and his family - lots of people have done what he did, but few of them have had to pay for it like he did. I won't pretend to understand what his family is going through, but I hope if God forbid I'm in a similar situation I'll be able to muster up a little more perspective and restraint.
by BTown Birds fan on May 24, 2007 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyway, after a minute to marinate on it:
I can kind of --- kind of -- find a tiny amount of fault in the tow truck driver; if (and it's a big if) he had time to put up flares, he should have.
But Josh is dead and thats his fault. Nobody else's. He made some horrible, horrible decisions that night and he paid for them dearly. To blame anyone other than Josh is at best absurd and at worst opportunistic.
I feel bad for the Hancock family. They lost a son, a brother, a friend. But no monetary compensation will bring Josh back. Don't drag others into this mess which he created by getting behind the wheel.
If I were to die in this sort of way, I would be royally pissed at my family for taking these actions. I hope they thought long and hard about whether or not Josh would have approved of this.
by Alxfritz on May 25, 2007 2:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
my brother was killed riding on the back of a motorcycle with a buddy. my family didn't even think of suing the other family for his death. yes, the funeral expenses put our lower-middle income family in a very tight bind at the time, but that was the VERY least of our concerns. the main concern was keeping the family from falling apart and dealing with the loss.
sorry - don't want to go on a tangent about me, but when i read this article, i just don't know what this world is coming to. in fact, it makes me wonder what kind of family would want to cause more turmoil in their lives with a law suit.
by Cayronut on May 25, 2007 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As long as Shannon's hires
All your legal talk - it frightens me. I'm only a caveman!
All joking aside - this is really unbelievable to me.
I mean, won't the defense team just dredge up all the times that Hancock was out on the town, undoubtedly wasted.
Great idea, dad. Drag your son's name through the mud and the much to exact some sick, twisted revenge.
This is what this country has come to.
by silent_bob on May 24, 2007 10:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Put me down as upset too....
by jillsinmo on May 24, 2007 11:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Torts....
There are three elements to the case against the driver of the car that we must prove. First, inaction that he could have taken to prevent harm to someone else (my torts professor calls this "the safety step"). Second, was the accident that occured forseeable. Third, damages.
I'll skip three because that's the no brainer. As to the first, the safety step, I don't know if we have enough facts to determine whether placing the car where he did was necessary and whether it was the most prudent place for him to do so. That should come out as part of the depositions.
Second, was the accident that occured forseeable. Again, that's up for debate, but if that's the only thing in contention, that's enough in my mind to get to a jury. The jury would have to determine that is it forseeable that IF I leave my car broken down here, that an accident MAY occur. That's the test.
Missouri, I would imagine, is a joint and several liablity state. That's fancy lawyer talk for a chain of events that leads to the ulimate tort. Spelled out in this case its: Shannon's + bad driver + bad tow truck placement = tort. Each of those is weighted to determine how at fault each party is and how much of the ulimate settlement they owe. If one falls out, the other two are responsible.
Also, Missouri probably has some variation of contributory negilgence. Under this doctrine, a person's ultimate award is discounted based on how much his/her actions contributed to the end result. So, looking at the above equation, the jury could find that it went 10% Shannon's, 20% driver, 70% tow truck company. HOWEVER, Josh was really 90% at fault for all of this, so each defendant gets a 90% discount. So, Shannon is really .1% at fault, .2% driver, and .9% two truck company.
Hope I didn't blow anyone's mind with that, this early in the morning. I have more comments on it, but I'll hold off and say them if this thread continues. I will say that if this went to court, I would strongly beleive that my 90% discount because of Hancock's actions is where a jury would find.
by Brock20 on May 25, 2007 8:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Regarding "the Safety Step"
I'm with the rest of you, I hate that it has come to this. For all the good lawyers I apologize, but I would be it was some money hungry lawyer that put the bug in dads ear.
by Just Rope Ball on May 25, 2007 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can Shannon's countersue
by Valatan on May 25, 2007 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Given that
I am thinking the jury would not find the tow truck driver or the broken down car driver negligent. It is hard for me to believe that the driver negligently became stuck in the left lane. If he could have gotten to the shoulder, he surely would have but he was in an accident. While they are both but for causes of the accident, I don't see them as the proximate cause.
I do agree that comparative negligence will greatly reduce any recovery (assuming MO law applies comparative negligence). Or if it doesnt, then there is likely the contributory negligence defense.
by OCCardsFan on May 25, 2007 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
Val, Shannon's could countersue easily.
by Brock20 on May 25, 2007 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's what I thought
I guess bereaved people make insane decisions sometimes.
by Valatan on May 25, 2007 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Suing the person
by AL on May 25, 2007 8:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
This reminds me...
There was a huge outpouring of sympathy for the family, but that eroded after the family sued the plow driver and county for damages including Street's likely NBA earnings. Street wasn't drunk or on the phone like Hancock, but police and the jury ruled he was at-fault for the crash.
In a case like Hancock's or Street's, it's easy to play armchair attorney or moralist and throw around accusations about greed and opportunism. But I think anytime there is this type of tragedy, especially given the money these athletes make, it's nearly impossible for it not to get messy. And I certainly don't pass judgment on the family or anyone else directly involved.
by bgodar on May 25, 2007 9:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Alternative
Second, if it really is about money, then what I'd much rather see is Josh's parents going on a speaking tour to high schools and colleges across the country. I'm sure those types of engagements don't pay super well, but they could probably do alright for themselves, and meanwhile expose young people to a high profile example of what can happen when you drink and drive.
Lastly, for whatever it's worth, I have a cousin that recently started working as a bartender, and what he was told was that legally all he's required to do is offer a cab. If the person refuses that, then they're liable for themselves from that point on. And to me, that makes sense. After all, you can't expect bartenders to start confiscating keys. In my experience, even close friends don't often do that.
by john vb on May 25, 2007 11:48 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not to mention that
by Valatan on May 25, 2007 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jeez
by roebirds on May 25, 2007 1:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
welcome to america, I'm your host , Eli
in the end all this does is: 1 waste tax payer money, 2. make the actual victim to be looked upon in a poor light 3. make the family and the attorney look greedy, 4. if they settle or win the trial its just makes it a little more likely to be sued or loose my business because someone was drunk, stupid, depressed or what ever.
by elirock83 on May 25, 2007 1:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
2 Things
And second, 2) Does anyone know who the family lawyer is?
by DuncanDipper on May 25, 2007 3:05 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Liability issues
When I first heard about the accident, and the tow truck driver said that he had his lights flashing, I wondered if he was telling the truth. He said he had just arrived at tht scene, and that he honked his horn at the last minute to warn the oncoming vehicle, but to no avail. What if he's lying? What if he forgot to turn on the lights until he saw an approaching vehicle? What if he turned them on too late? Nobody knows for sure, but everyone on this forum is apparently willing to take the driver's reported word for it. What if the Hancock family hired a private investigator who interviewed the driver of the broken down vehicle, and learned that the flashing lights didn't come on when claimed?
Second, (and I don't have access to Missouri law with my legal research subscription) is there a regulation requiring tow truck drivers to put out flares or other danger indicators in addition to the flashing lights? If not, there could be a finding of negligence per se. Negligence per se is essentially a presumption of negligence based upon the violation of law, so long as the law violated was enacted to prevent the type of harm that occurred. In this case, if Missouri law requires the lighting of roadside flares, or some other safety precaution that wasn't taken by the tow truck driver, there could be a very good claim for negligence against him. (I'll get to Josh's drunkenness in a minute). Surely such a law would have been enacted to prevent nighttime collisions with tow trucks, as occurred here.
Finally, on the issue of contributory negligence, some jurisdictions have a straight up contributory negligence statute that coldly precludes any recovery by a party that in any way negligently contributed to his own injuries. In a comparative fault jurisdiction, liability would be apportioned. Some states have "pure" comparative fault while others have "partial" comparative fault. "Pure" comparative fault gives the injured party exactly that percentage of his damages that was caused by the defendants (i.e., if Josh was 99% negligent he or his estate could recover 1%). More common is "partial" comparative fault, by which system a state court awards damages ONLY if the negligence of the defendant exceeds that of the plaintiff. So, if Josh was at least 51% responsible for his own injuries (which would be pretty easy to prove with all of the negative factors involved), there could be no recovery against the defendants.
When terms like "fault" are used, it's easy to apply their common, everyday layperson definition. In court, the principle of "fault" is a much more complicated issue.
While it doesn't look good for the Hancocks, let's not pile on and call them out for filing a "frivolous" suit, or for being "everything that's wrong with America". I prefer to be a little more fair-minded, like a jury, for example, and wait for all of the facts to come out before forming opinions and calling people "greedy" or "shameless".
by lawman3842 on May 25, 2007 5:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Lawman
I did want to dispute your point about the tow truck/light issue, however. There is security tape footage of the crash site, and the police were able, by reviewing that footage, to determine that around fifteen other motorists passed the original accident site before Hancock came along. Now, I do not recall if it was explicitly stated that the driver's lights were on in the account I heard, but the fact that several other motorists saw the truck and passed around it safely seems to lend credence to the idea, in my opinion, that there were appropriate safety measures taken. I'm a little fuzzy on the exact interpretation here, but I would tend to think that if enough precautions were taken to prevent an unimpaired driver from having a problem, then the legal responsibility of a motorist to avoid driving drunk would outweigh the truck driver's responsibility to provide for extraordinary situations.
by the red baron on May 25, 2007 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't know...
by lawman3842 on May 27, 2007 2:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please...
by rockin redbird on May 26, 2007 2:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Problem...
There are checks and balances to the system. They just don't fit in thirty second sound bites that be used for political gain.
I also wanted to note that this something I like about our little community. If you scroll through this diary, you get a nice little primer on tort law and a lot of frustration vented in a very reasonable adult manner.
by Brock20 on May 26, 2007 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
by rockin redbird on May 26, 2007 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If that's the worst you got...
by Brock20 on May 26, 2007 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that would explain
by Alxfritz on May 27, 2007 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL!!
by rockin redbird on May 27, 2007 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't call it "bullshit"
by lawman3842 on May 27, 2007 2:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
True--
by rockin redbird on May 27, 2007 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe...
Also keep in mind that insurance companies will be paying for the legal defense here. I'm not one of those anti-insurance company people, but paying for defense of auto accident lawsuits is a calculated cost, and factored into the premium. I don't think the tow truck driver will have to pay any attorney fees.
by lawman3842 on May 29, 2007 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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